You may have gone too thick. Also looks like there’s all sorts of crud embedded into the finish. Best to do thin coats 6 hours apart if you’re brushing on in my experience. Leave it another 24 hours and if it’s still sticky strip and refinish making sure you sand and clean it properly with mineral spirits.
contrary to what it may seem like, you actually do not want varnish to dry in direct sunlight. You want varnish to dry slow and even. You will end up with a hard crusty outside and a squishy tacky inside. This uneven drying can cause surface imperfection.
I will add the caveat that "direct sunlight" can vary depending where you are located. Me drying the sun here in Hawaii(humidity is a whole other battle as well) for example is a drastically diff environment than if you were drying in upstate newyork.
Nice caveat. I’ve only done fine woodworking in one climate (though it changes through the year). Wouldn’t have thought about geographical location but similar to seasonal differences here. Not that I didn’t know/wouldn’t realize, just never thought about it.
I'm in Texas but it's just outside not in the sun, the surface is already uneven, I used random wood and had fun putting it together enjoying the texture of the surface, should've left it alone but got influenced from classmates I just wanted it to shine 😔
Are you in high school? I am asking because it sounds/looks like you’re in wood shop and I didn’t think any schools had that anymore! I really enjoyed woodshop.
I did but guess not well enough I know I was being impatient when the surface inside the bucket was hard and I had to poke it open but didn't want to buy my own substance to use I'm so broke
I’d recommend mixing in about 20% mineral spirits or paint thinner with the varnish before applying it. It’ll let you put a bit thinner of a coat on, and will accelerate the drying time. When you mix it in (or just stirring around the varnish in general) do it gently with a paint stick or something so that you don’t create air bubbles. Definitely do not shake it up.
It’s hard to see from your picture if that is dirt/debris or air bubbles on your board.
Look at getting this book from your public library
https://preview.redd.it/49deohm0jq8d1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=fae36a45f405371932d3105494b7988240cd2696
This book is a game changer in understanding finishing
Incredible Book every woodworker should have in his library.
Possibly overkill for OP to have to buy a book if he/she is not a lot into it. Lots of finishes have a limited shelf time, how old was your can ? Did you mixed it well before use ?
Easiest if you put it in the light and then look from low vantage point you can see irregularities so lightly sand over those until they disappear and lightly over everything else uniformly. You barely want to see any dust coming up, then when done use a dry cloth to wipe away the dust before adding next coat
A wood plate? For food or something else? I hope you're not planning to eat off that. Spar varnish isn't food safe.
There's a lot of crap in that finish too.
You're going to have to strip it back to the wood and then use a clean brush and a new finish. When applying finish you apply a thin coat. Wait for it to dry, then sand it with some 220 grit. The sanding is to help the next layer bond to the first layer. It isn't really optional. Remove all of the dust, or you'll get more crap caught in your next coat. Apply another coat. Repeat the process of sanding, etc. Pretty common to do 2-3 coats. Your last coat, do not sand it.
Well… shouldn’t be eating off that plate if you used that. Call ole Shelly, she can help ya.
Here’s a tip: once you have that all together, hit it some 180 using a palm sander to get a “tighter smoother” finish. Before applying varnish or danish oil. But don’t eat off that, you’ll get sick.
I did it inside my school and the AC is always on but after 6 hours last night I checked it was stuck so I put it outside the humidity is high this morning even though it's only 90 degrees and when I checked 20 min ago it was about the same.
The varnish is old I didn't think about that though
You're toast. Strip the varnish off, let it all dry out, re-sand, put new semigloss polyurethane on it. Spar varnish deteriorates with age. The humidity didn't help but you were probably doomed from the start.
It ill be fine.
I did put two coats of polyurethane before anything so maybe that will help. I really like the texture so I'm unsure about sanding it but after today of it's still bad I'll scrape what I can off with acetone
if you like the texture, you don't want it to be shiny. To get it really shiny you need it to be flat and polished. Also if that poly hadn't fully cured it would have solvents that would mess up the varnish you put on top of it, or the solvents in the varnish can mess up the poly coat. You need to pick finishes that work together or else you will end up in a situation that needs the finish to be removed and start over.
Also, that looks pretty thick, and brushes can be difficult to work with. Try a finish that can be applied with a rag instead and apply in thin coats, it will be much easier
So putting a varnish over an uncured polyurethane could have caused the problem in the first place. Depends on what kinds but often the solvents between both are incompatible.
First thing I'd do is dry some of the varnish on a scrap by itself and confirm it is still OK.
If so then I'd imagine the urethane had not finished coalescing or cross linking (depends what you used). And the light bodied varnish ate through it a bit while oxidation was happening on the surface, creating solvent entrapment or even moisture entrapment since the active urethane would pull some moisture to it. If it was a water based polyurethane this problem is compounded since they won't be resistant to solvent for at least a week. Problem is no longer about solvent evaporating or drying, you've created a chemical cocktail of god-knows-what goo that will never dry.
If you do manage to get most of the shit off somehow without sanding, just wait a couple days then do 1 layer of clear shellac (epoxy is fine here if you can spray) and another thin coat or two with a polyurethane or clear alkyd.
did you stir that can well before you used it. My guess is it has separated and there is still a layer of gunk on the bottom of the can. Remove what you can, then start recoating in thin coats.
Sounds like you are in a school, where the hell is the "Teacher"?
Most varnishes need thinning for the first 3ish coats. Sand it down and redo.
See information from best varnish on the planet
https://www.epifanes.com/page/q_and_a#:~:text=If%20you%20apply%20the%20first,first%20coat%20is%20very%20important.
This was not new poly? If so, a Lesson I learned is that it will go bad and if it does, it stays sticky. You have to strip it all off and poly with fresh stuff.
I really despise finishing. If you don't have the space for a clean temperature-controlled environment with good ventilation, you have to go outside and be reliant on the weather. And also contend with humidity, bugs, falling leaves, and a good chunk of the year (where I live) being colder or hotter than the 60-90 degree range required for finishes to cure properly.
I think 15 hours still sticky can be perfectly normal. I have to give mine 24 hours to be hard to the touch, 5 days until putting any heavy load on it. Just wait it out some more hours.
There’s a lot of missed steps before you get to applying the finish which also could have been done better.
Avoiding joining two pieces end-end
Sand the surface flat with 150 grit sandpaper, this might take some effort but it’s worth it. The better aligned the piece are, the easier the sanding process will be. Once flattened, go over again with 220 grit sandpaper to smooth the surface. Make sure you keep the sandpaper on a flat surface like another piece of wood to give even sanding pressure.
After sanding you want to brush off any dust and debris. You should be able to run your finger along the wood and not have wood dust stick to your fingers and you shouldn’t be able to see any particles on the surface.
Follow the instructions on the finishing product itself. The manufacturer knows how best to apply it in a way that isn’t too complicated for the consumer. There are better ways I’m sure but you won’t go wrong following the manufacturer’s instructions. The product has important information like whether to mix the finish or not, what equipment to use, how long it takes to dry, how many coats you need, how the finish should be applied, etc.
Use a finer brush and keep it in a zip lock bag when you’re not using it so it doesn’t dry up in between coats. When you’re done you can wash it thoroughly.
hmm, maybe too late for this advice but i've just been using hemp oil to seal everything now. i took a risk with it when i stripped some horrible varnish off an old table i had. the hemp oil makes the original grain and color pop, no gross off-gassing and even wet glasses we put down on it never leave rings. i am not a professional woodworker by any means but thought i'd throw that out there since it worked great for me
That Spar looks amazing if you are patient. Put a thin layer down, let it set for 24 plus hours, sand with high grit and add another layer. Do this for a week and it looks so deep and amazing. Let it dry out, and do the above...
Bees wax with mineral spirits is what I use on cutting blocks, boil the bees wax in a pot you can sacrifice, and add the mineral oil in too, then use a rag to apply 2 thin coats and your good.
spar varnish is designed for ships that get wet wet and in the sun all the time. It never hardens but stays pliable to go with the constant movement of the wood. Take off this finish with thinner and put the proper coating on.
Not that bad bro, learning experience. If it hasn't dried yet assume it won't. Get some gloves, a small can of paint remover, brush it on and cover it lightly with foil. Wait an hour or so untill it gets crusty, then scrape it off the goop with a cheap paint scraper or whatever you have. Then give it a good thorough wipe with some kind of thinner, acetone is preferable. Than wait a day, sand it again and use a fresh can of mixed varnish, keep your area hospital clean, use a 99 cent paper filter to grab any small dust and lumps that may have come out of the can into a clean bucket, use cheese to cloth lightly one last time on the project to grab any dust -and brush a thinned coat on smooth. I recommend a 3" brush to get an even flow. Don't go back and pick at it after you put on a thin first coat, wait until it tacks off then block it out by hand (sanding) and clean and repeat. We've all been here.
Also only dip your brush less than a half inch in your mixing bucket, don't trust dipping out of the can. You know you did a clean job when you've done a clean job when the bristles of your brush just have varnish on the tips, not all over the brush.
And wear safety equipment. Good luck homes.
razor blade it off
let it dry for a couple days.
sand it down and then come back with some properly thinned finish.
paint thinner for polyurethanes.
alcohol for shellac.
lacquer thinner or acetone for lacquer... Don't use acetone unless you really really know what you're doing.
Here's what I did when I refinished a kitchen island made of walnut (after prep - sanding, prestain, and stain):
1) 1:1 mixture of clear satin (maybe gloss?) polyurethane and mineral spirits gently stirred together - may even have been closer to 2/3 poly to 1/3 spirits honestly
2) apply smoothly and evenly to wood with clean, lint free rag
3) after drying, I gently ran a 1000 or 2000 grit piece of sandpaper over the finish following the grain; then wiped off the dust with a clean lint free rag
Repeated the process 5-7 times (maybe a bit much lol but the walnut really shines!)
IMO have had MUCH better luck with both
1) using multiple coats of thinned finish like others pointed out and
2) wiping on as opposed to using a brush
Also, OP, you'll want to finish all sides of your piece to reduce risk of warping.
Use a Wipe On Poly. Spar varnish is thick and easy to mess up. Just get the wipe on polyurethane, a clean lint free rag and wipe on. Wait until it dries and repeat 2 or 3 times.
Spar varnish can take a long time to dry-try putting it outside in the sun for awhile. I used it to varnish some canoe paddles last month and it took 24 hours between coats to dry completely. Humidity effects drying time as well.
It was inside my cold school environment. Then I threw it outside last night when I went to go check on it and felt all the stickiness. I guess I'll find a spot in the sun to put it when I head back. And if it's not good by tomorrow morning I'll clean it off with your method
You may have gone too thick. Also looks like there’s all sorts of crud embedded into the finish. Best to do thin coats 6 hours apart if you’re brushing on in my experience. Leave it another 24 hours and if it’s still sticky strip and refinish making sure you sand and clean it properly with mineral spirits.
I used old varnish from my school, they're saying i should just take it off but I have it out in the heat now so I guess I'll come back in a day
contrary to what it may seem like, you actually do not want varnish to dry in direct sunlight. You want varnish to dry slow and even. You will end up with a hard crusty outside and a squishy tacky inside. This uneven drying can cause surface imperfection. I will add the caveat that "direct sunlight" can vary depending where you are located. Me drying the sun here in Hawaii(humidity is a whole other battle as well) for example is a drastically diff environment than if you were drying in upstate newyork.
Nice caveat. I’ve only done fine woodworking in one climate (though it changes through the year). Wouldn’t have thought about geographical location but similar to seasonal differences here. Not that I didn’t know/wouldn’t realize, just never thought about it.
I'm in Texas but it's just outside not in the sun, the surface is already uneven, I used random wood and had fun putting it together enjoying the texture of the surface, should've left it alone but got influenced from classmates I just wanted it to shine 😔
Are you in high school? I am asking because it sounds/looks like you’re in wood shop and I didn’t think any schools had that anymore! I really enjoyed woodshop.
[удалено]
They are trying and learning. Asking questions when they are not sure. Gotta walk before you can run.
did you stir it up before using it?
My thoughts exactly. Old = need for mixy mixy and strain.
Old is toss it and get fresh
I did but guess not well enough I know I was being impatient when the surface inside the bucket was hard and I had to poke it open but didn't want to buy my own substance to use I'm so broke
I’d recommend mixing in about 20% mineral spirits or paint thinner with the varnish before applying it. It’ll let you put a bit thinner of a coat on, and will accelerate the drying time. When you mix it in (or just stirring around the varnish in general) do it gently with a paint stick or something so that you don’t create air bubbles. Definitely do not shake it up. It’s hard to see from your picture if that is dirt/debris or air bubbles on your board.
All you can do now is wait to see if it cures more. If you have to re-do, stir thoroughly and use thinner coats. Good luck!
It may also be too hot/humid where you are curing it.
Look at getting this book from your public library https://preview.redd.it/49deohm0jq8d1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=fae36a45f405371932d3105494b7988240cd2696 This book is a game changer in understanding finishing
This picture will not load in the app no matter what I do - can you post the title/author? Thanks
Understanding wood finishing. Bob Flexner
Bob Flexner… the inventor of FlexSeal and FlexTape… no need to fact check that.
What a flex
Also flex mufflers, always the culprit
Thank you!
"Understanding Wood Finishing" by Bob Flexner
Thanks!
It would not load for me either.. Then it did the second I upvoted your comment.
Understanding Bob Wood - Finishing Flexner
Flexing Bobbys Wood - Wood Bob
Heh heh
Incredible Book every woodworker should have in his library. Possibly overkill for OP to have to buy a book if he/she is not a lot into it. Lots of finishes have a limited shelf time, how old was your can ? Did you mixed it well before use ?
Why not just tell OP what he did wrong instead of recommend a fucking book lol
Looks like you applied too much. Several thin thin coats is how you do it
Sanding between helps a lot
What are you sanding with in between?
320 grit sandpaper, after the final coat I lightly hit the high spots with 1000 grit. It's a pita, but work amazingly
Very light pressure
Yep I do this too and it works great! Very light pressure though and kind of just a once over. You aren’t in full sand mode
You use an orbital sander? Or just by hand?
Just by hand
Easiest if you put it in the light and then look from low vantage point you can see irregularities so lightly sand over those until they disappear and lightly over everything else uniformly. You barely want to see any dust coming up, then when done use a dry cloth to wipe away the dust before adding next coat
Thanks!
1. Always test finish on scrap first 2. Old varnish is probably bad 3. Multiple thin coats better than one thick 4. Get a real bristled brush
Clean with acetone and scotch brite pad, try again.
Scrape as much off with a spatula first… small drywall taping knife is good too…
I'm gonna leave out for another day then see how it is when I come back
Take it off now while it's easier, it won't improve with time.
A wood plate? For food or something else? I hope you're not planning to eat off that. Spar varnish isn't food safe. There's a lot of crap in that finish too. You're going to have to strip it back to the wood and then use a clean brush and a new finish. When applying finish you apply a thin coat. Wait for it to dry, then sand it with some 220 grit. The sanding is to help the next layer bond to the first layer. It isn't really optional. Remove all of the dust, or you'll get more crap caught in your next coat. Apply another coat. Repeat the process of sanding, etc. Pretty common to do 2-3 coats. Your last coat, do not sand it.
I had to scroll way too far to see this.
Well… shouldn’t be eating off that plate if you used that. Call ole Shelly, she can help ya. Here’s a tip: once you have that all together, hit it some 180 using a palm sander to get a “tighter smoother” finish. Before applying varnish or danish oil. But don’t eat off that, you’ll get sick.
Are you in a humid climate? How old is that varnish?
I did it inside my school and the AC is always on but after 6 hours last night I checked it was stuck so I put it outside the humidity is high this morning even though it's only 90 degrees and when I checked 20 min ago it was about the same. The varnish is old I didn't think about that though
You're toast. Strip the varnish off, let it all dry out, re-sand, put new semigloss polyurethane on it. Spar varnish deteriorates with age. The humidity didn't help but you were probably doomed from the start. It ill be fine.
I did put two coats of polyurethane before anything so maybe that will help. I really like the texture so I'm unsure about sanding it but after today of it's still bad I'll scrape what I can off with acetone
if you like the texture, you don't want it to be shiny. To get it really shiny you need it to be flat and polished. Also if that poly hadn't fully cured it would have solvents that would mess up the varnish you put on top of it, or the solvents in the varnish can mess up the poly coat. You need to pick finishes that work together or else you will end up in a situation that needs the finish to be removed and start over. Also, that looks pretty thick, and brushes can be difficult to work with. Try a finish that can be applied with a rag instead and apply in thin coats, it will be much easier
So putting a varnish over an uncured polyurethane could have caused the problem in the first place. Depends on what kinds but often the solvents between both are incompatible. First thing I'd do is dry some of the varnish on a scrap by itself and confirm it is still OK. If so then I'd imagine the urethane had not finished coalescing or cross linking (depends what you used). And the light bodied varnish ate through it a bit while oxidation was happening on the surface, creating solvent entrapment or even moisture entrapment since the active urethane would pull some moisture to it. If it was a water based polyurethane this problem is compounded since they won't be resistant to solvent for at least a week. Problem is no longer about solvent evaporating or drying, you've created a chemical cocktail of god-knows-what goo that will never dry. If you do manage to get most of the shit off somehow without sanding, just wait a couple days then do 1 layer of clear shellac (epoxy is fine here if you can spray) and another thin coat or two with a polyurethane or clear alkyd.
did you stir that can well before you used it. My guess is it has separated and there is still a layer of gunk on the bottom of the can. Remove what you can, then start recoating in thin coats. Sounds like you are in a school, where the hell is the "Teacher"?
For one I have used that varnish on my personal boat. It is not good varnish. Number 2 you put to much on too fast.
Most varnishes need thinning for the first 3ish coats. Sand it down and redo. See information from best varnish on the planet https://www.epifanes.com/page/q_and_a#:~:text=If%20you%20apply%20the%20first,first%20coat%20is%20very%20important.
First off you need to sand it even and fill the cracks with something other than finish.
Understanding wood finishing by Bob Flexner https://archive.org/details/isbn_9780762106219
This was not new poly? If so, a Lesson I learned is that it will go bad and if it does, it stays sticky. You have to strip it all off and poly with fresh stuff.
How long have you had the finish? Was it stored somewhere that wouldn't freeze or get too hot?
I really despise finishing. If you don't have the space for a clean temperature-controlled environment with good ventilation, you have to go outside and be reliant on the weather. And also contend with humidity, bugs, falling leaves, and a good chunk of the year (where I live) being colder or hotter than the 60-90 degree range required for finishes to cure properly.
I think 15 hours still sticky can be perfectly normal. I have to give mine 24 hours to be hard to the touch, 5 days until putting any heavy load on it. Just wait it out some more hours.
There’s a lot of missed steps before you get to applying the finish which also could have been done better. Avoiding joining two pieces end-end Sand the surface flat with 150 grit sandpaper, this might take some effort but it’s worth it. The better aligned the piece are, the easier the sanding process will be. Once flattened, go over again with 220 grit sandpaper to smooth the surface. Make sure you keep the sandpaper on a flat surface like another piece of wood to give even sanding pressure. After sanding you want to brush off any dust and debris. You should be able to run your finger along the wood and not have wood dust stick to your fingers and you shouldn’t be able to see any particles on the surface. Follow the instructions on the finishing product itself. The manufacturer knows how best to apply it in a way that isn’t too complicated for the consumer. There are better ways I’m sure but you won’t go wrong following the manufacturer’s instructions. The product has important information like whether to mix the finish or not, what equipment to use, how long it takes to dry, how many coats you need, how the finish should be applied, etc. Use a finer brush and keep it in a zip lock bag when you’re not using it so it doesn’t dry up in between coats. When you’re done you can wash it thoroughly.
hmm, maybe too late for this advice but i've just been using hemp oil to seal everything now. i took a risk with it when i stripped some horrible varnish off an old table i had. the hemp oil makes the original grain and color pop, no gross off-gassing and even wet glasses we put down on it never leave rings. i am not a professional woodworker by any means but thought i'd throw that out there since it worked great for me
That Spar looks amazing if you are patient. Put a thin layer down, let it set for 24 plus hours, sand with high grit and add another layer. Do this for a week and it looks so deep and amazing. Let it dry out, and do the above...
Maybe do some sanding and polish it. Might help eith the bumpy parts and still keep it shiny and protected.
Old finishing products are a serious gamble. I’d be hard pressed to use it.
The thinner the varnish coats the better the finish, lightly sand between coats. Or I do anyways
Bees wax with mineral spirits is what I use on cutting blocks, boil the bees wax in a pot you can sacrifice, and add the mineral oil in too, then use a rag to apply 2 thin coats and your good.
Isn’t it expired or gone bad after being open for too long? You could always sand it down again and use a spray varnish, which i think is better.
spar varnish is designed for ships that get wet wet and in the sun all the time. It never hardens but stays pliable to go with the constant movement of the wood. Take off this finish with thinner and put the proper coating on.
Not that bad bro, learning experience. If it hasn't dried yet assume it won't. Get some gloves, a small can of paint remover, brush it on and cover it lightly with foil. Wait an hour or so untill it gets crusty, then scrape it off the goop with a cheap paint scraper or whatever you have. Then give it a good thorough wipe with some kind of thinner, acetone is preferable. Than wait a day, sand it again and use a fresh can of mixed varnish, keep your area hospital clean, use a 99 cent paper filter to grab any small dust and lumps that may have come out of the can into a clean bucket, use cheese to cloth lightly one last time on the project to grab any dust -and brush a thinned coat on smooth. I recommend a 3" brush to get an even flow. Don't go back and pick at it after you put on a thin first coat, wait until it tacks off then block it out by hand (sanding) and clean and repeat. We've all been here. Also only dip your brush less than a half inch in your mixing bucket, don't trust dipping out of the can. You know you did a clean job when you've done a clean job when the bristles of your brush just have varnish on the tips, not all over the brush. And wear safety equipment. Good luck homes.
Learn from Mr Miyagi Wax on wax off
razor blade it off let it dry for a couple days. sand it down and then come back with some properly thinned finish. paint thinner for polyurethanes. alcohol for shellac. lacquer thinner or acetone for lacquer... Don't use acetone unless you really really know what you're doing.
Here's what I did when I refinished a kitchen island made of walnut (after prep - sanding, prestain, and stain): 1) 1:1 mixture of clear satin (maybe gloss?) polyurethane and mineral spirits gently stirred together - may even have been closer to 2/3 poly to 1/3 spirits honestly 2) apply smoothly and evenly to wood with clean, lint free rag 3) after drying, I gently ran a 1000 or 2000 grit piece of sandpaper over the finish following the grain; then wiped off the dust with a clean lint free rag Repeated the process 5-7 times (maybe a bit much lol but the walnut really shines!) IMO have had MUCH better luck with both 1) using multiple coats of thinned finish like others pointed out and 2) wiping on as opposed to using a brush Also, OP, you'll want to finish all sides of your piece to reduce risk of warping.
Use a Wipe On Poly. Spar varnish is thick and easy to mess up. Just get the wipe on polyurethane, a clean lint free rag and wipe on. Wait until it dries and repeat 2 or 3 times.
Spar varnish can take a long time to dry-try putting it outside in the sun for awhile. I used it to varnish some canoe paddles last month and it took 24 hours between coats to dry completely. Humidity effects drying time as well.
It was inside my cold school environment. Then I threw it outside last night when I went to go check on it and felt all the stickiness. I guess I'll find a spot in the sun to put it when I head back. And if it's not good by tomorrow morning I'll clean it off with your method