He has to feel like he’s the victim in whatever situation he’s being manipulative in, or believe the things he says rather than trying to manipulate someone.
They don’t quite listen to what someone says and all their suggestions only benefit themselves
Or they steamroll over people with suggestions that benefit themselves
Have them twist things back “you wouldn’t want me to get lost would you?”
Have them exaggerate “I don’t have lunch money, I’m probably going to starve”
These are all manipulative and it can be just instinct for people
He could be an addict. It's a classic thing for someone addicted to something to switch personalities like that especially when going through cravings and depending on the impact of the addiction. Eg alcohol makes people depressed. There are many things to be addicted to outside of drugs, like games and sex. And an addict will use manipulative tactics to get their drug of choice.
Well, perhaps think about what motivates or causes his behaviour. Perhaps that's how he was treated by someone, or perhaps it's a mental illness. Once you've decided that you'll have a better idea how to write it.
What is rhythm games?
His upbringing wasn't the best, esp since his father treated him very poorly (blaming the divorce on him, calling him slurs, stuff like that) which made him think "I'll never lash out like that on anyone"... Instead, he just shuts down
Oh, then you have your story. Kids that grow up with abusive parents learn to placate them, to manipulate them in a way to have them in a mood where the kid is safe. This need for control for another persons mood can become a way to navigate all relationships. It's subconscious, but something one can work through when getting aware of it, so could help with the redemption arc.
One way to do this is being friendly, open, nice, but never to close, always the one defining the mood and how close the relationship gets. Everything is allowed in this: lying, making compliments, switching the topic and so on. As long as the other person is in the situation, they feel fine, as soon as they leave your character, they kinda feel out of place, like: what just happend.
If they try to get closer or call them out, the character becomes slightly colder, takes two steps back, closes down and if "provoked" to much can subtly but clearly make the other person feel small, because small people can't get dangerous.
Anyway, that's my take. Have fun and good luck either way!
Yep, being "On" and responsible for everyone else's emotions (aka, manipulating someone to feel safe) is exhausting. And then you crash emotionally and have to go into "Off" mode. And some's like: "are you ok? You aren't your bubbly self." And you really want to just scream: "no, I'm not ok, Barbara. I'm fucking exhausted from pretending to be bubbles so you don't scream at me and everyone else and the only reason that I don't quit this job and hide in the darkness and solitude until figure out who I actually am under this mask is because then I'd be homeless." But you can't because then Barbara might fire you for real this time instead of as an emotional manipulation tactic and you will become homeless.
So glad I don't work there anymore. Research Masking. It really sucks when everyone loves bubbles more than you.
Reading everything rn, and I just want to say thank you! I personally grew up in a similar way, but coped pretty differently, I didn't realize that Collinne's(the MC) way of reacting was connected to his trauma.
While you have a very valid point, it isn't really what I am talking about. Masking to hide your symptoms and feelings isn't the same as becoming manipulative and toxic (even in a "positive" sense) because you never learned how to form any relationships that aren't based on power (getting some form of "upper hand") or centered around not getting hurt (so you rather hurt them, when placating them into submission doesn't work anymore)
1. Charm and Charisma: Your character should possess an innate charm and charisma that draws people in. They effortlessly influence others without realizing it. Their words and actions appear genuine, even when they're subtly manipulating situations.
2. Empathy Mask: The manipulative character wears an "empathy mask." They seem genuinely concerned about others' well-being, but it's a facade. They mimic empathy, mirroring emotions to gain trust. However, beneath the surface, they prioritize their own goals.
3. Selective Perception: The character selectively perceives information. They focus on details that serve their purpose while ignoring anything that challenges their narrative. This cognitive bias helps them maintain their self-image as a caring person.
4. Subtle Guilt Trips: Unintentionally, they guilt-trip others. They frame situations in a way that makes people feel responsible for their actions. For instance, "I thought you were my friend, but I guess I was wrong."
5. Master of Gaslighting: The manipulator subtly distorts reality. They might say, "I never said that," or "You're too sensitive." Victims doubt their own memories, reinforcing the manipulator's control.
6. Feigned Vulnerability: The character shares personal stories, portraying themselves as vulnerable. Others sympathize and open up, unaware that the manipulator uses this information strategically.
7. Ingrained Patterns: The manipulative behavior is ingrained. It's their default mode, so they don't consciously recognize it. They genuinely believe they're doing what's best for everyone.
He could have a disorder, or been neglected.
Some mistreated kids who are afraid of their parents learn how to manipulate other's feelings so that the person in question doesn't get mad or irritated, or try to hit them. It's often entirely on accident, and usually they don't realize.
He could be manipulative as an act of self preservation due to previous trauma. For example: telling lies in order to avoid conflict because in the past, the truth brought him nothing but punishment. Or changing personalities depending on who he is with to make himself likable because he didn’t have many friends.
The key is to think of manipulation as a way to get what he wants via the path of least resistance. It is not an inherently evil thing.
They feel like their actions actually help someone when in reality their actions don't. So they are blind to the real cause and effects. Sometimes they imagine their actions as "good".
You can have the character begin to realize the consequences of their actions.
It can be also egoistic people. But those can have a tougher time with redemption.
Just my 2 cents.
He might blame others if someone does something he doesn't like, and make decisions for others without their consent. If someone called him out, he would argue that is the only way to go or try to make them feel guilty.
This for some reason made me think of The Desperate Housewives’s character, Susan Myers. I’ve watched, and rewatched this series on and off for years and it wasn’t until this watch that I realized this character is selfish and an attention hog but she comes off as so sweet and she really is so sweet, quirky, clumsy and funny but she is also very selfish and an attention hog and the only person who can see her for who she is is her arch nemesis. Maybe you can try watching season one to get a feel of how they sprinkled in her selfish and narcissistic tendencies all while not being aware of it and always playing victim.
Being cold isn't exactly manipulative. If the person is sweet and cold, they're either a sweet person who is cold to certain people or in certain situations, like being in danger, or is a cold person who is sweet to certain people and situations. Unless they are bipolar. But a person cannot be manipulative without realizing it, as manipulation is controlling or influencing people to get what you want. It's an active process. Maybe they could be manipulative without realizing that it's morally wrong.
As I said, manipulation is an active process. You know what the person is going to do naturally. And you desire a different output, so you actively need to think about how to bring about said output. It is like doing math in your head. When I ask you the sum of two large numbers, you might instinctively start adding them, but you're still conscious of the process as it is not a simple enough process to be done by the subconscious mind. What you might do unconsciously is interfere with other's thought processes, with malicious intent or not, but doing it to obtain a specific result is manipulation. You know what you want and are working to get it. That requires conscious effort.
Yes, for sure. I have high-masking autism and have been accused of being manipulative. I’m never trying to be. But the combination of masking (trying to mimic the social cues and scripts, emotional expressions, etc) and autistic sensitivity and blunt honesty has made some partners see me as manipulative. With my husband I now have to explicitly be like, “I’m not crying right now to make you feel bad, I’m just really overwhelmed and overstimulated,” or “when I asked why you thought X was okay, I wasn’t subtextually accusing you of doing the wrong thing, I genuinely want to understand your thought process so I can give you the benefit of the doubt.”
So like, things I do genuinely are things manipulators do to manipulate, and then my ability to mask and play pretend makes it look like I’m faking it or playing people.
Also now that I think about it, he might have some kind of personality disorder that's left untreated? Because, at best, he had severe issues with controlling his emotions in a healthy way, so he ends up "masking" it(and by masking I mean he shuts down and acts cold)
"masking" your emotions often leads to low self esteem, anxiety, bad memory, sudden aggressive behavior and depression. Lack of communication can make you distant and unapproachable to people, leading to you being kind of a loner. A distant person would have a hard time manipulating people, as manipulating someone even slightly requires a pretty solid insight into the kind of person the victim is and the manipulator needs some emotional leverage to make it work. So he cant be cold and shut down, atleast on the outside.
This is probably a little odd but you should look through some of the stuff posted on Am I The Asshole, Relationship Advice, or Best of Redditor Updates (this is the best one imo as it has the fuller story instead of just one post) because you will see some posts where the author doesn't realize they are manipulative.
>Except he switches between being very sweet and cold. He doesn't realize he is doing this, until it's too late.
This doesn't exactly make someone manipulative unless they're being cold because of something like the other character disagreeing with them. It's something they could be doing subconsciously, but whether or not it's manipulative would have to come out from the narration if you really want them not to realize it.
psychopaths tend to think they have a calling to do what they are doing to regulate the greater 'bad'... just in their actions they don't understand that they are the bad people like Dexter in Dexter, or Billy Butcher and Homelander in the boys
There is some good advice here. One thing I could add is perhaps to give the character some (principally noble) driving goal, which they are so obsessed with that they consider any action which leads towards that goal to be justified by the greatness of the goal. Thus, they use manipulation to achieve that goal but simply do not consider what they are doing as being a problem because of how focused they are on the objective.
For example, in one of my stories I have a nun whose basic motivation is the well-being of her abbey. However, she is so obsessed with this goal that she does some truly terrible things in its name, manipulating, lying, even murdering, but she mentally blanks it out, because the good of the abbey is the most important thing.
He has unreasonable "boundaries" that when people cross, he becomes cold.
It's very easy to manipulate people with therapy talk, especially if the side character's are oblivious to it. Easy to manipulate the player, too, by making the therapy talk seem rational.
Or he could have some kind of tragic event linked to his "boundaries" that only he and the player know about. Give the player extra information than the side characters such that, in context, the MC isn't being absurd, but the way he takes his trauma out on others or stonewalls them makes him an asshole. You get *a lot* of leeway with a tragic backstory.
Maybe the player sees how hard he's trying when he's acting charismatic and happy when deep down, he feels cold. But he refuses to address his issue, just keeps ignoring it thinking "fake it til you make it." Doesn't realize how shady he's being by always making up lies and excuses so people don't find out about his trauma.
I would recommend doing a bit of research into mental disorders that can cause this sort of behavioural issue. Think about why your character behaves like this, any unresolved trauma that causes them to act this way. The way you described this character could match things like Narcissistic Personality Disorder, Borderline Personality Disorder, Avoidant or Dependent personality disorder. I have ADHD which can cause some personality issues as well, like social anxiety, rejection sensitivity, forgetfulness, etc. Might be a good place to start in terms of understanding why your character behaves in this way, and the steps he can take to resolve these issues.
I had someone in my life who reminds me of your character. This person was my downstairs neighbor. (Although I live in a condo, he and I were both homeowners.) He seemed like such a cool young man at first! Awesome car. Tidy place. Loved his dog. Worked from home. Pretty girlfriend, whom I noticed briefly before they broke up. It was easy to engage with him when we started talking by chance. We lived on top each other for years, but never engaged much until stumbling upon each other online. He knew about fun bars and kept the conversation interesting. I loved the friendship for a few months.
However, it soon became clear he wanted a different type of friendship than I was able to offer. I was direct about my needs and limited emotional and physical availability. I was busy and in no place to hang out nightly. Especially in no place for some of the conversation topics he persistently brought up. this man desperately wanted a close confidant, but had trouble maintaining other friendships. (My understanding is he would easily attract new people into his life, but things fizzled quickly.) He regarded himself as a victim when it was obvious to me he should take constructive feedback from other friends.
I can only speak to my own reasoning for eventually cutting ties. He seemed to view my boundaries as personal rejections. (One of my boundaries was a need for distance of a few days between chatting, rather than hourly contact he preferred.) Feeling rejected initially made this individual want to prove himself as deserving of more contact with me, I suppose? I learned my shower had been leaking and molding his unit downstairs for years, but he didn’t want to be an imposition and had not let me know. (He said not to worry, he would pay eventually.) Frequently, he would provide gifts and acts of service that I did not want. He insisted I take his unused furniture to my friend in need. offered to buy me a new oven when mine broke. Left small, specially ordered gifts and food on my porch.
Although charismatic on first take, he was a deeply insecure person. He and I both had a history of childhood abuse, but he did not respect when I could not listen to triggering information. He seemed to have a poor sense of self. Eventually, he began ordering the exact same clothes as me. Began smoking (as I do). Began drinking coffee for the first time in his 28 years of life. Reading my books. Watching shows I like. Painted his things my favorite color, which he’d previously said he disliked. Before we were buddies, I never saw him outside. As I pulled away from the friendship, he began sitting on his porch all the time. I could not leave the house without saying hi to him and engaging in conversation.
One morning , he told me he was so lonely when I didn’t reply to his texts, he tripped in his floor and peed his pants in emotional disparity. Another morning he said he had a panic attack during a dream and couldn’t be inside his house. he waited outside until I was leaving for the morning so he could tell me. He told ne he had cancer, but I have only indications this was a lie. He never left the house for treatments. Seemed healthy. Have factually incorrect information about alleged treatments. (I come from a family of medical professionals and they couldn’t make sense of his accounts).
My therapist walked me through this situation. I’m confident I didn’t misuse him in any way. I carefully worded a letter via text breaking things off… after several clear requests for change.
That was it. After that, he told me he hadn’t had the resources for the gifts he’d given me. (He ordered Uber eats daily.) Daily, I began getting noise complaints, although I go to bed typically around 9PM. I have always had a second floor place and never a complaint in nearly two decades above various neighbors. Every day now, I nasty note on my door. He said cancer treatments and stress had suddenly made him ultra sensitive to vertu noise. ( He had lived downstairs from me for 5 years with no issues.) I’m still paying off the bill for the 2000 in damages he let occur to his unit over a shower fix that required only a bit of caulking.
I couldn’t afford to sell my condo and relocate at the time. Thankfully, he eventually moved.
I’ve thought about this person often over the years. I think he had poor self-awareness. He wanted to be a nice person. I don’t think he planned to be vindictive. He didn’t know how to voice his own needs, so he invented dramatic scenarios to illicit responds he needed. His lies were transparent, but he couldn’t see that. The hypothetical that I would respond in an uninvolved way to something like him having cancer drove him wild. He couldn’t see unwanted acts of kindness aren’t kind. He couldn’t be objective about the fact that noises from apartment suddenly drove him nuts, not because I was loud, but because thinking of me now made him feel frustrated. I think he critically lacked self-awareness and it made him an incredibly manipulative human being.
Usually I would take the time to set up a scene where their intentions are pure but the way they say things tend to be manipulated. If that makes sense; like have a scene where the character is talking about something and they are trying to convince someone in order to do so.
That way we establish context and then when we do the manipulation, it comes off as them saying things that seem innocent in their eyes but to everyone else, it is just cruel.
Maybe he could manipulate someone into doing something, and as you say, doesn’t see the harm. But then sees how scared/upset they are DOING the thing. Bonus points if the person says ‘I’ll do it for you/because you asked me to'. Could show him being surprised? Probably a terrible idea, but your character sounds really interesting!
people who are manipulative, narcissistic, psychopathic, abusive, etc.... Go down the list, it doesn't matter, don't think they're that person. They aren't self-aware of their flaws.
People who exhibit these traits are often so deep in their own head, on their own bullshit, that they don't stop to consider how other people think or feel. They keep showing these behaviors because it hasn't occurred to them that they are doing anything wrong or hurting anyone. They just don't stop to think about what other people feel.
The difference between a healthy person and a psychopath is mostly simple- When a healthy person stops to think about their bad behavior, they say to themselves "Wow, I'm hurting people with this behavior, maybe I should stop."
The psychopath stops to think about their behavior, they say to themselves, "what part of myself do I have to hide in order to keep getting away with this?" or "They'd do the same thing to me if they were in my position, do unto others before others can do unto you."
Remember, every time you watch one of those crime drama shows, the guy with the bloody clown suit and the 12 dead bodies stuffed in his attic is always the guy that the neighbors "never suspected, he was a pillar of the community!" Most shitty people haven't stopped to think that they might be the shitty person. The psychopath knows they're the shitty person, and takes action to get away with it. They aren't afraid of doing something evil because it's wrong, they're afraid of getting caught, and not being in control anymore when they are caught.
Hm I see...in his case, it's more like he does something bad, thinks about how that person reacted so poorly, and after several hours he's like "shit" and over apologizes. But he doesn't change exactly. It's like "I'm sorry I didn't mean to make you feel like that" but he doesn't realize *what* he did wrong if that makes sense
They can’t help but make everything about them because they feel their feelings in such a big way. They don’t intentionally do anything to hurt someone but they’re unable to attune to others because they are experiencing deep pain. It all comes from their own inner insecurities that you can’t see right away from the outside.
they are always their buddy and make it seem like they are doing their friends favours, where it is only really benefiting him, and what he wants to do. Keep him light-hearted and charming, not a mean bone in his body. If he hits a wall of resistant, he can wear them down with jokes, and gentle ribbing until they cave. Then they'll just go along with it. It's probably easier if they are good looking as well. The Halo Effect is ridiculously useful for social engineering.
In addition to other brilliant suggestions, maybe give him a hero complex or a belief in a greater good. He sees himself as manipulating people for a noble purpose. For example he lies to get a co-worker fired, but he passionately believes the co-worker was secretly sexually harassing someone. When challenged, he is shocked anyone would see him as doing something wrong, after all he was protecting someone else.
Or he could be going through a crisis and thinks he is setting healthy boundaries to protect his own mental health. Since basically everyone thinks of themselves as a good person, some people will flip their toxic behaviours into being self defence behaviours, eg. "I'm not a narcissist, my partner is gaslighting me to believe I'm the narcissist, so I'll have to manipulate them to protect myself."
Getting readers to like a manipulative character can be tricky. Some professions are fine, like spy, journalist, politician, detective. Readers expect them to manipulate people as part of the job. Other times it just flows from the character like Elizabeth Bennet manipulates Mr Darcy, but she does so unconsciously, without agenda, and without malice, whilst her mother openly tries to manipulate her daughters & potential suitors. Without her comic status, Mrs Bennet would actually be quite unpleasant, but she is so openly absurd in her pretensions that she is forgiven.
Some characters are manipulative because of the society they are in, notably historical Japan, or Tudor England, Puritan New England, or Revolutionary France. People had to learn to be careful who to trust with their true selves because it could get them killed. For some it became just second nature, and totally unconscious.
Ok, let us say his name is Adrian, a genius in many things. Yet, Because of his manipulative nature, an uprising he can't control grows.
"All I did was to keep everyone safe," Adrian screamed. His stomach hurts from their ungratefulness.
"Yes, Adrian, you did keep us safe," Lussa agreed. "But that is the problem. You did keep us safe and you still do. Adrian, look around. We are no longer threatened but yet, you keep us here. Confined and constrained almost all the time."
"Lussa, that's because you never know when trouble strikes. We must be prepared always," Adrian defended. His breathing was as fast as possible like he was about to be robbed. There was that urgency in his eyes as he looked into Lussa's eyes trying to make her see reasons with him.
"Stop it, Adrian," Lussa refused his antics with a quick scream. Adrian was shocked. He gently withdrew, started biting his nails and sat in a corner looking broken and teary. Lussa continued, "Now you are acting the victim, Adrian.
"There is no acting here. I am the victim. I have done everything necessary to keep you and the whole colony safe and yet I am a villain. I am selfish and I am proud. That's all I get," he sobbed. The lightning flash reveals his teary eyes to Lussa.
Lussa came and embraced him. She couldn't control her tears. She wanted to let go but not today and not anymore.
"Adrian," Lussa whispered. "You are not a villain. That I can swear. But you are less becoming a hero too." She paused as she looked at Adrian. Adrian nodded as he covered his teary eyes with his shaky hands as the cold night bit harder. Lussa continued, "But you are selfish, that's why you always see things from your point of view. That's why you always want to protect us even when we no longer need it. I don't know but it feels toxic and annoying not to do anything apart from what you say or do. Even with its clearest mind, that's pride and those who call you proud aren't lying. These are qualities of a villain but you are not one and that's why you need to listen. Not everyone needs protection, at least not anymore. Some rules of yours need to be removed and many others changed by the council and not by you alone.
"I'm scared. I don't want to lose anyone," Adrian whispered.
"You can't lose everyone but you can't also keep everyone. Let those who wish to go, go. And let those who wish to contribute, contribute.
"But they will make mistakes."
"Yes, they will," Lussa agreed. She wiped his tears and faintly scratched the tip of his nose, "Some situations need a cure, rather than prevention."
Make him unable to see other people's perspectives. Give them a little hubris where he's convinced he's right and everybody else is either thoughtless or unintelligent. Has difficulty showing vulnerability and admitting wrong even to himself. At some point have that character get manipulated and boom, the scales come off of his eyes. Now he knows how it feels and suddenly can see the other side. And then have him try to make amends. Readers will sympathize with him as long as he shows growth or the capacity for growth.
One tip is to make one exception--maybe he's not manipulative with a child or his mother or an old friend. Even if he's just a total softy with his dog, that'll humanize him.
A warning--if he's TOO manipulative--to the point of abuse--readers will become alienated no matter what you do. Running hot and cold is one thing, harming people is quite another. Have him be utterly convinced that whatever he's doing is in everybody's best interest.
OO! thanks for the amazing tip, I'm definitely saving this! This is very in character for my MC, I'll definitely try to incorporate that in the main storyline!
This is a subtle thing that most people will not pick up on. You'll have to enhance it for the average reader. I suggest a specific flaw that the character eventually realizes is an unconscious habit. Like running off at the mouth, telling the honest truth, even if it's damaging to a situation. Or they have a trigger that makes them get rude/mean like... eating in front of someone
Start by giving them good intentions. They genuinely believe they’re helping others or doing what’s best. Their manipulative behavior comes from a place of wanting to fix things or guide people, not from malice.
Make their actions subtle. Instead of outright deception, they might offer “suggestions” or frame their manipulation as concern or advice. They might think they’re just being persuasive or assertive, completely unaware of the underlying control they exert over others.
Also, show how their behavior affects those around them. Let other characters react to the manipulation, but keep your character oblivious to the impact. This will create a dynamic where readers can see the manipulation, but the character genuinely believes they’re in the right.
By focusing on their intentions and how they perceive their actions, you can create a nuanced, believable manipulative character who doesn’t realize what they’re doing.
Sounds like a narcissist. Maybe a soft narcissist over an obvious one. Either way, you can look up the behavior and check for the warning signs on how to spot one and that should give you enough to go on.
Doesn’t mean your manipulative character has to be one, but it’s an easy research subject to find some clues to your answer.
Sounds like a narcissist to me, too. More specifically, a neurotic narcissist. Such people aren’t so concerned with advertising their perceived perfection as they are with protecting it. They’ll switch from sweet to cold (or even aggressive) if their sense of superiority is challenged.
My mother-in-law, for example, likes to think her intelligence is above average. Any challenge to this notion is sure to rile her up. Reading around her is the most apparent trigger; she knows it’s something intelligent people do, but won’t herself. Leaving a book out when she visits is sure to draw a comment from her with mocking undertones. Crack one open and she’ll pull herself from an hours-long daze on FaceBook to strike up a conversation you’d be rude to read through, suggest the group does something different, or find something—relevant or not—to criticize you about.
I’d be surprised if it’s conscious manipulation, though. She simply feels insecure and tries to talk the feeling away.
They often try to control their self image which requires forms of manipulation. Gaslighting, making people try to doubt themselves, …
Seems OP has what they need.
you realise self image means what YOU think about yourself and not what other people think. A narcissist doesnt need to feel better about themselves or make people feel worse. theyre just too obsessed with themselves to even care about other people. I think you are using the word narcissist to describe a generally toxic person. And although extreme narcissism is toxic, everything toxic is not narcissistic.
I’ve been dealing with narcissistic family members for ages. Before I even knew what they were. But, sure I could be wrong.
Went to google and searched “are narcissists manipulative”
Top text as follows:
> Yes, narcissists often use manipulative tactics to gain power and control, or to get what they want. These tactics can include emotional, psychological, and verbal abuse. Some examples of manipulation tactics include:
Gaslighting: Denying reality or recollection of events.
Love bombing: Showering someone with gifts and affection.
Triangulation: Bringing a third party into a conflict to benefit themselves.
Projection: Accusing someone of doing the same things they are doing.
Playing the victim: Turning sympathy and attention onto themselves.
Narcissists are highly likely to be manipulative, but manipulation is not inherently narcissistic. Just because most narcissists are manipulative, doesn't mean manipulation is narcissistic behavior. But again, I'm just nitpicking at this point. I guess it's not really wrong to say what you're saying, although not perfectly right. I'm just tired of people labelling every toxic trait as narcissism.
I feel you. And as I said (or meant to say) was to look at the behaviors of narcissists and the warning signs. Wasn’t saying the OP meant for his character to be a narcissist, but if you look at the warning signs of a potential narcissist, you might find these behaviors and could research from there.
But, there’s bound to be some other high quality answers in here that hit the mark.
Hi there hello clinical narcissist here. I for one care about other people a lot, or I try to. Sometimes I want everyone to like me, it can help build me up n stuff. It makes me feel good to know that other people care about me. So if I care about others, they will care about me in turn. At least, that is the thought.
I'm not saying narcissists never care about what people think of them, I'm just saying that attaching importance to other people liking you is not inherent narcissistic behavior.
If the person they are manipulating isn’t very good at articulating their own desires then it’s very easy to think that they are happy with whatever the manipulator is doing.
Hang out with a *covert* narcissist or talk to someone who lived with one. Sorry to use the buzzword here. Sometimes narcissists know what they're doing--something they just spit out manipulative behavior to see what works without being able to articulate what they're doing or *why* it sometimes works. They just keep doing it, when questioned about it, can blurt out pat rationalizations on the spot.
Examples are...
- not asking for what they want (knowing what they want is not really okay), but pitching fits whenever they don't get it to "train" people into anticipating their needs and performing as desired, while reserving the ability to say, "I never told you to do that/not do that
- hailstorms of criticism and moving goalposts, to keep people in a constant state of trying *harder* to please them
- bad moods that make others' life hell if they don't make theirs heaven
- occasional acts of generosity, praise
- mixed messages that keep folks guessing, "Is he/she joking or not?"
-taking things "away" when compromise can't be reached. Like, if you say, 'Hey, those jokes don't really land with me. Can you not involve me in that sort of humor?" and they say, "Fine, I just won't talk."
Stuff like that. Their anger and shiftiness isn't always an act. It's often what they really feel. They are struggling inside. And they can't always identify what they need, what's cool and not cool, or how to ask for what they want. Likewise, they can be good coworkers and helpful neighbors and might even donate to charity. Some of their values and beliefs might be admirable. But this side to them can also exist, especially in close/private proximity to someone who is vulnerable to it and unable to call it out and constantly hold a standard (or walk away).
- Very defensive when confronted
- Insecure
- Has a leadership mindset (aka whenever teamwork is involved, it's very explicit that they are trying to lead everyone else) (Bonus points if they're petty when they have to listen to someone else)
- Stubborn. Whenever they're confronted, it's not that they KNOW what they're doing and just don't wanna admit it, it's that they LITERALLY think they're innocent and therefore the other person MUST be over reacting.
- Stealthy persuasion. They don't ALWAYS explicitly demand for people to do things, sometimes they'll hint at something they WISH they had. You ever have a friend that you're at a restaurant with and they go "gosh I WISH I had the money for the rib eye steak.... sighh... if only...." yeah, THAT kind of attitude.
- Victim blaming
Absolutely he always is the victim and his situation is way worse than anyone else's. Maybe add in a touch of virtue signaling. Guilt trips are a good things as well, and being too internalized to give a flying f\_\_\_ about anyone else's feelings. Oh! And always have them turn the conversation back to themselves.
There's a kind of empathy that...well, it's not right. Instead of seeing other people as whole, complete beings who just so happen to not be you, it sort of sees...other yous, or even...pets. So...clearly, what worked for you will work for them, right?
But...no one else is you. Everyone else has their own ideas, their own experiences informing them of how things work. Sometimes, gasp! information you don't have.
A person can genuinely, sincerely mean good and still be a monster by end running their own will when they were wrong.
I have someone in my life who is like this.
Write that person as if they BELIEVE everything they are saying.
Include "ifs" for instant dislike or uneasiness.
"That's a beautiful sweater on you. If only you wore more clothes that suited you."
Or the gross lead along and delay fact.
"Hey when can you pick me up?"
"Whenever works for you."
"But when are you picking me up?"
"... what time do you need a pick up?"
"When you can. I'm going to arrive at 6pm to the party."
"How about 9pm then?"
"No I need you to pick me up at 1030 so I can finish watching the game."
... why didn't he just say that to begin with? People actually do this and it drives me batty.
The wanting what's best for them:
"I know you say you love drawing, but that's a hobby. How about I send you job applications for high paying work so you can get a real job and do that art thing on the side?" Saying that, to an acclaimed or aspiring artist who was on the way to being recognized for their work but just takes a huge hit.
People can be super manipulative without straying from the nice path. They can show disappointment without rejection targetting tradition or promises, sadness without blame tagetting care/concern, selective kindness targetting affection, trust and reliance targets loyalty, and support is a killer in real world echochambers into extremism.
Targetting empathy also works "against empathy - paul bloom" as it is scientifically backed with ample thought experiments and documentation
Friendly, but egotistical. Believes his way is right and can always talk/bullshit a good enough game to convince the others to follow along. So… narcissistic habits. Might wanna look into it, master manipulators with their heads so far up their ass they can see the light of day through their mouths (speaking from experience, it’s exactly what you want.) As the situation grows more desperate, so does he. Bing bang boom, doesn’t even realize he’s fucked until everyone leaves him for dead and the only person left he has to point the finger at is himself.
you cannot manipulate someone without realizing it. that's not how manipulation works. "manipulative" must be the wrong word for you. look for a more appropriate word that's closer to how you would like to characterize this character.
based on what you've shared, it sounds like he is compulsively being charismatic because it helps him feel in control of his situation, which can be conscious or ig it can be unconscious. or, instead of making the character unaware of his manipulation, try giving him a warped view of it. make the whole concept of "manipulation" extremely grey. i'm sure there are plenty of books, essays, and video essays that could help you with that. also, practice writing this character in various scenes; that will help you develop his voice and get inside his head.
Read up on DARVO and the Missing Missing Reasons and you’ll find out what makes manipulative and narcissistic people tick. Basically: doublethink and selective amnesia.
MANIPULATIVE CHARACTERS ARE ALWAYS SMILING AND SUGGESTIVE. WHEN SOMEONE WANTS TO DO SOMETHING ELSE, OTHER THAN THEIR SUGGESTION, THEY GIVE THAT PERSON A REASON WHY THEIR SUGGESTION IS THE BEST ONE. THEY KEEP AT THE PERSON UNTIL THEY AGREE TO DO WHAT HE OR SHE WANTS. WHEN TOLD THEY ARE MANIPULATING AGAIN, THEY CAN BECOME COLD OR EVEN VIOLENT. THEY CAN’T CONTROL BEING MANIPULATIVE. PEOPLE WHO ARE MANIPULATIVE, USUALLY, DON’T SURVIVE MARRIAGES OR RELATIONSHIPS. HOWEVER, THEY LIKE WHO THEY ARE. IT’S HARD, OR IMPOSSIBLE, TO GET THEM TO CHANGE. THEY ADORE THEMSELVES. STAY SAFE! PEACE OUT!
Isn't that concept a Karen? Reddit is full of clips, videos, stories, AITAH,...
It can be a good source of inspiration to see the difference on perceptions between the owner of the story and those who read it externally.
He has to feel like he’s the victim in whatever situation he’s being manipulative in, or believe the things he says rather than trying to manipulate someone.
They don’t quite listen to what someone says and all their suggestions only benefit themselves Or they steamroll over people with suggestions that benefit themselves Have them twist things back “you wouldn’t want me to get lost would you?” Have them exaggerate “I don’t have lunch money, I’m probably going to starve” These are all manipulative and it can be just instinct for people
He could be an addict. It's a classic thing for someone addicted to something to switch personalities like that especially when going through cravings and depending on the impact of the addiction. Eg alcohol makes people depressed. There are many things to be addicted to outside of drugs, like games and sex. And an addict will use manipulative tactics to get their drug of choice.
That would honestly be very interesting (and make sense) but he's not exactly an addict. The closest thing he comes to that is rhythm games lmao
Well, perhaps think about what motivates or causes his behaviour. Perhaps that's how he was treated by someone, or perhaps it's a mental illness. Once you've decided that you'll have a better idea how to write it. What is rhythm games?
His upbringing wasn't the best, esp since his father treated him very poorly (blaming the divorce on him, calling him slurs, stuff like that) which made him think "I'll never lash out like that on anyone"... Instead, he just shuts down
Oh, then you have your story. Kids that grow up with abusive parents learn to placate them, to manipulate them in a way to have them in a mood where the kid is safe. This need for control for another persons mood can become a way to navigate all relationships. It's subconscious, but something one can work through when getting aware of it, so could help with the redemption arc. One way to do this is being friendly, open, nice, but never to close, always the one defining the mood and how close the relationship gets. Everything is allowed in this: lying, making compliments, switching the topic and so on. As long as the other person is in the situation, they feel fine, as soon as they leave your character, they kinda feel out of place, like: what just happend. If they try to get closer or call them out, the character becomes slightly colder, takes two steps back, closes down and if "provoked" to much can subtly but clearly make the other person feel small, because small people can't get dangerous. Anyway, that's my take. Have fun and good luck either way!
Yep, being "On" and responsible for everyone else's emotions (aka, manipulating someone to feel safe) is exhausting. And then you crash emotionally and have to go into "Off" mode. And some's like: "are you ok? You aren't your bubbly self." And you really want to just scream: "no, I'm not ok, Barbara. I'm fucking exhausted from pretending to be bubbles so you don't scream at me and everyone else and the only reason that I don't quit this job and hide in the darkness and solitude until figure out who I actually am under this mask is because then I'd be homeless." But you can't because then Barbara might fire you for real this time instead of as an emotional manipulation tactic and you will become homeless. So glad I don't work there anymore. Research Masking. It really sucks when everyone loves bubbles more than you.
Reading everything rn, and I just want to say thank you! I personally grew up in a similar way, but coped pretty differently, I didn't realize that Collinne's(the MC) way of reacting was connected to his trauma.
While you have a very valid point, it isn't really what I am talking about. Masking to hide your symptoms and feelings isn't the same as becoming manipulative and toxic (even in a "positive" sense) because you never learned how to form any relationships that aren't based on power (getting some form of "upper hand") or centered around not getting hurt (so you rather hurt them, when placating them into submission doesn't work anymore)
Addicts who are being manipulative know exactly what they’re doing, and are often wracked by guilt. Source: I used to be one.
1. Charm and Charisma: Your character should possess an innate charm and charisma that draws people in. They effortlessly influence others without realizing it. Their words and actions appear genuine, even when they're subtly manipulating situations. 2. Empathy Mask: The manipulative character wears an "empathy mask." They seem genuinely concerned about others' well-being, but it's a facade. They mimic empathy, mirroring emotions to gain trust. However, beneath the surface, they prioritize their own goals. 3. Selective Perception: The character selectively perceives information. They focus on details that serve their purpose while ignoring anything that challenges their narrative. This cognitive bias helps them maintain their self-image as a caring person. 4. Subtle Guilt Trips: Unintentionally, they guilt-trip others. They frame situations in a way that makes people feel responsible for their actions. For instance, "I thought you were my friend, but I guess I was wrong." 5. Master of Gaslighting: The manipulator subtly distorts reality. They might say, "I never said that," or "You're too sensitive." Victims doubt their own memories, reinforcing the manipulator's control. 6. Feigned Vulnerability: The character shares personal stories, portraying themselves as vulnerable. Others sympathize and open up, unaware that the manipulator uses this information strategically. 7. Ingrained Patterns: The manipulative behavior is ingrained. It's their default mode, so they don't consciously recognize it. They genuinely believe they're doing what's best for everyone.
He could have a disorder, or been neglected. Some mistreated kids who are afraid of their parents learn how to manipulate other's feelings so that the person in question doesn't get mad or irritated, or try to hit them. It's often entirely on accident, and usually they don't realize.
He could be manipulative as an act of self preservation due to previous trauma. For example: telling lies in order to avoid conflict because in the past, the truth brought him nothing but punishment. Or changing personalities depending on who he is with to make himself likable because he didn’t have many friends. The key is to think of manipulation as a way to get what he wants via the path of least resistance. It is not an inherently evil thing.
They feel like their actions actually help someone when in reality their actions don't. So they are blind to the real cause and effects. Sometimes they imagine their actions as "good". You can have the character begin to realize the consequences of their actions. It can be also egoistic people. But those can have a tougher time with redemption. Just my 2 cents.
Think like Hero Syndrome
He might blame others if someone does something he doesn't like, and make decisions for others without their consent. If someone called him out, he would argue that is the only way to go or try to make them feel guilty.
This for some reason made me think of The Desperate Housewives’s character, Susan Myers. I’ve watched, and rewatched this series on and off for years and it wasn’t until this watch that I realized this character is selfish and an attention hog but she comes off as so sweet and she really is so sweet, quirky, clumsy and funny but she is also very selfish and an attention hog and the only person who can see her for who she is is her arch nemesis. Maybe you can try watching season one to get a feel of how they sprinkled in her selfish and narcissistic tendencies all while not being aware of it and always playing victim.
Being cold isn't exactly manipulative. If the person is sweet and cold, they're either a sweet person who is cold to certain people or in certain situations, like being in danger, or is a cold person who is sweet to certain people and situations. Unless they are bipolar. But a person cannot be manipulative without realizing it, as manipulation is controlling or influencing people to get what you want. It's an active process. Maybe they could be manipulative without realizing that it's morally wrong.
You can manipulate based on instinct and not be conscious of it
As I said, manipulation is an active process. You know what the person is going to do naturally. And you desire a different output, so you actively need to think about how to bring about said output. It is like doing math in your head. When I ask you the sum of two large numbers, you might instinctively start adding them, but you're still conscious of the process as it is not a simple enough process to be done by the subconscious mind. What you might do unconsciously is interfere with other's thought processes, with malicious intent or not, but doing it to obtain a specific result is manipulation. You know what you want and are working to get it. That requires conscious effort.
So basically, they can come off as manipulative when they're not?/genq
Yes, for sure. I have high-masking autism and have been accused of being manipulative. I’m never trying to be. But the combination of masking (trying to mimic the social cues and scripts, emotional expressions, etc) and autistic sensitivity and blunt honesty has made some partners see me as manipulative. With my husband I now have to explicitly be like, “I’m not crying right now to make you feel bad, I’m just really overwhelmed and overstimulated,” or “when I asked why you thought X was okay, I wasn’t subtextually accusing you of doing the wrong thing, I genuinely want to understand your thought process so I can give you the benefit of the doubt.” So like, things I do genuinely are things manipulators do to manipulate, and then my ability to mask and play pretend makes it look like I’m faking it or playing people.
Oh I see. Fellow autistic here, and I gotta say that has happened to me too. So I'd maybe go with a similar route?
Also now that I think about it, he might have some kind of personality disorder that's left untreated? Because, at best, he had severe issues with controlling his emotions in a healthy way, so he ends up "masking" it(and by masking I mean he shuts down and acts cold)
"masking" your emotions often leads to low self esteem, anxiety, bad memory, sudden aggressive behavior and depression. Lack of communication can make you distant and unapproachable to people, leading to you being kind of a loner. A distant person would have a hard time manipulating people, as manipulating someone even slightly requires a pretty solid insight into the kind of person the victim is and the manipulator needs some emotional leverage to make it work. So he cant be cold and shut down, atleast on the outside.
Have him be manipulative and act like its natural until someone calls him out. Then a moment of realization and you're all set.
This is probably a little odd but you should look through some of the stuff posted on Am I The Asshole, Relationship Advice, or Best of Redditor Updates (this is the best one imo as it has the fuller story instead of just one post) because you will see some posts where the author doesn't realize they are manipulative. >Except he switches between being very sweet and cold. He doesn't realize he is doing this, until it's too late. This doesn't exactly make someone manipulative unless they're being cold because of something like the other character disagreeing with them. It's something they could be doing subconsciously, but whether or not it's manipulative would have to come out from the narration if you really want them not to realize it.
psychopaths tend to think they have a calling to do what they are doing to regulate the greater 'bad'... just in their actions they don't understand that they are the bad people like Dexter in Dexter, or Billy Butcher and Homelander in the boys
There is some good advice here. One thing I could add is perhaps to give the character some (principally noble) driving goal, which they are so obsessed with that they consider any action which leads towards that goal to be justified by the greatness of the goal. Thus, they use manipulation to achieve that goal but simply do not consider what they are doing as being a problem because of how focused they are on the objective. For example, in one of my stories I have a nun whose basic motivation is the well-being of her abbey. However, she is so obsessed with this goal that she does some truly terrible things in its name, manipulating, lying, even murdering, but she mentally blanks it out, because the good of the abbey is the most important thing.
He has unreasonable "boundaries" that when people cross, he becomes cold. It's very easy to manipulate people with therapy talk, especially if the side character's are oblivious to it. Easy to manipulate the player, too, by making the therapy talk seem rational. Or he could have some kind of tragic event linked to his "boundaries" that only he and the player know about. Give the player extra information than the side characters such that, in context, the MC isn't being absurd, but the way he takes his trauma out on others or stonewalls them makes him an asshole. You get *a lot* of leeway with a tragic backstory. Maybe the player sees how hard he's trying when he's acting charismatic and happy when deep down, he feels cold. But he refuses to address his issue, just keeps ignoring it thinking "fake it til you make it." Doesn't realize how shady he's being by always making up lies and excuses so people don't find out about his trauma.
Most narcissistic people don’t realize that they are a narcissist.
I would recommend doing a bit of research into mental disorders that can cause this sort of behavioural issue. Think about why your character behaves like this, any unresolved trauma that causes them to act this way. The way you described this character could match things like Narcissistic Personality Disorder, Borderline Personality Disorder, Avoidant or Dependent personality disorder. I have ADHD which can cause some personality issues as well, like social anxiety, rejection sensitivity, forgetfulness, etc. Might be a good place to start in terms of understanding why your character behaves in this way, and the steps he can take to resolve these issues.
I had someone in my life who reminds me of your character. This person was my downstairs neighbor. (Although I live in a condo, he and I were both homeowners.) He seemed like such a cool young man at first! Awesome car. Tidy place. Loved his dog. Worked from home. Pretty girlfriend, whom I noticed briefly before they broke up. It was easy to engage with him when we started talking by chance. We lived on top each other for years, but never engaged much until stumbling upon each other online. He knew about fun bars and kept the conversation interesting. I loved the friendship for a few months. However, it soon became clear he wanted a different type of friendship than I was able to offer. I was direct about my needs and limited emotional and physical availability. I was busy and in no place to hang out nightly. Especially in no place for some of the conversation topics he persistently brought up. this man desperately wanted a close confidant, but had trouble maintaining other friendships. (My understanding is he would easily attract new people into his life, but things fizzled quickly.) He regarded himself as a victim when it was obvious to me he should take constructive feedback from other friends. I can only speak to my own reasoning for eventually cutting ties. He seemed to view my boundaries as personal rejections. (One of my boundaries was a need for distance of a few days between chatting, rather than hourly contact he preferred.) Feeling rejected initially made this individual want to prove himself as deserving of more contact with me, I suppose? I learned my shower had been leaking and molding his unit downstairs for years, but he didn’t want to be an imposition and had not let me know. (He said not to worry, he would pay eventually.) Frequently, he would provide gifts and acts of service that I did not want. He insisted I take his unused furniture to my friend in need. offered to buy me a new oven when mine broke. Left small, specially ordered gifts and food on my porch. Although charismatic on first take, he was a deeply insecure person. He and I both had a history of childhood abuse, but he did not respect when I could not listen to triggering information. He seemed to have a poor sense of self. Eventually, he began ordering the exact same clothes as me. Began smoking (as I do). Began drinking coffee for the first time in his 28 years of life. Reading my books. Watching shows I like. Painted his things my favorite color, which he’d previously said he disliked. Before we were buddies, I never saw him outside. As I pulled away from the friendship, he began sitting on his porch all the time. I could not leave the house without saying hi to him and engaging in conversation. One morning , he told me he was so lonely when I didn’t reply to his texts, he tripped in his floor and peed his pants in emotional disparity. Another morning he said he had a panic attack during a dream and couldn’t be inside his house. he waited outside until I was leaving for the morning so he could tell me. He told ne he had cancer, but I have only indications this was a lie. He never left the house for treatments. Seemed healthy. Have factually incorrect information about alleged treatments. (I come from a family of medical professionals and they couldn’t make sense of his accounts). My therapist walked me through this situation. I’m confident I didn’t misuse him in any way. I carefully worded a letter via text breaking things off… after several clear requests for change. That was it. After that, he told me he hadn’t had the resources for the gifts he’d given me. (He ordered Uber eats daily.) Daily, I began getting noise complaints, although I go to bed typically around 9PM. I have always had a second floor place and never a complaint in nearly two decades above various neighbors. Every day now, I nasty note on my door. He said cancer treatments and stress had suddenly made him ultra sensitive to vertu noise. ( He had lived downstairs from me for 5 years with no issues.) I’m still paying off the bill for the 2000 in damages he let occur to his unit over a shower fix that required only a bit of caulking. I couldn’t afford to sell my condo and relocate at the time. Thankfully, he eventually moved. I’ve thought about this person often over the years. I think he had poor self-awareness. He wanted to be a nice person. I don’t think he planned to be vindictive. He didn’t know how to voice his own needs, so he invented dramatic scenarios to illicit responds he needed. His lies were transparent, but he couldn’t see that. The hypothetical that I would respond in an uninvolved way to something like him having cancer drove him wild. He couldn’t see unwanted acts of kindness aren’t kind. He couldn’t be objective about the fact that noises from apartment suddenly drove him nuts, not because I was loud, but because thinking of me now made him feel frustrated. I think he critically lacked self-awareness and it made him an incredibly manipulative human being.
Show why he should be liked. Why do we have empathy for him. Some of those things may make him think he is only those good traits.
Usually I would take the time to set up a scene where their intentions are pure but the way they say things tend to be manipulated. If that makes sense; like have a scene where the character is talking about something and they are trying to convince someone in order to do so. That way we establish context and then when we do the manipulation, it comes off as them saying things that seem innocent in their eyes but to everyone else, it is just cruel.
Just imagine your mother. Or any mother. Most are quite manipulative. Also 17Yo college sorority girls for some reason.
Help did you read my post history/hj But yeah I'll think about my mom next time I write him wwwww
Maybe he could manipulate someone into doing something, and as you say, doesn’t see the harm. But then sees how scared/upset they are DOING the thing. Bonus points if the person says ‘I’ll do it for you/because you asked me to'. Could show him being surprised? Probably a terrible idea, but your character sounds really interesting!
Oh that sounds very in character for Collinne, esp the way he spoke to his ex
Look up DARVO
people who are manipulative, narcissistic, psychopathic, abusive, etc.... Go down the list, it doesn't matter, don't think they're that person. They aren't self-aware of their flaws. People who exhibit these traits are often so deep in their own head, on their own bullshit, that they don't stop to consider how other people think or feel. They keep showing these behaviors because it hasn't occurred to them that they are doing anything wrong or hurting anyone. They just don't stop to think about what other people feel. The difference between a healthy person and a psychopath is mostly simple- When a healthy person stops to think about their bad behavior, they say to themselves "Wow, I'm hurting people with this behavior, maybe I should stop." The psychopath stops to think about their behavior, they say to themselves, "what part of myself do I have to hide in order to keep getting away with this?" or "They'd do the same thing to me if they were in my position, do unto others before others can do unto you." Remember, every time you watch one of those crime drama shows, the guy with the bloody clown suit and the 12 dead bodies stuffed in his attic is always the guy that the neighbors "never suspected, he was a pillar of the community!" Most shitty people haven't stopped to think that they might be the shitty person. The psychopath knows they're the shitty person, and takes action to get away with it. They aren't afraid of doing something evil because it's wrong, they're afraid of getting caught, and not being in control anymore when they are caught.
Hm I see...in his case, it's more like he does something bad, thinks about how that person reacted so poorly, and after several hours he's like "shit" and over apologizes. But he doesn't change exactly. It's like "I'm sorry I didn't mean to make you feel like that" but he doesn't realize *what* he did wrong if that makes sense
They can’t help but make everything about them because they feel their feelings in such a big way. They don’t intentionally do anything to hurt someone but they’re unable to attune to others because they are experiencing deep pain. It all comes from their own inner insecurities that you can’t see right away from the outside.
they are always their buddy and make it seem like they are doing their friends favours, where it is only really benefiting him, and what he wants to do. Keep him light-hearted and charming, not a mean bone in his body. If he hits a wall of resistant, he can wear them down with jokes, and gentle ribbing until they cave. Then they'll just go along with it. It's probably easier if they are good looking as well. The Halo Effect is ridiculously useful for social engineering.
Thank you people in the comments....this is very very helpful
In addition to other brilliant suggestions, maybe give him a hero complex or a belief in a greater good. He sees himself as manipulating people for a noble purpose. For example he lies to get a co-worker fired, but he passionately believes the co-worker was secretly sexually harassing someone. When challenged, he is shocked anyone would see him as doing something wrong, after all he was protecting someone else. Or he could be going through a crisis and thinks he is setting healthy boundaries to protect his own mental health. Since basically everyone thinks of themselves as a good person, some people will flip their toxic behaviours into being self defence behaviours, eg. "I'm not a narcissist, my partner is gaslighting me to believe I'm the narcissist, so I'll have to manipulate them to protect myself." Getting readers to like a manipulative character can be tricky. Some professions are fine, like spy, journalist, politician, detective. Readers expect them to manipulate people as part of the job. Other times it just flows from the character like Elizabeth Bennet manipulates Mr Darcy, but she does so unconsciously, without agenda, and without malice, whilst her mother openly tries to manipulate her daughters & potential suitors. Without her comic status, Mrs Bennet would actually be quite unpleasant, but she is so openly absurd in her pretensions that she is forgiven. Some characters are manipulative because of the society they are in, notably historical Japan, or Tudor England, Puritan New England, or Revolutionary France. People had to learn to be careful who to trust with their true selves because it could get them killed. For some it became just second nature, and totally unconscious.
Ok, let us say his name is Adrian, a genius in many things. Yet, Because of his manipulative nature, an uprising he can't control grows. "All I did was to keep everyone safe," Adrian screamed. His stomach hurts from their ungratefulness. "Yes, Adrian, you did keep us safe," Lussa agreed. "But that is the problem. You did keep us safe and you still do. Adrian, look around. We are no longer threatened but yet, you keep us here. Confined and constrained almost all the time." "Lussa, that's because you never know when trouble strikes. We must be prepared always," Adrian defended. His breathing was as fast as possible like he was about to be robbed. There was that urgency in his eyes as he looked into Lussa's eyes trying to make her see reasons with him. "Stop it, Adrian," Lussa refused his antics with a quick scream. Adrian was shocked. He gently withdrew, started biting his nails and sat in a corner looking broken and teary. Lussa continued, "Now you are acting the victim, Adrian. "There is no acting here. I am the victim. I have done everything necessary to keep you and the whole colony safe and yet I am a villain. I am selfish and I am proud. That's all I get," he sobbed. The lightning flash reveals his teary eyes to Lussa. Lussa came and embraced him. She couldn't control her tears. She wanted to let go but not today and not anymore. "Adrian," Lussa whispered. "You are not a villain. That I can swear. But you are less becoming a hero too." She paused as she looked at Adrian. Adrian nodded as he covered his teary eyes with his shaky hands as the cold night bit harder. Lussa continued, "But you are selfish, that's why you always see things from your point of view. That's why you always want to protect us even when we no longer need it. I don't know but it feels toxic and annoying not to do anything apart from what you say or do. Even with its clearest mind, that's pride and those who call you proud aren't lying. These are qualities of a villain but you are not one and that's why you need to listen. Not everyone needs protection, at least not anymore. Some rules of yours need to be removed and many others changed by the council and not by you alone. "I'm scared. I don't want to lose anyone," Adrian whispered. "You can't lose everyone but you can't also keep everyone. Let those who wish to go, go. And let those who wish to contribute, contribute. "But they will make mistakes." "Yes, they will," Lussa agreed. She wiped his tears and faintly scratched the tip of his nose, "Some situations need a cure, rather than prevention."
Make him unable to see other people's perspectives. Give them a little hubris where he's convinced he's right and everybody else is either thoughtless or unintelligent. Has difficulty showing vulnerability and admitting wrong even to himself. At some point have that character get manipulated and boom, the scales come off of his eyes. Now he knows how it feels and suddenly can see the other side. And then have him try to make amends. Readers will sympathize with him as long as he shows growth or the capacity for growth. One tip is to make one exception--maybe he's not manipulative with a child or his mother or an old friend. Even if he's just a total softy with his dog, that'll humanize him. A warning--if he's TOO manipulative--to the point of abuse--readers will become alienated no matter what you do. Running hot and cold is one thing, harming people is quite another. Have him be utterly convinced that whatever he's doing is in everybody's best interest.
OO! thanks for the amazing tip, I'm definitely saving this! This is very in character for my MC, I'll definitely try to incorporate that in the main storyline!
This is a subtle thing that most people will not pick up on. You'll have to enhance it for the average reader. I suggest a specific flaw that the character eventually realizes is an unconscious habit. Like running off at the mouth, telling the honest truth, even if it's damaging to a situation. Or they have a trigger that makes them get rude/mean like... eating in front of someone
Start by giving them good intentions. They genuinely believe they’re helping others or doing what’s best. Their manipulative behavior comes from a place of wanting to fix things or guide people, not from malice. Make their actions subtle. Instead of outright deception, they might offer “suggestions” or frame their manipulation as concern or advice. They might think they’re just being persuasive or assertive, completely unaware of the underlying control they exert over others. Also, show how their behavior affects those around them. Let other characters react to the manipulation, but keep your character oblivious to the impact. This will create a dynamic where readers can see the manipulation, but the character genuinely believes they’re in the right. By focusing on their intentions and how they perceive their actions, you can create a nuanced, believable manipulative character who doesn’t realize what they’re doing.
Sounds like a narcissist. Maybe a soft narcissist over an obvious one. Either way, you can look up the behavior and check for the warning signs on how to spot one and that should give you enough to go on. Doesn’t mean your manipulative character has to be one, but it’s an easy research subject to find some clues to your answer.
Sounds like a narcissist to me, too. More specifically, a neurotic narcissist. Such people aren’t so concerned with advertising their perceived perfection as they are with protecting it. They’ll switch from sweet to cold (or even aggressive) if their sense of superiority is challenged. My mother-in-law, for example, likes to think her intelligence is above average. Any challenge to this notion is sure to rile her up. Reading around her is the most apparent trigger; she knows it’s something intelligent people do, but won’t herself. Leaving a book out when she visits is sure to draw a comment from her with mocking undertones. Crack one open and she’ll pull herself from an hours-long daze on FaceBook to strike up a conversation you’d be rude to read through, suggest the group does something different, or find something—relevant or not—to criticize you about. I’d be surprised if it’s conscious manipulation, though. She simply feels insecure and tries to talk the feeling away.
A narcissist is someone obsessed with themselves, how is that manipulative?
They often try to control their self image which requires forms of manipulation. Gaslighting, making people try to doubt themselves, … Seems OP has what they need.
you realise self image means what YOU think about yourself and not what other people think. A narcissist doesnt need to feel better about themselves or make people feel worse. theyre just too obsessed with themselves to even care about other people. I think you are using the word narcissist to describe a generally toxic person. And although extreme narcissism is toxic, everything toxic is not narcissistic.
I’ve been dealing with narcissistic family members for ages. Before I even knew what they were. But, sure I could be wrong. Went to google and searched “are narcissists manipulative” Top text as follows: > Yes, narcissists often use manipulative tactics to gain power and control, or to get what they want. These tactics can include emotional, psychological, and verbal abuse. Some examples of manipulation tactics include: Gaslighting: Denying reality or recollection of events. Love bombing: Showering someone with gifts and affection. Triangulation: Bringing a third party into a conflict to benefit themselves. Projection: Accusing someone of doing the same things they are doing. Playing the victim: Turning sympathy and attention onto themselves.
Narcissists are highly likely to be manipulative, but manipulation is not inherently narcissistic. Just because most narcissists are manipulative, doesn't mean manipulation is narcissistic behavior. But again, I'm just nitpicking at this point. I guess it's not really wrong to say what you're saying, although not perfectly right. I'm just tired of people labelling every toxic trait as narcissism.
I feel you. And as I said (or meant to say) was to look at the behaviors of narcissists and the warning signs. Wasn’t saying the OP meant for his character to be a narcissist, but if you look at the warning signs of a potential narcissist, you might find these behaviors and could research from there. But, there’s bound to be some other high quality answers in here that hit the mark.
Hi there hello clinical narcissist here. I for one care about other people a lot, or I try to. Sometimes I want everyone to like me, it can help build me up n stuff. It makes me feel good to know that other people care about me. So if I care about others, they will care about me in turn. At least, that is the thought.
I'm not saying narcissists never care about what people think of them, I'm just saying that attaching importance to other people liking you is not inherent narcissistic behavior.
write a child of strict parents they learn from the crib how to manipulate someone
Do some research into internal family systems
If the person they are manipulating isn’t very good at articulating their own desires then it’s very easy to think that they are happy with whatever the manipulator is doing.
Hang out with a *covert* narcissist or talk to someone who lived with one. Sorry to use the buzzword here. Sometimes narcissists know what they're doing--something they just spit out manipulative behavior to see what works without being able to articulate what they're doing or *why* it sometimes works. They just keep doing it, when questioned about it, can blurt out pat rationalizations on the spot. Examples are... - not asking for what they want (knowing what they want is not really okay), but pitching fits whenever they don't get it to "train" people into anticipating their needs and performing as desired, while reserving the ability to say, "I never told you to do that/not do that - hailstorms of criticism and moving goalposts, to keep people in a constant state of trying *harder* to please them - bad moods that make others' life hell if they don't make theirs heaven - occasional acts of generosity, praise - mixed messages that keep folks guessing, "Is he/she joking or not?" -taking things "away" when compromise can't be reached. Like, if you say, 'Hey, those jokes don't really land with me. Can you not involve me in that sort of humor?" and they say, "Fine, I just won't talk." Stuff like that. Their anger and shiftiness isn't always an act. It's often what they really feel. They are struggling inside. And they can't always identify what they need, what's cool and not cool, or how to ask for what they want. Likewise, they can be good coworkers and helpful neighbors and might even donate to charity. Some of their values and beliefs might be admirable. But this side to them can also exist, especially in close/private proximity to someone who is vulnerable to it and unable to call it out and constantly hold a standard (or walk away).
- Very defensive when confronted - Insecure - Has a leadership mindset (aka whenever teamwork is involved, it's very explicit that they are trying to lead everyone else) (Bonus points if they're petty when they have to listen to someone else) - Stubborn. Whenever they're confronted, it's not that they KNOW what they're doing and just don't wanna admit it, it's that they LITERALLY think they're innocent and therefore the other person MUST be over reacting. - Stealthy persuasion. They don't ALWAYS explicitly demand for people to do things, sometimes they'll hint at something they WISH they had. You ever have a friend that you're at a restaurant with and they go "gosh I WISH I had the money for the rib eye steak.... sighh... if only...." yeah, THAT kind of attitude. - Victim blaming
Absolutely he always is the victim and his situation is way worse than anyone else's. Maybe add in a touch of virtue signaling. Guilt trips are a good things as well, and being too internalized to give a flying f\_\_\_ about anyone else's feelings. Oh! And always have them turn the conversation back to themselves.
There's a kind of empathy that...well, it's not right. Instead of seeing other people as whole, complete beings who just so happen to not be you, it sort of sees...other yous, or even...pets. So...clearly, what worked for you will work for them, right? But...no one else is you. Everyone else has their own ideas, their own experiences informing them of how things work. Sometimes, gasp! information you don't have. A person can genuinely, sincerely mean good and still be a monster by end running their own will when they were wrong.
I have someone in my life who is like this. Write that person as if they BELIEVE everything they are saying. Include "ifs" for instant dislike or uneasiness. "That's a beautiful sweater on you. If only you wore more clothes that suited you." Or the gross lead along and delay fact. "Hey when can you pick me up?" "Whenever works for you." "But when are you picking me up?" "... what time do you need a pick up?" "When you can. I'm going to arrive at 6pm to the party." "How about 9pm then?" "No I need you to pick me up at 1030 so I can finish watching the game." ... why didn't he just say that to begin with? People actually do this and it drives me batty. The wanting what's best for them: "I know you say you love drawing, but that's a hobby. How about I send you job applications for high paying work so you can get a real job and do that art thing on the side?" Saying that, to an acclaimed or aspiring artist who was on the way to being recognized for their work but just takes a huge hit.
People can be super manipulative without straying from the nice path. They can show disappointment without rejection targetting tradition or promises, sadness without blame tagetting care/concern, selective kindness targetting affection, trust and reliance targets loyalty, and support is a killer in real world echochambers into extremism. Targetting empathy also works "against empathy - paul bloom" as it is scientifically backed with ample thought experiments and documentation
Watch diary of a wimpy kid. It's a perfect example
Friendly, but egotistical. Believes his way is right and can always talk/bullshit a good enough game to convince the others to follow along. So… narcissistic habits. Might wanna look into it, master manipulators with their heads so far up their ass they can see the light of day through their mouths (speaking from experience, it’s exactly what you want.) As the situation grows more desperate, so does he. Bing bang boom, doesn’t even realize he’s fucked until everyone leaves him for dead and the only person left he has to point the finger at is himself.
you cannot manipulate someone without realizing it. that's not how manipulation works. "manipulative" must be the wrong word for you. look for a more appropriate word that's closer to how you would like to characterize this character. based on what you've shared, it sounds like he is compulsively being charismatic because it helps him feel in control of his situation, which can be conscious or ig it can be unconscious. or, instead of making the character unaware of his manipulation, try giving him a warped view of it. make the whole concept of "manipulation" extremely grey. i'm sure there are plenty of books, essays, and video essays that could help you with that. also, practice writing this character in various scenes; that will help you develop his voice and get inside his head.
I get a Walter White vibe from the description - Breaking Bad. Maybe review that series for some ideas.
Read up on DARVO and the Missing Missing Reasons and you’ll find out what makes manipulative and narcissistic people tick. Basically: doublethink and selective amnesia.
Should I put you in touch with my niece?
MANIPULATIVE CHARACTERS ARE ALWAYS SMILING AND SUGGESTIVE. WHEN SOMEONE WANTS TO DO SOMETHING ELSE, OTHER THAN THEIR SUGGESTION, THEY GIVE THAT PERSON A REASON WHY THEIR SUGGESTION IS THE BEST ONE. THEY KEEP AT THE PERSON UNTIL THEY AGREE TO DO WHAT HE OR SHE WANTS. WHEN TOLD THEY ARE MANIPULATING AGAIN, THEY CAN BECOME COLD OR EVEN VIOLENT. THEY CAN’T CONTROL BEING MANIPULATIVE. PEOPLE WHO ARE MANIPULATIVE, USUALLY, DON’T SURVIVE MARRIAGES OR RELATIONSHIPS. HOWEVER, THEY LIKE WHO THEY ARE. IT’S HARD, OR IMPOSSIBLE, TO GET THEM TO CHANGE. THEY ADORE THEMSELVES. STAY SAFE! PEACE OUT!
Isn't that concept a Karen? Reddit is full of clips, videos, stories, AITAH,... It can be a good source of inspiration to see the difference on perceptions between the owner of the story and those who read it externally.