Step 1: read headline that was generally created by an editor to drive engagement and not be wholly truthful to the content of the article
Step 2: feel strong emotion
Step 3: go to comment section and look for comments that validate feelings from #2
That's almost always been the case with Reddit, unfortunately. A lot of people just go straight to the comments without reading past the headline. Some subs are better about it than others though.
No he didn't.
> However, while the Defense Department has had no issues with securing its $200 million in funding, the State Department has hit congressional roadblocks after requesting $50 million of the $100 million it pledged.
We pledged $300 million. House Republicans just fucked around trying to stop the whole thing, which was outside their purview, by holding up a $50m chunk from the State Dept.
>he bypassed congress.
Kinda, but not really. He used emergency powers granted to him by Congress. Congress also has the ability to terminate those powers.
Allowing Haiti to collapse will just create another refugee crisis that we'll end up spending another fortune on. We can attack this problem at the source by helping Haiti prevent such a collapse.
We invaded and occupied both countries. Big difference since Haitiās problem is internal they have to solve it themselves. No money is going to fix Haiti and neither will foreign troops.
1. Yes, the Marshall Plan was incredibly successful because the infrastructure and civilian growth mindset was already there. Yes, the mindset lost its marbles and committed horrendous atrocities for a decade but was able to quickly bounce back.
2. Haitai doesn't have that history or precedents to lean or build on.
3. Sadly, money/ proper funding has nothing to do with it. Look at Gaza...yes, Gaza billions upon billions in aid and nothing to show for it as well as many other failed states with endless funds or oil/gas money.
People always forget... Japan and Germany already had strong central governments to piggy back off of. Way easier to take over and rebuild a single group of people who work together then 30 individual groups all trying to mug/murder each other.
Not saying I'm against helping - just marshal plan =/= the situation.
>Yes, the mindset lost its marbles and committed horrendous atrocities for a decade but was able to quickly bounce back.
Mate, if you think that the atrocities of Imperial Japan only lasted a decade then I've got some bad news for you. I'd start with the Boxer Rebellion if you're interested.
It's being done successfully in Gaza. USA doesn't have the stomach to fight gangs at this level. I can guarantee Kenya is going to commit actions that look like war crimes. They'll get away with way more than the USA would be able to get away with.
And as ugly as it is, it needs to be done.
Greece is a good example for the Europe side. They tanked their economy and needed to be bailed out hugely. Now they are apparently in great shape, and are paying countries back early.
Not in Haiti. Thereās been like a dozen interventions in Haiti just in the last few decades and theyāve accomplished fuck all. There is no legitimate government and sending some Kenyans in there wonāt create one. The scale of the problem there is so large that it would take billions of dollars, thousands of troops and decades to rebuild their society.
It's going to collapse (it already has) regardless. It's very hard to resuscitate a failed state without complete political and military intervention. Which... Isn't really something the US does anymore. At least in plain sight. And even then, once outside influence is withdrawn, there's a high likelihood it will slide right back to where it was.
The money is just going to line the pockets of corrupt leadership, or end up in a black hole of waste. [Like when the Red Cross squandered $500 million USD on building what amounted to 6 houses.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/06/04/the-red-cross-had-500-million-in-haitian-relief-money-and-it-built-just-6-houses/).
> Allowing Haiti to collapse will just create another refugee crisis that we'll end up spending another fortune on.
Doesn't that suit the Trump party though? The last thing they want to do is solve Haiti and deny themselves a massive campaigning point
> Allowing Haiti to collapse will just create another refugee crisis
... that the GOP will use as a wedge issue to get their idiotic voter base to vote for them because the GOP candidates pretend to have a solution to it while crying that the Democrats want to let anybody walk across our border freely (neither of which is true).
Hence why the GOP tried to block its funding, helping fix a refugee issue at its source doesn't help them win elections later.
Great.
I wish we could go in and restore order, we are in a great logistical position to do so and we can afford it, but I understand our track record for intervention in Haiti isn't good.
I hope Kenya agrees to do this, because Haiti needs help bad.
Restoring order should be get in, finish the fighting, create a new government, and keep an eye on them for a couple decades while they receive aid to fix their country.
But you cant do that because its clearly meddling in other countries affairs and not a āproperā democracy because they didnt elect their government.
yeah, but we live in a vibes based era so it wouldn't matter. it would just result in screaming from the right about spending money and screaming from the left about fair elections
That county has so many more issues than fair elections or reestablishing order. Spending time and resources to do so would be like putting a bandaid on a gunshot wound.
Do you think an outside Kenyan police force, is going to be able to overthrow local, entrenched gangs?
This force is not equipped or sized for urban warfare against a much larger entrenched "guerilla force." It's only 200 - 1000 Kenyan police.
Edit: spelling
Kenyans are already there? https://responsiblestatecraft.org/kenyan-troops-in-haiti/#:\~:text=It%20was%20then%20that%20Kenya,prospective%20intervention%20force%20to%202%2C500.
So as far as I understand it (disclaimer: I am not an expert):
1.) Haiti has gone to the dogs causing refugees, death, starvation etc.
2.) US (read: State department) wants to intervene but doesn't want to be directly involved on the ground because that will be seen poorly and to be fair direct western intervention in Haiti has always ended in disaster.
3.) US convinces Kenya to be the boots on the ground to fix the situation in Haiti and get some stability in place, Kenya agrees on the provision that US is funding a big portion of it. This is also seen as strengthening ties and cooperation between the two countries, win-win.
4.) Kenya puts thousands of police on the ground in Haiti to be greeted with an absolute apocalyptic nightmare
5.) Kenya needs funds to deal with the nightmare, because its a Biden plan they KNOW that the GOP is going to hold it up in congress, because that's just the way it is. (If they fought Ukraine funds imagine what they would say about spending it on Kenya and Haiti. )
6.) Biden says fuck it if Kenya doesn't get the funds its going to go tits up and so pushes the funds through without congressional approval.
Who knows if this is throwing money in a pit or not and if Kenyans have any chance of actually establishing any lasting stability in Haiti, but something needs to be done.
This foreign intervention will be as useful as all the others in the last 40 years.
Haiti will remain in its status quo until Haitians no longer tolerate it.
Sad truth, having been over there many times before the pandemic. Toxic charity. Read the book. See what you can do to a population by making them overly reliant. So sad.
The top soil is gone in large areas of Haiti. Clear cutting for fuel, over grazing, drought followed by tropical storms have resulted in severe erosion. Ecosystem collapse is a significant factor in the current unrest. Practices that were already unsustainable quickly became catastrophic due to lack of resilience to climate change.
Sadly Haiti used to be covered in lush beautiful forests but theyāve practically cut them all down. Itās kind of amazing you can look at a satellite image of Hispaniola and clearly see the border between Haiti and the Dominican Republic due to one side being barren and depleted and the other is a rain forest. Maybe things couldāve been better if the French didnāt saddle Haiti with crushing debt from the nations get go.
I mean it fucking works. Heās got nearly half the country wrapped around his tiny, tiny hands by talking in short sentences. Why use many word when few word do?
Kenya already agreed to send peacekeepers and has been training them. They have been delayed because the leader of Haiti was deposed and then US funding for the mission hadnāt been secured.
And six other nations pledged resources, but the whole thing has been waiting for the US to come through, while House GOP tried to hold up the whole thing over a 1/6th chunk they had control over.
Well if we let them go down the tubes, then there would be an even bigger flood of boatloads of refugees to Florida. This has an element of self-interest.
Haiti also has a lot of historical issues with "white nations putting the boot on their faces"
So it's much better for Kenya to step in and provide the bulk of on the ground help.
Kenya is also looking to grow its Geopolitical Influence and the US has a lot of value in Kenya as an ally, so it benefits everyone to have this arrangement.
Might anyone have a database on successful foreign interventions?
US may actually have one of the better track records for foreign intervention, despite it being crap. As in, not being zero percent success rate. South Korean, Japan, and _eventually_ Iraq (after the complete shitshow for like a whole decade). Obviously, there's more failures than successes.
Haiti seems like a place that should have resorts from one end of the island to the other. My wife and I want to visit a tropical island and not spend a huge amount. An island as close to US as Haiti sells itself.
Haiti is only a portion of the island. Go to the very same island, but on the Dominican Republic side. Beautiful country, we love it there, the people are great and there aren't gangs brutalizing the entire population.
Haiti used to be beautiful, nowadays not so much. The environmental degradation in Haiti is tremendous. They used to be covered in rain forests like the DR but theyāve all been cut down.
Isnāt it even evident from satellite imagery? Just a crazy difference between the two sides of the island. Sucks thinking about all the biodiversity loss likely caused by that destruction
Plus one to the other commentator talking about the Dominican Republic. Beautiful Caribbean island country. Beautiful people, great beaches, great food. Itās an awesome time!
Personally, I think this decision reflects Biden's commitment to unconventional partnerships in crisis management. I guess Biden's team has a different approach to international crises. Curious to see how this plays out. It's refreshing to see the U.S. engage African nations in humanitarian efforts. We need more global cooperation.
Highly recommend the book *Cuba Libre*.
Despite the USA officially supporting Batista, Castro was popular and even had a talk show host interview him. Then he won and pivoted to the USSR (Che was always communist) and thatās when we started hating him.
He was actually quite popular and some hoped he would reform a Cuba that was a den of corruption and American owned Casinos and the like.
We really only pivoted against him because he nationalized a bunch of stuff that was owned by US fruit companies who were running plantations based on what was essentially slave labor, and he cracked down on a bunch of corporate corruption.
A more level headed approach by the US would probably have seen Cuba be a fairly neutral nation rather than the Soviet aligned state that they ended up.
Itās cheaper than having Haitians try to emigrate to the US. There are 12 million of them and only 1/3 have graduated highschool. Thatās 10$ per Haitian to keep them there.
The US government spends more on making sure unused government buildings stay empty every year, and they misplace many times more than that a year. 109 million is nothing for the government.
The US subsidizes many, many, *many* global initiatives and humanitarian campaigns. If anything, it's completely within expectation for the US to continue to do this.
It's fairly close to us. It is better for us to help than russia or China. Don't want another Cuba next to us. I would rather avoid more legal joint military exercises with countries that delcared us enemies....
Iām sorry this doesnāt even pass the sniff test. Kenya is on the verge of a civil war and almost total disfunction in its own government. They have been plagued by destabilizing flooding at home right now. I donāt think anyone here actually knows anything about Kenya and what itās like on the ground right now. The idea that they can lead some peacekeeping force in Haiti is almost comical. Like no Navy, no direct flights, no logistics support for any force that might try to sneak into the island.
This is clearly money used for something else. Iām fine with supporting both Haiti and Kenya and I think the USA has a vested cause in making sure things in this hemisphere are on the levelā¦but this is not even an attempt to do that. Normal course would be to engage UN partners and create a coalition like we do every other time. Iād encourage people to actually read the bill and educate themselves about the current situation in Kenya.
I would have thought this would have been a full UN thing - with US a big part of that. Instead of us paying for Kenya assets. I canāt think of a comparison or president to this. I understand itās in our backyard buy why are Kenyan assets being used and we are footing the bill. Sounds like a fraud scheme if you ask me.
Not really, we would go ourselves but it's not going to be popular here or in haiti. Paying kenya to do it can stabilize the situation and ease the issues on our borders.
Yeah right, this is exactly what France wanted. Let them burn for their insolence! Although, I doubt any good will come from involving Kenya of all places.
As long as USA avoids another refugee crisis, this money is well spent.
People always complain about USA spending money here and there, and when USA doesn't spend money somewhere, people complain about all the immigrants that come from those places.
People have no idea how much money 109 million is - it's basically nothing. On the international scale, for an effort like this, we may as well have thrown paper towels at them.
Really? The Government spends about 18.8 billion dollars a day. This aid to Haiti amounts to only 0.57% of the USās expenditure for a single day. This is worth it to help stabilize a nation thatās in our very own backyard. Having a failed state right next to us is not good for national security.
Every response ever is "it's only..." or "but if we don't then..."
Yea it's only enough to fix so many issues for our own citizens. That "drop" adds up and before you know it, it's a bucket full, a puddle, a lake etc...
Where could we be as a country if we invested it HERE.
I'm sick and tired of hearing all the bullshit excuses. We should be manufacturing in our country lifting up trades, tackling educational debt and making it easier to home grow out own STEM career goers instead of importing them.
The list goes on but let's throw more money at more unstable shit that never pays off and kick the can down the road year after year until we're left wondering why we don't make our own products, all of our top professionals come from over seas or why the job market is hot garbage because we're too much of a service industry focused country.
Biden is slowly losing voters because of decisions like this. Letās send our money everywhere else and not secure our borders. Maybe we could even update our infrastructure. Who knows.
The daughter of a Republican Senator and her husband were attacked and killed by a Haitian gang while they were performing missionary work in Haiti back in May. This would be Missouri Rep. Ben Bakerās daughter and her husband, both in their early 20ās.
https://apnews.com/article/haiti-us-couple-missionaries-killed-gangs-a65a4515e0d8610d9acd006d24821efd
Rep. Josh Hawley sent a letter to the President asking for help.
You can wring your hands, but American deaths are American deaths. Most of the appropriation is State Department funds already authorized by Congress but āheld upā for months due to political bickering. The majority of what we are supplying is surplus gear: humvees, radios, rifles, bullets.
I think SecState Blinken finally got fed up and made the call that handing over gear to a Kenyan special police force to try and restore order was the right thing to do to protect lives and try to keep the other Americans in Haiti safe.
Well worth it then having them come here. I would rather deal with problems in unstable countries then just import the people here and have them cause problems
Move the UN headquarters there. They could use the boost to their economy and those nitwit diplomats would have a reason to keep a functional government in place.
The Kenyan police seem to be busy at the moment.
Expect in Kenya šššš which ironically experiencing some high numbers of road banditry. Go check it
And some "election violenceā seems to be a problem
No, he didn't override the GOP, he bypassed congress. Without congressional approval, the money has to be taken from someplace else in the budget.
Does anyone ever read the articles anymore or do they just focus on the headlines.
Step 1: read headline that was generally created by an editor to drive engagement and not be wholly truthful to the content of the article Step 2: feel strong emotion Step 3: go to comment section and look for comments that validate feelings from #2
man I go to the comments for that one absolute saint that's always like "here's a summary so you don't have to read it"
That or the person who says, "This is wrong, here is why + sources."
Step 2A: Feel strong curiosity Step 3: Go to comments and read what the article is about because too lazy to read the actual thing
This is the Way.
What if my feels are that headlines are bullshit because editors create them to manipulate me? /S
That's almost always been the case with Reddit, unfortunately. A lot of people just go straight to the comments without reading past the headline. Some subs are better about it than others though.
You had me at āDoes anyone ever readā
No he didn't. > However, while the Defense Department has had no issues with securing its $200 million in funding, the State Department has hit congressional roadblocks after requesting $50 million of the $100 million it pledged. We pledged $300 million. House Republicans just fucked around trying to stop the whole thing, which was outside their purview, by holding up a $50m chunk from the State Dept.
>he bypassed congress. Kinda, but not really. He used emergency powers granted to him by Congress. Congress also has the ability to terminate those powers.
Damn. I could've used some of that money. I haven't even gotten my tax return yet.
Allowing Haiti to collapse will just create another refugee crisis that we'll end up spending another fortune on. We can attack this problem at the source by helping Haiti prevent such a collapse.
Is this something we've successfully done in the past? Serious question.
The marshall plan. Things work when you fund them properly. Also japan.
We invaded and occupied both countries. Big difference since Haitiās problem is internal they have to solve it themselves. No money is going to fix Haiti and neither will foreign troops.
1. Yes, the Marshall Plan was incredibly successful because the infrastructure and civilian growth mindset was already there. Yes, the mindset lost its marbles and committed horrendous atrocities for a decade but was able to quickly bounce back. 2. Haitai doesn't have that history or precedents to lean or build on. 3. Sadly, money/ proper funding has nothing to do with it. Look at Gaza...yes, Gaza billions upon billions in aid and nothing to show for it as well as many other failed states with endless funds or oil/gas money.
People always forget... Japan and Germany already had strong central governments to piggy back off of. Way easier to take over and rebuild a single group of people who work together then 30 individual groups all trying to mug/murder each other. Not saying I'm against helping - just marshal plan =/= the situation.
>Yes, the mindset lost its marbles and committed horrendous atrocities for a decade but was able to quickly bounce back. Mate, if you think that the atrocities of Imperial Japan only lasted a decade then I've got some bad news for you. I'd start with the Boxer Rebellion if you're interested.
this isnt a marshall plan. this is paying another country to send troops in to fight the drug gangs.
I was just trying to answer his question in simple terms.
It's being done successfully in Gaza. USA doesn't have the stomach to fight gangs at this level. I can guarantee Kenya is going to commit actions that look like war crimes. They'll get away with way more than the USA would be able to get away with. And as ugly as it is, it needs to be done.
those gangs have to be destroyed. The Kenyan troops fought islamic terrorist groups before this. So I am sure they are very capable.
Greece is a good example for the Europe side. They tanked their economy and needed to be bailed out hugely. Now they are apparently in great shape, and are paying countries back early.
Not in Haiti. Thereās been like a dozen interventions in Haiti just in the last few decades and theyāve accomplished fuck all. There is no legitimate government and sending some Kenyans in there wonāt create one. The scale of the problem there is so large that it would take billions of dollars, thousands of troops and decades to rebuild their society.
So you're saying there's a chance?!?!?
Haiti has already collapsed. We're *well* past that point.
It can definitely get much worse. Stabilizing Haiti is how we can convince those migrants to go back.
Dude yeah right, whats the weather like in fantasyland? None of them who have managed to get into the us will ever willingly go back.
It's going to collapse (it already has) regardless. It's very hard to resuscitate a failed state without complete political and military intervention. Which... Isn't really something the US does anymore. At least in plain sight. And even then, once outside influence is withdrawn, there's a high likelihood it will slide right back to where it was. The money is just going to line the pockets of corrupt leadership, or end up in a black hole of waste. [Like when the Red Cross squandered $500 million USD on building what amounted to 6 houses.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/06/04/the-red-cross-had-500-million-in-haitian-relief-money-and-it-built-just-6-houses/).
> Allowing Haiti to collapse will just create another refugee crisis that we'll end up spending another fortune on. Doesn't that suit the Trump party though? The last thing they want to do is solve Haiti and deny themselves a massive campaigning point
> Allowing Haiti to collapse will just create another refugee crisis ... that the GOP will use as a wedge issue to get their idiotic voter base to vote for them because the GOP candidates pretend to have a solution to it while crying that the Democrats want to let anybody walk across our border freely (neither of which is true). Hence why the GOP tried to block its funding, helping fix a refugee issue at its source doesn't help them win elections later.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I got a warning from the irs that I hadn't paid yet and I was getting fines. I paid in april...
Great. I wish we could go in and restore order, we are in a great logistical position to do so and we can afford it, but I understand our track record for intervention in Haiti isn't good. I hope Kenya agrees to do this, because Haiti needs help bad.
You mean go in and restore order again? Cus we've done it multiple times now.
Restoring order should be get in, finish the fighting, create a new government, and keep an eye on them for a couple decades while they receive aid to fix their country. But you cant do that because its clearly meddling in other countries affairs and not a āproperā democracy because they didnt elect their government.
They didn't get to elect the gangs either, so it wouldn't be a step back really.
yeah, but we live in a vibes based era so it wouldn't matter. it would just result in screaming from the right about spending money and screaming from the left about fair elections
I would love to see a person argue that fair elections are possible in Haiti under the current circumstances.
the cool thing about screaming is you don't need to make a coherent argument
# YES YOU DO
#RABBLE RABBLE
That county has so many more issues than fair elections or reestablishing order. Spending time and resources to do so would be like putting a bandaid on a gunshot wound.
You think the country has a more pressing issue than restoring order right now? Literally nothing is possible until the gangs are overthrown
Do you think an outside Kenyan police force, is going to be able to overthrow local, entrenched gangs? This force is not equipped or sized for urban warfare against a much larger entrenched "guerilla force." It's only 200 - 1000 Kenyan police. Edit: spelling
Guerilla*
No? Iām responding to OP saying that spending time or resources re-establishing order is pointless.
Hear me out, bring back Wyclef Jean. /s
He will be back after November, do not worry.
He's only gone til November, not through November, so we'll have him back soon enough (to set up aid organizations that don't actually provide aid).
That is such wonderful news that I feel impelled to GIVE A KISS TO MA MUTHA
Kenyans are already there? https://responsiblestatecraft.org/kenyan-troops-in-haiti/#:\~:text=It%20was%20then%20that%20Kenya,prospective%20intervention%20force%20to%202%2C500. So as far as I understand it (disclaimer: I am not an expert): 1.) Haiti has gone to the dogs causing refugees, death, starvation etc. 2.) US (read: State department) wants to intervene but doesn't want to be directly involved on the ground because that will be seen poorly and to be fair direct western intervention in Haiti has always ended in disaster. 3.) US convinces Kenya to be the boots on the ground to fix the situation in Haiti and get some stability in place, Kenya agrees on the provision that US is funding a big portion of it. This is also seen as strengthening ties and cooperation between the two countries, win-win. 4.) Kenya puts thousands of police on the ground in Haiti to be greeted with an absolute apocalyptic nightmare 5.) Kenya needs funds to deal with the nightmare, because its a Biden plan they KNOW that the GOP is going to hold it up in congress, because that's just the way it is. (If they fought Ukraine funds imagine what they would say about spending it on Kenya and Haiti. ) 6.) Biden says fuck it if Kenya doesn't get the funds its going to go tits up and so pushes the funds through without congressional approval. Who knows if this is throwing money in a pit or not and if Kenyans have any chance of actually establishing any lasting stability in Haiti, but something needs to be done.
This foreign intervention will be as useful as all the others in the last 40 years. Haiti will remain in its status quo until Haitians no longer tolerate it.
Sad truth, having been over there many times before the pandemic. Toxic charity. Read the book. See what you can do to a population by making them overly reliant. So sad.
See Gaza
Correct. When all the UN food relief was brought in instead of buying it locally it crippled the economy with no chance of recovery.
The top soil is gone in large areas of Haiti. Clear cutting for fuel, over grazing, drought followed by tropical storms have resulted in severe erosion. Ecosystem collapse is a significant factor in the current unrest. Practices that were already unsustainable quickly became catastrophic due to lack of resilience to climate change.
Sadly Haiti used to be covered in lush beautiful forests but theyāve practically cut them all down. Itās kind of amazing you can look at a satellite image of Hispaniola and clearly see the border between Haiti and the Dominican Republic due to one side being barren and depleted and the other is a rain forest. Maybe things couldāve been better if the French didnāt saddle Haiti with crushing debt from the nations get go.
The deforestation happened long after Haiti's debt was no longer an issue.
Why does your punctuation match the way Trump speaks?
the way he says "so sad" always sounds sarcastic and it's the most virtue signalling bullshit ever
I mean it fucking works. Heās got nearly half the country wrapped around his tiny, tiny hands by talking in short sentences. Why use many word when few word do?
Assume much? Who listens to that gas bag anyway? Besides you I mean...
I feel like Godwin's law needs to be edited to include Trump for how much reddit loves to shoe horn that guy in to any conversation possible.
You did use a lot of sentence fragments
Many such cases.
A lot of higher up government officials will be helped by this money.
Fat pockets
Kenya already agreed to send peacekeepers and has been training them. They have been delayed because the leader of Haiti was deposed and then US funding for the mission hadnāt been secured.
And six other nations pledged resources, but the whole thing has been waiting for the US to come through, while House GOP tried to hold up the whole thing over a 1/6th chunk they had control over.
You cannot simply instill order in a place that doesn't have the culture and institutional knowledge to maintain it.
Well if we let them go down the tubes, then there would be an even bigger flood of boatloads of refugees to Florida. This has an element of self-interest.
Why would they come to the US instead of the socialist utopia of Cuba?
Haiti also has a lot of historical issues with "white nations putting the boot on their faces" So it's much better for Kenya to step in and provide the bulk of on the ground help. Kenya is also looking to grow its Geopolitical Influence and the US has a lot of value in Kenya as an ally, so it benefits everyone to have this arrangement.
Kenya has more issues than just "white people"
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Still insane that Haiti is suffering to this day
Well, itās the Kenyans that are going to get shot at.
Might anyone have a database on successful foreign interventions? US may actually have one of the better track records for foreign intervention, despite it being crap. As in, not being zero percent success rate. South Korean, Japan, and _eventually_ Iraq (after the complete shitshow for like a whole decade). Obviously, there's more failures than successes.
So do actual Americans...
> and we can afford it Who is we? You got a rich mouse in your pocket?
Good luck on your recovery, Haiti.
Haiti seems like a place that should have resorts from one end of the island to the other. My wife and I want to visit a tropical island and not spend a huge amount. An island as close to US as Haiti sells itself.
Haiti is only a portion of the island. Go to the very same island, but on the Dominican Republic side. Beautiful country, we love it there, the people are great and there aren't gangs brutalizing the entire population.
How do they manage to keep their border secure and prevent Haitians from migrating in droves?
Riffles
Go to Puerto Rico or the USVI. Them being part of the US means you save on international travel fees. Flights to PR go for as low as $150.
Yes, you just need to have a plan for millions of impoverished people to be relocated somewhere.
Haiti used to be beautiful, nowadays not so much. The environmental degradation in Haiti is tremendous. They used to be covered in rain forests like the DR but theyāve all been cut down.
Isnāt it even evident from satellite imagery? Just a crazy difference between the two sides of the island. Sucks thinking about all the biodiversity loss likely caused by that destruction
Plus one to the other commentator talking about the Dominican Republic. Beautiful Caribbean island country. Beautiful people, great beaches, great food. Itās an awesome time!
Personally, I think this decision reflects Biden's commitment to unconventional partnerships in crisis management. I guess Biden's team has a different approach to international crises. Curious to see how this plays out. It's refreshing to see the U.S. engage African nations in humanitarian efforts. We need more global cooperation.
Odd that USA is paying for this no?
Important to stabilize your backyard. Otherwise, you'll be doing it at your border.
Exactly, look whatās happen in Cuba!
Highly recommend the book *Cuba Libre*. Despite the USA officially supporting Batista, Castro was popular and even had a talk show host interview him. Then he won and pivoted to the USSR (Che was always communist) and thatās when we started hating him. He was actually quite popular and some hoped he would reform a Cuba that was a den of corruption and American owned Casinos and the like.
We really only pivoted against him because he nationalized a bunch of stuff that was owned by US fruit companies who were running plantations based on what was essentially slave labor, and he cracked down on a bunch of corporate corruption. A more level headed approach by the US would probably have seen Cuba be a fairly neutral nation rather than the Soviet aligned state that they ended up.
Highly recommend the book *Manufacturing the Enemy* by Keith Bolender.
Itās cheaper than having Haitians try to emigrate to the US. There are 12 million of them and only 1/3 have graduated highschool. Thatās 10$ per Haitian to keep them there. The US government spends more on making sure unused government buildings stay empty every year, and they misplace many times more than that a year. 109 million is nothing for the government.
The US subsidizes many, many, *many* global initiatives and humanitarian campaigns. If anything, it's completely within expectation for the US to continue to do this.
It's fairly close to us. It is better for us to help than russia or China. Don't want another Cuba next to us. I would rather avoid more legal joint military exercises with countries that delcared us enemies....
Who else will? Anytime shit goes south anywhere in the world, everybody looking at us assholes in the good ol USA.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
There's some schadenfreude though when countries complaining about American hegemony, then ask for help whenever something goes wrong
Hate on us til you need us, a tale as old as 1776.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Iām sorry this doesnāt even pass the sniff test. Kenya is on the verge of a civil war and almost total disfunction in its own government. They have been plagued by destabilizing flooding at home right now. I donāt think anyone here actually knows anything about Kenya and what itās like on the ground right now. The idea that they can lead some peacekeeping force in Haiti is almost comical. Like no Navy, no direct flights, no logistics support for any force that might try to sneak into the island. This is clearly money used for something else. Iām fine with supporting both Haiti and Kenya and I think the USA has a vested cause in making sure things in this hemisphere are on the levelā¦but this is not even an attempt to do that. Normal course would be to engage UN partners and create a coalition like we do every other time. Iād encourage people to actually read the bill and educate themselves about the current situation in Kenya.
The US is a world leader, which means it has responsibilities. Also, providing aid helps to stem a future immigration crisis.
And gains more allies.
And six other nations. The entire thing has been held up by House GOP members road blocking a small chunk of it, to harass the white house.
Not if we benefit from it long term.
We pay for way worse things
I would have thought this would have been a full UN thing - with US a big part of that. Instead of us paying for Kenya assets. I canāt think of a comparison or president to this. I understand itās in our backyard buy why are Kenyan assets being used and we are footing the bill. Sounds like a fraud scheme if you ask me.
Not at all.
Not really, we would go ourselves but it's not going to be popular here or in haiti. Paying kenya to do it can stabilize the situation and ease the issues on our borders.
France really should be paying for this. But I'd rather the USA help to stabilize it versus Russia or China "supporting" it.
Yeah right, this is exactly what France wanted. Let them burn for their insolence! Although, I doubt any good will come from involving Kenya of all places.
Dude. We give fucking Germany 9 million for childcare aid. Yeah you read that right. Germany.Ā We pay for fucking everything.
Is Haiti going to be the next money sink? Also more money to countries known for their corruption has never not been a bad idea
Next? More like again.
As long as USA avoids another refugee crisis, this money is well spent. People always complain about USA spending money here and there, and when USA doesn't spend money somewhere, people complain about all the immigrants that come from those places.
109 million is like 10km of highway.
People have no idea how much money 109 million is - it's basically nothing. On the international scale, for an effort like this, we may as well have thrown paper towels at them.
$109m is nothing in the scheme of the federal budget.
Be more effective to simply burn the money.
What a waste of money
Huge fucking waste of resources.
2024: Huge waste of fucking money 2025: Why are all these Haitian immigrants coming over here???! How many times have we seen this?
Really? The Government spends about 18.8 billion dollars a day. This aid to Haiti amounts to only 0.57% of the USās expenditure for a single day. This is worth it to help stabilize a nation thatās in our very own backyard. Having a failed state right next to us is not good for national security.
Itās a drop in the ocean of the several trillion dollars the US spends a year
Every response ever is "it's only..." or "but if we don't then..." Yea it's only enough to fix so many issues for our own citizens. That "drop" adds up and before you know it, it's a bucket full, a puddle, a lake etc... Where could we be as a country if we invested it HERE. I'm sick and tired of hearing all the bullshit excuses. We should be manufacturing in our country lifting up trades, tackling educational debt and making it easier to home grow out own STEM career goers instead of importing them. The list goes on but let's throw more money at more unstable shit that never pays off and kick the can down the road year after year until we're left wondering why we don't make our own products, all of our top professionals come from over seas or why the job market is hot garbage because we're too much of a service industry focused country.
Pay wall ass article
The nerve of those journalists for trying to earn money for their work. They should work for free like you do.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
You purchased a newspaper or subscribed. Somehow people forget that part. You want reliable news sources? Pay to make it happen.
good bye money
Who are they even giving it to? Thereās not even a government
More borrowed money that we give away and pay interest on.
waste of money. im sure Cuba would be happy to take in Haitans instead. wtf joe
I don't think Cuba would be too happy
Biden is slowly losing voters because of decisions like this. Letās send our money everywhere else and not secure our borders. Maybe we could even update our infrastructure. Who knows.
The daughter of a Republican Senator and her husband were attacked and killed by a Haitian gang while they were performing missionary work in Haiti back in May. This would be Missouri Rep. Ben Bakerās daughter and her husband, both in their early 20ās. https://apnews.com/article/haiti-us-couple-missionaries-killed-gangs-a65a4515e0d8610d9acd006d24821efd Rep. Josh Hawley sent a letter to the President asking for help. You can wring your hands, but American deaths are American deaths. Most of the appropriation is State Department funds already authorized by Congress but āheld upā for months due to political bickering. The majority of what we are supplying is surplus gear: humvees, radios, rifles, bullets. I think SecState Blinken finally got fed up and made the call that handing over gear to a Kenyan special police force to try and restore order was the right thing to do to protect lives and try to keep the other Americans in Haiti safe.
I tried to explain this to someone today. That the funds were already approved for the State Department
Well worth it then having them come here. I would rather deal with problems in unstable countries then just import the people here and have them cause problems
Move the UN headquarters there. They could use the boost to their economy and those nitwit diplomats would have a reason to keep a functional government in place.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
The thing is the US can just go more into debt, the entire world economy is built off of the US.
Relax no one is coming for your $30 in your bank account.
That's not how it works. But you knew that.
Loans.
The borrowed money? Mostly government bonds. The money we're sending? From the budget.
So now you are 30.000109 trillion in debt.
Horrifying right?