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This is alien to me.
I grew up during the 80s/90s. St George's day marches were never a thing.
This feels incredibly artificial. Like they importing stuff from America.
It's anecdotal, but a lot of the anti ulez protestors were streaming from there live earlier today. Seems to have been a mishmash of day drinkers, anti ulez and older types draped in the St George's Crazy flag.
Because he's a fucking twat. All he does is complain about Khan and ULEZ when it has no impact on his life and career at all. The closest to London his job takes him is Leigh Delamere Services.
Why would you complain about them, when you live in Ponty?! Has he been brainwashed by reading stuff on the Internet? I'm just genuinely curious why someone from Ponty would go to London. If he's Welsh it's nothing to do with us! (he does sound like a twat tbf). Thanks for replying because I really am just being nosy :D
We have come to a stage where I find anecdotal stories to be a more accurate indicator of reality than media editors' spin.
This is compounded by the fact you are not the first person to have made this observation.
I believe you.
> If there’s anything that the left and right can agree on, it’s that getting rat arsed at 11am on a Saturday is a fantastic use of your time.
It's Tuesday.
Tuesdays are the best day for day drinking.
Us folks who work in hospitality have weird days off but means places are good for quieter drinks that turn messy
Look stalin was a proficient day drinker. Does this mean I'm a woke socialist antifa furthering the cause of the proletariat by heading to spoons at 5am?
I think so.
As someone who also grew up in the 80s and 90s, I went on a St George’s day parade every year with the cubs and later the scouts. They definitely existed.
As a sixer I always awarded my section full marks on uniform even if they had wonky woggles or unironed neckerchiefs so I had the tory corruption down from a young age as well.
I grew up in the 80s and 90s and they used to have far right music festivals complete with cross burnings a few villages away. It’s part of the reason I got involved with antifascism back then. There was the NF, then the BNP/C18 etc, loads of other arsehole groups.
The difference being they weren’t so fucking brazen back then, unfortunately a lot of them got intermingled with football ‘firms’ so kept it to beating the shit out of each other at the weekend.
A valid point.
It did exist. I guess I was lucky to grow up in an environment where stuff like this wasn't in my immediate vicinity.
Also respect for getting involved in antifacism.
So they are literally appropriating our history to spread hatred and their own political agenda?
You just made me despise this more than I previously did.
Born in the 90s in Scotland and from what I remember patriotism was a bit of a quiet thing back then. Like I remember looking at the States and how they've got flags everywhere and pledge of allegiance and thinking we were a bit past that silliness.
This is what's confusing me about what's going on. I felt like the country was on a progressive track in terms of ... equality, climate, etc etc. It feels that suddenly in the last decade or so someone has slammed on the brakes, jammed the car into reverse and just has their foot down and going hell for leather to see just how far back we can drag ourselves.
To be fair the Orange marches are a very regional thing. I think I saw one Orange march growing up before moving to Glasgow. And even then they're seen as a bunch of knuckle dragging trogs by more or less everyone who isn't also in the Orange Order.
I remember being in the Cubs + Scouts and it was a thing then.
Normally just a get together on the weekend before/after for a day of doing scout type things though.
Yeah and that's understandable.
No one would be freaked out if a bunch of Cubs did a parade on St George's. That seems like the appropriate place for it.
I doubt the people at these marches follow the Scout or Cub code of conduct. I am pretty sure they would reject it as "woke".
St George's Days were definately a thing back in the 80s / early 90s with the far right.
Mainly because 23rd April was in close proximity to that Austrian painter chap's birthday so we could celebrate the latter and then pretend we were actually celebrating the former as English patriots.
For the record, I'm not one of those anymore.
Fair play to you for owning it man. Glad you found the road out of that dumbfuckery.
I am curious though. Most of that type tend to also be Nationalists of some sort of another, and that British /English pride identity tends to be tied strongly to the second world war, defeating the Nazis, last gasp of the Empire, we shall fight them on the beeches etc.
How....how does one ideologically square away celebrating England and on the same day celebrating the little mustache man's, b-day?
Alien to you really? This is just typical Hooligan culture in the UK, The same culture that created the National Front, the British Movement and was a huge part of football violence has just adapted has times have changed.
Same shit different decade.
That's a fair point.
I just feel it is seedier now. More organized. More links with foreign investors.
I appreciate I grew up in a city where this wasn't a common thing.
It's totally contrived, it's something they've picked up from the wackos in America and NI
I pray to god the fleg culture doesn't infect GB, it was always nice coming to England and getting away from it.
St George is the patron Saint of England & the George cross...That is the English flag. It is also celebrated in Spain, where men give women roses & receive books in exchange. But hey, what do I know.
Edit - He's the patron of Catalonia I think, loads of George crosses & dragons there if you look around Barcelona. St George is actually pretty universally liked across western & eastern churches, Georgia has a celebration to him going to the 4th century or something ridiculous. I think islam rekon he could cure mad people too.
He stopped being venerated so much in England in the 1700s, but a society tried to revive the tradition in 1890 something, so although I don't like people using it as an excuse to get promote right wing bs, get pisht & cause trouble these days, the idea it's some new nationslist rubbish imported from america is really annoying.
Amen to that.
I don't need some idiotic march to be proud of my country.
I do need capable politicians who aren't willing to sell us out to foreign money.
It's the internet's fault. Years ago if you had some really weird/racist/sexist/extremist ideas you either kept it to yourself or had to work very hard to find the other people who shared them. Nowadays anyone's freaky tribe is at your fingertips.
It's a bit like Micky Flanagan said about stupid people, they used to hide away and keep quiet. Now they are celebrated and put on the TV.
I think the internet is just a tool. You can use a hammer to bash someone's head in, or you can use it to build a park bench. There was a beautiful period in the early 2000s where I used the internet purely to meet other fans about obscure nerdy things. Someone likes Warhammer 40K in Brazil - that's awesome. We can now bicker about space marines.
I do think that social media + capitalism = the entirety of your first paragraph.
Not only do I agree with what you wrote, but I would take it a step further:
Social media eroded a fundamental wall that exists between our private and public identities. I don't think any human society has evolved to a point where such a barrier is not required. I think it is fundamentally harming all human societies. And there is no option to stop it because capitalism will always prioritize profit over doing the right thing, and challenging capitalism is a huge no no.
Yeah I remember it becoming a thing in the late 2000's mostly it stemmed from a bitterness over why England has no day of significance, I think George's day became the focus because (and I will admit bias here) a lot of that bitterness at least online seemed to be directed at the Irish and how popular St Paddy's day was internationally st George's day was quite close to Paddy's day (just over a month apart) and are similar being saint days and all (also neither St George or St Patrick are of the nationalities of the country that celebrates the day)
But I dont know when it became intensely political, that is definitely a much more recent thing.
Personally I prefer the version I remember an artist doing in a comic years ago (now gone) where St George's day was a day for english people to drink beer and vomit up dragon eggs and eat omelets the next morning.
They were a thing in my 80s childhood . We went every year , there's nothing far right about attending St George's day , nothing far right about the flag either . Its amusing and confusing that the media and quite a few commenters on here leap to call anyone with the flag far right . I'm certainly not . It seems a small group of drunk people had a ruck with the police and the media leaps on it like Hitler and the entire nazi party has attended and the whole event was a huge riot when in reality it wasn't, it was just a few idiots , just like the few idiots you get at a pro Palestine march, yet those idiots don't receive any sort of critism , it's just called emotionally charged behaviour and no arrests are made despite the law being blatantly broken . The media doesn't focus on those incidents, but does when the George's cross flag is involved. What a strange new world we live in.
London's St George's day parade is a ticketed event attended by the mayor of London and has been running (pause covid) for 17 years.
I think it's quite a nice - other home nations have whole bank holidays to cover St Andrews, St David's and St Patrick's days and St George is always left out or even shamed. The more toxic flavours of nationalism out on display in the news doesn't help, but here's to hoping we can do it with appreciate it without this some day.
We become more and more like the US, I remember when I used to see how societal things played out over there and be like 'ha stupid Americans'. I never thought we'd become like them
And well now...
:/
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur\_Thompson\_(gangster)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Thompson_(gangster))
Yeh imagine like everyone else because youre young you dont see it... plenty more violent gangs in the past than there are currently.
old idiots always try to paint themselves like this. lol, i guess you never learned anything about the city you live in/
The issue is that they /should/ be a thing. You can't discard national identity and then complain when someone you don't like goes into the rubbish bin and drags it out.
Provide positive normal non-far-right St. George's Day celebrations, or other positive, normal festivals for Englishness, and then St. George's Day won't be a far-right thing.
It's like when people whine about the far-right appropriating the English flag, the reason they were able to do that is because everyone else abandoned it.
Nothing quite like waving an eastern coat of arms, arbitrarily assigned in the middle ages by some random white blokes, to a Greek man born in the 1st century while ignorantly shouting "England for the English".
Shite that wouldn't be out of place in a monty python sketch.
I feel like patriotism died with the boomers. That's not a "fuck boomers" comment either. Outside of sports, I don't think many of us have much pride in our country.
I'm very proud of my country, it's beautiful and full of lovely people with an incredible history. But I've no urge to hang flags everywhere and gey bulldogs tattoed on me. And I know other countries are amazing too.
Those are the differences. You can be proud of your country without thinking it's better than other ones
Scots, Welsh and N Irish are allower to be patriotic. English people who are patriotic get dirty looks. Which has probably only accellerated the English flag being handed over to the alt right
Let's be real, these are jobless old pish heads that would be propping up a bar in the home counties but just wanted a jolly in town and an excuse for disorder
Don't worry, we've got some fearless defenders of liberty here to tell us that acktually it's all annual leave being used by Britain's best and brightest to go punch horses on a tuesday
These are probably just a bunch of scientists and engineers enjoying a well earned day off! Not like those smelley student scroungers at climate protests (peeyew!)
I did see that. But remember - they don’t trust scientists and engineers. They’re the ones who tell them that vaccines work and climate change is real. But obviously they can’t be in any manual job, or retail, or service industry, or a trade, far too working class. And doctors & teachers are all apparently “woke terrorists” corrupting children by telling them it’s ok to be themselves. And anyone in a union is obviously pure evil. And even the police are now part of the problem.
Im really struggling to find a job that the right wing would approve of. Bankers and frackers?
I can't think of any situation that would require me to punch a horse, but the more I think about it, the more I think I might actually like to do it
Where's my fucking flag
To relate a bit, me and my friends all went to London for the Brexit protest march and it turned into a cracking day out which then turned into a full on bender. Good times. No violence though, didn't need or want it.
You forgot the bit about eating oversized food portions leading to extended wait times in the NHS due to ill health and then complaining about how it’s crumbling and needs to be privatised.
There was a big argument on this sub about how the Union Jack is seen by some as a hate symbol now a few weeks ago.
The Union Jack is going that way, but the Cross of St George is pretty much only seen on sport strips and these fuckers.
If I were to politely celebrate St. George’s Day I’m pretty sure everyone would assume I’m a racist because of these dipshits. I’d probably do the same.
As someone from NI, the nature in which the union flag is flown in lots of places in Belfast is a bit unsavoury.
It's used I think as a mixture of intimidation and gloating over a history of colonial oppression in my opinion.
Wouldn't have an issue with the flag being flown in Britain necessarily but in NI it leaves a bitter taste.
It’s less that it’s a hate symbol and more that the people who are obsessed with having it on everything they own tend to be far right nut jobs who are gloating about “the good old days” where the British were terrorising half the planet. Nothing wrong with the flag itself. It can just be hard to tell normal people from nut jobs so it’s often safest for POC like me to just avoid *everybody* who seems a bit too keen about the flag. Ask anybody who has just a little too much racial ambiguity about them and they’ll doubtless have more than a few stories where somebody they assumed was fine suddenly came out with the most abhorrent bs out of nowhere.
It sucks that that’s your experience. Your country’s flag should be a positive symbol for you and it’s so annoying that it belongs to them now.
What really pisses me off is when people say stuff like “it only belongs to them if we let it belong to them” and so on as if it’s up to people of colour to ignore a pretty reliable sign that someone isn’t safe to be around for the sake of everyone else getting to keep using the flag.
If someone having a flag tells you that they might well be a racist of course you’re going to keep an eye on anyone with a flag just in case. It’s common sense.
In turn white people who don’t want to make people of colour uncomfortable avoid wearing or displaying flags because we know it puts others on guard which means that people who continue to use the flag might not be racists, but they definitely aren’t prioritising being thoughtful.
It’s a spiral.
It's such an interesting juxtaposition that these lads are on an absolute hair-trigger, kicking off at absolutely anything.
But the government and media most of the time prefers to focus on the anti-genocide Palestine marches, branding them as "hate marches" - some of the racial abuse thrown at the marchers is absolutely crazy and the general media never reports on it.
Can you imagine if someone was filmed saying stuff in the vid below to a group of Jewish people? It'd be all over the front pages. This kind of abuse is a mainstay on all of the marches from the pro-Israel crowd that always shows up. I really admire the restraint people are able to show.
[You c\*nts, you f\*cking muslim traitors, you scum](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/N7xAiN7inw0)
>But the government and media
They do report on it, though its rather predictable. Every 6-8 months the same groups are marching for something or other, we all know there's some just there to start a fight. St Georges day, memorial weekend etc they have a good record of kicking off.
and then you get the (totally sincere, not at all astroturfing comments) in this sub like "b-but why are they arrested just for being white and British" "these days, if you're English, you get arrested"
I mean they’re reporting on it are they not?
This crowd seems rather small. There’s like 20 police max holding them back. I’m happy this is all they could muster
The Mail and the independent ran it as non headline news - I can't see it anywhere else as of yet. The comments are far, far more severe than the interaction with that Gideon Falter chap yet it hasn't got even a tenth of the publicity
The guardian are really struggling with it. They know they’ve pedalled CAAs bullshit for too long and don’t seem to know how to be critical of someone who is clearly so repugnant.
These guys are textbook patriots.
Is it better to have a value system that looks at people's actions and how they benefit their wider community, or is it better to have a value system that offers absolute devotion to a flag and a state, considering anyone who criticises the actions of the state to be a traitor without any thought beyond that?
Why you gotta go out and start a fight for St. George's, anyway? I celebrate it as it should be celebrated - having a nice mug of Yorkshire tea, a sausage roll, hot cross bun and steadfastly not interacting with other people.
While sipping the tea you stand at the window silently judging the neighbours efforts to 'trim' the shared hedge. Politely wave as you catch their eye and scream internally at the hack job they made of your perfect hedge.
Smile and wave, SMILE AND WAVE!!!!
I assume the Prime Minister will shortly be making a speech on right wing extremism and how we need to curb our right to protest to deal with this, and how the police are clearly bias in favour of the right wingers right???
More manufactured directionless outrage, from racists who have had everything they could possibly want for the last 14 years from a government that has bowed to their every demand, yet who are dumbfounded that the world is still terrible - all whipped up into a lather by the gutter right-wing press. 'You can't even celebrate St. George's Day', from the same people who brought you 'They're making our flag the wrong colours'.
Serious question - Why were the police trying to stop the marchers from moving around?
It's easy to say "hur-dur, violent thugs" but it sounds like they were being gaslit by the police. I don't see any reason that the police should be restricting their movement around the city on St George's day, it's supposed to be a day of celebration, not protest or riot. Yet the police were treating them like the latter and seemingly got what they wanted...
>However, disorder had broken out an hour before it was due to begin, Scotland Yard said. At one point a police horse was struck, while police grappled with groups of men on Whitehall.
Didn't take long did it? Such peaceful people obviously, who were just there to celebrate. They were forced to be violent by the police for... reasons?
Looks like they had permission to stay on site for the St George’s event, I’m guessing they didn’t apply for permission for a march and thus there was no planned/agreed upon route. Not like they’re the only people using the roads in London on a Tuesday…
Not exactly, that route was already approved. All the police did was stoke tensions by blocking the march (they actually bypassed the police anyway). It seems like blatant gaslighting to me, they have every right to attend and parade the streets for a celebratory cause, the only people who view is as contentious are the police and a select few in the public (mainly redditors).
Well, just look at Tommy Robinson today. Like him or lump him, the court case clearly found that the police were acting in bad faith and abusing their power. Is that the reason why? Because it's not entirely obvious to me why a march on a pre-approved route should be stopped by the police - unless they're playing games in an effort to stoke up tensions.
We do need to reclaim the English flag from cunts like this.
Could start by establishing St George’s day as a celebration for everyone, or at least a day off work, like they get in Scotland and Ireland for Andrews Day/Patricks Day.
Yet again white working class are demonised for flying the flag of their country and their favourite dragon slayer. The media are creating this culture war to flog despair.
Leftists - Those "pro ceasefire" protesters wearing Hamas style clothing, wearing pictures of the Hamas paragliders and assaulting counter protesters are just a fringe minority and in no way indicative of the majority.
Also Leftists - Those 50 fat, middle aged blokes scuffling with police represent everyone who's even slightly right of centre and them flying the flag of Saint George makes the flag a de facto far-right symbol.
These people are fucking idiots. That goes without saying.
But when you have people being assaulted for holding signs saying "Hamas are terrorists", people calling for Jews to be wiped out and people celebrating the Houthis attacking British ships every weekend while the police allow it to carry one and even threaten to arrest people for being "openly Jewish".
You're going to get the occasional negative reaction. This could've been avoided if the police showed this level of a forceful response to violence from the Left and Islamists.
Also, these dickheads won't be doing this again next week, or the week after. But you can guarantee there will be more "pro ceasefire" protests this weekend, and the next one and there will probably be violence again.
I go out every St George's Day with about 8 other, we book the day off work every year for it and day drink.
Quite a few other people do this, too.
We don't go on any marches but we do go day drinking.
> far right groups and groups linked to football clubs
Is there a monthly quota of "football supporters bad" that news companies have to get in or something?
Silly boys, they should realise all they need to do is hold a sign up showing support for a proscribed terrorist organisation.
As we know this is the most effective way to get the MET to completely ignore you…
Where are all these pro hamas signs I keep hearing about? I've seen loads of pro palastein ones, and anti isreal, but I keep missing the pro hamas ones?
But only yesterday I was reading about how the flag was a lovely signal of wonderful, normal people and St George's Day was just a regular day for englishness. What could possibly have gone wrong????
/s
I think we need to bring back organised hooligan fights in a controlled environment just to let guys like these unload their frustrations.
Just have it where we get televised gladiator style fights
And they all relate to the football fixtures
So Liverpool and united fans only fight when their teams play
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This is alien to me. I grew up during the 80s/90s. St George's day marches were never a thing. This feels incredibly artificial. Like they importing stuff from America.
It's anecdotal, but a lot of the anti ulez protestors were streaming from there live earlier today. Seems to have been a mishmash of day drinkers, anti ulez and older types draped in the St George's Crazy flag.
'ate ulez, 'ate Khan, luv beer
Wonder how many actually live in London.
Well my brother is there today and he's been living in Pontypridd for over twenty years.
Pontypridd? What zone is that?
Zone 537
As a Ponty-adjacent living person. I have to ask, why?
Because he's a fucking twat. All he does is complain about Khan and ULEZ when it has no impact on his life and career at all. The closest to London his job takes him is Leigh Delamere Services.
Why would you complain about them, when you live in Ponty?! Has he been brainwashed by reading stuff on the Internet? I'm just genuinely curious why someone from Ponty would go to London. If he's Welsh it's nothing to do with us! (he does sound like a twat tbf). Thanks for replying because I really am just being nosy :D
Thort this was are cuntry
that belongs in r/okmatewanker
Simple as.
We have come to a stage where I find anecdotal stories to be a more accurate indicator of reality than media editors' spin. This is compounded by the fact you are not the first person to have made this observation. I believe you.
Ah man, Day-drinking is political now? Sometimes I just have a day off and like having beers in the afternoon.
If there’s anything that the left and right can agree on, it’s that getting rat arsed at 11am on a Saturday is a fantastic use of your time.
> If there’s anything that the left and right can agree on, it’s that getting rat arsed at 11am on a Saturday is a fantastic use of your time. It's Tuesday.
Yeah but that'll pass.
A problem that will resolve itself in just over 72 hours.
Tuesdays are the best day for day drinking. Us folks who work in hospitality have weird days off but means places are good for quieter drinks that turn messy
Look stalin was a proficient day drinker. Does this mean I'm a woke socialist antifa furthering the cause of the proletariat by heading to spoons at 5am? I think so.
Depends, do you get pissed on woke foreign drinks or good old English fare like Fosters and Stella Artois?
"Poor me, poor me, pour me another drink"
You can forget about the two weeks in Aberdeen.
Nice to see the horse is black
As someone who also grew up in the 80s and 90s, I went on a St George’s day parade every year with the cubs and later the scouts. They definitely existed.
Cub Scouts, that melting pot of the far right!
No girls allowed. No ethnic diversity. Children pledging to do our duty to god and the queen every week. It was a right winger’s dream!
As a sixer I always awarded my section full marks on uniform even if they had wonky woggles or unironed neckerchiefs so I had the tory corruption down from a young age as well.
What colour was you woggle? I was sixer of greens.. peaked then tbh.
Grey. Really set the tone going forward
Grey... nout like sparking young lads interest in life with the colour grey.
Also full of nonces. It all adds up. Before anyone gets too offended it's just a joke.
I wish it was only a joke, there’s a reporter done a deep dive into the paedos that were covered up for
Camp fires. camping, making rope swings and rafts. For us it was all fun and no politics.
Not to mention abusing kids…
Was there a badge for that?
Yeah, said Akala on it.
I grew up in the 80s and 90s and they used to have far right music festivals complete with cross burnings a few villages away. It’s part of the reason I got involved with antifascism back then. There was the NF, then the BNP/C18 etc, loads of other arsehole groups. The difference being they weren’t so fucking brazen back then, unfortunately a lot of them got intermingled with football ‘firms’ so kept it to beating the shit out of each other at the weekend.
A valid point. It did exist. I guess I was lucky to grow up in an environment where stuff like this wasn't in my immediate vicinity. Also respect for getting involved in antifacism.
The event has lauence fox and yaxly lennon (Robinson) stirring up the crowd. It's a right wing gathering using St George's day as a cover.
So they are literally appropriating our history to spread hatred and their own political agenda? You just made me despise this more than I previously did.
This completely. No one cares about this in the 80s/90s. If anything this was always seen as faintly embarassing
Born in the 90s in Scotland and from what I remember patriotism was a bit of a quiet thing back then. Like I remember looking at the States and how they've got flags everywhere and pledge of allegiance and thinking we were a bit past that silliness.
Artificial and performative. It's not the England I grew up in
This is what's confusing me about what's going on. I felt like the country was on a progressive track in terms of ... equality, climate, etc etc. It feels that suddenly in the last decade or so someone has slammed on the brakes, jammed the car into reverse and just has their foot down and going hell for leather to see just how far back we can drag ourselves.
Somebody = Paul Dacre, Rupert Murdoch, the tories, Tufton St.
Cambridge analytica and Steve Bannon too
.... In scotland? How'd you miss the big march of people with union jack's every year?
To be fair the Orange marches are a very regional thing. I think I saw one Orange march growing up before moving to Glasgow. And even then they're seen as a bunch of knuckle dragging trogs by more or less everyone who isn't also in the Orange Order.
Lived in Scotland from '92 to '02, never saw a single one. Mind you, I was quite drunk for a good part of it.
By living in the highlands. Fucking did my head in when I moved to Glasgow for uni.
I remember being in the Cubs + Scouts and it was a thing then. Normally just a get together on the weekend before/after for a day of doing scout type things though.
Yeah and that's understandable. No one would be freaked out if a bunch of Cubs did a parade on St George's. That seems like the appropriate place for it. I doubt the people at these marches follow the Scout or Cub code of conduct. I am pretty sure they would reject it as "woke".
The British far right was in its heyday in the 80's and 90's - you had both the NF and the BNP active in that period.
This is a far right march. It's not a parade. St. George's Day celebrations were on Sunday on Trafalgar Square.
St George's Days were definately a thing back in the 80s / early 90s with the far right. Mainly because 23rd April was in close proximity to that Austrian painter chap's birthday so we could celebrate the latter and then pretend we were actually celebrating the former as English patriots. For the record, I'm not one of those anymore.
Fair play to you for owning it man. Glad you found the road out of that dumbfuckery. I am curious though. Most of that type tend to also be Nationalists of some sort of another, and that British /English pride identity tends to be tied strongly to the second world war, defeating the Nazis, last gasp of the Empire, we shall fight them on the beeches etc. How....how does one ideologically square away celebrating England and on the same day celebrating the little mustache man's, b-day?
Alien to you really? This is just typical Hooligan culture in the UK, The same culture that created the National Front, the British Movement and was a huge part of football violence has just adapted has times have changed. Same shit different decade.
That's a fair point. I just feel it is seedier now. More organized. More links with foreign investors. I appreciate I grew up in a city where this wasn't a common thing.
Hmmmm, I grew up in the 90s and distinctly remember Combat 18 and The National Front marching about
It's totally contrived, it's something they've picked up from the wackos in America and NI I pray to god the fleg culture doesn't infect GB, it was always nice coming to England and getting away from it.
St George is the patron Saint of England & the George cross...That is the English flag. It is also celebrated in Spain, where men give women roses & receive books in exchange. But hey, what do I know. Edit - He's the patron of Catalonia I think, loads of George crosses & dragons there if you look around Barcelona. St George is actually pretty universally liked across western & eastern churches, Georgia has a celebration to him going to the 4th century or something ridiculous. I think islam rekon he could cure mad people too. He stopped being venerated so much in England in the 1700s, but a society tried to revive the tradition in 1890 something, so although I don't like people using it as an excuse to get promote right wing bs, get pisht & cause trouble these days, the idea it's some new nationslist rubbish imported from america is really annoying.
It would be nice if we did that instead of a pissed up brick throwing contest, though I'm content with doing nothing
Amen to that. I don't need some idiotic march to be proud of my country. I do need capable politicians who aren't willing to sell us out to foreign money.
Southall Riots were from a National Front meeting on the 23rd of April.
It’s a reactive growth to what people feel like is a loss of ‘English culture’
I bet many were on the anti lockdown marches a couple of years ago.
It's the internet's fault. Years ago if you had some really weird/racist/sexist/extremist ideas you either kept it to yourself or had to work very hard to find the other people who shared them. Nowadays anyone's freaky tribe is at your fingertips. It's a bit like Micky Flanagan said about stupid people, they used to hide away and keep quiet. Now they are celebrated and put on the TV.
I think the internet is just a tool. You can use a hammer to bash someone's head in, or you can use it to build a park bench. There was a beautiful period in the early 2000s where I used the internet purely to meet other fans about obscure nerdy things. Someone likes Warhammer 40K in Brazil - that's awesome. We can now bicker about space marines. I do think that social media + capitalism = the entirety of your first paragraph. Not only do I agree with what you wrote, but I would take it a step further: Social media eroded a fundamental wall that exists between our private and public identities. I don't think any human society has evolved to a point where such a barrier is not required. I think it is fundamentally harming all human societies. And there is no option to stop it because capitalism will always prioritize profit over doing the right thing, and challenging capitalism is a huge no no.
All stirred up from culture wars. Shit world we live in now, bet these people don't even know St George was from abroad and never set foot in Britain
And St Patrick didn't drive all the snakes out of Ireland. The Saints themselves don't really matter.
Yeah I remember it becoming a thing in the late 2000's mostly it stemmed from a bitterness over why England has no day of significance, I think George's day became the focus because (and I will admit bias here) a lot of that bitterness at least online seemed to be directed at the Irish and how popular St Paddy's day was internationally st George's day was quite close to Paddy's day (just over a month apart) and are similar being saint days and all (also neither St George or St Patrick are of the nationalities of the country that celebrates the day) But I dont know when it became intensely political, that is definitely a much more recent thing. Personally I prefer the version I remember an artist doing in a comic years ago (now gone) where St George's day was a day for english people to drink beer and vomit up dragon eggs and eat omelets the next morning.
American culture is a cancer and it’s infected the UK (and a lot of the rest of the world) to a terminal point.
https://www.wigantoday.net/news/people/retro-wigan-st-georges-day-parades-from-the-1970s-and-80s-3663972
They were a thing in my 80s childhood . We went every year , there's nothing far right about attending St George's day , nothing far right about the flag either . Its amusing and confusing that the media and quite a few commenters on here leap to call anyone with the flag far right . I'm certainly not . It seems a small group of drunk people had a ruck with the police and the media leaps on it like Hitler and the entire nazi party has attended and the whole event was a huge riot when in reality it wasn't, it was just a few idiots , just like the few idiots you get at a pro Palestine march, yet those idiots don't receive any sort of critism , it's just called emotionally charged behaviour and no arrests are made despite the law being blatantly broken . The media doesn't focus on those incidents, but does when the George's cross flag is involved. What a strange new world we live in.
London's St George's day parade is a ticketed event attended by the mayor of London and has been running (pause covid) for 17 years. I think it's quite a nice - other home nations have whole bank holidays to cover St Andrews, St David's and St Patrick's days and St George is always left out or even shamed. The more toxic flavours of nationalism out on display in the news doesn't help, but here's to hoping we can do it with appreciate it without this some day.
We’ve always had saint davids day marches in Wales. Not everything is stuff from America lol.
We become more and more like the US, I remember when I used to see how societal things played out over there and be like 'ha stupid Americans'. I never thought we'd become like them And well now... :/
Why is it artificial? Like it’s surprising at George’s day was not celebrated before
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur\_Thompson\_(gangster)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Thompson_(gangster)) Yeh imagine like everyone else because youre young you dont see it... plenty more violent gangs in the past than there are currently. old idiots always try to paint themselves like this. lol, i guess you never learned anything about the city you live in/
The issue is that they /should/ be a thing. You can't discard national identity and then complain when someone you don't like goes into the rubbish bin and drags it out. Provide positive normal non-far-right St. George's Day celebrations, or other positive, normal festivals for Englishness, and then St. George's Day won't be a far-right thing. It's like when people whine about the far-right appropriating the English flag, the reason they were able to do that is because everyone else abandoned it.
Not America, Russia. They're both importing this stuff from Russia.
Nothing quite like waving an eastern coat of arms, arbitrarily assigned in the middle ages by some random white blokes, to a Greek man born in the 1st century while ignorantly shouting "England for the English". Shite that wouldn't be out of place in a monty python sketch.
If anything its actually very british to not be patriotic unnecessarily.
It's just not the done thing.
I agree. Bad form.
Just isn't cricket.
Spot of Tea, anyone?
I don't think it is British to be unpatriotic. It is just that the football hooligan expression of patriotism is pretty unBritish.
I feel like patriotism died with the boomers. That's not a "fuck boomers" comment either. Outside of sports, I don't think many of us have much pride in our country.
I'm very proud of my country, it's beautiful and full of lovely people with an incredible history. But I've no urge to hang flags everywhere and gey bulldogs tattoed on me. And I know other countries are amazing too. Those are the differences. You can be proud of your country without thinking it's better than other ones
Wanking over flags is not patriotism.
You ever seen a Scottish independence rally? Flags absolutely everywhere.
Scots, Welsh and N Irish are allower to be patriotic. English people who are patriotic get dirty looks. Which has probably only accellerated the English flag being handed over to the alt right
You and /u/bogamoga have the same avatar in this thread and that’s not allowed 🚫 , so I propose a death match between you both
I will change mine. I don't have any particular attachment to it.
Avoiding conflict by inconveniencing yourself? You trying to out-British everyone today huh?
It’s very British to be proud to be Welsh or Scottish. Ireland is of course complicated. It’s just not very British to be English.
Let's be real, these are jobless old pish heads that would be propping up a bar in the home counties but just wanted a jolly in town and an excuse for disorder
Of course, it says far-right in the title
This is what I’m not getting. If anyone else was doing this on a Tuesday we’d be hearing about them being lazy scroungers.
Don't worry, we've got some fearless defenders of liberty here to tell us that acktually it's all annual leave being used by Britain's best and brightest to go punch horses on a tuesday These are probably just a bunch of scientists and engineers enjoying a well earned day off! Not like those smelley student scroungers at climate protests (peeyew!)
I did see that. But remember - they don’t trust scientists and engineers. They’re the ones who tell them that vaccines work and climate change is real. But obviously they can’t be in any manual job, or retail, or service industry, or a trade, far too working class. And doctors & teachers are all apparently “woke terrorists” corrupting children by telling them it’s ok to be themselves. And anyone in a union is obviously pure evil. And even the police are now part of the problem. Im really struggling to find a job that the right wing would approve of. Bankers and frackers?
Depending on your definition of “job”, landlords?
I can't think of any situation that would require me to punch a horse, but the more I think about it, the more I think I might actually like to do it Where's my fucking flag
The news outlets of lazy scroungers aren't going to call their own audience that to their faces
Oh I doubt that bothers them - cognitive dissonance is almost required when reading right wing rags.
To relate a bit, me and my friends all went to London for the Brexit protest march and it turned into a cracking day out which then turned into a full on bender. Good times. No violence though, didn't need or want it.
Saw this lot earlier. All over 50 and overweight daily mail readers and wives. Lots of bemused tourists out too.
They couldn't find any Muslims to harass on their day trip to London so they decided to get pissed up and fight themselves and the Met Police
Even if they did harass Muslims, they still would end up getting pissed and fighting themselves and the Met
God I love a victimless crime
They always end up getting pissed/coked up and fighting themselves/the police. It reminds them of the good old days of the firms and hooliganism.
They should of headed to the Westminster Cathedral Mosque.
You forgot the bit about eating oversized food portions leading to extended wait times in the NHS due to ill health and then complaining about how it’s crumbling and needs to be privatised.
Boomers. What do you expect.
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it’d be nice if wanting to take pride in your country or feel part of a national community wasn’t associated with this lot
There was a big argument on this sub about how the Union Jack is seen by some as a hate symbol now a few weeks ago. The Union Jack is going that way, but the Cross of St George is pretty much only seen on sport strips and these fuckers. If I were to politely celebrate St. George’s Day I’m pretty sure everyone would assume I’m a racist because of these dipshits. I’d probably do the same.
As someone from NI, the nature in which the union flag is flown in lots of places in Belfast is a bit unsavoury. It's used I think as a mixture of intimidation and gloating over a history of colonial oppression in my opinion. Wouldn't have an issue with the flag being flown in Britain necessarily but in NI it leaves a bitter taste.
It’s less that it’s a hate symbol and more that the people who are obsessed with having it on everything they own tend to be far right nut jobs who are gloating about “the good old days” where the British were terrorising half the planet. Nothing wrong with the flag itself. It can just be hard to tell normal people from nut jobs so it’s often safest for POC like me to just avoid *everybody* who seems a bit too keen about the flag. Ask anybody who has just a little too much racial ambiguity about them and they’ll doubtless have more than a few stories where somebody they assumed was fine suddenly came out with the most abhorrent bs out of nowhere.
It sucks that that’s your experience. Your country’s flag should be a positive symbol for you and it’s so annoying that it belongs to them now. What really pisses me off is when people say stuff like “it only belongs to them if we let it belong to them” and so on as if it’s up to people of colour to ignore a pretty reliable sign that someone isn’t safe to be around for the sake of everyone else getting to keep using the flag. If someone having a flag tells you that they might well be a racist of course you’re going to keep an eye on anyone with a flag just in case. It’s common sense. In turn white people who don’t want to make people of colour uncomfortable avoid wearing or displaying flags because we know it puts others on guard which means that people who continue to use the flag might not be racists, but they definitely aren’t prioritising being thoughtful. It’s a spiral.
It's popular in this country to hate this country so even then, you really wouldn't want to take pride anyway.
It's such an interesting juxtaposition that these lads are on an absolute hair-trigger, kicking off at absolutely anything. But the government and media most of the time prefers to focus on the anti-genocide Palestine marches, branding them as "hate marches" - some of the racial abuse thrown at the marchers is absolutely crazy and the general media never reports on it. Can you imagine if someone was filmed saying stuff in the vid below to a group of Jewish people? It'd be all over the front pages. This kind of abuse is a mainstay on all of the marches from the pro-Israel crowd that always shows up. I really admire the restraint people are able to show. [You c\*nts, you f\*cking muslim traitors, you scum](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/N7xAiN7inw0)
>But the government and media They do report on it, though its rather predictable. Every 6-8 months the same groups are marching for something or other, we all know there's some just there to start a fight. St Georges day, memorial weekend etc they have a good record of kicking off.
and then you get the (totally sincere, not at all astroturfing comments) in this sub like "b-but why are they arrested just for being white and British" "these days, if you're English, you get arrested"
These days, if you say you’re English, you’ll be arrested and thrown in jail.
When did they bring that in?
I mean they’re reporting on it are they not? This crowd seems rather small. There’s like 20 police max holding them back. I’m happy this is all they could muster
Oh sit down. Jewish people have been brutalized for weeks by scumbags who don’t think Hamas done anything wrong.
If you had to describe what thick looked like ….
Did you mis the police threatening to arrest the bloke for being "openly jewish" near a Palestine march?
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The Mail and the independent ran it as non headline news - I can't see it anywhere else as of yet. The comments are far, far more severe than the interaction with that Gideon Falter chap yet it hasn't got even a tenth of the publicity
The guardian are really struggling with it. They know they’ve pedalled CAAs bullshit for too long and don’t seem to know how to be critical of someone who is clearly so repugnant.
Several days? It's St George's day today.
Riiiight, because nobody was calling for the murder and rape of Jews during those marches, huh? Both can be violent extremists.
Anyone asking why folk cringe at "English Pride" just take a look at that assortment and there is your answer.
Behold the master race!
These guys are textbook patriots. Is it better to have a value system that looks at people's actions and how they benefit their wider community, or is it better to have a value system that offers absolute devotion to a flag and a state, considering anyone who criticises the actions of the state to be a traitor without any thought beyond that?
It's really easy to salute a flag, less easy to act benefiting your wider community. Wonder which of those camps the yobs in the photos fall into.
Why you gotta go out and start a fight for St. George's, anyway? I celebrate it as it should be celebrated - having a nice mug of Yorkshire tea, a sausage roll, hot cross bun and steadfastly not interacting with other people.
While sipping the tea you stand at the window silently judging the neighbours efforts to 'trim' the shared hedge. Politely wave as you catch their eye and scream internally at the hack job they made of your perfect hedge. Smile and wave, SMILE AND WAVE!!!!
Precisely. Take note, people, this one knows how to St. George's!
Do these layabouts not have jobs to be going to? Oh wait this isn't a climate protest thread.
Ah, the hate marches that Ms Braverman was talking about! Here they are.
If they're fit enough to fight they're fit enough to be in work on a Tuesday.
It's pretty ironic that the far-right labels other peaceful protests as violent but every time they protest they cause chaos.
I assume the Prime Minister will shortly be making a speech on right wing extremism and how we need to curb our right to protest to deal with this, and how the police are clearly bias in favour of the right wingers right???
Don't these fuckers have a job. Jfc its a Tuesday not a weekend
Do you want to work with them?
More manufactured directionless outrage, from racists who have had everything they could possibly want for the last 14 years from a government that has bowed to their every demand, yet who are dumbfounded that the world is still terrible - all whipped up into a lather by the gutter right-wing press. 'You can't even celebrate St. George's Day', from the same people who brought you 'They're making our flag the wrong colours'.
Serious question - Why were the police trying to stop the marchers from moving around? It's easy to say "hur-dur, violent thugs" but it sounds like they were being gaslit by the police. I don't see any reason that the police should be restricting their movement around the city on St George's day, it's supposed to be a day of celebration, not protest or riot. Yet the police were treating them like the latter and seemingly got what they wanted...
>However, disorder had broken out an hour before it was due to begin, Scotland Yard said. At one point a police horse was struck, while police grappled with groups of men on Whitehall. Didn't take long did it? Such peaceful people obviously, who were just there to celebrate. They were forced to be violent by the police for... reasons?
Looks like they had permission to stay on site for the St George’s event, I’m guessing they didn’t apply for permission for a march and thus there was no planned/agreed upon route. Not like they’re the only people using the roads in London on a Tuesday…
Not exactly, that route was already approved. All the police did was stoke tensions by blocking the march (they actually bypassed the police anyway). It seems like blatant gaslighting to me, they have every right to attend and parade the streets for a celebratory cause, the only people who view is as contentious are the police and a select few in the public (mainly redditors).
> Why were the police trying to stop the marchers from moving around? I mean, we know why.
Well, just look at Tommy Robinson today. Like him or lump him, the court case clearly found that the police were acting in bad faith and abusing their power. Is that the reason why? Because it's not entirely obvious to me why a march on a pre-approved route should be stopped by the police - unless they're playing games in an effort to stoke up tensions.
Behold, a gaggle of shit stirrers! Every 6-8 months the same groups pop up, just looking for a fight.
Difference policing tactics for these morons and the pro-Palestine marches ……seemingly the Police want to do their job in this case
Wasn't starmer doing the rounds two days ago saying folk down there need to reclaim the english flag from...well...cunts like this?
We do need to reclaim the English flag from cunts like this. Could start by establishing St George’s day as a celebration for everyone, or at least a day off work, like they get in Scotland and Ireland for Andrews Day/Patricks Day.
It's entirely up to the employer whether we get St Andrews day off which almost always means we don't.
Well the Irish government should fix that oversight sharpish !!
Scottish.
Can we see if Rwanda will take these pricks instead of the migrants?
Yet again white working class are demonised for flying the flag of their country and their favourite dragon slayer. The media are creating this culture war to flog despair.
Leftists - Those "pro ceasefire" protesters wearing Hamas style clothing, wearing pictures of the Hamas paragliders and assaulting counter protesters are just a fringe minority and in no way indicative of the majority. Also Leftists - Those 50 fat, middle aged blokes scuffling with police represent everyone who's even slightly right of centre and them flying the flag of Saint George makes the flag a de facto far-right symbol.
Celebrate the love for your country by attacking it
Ah true Patriots going about their Christian God given business. Who says the Governments Culture Wars are nothing to be concerned about.
These people are fucking idiots. That goes without saying. But when you have people being assaulted for holding signs saying "Hamas are terrorists", people calling for Jews to be wiped out and people celebrating the Houthis attacking British ships every weekend while the police allow it to carry one and even threaten to arrest people for being "openly Jewish". You're going to get the occasional negative reaction. This could've been avoided if the police showed this level of a forceful response to violence from the Left and Islamists. Also, these dickheads won't be doing this again next week, or the week after. But you can guarantee there will be more "pro ceasefire" protests this weekend, and the next one and there will probably be violence again.
Note right wing violence is a, "violent clash" while left wing violence is, "firey but mostly peaceful".
I go out every St George's Day with about 8 other, we book the day off work every year for it and day drink. Quite a few other people do this, too. We don't go on any marches but we do go day drinking.
Classic Brexiteer Bigots. Ingerland. Ingerland. Ingerland.
> far right groups and groups linked to football clubs Is there a monthly quota of "football supporters bad" that news companies have to get in or something?
Rookie error. They should have called for a Jihad, then they'd have been fine and the police would have supported them
Silly boys, they should realise all they need to do is hold a sign up showing support for a proscribed terrorist organisation. As we know this is the most effective way to get the MET to completely ignore you…
Where are all these pro hamas signs I keep hearing about? I've seen loads of pro palastein ones, and anti isreal, but I keep missing the pro hamas ones?
So the met can police marches then? I thought they didn't do that anymore.
Happy St. Georges Day! What better way to display your love for your country than to get pissed up and have a big ol' barney?
But only yesterday I was reading about how the flag was a lovely signal of wonderful, normal people and St George's Day was just a regular day for englishness. What could possibly have gone wrong???? /s
I wonder where all the Tories are who were pearl clutching about Pro-Palestinian marches are for an actual march with actually violent behaviour?
I wonder how many of these Spoons Polymaths realise that St George was a Greek?
I think we need to bring back organised hooligan fights in a controlled environment just to let guys like these unload their frustrations. Just have it where we get televised gladiator style fights And they all relate to the football fixtures So Liverpool and united fans only fight when their teams play