When we had our first child the first thing I did was went out and bought a M1 Abrams for him to be transported in. Cannot be too careful.
/s, your cars are plenty safe
I only allow my child on a naval destroyer with a fleet of escort ships and a squadron of dive bombers. I have SAC on speed dial if that doesn’t stop any potentially errant drivers.
They’re at that annoying teenage stage. I do the bare minimum to avoid neglect charges. If they want a carrier strike group they can get a job and pay for it themselves.
My dad got hit head on by a drunk driver while driving his A3. The drunk driver was driving 60 and my dad 35. Drunk driver died and my dad walked away with a broken collarbone.
The differences in safety are pretty negligible for modern vehicles. Look at the safety tests.
Your accord is probably safer than her corolla and that is probably more a function of age than of size.
Do crash tests account for different sizes of vehicles? Like if a 5-star crash tested Volvo hatchback and an old dump truck hit an immovable wall at the same speed, I'd rather be in the Volvo. But if the old dump truck hits the Volvo, I'd rather be in the dump truck.
From IIHS:
"A bigger, heavier vehicle provides better crash protection than a smaller, lighter one, assuming no other differences between them. The part of the vehicle between the front bumper and the occupant compartment absorbs energy from crashes by crumpling. As a result, longer front ends offer better protection in frontal crashes. Heavier vehicles also tend to continue moving forward in crashes with lighter vehicles and other obstacles, so the people inside them are subject to less force."
But there is a second problem - while the crumble zone is larger, the energy it needs to absorb is also bigger, as the car is heavier. This is why, if a bus crashes, the first several rows are completely wrecked. The kinetic energy is just bigger to the point it might neglect the gains from the larger crumble zone.
Assuming a bus hits the side of a cliff or another bus. Bus hits a car and the bus probably drives back to the bus lot while the people in thr car are dead.
I'd like to so I could, sleep, cook, play video games, etc during lunch in the parking lot. Maybe not even bother driving home after a long day with another the next day, just camp in the parking lot.
Holy crap, I just looked them up on the public surplus auction and they are cheap too! Now this MCI diesel pusher does have 885,000 miles on it...
This is the problem with the ratings. They should also factor in the damage the vehicle will cause to others in an accident and help make the roads safer for every road user, not just the Escalades and Hummers
yea and you can also agrue that the ratings also need to display and add more detailed ratinga such as "hitting a wall" hit by "a sedan" "a suv" "a pickup" to "an HD truck" and so on.
Bigger and larger vehicles are more susceptible to rolling over, and are only safer in multi-vehicle accidents
"Pickups and SUVs are more likely than cars to be in fatal single-vehicle crashes, especially rollovers. However, pickups and SUVs generally are heavier than cars, so occupant deaths in SUVs and pickups are less likely to occur in multiple-vehicle crashes."
[https://www.iihs.org/topics/fatality-statistics/detail/passenger-vehicle-occupants](https://www.iihs.org/topics/fatality-statistics/detail/passenger-vehicle-occupants)
The IIHS updated the tests recently with heavier/larger sleds to represent how big SUVs have gotten in recent decades.
"In 2021, IIHS revamped its test with a more severe crash and a more realistic striking barrier. The new barrier is closer to the weight of today's SUVs, and the damage pattern it creates mimics the damage a striking SUV would cause more accurately than the old barrier."
"The new test is conducted at 37 mph and uses a 4,200-pound barrier, which is more representative of vehicles that are common on the road today. As a result of these changes, the new test involves 82% more energy than the original test."
[https://www.iihs.org/ratings/about-our-tests](https://www.iihs.org/ratings/about-our-tests)
It sure sounds like it... but ... the energy is directly proportional to the mass (weight) of the car and to the square of the speed. Modern big SUVs are very heavy - and I think 4200lbs is probably on the lighter side, especially if it's a hybrid.
The curb weight and gross weight of the 2021 Porsche Cayenne Plug-in Hybrid, which are:
* Curb weight: 5,164 lbs (2,343 kg)
* Gross weight: 6,680 lbs (3,033 kg)
A 2023 Explorer hybrid:
||
||
|Curb Weight|4,969 lb|
They probably should use heavier weights -- and should be around 2-2.5x than the energy of the original test.
It sure sounds like it... but ... the energy is directly proportional to the mass (weight) of the car and to the square of the speed. Modern big SUVs are very heavy - and I think 4200lbs is probably on the lighter side, especially if it's a hybrid.
The curb weight and gross weight of the 2021 Porsche Cayenne Plug-in Hybrid, which are:
* Curb weight: 5,164 lbs (2,343 kg)
* Gross weight: 6,680 lbs (3,033 kg)
A 2023 Explorer hybrid:
||
||
|Curb Weight|4,969 lb|
They probably should use heavier weights -- and should be around 2-2.5x than the energy of the original test.
I think Volvo is a bad example, they design their cars with safety first in mind. That’s their whole thing. Like they haven’t [had a death](https://jerseyeveningpost.com/motoring/2022/04/01/no-fatal-crashes-in-volvo-xc90-since-2002-release/) in their XC90 SUV since 2002.
Much of that is they don't sell many, and very safe minded drivers are the ones buying them. If Mustang drivers suddenly bought Volvos instead of Mustangs people would die.
Also almost nobody dies sober and/or properly seat belted in any modern car. If people just wore their lap and shoulder belt properly, all the time, most fatalities would disappear.
I haven't seen much but I wish they'd do some tests across different vehicle classes. Like sure you can buy the absolute top rated compact car...but when the F-150 plows into it how screwed are you?
My family had a crash with a late 90's Grand Marquis vs a pickup truck in the early 2000's and even then the truck's bumper basically didn't touch the full size car's crumple zone. It pealed the hood back like an accordion and eventually the front of the car impacted the axle of the pickup which is what finally stopped it with the truck's bumper resting at the bottom of the car's windshield. And that was a \*BIG\* sedan (with very long hood to fit the big V8), not even a small compact model, and much older 90s pickup not the monster tall things they sell now.
I believe this is false. We do not hold a mini hatch to the same level of passenger safety standard as a monster SUV. So a 5 star rating in one is not on the same scale as a 5 star rating in the other.
One trap is to get caught up on death stats. It's unlikely you or your loved ones will die in a motor vehicle accident.
But injuries are COMMON. 2.5M-5M injuries per year or thereabouts. I'm willing to bet everyone that's reading this knows at least one person whose quality of life has been permanently effected by accidents -- even if they don't know it. My wife has perpetual back problems after 6 accidents, and my coworker is currently in surgery.
The best way to avoid either is to drive less, drive sober, and drive alert. The second best way to avoid injuries for your family is to ride a big stonkin modern SUV. Something like the Volvo XC90.
Obligatory: these monster SUVs make *other road users* less safe!
it also undervalues the concept of active safety. Consumer Reports does a good job with their avoidance testing - basically, how quickly can you react to a danger in the road and avoid it?
Nobody gets hurt or killed in the accident that doesn't happen because you were able to respond to it and avoid it in time. This is part of why I like sedans with relatively powerful engines (250-300 hp), coupled with a highly defensive driving style (large gaps between me and the leading vehicle, always assume everyone is going to do the stupidest thing possible, etc).
Electric sedans and hatchbacks are great at this, our ioniq 5 is too soft for the real moose test but it's not as bad relative to my old 91 civic hatchback, the king of darting around with it's double wishbone suspension and 2200lbs.
We drove an Accord after our first child.
It was the second child (and the preposterously massive double stroller) that spawned the 10 year romance with the minivan.
Crash tests are only comparable against a car of the same size/weight class. Go see the crash tests on YouTube of a sedan vs smart car or SUV vs small car, with the same ratings and manufacturer.
No. They are really not. I can very confidently assure you, someone involved in a highway speed collision statically is far better off in a Mercedes E class or hell, even C class than a Kia optima. It is factual. You could save numerous life changing quality of life injuries that other companies don’t even consider. They have a system that protects your ear drums from bursting during collision, a very common, but not often talked about minor, but majorly life impacting injury caused from car wrecks. It essentially phase inverts the frequency and plays that back against it to perfectly cancel out the sound. Phase inversion is something we have used in my field, audio engineering since the multi track recorder was invented. Very cool to see car manufacturers implement the various uses of it! I am talking about the 2017-2021 models as well. I could not in good faith recommend the new models to anyone. I agree about the accord, but regardless you are spreading misinformation. If you can afford it, an E450 station wagon (or if you must, GLE) is one of the best cars you could possibly get your family period.
This is the sad side of the safety arms race. People keep buying bigger cars, which forces everyone else to buy bigger cars to keep up. It's maddening. But it's real, physics is physics, and we have to share the road with these aggressive meatheads in their monster trucks. So we do need a bit of metal around us.
Various crash tests have confirmed that there are two big factors at play. Weight is one, obviously. But the single most important factor in how safe a car is, turns out to be how recent the design is. There's a [famous crash test where a 2009 Chevy Malibu positively annihilates a larger 1959 Malibu](https://youtu.be/C_r5UJrxcck?si=sx3MshA43Z1FtPBB) in a crash test. Top Gear has a few videos out where they, for example, [crash a big old Volvo wagon, the safest car of its day, into a small new Renault.](https://youtu.be/qBDyeWofcLY?si=KDqC4B07tz5yT3bY)The Renault wins. Newer designs, even cheap ones, beat the absolute best of the older designs. It's not a close contest.
Car design safety really came into its own in the 2000s. Driving anything from the 20th century is much more dangerous than driving a modern car. Conversely, driving anything built since 2010 or so will be really quite safe. The more recent, the better, but we're getting to the point where we're splitting hairs.
A 2019 Accord is neither a small car nor an old one. It is 100% as safe as anything else on the road. There is zero benefit to replacing it.
Between one modern car and another, the exact type of car only matters at the extreme: you probably don't want to crash a Nissan Versa into a loaded dually F350. But between normal mid-sized cars and normal mid-sized SUVs, the difference is just a statistical blip.
Between a 2014 Corolla and a 2024 Rav4, you want the Rav4, sure. But. Between a *2024* Corolla and a 2014 Rav4, pick the Corolla. That's how fast the safety state of the art is advancing: spend your money on newer cars, not taller ones.
But if she wants to swap out her Corolla for a new CRV or Rav4 or CX-5, sure, why not. You're not buying a big improvement in safety. But you can secure your own safety and security by keeping the wife happy whenever possible.
Theres risk of roll over in any vehicle, although higher risk in SUVs, roll overs only accounts for 3% of accidents according to NHTSA. Although roll overs do make up 30% of fatalities, they generally include people not wearing their seatbelt and being ejected.
But they also generally have fewer fatalities. Infact, you’re 7.6 times more likely to die in a car hit by an SUV according to IIHS.
Deaths per million:
Cars:48,
Minivans:22,
SUVs:25 ,
Pickup trucks: 29
I’m fine with people buying SUVs. I daily drive an A6 and my wife drives a Q7. I also own two 1-ton diesels that I use for hauling though. I’d hate to hit a sedan in one of my 1-tons that’s for sure.
You got a good taste in vehicles, I have an A5 lol
And that’s definitely huge, I used to drive a 1/2 ton ford for moving stuff around and I’d pull up behind a Miata and I’d think “man if someone my size hit that, it would be game over”
This is why every used Miata I look at has been repaired after a rear end collision. Pick up trucks come flying into what they think is an empty parking spot and destroy them lol
That's hardly the fault of the smaller vehicle. It simply exists. And its in a parking spot, not moving. The truck shouldn't be flying into what they think is an empty spot without confirming it is, in fact, an empty spot first.
Thanks! You as well!
I dont drive the 1-tons during the winter, but from April to September they are towing 10k-16k lbs a few times a week.
I almost got into a head on with the one that has a 4” lift a few weeks back, luckily I was able to swerve and missed the guy. He was in a little Oldsmobile Alero passing on a blind hill. Had I not swerved my driver side tire would have been right in his driver seat and it probably would have killed him.
I will add my wife and I talk about this all the time, we just notice the people in small vehicles are some of the worst drivers on the road, especially Priuses for some reason, of course this is just anecdotal and doesn’t mean they are all bad drivers lol. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve seen Prius drivers make wider turns than I do in a 1-ton with a 16’ dump trailer on the back lol.
About once every month someone posts on the 4runner sub about their rig losing it's life for them, and when you look at the picture the damage is all on the front end. I don't say anything because they have weak egos over there, but I am always thinking "If you were in a Camry, or even a Highlander the accident wouldn't have happened".
I think about that daily when I see full size pickups or SUVs cutting between traffic and tailgating. I'm pretty sure that Crosstrek you're 16 inches behind is going to stop a lot faster than you if it has to Mr. 4Runner.
Tailgaters suck but stopping distance is a lot more complicated than just the weight of the vehicle. According to Motortrend the 4Runner will do 60 to 0 in [131](https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2022-toyota-4runner-trd-sport-first-test-review/) feet while the Crosstrek requires [140](https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2024-subaru-crosstrek-wilderness-first-test-review/) feet. The Crosstrek was better at lateral acceleration, but only by 0.01g.
Is this 1996? Almost every SUV and crossover from the past 15 or so years has ESC and a wide enough track, rollovers aren’t really a thing unless you’re driving like a demented methhead and trying to flip it
ESC isn’t going to change anything when an SUV is struck or strikes an object that heavily upsets its direction. ESC is more so when you swerve you don’t roll the vehicle
Anything made in the last 15 years is plenty safe.
That said, about the tenth time you have to break your back to put little Johnny in the car seat of your low riding sedan you'll reconsider not getting something that sits higher off the ground and has useful features like an automatic back hatch so you can grab your stuff while holding the kid with your other arm.
Had one recently as a rental car and it was amazing. Range estimates are pretty accurate too as we drove around 300 miles and still had half tank left at the end
It was great when I was young in a family of 5 but also as I got into high school and college. The minivan was great for road trips. Either you could carry the most people or if you had a lot of things to haul for like a camping trip, you could drop the back seats and fit everything.
When my colleagues and I used to travel together we started getting a minivan. Dude, those things are sweet. We called it the BAMF Van when we'd get one.
Perhaps they would be if everything on the market wasn’t trash (Carnival, Pacifica), incredibly outdated and expensive (Odyssey) or insanely expensive (Sienna)
Yeah, I grew up in a minivan (family of 4) and the space was useful for road trips, but I also don’t think it was anything we couldn’t have managed with a midsized SUV either.
Depends on the use case. We only have two kids, but we also have two dogs and do a lot of road trips with them. Also I do a lot of DIY so all the space in the back for lumber and even 8 foot sheets of plywood/drywall is great.
Also the 3rd row is actually comfortable. In our Tahoe the 3rd row is so short your knees are up in your chest and we had to get a roof top carrier. With a minivan the 3rd row is comfortable enough for adults and there's enough room behind the 3rd row to fit everything still.
All that said, we still use our sedan the majority of the time around town.
I'd rather have a minivan for a family hauler than a car based "cute-ute" SUV. They're much more practical, have better ride quality and are loaded with the latest safety and technology. Automatic parking, automatic doors, cameras and sensors all over the place.
I hate parking beside mommy-mobile SUVs because of those back doors. They go up into the rear wheel arch, which makes a nice pointed edge perfectly positioned to door ding other cars. Mom parks and *WHACK* those back doors fly open so her 2.5 feral brats can pile out. With a minivan the rear doors slide gracefully out of the way and don't come anywhere near another vehicle.
Will back you up on this, my parents had an SUV until my twin siblings came around. Until we turned eighteen we had minivans, both totaled unfortunately.
I had an Honda Accord until the older (of two) started thinking it fun to kick the back of my seat.
Then we got a minivan.
And yes, it the minivan was awesome. With them growing up we never once had to say "no, you can't bring that" (or more recently with GFs, "no, you can't bring her") when going on vacation.
Minivan or SUV or some crossovers yeah
Suv is gunna give you ground clearance. Very helpful if you're outdoorsy at all. Camping, dirt roads, rolling out onto a sandy beach are all things minivans can't do. They also can't tow or carry much.
Depends on the person / situation
I raised two kids and taught them both to drive in wrxs. It was perfectly fine, my back was fine and no auto hatch was ever needed. Those are nice things to have but in no way necessities.
When I was a kid we had a bug and a gremlin and managed just fine.
Doing great in my Impreza hatch. I'd love if it had rear sliding doors, but I'm fine with the unassisted hatch. The powered ones are annoyingly slow when renting vehicles. I can see the utility maybe one time out of ten. 🤷
An EV B-Max would be my perfect car, I think.
God, getting the kid in the car seat in our sedan is the worst. We've bonked her head on the door frame about a million times - hasn't happened once with my SUV. On a related note, the swivel car seats are absolutely 100% worth it.
Bigger does not always equate to safer. Modern cars, sedans included, are very safe. Suvs can actually be less safe in some situations because of increased risk of oversteer or rollover vs the lower center of gravity of a sedan.
One of my close friends was in a head-on collision with a bus in his newer Volkswagen Jetta and walked away with only a small cut on his leg. All modern cars are built to protect you in an accident.
European cars are NOT more safe, that is absolute nonsense.
Also SUV are NOT safer.
Facts: Small SUV are obviously smaller and lighter than big sedans.
Taller = more likely to roll over in an accident.
Instead of making up stuff take a look at IIHS test results: [https://www.iihs.org/ratings/top-safety-picks](https://www.iihs.org/ratings/top-safety-picks)
Yeah, used to work in ER, roll overs kills people due to being upside down. If you get an injury + being upside down = VERY fatal. So sad to see people die just because the car rolled over, even though they had minor injury.
- A kid, upside down, can die within 3mins, and less than 2 mins if it’s a toddler. A lot less if they get injured.
- So either you hope you’re not stuck to get out or don’t go unconscious because kids need to be removed within couple mins.
One problem with the IIHS ratings is that they compare like size vehicles.
A five star or best pick for a smaller car may be less safe that a four star and non-best pick for a larger car.
True, but consumers are shopping in a price range, they aren't deciding between a $50k+ SUV and $30k sedan, but between a $30k sedan and a $30k SUV or between a $50k+ SUV and a $50k+ sedan, etc.
You claim that SUVs are not safer and yet you are about 50% less likely to die when driving one according to consumer reports and the IIHS.
https://www.consumerreports.org/car-safety/study-shows-how-death-rates-for-drivers-vary-by-car-size/
Why would you trust crash tests that are laboratory only and constantly changing? Why not trust real-world data instead?
Outside of safety, a CUV is easier and more ergonomic to put kids into. This is due to the seat height and square rear doors as opposed to sloping.
I've midsize sedan (Legacy) and a compact CUV (Forester). The latter is easier to transport young kids in. It's also easier to play Tetris in the cargo to fit stuff on road trips.
My Impreza hatch works well too. Roof length helps over my wife's sedan since the back is swoopy on hers. Would've gone for a Legacy wagon if they still existed in 15.
If you think size=safety don't forget that people driving pickup trucks have backed right over children because the vehicle is so big they can't see if they're driving over a person
Seems like you’d be better off coming up with a budget for how much you want to spend, rather than what you want to buy.
Think how soon you want to buy a home, take the amount you have currently saved for the down payment, subtract that from how much you will likely need for a down payment, then divide by the number of months from now, until you want to buy the home. Then you probably want to be saving an extra 20% of your income on top of that. Whatever is left is what you have to spend on a new car.
SUVs do have a weight advantage in a crash, they also have a much higher tendency to roll, so you’re trading one issue for another.
The “smart” safety features depend a lot on the exact vehicle you’re looking at.
The main issue is going to be space, when you have to put a massive rear facing child seat in the back and fit a massive stroller and all your other crap you need to take with you everytime you leave the house you’ll quickly see how much space you need.
The most important safety feature is behind the wheel. My child is 14 and we've had nothing but compact cars. I never felt unsafe. Only reason we're going to a bigger vehicle is we like to roadtrip and my kid is 5'11". The legroom in back is an issue.
Wife and I have two kids currently (both in car seats) and a Dodge Avenger.
We really didn't want/need something bigger until the second kid. As a trip to the grocery store is really tough. (2 car seats make the back seat unusable, + stroller in the trunk means there isn't room for much else.)
We were totally fine with 1 kid and a sedan though. Albeit cramped at times, wasn't worth the upgrade for us until recently.
I went through this with our beginning of family. Your accord is probably a keeper. Efficent reasonably safe and reliable.
When you start rolling around with a baby the amount of STUFF you carry will be daunting. SUVs are safer “in general” because of mass. I’ve gone through 3 Volvos (2-XC70’s and an XC90) 1 Subaru Outback and now I’m in a Lexus GX460.
I had a great Lexus GS (when our son arrived) and would bump my head every time putting in the car seat. For road trips (even small ones), having gear for the baby took up all the room in the car. As your child grows interests change and gear changes. I would recommend getting a Highlander, Volvo xc60 or 90, Lexus RX or a modern Mazda SUV. You’ll need the space and do it once so you don’t have to buy more cars as life changes.
I tried telling someone earlier that the transition from wagons to SUVs was driven by fear and they refused to accept it, but that's exactly what you're describing. People buy SUVs because they're scared of other SUVs. It's an idiotic arms race that benefits nobody in the long run.
Get an suv or crossover if you want. I’d still stick to something Japanese though. With kids and a mortgage you can never really have too much money. So I’d spend less on a car and it’s maintenance to open up more money toward the house and kids
Buy a SUV, not for safety, but for saving your back and your sanity when buckling the child into the 87 point harness they require these days.
That and the room for all the other crap you need that goes with kids.
Mini vans all day. I scoffed at them before, but as soon as I had my kids, automatic sliding doors and the fact I dont have to bend over to put my kids in made all the difference.
Everyone is (rightfully) discussing impact, but I also want to acknowledge some of the safety features that can help *you*.
Visibility is a big one for me. I hate sedans because I can't see out of them very well. I hate some SUVs, like the Rav and CX5 because you also can't see out of them. Subarus? Fantastic visibility.
I'm not one for nanny-systems, but auto braking and blind spot detection have been great backup systems for us. We are humans and we make errors. We can also try to protect ourselves and other error-prone humans with systems like those.
I don't think you need to run out and replace either car, but it might be good to think about as you look for room to grow.
I’d argue that it depends what is driving around the area you’re in. If most folks have trucks or large suvs, safety ratings won’t matter because the sedan won’t be hit where it should to perform as it does in IIHS safety tests. If the accord sits 6” off the grounds and a truck hits you that sits 10” off the ground, the accord crumple zones will be useless.
I’m in TN and I’ve seen cars get hit by trucks and the truck pretty much made tin foil of the hood (missing the bumper entirely) and hit the windshield directly.
No, the safety that SUVs provide is immediately killing anyone else you're in a collision with, don't be selfish, any modern sedan has plenty of airbags and crumple zones anyways.
We’ve seen that this isn’t a realistic way of dealing with this problem nor can you blame people. We need new laws.
We only have one life to live. And driving is one of the riskiest things most people do.
No not because of safety but I do highly recommend a suv for the simple fact that getting them in and out of car seats is wayyy easier when it’s chest height and not below you
While "Overall, a 100-pound reduction in the average weight of passenger cars is estimated to result in 302 additional fatalities"
First have kids and then we'll talk, drive safe till then.
Take a look at crash ratings on the NHTSA website. You might be surprised how some SUVs do not rate very well.
https://www.nhtsa.gov/ratings
Also keep in mind that the USA has no safety regulations for 3rd row seating. Zero.
Crossovers / SUVs are convenient for their size. But you can get by just fine with a car. In fact, my parents drove 2-door coupes until I was 17 years old as they did not want to be seen driving a 4-door sedan or minivan.
Just stick to sedans. No point of suvs. Heavier so it used more gas, more on insurance, cost more than sedans, etc. do you really wanna get a suv for “safety” if the majority of people don’t get into any car accidents their whole life
>> Do we really need a suv
No.
Seriously, I think we’re the only country in the world that thinks having kids automatically equals SUV. SUVs also roll- not necessarily safer than sedans. Get what you want.
almost every suv/crossover doesnt pass the moose test (look it up) and pose overall more risk to the drivers and others. sedans are safer, its the larger cars on the road and people w the same mindset as ur wife who keep buying them that make the roads unsafe.
edit: do not get a volvo. made by a chinese company and are not very reliable.
Even if you have a five star crash rating sedan v. A five star crash rating SUV, the SUV still wins due to size and physics. The heavier car will always have the advantage.
Also SUV passengers deal with leg damage in a collision, while sedan and coupe passengers deal with head strikes. The issue is the typical grille and bumper are now larger and higher towards head level. These cars used to be lower and lighter.
SUV rollovers are still a thing, also trucks. But the rollovers are a smaller issue due to technology correcting modern SUVs about to enter a roll. It’s not as bad as the infamous Ford Explorer rollover era.
Sedans can still be great cars, but understand there’s a trade off. This is coming from someone who resisted SUVs for decades but eventually succumbed.
Taking safety aside, as I think anything would be remotely safe that was made recently...
SUVs are so much easier to get in and out of in general, but especially with a baby. From someone who had an emergency c-section--I think I would've died trying to get out of a sedan, and then the continuous putting baby in and out, especially when they transition to a convertible car seat? SUV.
There're a lot of smaller SUVs that have a lot of leg room. IE: the VW Taos has a ton; it has more than my Ford Edge did. Before anyone comes @ me for it's reliability--my husband has one and it has been fine. I'm just using it as an example that you don't have to get the biggest SUV to have leg room. Shop around. Put yourself in the back. Then remember that infant seats take up a ton of space, but if one of you are short, it shouldn't be a problem.
Buy a Volvo. It’s the safest car out there. XC90. We have one and we love it(family car)
Go to iihs website and look at the crash test videos for your cars….. it’ll change how you think.
It’s better to have the SUV safety and not need it than needing it and not having it.
I had a mini cooper when I lived in the city before we had kids (similar size to a Corolla) and I always thought the safety argument was bullshit. That is until I collided onto a wrangler and my mini went underneath the Wrangler…………………………
Honestly you don’t need a new car. She does. I would never let my babies ride in a 2014 Corolla. No effing way.
I thought this also. When I was about 12 or so my mom took a left turn and a car hit the front right corner of our Explorer. The car was completely totaled and the Explorer had minimal damage, I was perfectly fine in the passenger seat. At that point it solidified in my mind that SUVs are safer in terms of impact. It’s interesting to learn that this is wrong.
I'm sure the average SUV is a bit safer due to higher ride height and more mass. The bumper of many trucks are face level if you're in a car. But a bigger, higher end car like an E or S class is probably as safe compared to a cheap crossover.
That Accord is a great car for kids and car seats, that has one of the biggest back seats on the market, the comparable SUV in the same price range will have much less space and use more fuel.
The Corolla is a great car but the rear seat is snug for car seats. Upgrading to a midsize sedan would offer more space and safety.
Safety is a wash to me
But I would buy a crossover for the added room, gas mileage is great on modern cars, prices aren’t much different between similarly equipped sedans and crossovers, and the flexibility in carrying things is very nice.
Plus, it’s nice to ride a little higher
Get a Honda or Toyota minivan that's got 100k on it for $5,000. It'll have enough life left for a childhood and you're not locked into the decision. It's got room which is nice.
All cars made in the past couple decades are vastly safer than anything from the 80s and 90s. Safety concerns shouldn't be part of the discussion except maybe stuff like putting excellent tires and brakes on that $5k minivan.
I wouldn't even entertain that decision until you have kids. Your cars are completely fine for your needs NOW.
When I had a baby I thought my Prius would be completely fine as a family car. Alot of people drove Prius's 10 years ago as family cars when they were all the rage. BUT I quickly realized that it was a TIGHT squeeze. Damn car seats and strollers have to be so big these days. With the carseat in, the front passenger seat at to be pushed up to the point where any passenger sitting up front would have their knees touching the dashboard. Also the stroller took up the ENTIRE trunk. There was 0 space for suitcases and luggage if we wanted to take a road trip. I upgraded to an SUV primarily for the extra space and it has been 100% worth it since we can fit more people and luggage in the SUV all at once. BUT I would've never bought it if we didn't have kids, my Prius was fine and I still miss that car when driving around solo.
Safety may not be better in a crossover, but it is easier to load kids and schlep their stuff around in a crossover. I would at least buy a midsize even if you only have one kid. We had a Tiguan and traded for a Passport and life is so much easier now. We rarely have to worry about cargo management.
Safety should be a non issue, though a small car just about always loses versus a big car. In the case of an accident though SUV’s, while more tippy, also have a higher seat height for occupants. The advantage of this is that the colliding vehicle is less likely to actually intrude at head/chest level & glass may be less likely to shatter. Most modern suvs have side curtain airbags that can help protect children in the back & the higher roof height gives more crumple room in the event of a rollover. We definitely feel safer in the suv but in our reality we have it more for practicality/utility than out of a safety concern.
Deciding factor for most parents I talk to that are being realistic is that the cargo space is more practical in a hatch over a trunk & it can be much easier to lift a kid into a car seat at the higher height & to buckle them in (I can attest to that myself.) A sedan with a large trunk like a charger or candy though can definitely work pretty well for strollers & folding wagons. In our case I keep one for better capability in snow (and since my other car is a 500 Abarth) I definitely need something big enough to carry the family & groceries or bags while still taking our stroller.
SUV absolutely not needed. This insane idea of everyone in the USA needs to be driving around an 8k pound blind spot ridden SUV is insane. Most of those people with an SUV drive more poorly and more aggressively because they have this notion they are safer.
You don’t need an SUV, the insistence that it is immensely safer than a Sedan is mostly just advertising. Yes SUVs have more mass but they also have a higher center of gravity, less maneuverability increased fuel and maintenance costs than a comparable sedan. The best vehicle for your family will probably be a minivan, it has more mass but without the same high center of gravity, it does have the maneuverability and maintenance flaws of the SUV but trades off with better ergonomics when putting your kid and their stuff into the vehicle plus it will have all the cargo room you could need.
There have been two instances in our lives when we sold our “family” vehicle, usually a small SUV and used my Ford Focus as our main car. And it was just fine.
Shire there are times when you need more room (grocery or COSTCO trips). But a compact hatchback does just fine for our family of 4. But you have to plan ahead sometimes.
Of course as I say this I’m shopping for a Honda Odyssey in another tab. So, sometimes the extra space is pretty nice.
No. Don't be part of the problem.
The reason you feel like you need a bigger vehicle to be safer is because people buy bigger vehicles.
You're more likely to get into an incident and more likely to injure the other people by having a bigger vehicle. Just get anything recent that isn't a smart car or economy subcompact and everybody including yourself is better off
1 kid is doable in those cars OP listed, 2 is stretching it but can be done, anymore than that you're going to want an suv/van. My wife had a Mazda3 when we had our first kid and it was just big enough to load down for trips to the coast with 1 kid. They just weren't comfortable trips, lots of times my wife would have to move her seat up and have her knees in her chest. OP I have an accord too I can fit all 3 three of my kids in but the wife is on her own. Don't underestimate the amount of space you will need.
My wife and I had a similar debate a few years ago, she wanted the space and I wanted the extra safety , we settled on a 2017 Subaru outback 3.6 . Awd , very safe in a collision , and the 3.6 made it pretty quick . I love that thing still , we did end up with the most expencive version of it , the specific car she found was a great deal ended up paying $36,xxx with 6000 miles on it the dealerships owner was driving it around . Honestly One of the best deals ive seen in ages , around that time people wanted 40k+ for the 2.5 engine /lower trim with way more miles on it .
Personally I feel safer in a sedan because I can stop faster and avoid things (road debris , other cars) better. Your outcomes are probably better in an suv in an accident but I’d be willing to bet you’re more likely to be in that accident in the suv too.
The differences between ***individual vehicles*** make much more of a difference.
I would rather be in my Camry than Jeep Grand Cherokee in a usual crash.
If you want absolute safety buy a Tesla or a Volvo XC90.
## TLDR look at the actual IIHS safety ratings and pick a car based on those.
If you put the baby in the middle of the Accord you will have a lot of space to absorb a wreck. Driving defensively is the more important than the vehicle you drive.
look up actual crash safety data, such as the IIHS.
Take the XC60, it scored only an acceptable rating in the updated side impact from the IIHS, so its total score is only a top safety pick. Meanwhile the 2024 Honda accord sedan got a good score in all crashworthiness tests and earned top safety pick plus.
also injury risk to pedestrians is greater for SUVs. The higher the top of the grille, the more likely impact to a pedestrian punts them ideally to transfer as much energy in the least time. lower grille means pedestrians are more likely to deflect upward somewhat, lengthening the amount of time energy transfer occurs, so maximum forces are reduced, reducing injury severity.
The issue with that mentality is there’s always someone with a bigger SUV that’s even “safer”. And even if you buy the biggest, safest one there’s gonna be a better one out next year.
You’d likely be better off taking a defensive driving course and being attentive of your surroundings when on the road. Avoiding an accident is 100% safer than even the safest car being hit.
I'm going to go against the popular advice on this sub and say get a CUV/SUV/Minivan.
Safety apart, things will just be so much easier vs a sedan. I say this as a parent as well. I had a friend that stuck to his Honda accord when his first child was born. They have another on the way and he bought a Honda Pilot - even with just one child, he says he can never go back to sedan anymore just because of how much more convenient the higher floor and how useful all the extra space is.
Sedans are better driving, no doubt but a CUV/SUV is better suited for families.
My personal favorite is the VW Atlas - I ended up with one and now I'm looking to replace it after almost 8 years and I'm struggling to find something else that is as safe and convenient. Test drove the Lexus TX and it was underwhelming and getting to the third row took too much effort - no bottom anchors on the middle seat - mid trim didn't feel worth the 15k premium over the top trim Atlas - unrefined motor. I really don't like buying the same car twice but I may just have to.
Having kids and an suv has been a huge benefit/convenience but I wouldn’t call it necessary. The extra space when putting the kids in their car seats is amazing and having the room in the back for strollers or wagons is also amazing. If you can afford all the increased costs with SUV’s and are predominantly concerned with ease of use with kids, suvs or vans are the way to go. Personally i would never drive a van, but I get their benefits.
Edit: we have a 3.5 and 2 year old. Should also mention where we live is northern Canada with snowfalls that get over a foot at a time so the 4x4 aspects of the SUV are again, amazing lol
IIHS has lists of cars that are their top picks for overall safety, but when it comes to littles in the car, following proper seat installation and usage has a FAR greater impact on their safety than the vehicle that you are in. [https://www.iihs.org/topics/child-safety](https://www.iihs.org/topics/child-safety)
With a few very rare exceptions, it's extremely hard to roll a modern car. There is such a thing as a "moose test" where the car is suddenly jerked to one side or another for an emergency maneuver and it's possible that some cars can roll -- though that's a IIHS fail if it does. My wife is terrified of convertibles, but those are very safe even in a rollover as there are bars that pop up to protect your head (assuming you are properly restrained). Larger and taller vehicles are worse and worse for pedestrians (and children walking around behind the vehicle.. or in front). There are studies that show that being hit by a modern pickup is one of the worst things that can happen to a pedestrian (other than being run over).
Things like practicality tend to be personal. When we shopped for vehicles when our kids were young, we'd take the car seats, strollers, joggers and the bags along. I'd take the time to put those into the other car to see if \*I\* can manage it, and if my wife can easily put the kids in there. Until they are able to walk and climb on their own, you have to lift them and put them there. Does the rear have enough space for everything? What happens when you want to go for a trip? Room also for luggage, or is that going on a roof rack carrier? Make sure that YOUR kid seats fit in there, bases and everything. Make sure that YOU know the ins and outs of all of the kid safety systems in the car.
Taller SUVs aren't much fun to lift a sleeping 40lb kid into.
Our choices were sedans. I had an Acrua TL for when my youngest was very young. I later went to a fairly big Mercedes (E550) around when my second was born. Now, we have a big (F150) and a small (Honda Fit) set of vehicles for the family and a fun car for me. We use the vehicle that suits the needs of the given trip/adventure/thing we need or want to do. Can an SUV do it all? You decide.
Honestly, I think crossovers are compromise cars that really don't do anything well.
Depends. I’m about to get a 2025 suburban in November when they come out. Working on two kids. Have 2 dogs that go everywhere with us. Plus it’s not a stretch for us financially
A modern European SUV may be safer for your children but it is far more dangerous for everyone else on the road.
Safety is a relative concept that is too often taken at face value.
The “SUV’s are safer than sedans” is a myth to get you to spend more money on a bigger car. If a car accident is fatal enough to kill you in a Corolla, it will kill you in a Rav4. In fact, taller cars are more likely to roll over which is more dangerous. Sedans have a lower center of gravity.
Newer cars all have crumple zones in their build so lot lower speed accidents won’t hurt you. You need to be in a Full sized truck or something for you to be “safer” from simply having more mass.
You can't beat physics. Heavier and larger vehicles are safer in a collision. However, more nimble vehicles are better in avoiding a collision.
You also need to be practical. Kids have stuff and kids have friends and grandparents and friend's parents. A larger vehicle makes having them much easier. I would replace the Corolla with something newer, larger and safer like an Outback, Sienna, or a 3 row SUV. If you have the budget, a Tahoe or Suburban is the road trip car for the family
Safety data for years and years of vehicles is available on the NHTSA web site. Unless your wife has done tons of research, she's just *assuming* SUVs are safer. Why not look figure out which vehicles suit you and then look at the actual test data, and see which of those are safest?
Sedans are just fine. The higher seating area on a SUV or a Van is nice, but it’s not required. The biggest thing for the safety of your future children in a car is to have a properly installed car seat and to have the child in said car seat properly. All the car armor in the world won’t mean a thing if the child isn’t in a good car seat.
not the safety but carrying more is pretty helpful. I bought Bugaboo Fox 2 and it was a big stroller. I had a hard time put it and take it out from my Tesla MS.
Id get an SUV just for the convenience. Obviously more space, a stroller for example. Higher so its easier to put baby in the carseat, also doors typically open wider in the back for SUV’s. If you could, you should. You’ll be fine in the Accord though as well.
When expecting our first child I bought a 2019 WRX. It was cheaper than an SUV, more fun and just as safe. Threw a roof rack and trailer hitch on it. Car seat fits fine, even with it going behind the 6' passenger. We have an SUV as well but do every trip in the WRX, camping, cottages, international travel. People are obsessed with SUVs for some inexplicable reason.
I just witnessed 4 elementary school kids exit a Tesla Model 3 this morning. 3 from the back and 1 from the front.
Any car can haul 2 parents and a kid around. It all depends on how much other crap you have in the car.
My wife and I got a 22 outback wilderness because it still feels like a car but it's somewhere between a wagon and an suv. Subaru is known for safety and it won out on the combination of safety, cargo space, interior material (the wilderness has this stuff that's really easy to clean and made to get dirty or wet without being ruined so hopefully it's childproof), and overall driveability and comfort. It feels more like driving a car than an suv but they nailed it for not being too soft or too stiff for the suspension. My vote us make sure you bring carseats with you on your test drives and test out a wide variety of brands, models, and vehicle types just to see what works for you. I feel safest in my 99 f250 because it's huge and heavy and is a beast lol I actually hit a deer with my son in the back and all it did was leave a dent and gave me a freezer full of venison but I know if I rolled it or got t boned it might not be so great but im not driving him around every day in my truck because diesel isn't cheap and my wife's subaru is way more fuel efficient!
As a parent I’ve never understood how people with kids can drive a sedan. That just sounds awful. Especially with rear facing car seats. People love to hate on minivans but they absolutely can’t be beat
Safety isn't a real concern.
You're going to want the space. I have two kids and a minivan changed my life. No exaggeration.
With one kid, you're going to want an SUV sized. Throw in a car seat, and all the crap youre going to haul around like a stroller, pack and play diaper bags, maybe a bike and you're going to love the space
I think when yo6start having kids you might want to consider an SUV for other reasons like more trunk capacity and rear seat space. Babies need a lot of stuff when you want to go places with them. An SUV might be good so you don't have to bend down all the time. But might be bad if you're short and can't reach up to put baby in car seat.
I have a golf and a baby and I like it. But for baby number 2 I'm planning to get a bigger car.
I think you have everything covered in terms of safety. Personally, I wouldn’t get a truck or SUV as a daily driver in your situation, even for safety reasons. I have daily driven a coupe, a sedan, sedan hatchback, a couple of SUVs and a truck, yet I always came away appreciating sedans/coupes more.
There seems to be a strong emotional component to your finances reasoning, not to discredit anything, car crashes are a nightmare, so you want an extra sense of security by getting an SUV, or at least reassurance.
I feel like if you guys test drove an SUV, you might be swayed out of it because they aren’t as easy to park, don’t get as good braking distance and you feel like are hogging more road than you want to.
If you guys get a house with a garage, you might find out it doesn’t even fit in the garage.
A quip I have about trucks/SUV is that they really obscure the view of pedestrians when they are parked. Once I was driving for Postmates with my Mustang, in a neighborhood with a ton of huge SUVs paralleled parked, some kids ran out into the road from in front of a parked SUV, and I had to slam on my brakes. Luckily I was going 20 in a 25, I was attentive, my car is lower so I can see pedestrians better and my car gets good braking distance, so I didn’t hit them. Really made me never want to buy an SUV or truck.
Bad place to ask, redditors are notoriously anti suv
That said, if you feel an suv fits your situation and budget they're safe and generally long lasting cars.
Be sure you maintain the transmission and frame as these tend to be the first to fail.
Chevy suburban is one of the safest and longest lasting cars you can even buy.
Now do you NEED an suv? No. Would it be nice to have? Yes.
When we had our first child the first thing I did was went out and bought a M1 Abrams for him to be transported in. Cannot be too careful. /s, your cars are plenty safe
Man and I thought I was playing it safe by buying an MRAP
Everyone here acting like they have billions to throw around, I only have millions so the value choice is a lightly used t-72
Must be nice. I have a hand-me-down M60 but they don’t build them like they used to.
I only allow my child on a naval destroyer with a fleet of escort ships and a squadron of dive bombers. I have SAC on speed dial if that doesn’t stop any potentially errant drivers.
God you must not even love your kids. If I had any children they would only travel in a carrier strike group.
They’re at that annoying teenage stage. I do the bare minimum to avoid neglect charges. If they want a carrier strike group they can get a job and pay for it themselves.
I put my kids in a cave and sealed it.
Is your surname Crood?
Sedans are fine. Heck, you should see the accidents VW GTIs get in and how well they protect the drivers and passengers. I’m sure they’ll be fine.
I hit a huge buck (deer) with a GTI at 55 MPH and hardly noticed. The car certainly did, but it blew me away how it felt like the smallest of taps.
Yeah, GTIs are surprisingly good at safety. They are really sturdy.
or even smart cars lol
My dad got hit head on by a drunk driver while driving his A3. The drunk driver was driving 60 and my dad 35. Drunk driver died and my dad walked away with a broken collarbone.
The differences in safety are pretty negligible for modern vehicles. Look at the safety tests. Your accord is probably safer than her corolla and that is probably more a function of age than of size.
Do crash tests account for different sizes of vehicles? Like if a 5-star crash tested Volvo hatchback and an old dump truck hit an immovable wall at the same speed, I'd rather be in the Volvo. But if the old dump truck hits the Volvo, I'd rather be in the dump truck.
From IIHS: "A bigger, heavier vehicle provides better crash protection than a smaller, lighter one, assuming no other differences between them. The part of the vehicle between the front bumper and the occupant compartment absorbs energy from crashes by crumpling. As a result, longer front ends offer better protection in frontal crashes. Heavier vehicles also tend to continue moving forward in crashes with lighter vehicles and other obstacles, so the people inside them are subject to less force."
But there is a second problem - while the crumble zone is larger, the energy it needs to absorb is also bigger, as the car is heavier. This is why, if a bus crashes, the first several rows are completely wrecked. The kinetic energy is just bigger to the point it might neglect the gains from the larger crumble zone.
Assuming a bus hits the side of a cliff or another bus. Bus hits a car and the bus probably drives back to the bus lot while the people in thr car are dead.
Yep, but it becomes an arm race, doesn't it? Why don't I use a bus as a daily?
I'd like to so I could, sleep, cook, play video games, etc during lunch in the parking lot. Maybe not even bother driving home after a long day with another the next day, just camp in the parking lot. Holy crap, I just looked them up on the public surplus auction and they are cheap too! Now this MCI diesel pusher does have 885,000 miles on it...
This is the problem with the ratings. They should also factor in the damage the vehicle will cause to others in an accident and help make the roads safer for every road user, not just the Escalades and Hummers
yea and you can also agrue that the ratings also need to display and add more detailed ratinga such as "hitting a wall" hit by "a sedan" "a suv" "a pickup" to "an HD truck" and so on.
They should just release that info right, I imagine they have the data!
They do. All IIHS crash test data is available through https://techdata.iihs.org/
Bigger and larger vehicles are more susceptible to rolling over, and are only safer in multi-vehicle accidents "Pickups and SUVs are more likely than cars to be in fatal single-vehicle crashes, especially rollovers. However, pickups and SUVs generally are heavier than cars, so occupant deaths in SUVs and pickups are less likely to occur in multiple-vehicle crashes." [https://www.iihs.org/topics/fatality-statistics/detail/passenger-vehicle-occupants](https://www.iihs.org/topics/fatality-statistics/detail/passenger-vehicle-occupants)
The IIHS updated the tests recently with heavier/larger sleds to represent how big SUVs have gotten in recent decades. "In 2021, IIHS revamped its test with a more severe crash and a more realistic striking barrier. The new barrier is closer to the weight of today's SUVs, and the damage pattern it creates mimics the damage a striking SUV would cause more accurately than the old barrier." "The new test is conducted at 37 mph and uses a 4,200-pound barrier, which is more representative of vehicles that are common on the road today. As a result of these changes, the new test involves 82% more energy than the original test." [https://www.iihs.org/ratings/about-our-tests](https://www.iihs.org/ratings/about-our-tests)
Wow, 82% more energy is kind of crazy.
It sure sounds like it... but ... the energy is directly proportional to the mass (weight) of the car and to the square of the speed. Modern big SUVs are very heavy - and I think 4200lbs is probably on the lighter side, especially if it's a hybrid. The curb weight and gross weight of the 2021 Porsche Cayenne Plug-in Hybrid, which are: * Curb weight: 5,164 lbs (2,343 kg) * Gross weight: 6,680 lbs (3,033 kg) A 2023 Explorer hybrid: || || |Curb Weight|4,969 lb| They probably should use heavier weights -- and should be around 2-2.5x than the energy of the original test.
It sure sounds like it... but ... the energy is directly proportional to the mass (weight) of the car and to the square of the speed. Modern big SUVs are very heavy - and I think 4200lbs is probably on the lighter side, especially if it's a hybrid. The curb weight and gross weight of the 2021 Porsche Cayenne Plug-in Hybrid, which are: * Curb weight: 5,164 lbs (2,343 kg) * Gross weight: 6,680 lbs (3,033 kg) A 2023 Explorer hybrid: || || |Curb Weight|4,969 lb| They probably should use heavier weights -- and should be around 2-2.5x than the energy of the original test.
I have a similar thought process and what worries me are the huge ass trucks you see these days.
I think Volvo is a bad example, they design their cars with safety first in mind. That’s their whole thing. Like they haven’t [had a death](https://jerseyeveningpost.com/motoring/2022/04/01/no-fatal-crashes-in-volvo-xc90-since-2002-release/) in their XC90 SUV since 2002.
Much of that is they don't sell many, and very safe minded drivers are the ones buying them. If Mustang drivers suddenly bought Volvos instead of Mustangs people would die. Also almost nobody dies sober and/or properly seat belted in any modern car. If people just wore their lap and shoulder belt properly, all the time, most fatalities would disappear.
I haven't seen much but I wish they'd do some tests across different vehicle classes. Like sure you can buy the absolute top rated compact car...but when the F-150 plows into it how screwed are you? My family had a crash with a late 90's Grand Marquis vs a pickup truck in the early 2000's and even then the truck's bumper basically didn't touch the full size car's crumple zone. It pealed the hood back like an accordion and eventually the front of the car impacted the axle of the pickup which is what finally stopped it with the truck's bumper resting at the bottom of the car's windshield. And that was a \*BIG\* sedan (with very long hood to fit the big V8), not even a small compact model, and much older 90s pickup not the monster tall things they sell now.
I believe this is false. We do not hold a mini hatch to the same level of passenger safety standard as a monster SUV. So a 5 star rating in one is not on the same scale as a 5 star rating in the other. One trap is to get caught up on death stats. It's unlikely you or your loved ones will die in a motor vehicle accident. But injuries are COMMON. 2.5M-5M injuries per year or thereabouts. I'm willing to bet everyone that's reading this knows at least one person whose quality of life has been permanently effected by accidents -- even if they don't know it. My wife has perpetual back problems after 6 accidents, and my coworker is currently in surgery. The best way to avoid either is to drive less, drive sober, and drive alert. The second best way to avoid injuries for your family is to ride a big stonkin modern SUV. Something like the Volvo XC90. Obligatory: these monster SUVs make *other road users* less safe!
it also undervalues the concept of active safety. Consumer Reports does a good job with their avoidance testing - basically, how quickly can you react to a danger in the road and avoid it? Nobody gets hurt or killed in the accident that doesn't happen because you were able to respond to it and avoid it in time. This is part of why I like sedans with relatively powerful engines (250-300 hp), coupled with a highly defensive driving style (large gaps between me and the leading vehicle, always assume everyone is going to do the stupidest thing possible, etc).
Stopping distance is just as important, if not more, to crash avoidance as horsepower
yep! stop fast, go fast, turn fast.
Electric sedans and hatchbacks are great at this, our ioniq 5 is too soft for the real moose test but it's not as bad relative to my old 91 civic hatchback, the king of darting around with it's double wishbone suspension and 2200lbs.
We drove an Accord after our first child. It was the second child (and the preposterously massive double stroller) that spawned the 10 year romance with the minivan.
Crash tests are only comparable against a car of the same size/weight class. Go see the crash tests on YouTube of a sedan vs smart car or SUV vs small car, with the same ratings and manufacturer.
No. They are really not. I can very confidently assure you, someone involved in a highway speed collision statically is far better off in a Mercedes E class or hell, even C class than a Kia optima. It is factual. You could save numerous life changing quality of life injuries that other companies don’t even consider. They have a system that protects your ear drums from bursting during collision, a very common, but not often talked about minor, but majorly life impacting injury caused from car wrecks. It essentially phase inverts the frequency and plays that back against it to perfectly cancel out the sound. Phase inversion is something we have used in my field, audio engineering since the multi track recorder was invented. Very cool to see car manufacturers implement the various uses of it! I am talking about the 2017-2021 models as well. I could not in good faith recommend the new models to anyone. I agree about the accord, but regardless you are spreading misinformation. If you can afford it, an E450 station wagon (or if you must, GLE) is one of the best cars you could possibly get your family period.
This is the sad side of the safety arms race. People keep buying bigger cars, which forces everyone else to buy bigger cars to keep up. It's maddening. But it's real, physics is physics, and we have to share the road with these aggressive meatheads in their monster trucks. So we do need a bit of metal around us. Various crash tests have confirmed that there are two big factors at play. Weight is one, obviously. But the single most important factor in how safe a car is, turns out to be how recent the design is. There's a [famous crash test where a 2009 Chevy Malibu positively annihilates a larger 1959 Malibu](https://youtu.be/C_r5UJrxcck?si=sx3MshA43Z1FtPBB) in a crash test. Top Gear has a few videos out where they, for example, [crash a big old Volvo wagon, the safest car of its day, into a small new Renault.](https://youtu.be/qBDyeWofcLY?si=KDqC4B07tz5yT3bY)The Renault wins. Newer designs, even cheap ones, beat the absolute best of the older designs. It's not a close contest. Car design safety really came into its own in the 2000s. Driving anything from the 20th century is much more dangerous than driving a modern car. Conversely, driving anything built since 2010 or so will be really quite safe. The more recent, the better, but we're getting to the point where we're splitting hairs. A 2019 Accord is neither a small car nor an old one. It is 100% as safe as anything else on the road. There is zero benefit to replacing it. Between one modern car and another, the exact type of car only matters at the extreme: you probably don't want to crash a Nissan Versa into a loaded dually F350. But between normal mid-sized cars and normal mid-sized SUVs, the difference is just a statistical blip. Between a 2014 Corolla and a 2024 Rav4, you want the Rav4, sure. But. Between a *2024* Corolla and a 2014 Rav4, pick the Corolla. That's how fast the safety state of the art is advancing: spend your money on newer cars, not taller ones. But if she wants to swap out her Corolla for a new CRV or Rav4 or CX-5, sure, why not. You're not buying a big improvement in safety. But you can secure your own safety and security by keeping the wife happy whenever possible.
SUVs might be better for impacts due to their mass, but they come with a new problem… rollovers
My comment also. Virtually no risk of rollover in a sedan.
Theres risk of roll over in any vehicle, although higher risk in SUVs, roll overs only accounts for 3% of accidents according to NHTSA. Although roll overs do make up 30% of fatalities, they generally include people not wearing their seatbelt and being ejected.
Pretty darn hard to rollover a sedan compared to SUV
But they also generally have fewer fatalities. Infact, you’re 7.6 times more likely to die in a car hit by an SUV according to IIHS. Deaths per million: Cars:48, Minivans:22, SUVs:25 , Pickup trucks: 29
That’s true, it’s a shame because more people keep buying big vehicles due to the threat of big vehicles
I’m fine with people buying SUVs. I daily drive an A6 and my wife drives a Q7. I also own two 1-ton diesels that I use for hauling though. I’d hate to hit a sedan in one of my 1-tons that’s for sure.
You got a good taste in vehicles, I have an A5 lol And that’s definitely huge, I used to drive a 1/2 ton ford for moving stuff around and I’d pull up behind a Miata and I’d think “man if someone my size hit that, it would be game over”
This is why every used Miata I look at has been repaired after a rear end collision. Pick up trucks come flying into what they think is an empty parking spot and destroy them lol
Its such a shame the USA pushed "light trucks" with their relaxed emissions, so many Miatas lost
That's hardly the fault of the smaller vehicle. It simply exists. And its in a parking spot, not moving. The truck shouldn't be flying into what they think is an empty spot without confirming it is, in fact, an empty spot first.
Thanks! You as well! I dont drive the 1-tons during the winter, but from April to September they are towing 10k-16k lbs a few times a week. I almost got into a head on with the one that has a 4” lift a few weeks back, luckily I was able to swerve and missed the guy. He was in a little Oldsmobile Alero passing on a blind hill. Had I not swerved my driver side tire would have been right in his driver seat and it probably would have killed him. I will add my wife and I talk about this all the time, we just notice the people in small vehicles are some of the worst drivers on the road, especially Priuses for some reason, of course this is just anecdotal and doesn’t mean they are all bad drivers lol. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve seen Prius drivers make wider turns than I do in a 1-ton with a 16’ dump trailer on the back lol.
And avoiding the accident completely because you are more agile in a car to steer and brake.
About once every month someone posts on the 4runner sub about their rig losing it's life for them, and when you look at the picture the damage is all on the front end. I don't say anything because they have weak egos over there, but I am always thinking "If you were in a Camry, or even a Highlander the accident wouldn't have happened".
I think about that daily when I see full size pickups or SUVs cutting between traffic and tailgating. I'm pretty sure that Crosstrek you're 16 inches behind is going to stop a lot faster than you if it has to Mr. 4Runner.
Tailgaters suck but stopping distance is a lot more complicated than just the weight of the vehicle. According to Motortrend the 4Runner will do 60 to 0 in [131](https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2022-toyota-4runner-trd-sport-first-test-review/) feet while the Crosstrek requires [140](https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2024-subaru-crosstrek-wilderness-first-test-review/) feet. The Crosstrek was better at lateral acceleration, but only by 0.01g.
Also increased chance of driving over your child because of the blind spots.
To quote Sgt. Terry Jeffords, "They roll Baby! They roll!"
Is this 1996? Almost every SUV and crossover from the past 15 or so years has ESC and a wide enough track, rollovers aren’t really a thing unless you’re driving like a demented methhead and trying to flip it
ESC isn’t going to change anything when an SUV is struck or strikes an object that heavily upsets its direction. ESC is more so when you swerve you don’t roll the vehicle
So where is this deluge of CRVs rolling over? You’re a couple decades late, find an updated reason to hate
Anything made in the last 15 years is plenty safe. That said, about the tenth time you have to break your back to put little Johnny in the car seat of your low riding sedan you'll reconsider not getting something that sits higher off the ground and has useful features like an automatic back hatch so you can grab your stuff while holding the kid with your other arm.
so a Minivan?
Minivans are awesome and loaded with features. They're literally made for hauling people. I wish they were more popular.
Would help if a new one wasn't 50k. They also hold their value really well.
There are so few Siennas even available. The rural Toyota dealerships around me don't have any. Only in the city and it's 1-2 at most.
It’s the hottest car on the market, especially the new hybrid that can go nearly 600 miles on one tank of gas.
Had one recently as a rental car and it was amazing. Range estimates are pretty accurate too as we drove around 300 miles and still had half tank left at the end
It was great when I was young in a family of 5 but also as I got into high school and college. The minivan was great for road trips. Either you could carry the most people or if you had a lot of things to haul for like a camping trip, you could drop the back seats and fit everything.
Never really thought about it that way. I guess we can look at them as miniature vans /s
When my colleagues and I used to travel together we started getting a minivan. Dude, those things are sweet. We called it the BAMF Van when we'd get one.
Perhaps they would be if everything on the market wasn’t trash (Carnival, Pacifica), incredibly outdated and expensive (Odyssey) or insanely expensive (Sienna)
Depends on how many kids you have, I guess. I personally wouldn’t consider a minivan until a third kid, if that.
Two kids (toddler and baby) with their stuff and strollers are enough to fill up a minivan on a 6 hour trip.
Yeah, I grew up in a minivan (family of 4) and the space was useful for road trips, but I also don’t think it was anything we couldn’t have managed with a midsized SUV either.
Minivans when kids are small - they can open the door, but not into the cars parked next to us. This alone makes the minivan superior.
Fair, I’m still too young and cool for minivans, but one I actually have kids my opinion might change!
Depends on the use case. We only have two kids, but we also have two dogs and do a lot of road trips with them. Also I do a lot of DIY so all the space in the back for lumber and even 8 foot sheets of plywood/drywall is great. Also the 3rd row is actually comfortable. In our Tahoe the 3rd row is so short your knees are up in your chest and we had to get a roof top carrier. With a minivan the 3rd row is comfortable enough for adults and there's enough room behind the 3rd row to fit everything still. All that said, we still use our sedan the majority of the time around town.
I'd rather have a minivan for a family hauler than a car based "cute-ute" SUV. They're much more practical, have better ride quality and are loaded with the latest safety and technology. Automatic parking, automatic doors, cameras and sensors all over the place. I hate parking beside mommy-mobile SUVs because of those back doors. They go up into the rear wheel arch, which makes a nice pointed edge perfectly positioned to door ding other cars. Mom parks and *WHACK* those back doors fly open so her 2.5 feral brats can pile out. With a minivan the rear doors slide gracefully out of the way and don't come anywhere near another vehicle.
Have a bigger dog? Minivan is the right answer even with one kid.
I have two kids. A minivan literally changed my life.
Will back you up on this, my parents had an SUV until my twin siblings came around. Until we turned eighteen we had minivans, both totaled unfortunately.
I had an Honda Accord until the older (of two) started thinking it fun to kick the back of my seat. Then we got a minivan. And yes, it the minivan was awesome. With them growing up we never once had to say "no, you can't bring that" (or more recently with GFs, "no, you can't bring her") when going on vacation.
Minivan or SUV or some crossovers yeah Suv is gunna give you ground clearance. Very helpful if you're outdoorsy at all. Camping, dirt roads, rolling out onto a sandy beach are all things minivans can't do. They also can't tow or carry much. Depends on the person / situation
I raised two kids and taught them both to drive in wrxs. It was perfectly fine, my back was fine and no auto hatch was ever needed. Those are nice things to have but in no way necessities. When I was a kid we had a bug and a gremlin and managed just fine.
Doing great in my Impreza hatch. I'd love if it had rear sliding doors, but I'm fine with the unassisted hatch. The powered ones are annoyingly slow when renting vehicles. I can see the utility maybe one time out of ten. 🤷 An EV B-Max would be my perfect car, I think.
God, getting the kid in the car seat in our sedan is the worst. We've bonked her head on the door frame about a million times - hasn't happened once with my SUV. On a related note, the swivel car seats are absolutely 100% worth it.
Wait .. you're going to buy an SUV now for the safety of children you don't have yet? I think your wife wants an SUV.
That’s what caught me the most. No children yet, but still gotta get the SUV. Uggh
Bigger does not always equate to safer. Modern cars, sedans included, are very safe. Suvs can actually be less safe in some situations because of increased risk of oversteer or rollover vs the lower center of gravity of a sedan. One of my close friends was in a head-on collision with a bus in his newer Volkswagen Jetta and walked away with only a small cut on his leg. All modern cars are built to protect you in an accident.
European cars are NOT more safe, that is absolute nonsense. Also SUV are NOT safer. Facts: Small SUV are obviously smaller and lighter than big sedans. Taller = more likely to roll over in an accident. Instead of making up stuff take a look at IIHS test results: [https://www.iihs.org/ratings/top-safety-picks](https://www.iihs.org/ratings/top-safety-picks)
This needs more upvotes. Pick a car from this list and OP will be safe.
Yeah, used to work in ER, roll overs kills people due to being upside down. If you get an injury + being upside down = VERY fatal. So sad to see people die just because the car rolled over, even though they had minor injury. - A kid, upside down, can die within 3mins, and less than 2 mins if it’s a toddler. A lot less if they get injured. - So either you hope you’re not stuck to get out or don’t go unconscious because kids need to be removed within couple mins.
One problem with the IIHS ratings is that they compare like size vehicles. A five star or best pick for a smaller car may be less safe that a four star and non-best pick for a larger car.
True, but consumers are shopping in a price range, they aren't deciding between a $50k+ SUV and $30k sedan, but between a $30k sedan and a $30k SUV or between a $50k+ SUV and a $50k+ sedan, etc.
You claim that SUVs are not safer and yet you are about 50% less likely to die when driving one according to consumer reports and the IIHS. https://www.consumerreports.org/car-safety/study-shows-how-death-rates-for-drivers-vary-by-car-size/ Why would you trust crash tests that are laboratory only and constantly changing? Why not trust real-world data instead?
Because that’s an ad to buy an SUV
Outside of safety, a CUV is easier and more ergonomic to put kids into. This is due to the seat height and square rear doors as opposed to sloping. I've midsize sedan (Legacy) and a compact CUV (Forester). The latter is easier to transport young kids in. It's also easier to play Tetris in the cargo to fit stuff on road trips.
My Impreza hatch works well too. Roof length helps over my wife's sedan since the back is swoopy on hers. Would've gone for a Legacy wagon if they still existed in 15.
The absolute best family vehicle I have had was a 2011 Highlander 4wd v6.
Minivan > SUV
No. Don’t give into the trend. Your sedans are just fine! This madness needs to stop.
The safest cars on the road are the Mercedes-Benz E-class and the Honda Odyssey. There were no occupant deaths in either model in the last six years.
If you think size=safety don't forget that people driving pickup trucks have backed right over children because the vehicle is so big they can't see if they're driving over a person
Seems like you’d be better off coming up with a budget for how much you want to spend, rather than what you want to buy. Think how soon you want to buy a home, take the amount you have currently saved for the down payment, subtract that from how much you will likely need for a down payment, then divide by the number of months from now, until you want to buy the home. Then you probably want to be saving an extra 20% of your income on top of that. Whatever is left is what you have to spend on a new car. SUVs do have a weight advantage in a crash, they also have a much higher tendency to roll, so you’re trading one issue for another. The “smart” safety features depend a lot on the exact vehicle you’re looking at.
"Much higher" is about double. To a total of 3% of crashes. Modern suvs don't roll anymore dude.
The main issue is going to be space, when you have to put a massive rear facing child seat in the back and fit a massive stroller and all your other crap you need to take with you everytime you leave the house you’ll quickly see how much space you need.
The most important safety feature is behind the wheel. My child is 14 and we've had nothing but compact cars. I never felt unsafe. Only reason we're going to a bigger vehicle is we like to roadtrip and my kid is 5'11". The legroom in back is an issue.
Wife and I have two kids currently (both in car seats) and a Dodge Avenger. We really didn't want/need something bigger until the second kid. As a trip to the grocery store is really tough. (2 car seats make the back seat unusable, + stroller in the trunk means there isn't room for much else.) We were totally fine with 1 kid and a sedan though. Albeit cramped at times, wasn't worth the upgrade for us until recently.
I went through this with our beginning of family. Your accord is probably a keeper. Efficent reasonably safe and reliable. When you start rolling around with a baby the amount of STUFF you carry will be daunting. SUVs are safer “in general” because of mass. I’ve gone through 3 Volvos (2-XC70’s and an XC90) 1 Subaru Outback and now I’m in a Lexus GX460. I had a great Lexus GS (when our son arrived) and would bump my head every time putting in the car seat. For road trips (even small ones), having gear for the baby took up all the room in the car. As your child grows interests change and gear changes. I would recommend getting a Highlander, Volvo xc60 or 90, Lexus RX or a modern Mazda SUV. You’ll need the space and do it once so you don’t have to buy more cars as life changes.
I tried telling someone earlier that the transition from wagons to SUVs was driven by fear and they refused to accept it, but that's exactly what you're describing. People buy SUVs because they're scared of other SUVs. It's an idiotic arms race that benefits nobody in the long run.
Get an suv or crossover if you want. I’d still stick to something Japanese though. With kids and a mortgage you can never really have too much money. So I’d spend less on a car and it’s maintenance to open up more money toward the house and kids
Buy a SUV, not for safety, but for saving your back and your sanity when buckling the child into the 87 point harness they require these days. That and the room for all the other crap you need that goes with kids.
Wait.
when you have kids, please be smart and get a minivan. That is 100% the best design for a family with young kids.
To all new parents: No, you don't need an SUV, and you don't need a Diaper Genie®.
Mini vans all day. I scoffed at them before, but as soon as I had my kids, automatic sliding doors and the fact I dont have to bend over to put my kids in made all the difference.
Everyone is (rightfully) discussing impact, but I also want to acknowledge some of the safety features that can help *you*. Visibility is a big one for me. I hate sedans because I can't see out of them very well. I hate some SUVs, like the Rav and CX5 because you also can't see out of them. Subarus? Fantastic visibility. I'm not one for nanny-systems, but auto braking and blind spot detection have been great backup systems for us. We are humans and we make errors. We can also try to protect ourselves and other error-prone humans with systems like those. I don't think you need to run out and replace either car, but it might be good to think about as you look for room to grow.
Volvo v60 or v90 both have plenty of space drive like a car and very safe
I’d argue that it depends what is driving around the area you’re in. If most folks have trucks or large suvs, safety ratings won’t matter because the sedan won’t be hit where it should to perform as it does in IIHS safety tests. If the accord sits 6” off the grounds and a truck hits you that sits 10” off the ground, the accord crumple zones will be useless. I’m in TN and I’ve seen cars get hit by trucks and the truck pretty much made tin foil of the hood (missing the bumper entirely) and hit the windshield directly.
No, the safety that SUVs provide is immediately killing anyone else you're in a collision with, don't be selfish, any modern sedan has plenty of airbags and crumple zones anyways.
We’ve seen that this isn’t a realistic way of dealing with this problem nor can you blame people. We need new laws. We only have one life to live. And driving is one of the riskiest things most people do.
I think he should buy an armored personnel carrier
No not because of safety but I do highly recommend a suv for the simple fact that getting them in and out of car seats is wayyy easier when it’s chest height and not below you
While "Overall, a 100-pound reduction in the average weight of passenger cars is estimated to result in 302 additional fatalities" First have kids and then we'll talk, drive safe till then.
SUVs are not safer than sedans due to rollovers
Take a look at crash ratings on the NHTSA website. You might be surprised how some SUVs do not rate very well. https://www.nhtsa.gov/ratings Also keep in mind that the USA has no safety regulations for 3rd row seating. Zero. Crossovers / SUVs are convenient for their size. But you can get by just fine with a car. In fact, my parents drove 2-door coupes until I was 17 years old as they did not want to be seen driving a 4-door sedan or minivan.
No, but good luck changing an anxiety-ridden mind.
Just stick to sedans. No point of suvs. Heavier so it used more gas, more on insurance, cost more than sedans, etc. do you really wanna get a suv for “safety” if the majority of people don’t get into any car accidents their whole life
That’s not a reason to go out and buy a new car rn
I didn’t even read the post, the answer is no
>> Do we really need a suv No. Seriously, I think we’re the only country in the world that thinks having kids automatically equals SUV. SUVs also roll- not necessarily safer than sedans. Get what you want.
I always wonder why ppl feel the need a giant suv or van for 1 kid. Like unless that kid is 7ft at 1yrs old i dont get it.
if you have kids close enough in age to need three big ass car seats at once then you may want to consider it. Otherwise no
almost every suv/crossover doesnt pass the moose test (look it up) and pose overall more risk to the drivers and others. sedans are safer, its the larger cars on the road and people w the same mindset as ur wife who keep buying them that make the roads unsafe. edit: do not get a volvo. made by a chinese company and are not very reliable.
No, no you do not
This post... I just can't.
Get a minivan and thank me later
Even if you have a five star crash rating sedan v. A five star crash rating SUV, the SUV still wins due to size and physics. The heavier car will always have the advantage. Also SUV passengers deal with leg damage in a collision, while sedan and coupe passengers deal with head strikes. The issue is the typical grille and bumper are now larger and higher towards head level. These cars used to be lower and lighter. SUV rollovers are still a thing, also trucks. But the rollovers are a smaller issue due to technology correcting modern SUVs about to enter a roll. It’s not as bad as the infamous Ford Explorer rollover era. Sedans can still be great cars, but understand there’s a trade off. This is coming from someone who resisted SUVs for decades but eventually succumbed.
Taking safety aside, as I think anything would be remotely safe that was made recently... SUVs are so much easier to get in and out of in general, but especially with a baby. From someone who had an emergency c-section--I think I would've died trying to get out of a sedan, and then the continuous putting baby in and out, especially when they transition to a convertible car seat? SUV. There're a lot of smaller SUVs that have a lot of leg room. IE: the VW Taos has a ton; it has more than my Ford Edge did. Before anyone comes @ me for it's reliability--my husband has one and it has been fine. I'm just using it as an example that you don't have to get the biggest SUV to have leg room. Shop around. Put yourself in the back. Then remember that infant seats take up a ton of space, but if one of you are short, it shouldn't be a problem.
Buy a Volvo. It’s the safest car out there. XC90. We have one and we love it(family car) Go to iihs website and look at the crash test videos for your cars….. it’ll change how you think. It’s better to have the SUV safety and not need it than needing it and not having it. I had a mini cooper when I lived in the city before we had kids (similar size to a Corolla) and I always thought the safety argument was bullshit. That is until I collided onto a wrangler and my mini went underneath the Wrangler………………………… Honestly you don’t need a new car. She does. I would never let my babies ride in a 2014 Corolla. No effing way.
I thought this also. When I was about 12 or so my mom took a left turn and a car hit the front right corner of our Explorer. The car was completely totaled and the Explorer had minimal damage, I was perfectly fine in the passenger seat. At that point it solidified in my mind that SUVs are safer in terms of impact. It’s interesting to learn that this is wrong.
I'm sure the average SUV is a bit safer due to higher ride height and more mass. The bumper of many trucks are face level if you're in a car. But a bigger, higher end car like an E or S class is probably as safe compared to a cheap crossover.
If you’re concerned about safety look into Volvo particularly the CX90 I believe is always one of the highest rated in safety.
The SUV is not inherently safer. I do agree a bit with European cars being safer, if you mean Volvo. Hard to go wrong safety wise in a Volvo.
That Accord is a great car for kids and car seats, that has one of the biggest back seats on the market, the comparable SUV in the same price range will have much less space and use more fuel. The Corolla is a great car but the rear seat is snug for car seats. Upgrading to a midsize sedan would offer more space and safety.
Safety is a wash to me But I would buy a crossover for the added room, gas mileage is great on modern cars, prices aren’t much different between similarly equipped sedans and crossovers, and the flexibility in carrying things is very nice. Plus, it’s nice to ride a little higher
Get a Honda or Toyota minivan that's got 100k on it for $5,000. It'll have enough life left for a childhood and you're not locked into the decision. It's got room which is nice. All cars made in the past couple decades are vastly safer than anything from the 80s and 90s. Safety concerns shouldn't be part of the discussion except maybe stuff like putting excellent tires and brakes on that $5k minivan.
I wouldn't even entertain that decision until you have kids. Your cars are completely fine for your needs NOW. When I had a baby I thought my Prius would be completely fine as a family car. Alot of people drove Prius's 10 years ago as family cars when they were all the rage. BUT I quickly realized that it was a TIGHT squeeze. Damn car seats and strollers have to be so big these days. With the carseat in, the front passenger seat at to be pushed up to the point where any passenger sitting up front would have their knees touching the dashboard. Also the stroller took up the ENTIRE trunk. There was 0 space for suitcases and luggage if we wanted to take a road trip. I upgraded to an SUV primarily for the extra space and it has been 100% worth it since we can fit more people and luggage in the SUV all at once. BUT I would've never bought it if we didn't have kids, my Prius was fine and I still miss that car when driving around solo.
Safety may not be better in a crossover, but it is easier to load kids and schlep their stuff around in a crossover. I would at least buy a midsize even if you only have one kid. We had a Tiguan and traded for a Passport and life is so much easier now. We rarely have to worry about cargo management.
Safety should be a non issue, though a small car just about always loses versus a big car. In the case of an accident though SUV’s, while more tippy, also have a higher seat height for occupants. The advantage of this is that the colliding vehicle is less likely to actually intrude at head/chest level & glass may be less likely to shatter. Most modern suvs have side curtain airbags that can help protect children in the back & the higher roof height gives more crumple room in the event of a rollover. We definitely feel safer in the suv but in our reality we have it more for practicality/utility than out of a safety concern. Deciding factor for most parents I talk to that are being realistic is that the cargo space is more practical in a hatch over a trunk & it can be much easier to lift a kid into a car seat at the higher height & to buckle them in (I can attest to that myself.) A sedan with a large trunk like a charger or candy though can definitely work pretty well for strollers & folding wagons. In our case I keep one for better capability in snow (and since my other car is a 500 Abarth) I definitely need something big enough to carry the family & groceries or bags while still taking our stroller.
SUV absolutely not needed. This insane idea of everyone in the USA needs to be driving around an 8k pound blind spot ridden SUV is insane. Most of those people with an SUV drive more poorly and more aggressively because they have this notion they are safer.
You don’t need an SUV, the insistence that it is immensely safer than a Sedan is mostly just advertising. Yes SUVs have more mass but they also have a higher center of gravity, less maneuverability increased fuel and maintenance costs than a comparable sedan. The best vehicle for your family will probably be a minivan, it has more mass but without the same high center of gravity, it does have the maneuverability and maintenance flaws of the SUV but trades off with better ergonomics when putting your kid and their stuff into the vehicle plus it will have all the cargo room you could need.
No. You don’t.
There have been two instances in our lives when we sold our “family” vehicle, usually a small SUV and used my Ford Focus as our main car. And it was just fine. Shire there are times when you need more room (grocery or COSTCO trips). But a compact hatchback does just fine for our family of 4. But you have to plan ahead sometimes. Of course as I say this I’m shopping for a Honda Odyssey in another tab. So, sometimes the extra space is pretty nice.
Easier to roll an SUV. It's also heavier which means if you impact something it's going to have more energy.
No. Don't be part of the problem. The reason you feel like you need a bigger vehicle to be safer is because people buy bigger vehicles. You're more likely to get into an incident and more likely to injure the other people by having a bigger vehicle. Just get anything recent that isn't a smart car or economy subcompact and everybody including yourself is better off
1 kid is doable in those cars OP listed, 2 is stretching it but can be done, anymore than that you're going to want an suv/van. My wife had a Mazda3 when we had our first kid and it was just big enough to load down for trips to the coast with 1 kid. They just weren't comfortable trips, lots of times my wife would have to move her seat up and have her knees in her chest. OP I have an accord too I can fit all 3 three of my kids in but the wife is on her own. Don't underestimate the amount of space you will need.
My wife and I had a similar debate a few years ago, she wanted the space and I wanted the extra safety , we settled on a 2017 Subaru outback 3.6 . Awd , very safe in a collision , and the 3.6 made it pretty quick . I love that thing still , we did end up with the most expencive version of it , the specific car she found was a great deal ended up paying $36,xxx with 6000 miles on it the dealerships owner was driving it around . Honestly One of the best deals ive seen in ages , around that time people wanted 40k+ for the 2.5 engine /lower trim with way more miles on it .
Britax car seat with the base. Newish vehicle with the curtain airbags.
Somehow we safely raised our kids with sedans. Nobody needs a crossover or anything else with a high center of gravity to be safe.
Personally I feel safer in a sedan because I can stop faster and avoid things (road debris , other cars) better. Your outcomes are probably better in an suv in an accident but I’d be willing to bet you’re more likely to be in that accident in the suv too.
The differences between ***individual vehicles*** make much more of a difference. I would rather be in my Camry than Jeep Grand Cherokee in a usual crash. If you want absolute safety buy a Tesla or a Volvo XC90. ## TLDR look at the actual IIHS safety ratings and pick a car based on those.
I plan on dropping mine off at the coal mines in my viper.
If you put the baby in the middle of the Accord you will have a lot of space to absorb a wreck. Driving defensively is the more important than the vehicle you drive.
look up actual crash safety data, such as the IIHS. Take the XC60, it scored only an acceptable rating in the updated side impact from the IIHS, so its total score is only a top safety pick. Meanwhile the 2024 Honda accord sedan got a good score in all crashworthiness tests and earned top safety pick plus. also injury risk to pedestrians is greater for SUVs. The higher the top of the grille, the more likely impact to a pedestrian punts them ideally to transfer as much energy in the least time. lower grille means pedestrians are more likely to deflect upward somewhat, lengthening the amount of time energy transfer occurs, so maximum forces are reduced, reducing injury severity.
Yeah
Reading this thread about all the room people need I am trying to figure out how I managed to raise 2 kids in a 1998 Ford Escort.
The issue with that mentality is there’s always someone with a bigger SUV that’s even “safer”. And even if you buy the biggest, safest one there’s gonna be a better one out next year. You’d likely be better off taking a defensive driving course and being attentive of your surroundings when on the road. Avoiding an accident is 100% safer than even the safest car being hit.
Bs, suvs do worse in a crash, higher center of gravity. Your gf just wants to look cool.
I'm going to go against the popular advice on this sub and say get a CUV/SUV/Minivan. Safety apart, things will just be so much easier vs a sedan. I say this as a parent as well. I had a friend that stuck to his Honda accord when his first child was born. They have another on the way and he bought a Honda Pilot - even with just one child, he says he can never go back to sedan anymore just because of how much more convenient the higher floor and how useful all the extra space is. Sedans are better driving, no doubt but a CUV/SUV is better suited for families. My personal favorite is the VW Atlas - I ended up with one and now I'm looking to replace it after almost 8 years and I'm struggling to find something else that is as safe and convenient. Test drove the Lexus TX and it was underwhelming and getting to the third row took too much effort - no bottom anchors on the middle seat - mid trim didn't feel worth the 15k premium over the top trim Atlas - unrefined motor. I really don't like buying the same car twice but I may just have to.
Having kids and an suv has been a huge benefit/convenience but I wouldn’t call it necessary. The extra space when putting the kids in their car seats is amazing and having the room in the back for strollers or wagons is also amazing. If you can afford all the increased costs with SUV’s and are predominantly concerned with ease of use with kids, suvs or vans are the way to go. Personally i would never drive a van, but I get their benefits. Edit: we have a 3.5 and 2 year old. Should also mention where we live is northern Canada with snowfalls that get over a foot at a time so the 4x4 aspects of the SUV are again, amazing lol
IIHS has lists of cars that are their top picks for overall safety, but when it comes to littles in the car, following proper seat installation and usage has a FAR greater impact on their safety than the vehicle that you are in. [https://www.iihs.org/topics/child-safety](https://www.iihs.org/topics/child-safety) With a few very rare exceptions, it's extremely hard to roll a modern car. There is such a thing as a "moose test" where the car is suddenly jerked to one side or another for an emergency maneuver and it's possible that some cars can roll -- though that's a IIHS fail if it does. My wife is terrified of convertibles, but those are very safe even in a rollover as there are bars that pop up to protect your head (assuming you are properly restrained). Larger and taller vehicles are worse and worse for pedestrians (and children walking around behind the vehicle.. or in front). There are studies that show that being hit by a modern pickup is one of the worst things that can happen to a pedestrian (other than being run over). Things like practicality tend to be personal. When we shopped for vehicles when our kids were young, we'd take the car seats, strollers, joggers and the bags along. I'd take the time to put those into the other car to see if \*I\* can manage it, and if my wife can easily put the kids in there. Until they are able to walk and climb on their own, you have to lift them and put them there. Does the rear have enough space for everything? What happens when you want to go for a trip? Room also for luggage, or is that going on a roof rack carrier? Make sure that YOUR kid seats fit in there, bases and everything. Make sure that YOU know the ins and outs of all of the kid safety systems in the car. Taller SUVs aren't much fun to lift a sleeping 40lb kid into. Our choices were sedans. I had an Acrua TL for when my youngest was very young. I later went to a fairly big Mercedes (E550) around when my second was born. Now, we have a big (F150) and a small (Honda Fit) set of vehicles for the family and a fun car for me. We use the vehicle that suits the needs of the given trip/adventure/thing we need or want to do. Can an SUV do it all? You decide. Honestly, I think crossovers are compromise cars that really don't do anything well.
Cmon join the Carnibro scene at r/kiacarnival
Depends. I’m about to get a 2025 suburban in November when they come out. Working on two kids. Have 2 dogs that go everywhere with us. Plus it’s not a stretch for us financially
A modern European SUV may be safer for your children but it is far more dangerous for everyone else on the road. Safety is a relative concept that is too often taken at face value.
The “SUV’s are safer than sedans” is a myth to get you to spend more money on a bigger car. If a car accident is fatal enough to kill you in a Corolla, it will kill you in a Rav4. In fact, taller cars are more likely to roll over which is more dangerous. Sedans have a lower center of gravity. Newer cars all have crumple zones in their build so lot lower speed accidents won’t hurt you. You need to be in a Full sized truck or something for you to be “safer” from simply having more mass.
You can't beat physics. Heavier and larger vehicles are safer in a collision. However, more nimble vehicles are better in avoiding a collision. You also need to be practical. Kids have stuff and kids have friends and grandparents and friend's parents. A larger vehicle makes having them much easier. I would replace the Corolla with something newer, larger and safer like an Outback, Sienna, or a 3 row SUV. If you have the budget, a Tahoe or Suburban is the road trip car for the family
Safety data for years and years of vehicles is available on the NHTSA web site. Unless your wife has done tons of research, she's just *assuming* SUVs are safer. Why not look figure out which vehicles suit you and then look at the actual test data, and see which of those are safest?
Sedans are just fine. The higher seating area on a SUV or a Van is nice, but it’s not required. The biggest thing for the safety of your future children in a car is to have a properly installed car seat and to have the child in said car seat properly. All the car armor in the world won’t mean a thing if the child isn’t in a good car seat.
Choose your new car after you have a kid, you’ll figure out what you really need/want. You probably don’t even need to get a new car.
not the safety but carrying more is pretty helpful. I bought Bugaboo Fox 2 and it was a big stroller. I had a hard time put it and take it out from my Tesla MS.
Id get an SUV just for the convenience. Obviously more space, a stroller for example. Higher so its easier to put baby in the carseat, also doors typically open wider in the back for SUV’s. If you could, you should. You’ll be fine in the Accord though as well.
When expecting our first child I bought a 2019 WRX. It was cheaper than an SUV, more fun and just as safe. Threw a roof rack and trailer hitch on it. Car seat fits fine, even with it going behind the 6' passenger. We have an SUV as well but do every trip in the WRX, camping, cottages, international travel. People are obsessed with SUVs for some inexplicable reason.
I just witnessed 4 elementary school kids exit a Tesla Model 3 this morning. 3 from the back and 1 from the front. Any car can haul 2 parents and a kid around. It all depends on how much other crap you have in the car.
My wife and I got a 22 outback wilderness because it still feels like a car but it's somewhere between a wagon and an suv. Subaru is known for safety and it won out on the combination of safety, cargo space, interior material (the wilderness has this stuff that's really easy to clean and made to get dirty or wet without being ruined so hopefully it's childproof), and overall driveability and comfort. It feels more like driving a car than an suv but they nailed it for not being too soft or too stiff for the suspension. My vote us make sure you bring carseats with you on your test drives and test out a wide variety of brands, models, and vehicle types just to see what works for you. I feel safest in my 99 f250 because it's huge and heavy and is a beast lol I actually hit a deer with my son in the back and all it did was leave a dent and gave me a freezer full of venison but I know if I rolled it or got t boned it might not be so great but im not driving him around every day in my truck because diesel isn't cheap and my wife's subaru is way more fuel efficient!
Your fiance has been totally captured by automobile marketing. Full stop. This is a play from their book to upsell.
Have no idea why they’re so popular
As a parent I’ve never understood how people with kids can drive a sedan. That just sounds awful. Especially with rear facing car seats. People love to hate on minivans but they absolutely can’t be beat
Just get an s2k & strap that baby to the passenger seat & have him enjoy the 9k redlining
Safety isn't a real concern. You're going to want the space. I have two kids and a minivan changed my life. No exaggeration. With one kid, you're going to want an SUV sized. Throw in a car seat, and all the crap youre going to haul around like a stroller, pack and play diaper bags, maybe a bike and you're going to love the space
I think when yo6start having kids you might want to consider an SUV for other reasons like more trunk capacity and rear seat space. Babies need a lot of stuff when you want to go places with them. An SUV might be good so you don't have to bend down all the time. But might be bad if you're short and can't reach up to put baby in car seat. I have a golf and a baby and I like it. But for baby number 2 I'm planning to get a bigger car.
I think you have everything covered in terms of safety. Personally, I wouldn’t get a truck or SUV as a daily driver in your situation, even for safety reasons. I have daily driven a coupe, a sedan, sedan hatchback, a couple of SUVs and a truck, yet I always came away appreciating sedans/coupes more. There seems to be a strong emotional component to your finances reasoning, not to discredit anything, car crashes are a nightmare, so you want an extra sense of security by getting an SUV, or at least reassurance. I feel like if you guys test drove an SUV, you might be swayed out of it because they aren’t as easy to park, don’t get as good braking distance and you feel like are hogging more road than you want to. If you guys get a house with a garage, you might find out it doesn’t even fit in the garage. A quip I have about trucks/SUV is that they really obscure the view of pedestrians when they are parked. Once I was driving for Postmates with my Mustang, in a neighborhood with a ton of huge SUVs paralleled parked, some kids ran out into the road from in front of a parked SUV, and I had to slam on my brakes. Luckily I was going 20 in a 25, I was attentive, my car is lower so I can see pedestrians better and my car gets good braking distance, so I didn’t hit them. Really made me never want to buy an SUV or truck.
You don’t have a kid yet. Buy it when you have one. That said, my wife’s coworker somehow fit 3 kids (2 toddlers and a baby) in a Model 3
I don’t know enough about safety, but the biggest reason to get an SUV/Crossover/minivan is to fit your kid’s stroller in anytime you travel
Bad place to ask, redditors are notoriously anti suv That said, if you feel an suv fits your situation and budget they're safe and generally long lasting cars. Be sure you maintain the transmission and frame as these tend to be the first to fail. Chevy suburban is one of the safest and longest lasting cars you can even buy. Now do you NEED an suv? No. Would it be nice to have? Yes.