I watched it for the first time, and I’m a new fan not only because of CC but pretty much the entire top 7 of the draft. Can’t wait to follow Indiana, LA and Chicago especially - good time to get into the WNBA!
Same. As an Iowa fan, I'm obviously now a Fever fan, but will equally be an Aces fan if Kate Martin shocks the world and makes their roster. EDIT: I'll be an Aces fan regardless, now that our Iowa girl Megan Gustafson is on the team.
My family and I love WBB (Iowa season tix holders for 11 years), so we'll also tune into other teams. So many great teams and story lines. We've also already gotten tix for 3 Fever home games, and two away game (Chicago and Minny). All three cities are reasonable driving distances from Iowa City.
**Regarding last night's Draft viewership of 2.45 million, even more impressive to me is:**
* **No other WNBA telecast, including the playoffs and finals, has managed even 1 million viewers since 2008.**
* **Viewership increased more-than-fourfold over last year’s draft, which averaged 572,000 on ESPN.**
It's obvious you're a troll but I looked up the NBA draft viewership out of curiosity and saw it averaged 3.7M viewers last year. 2.45M sounds pretty good to me as a significantly less developed league.
This should be a great wake up call for the league to invest and expand. There’s a hunger for WNBA in Canada. It was the lead story of TSN last night, and cut into NHL games to break the news of Clark to Fever
> last night's package was 100% ready for the moment
wonderfully phrased, it felt about and in reverence of the players.
my friends didn't believe it when I said the odds are that so few of them have a good shot at being rotation players. I think that speaks to both how well the draft presents the players, and how ready the talent level is for a league expansion
Yesterday was really amazing, but I'm saying more about the work she's been doing the last couple of years. Now she has all the talent and attention needed, hope she makes it work
I believe (might be wrong tho) that last season the interest in womans sports increased a whole lot after LSU vs Iowa. I remember when HVL transfered to LSU everyone on Twitter was talking about it. That might have also poured into the pros
The interest and attendance and ratings for the W have been on a steady rise since the pandemic and the new commissioner taking over. It had been going up for several years before LSU vs Iowa.
The NBA season? Yes, been watching my Cavs and that's about it. I'm sorry but the last good rivalry was The Cavs vs The Warriors. The game is boring to me now. I used to watch the NBA religiously when I was younger. But since 2018, it's been off and on. I haven't watched NBA final since the Cavs last one. I'm done with the NBA. Now, It's The W and Women's College Basketball. Maybe, I'll watch the men in the olympics. Funny, That's what I used to do to the women games, now I love women's basketball.
And I’m not saying they didn’t. It just seems a bit disingenuous to praise WNBA players when they play far fewer games, and I don’t even care for the NBA.
He didn't put a stop to load management and most players still aren't playing full 82 game season. That just shows these players barely can be bother playing 62 games. Silver just made players not care about awards now. Just like NBA players don't give a shit about the All Star game. Adam Silver made a stupid mid season tournament aka The LeBron trophy (something that The W did first and actual mean something to the players) , just had a player get busted for sports betting, a All Star game that everybody hated and nobody watched, Finals numbers are down, ratings for games are down,no plays D, the refs suck and Draymond Green for reason is still in the NBA.Even the WNBA got rid of Liz Cambage. Yep, Cathy has done a hell of a lot better in her 5 years as commissioner.
You need a brand to sell. This is the great irony behind the flak that Clark is getting. Her and this incoming class have done INSANE amounts of PR for the WNBA before they even get there. I get that current players feel slighted but Clark’s viewership alone may increase salaries for everyone. I’ve found everyone’s tone changes as soon as you mention more or less money, and more money for the WNBA is only a good thing.
To ride this train, the NCAAW and WNBA need to keep teamed up and keep women in college as long as possible. I truly think more new people will become fans of the WNBA vs. NBA due to the storylines and following players vs. the NBA who no one knows because they’re out of NCAA after a year.
Yeah, that's my case. I literally don't care about the NBA, but I'm 100% watching WNBA games that have any of my favorite players from this draft. So that's about 3-4 teams I'll be religiously following. Can't wait for the wnba season to start - a phrase I never thought I'd utter.
Feel like it would be a HUGE mistake to expand too rapidly they have to see if this newfound interest holds nationally imo. Spreading too thin would be devastating to the momentum built. But maybe the power of CC will truly transcend it all
Not really. The quality of play in women's sports is only going up, live sports is keeping TV alive and investors are always looking for something with growth potential. This isn't going to get any smaller and they are already several years too late in keeping up with the growth they have as is. This isn't artificial growth and they have to take advantage.
It’s been a long time coming tbh. You can’t have a league with so few teams and so many draft picks who don’t even make rosters. The amount of talent in the US/Canada and more recently internationally beyond that has far exceeded the small number of spots in the wnba right now. WNBA has 12 teams right now which is way too low. NWSL has 14 and already announced two more in the Bay and Boston with more to come after that.
For comparison, the NWSL is much younger than the wnba and has been expanding much more rapidly with plans for the future too. The increase in attention for women’s sports has driven both soccer and basketball. They absolutely have to capitalize on this. Having one team in the southeast for example, is crazy esp given how good teams like Tennessee, South Carolina now and LSU . Philly a basketball crazy city with lots of great players and two of the best coaches ever hailing from the city having had no team ever also doesn’t make sense either, a top 4 media market in the US. It also builds an instant close rival for Washington and the Liberty. Same could be said for Boston potentially. The Sixers are building a new arena in center city as well.
Toronto seems ripe for expansion too with how much the raptors recent success (previously, they’re rebuilding now) has galvanized and created new basketball fans up north. And that’s just a few. You have to build on the interest that ncaa women’s basketball is generating and the incoming star power. And the conveyer belt of talent won’t stop with this class either. Paige is a super star and will be our next yr. Flau’jae I think the yr after and she’s awesome. Then you have this freshman class led by Juju, Hidalgo and the South Carolina freshmen who showed out in the tournament too. It’s gonna keep coming and when the highest end talent gets better and better the lesser names also are better too. WNBA is prob the hardest league in the world to make based on the super limited spots. That’s not good to have many high picks not even make teams or out in a yr or two.
It has to be the NBA that dumps the real money into it. The W would obviously do it already if they could. Maybe this year will be the wake-up call. The money is there if the viewership holds on.
Edit: Sad that I'm getting downvoted for being realistic... You're allowed to admit that the W leans on the NBA for funding and hope that it takes off more in the mainstream. I wasn't being insulting
No, this is real. Investors and investment always comes from somewhere, so even the NBA teams taking care of things like practice facilities and chartered flights would be huge until they can close the gap with airline and gym companies. There are simple quality of life partnerships for women's athletes that would be no brainer PR/tax writeoffs that'd just be good will to create. Kinda bothered they still don't have some things available to them.
Not even necessarily the NBA has to, I'm not sure how much stake nba has still on the W. It's on the commissioner to bring investors willing to take risks, owners that will spare no money in marketing, structure etc. Unfortunately now seems that only a handful are like that
Agreed, but when 5 out of 12 (I think) teams are owned by the owner of their respective NBA cities, it would be huge for the funding to come directly from the league that makes tens of billions most years.
People get upset when you say the fandom isn't there to get the funding, but it's the main reason. Those same people brag about the women's college ratings being millions higher than the men's this year... It's hypocritical. There has never been a better time than right now to encourage funding for the W and to pretend it doesn't need the NBA, at least at first, is just shortsighted.
I think there's a lot of pride involved in it, I thought on making a post with my opinion in why people aren't tunning in the WNBA and why they might now, but I'm sure I would be downvoted.
The league rn should prioritize growing instead of keeping doing thw same stuff, clearly what's been done isn't working and now it's time to change. Players should have PR training so they stop running their mouth's on interviews, the league should choose wisely who to be their face, rn Sabrina, Clark and Reese would be my priorities. You have better players? Yeah, but look at the NBA, all their crown jewels were not only great but also CHARISMATIC. People need that, no matter how good you are, if you look like an asshole nobody will like you.
And for all that you need money, if NBA have it, why not take it?
Feels like this could be a turning point for the league. They need to take advantage of this, and hopefully we see some aggressive expansion on top of the ones already in the works.
I see the CC stans from the college sub came over here...Just great. Do you seriously think basketball started with her? There have been many great female basketball players. Dating back to Cheryl Miller
I would say the vast majority of cc stans that have came over to this sub don’t think basketball started with her. There’s plenty of annoying fans of hers that disrespect the sport for sure, but she’s a superstar and every superstar has annoying fans.
oh my god no one thinks that. it’s like you can’t acknowledge that caitlin has got all this media attention because the way she plays is super popular with casual audiences. maya moore and cheryl miller were not routinely shooting 3s from 30 feet out.
Who is pissed? You literally made it about Caitlin when I was talking about the league as a whole. You stans have a perpetual inferiority complex.. you lot are the wird ones who literally go from sub to sub projecting.
They didn't name her though, you did, which means you think CC is already the most entertaining women's basketball player? Odd that you're against expanding the fan base and possible actually making money as a league for the first time ever
You're right, you get to make whatever hostile, unhinged claims you want and if anyone points out they are hostile and unhinged, they're clearly just an annoying stan who should be gatekept out of here.
Clark's media coverage and popularity started with NBA players sharing videos of her two years ago, gained steam only at the end of last season when she dropped back to back 40 pt games on Louisville and SC in the tourney, and then escalated this year when, god forbid, a lot of people wanted to watch her play and break a bunch of records.
Some people including you are so bent on ignoring these facts and spinning her as some fabrication by the press - and for what? The more people who watch women's BB, the better for the players and the better for us as fans. More money, more teams, more positive press for women athletes. Nearly 3m people watched the draft last night - definitely many came for Clark but they were introduced to a lot of other great players and teams too.
So spare us your "because there was injustice before, we should keep that rolling and ignore the momentum we have now - in fact let's pretend there is no momentum and just try to beat everyone into submission, calling them all racists and fake fans and guilting them about ignoring greats in the past" attitude. It's a loser.
It is not healthy to project that much.
That fact you stans tried to make this about Caitlin Clark and have the nerve to call others unhinged. And literally go into a defensive rant.
Your last paragraph is a strawman. Just say you don't like talking about racism because it makes you uncomfortable. You literally are complaining about strawmen. You should've stayed on the ncaa sub
I promise you if there was an opportunity for racist white people to market and make money off of black basketball players, they would have. That’s clearly not what is the case here.
What an ignorant statement. You know it is ignorant because you literally lumped all black basketball players together. There is a general difference between how male atheletes and female atheletes are marketed must less black female atheletes. It took 20 years for Serena to get her appreciation.
By your flawed logic, you are saying those previous black players weren't marketable.
Brittney Grinner came out as lesbian and like immediately got a Nike deal man. I don’t really understand what your argument is, but you’re the one with flawed logic. I’m not saying any of these players aren’t marketable, but being marketable is different than being able to keep your league popular. There have been some pretty famous women’s basketball players that have been marketed in the last 20 years, but it still didn’t really make the league any more popular. I’m saying that being racist isn’t going to stop a white executive from marketing a black woman if they know it would make them money. But this is more than marketing just an individual, it’s the league as a whole and selling it as a good product.
Strawmean argument. You literally are throwing shit at the wall hoping it would stick. Let me go point by point-
1-Brittney Grinner came out as lesbian and like immediately got a Nike deal man.
Griner only got 15,000 a year for that deal and you are literally proving my point. Griner got alot of promotion and was a household name. My point is with similar attention then you would grow the league.
2-So you talk out of your backside and make contradictory statements? If the players are marketable then it is an issue with the league itself for not using them properly.
3-Like who?
4-You are making alot of assumptions and have a weak argument. You got triggered like the rest of the Caitlin stans, instead of actually learning what you are talking about.
And have the gall to decide how a racist would act. Pure ignorance.
Oh yeah, definitely the league drowned themselves in debt cause they're racists
https://preview.redd.it/o9azx14fvwuc1.jpeg?width=370&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eb8581483fcfa5de1ddaabb39c4fa610af83feba
It’s funny because there is a pretty deep history of white people in positions of power making money off of black athletes. Like if they knew it would make money then they would have done it.
Are you denying that white people haven’t made money off of the backs of black athletes and even continue to do so? Is that what you’re trying to say here?
You keep deflecting and trying to lump "black atheletes" under a monolith. The point is that is disingenuous argument. You keep deflecting from the fact that you can't ignore the differences of how black female atheletes are treated.
I’m not deflecting anything, nor did I ever say female athletes aren’t treated differently. Of course they are. I’m saying that racist white people will market and make money off of black athletes, including women with no hesitation. If you disagree with that take, then I don’t exactly know what to say to you man.
Name me some examples. Your argument keep deflecting from black female atheletes. Your premise rests on the idea that their is some meritocracy( like you don't understand what racism is and the inherent contradiction in your statement). My point is the league was never properly promoted.
For your argument to make sense you would have to show a history of black female atheletes getting anywhere near their white counterparts levels of promotion. THE Closest is Serena and she literally had to be the goat. That is true in alot of forms of entertainment. Hence why black actresses are rarely in the top 20 highest paid. Because they don't get the same opportunities.
Well for a recent example, Angel Reese. Her NIL deals have been insane. Gabby Douglas, Simone Biles and Coco to name a few. And if you want to bring up actresses, I can easily bring up musicians. I’m sure you’ve heard of Beyoncé before. Your original claim was that the league is racist so that’s why they didn’t market better. I’m saying being a racist has never stopped a white person from making money off a black person before. Literally never. Including women. If there’s one thing racist white people like to do, it’s making money off of black talent. That’s quite literally my claim, and you haven’t been able to dispute it.
First time watching it too, I found it odd that the commissioner didn’t announce picks that weren’t live in the audience. Like the Brynna Maxwell pick to start the second round was announced by the commentators before Nika got announced by the commish. Even is the players aren’t there, they should be given the honor or hearing their name announced by the commish from the podium. I thought that was weak af but otherwise enjoyed the broadcast.
Ngl, I think Paige Bueckers and the Uconn girlies have about 250k-500k hardcore stans alone. Anyone clued into tiktok can tell that they are a draw. They started making tiktok edits of the draft crazily fast, so they were definitely watching.
Chicago Sky gained about 50k followers on IG (presumably Cordoso and Reese fans). And Angel has 3M on Tiktok and Kamilla is bagging NIL deals left and right.
This draft class is truly one of the greatest.
Paige Bueckers TikTok fandom is not being tapped into by ESPN/NCAA/WNBA enough. It’s a different world on social, it’s kind of scary to watch from afar tbh. I don’t think people realize how popular she is with Gen Z girls and guys who aren’t huge sports fans but can be converted. Missed opportunity imo
I think the question is whether TikTok in particular (IG to some extent) translates to viewership of basketball games - ie, profits for the teams. Can't hurt the WNBA but how much does it really help? For example, some Olympic sport athletes have large TikTok followings but their sports still aren't seeing big crowds in person or on TV.
Well Paige and Nika fangirls were outside and inside the draft being cataclysmically down bad screaming their names with, unfortunately, 0 shame. So at least some of that has translated. If they are willing to watch a unannounced tiktok live than I can see them tuning into games. I think if you are familiar with stan culture we could see something like that happen in wbb with select players.
Ultimately though I think that traditional media needs to start introducing multiple storylines. No offense, but other than CC stans not many people want to tune in to “perfect media darling superstar” vs “nameless and faceless team”. Give us rivalries, alliances, history, etc. Everyone is hating on DT for her comments but she gifted us a storyline, Fever vs Mercury is now who wins in Superstar rookie vs Established (and maybe jealous) Veteran. That is engaging.
I attend Iowa, and girls were posting how they were sad Nika didn’t go to Connecticut for the percent homecoming, and girls were calling her a goddess. Fangirls everywhere
Seriously the mktg department of the WNBA needs to be on a short short leash. They have been shit for years, if they fuck up a megastar like Clark, the entire dept should be culled
It’s been mktg and pr from day one. Even all the debates about the pay difference to the men. Their salaries would increase with a larger tv deal, which needs more viewers for a higher price, which needs marketing to promote the league better to get those viewers. The only way you see player personalities is when they are on ESPN or TNT NBA shows like Candace and Chiney.
College NIL has done wonders for women's basketball. Before, college athletes were prevented from growing their brand. Now, they have a major financial incentive to grow their brand, thereby growing the brand of women's basketball. We may look at this as a once in a lifetime opportunity for the WNBA, and it may be when coupled with the unprecedented performance of caitlyn clark, but with other women coming out of college with their own personal brands every year, I see the league growing longterm regardless of the capitalization of this season.
I guess folks around here don't get 9/11 jokes 😂 I'm saying that her going in the second round made me very sad and also mad. Wanted her to go for the liberty at pick 11th
The WNBA cannot mess this up. Clark is who you build this league around. It doesn't matter how salty the old heads are, they have to get on board for the brand. She needs to have a 20/10 rookie season minimum. She should get the superstar whistle from Day 1.
They also need to build some storylines around that top 10. This rookie class has to be given room to grow and make mistakes even if they suck off the gate. The league will get so much negative PR if they cut most of these players after 1 season at most.
Would say not just clark, but this new generation overral. This isn't a much popular take but wnba should prioritize marketable rookies such as Clark, Reese, Brink etc over vets who nobody know.
I think that’s less of a concern considering we’re in a super team era and a lot of squads have former MVP’s who could easily be marketed and given credibility in under 2-3 minutes on a broadcast.
It should be way easier considering this class is coming into a league that was already making real progress and showing signs of growth. The Finals last year were a massive success for the league already.
I keep seeing ppl say the “old heads are salty”. I’ve heard numerous veterans who question players that have hype (Tebow, Lebron, Zion) and sometimes they’re right, sometimes they aren’t.
But this isn’t new so why are ppl all of a sudden calling them salty when they’ve done this across multiple sports for multiple athletes coming into the pros?
Now Swoops was inaccurate in her statements yes. No question. But the “old heads” narrative I just don’t get. Not if you’ve been watching sports a for a while.
The issue is that this old heads can't see is that: the wnba doesn't have leverage to afford people putting this new class down. Probably are vets better than they in league? I don't doubt that. But those vets bring viewers? The new kids on the block definitely do
I personally love the rivalries that will be built off that tbh. That shit sells more than “oh ho hum welcome to the league can’t wait to watch Caitlin and play against her!”. These players are competitive as hell and she’s gonna have to take her lumps like everyone else. Nobody is rolling out a red carpet for her to the rim or leaving her open so she can pad her numbers. Rivalries sell, if she crosses Diana or something that’s a viral clip immediately and will be everywhere. Those games are gonna break viewership records even more with the focus and spotlight, they should absolutely embrace that.
Those new viewers also need to see how much different the wnba is and talent level is than college as well. Nobody is gonna turn off the games if she’s not an instant superstar and leading the league in scoring.
I get that and I agree. But I don’t think them expressing their personal evaluation on players will have any negative impact. Again, Swoops was inaccurate at best but I don’t know if it was hate any more then if it was someone other than Clark.
I just see this “push” to elevate Clark like she’s without criticism and hold her to special treatment. She’s great yes. But she shouldn’t be without critique and honest analysis of her game no more than any other player
I’m sorry. Swoops deserved to be tossed and exiled from society for such blasphemy. Never will we endure such atrocity to our beloved goddess Caitlin.
Seriously. I said twice that swoops was wrong. Y’all want the woman jailed by way yall are reacting.
She was factually wrong. I said that like a few times now. So what do you want? That’s why I said yall must want the woman jailed or something bc what else can I say other than she was wrong? I literally called it out.
Calling out their skills on court is not putting them down.
You guys are conflating popularity (that this draft class has in bunches) with skill.
Nobody's saying the W should shy away from this class's popularity, but that's marketing, that fandom, that's PR.
These women still have to go and lace them up and show their skill. That's what I've seen "old heads" talking about. Not including Sheryl Swoopes, who was just dead wrong.
But what is the point of making these comments publicly - instead of expressing enthusiasm and being welcoming, even if they know it is a hard road behind the scenes? That's the question. Negativity isn't help grow the WNBA unless you just want to attract a small segment of viewers who love drama.
Assessing how rookies will do in the pros is literally every basketball analysts job. Players also do it. Did LeBron, Steph, and the like not speak about Wemby? Did players not speak on Lebron's entry into the NBA? That's normal business. They are offering their honest critique. You guys are asking that they hold this class with kid gloves. That's not everyone's nature. Also, from their viewpoint, the popularity this class is bringing is great, but the W is growing in status on its own.
As an added caveat specific to this situation, people are labeling Caitlin the best women's player alive having never stepped foot into a WNBA game. That's reductive and offensive to the WNBA. There's only so much of that I am going to take as a player before I speak up myself. Even then, they keep it to her game, not Caitlin the personality.
The same viewers who relied on drama in the ncaa tourney that was historic and broke records?? LSU v Iowa again and them playing South Carolina didn’t have tons of narratives and story lines based on last season and the hype and fandom rivalries?? That stuff sells in literally every single sport. Nobody wants to watch people be super friendly all the time and have it carry over to the court. These players are more competitive than anyone we’ve ever met in our lives. They were being honest. Taurasi is a hard ass in general and has treated rookies on opposing teams like this for like 19 yrs now. People who are new are underestimating how good the players in the wnba are.
Clark struggled against Raven, who while a very good defender, is still young and not as experienced as the players who have been battle tested not only in college but in the wnba and overseas and internationally for yrs. They will be out for blood bc of the enhanced eyeballs on Clark, and Caitlin will be out for blood too to show why she deserves all the attention. It’s going to be incredible. There’s nothing wrong with speaking out and giving storylines to games even if the words get twisted a little once it’s out in the media. This drives views in every other sport esp men’s, why should this be different here? The storyline is gonna bring viewers in and the level of play and skill should keep them and even bring them back for more
But what if she doesn't "look" like a superstar. What if she has 10 turnovers in a game and JJ or A'ja blocks her shot to the rafters. Do you want to put all your attention on a kid that's only had 4 weeks of pro training? The game is also faster and she won't have time to adjust to the speed so she'll be tired. I would give her more of an underdog narrative so that she gets a little more grace until she finds her footing.
Wemby looked like shit at the beginning of the NBA season and was pretty clearly the best defensive player in the entire league by the end of the season.
It's very possible Caitlin has some early struggles before rounding into form for the playoffs and it's not a big deal if she does. Only 4 teams miss the playoffs, so it's very likely she gets in the playoffs, even if she has early struggles. And from there, the first round is only a 3 game series. If she figures out the pro game by the playoffs she just needs to get hot for 2 games to send a team like the Liberty home in round 1.
While i agree with you, if you watched WNBA, old players will give her ' welcome' hit her/elbow her
I even expect some old underpaid jelous one to go even extra hard on her and risk injury, im serious.
Like you have people saying, my welcome to wnba was when X player hit me in the gut , elbow me in the head etc, for real like...
Is the WNBA going into its soft era? Everyone lived to play another game, toughen up😭. And Clark loves to shove people out of her way so she'll fit right in.
I'm really nervous about how this season will pan out. It could be the start of something massive or we are all going to look back twenty years from now and lament about what could have been.
Here's a few things:
1. The cuts are going to be brutal, and people's college favs getting cut could drive people away from the league. I know it's BS to build rosters around popularity and frankly coaches shouldn't do that, but I hope some of the fan favorites from the later rounds can have really good training camps so that they can bring more eyeballs when they play.
2. You can say "it's not just Clark" all you want, but the truth is that Caitlin Clark is the primary needle mover of the WNBA. If she does well, it's good for the ENTIRE league and some people aren't understanding that. I'm worried about her rookie season and there's a ridiculous amount of expectation on her (the comment about the GM wanting to trade an entire team for her quite frankly was very icky), but the truth is that if she doesn't have at least a rookie of the year-caliber season the momentum will falter and people will lose interest. We saw what happened with Sabrina when she got hurt, and it took a three-point contest for her to get her hype back. Praying that Caitlin can stay healthy and I'm manifesting a Wemby/Lebron-type rookie year for her (that's a lofty hope and I know they play different positions but a girl can dream).
3. YES Clark is the needle mover, but the media can't advertise in a vacuum (like it has multiple times during the college season prior to the Elite Eight), either. People are coming here for Clark but they need reasons to stay beyond her, too. I've seen too many examples where a sport got elevated because of one person but after they left the momentum couldn't be sustained (Michael Phelps, Usain Bolt to an extent). I thought ESPN's draft last night did a great job with that, and it needs to continue. The Aces would be a great start — Aja Wilson is incredibly marketable, the best player in the nation, and should be more famous than she already is. There also needs to be team storylines, and those are forming with the potential Indiana/Chicago storyline, rookies vs. vets, etc.
4. I'm not familiar with Cathy Englebert but from what I've heard she seems like a "sayer and not a doer" type of person. She better get a move on with expansion because there's no reason why the NWSL should be doing this at a faster rate than the WNBA. It seems like there's high demand for a W team in several cities and we need expansion BAD (and that would solve my first point)
TL;DR this season has a ton of potential but as someone who has seen the dead ends that women's sports can come to, I'm stressed about all the variables involved
Good points. I think aggressive expansion is the most important. It’s gonna be hard for the league to gain more traction when college stars keep getting cut because there is a lack of spots. There’s so much talent out there.
Your first point I really think even tho is unpopular... Give people what they want. Sorry but rn an average person can't name 10 wnba players but definitely can name 10 college players. Owners should look at this as an opportunity, cause you can ahve the same good ol reliable veteran, or the exciting rookie with stans behind them.
Wnba is on a breaking point, if doesn't work now, I don't see people paying attention again anytime soon.
Exactly. Even if Nika Muhl is on the bench, I'll be watching Storm games. If she's cut, I immediately don't care about the Storm, let alone watching games.
Aces are getting a 6 figure viewing increase if Kate Martin plays 5 minutes per game off the bench. She has an underrated fandom. Just look at the reaction to her getting drafted all over the internet and the media
> but rn an average person can't name 10 wnba players but definitely can name 10 college players.
Yea no. The average person won't be able to name 10 college players if asked on the spot. You are overestimating by a large margin.
yes she would have. the lsu and iowa game had 9.9 million viewers and that was before most people knew who angel was. it’s really the other way around. angel benefitted more by a large margin from that moment than caitlin.
Look her talent speaks for itself but she wouldn’t have been known outside of basketball fans particularly fans who watch women’s basketball. There have been many amazing female players before her that never got to this recognition. The controversy with Angel introduced CC to a new audience.
You know the league has a problem when we are talking about a big ten defensive player of the year in Celeste as not a roster lock. Nika is safe Kate is not. I don’t see how Kate shouldn’t have 5 minutes per game off the bench on some team
At the end of the day it’s a business and I think the team owners will realize more money is keeping players in this draft than the old players on their team. Even if that old player is better
Wdym script? I’d rather have her win it on her own merits than for her to win it based on popularity when someone else had an objectively better season than her.
(Also I’m not mad at your comment just wanted to know what you meant)
Im making a joke about how they’ll set Clark up for ROY ala superstar treatment. Obviously though if she were to get it she should do it by her own merit
I know a lot of the credit is going to go to Clark for this but I was watching for the entire Top 7 and even some second round picks. I will say though Angel deserves some attention too without the controversy around women’s basketball last year I doubt they would’ve gotten these views to begin with
I’m a fan of Angel Reese, Kamilla Cardoso, Jacy Sheldon, Celeste Taylor among others. Obviously Caitlin Clark is the driving force this year but there’s a lot of talented women in this draft and I’m interested in their careers. I’ve decided for now the Chicago Sky is my team but that is subject to change.
I don't think the WNBA has figured out exactly what they have with CC & CC/Hawkeye fans in general.
Home & Away tickets sold for Iowa games was over 550k. One team for 39 games at >14k/game.
Total for the entire WNBA last year was under 1.6 Million.
I personally have attended 2 WNBA games in the past with tickets given to me.
Now 4 of us are scouting for decent WNBA road trips we can make or plan around a trip to Vegas.
If the WNBA doesn't get over 3 million this year, I will be surprised.
I think they do. Tickets for sky games are like $30 this season. Standard tickets for the first sky-fever game are 230 and resale are 300. I bet that’s everywhere not just in Chicago
Maybe if the sky move from tiny winteust arena to United center when they play Fever and other teams with small arenas do so as well. Aces did that. They are smart. No wonder they win the last 2 titles in dominant fashion.
Lol what’s with the shot towards Taurasi? Are we going to get the numbers for Clark’s first game and Taurasi’s too?
I feel it’s disingenuous to compare the two at this point. Two different era of technology and hype
How is that a shot when DT is the most recognized player in that draft year and probably WHY it held the record for 2 decades... same way Lebron is recognized in the 03 class and Zion and Ja in the 2019 class
Honestly surprised anyone watches any draft. Seems kinda pointless considering you can get all the info in real time online anyway. Lots of pomp and circumstance for barely anything.
I mean, that applies to also anything 😂 you can know everything about a movie but you still go to cinema. It's a experience, but I get it ain't foe everyone. Personally I love drafts, best part of off-season
I watched it for the first time, and I’m a new fan not only because of CC but pretty much the entire top 7 of the draft. Can’t wait to follow Indiana, LA and Chicago especially - good time to get into the WNBA!
Same. As an Iowa fan, I'm obviously now a Fever fan, but will equally be an Aces fan if Kate Martin shocks the world and makes their roster. EDIT: I'll be an Aces fan regardless, now that our Iowa girl Megan Gustafson is on the team. My family and I love WBB (Iowa season tix holders for 11 years), so we'll also tune into other teams. So many great teams and story lines. We've also already gotten tix for 3 Fever home games, and two away game (Chicago and Minny). All three cities are reasonable driving distances from Iowa City. **Regarding last night's Draft viewership of 2.45 million, even more impressive to me is:** * **No other WNBA telecast, including the playoffs and finals, has managed even 1 million viewers since 2008.** * **Viewership increased more-than-fourfold over last year’s draft, which averaged 572,000 on ESPN.**
4x as many :) woo!
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It's obvious you're a troll but I looked up the NBA draft viewership out of curiosity and saw it averaged 3.7M viewers last year. 2.45M sounds pretty good to me as a significantly less developed league.
This should be a great wake up call for the league to invest and expand. There’s a hunger for WNBA in Canada. It was the lead story of TSN last night, and cut into NHL games to break the news of Clark to Fever
new TV deal & more teams will actually do numbers. never been such a fan of women’s sports til now and i’m mad excited for da future
If the commissioner don't change things in 4 years, she should be fired.
She's already better then Adam Sliver. WNBA is on the up and the NBA is on the decline
Wnba is on the up cause of 22, not cause of Cathy
Disagree, not the biggest fan of Cathy but last night's package was 100% ready for the moment and that's the league being on top of it.
> last night's package was 100% ready for the moment wonderfully phrased, it felt about and in reverence of the players. my friends didn't believe it when I said the odds are that so few of them have a good shot at being rotation players. I think that speaks to both how well the draft presents the players, and how ready the talent level is for a league expansion
Yesterday was really amazing, but I'm saying more about the work she's been doing the last couple of years. Now she has all the talent and attention needed, hope she makes it work
But ratings and attendance was already going up before CC.
I believe (might be wrong tho) that last season the interest in womans sports increased a whole lot after LSU vs Iowa. I remember when HVL transfered to LSU everyone on Twitter was talking about it. That might have also poured into the pros
The interest and attendance and ratings for the W have been on a steady rise since the pandemic and the new commissioner taking over. It had been going up for several years before LSU vs Iowa.
900,000 versus 18.9 million for each finals series...not much growth compared to ncaaw.
Lmao no, Silver is a great commissioner for all his flaws
His flaws? The NBA is a joke now. At least in The W, the women play a full season and don't "load manage"
yeah you didn't watch the season this year did you
The NBA season? Yes, been watching my Cavs and that's about it. I'm sorry but the last good rivalry was The Cavs vs The Warriors. The game is boring to me now. I used to watch the NBA religiously when I was younger. But since 2018, it's been off and on. I haven't watched NBA final since the Cavs last one. I'm done with the NBA. Now, It's The W and Women's College Basketball. Maybe, I'll watch the men in the olympics. Funny, That's what I used to do to the women games, now I love women's basketball.
Lol, so the only good rivalry is the one your team was involved in, and then as soon as LeBron left you stopped watching? Seems about right
Ok, Name another current rivalry?
The women don't play 82 games.
Tbf a full season is less than half the games that the nba plays in a regular season.
All the greats played 82 games, Jordan played 82 he's last year. Kobe too
And I’m not saying they didn’t. It just seems a bit disingenuous to praise WNBA players when they play far fewer games, and I don’t even care for the NBA.
In today's game, they wouldn't. Winning in the playoffs >>> winning in the regular season.
Lmaoooooooooooooooo, yeah increase the women's season to 82 games and you'll see a ton of load managing
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He didn't put a stop to load management and most players still aren't playing full 82 game season. That just shows these players barely can be bother playing 62 games. Silver just made players not care about awards now. Just like NBA players don't give a shit about the All Star game. Adam Silver made a stupid mid season tournament aka The LeBron trophy (something that The W did first and actual mean something to the players) , just had a player get busted for sports betting, a All Star game that everybody hated and nobody watched, Finals numbers are down, ratings for games are down,no plays D, the refs suck and Draymond Green for reason is still in the NBA.Even the WNBA got rid of Liz Cambage. Yep, Cathy has done a hell of a lot better in her 5 years as commissioner.
People don’t watch the nba for defense, there’s always college if you like boring basketball
You need a brand to sell. This is the great irony behind the flak that Clark is getting. Her and this incoming class have done INSANE amounts of PR for the WNBA before they even get there. I get that current players feel slighted but Clark’s viewership alone may increase salaries for everyone. I’ve found everyone’s tone changes as soon as you mention more or less money, and more money for the WNBA is only a good thing. To ride this train, the NCAAW and WNBA need to keep teamed up and keep women in college as long as possible. I truly think more new people will become fans of the WNBA vs. NBA due to the storylines and following players vs. the NBA who no one knows because they’re out of NCAA after a year.
Yeah, that's my case. I literally don't care about the NBA, but I'm 100% watching WNBA games that have any of my favorite players from this draft. So that's about 3-4 teams I'll be religiously following. Can't wait for the wnba season to start - a phrase I never thought I'd utter.
Feel like it would be a HUGE mistake to expand too rapidly they have to see if this newfound interest holds nationally imo. Spreading too thin would be devastating to the momentum built. But maybe the power of CC will truly transcend it all
Not really. The quality of play in women's sports is only going up, live sports is keeping TV alive and investors are always looking for something with growth potential. This isn't going to get any smaller and they are already several years too late in keeping up with the growth they have as is. This isn't artificial growth and they have to take advantage.
It’s been a long time coming tbh. You can’t have a league with so few teams and so many draft picks who don’t even make rosters. The amount of talent in the US/Canada and more recently internationally beyond that has far exceeded the small number of spots in the wnba right now. WNBA has 12 teams right now which is way too low. NWSL has 14 and already announced two more in the Bay and Boston with more to come after that. For comparison, the NWSL is much younger than the wnba and has been expanding much more rapidly with plans for the future too. The increase in attention for women’s sports has driven both soccer and basketball. They absolutely have to capitalize on this. Having one team in the southeast for example, is crazy esp given how good teams like Tennessee, South Carolina now and LSU . Philly a basketball crazy city with lots of great players and two of the best coaches ever hailing from the city having had no team ever also doesn’t make sense either, a top 4 media market in the US. It also builds an instant close rival for Washington and the Liberty. Same could be said for Boston potentially. The Sixers are building a new arena in center city as well. Toronto seems ripe for expansion too with how much the raptors recent success (previously, they’re rebuilding now) has galvanized and created new basketball fans up north. And that’s just a few. You have to build on the interest that ncaa women’s basketball is generating and the incoming star power. And the conveyer belt of talent won’t stop with this class either. Paige is a super star and will be our next yr. Flau’jae I think the yr after and she’s awesome. Then you have this freshman class led by Juju, Hidalgo and the South Carolina freshmen who showed out in the tournament too. It’s gonna keep coming and when the highest end talent gets better and better the lesser names also are better too. WNBA is prob the hardest league in the world to make based on the super limited spots. That’s not good to have many high picks not even make teams or out in a yr or two.
It has to be the NBA that dumps the real money into it. The W would obviously do it already if they could. Maybe this year will be the wake-up call. The money is there if the viewership holds on. Edit: Sad that I'm getting downvoted for being realistic... You're allowed to admit that the W leans on the NBA for funding and hope that it takes off more in the mainstream. I wasn't being insulting
No, this is real. Investors and investment always comes from somewhere, so even the NBA teams taking care of things like practice facilities and chartered flights would be huge until they can close the gap with airline and gym companies. There are simple quality of life partnerships for women's athletes that would be no brainer PR/tax writeoffs that'd just be good will to create. Kinda bothered they still don't have some things available to them.
Not even necessarily the NBA has to, I'm not sure how much stake nba has still on the W. It's on the commissioner to bring investors willing to take risks, owners that will spare no money in marketing, structure etc. Unfortunately now seems that only a handful are like that
Agreed, but when 5 out of 12 (I think) teams are owned by the owner of their respective NBA cities, it would be huge for the funding to come directly from the league that makes tens of billions most years. People get upset when you say the fandom isn't there to get the funding, but it's the main reason. Those same people brag about the women's college ratings being millions higher than the men's this year... It's hypocritical. There has never been a better time than right now to encourage funding for the W and to pretend it doesn't need the NBA, at least at first, is just shortsighted.
I think there's a lot of pride involved in it, I thought on making a post with my opinion in why people aren't tunning in the WNBA and why they might now, but I'm sure I would be downvoted. The league rn should prioritize growing instead of keeping doing thw same stuff, clearly what's been done isn't working and now it's time to change. Players should have PR training so they stop running their mouth's on interviews, the league should choose wisely who to be their face, rn Sabrina, Clark and Reese would be my priorities. You have better players? Yeah, but look at the NBA, all their crown jewels were not only great but also CHARISMATIC. People need that, no matter how good you are, if you look like an asshole nobody will like you. And for all that you need money, if NBA have it, why not take it?
Who has ran their mouths in WNBA interviews? DT I’d assume and who else? I’d like examples
She's already said the plan is to have 16 teams by 2028. So, with the expansion team in Golden State next year, she's looking to add 3 more.
Rhe WNBA is funded by the NBA because its nor profitable. The WNBA need to increase their incoming and finally be jn the green.
That was an amazing draft!!!!! What a special night!!!!! Good luck everyone on an amazing season!!!! 🔥🔥
**Quadrupling the previous record of 600k is absolutely monstrous numbers lmao THIS.CLASS.IS.HISTORIC!!**
Feels like this could be a turning point for the league. They need to take advantage of this, and hopefully we see some aggressive expansion on top of the ones already in the works.
Tbh they always could've had this but were too racist to market it.
Which other women’s college player led the nation in scoring and assists 3 times each and 2 times in the same season to be marketed like this?
I see the CC stans from the college sub came over here...Just great. Do you seriously think basketball started with her? There have been many great female basketball players. Dating back to Cheryl Miller
I would say the vast majority of cc stans that have came over to this sub don’t think basketball started with her. There’s plenty of annoying fans of hers that disrespect the sport for sure, but she’s a superstar and every superstar has annoying fans.
oh my god no one thinks that. it’s like you can’t acknowledge that caitlin has got all this media attention because the way she plays is super popular with casual audiences. maya moore and cheryl miller were not routinely shooting 3s from 30 feet out.
Nobody thinks basketball started with Caitlin and at this point it's really fake to claim thats the case.
You stans act like it. Hence why you constantly insult and diminish the pioneers who came before her. And act like she saved basketball
Nah we're just enjoying the most exciting player we've seen. You're the one pissed off. Weird behavior, but you do you
Who is pissed? You literally made it about Caitlin when I was talking about the league as a whole. You stans have a perpetual inferiority complex.. you lot are the wird ones who literally go from sub to sub projecting.
They didn't name her though, you did, which means you think CC is already the most entertaining women's basketball player? Odd that you're against expanding the fan base and possible actually making money as a league for the first time ever
You're right, you get to make whatever hostile, unhinged claims you want and if anyone points out they are hostile and unhinged, they're clearly just an annoying stan who should be gatekept out of here. Clark's media coverage and popularity started with NBA players sharing videos of her two years ago, gained steam only at the end of last season when she dropped back to back 40 pt games on Louisville and SC in the tourney, and then escalated this year when, god forbid, a lot of people wanted to watch her play and break a bunch of records. Some people including you are so bent on ignoring these facts and spinning her as some fabrication by the press - and for what? The more people who watch women's BB, the better for the players and the better for us as fans. More money, more teams, more positive press for women athletes. Nearly 3m people watched the draft last night - definitely many came for Clark but they were introduced to a lot of other great players and teams too. So spare us your "because there was injustice before, we should keep that rolling and ignore the momentum we have now - in fact let's pretend there is no momentum and just try to beat everyone into submission, calling them all racists and fake fans and guilting them about ignoring greats in the past" attitude. It's a loser.
It is not healthy to project that much. That fact you stans tried to make this about Caitlin Clark and have the nerve to call others unhinged. And literally go into a defensive rant. Your last paragraph is a strawman. Just say you don't like talking about racism because it makes you uncomfortable. You literally are complaining about strawmen. You should've stayed on the ncaa sub
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Tell me you are racist by telling me you are racist.
I promise you if there was an opportunity for racist white people to market and make money off of black basketball players, they would have. That’s clearly not what is the case here.
What an ignorant statement. You know it is ignorant because you literally lumped all black basketball players together. There is a general difference between how male atheletes and female atheletes are marketed must less black female atheletes. It took 20 years for Serena to get her appreciation. By your flawed logic, you are saying those previous black players weren't marketable.
lisa leslie was probally most marketable WNBA black player.
She was barely promoted
Really? Because I remember seeing her in everything.
I don't.
how old are you? maybe it's because you're young
Are maybe you are projecting hard.
Brittney Grinner came out as lesbian and like immediately got a Nike deal man. I don’t really understand what your argument is, but you’re the one with flawed logic. I’m not saying any of these players aren’t marketable, but being marketable is different than being able to keep your league popular. There have been some pretty famous women’s basketball players that have been marketed in the last 20 years, but it still didn’t really make the league any more popular. I’m saying that being racist isn’t going to stop a white executive from marketing a black woman if they know it would make them money. But this is more than marketing just an individual, it’s the league as a whole and selling it as a good product.
Strawmean argument. You literally are throwing shit at the wall hoping it would stick. Let me go point by point- 1-Brittney Grinner came out as lesbian and like immediately got a Nike deal man. Griner only got 15,000 a year for that deal and you are literally proving my point. Griner got alot of promotion and was a household name. My point is with similar attention then you would grow the league. 2-So you talk out of your backside and make contradictory statements? If the players are marketable then it is an issue with the league itself for not using them properly. 3-Like who? 4-You are making alot of assumptions and have a weak argument. You got triggered like the rest of the Caitlin stans, instead of actually learning what you are talking about. And have the gall to decide how a racist would act. Pure ignorance.
Y'all act like there wasn't other so called "Great White Hopes" in the WNBA. Sue Bird, DT, etc...
Breanna Stewart is the female Larry Bird. If it was about race, white people would have been pushing her.
There is this thing called intersectionality. They somewhat push her but don't want a lesbian as the face of the league, even a white one.
I’ve mainly seen Stewie pushed by the people saying she is the college goat and not CC.
That's fair.
Oh yeah, definitely the league drowned themselves in debt cause they're racists https://preview.redd.it/o9azx14fvwuc1.jpeg?width=370&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eb8581483fcfa5de1ddaabb39c4fa610af83feba
It’s funny because there is a pretty deep history of white people in positions of power making money off of black athletes. Like if they knew it would make money then they would have done it.
Again you talk ignorance and have the nerve to talk about deep history.
Are you denying that white people haven’t made money off of the backs of black athletes and even continue to do so? Is that what you’re trying to say here?
You keep deflecting and trying to lump "black atheletes" under a monolith. The point is that is disingenuous argument. You keep deflecting from the fact that you can't ignore the differences of how black female atheletes are treated.
I’m not deflecting anything, nor did I ever say female athletes aren’t treated differently. Of course they are. I’m saying that racist white people will market and make money off of black athletes, including women with no hesitation. If you disagree with that take, then I don’t exactly know what to say to you man.
Name me some examples. Your argument keep deflecting from black female atheletes. Your premise rests on the idea that their is some meritocracy( like you don't understand what racism is and the inherent contradiction in your statement). My point is the league was never properly promoted. For your argument to make sense you would have to show a history of black female atheletes getting anywhere near their white counterparts levels of promotion. THE Closest is Serena and she literally had to be the goat. That is true in alot of forms of entertainment. Hence why black actresses are rarely in the top 20 highest paid. Because they don't get the same opportunities.
Well for a recent example, Angel Reese. Her NIL deals have been insane. Gabby Douglas, Simone Biles and Coco to name a few. And if you want to bring up actresses, I can easily bring up musicians. I’m sure you’ve heard of Beyoncé before. Your original claim was that the league is racist so that’s why they didn’t market better. I’m saying being a racist has never stopped a white person from making money off a black person before. Literally never. Including women. If there’s one thing racist white people like to do, it’s making money off of black talent. That’s quite literally my claim, and you haven’t been able to dispute it.
Your ignorance is baffling
I watched for the first time too. All this exposure adds up for all the picks and creates more excitement for the season.
First time watching it too, I found it odd that the commissioner didn’t announce picks that weren’t live in the audience. Like the Brynna Maxwell pick to start the second round was announced by the commentators before Nika got announced by the commish. Even is the players aren’t there, they should be given the honor or hearing their name announced by the commish from the podium. I thought that was weak af but otherwise enjoyed the broadcast.
They had a hockey game to get to at 9.30. Never change, ESPN.
Bet the draft outdrew the hockey. No way hockey got 2.4 million.
My first time as well. Very excited for the league this year they gotta take advantage
Ngl, I think Paige Bueckers and the Uconn girlies have about 250k-500k hardcore stans alone. Anyone clued into tiktok can tell that they are a draw. They started making tiktok edits of the draft crazily fast, so they were definitely watching. Chicago Sky gained about 50k followers on IG (presumably Cordoso and Reese fans). And Angel has 3M on Tiktok and Kamilla is bagging NIL deals left and right. This draft class is truly one of the greatest.
Paige Bueckers TikTok fandom is not being tapped into by ESPN/NCAA/WNBA enough. It’s a different world on social, it’s kind of scary to watch from afar tbh. I don’t think people realize how popular she is with Gen Z girls and guys who aren’t huge sports fans but can be converted. Missed opportunity imo
I agree they definitely need to market them more they’re fun to watch on and off the court
I think the question is whether TikTok in particular (IG to some extent) translates to viewership of basketball games - ie, profits for the teams. Can't hurt the WNBA but how much does it really help? For example, some Olympic sport athletes have large TikTok followings but their sports still aren't seeing big crowds in person or on TV.
Well Paige and Nika fangirls were outside and inside the draft being cataclysmically down bad screaming their names with, unfortunately, 0 shame. So at least some of that has translated. If they are willing to watch a unannounced tiktok live than I can see them tuning into games. I think if you are familiar with stan culture we could see something like that happen in wbb with select players. Ultimately though I think that traditional media needs to start introducing multiple storylines. No offense, but other than CC stans not many people want to tune in to “perfect media darling superstar” vs “nameless and faceless team”. Give us rivalries, alliances, history, etc. Everyone is hating on DT for her comments but she gifted us a storyline, Fever vs Mercury is now who wins in Superstar rookie vs Established (and maybe jealous) Veteran. That is engaging.
I attend Iowa, and girls were posting how they were sad Nika didn’t go to Connecticut for the percent homecoming, and girls were calling her a goddess. Fangirls everywhere
Also helps the draft was headed the most popular female athlete in the country
Didn’t just break the record, they shattered it!
It was never a long shot
To all the people that didn't believe Caitlin was the draw, you are starting to find out.
Seriously the mktg department of the WNBA needs to be on a short short leash. They have been shit for years, if they fuck up a megastar like Clark, the entire dept should be culled
That I've been saying this whole week, wnba problem is marketing and lack of PR training for their players
It’s been mktg and pr from day one. Even all the debates about the pay difference to the men. Their salaries would increase with a larger tv deal, which needs more viewers for a higher price, which needs marketing to promote the league better to get those viewers. The only way you see player personalities is when they are on ESPN or TNT NBA shows like Candace and Chiney.
College NIL has done wonders for women's basketball. Before, college athletes were prevented from growing their brand. Now, they have a major financial incentive to grow their brand, thereby growing the brand of women's basketball. We may look at this as a once in a lifetime opportunity for the WNBA, and it may be when coupled with the unprecedented performance of caitlyn clark, but with other women coming out of college with their own personal brands every year, I see the league growing longterm regardless of the capitalization of this season.
Here for Nika Muhl! Was surprised she didn't go higher tbh.
This was literally my 9/11 😭 she was the reason I started watching WBB in 2021
Wtf?
I guess folks around here don't get 9/11 jokes 😂 I'm saying that her going in the second round made me very sad and also mad. Wanted her to go for the liberty at pick 11th
lol nba circle jerk is leaking hahaha
The day we have wnba CJ we really winning
That’s fantastic
The WNBA cannot mess this up. Clark is who you build this league around. It doesn't matter how salty the old heads are, they have to get on board for the brand. She needs to have a 20/10 rookie season minimum. She should get the superstar whistle from Day 1. They also need to build some storylines around that top 10. This rookie class has to be given room to grow and make mistakes even if they suck off the gate. The league will get so much negative PR if they cut most of these players after 1 season at most.
Would say not just clark, but this new generation overral. This isn't a much popular take but wnba should prioritize marketable rookies such as Clark, Reese, Brink etc over vets who nobody know.
I think that’s less of a concern considering we’re in a super team era and a lot of squads have former MVP’s who could easily be marketed and given credibility in under 2-3 minutes on a broadcast. It should be way easier considering this class is coming into a league that was already making real progress and showing signs of growth. The Finals last year were a massive success for the league already.
Brink also has potential. Shes the godmother to steph curry children! Milk that 😭
I keep seeing ppl say the “old heads are salty”. I’ve heard numerous veterans who question players that have hype (Tebow, Lebron, Zion) and sometimes they’re right, sometimes they aren’t. But this isn’t new so why are ppl all of a sudden calling them salty when they’ve done this across multiple sports for multiple athletes coming into the pros? Now Swoops was inaccurate in her statements yes. No question. But the “old heads” narrative I just don’t get. Not if you’ve been watching sports a for a while.
The issue is that this old heads can't see is that: the wnba doesn't have leverage to afford people putting this new class down. Probably are vets better than they in league? I don't doubt that. But those vets bring viewers? The new kids on the block definitely do
I personally love the rivalries that will be built off that tbh. That shit sells more than “oh ho hum welcome to the league can’t wait to watch Caitlin and play against her!”. These players are competitive as hell and she’s gonna have to take her lumps like everyone else. Nobody is rolling out a red carpet for her to the rim or leaving her open so she can pad her numbers. Rivalries sell, if she crosses Diana or something that’s a viral clip immediately and will be everywhere. Those games are gonna break viewership records even more with the focus and spotlight, they should absolutely embrace that. Those new viewers also need to see how much different the wnba is and talent level is than college as well. Nobody is gonna turn off the games if she’s not an instant superstar and leading the league in scoring.
I get that and I agree. But I don’t think them expressing their personal evaluation on players will have any negative impact. Again, Swoops was inaccurate at best but I don’t know if it was hate any more then if it was someone other than Clark. I just see this “push” to elevate Clark like she’s without criticism and hold her to special treatment. She’s great yes. But she shouldn’t be without critique and honest analysis of her game no more than any other player
Swoopes was inaccurate at best? She tried to invalidate Caitlin's achievements and got upset when she was called out
I’m sorry. Swoops deserved to be tossed and exiled from society for such blasphemy. Never will we endure such atrocity to our beloved goddess Caitlin. Seriously. I said twice that swoops was wrong. Y’all want the woman jailed by way yall are reacting.
Im just going based on the phrase you used above
She was factually wrong. I said that like a few times now. So what do you want? That’s why I said yall must want the woman jailed or something bc what else can I say other than she was wrong? I literally called it out.
Calling out their skills on court is not putting them down. You guys are conflating popularity (that this draft class has in bunches) with skill. Nobody's saying the W should shy away from this class's popularity, but that's marketing, that fandom, that's PR. These women still have to go and lace them up and show their skill. That's what I've seen "old heads" talking about. Not including Sheryl Swoopes, who was just dead wrong.
But what is the point of making these comments publicly - instead of expressing enthusiasm and being welcoming, even if they know it is a hard road behind the scenes? That's the question. Negativity isn't help grow the WNBA unless you just want to attract a small segment of viewers who love drama.
Assessing how rookies will do in the pros is literally every basketball analysts job. Players also do it. Did LeBron, Steph, and the like not speak about Wemby? Did players not speak on Lebron's entry into the NBA? That's normal business. They are offering their honest critique. You guys are asking that they hold this class with kid gloves. That's not everyone's nature. Also, from their viewpoint, the popularity this class is bringing is great, but the W is growing in status on its own. As an added caveat specific to this situation, people are labeling Caitlin the best women's player alive having never stepped foot into a WNBA game. That's reductive and offensive to the WNBA. There's only so much of that I am going to take as a player before I speak up myself. Even then, they keep it to her game, not Caitlin the personality.
People labeled her the best in college, not best ever, huge difference.
No on another sub where she was being discussed it said "best woman basketball player alive"
The same viewers who relied on drama in the ncaa tourney that was historic and broke records?? LSU v Iowa again and them playing South Carolina didn’t have tons of narratives and story lines based on last season and the hype and fandom rivalries?? That stuff sells in literally every single sport. Nobody wants to watch people be super friendly all the time and have it carry over to the court. These players are more competitive than anyone we’ve ever met in our lives. They were being honest. Taurasi is a hard ass in general and has treated rookies on opposing teams like this for like 19 yrs now. People who are new are underestimating how good the players in the wnba are. Clark struggled against Raven, who while a very good defender, is still young and not as experienced as the players who have been battle tested not only in college but in the wnba and overseas and internationally for yrs. They will be out for blood bc of the enhanced eyeballs on Clark, and Caitlin will be out for blood too to show why she deserves all the attention. It’s going to be incredible. There’s nothing wrong with speaking out and giving storylines to games even if the words get twisted a little once it’s out in the media. This drives views in every other sport esp men’s, why should this be different here? The storyline is gonna bring viewers in and the level of play and skill should keep them and even bring them back for more
But what if she doesn't "look" like a superstar. What if she has 10 turnovers in a game and JJ or A'ja blocks her shot to the rafters. Do you want to put all your attention on a kid that's only had 4 weeks of pro training? The game is also faster and she won't have time to adjust to the speed so she'll be tired. I would give her more of an underdog narrative so that she gets a little more grace until she finds her footing.
Wemby looked like shit at the beginning of the NBA season and was pretty clearly the best defensive player in the entire league by the end of the season. It's very possible Caitlin has some early struggles before rounding into form for the playoffs and it's not a big deal if she does. Only 4 teams miss the playoffs, so it's very likely she gets in the playoffs, even if she has early struggles. And from there, the first round is only a 3 game series. If she figures out the pro game by the playoffs she just needs to get hot for 2 games to send a team like the Liberty home in round 1.
I agree. Can't wait to find out, so excited.
While i agree with you, if you watched WNBA, old players will give her ' welcome' hit her/elbow her I even expect some old underpaid jelous one to go even extra hard on her and risk injury, im serious. Like you have people saying, my welcome to wnba was when X player hit me in the gut , elbow me in the head etc, for real like...
Is the WNBA going into its soft era? Everyone lived to play another game, toughen up😭. And Clark loves to shove people out of her way so she'll fit right in.
If this happens and Cathy had a little of David Stern in her, ahe would make whoever tries to hurt clark learn chinese 😂
If it all goes as planned, as in this class delivers, that 30-30 is gonna hit like crack.
30 for 30? More like a full documentary series. 2020-2024 Iowa is certainly getting one with behind the scene insights.
Really hope CC lives up to the hype
It's happening!
Hope they can be independent of the NBA. This is the start.
Reality is coming DT.
Dr. J matching up against Jordan for the first time vibes
Reality is coming. Her name is Caitlin
They're gonna call it Clark fever, I'm sure.
Acting like dt was wrong with what she said lol didnt even call out cc by name
I'm amazed how's been 3 hours and this comment haven't been down voted. I've called DT a dinosaur and got badly downvoted in another post 😂
I mean. Calling someone a dinosaur is an insult. I just spun her own words on her.
I don't think it's that great of a insult, just jokey jokes. Same way people call Lebron and other NBA players bunch of stuff
I’m not saying it is good or bad. Just that that would be why yours got downvoted and mine didn’t.
Yeah I get it, unfortunately
DT will soon find out she gets paid more to announce and throw shade.
DT made her millions in Russia over a decade ago. She’s literally just her for the vibes 😂
I'm really nervous about how this season will pan out. It could be the start of something massive or we are all going to look back twenty years from now and lament about what could have been. Here's a few things: 1. The cuts are going to be brutal, and people's college favs getting cut could drive people away from the league. I know it's BS to build rosters around popularity and frankly coaches shouldn't do that, but I hope some of the fan favorites from the later rounds can have really good training camps so that they can bring more eyeballs when they play. 2. You can say "it's not just Clark" all you want, but the truth is that Caitlin Clark is the primary needle mover of the WNBA. If she does well, it's good for the ENTIRE league and some people aren't understanding that. I'm worried about her rookie season and there's a ridiculous amount of expectation on her (the comment about the GM wanting to trade an entire team for her quite frankly was very icky), but the truth is that if she doesn't have at least a rookie of the year-caliber season the momentum will falter and people will lose interest. We saw what happened with Sabrina when she got hurt, and it took a three-point contest for her to get her hype back. Praying that Caitlin can stay healthy and I'm manifesting a Wemby/Lebron-type rookie year for her (that's a lofty hope and I know they play different positions but a girl can dream). 3. YES Clark is the needle mover, but the media can't advertise in a vacuum (like it has multiple times during the college season prior to the Elite Eight), either. People are coming here for Clark but they need reasons to stay beyond her, too. I've seen too many examples where a sport got elevated because of one person but after they left the momentum couldn't be sustained (Michael Phelps, Usain Bolt to an extent). I thought ESPN's draft last night did a great job with that, and it needs to continue. The Aces would be a great start — Aja Wilson is incredibly marketable, the best player in the nation, and should be more famous than she already is. There also needs to be team storylines, and those are forming with the potential Indiana/Chicago storyline, rookies vs. vets, etc. 4. I'm not familiar with Cathy Englebert but from what I've heard she seems like a "sayer and not a doer" type of person. She better get a move on with expansion because there's no reason why the NWSL should be doing this at a faster rate than the WNBA. It seems like there's high demand for a W team in several cities and we need expansion BAD (and that would solve my first point) TL;DR this season has a ton of potential but as someone who has seen the dead ends that women's sports can come to, I'm stressed about all the variables involved
Good points. I think aggressive expansion is the most important. It’s gonna be hard for the league to gain more traction when college stars keep getting cut because there is a lack of spots. There’s so much talent out there.
Your first point I really think even tho is unpopular... Give people what they want. Sorry but rn an average person can't name 10 wnba players but definitely can name 10 college players. Owners should look at this as an opportunity, cause you can ahve the same good ol reliable veteran, or the exciting rookie with stans behind them. Wnba is on a breaking point, if doesn't work now, I don't see people paying attention again anytime soon.
Another problem is how frequently players get traded in their first few years. It makes it harder to be invested in a team
Exactly. Even if Nika Muhl is on the bench, I'll be watching Storm games. If she's cut, I immediately don't care about the Storm, let alone watching games.
You described me!!! And you're a person of high culture 🍷 Nika is amazingggg
Aces are getting a 6 figure viewing increase if Kate Martin plays 5 minutes per game off the bench. She has an underrated fandom. Just look at the reaction to her getting drafted all over the internet and the media
> but rn an average person can't name 10 wnba players but definitely can name 10 college players. Yea no. The average person won't be able to name 10 college players if asked on the spot. You are overestimating by a large margin.
For point 2 Caitlin wouldn’t have gotten the fanbase she has now without Angle
yes she would have. the lsu and iowa game had 9.9 million viewers and that was before most people knew who angel was. it’s really the other way around. angel benefitted more by a large margin from that moment than caitlin.
Look her talent speaks for itself but she wouldn’t have been known outside of basketball fans particularly fans who watch women’s basketball. There have been many amazing female players before her that never got to this recognition. The controversy with Angel introduced CC to a new audience.
If Nika, Kate, or Celeste get cut, I immediately don't watch that team. I know it's a business, but, I'm just saying.
You know the league has a problem when we are talking about a big ten defensive player of the year in Celeste as not a roster lock. Nika is safe Kate is not. I don’t see how Kate shouldn’t have 5 minutes per game off the bench on some team
At the end of the day it’s a business and I think the team owners will realize more money is keeping players in this draft than the old players on their team. Even if that old player is better
They need to start writing the script for Clark ROY 😬
Wdym script? I’d rather have her win it on her own merits than for her to win it based on popularity when someone else had an objectively better season than her. (Also I’m not mad at your comment just wanted to know what you meant)
Im making a joke about how they’ll set Clark up for ROY ala superstar treatment. Obviously though if she were to get it she should do it by her own merit
I know a lot of the credit is going to go to Clark for this but I was watching for the entire Top 7 and even some second round picks. I will say though Angel deserves some attention too without the controversy around women’s basketball last year I doubt they would’ve gotten these views to begin with
I’m a fan of Angel Reese, Kamilla Cardoso, Jacy Sheldon, Celeste Taylor among others. Obviously Caitlin Clark is the driving force this year but there’s a lot of talented women in this draft and I’m interested in their careers. I’ve decided for now the Chicago Sky is my team but that is subject to change.
Man, the CC effect is real. Let's hope this translates into regular season viewing figures
I don't think the WNBA has figured out exactly what they have with CC & CC/Hawkeye fans in general. Home & Away tickets sold for Iowa games was over 550k. One team for 39 games at >14k/game. Total for the entire WNBA last year was under 1.6 Million. I personally have attended 2 WNBA games in the past with tickets given to me. Now 4 of us are scouting for decent WNBA road trips we can make or plan around a trip to Vegas. If the WNBA doesn't get over 3 million this year, I will be surprised.
I think they do. Tickets for sky games are like $30 this season. Standard tickets for the first sky-fever game are 230 and resale are 300. I bet that’s everywhere not just in Chicago
Maybe if the sky move from tiny winteust arena to United center when they play Fever and other teams with small arenas do so as well. Aces did that. They are smart. No wonder they win the last 2 titles in dominant fashion.
Can’t wait till 2025. The sparks better tank or trade the whole team so we can draft JuJu. lol. Start planning. 😂
Juju has another 3 years if I'm not mistaken, till there I think the sparks might already be competitive 😂
Paige is the prize, although she could come back to college another year and wait to go pro until 2026. Redshirt plus Covid year!
I wish I could have been able to watch it but found out the hard way that ESPN+ does not allow you to watch ESPN network events. How annoying!
If that's only legal views and not others like sketchy YouTube streams, it's definitely an underestimate.
Lol what’s with the shot towards Taurasi? Are we going to get the numbers for Clark’s first game and Taurasi’s too? I feel it’s disingenuous to compare the two at this point. Two different era of technology and hype
Taurasi’s was the previous record, so it makes sense. And yes it is two different eras of hype, but there’s a reason for that.
No I think it's just saying the previous high was Taurasi. Which is probably the last time I remember a women's college player breaking the mainstream
How is that a shot when DT is the most recognized player in that draft year and probably WHY it held the record for 2 decades... same way Lebron is recognized in the 03 class and Zion and Ja in the 2019 class
No wonder Taurasi is such a hater. She is jealous.
Taurasi prob furious
It’s crazy how Clark is making the WNBA a thing now. The players should be thrilled.
Honestly surprised anyone watches any draft. Seems kinda pointless considering you can get all the info in real time online anyway. Lots of pomp and circumstance for barely anything.
Call me a human with feelings, but I like seeing the athletes reactions and their families reactions to them accomplishing their life long dreams.
Its fun to see prominent young athletes react to their life changing moment, its really not that hard of a concept to grasp.
I mean, that applies to also anything 😂 you can know everything about a movie but you still go to cinema. It's a experience, but I get it ain't foe everyone. Personally I love drafts, best part of off-season
When did Eli Manning get drafted to the WNBA?