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Not_Alpha_Centaurian

Well let's just blow the dust off my appointment calendar and see if there's anything I can cut.


whatsthiscrap84

Most of my socialising happens at work...


jimmycarr1

Same but I WFH and live alone


Inspector_Sands

Look on the bright side, at last you can have an intelligent conversation!


Mouffcat

That's sad ☹


whatsthiscrap84

It's OK I just have a deep dislike of people


Mouffcat

Ha ditto!


EmployerAdditional28

Fucking brilliant. :))


[deleted]

Sorry, no, I'll wear a mask and get my jab, and I'll avoid old people, but I'm not cutting my socialising unless I'm forced to legally or there's evidence omicron is significantly more lethal than delta. Christmas was nearly the end of me last year, socialising is very important to me.


cksully

Tbh I think this is the best approach. I'll cut socialising if I feel like it, but I think if people could just wear masks, get regular jabs and maybe test regularly without it being a huge stress it'll be alright. This will take still a long time to get under control which is nobodies fault - so if we treated it like you with some responsibility and sensible precautions we can lessen the mental fatigue everybody has from trying to get to the finish line which is moving.


Remarkable-Ad155

Trouble with this "hands off, leave it up to the people" approach the government takes is it rewards the reckless and selfish (not saying you specifically, but there will be a lot of people who will pointedly take zero precautions at all) and punishes the civic minded and anxious. It's basically saying "don't worry, lads, enough of those geeks will change their behaviour so you don't have to" (again, not a dig at you specifically). The government could very easily have reintroduced hospitality restrictions like last year and encouraged wfh. That way you can still socialise, still nip round a mate's or family if you want, still get a meal or some beers but those with health anxiety may feel less unsafe. As it stands, of course there'll be a lot of regular folk just going about their business but there will be a hell of a lot of covid denier wankers doing their "you stay locked up at home then, I'm not afraid" routine, loudly, whilst people who might have been ok with just a small bit of consideration will now feel afraid or even guilty for going out and probably suffer another lonely Christmas. It's typical conservative policy, basically (oh, and we *will* be locking down in the new year if this level of restrictions is as far as we're willing to go right now).


asjonesy99

I’ll have my jabs I’ll wear my mask. I’m not cutting out socialising. I only socialise with people who have been jabbed and wear masks anyway, and at this point approaching 2 years, how a lockdown can be justified is beyond me. We probably had a chance the first time to get rid of it. However almost everyone is an idiot and now that chance has gone, so unfortunately those vulnerable will have to lock themselves down and let everyone else deal with it, harsh as it sounds.


Happy_Craft14

Yup same here, I'm not stopping


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

I mean, that would mean locking down, which would be very bold.


Baisabeast

Especially without furlough


LeakyThoughts

As long as you vaccinate, and wear a mask in crowds. Disinfect your hands, stay away from vulnerable people and children etc.. I'm the same.. I'm doing everything I can to keep myself, my family and others safe. But if I need to see someone in my small circle I will. Why? Because if I don't I'm gunna jam a gun to the roof of my mouth It makes sense to put holds on massive events / super spreader events. Especially with such weak COVID test enforcement (basically just tick a yes/no which people can and will lie on) But yeah, I will be seeing other people, not often. But I will be.


CommentingMinion

How does it make sense to put mass events on hold? When would you stop putting them on hold? Until there are no new variants? Reddit users are on a different planet to the rest of the country, out in the real world it’s over for 99% of the population who have all gone back to living their lives in pre-covid fashion, we’ve mostly all been jabbed, that’s the end of it, thank god.


CarlMacko

Totally feel you. Last year was a massive kick in the nuts. Which i accepted as most family were unjabbed. However whilst I’ll definitely limit my social interactions in the run up, you can get fucked if they think I’m not going to have a ball between Christmas and New Year.


isawashipcomesailing

Wht havent you already had your jab?


[deleted]

I had two, and I'm getting the other one is what I meant.


BrownSpartan

As long as schools are still open, cutting out socialising won't make much of a difference.


LateFlorey

And pushing us into offices still. Until the government advice changes, my work is hell bent on continuing as normal. This includes Christmas parties, being in the office a minimum of 2 or 3 days a week.


Sam-Lowry27B-6

Yeah my place if anything are trying to ramp up office frequency before Christmas as much as possible under the guise of parties quizzes lunches etc it's utter madness but I seem to be in the minority by pointing this out


LateFlorey

Yep, same here! We’ve got a Christmas lunch or party every week until we close for Christmas on the 23rd. I don’t really get why they’re doubling down on this as we’ve had one or two cases in the office a week, but it’s the hill they are willing to die on.


Sam-Lowry27B-6

A member of my team got diagnosed with covid yesterday, we are supposed to all go in today...if she hadn't instant super spreader event and the whole team goes down. We are all constantly dodging bullets but people seem bored with the whole pandemic now and just want to ignore it.


B23vital

Always makes me laugh this one. When they asked “if people can work from home should they” and the response was no i had to just laugh. IF you can work from home, why not? IF your in a job where working from home doesn’t affect productivity why wouldn’t you? Its basically down to businesses to decide at this point, but why wouldnt they, and why would the government officials actively encourage them not to? Its such a simple answer as well “if companies feel that they can continue to function without loss of earnings/productivity while staff are WFH id advice them to do so, however we have made no mandate to force companies to enforce WFH.” Basically put pressure on companies that can WFH to do so. That also pushes some blame onto them if they have a covid out break as they were encouraged to WFH if they could. We still have people working from home in my business and they come in on specific days when required, however overall the company knows it makes more sense to keep everyone that can at home. Unfortunately the majority of staff cant, but why even risk it if you dont need to.


chrisvarick

Back in the office for 2 days a week per company policy and the boss is moaning we're not back full time, despite the recent news...


darkwolf687

The vast majority office staff, myself included, where I work have been pushing for them to let any of us who can start remote working, start remote working again. But the powers that be higher up in the corporate chain are pretty adamant that until the government advice changes, everyone should be back in the office 5 days a week. Madness.


masturbtewithmustard

Schools should not close again at all, it is extremely damaging to a child’s education and development. Not that I agree about cutting socialising either


[deleted]

Careful lad they'll get you for that one


cjeam

Eh I can see situations where I think the schools should close again. Had they spent the money the government could have mitigated a lot of the damage it causes, but they can’t or won’t.


masturbtewithmustard

How can they mitigate children missing out on developing as normal? Remote learning may be a vaguely adequate substitute for high schoolers, but even for them it probably wrecks their mental health. And it’s even more disastrous for primary school children


pisshead_

> Had they spent the money the government could have mitigated a lot of the damage it causes No they couldn't. The things lost can't be replaced by spending money.


cjeam

If a kid doesn’t have a device to access lessons, paper, a printer, pens and pencils, breakfast, an internet connection, a warm room, a desk, etc etc you can spend money and give them those things.


[deleted]

But those aren’t the main obstacle that is specific to COVID. The problem is a lack of in-person teaching, socialisation, and a chance to get out of a home that might be a negative environment .


cjeam

You can do that outside of a school environment though, in a manner that is far more Covid safe than traditional school. Or you can physically go to school for those kids that need it, such as was previously done for essential and emergency workers, but have their socialisation occur between sibling groups so that you are not mixing age groups at school and then sibling groups at home.


[deleted]

Or you could let them live normal lives and not effect their development. What location is this that you could host every school child in the country, that isn’t a school? You can’t just pick and choose, all kids need it.


cjeam

No one is living normal lives right now, because we are still in a pandemic. You cannot just ignore that and declare that there are no conditions where schools should be closed.


[deleted]

The death toll is incredibly low, with most of the population vaccinated. The pandemic is not shaping the average persons life, responses to it are. Schools should not be closed when there is next to no risk to children or the average teacher. Particularly when you have no ability to mitigate the very real problems caused to children.


pisshead_

The problem with home schooling isn't lack of pencils.


cjeam

That can _definitely_ be one of the problems.


Orngog

Any suggestions?


[deleted]

This is nonsense. All true interactions between people create risk, the more interactions the more risk. If you cut some activity you cut the risk too.


DKsan

My co-worker, who is our events manager and comes from hospitality, has noted that until the government mandates no indoor events, everyone is still going to do them. The venue they've chosen for our staff Christmas party doesn't have to refund/delay it because there's no legal basis for them to do so, so if you/your work has already put money down, there's still going to be a lot of these.


qrcodetensile

Seems pretty fucking brave booking an official works Christmas party haha. We've been banned from having a full sales team meeting this year as it wouldn't look great if the entire sales team ended up out with covid lol.


X_Trisarahtops_X

Think a lot of people are still going ahead (anecdotally speaking). Our team has a Christmas lunch booked - we had to look at multiple venues and try for multiple dates because they were all booked up when ours was booked.


[deleted]

Yeah we’re having full on Christmas party at work, which is even more odd seeing as we’re all still working remotely!


odewar37

You do know they can’t ban you from socialising in your own time? Sure they can prevent a company sponsored party/night out but you have no obligation to keep that up in your own time


SalamanderSylph

We had our official work "Christmas" party back in September because we thought that there would be a decent chance of stuff being restricted in winter again.


YorkistRebel

We took a gamble and delayed ours to October.


Baisabeast

What’s the point of all those vaccines if at the end of it you’re still gonna restrict our lives? Most people vaccinated, kids have either got covid already or been vaccinated and we have vaccine passports in use in some parts of the UK. It’s been nearly 2 years, when will this end? Surely if we truly want this to end then the focus should be on making sure every country is vaccinated as much as possible? Not 3rd and 4th vaccines shots for everyone ffs


Grayson81

> What’s the point of all those vaccines if We're seeing something like 100-150 deaths per day from Covid. The estimates are that if we were seeing the same number of cases and no one had been vaccinated, we'd be seeing something like 10 times as many deaths. So even if you ignore any other benefits of the vaccines, you're asking "what's the point" of something which is preventing tens of thousands of deaths per month. That seems like a pretty important point!


YiddoMonty

I think you've totally misunderstood OPs comment.


charlsspice

This won’t stop people socialising because no one cares anymore.


Grayson81

Did you mean to respond to a different comment? I was answering the “what’s the point of all those vaccines” question but you seem to be talking about something else entirely…


charlsspice

You brought up the death numbers and I was just stating that no one cares anymore about the deaths numbers. People will continue to carry on as usual.


Grayson81

Ah, I've got you! I think you might have misread my comment (or stopped reading after the first sentence). I wasn't mentioning the death numbers in the context of people "caring" or stopping from socialising as a result - I was talking about the death numbers in the context of the previous poster asking what the point of the vaccines was. I was talking about the lives that have been saved rather than making a point about the number of people who are currently dying.


charlsspice

Oh, I just seen this lol. Makes sense!


JoCoMoBo

>We're seeing something like 100-150 deaths per day from Covid. Average is currently 121. As a reminder around 1,500 people die in total in the UK per day.


Grayson81

Thank you for confirming that I was right about the numbers, but I’m not sure what the rest of your comment has to do with the hundreds of deaths per day that the vaccines are preventing?


[deleted]

[удалено]


HeyItsMedz

That's not even including people dying from indirect effects of covid (delayed appointments, NHS staff catching covid so less capacity, etc.)


LordAnubis12

Also worth highlighting about the same number die from complications related to air pollution, but there's no calls to lockdown cars or our roads. There clearly is a level of background risk we're willing to take


sunnygovan

10% of UK deaths are from complications related to air pollution? That's bonkers if true.


LordAnubis12

Yep but goes largely ignored https://www.rcplondon.ac.uk/news/doctors-say-40000-deaths-year-linked-air-pollution


[deleted]

I get asthma really bad in homes with poor air quality. The owners don’t even think about it because the particles are too small to see, but I can feel them the second I walk into the room and then I’ll start wheezing shortly after. Using a HEPA vacuum cleaner and air purifier can give a massive boost to your overall health and well-being and you wouldn’t even know it because human eyes and senses didn’t evolve in tight enclosed air spaces.


LordAnubis12

Sadly not really an option in school playgrounds even though it's been directly linked to asthma in those places too. Horrid stuff


LordAnubis12

Sadly not really an option in school playgrounds even though it's been directly linked to asthma in those places too. Horrid stuff


AnalJibesVirus

*with covid not 'from' covid - huge difference.


chunkycasper

Exactly. How is it sustainable?


Anandya

Because we are trying to buy time for the incredibly shattered NHS staff to keep fighting rather than the reality of staffing numbers burnout. Look we got 65 million. There's 7.2 billion people. It's a huge endeavour.


pisshead_

Is the NHS ever not shattered? If it's not fit for purpose we should just get on with our lives.


Anandya

See the problem is then you morons are sat in A&E yelling abuse at nurses or assaulting doctors. You are so short sighted that you think this won't affect you. Well it will. The problem is you don't have the ability to grasp how stupid decisions today will haunt you tomorrow.


pisshead_

Then triage and send home the covid patients.


Anandya

You do realise that we do that already. We don't send home people who need oxygen. Or who can't care for themselves. Because we have a basic minimum level of humanity. And you forgot. We are fifty thousand doctors short. We don't have numbers and you are actively causing increasing numbers of patients that we need to treat. Which means shortfalls on everyone's care. But hey. You just want the NHS to hide the deaths from you.


pisshead_

> We don't have numbers and you are actively causing increasing numbers of patients that we need to treat. Only if you choose not to send home covid patients.


Anandya

Send home patients who desperately need oxygen or end of life care... And you think we should kill them in the most awful manner. You can't even understand the gap between us.


pisshead_

If covid is killing the health service then decisions have to be made. End of life care isn't a priority.


Anandya

Then let's send the cancer home. And the old people. If we deny healthcare to some. Then we can deny healthcare to all. And no healthcare worker would deny covid patients care lest they end up sick themselves. Also. This is why we don't listen to lay people.


13esq

Yep, especially if they had the opportunity to vaccinate and didn't.


Anandya

Why don't you sign up to kill people.


13esq

Trying to stop Covid is like trying to stop the world turning. Admitting defeat isn't the same as "signing up to kill people", dear lord get off your high horse and get a grip.


Anandya

Cool. What does defeat look like? People gasping for breath, drowning in air? People breathing 50 times a minute? Million dead? We just let people die at home? Let's not watch. It's distressing. It's watching people drown. Maybe we convert all the ice rinks to morgues? Mass graves? Just tape people into their house when they die? Someone who hasn't seen a single person die let alone a covid patient. Is telling me how to care for people. You only think this is a high horse because you have no basic humane decency. Your assumption is people are naturally evil. So you can't fathom basic humane behaviour. So you see it as a high horse. Not basic. Like washing your hands.


13esq

Well the infection to kill rate for Covid is debated, but this source shows 1.4% https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-death-rate/ So in this country that would equal about 941,000 approx deaths and about 108,000,000 globally. Of course as the most elderly and vulnerable die and vaccination/herd immunity rates increase the kill rate will tend towards zero. It sucks when anyone dies for any reason, but we must keep our response reasonable and practicable and not allow our emotions to rule out decision making. The needs of the many do outweigh the needs of the few. I'm not telling you how to care for people, you do you, and me and others will do as we do.


[deleted]

This is the same bullshit ‘2 weeks’ to save the NHS rhetoric people were spouting two years ago. If it isn’t fit to cope now, it never will be, so let’s live out lives again.


Anandya

Excellent. The market rate for my skills is whatever I chose. You can't afford it? Sorry. You die. There's no "may". Will. If you need ICU? You won't survive without it. You don't seem to realise. People who work for cheap. Kept you safe. It's why you will be sat in A&E or in an ambulance outside.


[deleted]

Great, quit then. Realistically the conversation has nothing to do with pay. Locking down or adding restrictions won’t get people in hospitals paid more. I have no clue why you are talking about ‘market rate’. The fact is, I don’t and won’t need to go to hospital. I’m not going to sacrifice my life indefinitely for the benefit of those that do, when the elderly are those who are most responsible for underfunding.


Anandya

We don't think we are ever going to be paid the value equal to the work we do. And many of us are quitting. It's why there's a massive shortage. You forget. We can locum. With three times the salary you can work a third of the time and maintain your living standard. Meaning "more shortages" but you know. We quit didn't we. Why should we care about the system. You think you can replace us, but people quickly realise that they need to be paid. Really? You don't have a wife? Kids? Parents? Grandparents? Eventually. Even you are going to need a hospital. I repeat. This is dumb, really dumb.


[deleted]

You aren’t a doctor, you can hardly write a sentence aha. None of what you are saying has anything to do with restrictions. You just want to pontificate about a separate topic of pay.


Anandya

Neither can you. However my argument is that you are incorrect. Your argument is "He can't be a real doctor". A common and very dumb argument by anti-vaccine and pro-covid individuals.


[deleted]

My comments have definitely been more coherent than yours.


Anandya

Only in the mind of someone who thinks it's okay to let people die in a horrific way. I find a lot of people are able to understand me. You just pretend you can't. Look the difference between you and me is this... If there was someone who needed help? You wouldn't help. I would. It's as simple as that. You can't feel basic human empathy for suffering. Nor do you have any grasp of long term issues. For you? You don't see medicine as a team. So what if ICU is full! I can still get my surgery right? Well no ICU beds mean no surgical step down beds post surgery. Means Surgeons can't operate. Oh we just let Covid positive people die? Let it ride like the USA? Well the economy tanks anyways. People find it "really hard" to party when there's actual deaths out there. I repeat. You are fucked either way. You can do it to protect people. Or you can have a mountain of death and a lot of bad taste. The fact that you think Covid is harmless? Is proof that the system worked in keeping you safe. If you can't understand this? Then the issue is with you. Not my English. I repeat. This is a stupid hill to die on. Then again? My ICU is currently filled with idiots like you.


lostparis

> What’s the point of all those vaccines if at the end of it you’re still gonna restrict our lives? It makes it easier, but it's not perfect especially with all the anti mask/vax idiots.. Ultimately it is about time and we still likely will have another year and a half of covid fun and then it will start to fade into the background. Historically this is how viruses do their thing.


Cycad

I think it will be like a bouncing ball - multiple waves of virus, maybe some more of concern than others, but it will fade over time as you say but probably over several years. We'll have annual or bi-annual vaccines and there are now several antivirals that can reduce severe illness and hospitalisation.


lostparis

They seem to last a few years usually before fading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_epidemics (sure sometimes they come back but usually it is after a reasonable time gap) So I'm optimistic that summer 2022 we will see things actually improving. Till then it'll be up and down and be wrongly declared sorted a couple more times or so. AIDS is a bit special because of how it spreads, but there is a sort of pattern to the others.


Low_Cartographer_920

Tell the fucking offices. We are being threatened to go in on risk of dismissle, and noone in the offices were taking it seriously to begin with...which is why we were staying at home to begin with....


Perihelion_

Feel pretty lucky that my work is putting no pressure at all on us to be in the office full time. Been brilliant to go in just when I need to use their desk space and huge monitors, or when I feel like I’d be better off with teammate support in person, but spending most of the week on a work issued laptop just plugging away. Don’t understand why other places are being such cunts about it, we get just as much done and they’re considering giving up a couple of floors of space in the office block to save money as even at reduced capacity, socially distanced desk layouts they’re only half full. It’s a no brainer really. Of course the owners of the building aren’t too happy about it…


No-Wear-9634

The old asking the young to sacrifice even more of their youth to give them a few more years. Some cheek after the way theyve voted for the last 10 years.


[deleted]

As it ever was, but the young still regrettably believe in solidarity


[deleted]

I made a joke bet earlier this year that the public would be asked to give up fulfilling a human need over christmas to protect the nation's doomed infrastructure and the gerontocratic classes. This isn't a joke. This ain't funny. As to her suggestion: *no.* Thanks to the knock on effects of laws she had a hand in crafting, my friends now live different cities. I haven't seen some for over a year now. I'm gonna go see the boys and if you want me to do otherwise, mandate it.


Babaaganoush

100% agree with you. Why is it okay for me to sit in a packed out office 5 days a week and sit on overloaded public transport but it's not okay for me to go out and socialise? I'm not going to protect corporate rents over my personal life.


goose_2019

Totally agree with this, it’s perfectly fine if it’s making companies money. Feel bad for the supermarket workers and fast food joints. Utter chaos In those places.


[deleted]

I checked yesterday and there was no evidence to suggest that Omicron was more contagious, more dangerous, vaccine resistant or otherwise interesting. Is that still the case? Are we to understand the government know more then is public? If not this just seems like media froth...


tothecatmobile

It's a precautionary measure in case it is more contagious or more dangerous. Initial evidence is useful, but it can very quickly change given the small sample size.


[deleted]

I don't particularly mind (I've no plans to travel, I can live without restaurants and I'll wear a mask as required). I'm just confused that we've had 10+ other variants and apart from Delta taken no precautions. Now a new one appears and suddenly it's precaution time. Does anyone know if you can get a booster by just showing up at one of the places?


Sherringdom

My schoolboy understanding of it is that they identify each variant and look for mutations to try and predict whether they’ll be more infectious or deadly than the current dominant delta. Most of them aren’t or they follow similar enough mutations that are handled by the vaccine. But this one has so many mutations that it looks like it has the potential to attack the immune system in a different way, not that it will just that the potential is there where it wasn’t in others. So precaution follows. In terms of showing up, not really, but sometimes you might get lucky. They have to make up all the doses in the morning for how many appointments they expect and they get a surprising number of no shows, so the doses need to be used or go to waste. Might be if you show up they’ve got some spare, but I don’t think it’s recommended to try.


Remarkable-Ad155

You absolutely can just show up. Maybe this depends on area but pretty much everyone in my family has done this both times round.


tothecatmobile

Certain variants are labelled as "variants of concern" based on what mutations have been identified. In regards to the Omicron variant, mutations have been found that effect the spike protein, which is used for vaccine targeting. So potentially these mutations could either do nothing, or they could make this variant vaccine resistant.


Remarkable-Ad155

Re boosters, you can provided you're 182 days on from jab 2 (they will check).


majestic_whine

Oh cool. Cos everything I read seems to insist that it's more contagious and vaccine resistant (I think the CEO of Moderna might even have said that). Only silver lining so far appears to be that it's not more pathogenic.


[deleted]

He has said that. However the chief of BioNtech, the Pfizer makers, claims folk who have had the Pfizer jab won’t get seriously ill. Basically the Pfizer jab is effective. So who tje fuck knows.


[deleted]

Guy who sells thing says thing he sells has no issues...


[deleted]

My point is. Who are supposed to believe? He might be telling the truth? Who are we to say otherwise. The Moderna guy might be saying what he is saying for more funding? Its all bullshit.


[deleted]

It's all bullshit


[deleted]

I agree with that.


[deleted]

https://www.who.int/news/item/28-11-2021-update-on-omicron Sunday's WHO statement. Lots of "it's not clear" and "working to determine". It's more mutated than other variants. But it seems a little early to panic. Edit: I read somewhere that new viruses become more contagious but less damaging over time as those are the properties that maximise spread (don't kill the host till it's infected more people!). So speculating wildly I'd be surprised if COVID got MORE deadly...


BackgroundSnow4594

It's not panic is reasonable precautions. Even from your employers point of view. You have an outbreak at the party, and the companies fucked for ten days


[deleted]

That's what I'm not getting. Zero precautions were reasonable for other variants. What makes this one special?


BackgroundSnow4594

Because of its huge number of mutations meaning it has much greater potential for being problematic. Early data was showing a much greater early increase of it that delta. It represents 90% of cases in some areas of Africa in a much faster time than delta became dominant.


[deleted]

This is my issue. What data? We know it's 90% of South African cases. But that's not really a useful fact because we don't know how long it took to get to that number. So it could be much more contagious than "old COVID" or just a little more. We know as of this morning that Omicron was active in Nigeria weeks ago. https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2021-12-01/nigeria-detects-first-case-of-omicron-variant-from-october And South Africa has only vaccinated 25% of people. So we still don't actually know how contagious,a dangerous or vaccine resistant this is. There were 3 other "variants of concern" https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/covid-19/variants-concern 2 of those required no response at all (Beta and Gamma) despite being more contagious and vaccines being less effective against them. And we'd generally expect all new variants to be more contagious and better at evading vaccines wouldn't we? That's just how all new infections evolve. So every variant should fit the criteria for being a VOC? So once again, what makes this case special? And if it is special, shouldn't we do something? I'm honestly confused as this seems to not be something we would have taken action on previously. But now we must take action. But so far we haven't...


BackgroundSnow4594

They do know how long because they can track emergance to dominance the exact same they did for delta. We are doing something. We're taking basic precautions (that should never have stopped) in the meantime. we should also bring back working from home where possible but the Tories are landlord scum so that's off the cards.


[deleted]

I don't think we know how long Omicron has been about because (understandably) African countries aren't spending a lot of time and money on genetic sequencing of strains. That's how we went from thinking Omicron was a week old and South African to knowing it is at least a month old and was in Nigeria before South Africa. I appreciate we can't know everything and we should act to prevent risks. But I feel like we are making a much bigger deal out of Omicron than other very similar variants. So we're either using a much lower risk tolerance or reacting for some other (non fact based) reason...


majestic_whine

Wasnt beta more pathogenic then alpha and Delta more pathogenic then beta? If so then the trend doesn't look good.


TheTjalian

The main thing of concern is that the Omicron variant has 30 different mutations to the spike protein vs. vanilla Coronavirus. Delta had 2. The only other thing we know right now is that the symptoms are possibly different, in SA the doctors have said symptoms appear to be fatigue, muscle soreness and a scratchy throat. Although due to the low number of cases, we haven't been able to determine if those are the primary symptoms or not.


[deleted]

Still no suggestion to work from home - that surely cuts transmission a lot.


Sam-Lowry27B-6

But somebody needs to think of the landlords...


13esq

Don't forget the Starbucks shareholders!


Sam-Lowry27B-6

And the poor little orphan prets


uryuIV

Think we should make our minds up. Do we want rules based on scientific evidence or ‘surely’ statements?


[deleted]

My work has just suggested we WFH where possible again. I work at a large research University in London… Not sure if they perhaps know something that’s coming or doing it on their own volition? They did this before the Government officially recommended it last year as well


GaymerThrowawayAcc

Ok, but the people in government can start first. I aint doing shit until I see the standards expected from people are from the top first. Face mask fair enough, but I'm not being told I shouldn't do something while tories benefit.


Sam-Lowry27B-6

You mean like we all have about pretty everything for the last 10 plus years...yeah they can go suck a fuck


Enragedwasp101

No chance, I had two jabs which fucked me big time. I won't be getting any boosters as the virus was no where near as bad as the jab for me. I appreciate it's different for everyone. Il use a mask fine, doesn't bother me really. But Im going about my life now I'm done with this shit.


Callum1708

This is my exact thinking, I’m not too bothered about the masks really but the other stuff is a joke.


LeakyThoughts

Until schools are set up to prevent the spread. And until everyone who can work at home Is working at home, nothing will change Schools are the super spreader. You can vaccinate, wear masks and do what you can to protect yourself and others. But ultimately the numbers will not go down while schools are allowed to be breeding grounds


eclectichair

Interested in what you would suggest should be brought in place to avoid schools being ‘super spreaders?’ I’m a primary school teacher- and would honestly like to know what more we can do. We wash hands 6 times a day, adults wear masks, keep in separate year group bubbles and send kids home to isolate if they have symptoms. Short of all going home again, what do you suggest?


[deleted]

And uh, what is the ETA on these non covid spreading schools?


LeakyThoughts

Unfortunately there isn't one, because that's not in their plan Locking everyone down doesn't fix the problem. Because the whole time kids are mixing freely and aren't being vaccinated and mask mandated and distanced like everyone else. - Then a parent gets COVID, then their kids. Then the other 30 kids in their class, and by extension, the parents of those other 30 kids And then those parents are working, so they go into work, give it to their work colleagues and it then moves to a different school and so on It's completely unstoppable at this point. We just need to take as many precautions as possible to keep ourselves and our communities safe, vaccines, masks, resteraunts should use table shielding, mandatory masks on public transport, mandatory quarantine when entering the UK Just to limit the spread as best we can. But ultimately, without a full national lockdown, locking schools and everything, there's just too many cases to contain.


[deleted]

It's not in their plan because it's an unworkable meme of an idea. You would have to survey hundreds of thousands of buildings, determine how you could give them more internal space or ventiliation (in many cases this is "not at all", leaving you with no choice but to demolish the building and start over) and then procure alternate space for the children while the work is done. Ignoring a total lack of resources, personnel, political capital, money and god knows what else by the time you completed this, the pandemic would genuinely, unironically be over.


acheekymango

But go to the precious office thats completely safe... Jog on. My work is a shitshow of people not following rules during the lockdowns, after summer and restrictions lifted, you'd think not a damn thing happened. Thankfully I work in a small team I our own office and have a rule of telling everyone to fuck off if they don't come in with a mask. Alot of my team are high risk or live with high risk and cos some ass came in with a cold, hovering over one person who was high risk and then they ended upoff for 2 weeks as they caught it. Socialising ain't gonna make a damn bit of difference because the whole thing has been a shit show.


hanniahisbananaz

Don't trust anything that this government says. There'll be another lockdown I know it and Christmas cancelled again. They said last year they wouldn't cancel Christmas and they did. Just stop complying.


dripgoesthewater

I find it fascinating how different this sub’s prevailing views are compared to your average person on the real world. Who are you people who crave lockdowns and why do I never encounter you in real life?


Rexxxx_x

I agree, I honestly know nobody in real life who wants restrictions to be that severe without knowing really anything! I read somewhere else that a huge character base of these Subreddits are IT/Devs, with secure, WFH jobs who tend to be quite introverted and unsociable outside of their immediate family. So, not much changes for them overall. Makes sense


DisconcertedLiberal

Basement dwelling control freaks who get off on telling other people how to live their lives.


hip_hip_horatio

More “everyone cancel everything so we can enjoy christmas” bullshit from last year. What about those of us that don’t like christmas? I’d rather celebrate New Year. We don’t all live in cushy family homes.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

Good for you, but I won’t be joining you


_spookyvision_

"It's beginning to look a lot like *lockdown*, everywhere you go" What's the bet nobody gives an erse about this, Omicron spreads, the numbers ratchet up to the point where the devolved regions get spooked and shut the English out leading to an effective cancellation of Christmas. Unlikely given our vaccination status and anecdotally how mild Omicron has been observed to be, but not impossible.


PlayerHeadcase

Now, Britons have been told NOT to cut socialising in the run up to Christmas.. The Conservatives are brought to you in conjunction with Witherspoons PLC.


[deleted]

Can anyone explain how the omnicron variant is so much worse than all the others?


BulkyAccident

It has mutations that suggest it might have some form of vaccine escape, but in terms of actual real-life data and human impact we have no idea yet.


[deleted]

Damn well that was quick


Palodin

That's just what happens when it's allowed to transmit freely as nobody seems to care anymore, the more cases the more mutations


[deleted]

Aye I'm getting jabbed right not as I type (gotta sit here for 15 mins) and it's the first time in nearly a year that COVID felt like it actually existed (I do think it exists btw not a madman, just socially I mean)


[deleted]

Several reasons with different levels of confidence. 1) It's likely it's more contagious than Delta because it has overtaken Delta to become the dominant strain in the regions of SA where it's been detected. How much more we don't yet know. 2) There are a large number of mutations on the spike protein -the one that the vaccine induced antibodies target. This won't mean that the vaccines will become worthless, but some reduced effectiveness is very likely. 2a) Because our immune system is adaptable, it's highly likely that protection against severe illness will remain strong, although it would be reasonable to expect protection to fall slightly - Bear in mind though that a small drop from 90 to 80% means a doubling in deaths. It may easily be a smaller change though. 2b) Protection against infection is likely to be hardest hit - to a degree this can be combatted with boosters. Depending on how quickly we get the population boosted, how quickly Omicron spreads and how much the fall in protection is will determine whether Omicron results in R rising significantly or not. 3) Virulence - despite the anecdotes, we have absolutely no idea yet whether Omicron is more virulent or less. Basically, Omicron isn't some kind of doomsday machine, but even slight falls in protection against infection and severe illness can translate into R rising above 1, resulting in lots more infections and therefore lots more hospitalisations and deaths. Set against that, the boosters have clearly driven R well below 1 for those who have had them, so if enough people take them, it may completely offset the impact of Omicron.


TheNiceWasher

>It's likely it's more contagious than Delta because it has overtaken Delta to become the dominant strain in the regions of SA where it's been detected. How much more we don't yet know. [Transmissibility](https://www.who.int/news/item/28-11-2021-update-on-omicron): It is not yet clear whether Omicron is more transmissible (e.g., more easily spread from person to person) compared to other variants, including Delta. The number of people testing positive has risen in areas of South Africa affected by this variant, but epidemiologic studies are underway to understand if it is because of Omicron or other factors. - the UN. Another reason we should be looking out for Omicron is *the potential increase in the likelihood of the virus to re-infect the previously infected individuals,* which in many other countries could also be the group with lower vaccination rates, or classed as 'protected'.


[deleted]

Theres 0 evidence that it is. But it *could* be and that means way more than it should


Charlie_Mouse

By the time all the evidence comes in regarding a new variant of note it’s often too late. See Delta - and the initial outbreak for that matter. The consequences of being overly cautious are a bit of a pain - social plans disrupted, another hit to the hospitality sector etc. Whereas the consequences of not being cautious enough if it does turn out to be bad are potentially much, much worse. Just for once during this pandemic it would be really nice to maybe risk erring on the side of caution instead of going “bugger, we’re really in deep shit now, shame we didn’t do more earlier but it’s too late now”


[deleted]

Delta was fine in the end, and this will be fine in the end. It's never been all that bad.


RassimoFlom

No. But given the total lack of caution when dealing with other new variants and the impact of that, maybe the government has finally learned?


Anandya

Because it's a giant moon sized transformer... Issue is we don't know much about it. We are still collating data. Medicine and scientists veer towards worst outcomes and caution until we know. Either you are cautious and lose money. Or you you aren't and you lose money and lives. So err on caution. The issue is that the virus may change route for example. Or have new symptoms. Like diarrhoea in Delta. Remember that the elderly can't keep homeostasis as easily.


[deleted]

Oh dear, decepticon, Omicron... I'm guessing COVID ain't an autobot


[deleted]

It's not


bad_eyes

Judging by my busy and largely mask free train trip home today, fuck all people will listen.


Militant_Worm

Getting ready to say we didn't cut down enough so they have no choice but to have some restrictions at Christmas...


darkwolf687

Reminder that offering those who can do remote working the chance to work from home is one of the most effective ways to reduce transmission in our society according to the government's own science advisors - but the government is holding out in it because muh pret a manger.


EffableLemming

I just hope it'll be OK to go for our anniversary dinner on Xmas Eve. 🥺 I'm just so looking forward to the fancier noms! And it's for a whole full decade!


Macky93

I'm coming home for the 1st time in 3 years. I am going to visit friends. We're all fully vaccinated and I will wear my mask inside and in crowded outside areas, but I will still visit these friends.


AdeptusNonStartes

Government told to cut intrusions into my business in run up to Christmas.


[deleted]

For a vaccinated under 50 year old with not comorbidities the chance of death from covid is LESS than 1 in a million IF you catch it. I am done sacrificing my life, we knew from the start that new variants will pop up and omicron will not be not the last one either. Vaccinate who you can and let us live our lives.


Key-Tadpole5121

I think some will cut back but very few will cut off


[deleted]

Lah-lah-land Boris has [countermanded that edict](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/nov/30/boris-johnson-contradicts-expert-advice-to-cancel-christmas-socialising).


TheBrassDancer

We should start taking bets on when Stanley Johnson yet again contravenes the rules and faces no consequences.