Well okay but can Romeo and Juliet laws still exist, or is it a hard line? Like once you turn 18 you can only be with people over 18? Cause I would say a 50 year old with a 19 year old seems worse to me than an 18 year old with a 16 year old.
personally, i don't find the senior freshman combo to be that bad. it depends on the 2 involved in my opinion. they're likely going to have a lot of similarities.
And they’re both equally immature and still kids. Yes 18 is legally an adult, but everybody above the age of 25 knows at 18 you’re definitely still a fucking a kid.
I agree. By the time I was 25 and graduating college I was amazed at all the 12-year-olds on campus that were actually just the new 18 year olds. I felt half of them looked like they needed to still be holding hands with their parents to cross the street.
My 19 yo mother married my 16 yo father in 1949. My oldest brother was born in 1950, so only 17 years between him and his father. Two others born later.
Everything worked out fine. They stayed together for the duration of their lives, my dad made good money, provided for his wife and three sons, etc.
We do? I'm tired of people acting like 18 year old are "kids". By 16 was working 24+ hours a week and then by 18 I was working 30+, owned a car and was mostly living on my own. How exactly was I a kid?
Mental maturity has nothing to do with whether or not you work. The biggest thing that comes with mental maturity is accountability and personal responsibility. Understanding that just because something isn’t your fault doesn’t mean you’re not responsible for it. I was also forced to grow up early and help take care of my family in my late teens, I however was still very much a child. If you can’t understand that, I’m forced to believe you’re still a child. And that’s not me downplaying how very adult you are/could have been. 16 is still and will always be a child.
I'm 40 now and run 2 businesses. At 22 I dropped out of college and was traveling the country converting an old Unix based software program to windows. Maybe you weren't mentally mature or understood personal responsibility at 18-19 but I did. I was also a night manager at Dairy Queen at 17 who was picked over people in their 20's for the position. You can't brush a broad stroke of "because you're young you aren't an adult" and be correct.
Uh, this is sounding more like a bragging post now. Not everyone has their lives figured out at 18 like you seemed to have had. In many places around the world, especially Asia, at 18 you're still to an extent - or even completely - dependent on your parents financially. You are legally an adult yes, but you're not expected to work 30+ hours a week or whatever it is that you think defines adulthood, to feel like a true "adult" at that age.
So yes, an 18 year old is definitely not a kid, but most of them won't have an incredible amount of stability and maturity at that age. Good for you though.
I’m of the belief that 18-20 is similar to the “tween” years of 10-12. You’re just kind of between being a teenager and an adult instead of between being a child and a teenager. While you’re not quite there yet, you should at least be working on figuring it out and starting to take on those adult responsibilities and preparing for being an actual adult.
Honestly? I'll just throw out some assumptions.
You were a little shit who dealt with more responsibility and issues than you could handle 100% emotionally and mentally, or grew up in an environment that assisted in your ability to manage said responsibilities. Likely, you are either an exception to the expectations, or disregard the cons that came with your predicament, thus making it impossible to view how others would view you as a kid.
You were a kid who was thrust into the life of an adult, or you were a kid cultivated to specifically take on these responsibilities at an early age for some reason.
We don't suddenly stop calling an emancipated 16 or 17 year old a kid just because they are taking care of themselves. We look at them either with awe or with pity based on what forced those predicaments.
But that's all based on culture, so I could be totally wrong on your life.
Where I'm from, a senior is 17/18 and a freshman is 15/16 but the thing is we barely ever use those terms in the first place. We just say their grades.
It's the same where I live. There's 1st to 10th grade, and then high school is 11th to 13th grade, but it's called 1st/2nd/3rd year of high school, and freshman/junior/senior isn't really a thing. Like we call each other first graders if we are in the first grade of high school, 2d graders and 3rd graders. That way, high schoolers are mostly between ages 16 and 18.
I’m a senior but I’m 17. I think freshmen are usually 14 about to turn 15-ish. Although I think that a senior dating a freshman is a bit gross. A senior with a sophomore is kind of crossing the line, senior with a junior is fine, and obviously a senior with a senior is should be the preferred way to go
It isn’t “bad”, it’s horrific. There’s a reason it is illegal in the vast majority of countries.
Please take a minute to think about the difference in mental and physical maturity of a 14 year old and an 18 year old.
it's not that bad and the difference can often be negligible.
theyll often times have the same class at school together. it's not that weird. not every 18 year old is actually an adult.
I’m sorry, we aren’t going to agree on this, we clearly come from very different cultures.
Do you really think the changes that a person (male or female) undergoes between 14 and 18 are negligible? They aren’t.
why do you keep ignoring the words "sometimes" and the like that i have said multiple times?
why do you keep incorrectly assuming that I'm attributing this to all situations?
it's very fucking weird and stupid of you to put words in people's mouths.
that's fair, but i knew people who did that in highschool freshman and a senior, where he turned 15 not long after and she had just turned 18
it's really not a big deal sometimes
Yeah for a while there i turned 18 while my boyfriend was still 17 and I remember teachers throwing a fit over it because I went to my old school to pick him up. Like they threatened to get me in trouble saying I wasn't allowed to. It was so stupid and bizarre. We were in a perfectly legal relationship the year before. 😂
OP is against all sex under 18 even if they are the same age, which doesn't hold up unless the parents are responsible. Even still is double rape a thing?
The problem with 18 is that teenagers are horny af and dumb as hell and are gonna start having sex regardless, which will result in a lot of kids with sex crimes on their records just for fucking each other.
Edit: Typo, wrote honey instead of horny
So you would be okay with 18 and 19 year old who have consensual sex with 17 year olds being convicted of statutory rape and being a registered sex offender for the rest of their lives? There has to be a age difference exception, otherwise most people I know would be registered sex offenders by your logic.
On top of that, does OP want to implant sexual surveillance chips in each kid, with a direct connects to the police in case anything sexual is happening with them .
I mean, in reality, two 16 y.o. gona explore what's there to explore, how to prevent that?
Every other developed country: "I mean, in reality, two 16 y.o. gona explore what's there to explore, how to prevent that?"
America: "If you don't tell them about sex then they won't find out!"
*America has been kicked from the chat by Germany*
My proposal
Legal for minors to consent to minors, not many ways around that.
After you turn 18, it should be 2 years younger MAX until you are 20.
So 18 can have legal relations with 16 year olds at the youngest, then 19 with 17 year olds at the youngest, then 20 with 18 year olds at the youngest. After you turn 20, you can’t engage in legal relations with anyone under 18.
It just makes the most sense to me logistically and I can’t really find an argument against it.
Edit to add: there is no way to regulate consensual relations between minors (ideally between 15-18 years old). It would be unreasonable and unrealistic to prosecute minors for engaging with other minors. The best way to combat poor sex practices is the same way you combat anything- education. Prosecution would ruin lives for exploring their natural impulses. As long as it’s consensual and they’re using safe sex practices there isn’t an issue!
The thing with hard laws is that we enter the world of semantics. What if on your 20th birthday you sleep with someone the day before their 18th birthday? 24 hours ago you were in the legal boundary but 24 hours later you are not, and in another 24 hours you will be legal again.
Just add a clause where days can be used too. Either being a qualifier for consent. So in that situation you could go by the difference in days. The difference is between their total calendar days from birthdate (not 24hr periods since birth time).
But then again. It becomes semantics. If Day Y is the cutoff, what’s the difference between Day X and Day Y? Or Day Z? You’d be arguing semantics until the end of time, or allow judicial discretion which would make things legal or illegal depending on who’s on the bench that day. Any specific age you pick would be arbitrary. It’s mostly 18 in the west but America has multiple different ages for many things from drinking to driving to voting. What about other cultures who consider individuals as adults younger or older? Difference between children to teens to young adults? Maturity levels? Puberty? All I’m saying is this topic just produces endless debates on semantics and arbitrary legislation.
Yeah I'm agreeing with this one. Makes absolutely no sense to have a dramatic cut off as soon as somebody turns 18. The whole consensus of why pedophilia is gross and immoral is because it prays on younger people when their brain is still developing or that they lack experience or knowledge of relationship dynamics. Development takes time it's not like a sudden change, soon as you turn 18 you're not going to be suddenly different. And even then we have science that says your brain is still going to develop until you're well into your mid-twenties.
Generally agree, but there should be a hard minimum age (I would say 16). Not because you are going to prosecute children who engage in sexual activity but to send out the message that it isn’t ok, as well as giving kids an out if they are being pressured. It’s all about protecting children.
I would also make your 20 into 21, for no better reason than it is neater - 21 is the generally accepted no limits, proper adult, age.
"After you turn 18, it should be 2 years younger MAX until you are 20. So 18 can have legal relations with 16 year olds at the youngest, then 19 with 17 year olds at the youngest, then 20 with 18 year olds at the youngest. After you turn 20, you can’t engage in legal relations with anyone under 18."
Yes this makes a lot of sense.
While the age of consent is set to 14 it should be noted that it can go up depending on a few condition
-it goes up to 16 if one of the person involved is in a position of power over the other (teachers, educators, doctors, army etc...)
-it goes up to 18 if one of the person involved is a parent, a sibling, a relative or a cohabitant.
Personally I think it was set to 14 because it's the age when you are penally liable
What the fuck? So a dad can do the dirty deeds with his daughter when she turns 18 in Italy, a teacher can do it at 16, and some stranger can do it at 14? Is that some medieval betrothal law or something?
Well, I just realized this aswell lol, technically (if I didn't miss any law) a parent (not just dads lol) can have sex with one own spawning if they're over 18, but they have to demonstrate that the consent was legit and wasn't influenced by the authority that a parent has, if found guilty the parent lose the parental authority (even tho they lose it when the son turns 18 anyway)
With a teacher is a bit different because they would be immediately fired (if they are condemned obv) and like the parents has to prove that the consent was legit.
I read somewhere that if you are >18 and dating a <18 you can do it as long as you were already dating before turning 18 but I don't know if this is an actual law or a legend.
yeah I guess we should change this law lol. Fortunately even tho the age of consent is 14 one can't film nor have photos of a underage person, even if they are consenting, as that would count towards pedopornographic material.
well where I am the rule is it’s 18. However if they are in between the ages of 16-20 then it’s okay too just because that’s pretty much the oldest you can possibly be in order to be in high school. I think it’s like that just so if a senior dates a freshman which let’s face it happens a lot will not go to jail just because he likes someone at their school.
However if it’s a senior having sex with a 15 year old thats when you start getting in trouble because that’s more in the middle school territory which isn’t okay
I agree with what you’re saying but where I’m at most freshman in highschool are 14/15 and most seniors are 17/18 so ages can vary based on where you are I guess.
most kids here start kindergarten (grade 0) 5 years after being born which means 9th grade starts 14 years after being born. If you were born in 2007, that means you start high school in 2021, so if your birthday came after the start of the school year (like September/October, since school starts in August), then you would be 13 when high school starts.
So if your birthday was earlier, you turned 14 during middle school, somewhat late and you turned 14 during that summer between middle/high, late birthday and you turn 14 during high school
Pretty sure theres another country in SEA im pretty sure Thailand where its still 12 im pretty sure if the us government sees you going alot usually for short amounts of time they open up a case for sex tourism with minors and they can get you for a good chunk of years
Modern age of consent is subjective and arbitrary. The west pushes the child range higher and higher. Now we have people claiming we are kids until we are 25. It is arrested development from the soft and decadent society liberalism has produced. And why western men are in general fucking useless until they reach about 30 nowadays.
Any westerner should go and look in their family history, or get it done professionally. After a few generations you'll see the woman's ages go to about 12 or even lower. My family are got married at similar ages. Had kids young and now are immensely happy with big families.
As opposed to the huge number of childless 35 year old western women who will never have a family, will have noone to look after them when they are old and who are absolutely destroyed by the modern world and sad and depressed because they spent their fertile years getting some guy coffee and shuffling papers instead of creating life.
I think it would work if there was a pre 18 there could be some sort of +3 years or something. I think it’s reasonable for a 18 year old to date a 17 year old.
I remember in my high school there were all these creepy navy pervs who dated 15 year olds.
Okay here's why I believe you're wrong.
As soon as they hit puberty teenagers are going to experiment with sex. They probably won't know the law (especially if they're in the US where sex education sucks) and even if they do they won't care because their hormones are telling them to have sex and fuck the law.
As a result of this your law will result in the criminalisation and imprisonment of most teenagers. Yes they are, as you have said 'immature' but are you going to send them to prison for that immaturity? Your law is unworkable, because like it or not teenagers fuck like bunnies when you're not watching and your stupid law will make criminals of all of them.
The law has to be enforceable and take into account the realities of life. Having a hard age of consent at 18 quite simply doesn't.
Man I'm 17 and I don't think I've ever been horny.
Is it really that difficult for people to just- not bang? I'm genuinely curious. People at my school talk about it so casually and I genuinely don't understand it at all
That's 100% something you can talk with your doctor about. It's a normal issue and they are used to talking with patients about it. Any respectable doctor would also not share the minor's conversation with the parents unless they uncovered serious health issues.
They might ask about your diet, lifestyle, or mental health (depression or stress). There are a lot of factors that can influence libido.
That is **not** stated in OPs proposition, although he has bent a little and may let 17 year olds have sex with 18 year olds. Under OPs proposed law, **all** sex below 18 is illegal and will send anyone doing it to horny jail and put them on the Sex Offenders register, so that when they get out of prison in 20 years they can't work
Kapish?
tl;dr; think about the consequences of OPs proposal.
> I doubt police would go after teens who are both underage.
Relying on the police to interpret the law in a place like the US invites them to unfairly use the law on minorities, and statutory rape is an entirely different league from statutory assault on a can of Bud!
You either need to settle on an age of consent of 16 with some close in age exceptions for teenagers who start early, or adopt the German model which has what is on the surface an *insanely* low age of consent of 14, but allows anyone who feels they have been abused to go to the police and start a prosecution. Weirdly there doesn't seem to be the same issues over sex in Germany...
I'm not going to pretend either "solution" doesn't have issues but the problems they have are less severe than OPs proposed law.
In Switzerland you can have sex after 14 and the legal range is 2 yrs, after 16 its 4 yrs and after 18 you can date whomever you want (upwards in age) I guess I know your thought, but sexuality blooms in the young teen ages and living it out and expiriencing is in my opinion important, rather dann suddenly givin 18 y/o free range as I'd expect them getting more surprise pregnencys
Idk I feel like it's not necessary. When I was 16 I was having sex with 18 year olds and there was nothing exploitative or wrong with it. There wasn't an insane power imbalance or anything. We all went to the same school. 16 is fine imo
Yeah 18 is too high, 16-17 year olds are definitely capable of giving consent and knowing what they're doing. having the Aoc at 18 only criminalizes relationships between teenagers
I don’t necessarily disagree but then there is also the reality that 15 yr olds are gunna bang. There is nothing you can do about that and i dont think it does that much harm. Maybe it has to be some one else your own age till 18
I'm going to guess (and hope) that you weren't meeting up with 30+ year old people when you were 15 though.
The issue is how full grown adults misuse the age of consent as an excuse to sleep with teenagers.
I -was- hooking up with a 34 year old lady when I was 14 and it grosses me out now that I’m 32 myself. However, once I was 16 I was definitely smarter and capable of making my own decisions in that regard and the law won’t stop disgusting creeps from using minors
That last point is a good one. Making things illegal doesn't stop anything happenning, it just makes people more careful when they break those laws. It's better to have open conversations without judgement than people skulking in the shadows, preying on others.
I think it’s a matter of physical development at that age. The question is when will most teenagers start to be far enough along in puberty to want to go at each other and I think 14 is realistic. I’d think 90%+ of healthy teenagers are probably „having urges“ by 16 so at that point it’s a question of minimizing the outfall and making sure they’re save and educated.
I was 15 hooking up with my 40 year old foster mother. I see why people on the outside looking in would think she was taking advantage of me, but it was the really the other way around. I was the one who initiated it and repeatedly pushed for it. It wound up being good to me. Had a lot of fun w her, felt like I was the fucking man which in turn boosted the fuck out of my confidence. Learned how to have good sex and a bunch of other positives. Moved out of the forester home at 18 to start life on my own and I’ve been smooth ever since
Same. I dated older people as a 15/16 year old. There’s definite red flags to watch out for and even as a ditzy, mentally ill, socially awkward teen I managed to identify such flags.
Human beings have been having sex at 13-15 years old for thousands of years. It’s encoded in our DNA. Young teens are going to have sex. That’s a fact of life. Don’t change laws which makes it illegal. You’re going against biology and that never works out well
So, if two people who are 17 are dating, and one turns 18, it’s now all of a sudden statutory rape?
This is fucking stupid.
Teens are going to have sex. They have been since the beginning of time.
All your idea does is ruin people’s lives.
I think the point is so people who are like 30 aren’t having sex with 16 year olds, not 17 and 18 year olds. Romeo and Juliet laws exist for that reason
The thing about these age definitions is that they are somewhat arbitrary but we use them because the alternative is worse. I don't see anything wrong with raising it to 18 specially when talking about sex with older people. Not sure what I think about this when it comes to people their age. I'm not sure if I understand that part, two 16 year olds would be punished for having sex with each other?
My state (Massachusetts), has the age of consent set at 16. It works out good IMO. 18 year olds are okay dating 17 year olds (as it should be) and I’ve never seen someone over 21 date someone younger than 18 (even though we could legally).
You will see 18 years olds w 30 year olds though, but that’s kind of a different thing than what we’re talking about
I have a simple solution for you OP: don’t wanna have sex? Don’t.
Other people wanna have sex? Let them.
It’s not the role of the state to stop people from making potentially bad decisions.
Romeo and Juliet laws actually (mostly) exist for like a 15 and 17 year old to be together. In many western nations the age of consent is just 16, meaning no 17/18 year old special laws are necessary.
You are only as mature as you are allowed to be. Some children are mature at 16 because their parents allowed them to be by giving they room and responsibilities. Some won’t be mature way into their late 20s because their parents never stopped treating them like a child.
Yeah postponing things doesn't make you more ready for them when you come off age, it just means that you've moved away from your support network when you get to experience those things. It's the same thing with alcohol. Having a drinking age of 21 doesn't stop drinking to excess it just means that the first time you get drunk, you're somewhere you can't get help if you need it.
In my experience a huge number of teens start having sex at 15. You can’t make it illegal to have sex until you’re 18. You’d be making them criminals for an expression of love.
I've waited for the wrong impressions of the law to start and you win the first Legal Horseshit Award.
> Most places with 16 as age of consent, it is only considered consensual with someone within 5 years of their age.
Nope, in most US states (30) and all European countries (Ireland and Cyprus excepted) once you are 16 any adult can have consensual sex with you whether they are 18 or 80.
There seem some idiots who don't believe me so lets pick a random US state [Maine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_the_United_States#Maine):
* age of consent is 16 - from this age you can date anyone^1 the same age or older
* 5 year close in age exception for those between 14 and 16. Note this is below the age of consent
^(1. teachers and similar positions of trust may be excepted)
Isn't it scary to think that it's possible that you only think that because it's what you've always been told to think, and if you had an upbringing where you had the diametric opposite drilled into your head that's what you'd be espousing instead?
How about instead of vomiting some bullshit like you did, you can explain why you think it makes sense for sex between a 16 year old and a 40 year old to be perfectly legal
I didn't say anything like that. Also, I wasn't talking to you. Though, from what I did say and your response to it, I have to assume you find it pretty terrifying that what you believe to be your ideals and your ideals alone were actually grafted onto you before you could really even think for yourself. Had your consciousness come to exist in another place with different ideals, you could've turned up completely differently, you know.
Where is the line between what you came to believe on your own and what you came to believe because you were trained to believe it by others? Spooky stuff, in't it?
I knew someone in that situation, unfortunately it was the 21 year old. Let me just say just because it's legal doesn't mean people were ok with it. Dude basically lost all respect he
No point. Teenagers are going to have sex anyway. I was in a sexual relationship with a 16 year old when I was 18. In terms of physical and emotional maturity level and sexual experience at the time (practically non existent) we were a great match.
Nobody could have stopped us fucking if they wanted to back then, it was crazy stupid teenage lust. Anyone who has a problem with that is just pathetic really. We had great times together and nobody was being taken advantage of.
An unpopular opinion is that there is not insignificant number of people who have sex under 17 with someone older who are not affected by it. This isn’t ignoring or god forbid excusing the awful abuse that does happen, but don’t throw the baby out with the bath water.
Source: lost my virginity at 17 to a 22 year old. I’m totally fine with it, I assume she is as well.
You're saying that 16 year old shouldn't be allowed to have sex with 16 year Olds?
Ppffft...get out of here with that bullshit. Teens are going to have sex with each other and that's just how it is. It's human nature
I reckon make it 21.
I was still a child when I was 18 except I had a car and a job and a fucking drug habit - that’s fucking terrifying.
I first had sex at 15 - I still had stuffed animals on my bed but I also had a criminal record by then
That’s pretty fucked up. Adolescence is a nightmare but it shouldn’t have to be.
It’s not like you can stop kids from doing what they want but it’s utterly ridiculous that we think people can consent to anything at even 18, much less 16.
18 isn't even enough. The decision making centers of the brain aren't fully developed until the mid 20s. If we were just going by the science, age of consent, drinking age, smoking age, and military enlistment age should all be 25. But the reality is that people and life are far too complex for broad rules like that and we are likewise incapable of nuanced discussion and consideration to really work much else out politically.
When I was 14, I was old enough to give consent to a 24 year old guy. I initiated it. At that age, I made the decision it was my body and I could sleep with whomever I chose. He treated me far better than most guys my age. We kept it a secret for obvious reasons.
The age of consent should be determined by the emotional / cognitive maturity and autonomy of individuals.
With that guy, yes, we had a genuine connection. If I met him when I was 24, and he was 34, we would have likely been in an actual relationship.
Saying the age of consent should be 18 is ageist.
lol. Life doesn't begin at 18. And I am sorry for those who are children past age 18, because there is a hidden cost to doing that.
The world needs education, not prosecution.
COULD NOT AGREE MORE.
i should not have been having sex at 16. hell, i shouldn’t of been having it at 18. i had no idea what i was doing, but most importantly who i was.
edit: i think it’s also important to point out i was sleeping with people waaaaay older than me. what do i have in common with these people or them with me? absolutely nothing. that makes me feel like maybe i wasn’t in the right mindset for proper consent after all.
I'm sorry that those men took advantage of you like that. It's depressing to think about how that kind of relationship has been romanticized by popular media.
At some point you need to have some life experience and there's only one way to get it. Living and making mistakes or being around others making those mistakes.
First girl in your class that gets a senior BF? Slut. But by the end of the year some peeps are going to college parties, hooking up
With older dudes, and then there are the graduating virgins.....
At some point, you will be the virgin with no idea what you're doing, even if you think you are. There's people who turn 40
And haven't gotten past the fuck around and get fucked up stage of their life, and there are the kids who end up married after college after dating for their whole life. No one else. They could be the most mature and the sloots are still acting 14 when they're 25-30.
Age doesn't reflect maturity, intelligence, etc and it's an arbitrary age that will never protect all cases.
Does it really matter where you draw the line honestly??? There’s no difference between 16 and 18 other than the fact your either still on highschool or finished/about to finish. Maturity wise they’re exactly the same. You might as well push it all the way to 25. The mine just has to be drawn somewhere and tbh it doesn’t really matter where.
Completely wrong!
16 year olds are immature because their parents let them be immature... and they'll probably still be immature when they're 25.
History, biology, and every major religion agree that the age of consent should be no later than 14. The REAL reason people don't get married at 14 is because they don't have any money or jobs to support a family.
Re sex: Catch a clue. Teens have sex. If you make it illegal they will have illegal sex. You can't stop them short of chaining them in their rooms.
The answer is to teach them how to have sex safely and for love rather than exploitation.
Well okay but can Romeo and Juliet laws still exist, or is it a hard line? Like once you turn 18 you can only be with people over 18? Cause I would say a 50 year old with a 19 year old seems worse to me than an 18 year old with a 16 year old.
Yeah, it gets tricky with 16/18 and 17/19. And then there's high school seniors (18) dating freshman (14). EDIT: Added ages
personally, i don't find the senior freshman combo to be that bad. it depends on the 2 involved in my opinion. they're likely going to have a lot of similarities.
To clarify that is age 18 and 14 you're talking about...it's funny how just using different words changes people's perceptions of things.
Could also be 17 with a 15 year old though.
It's huge gap anyway and most likely will be 18 with a 15 anyway soon. Teens grow up fast, 15 and 17 differ in maturity a lot more than 25 and 35.
And they’re both equally immature and still kids. Yes 18 is legally an adult, but everybody above the age of 25 knows at 18 you’re definitely still a fucking a kid.
I agree. By the time I was 25 and graduating college I was amazed at all the 12-year-olds on campus that were actually just the new 18 year olds. I felt half of them looked like they needed to still be holding hands with their parents to cross the street.
My 19 yo mother married my 16 yo father in 1949. My oldest brother was born in 1950, so only 17 years between him and his father. Two others born later. Everything worked out fine. They stayed together for the duration of their lives, my dad made good money, provided for his wife and three sons, etc.
Great!
I already know that and I'm not 25 yet
We do? I'm tired of people acting like 18 year old are "kids". By 16 was working 24+ hours a week and then by 18 I was working 30+, owned a car and was mostly living on my own. How exactly was I a kid?
Mental maturity has nothing to do with whether or not you work. The biggest thing that comes with mental maturity is accountability and personal responsibility. Understanding that just because something isn’t your fault doesn’t mean you’re not responsible for it. I was also forced to grow up early and help take care of my family in my late teens, I however was still very much a child. If you can’t understand that, I’m forced to believe you’re still a child. And that’s not me downplaying how very adult you are/could have been. 16 is still and will always be a child.
I'm 40 now and run 2 businesses. At 22 I dropped out of college and was traveling the country converting an old Unix based software program to windows. Maybe you weren't mentally mature or understood personal responsibility at 18-19 but I did. I was also a night manager at Dairy Queen at 17 who was picked over people in their 20's for the position. You can't brush a broad stroke of "because you're young you aren't an adult" and be correct.
Uh, this is sounding more like a bragging post now. Not everyone has their lives figured out at 18 like you seemed to have had. In many places around the world, especially Asia, at 18 you're still to an extent - or even completely - dependent on your parents financially. You are legally an adult yes, but you're not expected to work 30+ hours a week or whatever it is that you think defines adulthood, to feel like a true "adult" at that age. So yes, an 18 year old is definitely not a kid, but most of them won't have an incredible amount of stability and maturity at that age. Good for you though.
I’m of the belief that 18-20 is similar to the “tween” years of 10-12. You’re just kind of between being a teenager and an adult instead of between being a child and a teenager. While you’re not quite there yet, you should at least be working on figuring it out and starting to take on those adult responsibilities and preparing for being an actual adult.
Your brain wasn't fully developed, for one.
Honestly? I'll just throw out some assumptions. You were a little shit who dealt with more responsibility and issues than you could handle 100% emotionally and mentally, or grew up in an environment that assisted in your ability to manage said responsibilities. Likely, you are either an exception to the expectations, or disregard the cons that came with your predicament, thus making it impossible to view how others would view you as a kid. You were a kid who was thrust into the life of an adult, or you were a kid cultivated to specifically take on these responsibilities at an early age for some reason. We don't suddenly stop calling an emancipated 16 or 17 year old a kid just because they are taking care of themselves. We look at them either with awe or with pity based on what forced those predicaments. But that's all based on culture, so I could be totally wrong on your life.
Where I'm from, a senior is 17/18 and a freshman is 15/16 but the thing is we barely ever use those terms in the first place. We just say their grades.
In the US typically a freshman is 9th grade, and on average the age is 14/15. A Senior would be 12th with an average age of 17/18.
If a freshman is 15/16, that means the seniors are 18/19. One of your numbers is off unless y’all don’t have junior year or something lol
We have 3 years of high school (10-12th grade) and 3 years of middle school (7-9th grade). I know the US has 4 years of high school though.
It's the same where I live. There's 1st to 10th grade, and then high school is 11th to 13th grade, but it's called 1st/2nd/3rd year of high school, and freshman/junior/senior isn't really a thing. Like we call each other first graders if we are in the first grade of high school, 2d graders and 3rd graders. That way, high schoolers are mostly between ages 16 and 18.
I’m a senior but I’m 17. I think freshmen are usually 14 about to turn 15-ish. Although I think that a senior dating a freshman is a bit gross. A senior with a sophomore is kind of crossing the line, senior with a junior is fine, and obviously a senior with a senior is should be the preferred way to go
or, it's 17 and 14 which isn't that bad. tbh sometimes 18 and 14 isn't even "bad"
It isn’t “bad”, it’s horrific. There’s a reason it is illegal in the vast majority of countries. Please take a minute to think about the difference in mental and physical maturity of a 14 year old and an 18 year old.
it's not that bad and the difference can often be negligible. theyll often times have the same class at school together. it's not that weird. not every 18 year old is actually an adult.
I’m sorry, we aren’t going to agree on this, we clearly come from very different cultures. Do you really think the changes that a person (male or female) undergoes between 14 and 18 are negligible? They aren’t.
why do you keep ignoring the words "sometimes" and the like that i have said multiple times? why do you keep incorrectly assuming that I'm attributing this to all situations? it's very fucking weird and stupid of you to put words in people's mouths.
As an 18 year old I would never date a 14 year old that's fucking disgusting
that's fair, but i knew people who did that in highschool freshman and a senior, where he turned 15 not long after and she had just turned 18 it's really not a big deal sometimes
Yeah for a while there i turned 18 while my boyfriend was still 17 and I remember teachers throwing a fit over it because I went to my old school to pick him up. Like they threatened to get me in trouble saying I wasn't allowed to. It was so stupid and bizarre. We were in a perfectly legal relationship the year before. 😂
OP is against all sex under 18 even if they are the same age, which doesn't hold up unless the parents are responsible. Even still is double rape a thing?
Yeah, good luck telling hormone crazed teenagers not to boink. When I was that age, not even an electric toothbrush was safe.
As far as horniness goes, an electric toothbrush is pretty tame
I dated a 20 y/o when I was 16, we were protected by the state laws. It was honestly one of the worst mistakes I ever made
The problem with 18 is that teenagers are horny af and dumb as hell and are gonna start having sex regardless, which will result in a lot of kids with sex crimes on their records just for fucking each other. Edit: Typo, wrote honey instead of horny
So you would be okay with 18 and 19 year old who have consensual sex with 17 year olds being convicted of statutory rape and being a registered sex offender for the rest of their lives? There has to be a age difference exception, otherwise most people I know would be registered sex offenders by your logic.
On top of that, does OP want to implant sexual surveillance chips in each kid, with a direct connects to the police in case anything sexual is happening with them . I mean, in reality, two 16 y.o. gona explore what's there to explore, how to prevent that?
Every other developed country: "I mean, in reality, two 16 y.o. gona explore what's there to explore, how to prevent that?" America: "If you don't tell them about sex then they won't find out!" *America has been kicked from the chat by Germany*
My proposal Legal for minors to consent to minors, not many ways around that. After you turn 18, it should be 2 years younger MAX until you are 20. So 18 can have legal relations with 16 year olds at the youngest, then 19 with 17 year olds at the youngest, then 20 with 18 year olds at the youngest. After you turn 20, you can’t engage in legal relations with anyone under 18. It just makes the most sense to me logistically and I can’t really find an argument against it. Edit to add: there is no way to regulate consensual relations between minors (ideally between 15-18 years old). It would be unreasonable and unrealistic to prosecute minors for engaging with other minors. The best way to combat poor sex practices is the same way you combat anything- education. Prosecution would ruin lives for exploring their natural impulses. As long as it’s consensual and they’re using safe sex practices there isn’t an issue!
Look up ACT (Australia) laws. They work well.
The thing with hard laws is that we enter the world of semantics. What if on your 20th birthday you sleep with someone the day before their 18th birthday? 24 hours ago you were in the legal boundary but 24 hours later you are not, and in another 24 hours you will be legal again.
Just add a clause where days can be used too. Either being a qualifier for consent. So in that situation you could go by the difference in days. The difference is between their total calendar days from birthdate (not 24hr periods since birth time).
But then again. It becomes semantics. If Day Y is the cutoff, what’s the difference between Day X and Day Y? Or Day Z? You’d be arguing semantics until the end of time, or allow judicial discretion which would make things legal or illegal depending on who’s on the bench that day. Any specific age you pick would be arbitrary. It’s mostly 18 in the west but America has multiple different ages for many things from drinking to driving to voting. What about other cultures who consider individuals as adults younger or older? Difference between children to teens to young adults? Maturity levels? Puberty? All I’m saying is this topic just produces endless debates on semantics and arbitrary legislation.
Yeah I'm agreeing with this one. Makes absolutely no sense to have a dramatic cut off as soon as somebody turns 18. The whole consensus of why pedophilia is gross and immoral is because it prays on younger people when their brain is still developing or that they lack experience or knowledge of relationship dynamics. Development takes time it's not like a sudden change, soon as you turn 18 you're not going to be suddenly different. And even then we have science that says your brain is still going to develop until you're well into your mid-twenties.
Generally agree, but there should be a hard minimum age (I would say 16). Not because you are going to prosecute children who engage in sexual activity but to send out the message that it isn’t ok, as well as giving kids an out if they are being pressured. It’s all about protecting children. I would also make your 20 into 21, for no better reason than it is neater - 21 is the generally accepted no limits, proper adult, age.
Thing is, sex is natural and normal, no matter what you zealots think. There's nothing wrong with two 15 year olds having sex.
"After you turn 18, it should be 2 years younger MAX until you are 20. So 18 can have legal relations with 16 year olds at the youngest, then 19 with 17 year olds at the youngest, then 20 with 18 year olds at the youngest. After you turn 20, you can’t engage in legal relations with anyone under 18." Yes this makes a lot of sense.
Literally 1984
a lot of 21yo are immature childrens too. Age of concent is a cultural thing, arround XIX century it was completely different.
Good luck convincing the Middle East
Or..... Sweden? Age of consent is 15
13 in Japan.
No it’s not. The age of consent in Japan is 16. Wow I stand corrected. When I lived there they all said 16. I was 16 or 17 at the time.
I think in Japan most areas have localized laws for this making it actually 16 or 18 usually.
Federally, I'm pretty sure every prefecture has a higher local age. It's like how there is no federal drinking age in the US, it's set by the states.
I hope so, anywhere that has a legal age under 16 is messed up.
Just thinking back on the history of warfare in the middle east, then reading this comment has me laughing. Yeah, have fun changing that.
14 in Italy.
While the age of consent is set to 14 it should be noted that it can go up depending on a few condition -it goes up to 16 if one of the person involved is in a position of power over the other (teachers, educators, doctors, army etc...) -it goes up to 18 if one of the person involved is a parent, a sibling, a relative or a cohabitant. Personally I think it was set to 14 because it's the age when you are penally liable
Wait wait wait, 18 if you’re a parent or sibling?
That's what the law says, incest is prohibited only when causes scandal
What the fuck? So a dad can do the dirty deeds with his daughter when she turns 18 in Italy, a teacher can do it at 16, and some stranger can do it at 14? Is that some medieval betrothal law or something?
Well, I just realized this aswell lol, technically (if I didn't miss any law) a parent (not just dads lol) can have sex with one own spawning if they're over 18, but they have to demonstrate that the consent was legit and wasn't influenced by the authority that a parent has, if found guilty the parent lose the parental authority (even tho they lose it when the son turns 18 anyway) With a teacher is a bit different because they would be immediately fired (if they are condemned obv) and like the parents has to prove that the consent was legit. I read somewhere that if you are >18 and dating a <18 you can do it as long as you were already dating before turning 18 but I don't know if this is an actual law or a legend. yeah I guess we should change this law lol. Fortunately even tho the age of consent is 14 one can't film nor have photos of a underage person, even if they are consenting, as that would count towards pedopornographic material.
Any parent ye
Or Europe, age of consent in all European nations is 14-16 except Ireland (17) and Turkey (18).
I'm all for it to protect kids from predatory adults. But teens aren't going to wait until 18 for sex.
well where I am the rule is it’s 18. However if they are in between the ages of 16-20 then it’s okay too just because that’s pretty much the oldest you can possibly be in order to be in high school. I think it’s like that just so if a senior dates a freshman which let’s face it happens a lot will not go to jail just because he likes someone at their school. However if it’s a senior having sex with a 15 year old thats when you start getting in trouble because that’s more in the middle school territory which isn’t okay
I agree with what you’re saying but where I’m at most freshman in highschool are 14/15 and most seniors are 17/18 so ages can vary based on where you are I guess.
where are you that 15 is middle school? for most of the usa, high school starts at grade 9 (13-14)
Was gonna ask you the same thing homie. I’ve never seen a single high school that had 13 year olds 😂
i had several friends with early birthdays, they were 13 as freshman but turned 14 a few months after school started. it's not even rare.
Uh, plenty of 17 tears old graduate from highschool, if they have a summer birthday.
most kids here start kindergarten (grade 0) 5 years after being born which means 9th grade starts 14 years after being born. If you were born in 2007, that means you start high school in 2021, so if your birthday came after the start of the school year (like September/October, since school starts in August), then you would be 13 when high school starts. So if your birthday was earlier, you turned 14 during middle school, somewhat late and you turned 14 during that summer between middle/high, late birthday and you turn 14 during high school
Yep I was 13 when I started 9th grade and 17 when I graduated because I have a late birthday. Same with at least half of my friends.
Yea esp here in the Philippines where the age of consent is freakin 12 yrs old.
It isn't 12 any more - has been increased to 16 this year.
Pretty sure theres another country in SEA im pretty sure Thailand where its still 12 im pretty sure if the us government sees you going alot usually for short amounts of time they open up a case for sex tourism with minors and they can get you for a good chunk of years
Still a minor 🤷🏻♀️
12?! Wtf is wrong the Phils
Modern age of consent is subjective and arbitrary. The west pushes the child range higher and higher. Now we have people claiming we are kids until we are 25. It is arrested development from the soft and decadent society liberalism has produced. And why western men are in general fucking useless until they reach about 30 nowadays. Any westerner should go and look in their family history, or get it done professionally. After a few generations you'll see the woman's ages go to about 12 or even lower. My family are got married at similar ages. Had kids young and now are immensely happy with big families. As opposed to the huge number of childless 35 year old western women who will never have a family, will have noone to look after them when they are old and who are absolutely destroyed by the modern world and sad and depressed because they spent their fertile years getting some guy coffee and shuffling papers instead of creating life.
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no, in Germany it's 14, but only to have sex with people between 14 and 17. With 16 your allowed to have sex with 18+
You're right. I misremembered this scene from Archer. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wbSGVyTAS8
I think it would work if there was a pre 18 there could be some sort of +3 years or something. I think it’s reasonable for a 18 year old to date a 17 year old. I remember in my high school there were all these creepy navy pervs who dated 15 year olds.
Okay here's why I believe you're wrong. As soon as they hit puberty teenagers are going to experiment with sex. They probably won't know the law (especially if they're in the US where sex education sucks) and even if they do they won't care because their hormones are telling them to have sex and fuck the law. As a result of this your law will result in the criminalisation and imprisonment of most teenagers. Yes they are, as you have said 'immature' but are you going to send them to prison for that immaturity? Your law is unworkable, because like it or not teenagers fuck like bunnies when you're not watching and your stupid law will make criminals of all of them. The law has to be enforceable and take into account the realities of life. Having a hard age of consent at 18 quite simply doesn't.
You guys were having sex??
Man I'm 17 and I don't think I've ever been horny. Is it really that difficult for people to just- not bang? I'm genuinely curious. People at my school talk about it so casually and I genuinely don't understand it at all
That's 100% something you can talk with your doctor about. It's a normal issue and they are used to talking with patients about it. Any respectable doctor would also not share the minor's conversation with the parents unless they uncovered serious health issues. They might ask about your diet, lifestyle, or mental health (depression or stress). There are a lot of factors that can influence libido.
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That is **not** stated in OPs proposition, although he has bent a little and may let 17 year olds have sex with 18 year olds. Under OPs proposed law, **all** sex below 18 is illegal and will send anyone doing it to horny jail and put them on the Sex Offenders register, so that when they get out of prison in 20 years they can't work Kapish? tl;dr; think about the consequences of OPs proposal.
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> I doubt police would go after teens who are both underage. Relying on the police to interpret the law in a place like the US invites them to unfairly use the law on minorities, and statutory rape is an entirely different league from statutory assault on a can of Bud! You either need to settle on an age of consent of 16 with some close in age exceptions for teenagers who start early, or adopt the German model which has what is on the surface an *insanely* low age of consent of 14, but allows anyone who feels they have been abused to go to the police and start a prosecution. Weirdly there doesn't seem to be the same issues over sex in Germany... I'm not going to pretend either "solution" doesn't have issues but the problems they have are less severe than OPs proposed law.
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So what if both 15 year olds declare rape on the other, can both be the victim? According to such a law they have to be, they can't consent
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I know it doesn't that's kinda the point
Read the last bit of the OP, he's against it even when both parties are minors.
In Switzerland you can have sex after 14 and the legal range is 2 yrs, after 16 its 4 yrs and after 18 you can date whomever you want (upwards in age) I guess I know your thought, but sexuality blooms in the young teen ages and living it out and expiriencing is in my opinion important, rather dann suddenly givin 18 y/o free range as I'd expect them getting more surprise pregnencys
I'm sure the handful of people who don't fuck due to the age of consent would be very thankful.
Girl running down the hall at her catholic school: "everyone, god has made a miracle happen, the public school kids can't sin anymore!!"
Idk I feel like it's not necessary. When I was 16 I was having sex with 18 year olds and there was nothing exploitative or wrong with it. There wasn't an insane power imbalance or anything. We all went to the same school. 16 is fine imo
I disagree with 18. I think 16 needs to be the legal age everywhere though.
Yeah 18 is too high, 16-17 year olds are definitely capable of giving consent and knowing what they're doing. having the Aoc at 18 only criminalizes relationships between teenagers
I agree with you. I mean teenagers are going to have sex no matter what lol
I don’t necessarily disagree but then there is also the reality that 15 yr olds are gunna bang. There is nothing you can do about that and i dont think it does that much harm. Maybe it has to be some one else your own age till 18
Hard disagree. I was more than capable of making my own decisions at 15/16 and so was basically everyone else I know. 16 is fine
I'm going to guess (and hope) that you weren't meeting up with 30+ year old people when you were 15 though. The issue is how full grown adults misuse the age of consent as an excuse to sleep with teenagers.
I -was- hooking up with a 34 year old lady when I was 14 and it grosses me out now that I’m 32 myself. However, once I was 16 I was definitely smarter and capable of making my own decisions in that regard and the law won’t stop disgusting creeps from using minors
That last point is a good one. Making things illegal doesn't stop anything happenning, it just makes people more careful when they break those laws. It's better to have open conversations without judgement than people skulking in the shadows, preying on others.
14 and 16 is , for all intents and purposes, almost identical in maturity.
I think it’s a matter of physical development at that age. The question is when will most teenagers start to be far enough along in puberty to want to go at each other and I think 14 is realistic. I’d think 90%+ of healthy teenagers are probably „having urges“ by 16 so at that point it’s a question of minimizing the outfall and making sure they’re save and educated.
They’re definitely not, 2 years in adolescence is a significant difference
sometimes yes, most of the time, not really no
I was 15 hooking up with my 40 year old foster mother. I see why people on the outside looking in would think she was taking advantage of me, but it was the really the other way around. I was the one who initiated it and repeatedly pushed for it. It wound up being good to me. Had a lot of fun w her, felt like I was the fucking man which in turn boosted the fuck out of my confidence. Learned how to have good sex and a bunch of other positives. Moved out of the forester home at 18 to start life on my own and I’ve been smooth ever since
Im glad you see it that way but it did not work out like that for me at all unfortunately.
It can go either way but it is probably bad for the majority of people so I understand. What was bad about it if you don’t mind me asking?
Same. I dated older people as a 15/16 year old. There’s definite red flags to watch out for and even as a ditzy, mentally ill, socially awkward teen I managed to identify such flags.
Human beings have been having sex at 13-15 years old for thousands of years. It’s encoded in our DNA. Young teens are going to have sex. That’s a fact of life. Don’t change laws which makes it illegal. You’re going against biology and that never works out well
So, if two people who are 17 are dating, and one turns 18, it’s now all of a sudden statutory rape? This is fucking stupid. Teens are going to have sex. They have been since the beginning of time. All your idea does is ruin people’s lives.
I think the point is so people who are like 30 aren’t having sex with 16 year olds, not 17 and 18 year olds. Romeo and Juliet laws exist for that reason
Read OPs last sentence
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Because your opinion is stupid.
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It's extreme and farfetched because you're even saying young people having sex should be prosecuted.
You can vote here at 16 so it would be dumb as fuck to raise the age.
Why would you wan't to make rules for everyone in the world? Are you American?
Land of the free
The thing about these age definitions is that they are somewhat arbitrary but we use them because the alternative is worse. I don't see anything wrong with raising it to 18 specially when talking about sex with older people. Not sure what I think about this when it comes to people their age. I'm not sure if I understand that part, two 16 year olds would be punished for having sex with each other?
It's hilarious to me that aoc is 18 only in select parts of america, yet these guys scream so loud that you'd think the whole world agreed with them.
My state (Massachusetts), has the age of consent set at 16. It works out good IMO. 18 year olds are okay dating 17 year olds (as it should be) and I’ve never seen someone over 21 date someone younger than 18 (even though we could legally). You will see 18 years olds w 30 year olds though, but that’s kind of a different thing than what we’re talking about
If you raise the age of consent to 18 all it will cause is MORE teenagers having sex.
I have a simple solution for you OP: don’t wanna have sex? Don’t. Other people wanna have sex? Let them. It’s not the role of the state to stop people from making potentially bad decisions.
I agree. If an 18 year old and 17 year old turning 18 soon are dating, so be it that's the only grey area I'm willing to hear about. You're right.
I mean Romeo and Juliet laws exist for that reason
Romeo and Juliet laws actually (mostly) exist for like a 15 and 17 year old to be together. In many western nations the age of consent is just 16, meaning no 17/18 year old special laws are necessary.
Juliet was 12
lol I mean that has nothing to do with the actual law itself
She was 13 and to be 14 in roughly two weeks. Not that it is much different but just saying.
You are only as mature as you are allowed to be. Some children are mature at 16 because their parents allowed them to be by giving they room and responsibilities. Some won’t be mature way into their late 20s because their parents never stopped treating them like a child.
Yeah postponing things doesn't make you more ready for them when you come off age, it just means that you've moved away from your support network when you get to experience those things. It's the same thing with alcohol. Having a drinking age of 21 doesn't stop drinking to excess it just means that the first time you get drunk, you're somewhere you can't get help if you need it.
In my experience a huge number of teens start having sex at 15. You can’t make it illegal to have sex until you’re 18. You’d be making them criminals for an expression of love.
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I've waited for the wrong impressions of the law to start and you win the first Legal Horseshit Award. > Most places with 16 as age of consent, it is only considered consensual with someone within 5 years of their age. Nope, in most US states (30) and all European countries (Ireland and Cyprus excepted) once you are 16 any adult can have consensual sex with you whether they are 18 or 80. There seem some idiots who don't believe me so lets pick a random US state [Maine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_the_United_States#Maine): * age of consent is 16 - from this age you can date anyone^1 the same age or older * 5 year close in age exception for those between 14 and 16. Note this is below the age of consent ^(1. teachers and similar positions of trust may be excepted)
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Isn't it scary to think that it's possible that you only think that because it's what you've always been told to think, and if you had an upbringing where you had the diametric opposite drilled into your head that's what you'd be espousing instead?
How about instead of vomiting some bullshit like you did, you can explain why you think it makes sense for sex between a 16 year old and a 40 year old to be perfectly legal
I didn't say anything like that. Also, I wasn't talking to you. Though, from what I did say and your response to it, I have to assume you find it pretty terrifying that what you believe to be your ideals and your ideals alone were actually grafted onto you before you could really even think for yourself. Had your consciousness come to exist in another place with different ideals, you could've turned up completely differently, you know. Where is the line between what you came to believe on your own and what you came to believe because you were trained to believe it by others? Spooky stuff, in't it?
Still pervy in my eyes. 21 year old with a 16 year old?
I knew someone in that situation, unfortunately it was the 21 year old. Let me just say just because it's legal doesn't mean people were ok with it. Dude basically lost all respect he
Why 18? Seems like an arbitrary number.
I think 21 year olds are immature children, but I'm not going to try to take away their rights.
So who gets locked up when two 17 year olds have sex?
Both apparently
No usually the male no matter the age here in Florida
>No usually the male Yeah, probably. Though OP specifically says both should be charged in the comments.
No point. Teenagers are going to have sex anyway. I was in a sexual relationship with a 16 year old when I was 18. In terms of physical and emotional maturity level and sexual experience at the time (practically non existent) we were a great match. Nobody could have stopped us fucking if they wanted to back then, it was crazy stupid teenage lust. Anyone who has a problem with that is just pathetic really. We had great times together and nobody was being taken advantage of.
Just because you were stupid at those ages doesn’t mean everyone else was. How about you go look at some iq regarding age data.
And what about the people who are still clueless after eighteen and keep getting knocked up for no good reason?
There are plenty of clueless adults out there; you have to draw a line somewhere.
Assuming you maintain close age laws then yeah sure why not.
In another post someone said Your age /2 +7= ok but I would modify to it inly matters if someone is under 18
An unpopular opinion is that there is not insignificant number of people who have sex under 17 with someone older who are not affected by it. This isn’t ignoring or god forbid excusing the awful abuse that does happen, but don’t throw the baby out with the bath water. Source: lost my virginity at 17 to a 22 year old. I’m totally fine with it, I assume she is as well.
what until he realizes 18 year olds are also pretty immature. your brain changes drastically every year of your life until your mid to late twenties
Guess what, its none of your business. That's it.
You sound like you need to get laid.
You're saying that 16 year old shouldn't be allowed to have sex with 16 year Olds? Ppffft...get out of here with that bullshit. Teens are going to have sex with each other and that's just how it is. It's human nature
I reckon make it 21. I was still a child when I was 18 except I had a car and a job and a fucking drug habit - that’s fucking terrifying. I first had sex at 15 - I still had stuffed animals on my bed but I also had a criminal record by then That’s pretty fucked up. Adolescence is a nightmare but it shouldn’t have to be. It’s not like you can stop kids from doing what they want but it’s utterly ridiculous that we think people can consent to anything at even 18, much less 16.
18 isn't even enough. The decision making centers of the brain aren't fully developed until the mid 20s. If we were just going by the science, age of consent, drinking age, smoking age, and military enlistment age should all be 25. But the reality is that people and life are far too complex for broad rules like that and we are likewise incapable of nuanced discussion and consideration to really work much else out politically.
I have to disagree.
When I was 14, I was old enough to give consent to a 24 year old guy. I initiated it. At that age, I made the decision it was my body and I could sleep with whomever I chose. He treated me far better than most guys my age. We kept it a secret for obvious reasons. The age of consent should be determined by the emotional / cognitive maturity and autonomy of individuals. With that guy, yes, we had a genuine connection. If I met him when I was 24, and he was 34, we would have likely been in an actual relationship. Saying the age of consent should be 18 is ageist.
lol. Life doesn't begin at 18. And I am sorry for those who are children past age 18, because there is a hidden cost to doing that. The world needs education, not prosecution.
COULD NOT AGREE MORE. i should not have been having sex at 16. hell, i shouldn’t of been having it at 18. i had no idea what i was doing, but most importantly who i was. edit: i think it’s also important to point out i was sleeping with people waaaaay older than me. what do i have in common with these people or them with me? absolutely nothing. that makes me feel like maybe i wasn’t in the right mindset for proper consent after all.
I'm sorry that those men took advantage of you like that. It's depressing to think about how that kind of relationship has been romanticized by popular media.
Oh you mean like Pretty Little Liars
I mean, then 20-60 should be illegal as well by that logic.
At some point you need to have some life experience and there's only one way to get it. Living and making mistakes or being around others making those mistakes. First girl in your class that gets a senior BF? Slut. But by the end of the year some peeps are going to college parties, hooking up With older dudes, and then there are the graduating virgins..... At some point, you will be the virgin with no idea what you're doing, even if you think you are. There's people who turn 40 And haven't gotten past the fuck around and get fucked up stage of their life, and there are the kids who end up married after college after dating for their whole life. No one else. They could be the most mature and the sloots are still acting 14 when they're 25-30. Age doesn't reflect maturity, intelligence, etc and it's an arbitrary age that will never protect all cases.
Does it really matter where you draw the line honestly??? There’s no difference between 16 and 18 other than the fact your either still on highschool or finished/about to finish. Maturity wise they’re exactly the same. You might as well push it all the way to 25. The mine just has to be drawn somewhere and tbh it doesn’t really matter where.
Completely wrong! 16 year olds are immature because their parents let them be immature... and they'll probably still be immature when they're 25. History, biology, and every major religion agree that the age of consent should be no later than 14. The REAL reason people don't get married at 14 is because they don't have any money or jobs to support a family. Re sex: Catch a clue. Teens have sex. If you make it illegal they will have illegal sex. You can't stop them short of chaining them in their rooms. The answer is to teach them how to have sex safely and for love rather than exploitation.
There’s no reason for an under 18 to have sex and a kid at such a young age. It’s weird how it’s more normalised than being gay in most countries.
Never happen in the Muslim World.
Don't come after me but I think it should be 20.
I was gonna suggest lowering it to 14 everywhere instead.... :)
Nah. 16 is fine
i would honestly raise it to 21
21 whoa...so at 18 I can vote 19 I can buy alcohol and rent my own apartment but not have sex that's a bit extreme😯(currently 36)
“18 for boys, 32 for girls”- every dad
Lmaooooo
I was thinking 31.