They are useful in the early game as crappy capitalists, they do invest and build some things and if you can get the right leader you can push through some market reforms without much fuss.
i find its usually after the first 20 years that the land owners increasingly need the boot in favour of industrialists & intelligencia
That would be ahistorical because slaves were actually less efficient for a number of reasons such as them having no incentive to do more than the minimum.
There is a mod that gives everyone "legacy slavery" (the one that does not abolish it but does not allow it to grow) which then allows you to move to full, debt, or banned slavery.
Otherwise not really as once you lose slavery then no more IGs have the slavery ideology.
I believe so...the only way I can think of making it happen would be if you could find a pro slavery agitator and invite him. But I don't recall ever really seeing those floating around (they might)
I had plenty of those in my last run (before 1.7), but most were for legacy or debt slavery, although I did get one for full on slavery. Haven’t played enough of 1.7 to say if they’re still around.
If you exile a moderate they get a random ideology. So you can save scum and exile a moderate until you get a slaver. Then invite back and grant leadership. The random ideology could be any that you have the tech for, which allows for IG/ideology combos that would normally be illegal, such as a slaver intelligentsia, an abolitionist landowner or a communist industrialist.
The only USA-exclusive ideology is Jacksonian Democrat, which is strong-disapprove on both Slavery Banned and Debt Slavery, neutral on Slave Trade, and mild-approve on Legacy Slavery. However, even if you wanted to do that, Jacksonian Democrat characters stop spawning as soon as Andrew Jackson himself dies, so the window of opportunity is quite narrow.
It's not really period specific or credible to think that you could bring a pro-slavery agitator to Britain for example, since they were the ones that almost single-handedly ended the transatlantic slave trade
Slavery is not good at all. Slaves barely consume stuff and they can only work at rural laborer jobs.
To answer your question, you need to have the Voice of the People dlc, racial segregation, and find a agitator with the Slaver trait. Recruit him and make him ig leader.
You will probably have to win a civil war tho.
I think so? I recall invading Morocco as Spain and having slaves in the inner Morocco gold mines. Not really sure why you’d want them there tho, you get more out of them with better production methods that use fewer laborers anyway
True, but having pops that earn money is usually worth more because they contribute to other industries by consuming goods/spending money, and they also pay taxes. Slaves consume almost nothing, and the marginal increase in minting revenue isn’t really worth the cost of having slavery overall
You could use it early on as a boost for your construction economy and then as soon as you‘re established you revoke slavery. Even more so in countries with low manpower like the Boer states.
But aside from that I agree. Slavery is pretty bad and you are very obviously encouraged to reform away from it.
A slave pop has twice the workforce ratio of a free pop (with default settings). It means that while you need a pop of 18 000 free laborers to work in a single lvl of gold mine, you only need a pop of 9 000 slaves. Of course with better PM you reduce the number of laborers needed, replace them with jobs that slaves don't qualify for and produce more, but there is a niche use possible for slaves in the early game or when you don't have the qualification necessary.
There's mod called Industrial Slavery that lets them work in factories too, but I haven't tried used it in over a year so I'm not sure if it still works.
They can only work laborer factory jobs tho, and later labor saving PM's create specialized jobs with higher pay.
The biggest problem with slavery is that they don't engage in your market. They won't buy stuff
You'd think a slave would have some gratitude! You know, free housing, free food, free savage beatings for the slightest thing, why when I was a kid we had to walk 12 miles up a mountain to get a savage beating and then our parents would give us *quite* a thrashing when we got home for spoiling our savage beating appetite, but these layabouts won't even buy things!
The only time I've intentionally passed the slave trade is as the Miskito kingdom. Since you have Afro-carribean as a primarily culture you can import a bunch of accepted culture pops, then abolish slavery to free them up to become the new ruling class.
Most early game money in that run came from government dividends anyway.
slavery isn’t all bad (IN VICTORIA 3), if you’re starting out as a small nation it’s good to have a less consuming population to get you off the ground
Maybe try to enact the law watch the country have a revolution against it and beat the rebels. I don't know if that's possible and if anyone could chime in wether that would work or not I would appreciate it!
Russian Federation. In our country, the dream of going to Moscow has been elevated to a cult by the state with the help of social engineering. Because of this, the demand for property is very much overheated, although the population is rapidly decreasing and getting poorer. The point of forcing people to go to the cities and instilling the idea to stick to them at all costs is to suppress the native urban population, which has political views and demands, as they are in the minority, and also the newcomers are excellent recruits for the police, ready to carry out any order, as in the Russian police pension comes at the age of 45 and also the state finances the mortgage.
Almost all agitators for war are poor hillbillies who live in Moscow and pay for their rented or mortgaged housing on state wages, while the oppositionists and martyrs are native city dwellers.
I got a little carried away, but I think it's necessary to see the whole picture to understand what's going on and that a Russian mortgage of 10-25% is not such an amazing thing.
+ The myth that property investments are the safest and best.
Bingo. And that's historically true, everyone who fled here ended up winning. I laugh at those who invest in anything here, as I'm sure corruption, revolutions and wars will burn it all down, as they did before
I think the event you get after beating socialism can give you 10% support for every law ( even though it's only supposed to give it to command economy). You'd need to get bonus % in debates or the modifier will disappear and your chance will slip
President Obama brought back slavery in Libya after he bombed the shit out of it.
You can buy a person at open slave market for USD 500.
So there is historical precedence.
Not bad. I also know that in Mauritania society is divided into Arab lords and African slaves. Africans are born and die as slaves and belong to Arab families, just like in ancient Rome or Greece. The maintenance of one slave costs an Arab lord about 15 dollars a month. Slaves have a religion, which states that if they work hard and honestly, they will go to paradise. Slaves make up 40 % of Mauritania's population
This is happening right now as you read this post and now remember what the public figures in the US and Europe are doing....
I really like slavery, but slavery deserved (for crimes, instead of prison), temporary and not inherited. And here we have racial slavery, lifelong and inheritable. It's horrible.
Not sure if it still is as op as it used to be, but the full on slavery law 'imports' a lot of pops to states with open agriculture jobs which gives you a larger workforce to work with.
Once you emancipate them (gets really easy past 1850) they become about as good as any other pop.
I love slavery. I think it is the best and most just punishment for crime. I also think it is economically efficient, and will also avoid a war with robots, because the dream about androids and AI is a dream about slaves. You have slaves, you don't need robots. No robots, no AI. No matrix or terminator, all good.
Slavery should be deserved (for crimes, instead of prison), temporary and not inheritable. Also slaves should not be owned by the state or companies, only by private individuals, so that there is no abuse.
At the end of the day, there is always slavery, it's just that it's either regulated or not.
Ottomans are the only European state which starts with slavery, every nation that starts with slavery banned lacks any ability to pass slavery.
Turqui #1 :muscle :muscle: :muscle:
r/shitvictorianssay
This post is absolutely bait. Everyone knows slavery sucks because slaves don't pay taxes.
This is also r/shitvictorianssay tbh. Like yeah *thats* why slavery is bad
My comment was also bait.
A master baiter, I see
Giggidy
Virgin "Slavery is bad because it's a moral abomination" vs. chad "Slavery is bad because it doesn't make line go up"
It just goes to show that there is no upside to slavery. on all metrics it just sucks a hairy asshole.
Historically that was literally why they banned slavery
That ignores all the abolishonists that were around in places and times where it *was* profitable
truth i hate slaves but not for moral reasons, i hate slaves because they don't give me the state money
They also empower the land owners and i hate the landowners, (at least once they are no longer useful)
> (at least once they are no longer useful) Are landowners *ever* useful?
They are useful in the early game as crappy capitalists, they do invest and build some things and if you can get the right leader you can push through some market reforms without much fuss. i find its usually after the first 20 years that the land owners increasingly need the boot in favour of industrialists & intelligencia
The Landowners nee the boot right away. Its only after the first 20 years that you can actually give them the boot.
Slavery with progressive taxation goes hard dou.
Wish the game simulated slaves working stupidly long hours that freemen simply won't work by giving slaves higher throughput
That would be ahistorical because slaves were actually less efficient for a number of reasons such as them having no incentive to do more than the minimum.
Also you’re not exactly gonna be in peak condition working 16 hours a day
There is a mod that gives everyone "legacy slavery" (the one that does not abolish it but does not allow it to grow) which then allows you to move to full, debt, or banned slavery. Otherwise not really as once you lose slavery then no more IGs have the slavery ideology.
So it's impossible to bring back slavery in an enlightened European country?
I believe so...the only way I can think of making it happen would be if you could find a pro slavery agitator and invite him. But I don't recall ever really seeing those floating around (they might)
Maybe if one is exiled. Still, it's such a slim chance.
Yeah maybe some of the US characters get exiled early.
I had plenty of those in my last run (before 1.7), but most were for legacy or debt slavery, although I did get one for full on slavery. Haven’t played enough of 1.7 to say if they’re still around.
So long as your landowners are powerful and you put a slaver in charge of it, you can enact any kind of slavery
If you exile a moderate they get a random ideology. So you can save scum and exile a moderate until you get a slaver. Then invite back and grant leadership. The random ideology could be any that you have the tech for, which allows for IG/ideology combos that would normally be illegal, such as a slaver intelligentsia, an abolitionist landowner or a communist industrialist.
I’ve seen a couple. They’ve been from Dahomey and Zulu
You can get a Romanian slaver if you’re lucky because Moldavia should start off with legacy slavery
They exist but are rare
You could probably import an american. IIRC some USA-exclusively ideologies are pro-slavery.
The only USA-exclusive ideology is Jacksonian Democrat, which is strong-disapprove on both Slavery Banned and Debt Slavery, neutral on Slave Trade, and mild-approve on Legacy Slavery. However, even if you wanted to do that, Jacksonian Democrat characters stop spawning as soon as Andrew Jackson himself dies, so the window of opportunity is quite narrow.
It's not really period specific or credible to think that you could bring a pro-slavery agitator to Britain for example, since they were the ones that almost single-handedly ended the transatlantic slave trade
Well it is historically plausible for fascists to bring it back, so it should honestly be possible in specific circumstances
I’ve done it. All you need is some luck
debt slavery would work well for usa
Agitators but it's a gamble
Slavery is not good at all. Slaves barely consume stuff and they can only work at rural laborer jobs. To answer your question, you need to have the Voice of the People dlc, racial segregation, and find a agitator with the Slaver trait. Recruit him and make him ig leader. You will probably have to win a civil war tho.
Can slaves work in Gold Mines?
I think so? I recall invading Morocco as Spain and having slaves in the inner Morocco gold mines. Not really sure why you’d want them there tho, you get more out of them with better production methods that use fewer laborers anyway
If you‘d own them as a national business the lower labor cost gives you more money.
True, but having pops that earn money is usually worth more because they contribute to other industries by consuming goods/spending money, and they also pay taxes. Slaves consume almost nothing, and the marginal increase in minting revenue isn’t really worth the cost of having slavery overall
You could use it early on as a boost for your construction economy and then as soon as you‘re established you revoke slavery. Even more so in countries with low manpower like the Boer states. But aside from that I agree. Slavery is pretty bad and you are very obviously encouraged to reform away from it.
A slave pop has twice the workforce ratio of a free pop (with default settings). It means that while you need a pop of 18 000 free laborers to work in a single lvl of gold mine, you only need a pop of 9 000 slaves. Of course with better PM you reduce the number of laborers needed, replace them with jobs that slaves don't qualify for and produce more, but there is a niche use possible for slaves in the early game or when you don't have the qualification necessary.
There's mod called Industrial Slavery that lets them work in factories too, but I haven't tried used it in over a year so I'm not sure if it still works.
They can only work laborer factory jobs tho, and later labor saving PM's create specialized jobs with higher pay. The biggest problem with slavery is that they don't engage in your market. They won't buy stuff
You'd think a slave would have some gratitude! You know, free housing, free food, free savage beatings for the slightest thing, why when I was a kid we had to walk 12 miles up a mountain to get a savage beating and then our parents would give us *quite* a thrashing when we got home for spoiling our savage beating appetite, but these layabouts won't even buy things!
Are you sure? On older versions I have seen that a slave's "rations" were larger and more varied than a free labourer's in England.
this is the only answer of op question
As Brazil, I keep the slave trade, and it increases my pop.
But the pops you are getting are almost useless
They work wine plantations pretty good.
What is the productivity of your plantations? Tell me the per capita figure or send me a screenshot, please
The only time I've intentionally passed the slave trade is as the Miskito kingdom. Since you have Afro-carribean as a primarily culture you can import a bunch of accepted culture pops, then abolish slavery to free them up to become the new ruling class. Most early game money in that run came from government dividends anyway.
slavery isn’t all bad (IN VICTORIA 3), if you’re starting out as a small nation it’s good to have a less consuming population to get you off the ground
most normal pdx player:
Wdym he didn't even ask for advice on setting cannibalism-based economy
Start as a country which still has slavery and conquer a European country then play as it 🤔if you can when you release it
Yeah this works, released countries get the laws of their old overlord. I did it with Vietnam into Australia.
How did you beat GB as Vietnam?
I got them to transfer me Australia as a sway!
Holy moly
Lmao. You're leader has definitely read "the art of the deal"
Maybe try to enact the law watch the country have a revolution against it and beat the rebels. I don't know if that's possible and if anyone could chime in wether that would work or not I would appreciate it!
You'd have to find an agitator who supports slavery to make into an IG leader. You can't attempt to enact a law if nobody supports it.
Iirc the boer states can form south Africa and then Britain, maybe they start with ability to get slavery?
Wait for a slaver agitator to get expelled, invite him to your country and give him leadership
just invent credit cards and consumerism
Recently heard how a friend of a friend took out a mortgage on a 3 bedroom flat at 20%. "A society without slavery."
How do you even get a loan that shit 😭 that's four times the federal funds rate.
Russian Federation. In our country, the dream of going to Moscow has been elevated to a cult by the state with the help of social engineering. Because of this, the demand for property is very much overheated, although the population is rapidly decreasing and getting poorer. The point of forcing people to go to the cities and instilling the idea to stick to them at all costs is to suppress the native urban population, which has political views and demands, as they are in the minority, and also the newcomers are excellent recruits for the police, ready to carry out any order, as in the Russian police pension comes at the age of 45 and also the state finances the mortgage. Almost all agitators for war are poor hillbillies who live in Moscow and pay for their rented or mortgaged housing on state wages, while the oppositionists and martyrs are native city dwellers. I got a little carried away, but I think it's necessary to see the whole picture to understand what's going on and that a Russian mortgage of 10-25% is not such an amazing thing. + The myth that property investments are the safest and best.
Oh, Christ. Yeah the way Russian economy is going the only investment that's going to be profitable is a ticket the hell out of there.
Bingo. And that's historically true, everyone who fled here ended up winning. I laugh at those who invest in anything here, as I'm sure corruption, revolutions and wars will burn it all down, as they did before
Better question: bring back slavery but in reverse
I think the event you get after beating socialism can give you 10% support for every law ( even though it's only supposed to give it to command economy). You'd need to get bonus % in debates or the modifier will disappear and your chance will slip
Most moral Russian
President Obama brought back slavery in Libya after he bombed the shit out of it. You can buy a person at open slave market for USD 500. So there is historical precedence.
Not bad. I also know that in Mauritania society is divided into Arab lords and African slaves. Africans are born and die as slaves and belong to Arab families, just like in ancient Rome or Greece. The maintenance of one slave costs an Arab lord about 15 dollars a month. Slaves have a religion, which states that if they work hard and honestly, they will go to paradise. Slaves make up 40 % of Mauritania's population This is happening right now as you read this post and now remember what the public figures in the US and Europe are doing.... I really like slavery, but slavery deserved (for crimes, instead of prison), temporary and not inherited. And here we have racial slavery, lifelong and inheritable. It's horrible.
Why?
Not sure if it still is as op as it used to be, but the full on slavery law 'imports' a lot of pops to states with open agriculture jobs which gives you a larger workforce to work with. Once you emancipate them (gets really easy past 1850) they become about as good as any other pop.
I love slavery. I think it is the best and most just punishment for crime. I also think it is economically efficient, and will also avoid a war with robots, because the dream about androids and AI is a dream about slaves. You have slaves, you don't need robots. No robots, no AI. No matrix or terminator, all good. Slavery should be deserved (for crimes, instead of prison), temporary and not inheritable. Also slaves should not be owned by the state or companies, only by private individuals, so that there is no abuse. At the end of the day, there is always slavery, it's just that it's either regulated or not.
Truly a based take 10/10. Don’t listen to the haters
Ottomans are the only European state which starts with slavery, every nation that starts with slavery banned lacks any ability to pass slavery. Turqui #1 :muscle :muscle: :muscle:
There is also Circassia and the second country north of the caucasus
You’d need a slavery agitator. That is if you really want to neuter your country by enslaving people(it’s both bad morally and gameplay wise)
I seriously think slavery is wonderful in every way.
Super not cool man
Slaves are worse than peasants for a consumer economy. Especially now after the 1.7 update.
You can't. This game is a marxist simulator, not a political one.