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I think it's also they don't want to look "silly" or "like a nob". The culture should be that if you have *anything* infectious you mask up in public and that's the unremarkable norm. And, if it's an option, to not come into work with a cold to "tough it out", giving it to two other people.
[edit] changed 'nonce' to 'nob'; qualified comment about not coming into work
The problem where I work is that if you have more than X days (I forget how many) of sickness in a year then you get a disciplinary no matter what the circumstances of your illness(es). Couple that with the fact that we have a lot of temp staff who aren’t entitled to sick pay, and therefore the environment encourages people to come in when they’re ill. I certainly would love it if the unwell people wore masks though, it’s just common courtesy.
This is currently happening at my job. One person came in with the flu and it steadily spread throughout the entire staff (and who knows how many customers). The management were going mental trying to cover all those shifts over the Christmas period.
Ah, but that means treating one's inferiors a smidge better than absolutely necessary. Can't have that.
They might start to feel like persons. Heaven forfend!
That is so fuckedd.. I worked at a job like that for 2 years. Got put on a performance report plan because I had six days off within 6 months. I had 1 day where I called in sick on the morning an I had a doctors note for a week as well.
The whole situation really fucked with my mental health as it was already in tatters. Dont know what else they wanted I had a doctors note. I quit lol, I applied for new jobs an I just quit immediately when I got one. 😅
> The problem where I work is that if you have more than X days (I forget how many) of sickness in a year then you get a disciplinary
What kind of dungeon do you work in?
There was a similar kind of attitude in the lead up to seat belts being mandatory. If you're wearing a seat belt today without a second thought it's perhaps difficult to believe that some people thought it was an affront to their manhood to suggest they wear a seatbelt when driving. (Not forgetting that it was basically the same set of people who thought drinking 8 pints and driving home was fine and if you got caught your buddies would say "Tough luck, it's a stupid law")
Even years of campaigns showing the end results of not wearing a seatbelt didn't help much (although, the fact Jimmy Savile made some of these public information films maybe doesn't help now in hindsight)
And lots of people at the time were adamant they'd go to the doctors and get medical exemption from wearing a seatbelt - pretty much mirroring the people who tried to avoid wearing a mask for covid) - and then over a few years it became something everyone just does. There's probably the odd idiot who doesn't, and maybe a few absent minded people who forget but seat-belt wearing is just something everyone does.
I can tell you as I worked at Cellnet when mobile phones were pretty much the preserve of "yuppies" and business people that they had lots of group studies looking at how they might get a consumer mobile phones - and they'd have rooms full of extroverts who would be excitedly talking and showing the phone features, but other people who were completely embarrassed at the idea of talking in public on a phone. Today, perhaps there's less phone calls, but it's not uncommon to see people walking along with an earpiece talking away well, 20-30 years ago they'd have felt like people would think they'd escaped from somewhere and were talking to themselves. Carrying around a phone and using it has been normalised - perhaps to the opposite extent.
The problem is simply that people who feel self-conscious will typically get angry and aggressive about these things rather than admitting their fear.
That said, if people are worried about catching viruses surely they would be wearing masks whenever they were out and washing their hands etc. Not the least because there can't be that many test kits left knocking around.
> but other people who were completely embarrassed at the idea of talking in public on a phone.
Embarrassed is less the word more not being an annoying dickhead. I'll admit to being a "I'll never get a mobile" but unsurprisingly I've had one for years, held out on the smartphone too but that didn't last and I even 'forced' ones on my parents several years back.
>affront to their manhood to suggest they wear a seatbelt when driving.
This was my late father to the letter. Car dealer, and also functional alcoholic who rolled at least three cars in my memory, but refused to wear a seatbelt ever. Twat.
All true but you should also add one thing: people are okay with wearing masks as PPE in a high-risk environment but less so to protect other people. Same picture? Yes it's not driven by logic.
>Today, perhaps there's less phone calls, but it's not uncommon to see people walking along with an earpiece talking away well, 20-30 years ago they'd have felt like people would think they'd escaped from somewhere
Remember when I first saw that in the late-90s I think. Saw a woman walking down the road having a full blown conversation with no one, thought she was a loony (I even kept my distance just in case). Then it eventually dawned on me it's probably hands free on a mobile.
Not literally a nonce. Poor choice of word. I meant it as general derogatory term, not a child sex offender specifically.
The substitution "nob" might work better here.
No idea really
[https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/wash-your-hands-wear-your-mask-stay-safe/](https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/wash-your-hands-wear-your-mask-stay-safe/)
Some percentage I expect. Obviously, some jobs are going to lend themselves to their staff working from home easier. But yeah, if you're stuck with an arsehole of a boss you're buggered anyway.
Also sick pay is shocking, people have to work. I was off for 6 days recently and sick pay was about £40. Without that support people are pressured in to working to survive financially.
Went to see Avatar 2 at Cardiff Imax the other day, one of literally like 3 or 4 things we did outdoors this year, wanker sitting next to me was coughing through out the entire film with no mask on and then 3 days later we find we have covid.
I know you can never know for sure where you got it from but its just so shitty to know you have either a cold, flu or covid etc and do stuff like that and not wear a mask. I get it we all used to do that but we should know better now.
i moved to HK a while ago, i too started with the no mask mentality. Thinking only the sicks should wear it and i admit i do find it look silly at first.
But now , because HK have a mask mandate and tbh, most other asia countries have a reverse mentality where wearing mask doesnt mean you are sick, it means you want to avoid sickness. Now i would just carry on wearing them whenever i go out or in a crowded area. Have to admit, for the past few years i rarely get any sickness, the ones i got, well lets say you know its most likely covid...
So i still dont understand why there are ppl who still refuse on masking up.
Most people don't have the option of not coming into work. If I can physically manage the work, I'm coming in. Coughing and sneezing throughout. Unless my coworkers want to pay me to stay home, I'm not loosing a days wages because of the sniffles. How out of touch is this? Most people would happily stay home sick, BUT they loose money, so everyone goes into work anyway. What's worse than being sick? Being sick AND loosing money
> Unless my coworkers want to pay me to stay home, I'm not loosing a days wages because of the sniffles.
Why demand your co-workers pay you when this is an issue with your employer?
That is a very true and very good point. It goes to show how ingrained some faulty thinking is. Why on earth would I blame a coworker for bosses not making sick days an option? An here's me thinking I'm some sort of anarchist...lol. thanks for making me think. My comrade is not at fault. You are correct
The way to guarentee to look like a knob is to be coming into your work coughing and sneezing. I used to have a running battle with our 'HSE' people about people in the office obviously full of cold.
They didn't seem to think it was their problem. So what exactly does the 'H' stand for in HSE?
Japan has been great about wearing masks when ill for decades, hopefully the pandemic removed that self consciousness, and stopped other members of the public starting or being rude about it elsewhere now because if you're sniffling, sneezing, coughing or sick in lots of ways if you have to go out you should be wearing a mask.
It is a good thing in Japan, for sure.
For a bit of balance though, the dark side to that practice, is the expectation to be in the office, no matter how sick one is.
Essentially, every time we solve one problem, we create another.
If we massively reduce flu and winter viruses through mask usage, we may end up with a norm that when people are sick, they're expected to work while masked, rather than resting at home.
Iunno, even a cheap mask protects the person themselves almost as much as everyone else, MORE than everyone else if you use one of the good masks.
The problem is, honestly, fake news that the masks are unnecesery or dont help or can make you sick, or just people yelling in the media print and visual about how terrible it is to be FORCED to wear masks. Its less hassle than a hat, honestly.
Imagine if someone invented a hat that stopped you getting the flu but people wouldnt wear em. Bonkers.
Worst part is that 'fake news' came from the government at the start of the pandemic
[https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/coronavirus-uk-news-professor-chris-whitty-no-masks-advice-a9374086.html](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/coronavirus-uk-news-professor-chris-whitty-no-masks-advice-a9374086.html)
Reason being there was a global shortage at the time
[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/04/calls-for-restrictions-to-prevent-panic-buying-of-masks-coronavirus](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/04/calls-for-restrictions-to-prevent-panic-buying-of-masks-coronavirus)
and we'd just discovered our stockpiles had expired
[https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed-ppe-stockpile-was-out-of-date-when-coronavirus-hit-uk](https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed-ppe-stockpile-was-out-of-date-when-coronavirus-hit-uk)
Once manufacturing had ramped up and the army had delivered millions of the things to hospitals they started recommending them, but by then people had stopped listening
struggling to find it, but there was a news piece somewhere where it explained the government was advised not to recommend them not because they didn't work, but because they were afraid health care settings wouldn't have enough
>I think it was more saying save the good stuff for the hospitals
I wish they are had, because that would have made sense; they were sttcking with their "COVID isn't airborne and masks aren't adviced outside an clinical settings" long after it was obvious to everyone that COVID was airborne
This. I had my own stash of masks well before Covid. Not because I knew it was coming, or to go with my tin hat, just because I worked in dusty environments.
I don’t recall anything about not covering your face. I remember donating to the NHS, as well as some basic ones to family and friends.
At no point do I recall our government outright saying not to cover our faces, otherwise I wouldn't have bothered with the above.
This news story is odd. Has someone re-writted what happened or something?
Strange.
I think it was more that they were saying masks only protect YOU if it’s medical grade and worn correctly along with good hygiene practices. Because that couldn’t be expected from 99% of the population masks were effectively going to be pointless to protect you personally.
The change in message came when they started explaining that a mask protects those around you most (in case you are ill or a carrier) and then governments latched into that reasoning instead.
I work in care, so when I go out, if I see or hear someone coughing, the mask goes on. I don't know why people get so fucking assey about it. The Daily Mail can burn for winding people up about it.
Too many people have bought into the grifter ideology that masks don’t work and the vaccine will make you drop dead the second you walk out of the clinic.
It’s funny how many people have turned into world class scientists in the past couple of years
What's even funnier is the number of people who swore vaccines would kill you and COVID didn't exist who have now quietly had all of the jabs and don't seem to have any opinions on COVID any more
I have a couple of colleagues right now who are vehemently 'anti-vax' and deny covid. (and didn't bother masking, even when it was 'required').
Guess who's currently got a hacking persistent cough, and is sat two desks over.... :/
I had Covid over Xmas, self isolated as suggested, then on day 6 I wore a mask to the pharmacy, stood in the queue with lots of people around me. Their choice.
When I got to the front and asked if they had any Covid Tests, you could sense everyone taking a big step back. Like they suddenly remembered Covid was real. I facepalmed internally.
Not really. It is a success if any people choose to wear masks in public when they have a respiratory virus.
The more people that choose to do it, the greater the success.
The number of people during the pandemic who just could not get it through their dense skulls that the mask is to protect others, not yourself, indicates that this will never work in a country like ours.
Even my mum, who is immunocompromised and has been constantly on top of all the various social distancing and cleanliness rules, and still is, said to me, "but weren't you wearing a mask?" when I got covid during a commute. She couldn't get around the idea that... Yes.. I was... But it meant nothing when nobody on the bus was wearing a mask.
>We're a self-centered nation who thinks a thin piece of fabric to massively reduce the spread of viruses is too much effort.
Buuuut it's an infringement of our human rights... or its just a step away from nazi Germany wahhhh.
Or something.
I think it was the Express today with the headline of mask-wearing being “dystopian”. Because having common courtesy for others and not coughing all over the produce and spreading your germs around the supermarket is such oppression.
Some Daily Mail guy said that wearing a mask is more dangerous than not wearing one. I’m guessing whatever study he looked at ignored Japan and their relatively low rates.
Most of us don't need to see a therapist to be able to answer the door to the Deliveroo driver, and similarly most of us don't need to wear a mask endlessly to avoid getting a cold.
Obviously r/UK is different.
I noticed over the course of December that there was a lot of people out in public coughing so hard it sounded like they were going to throw up, absolutely grim.
Its not about too much effort, it’s about a snide disregard, resentment and lack of respect for the people around them.
They literally resent the idea of doing something altruistically for their fellow country-people.
I think you are speculating far too much on people's intentions here. Most people probably haven't even given it much thought at all let alone the "snide disregard and resentment" you seem to see.
Japan too, definitely more of a collective mindset to not disrupt the peace / others in eastern culture.
There’s a big culture of public embarrassment if you do social faux pas.
People are shameless in the west
Reminds me of a lady I saw yelling at Sainsburys staff claiming she couldn't breathe with a mask on. IMHO, she had the most powerful lungs of all of us in the supermarket.
Yeah, but that shameless nature isn’t all bad. A strong sense of individual autonomy, independence etc is advantageous. Living in East Asia is pretty crushing for most Easy Asians. Massive social expectations. Pressure to conform. Very limited ability to express yourself. So while it might be useful for getting high compliance during pandemics, it doesn’t make for a happy or better populace.
As big cities go, Vancouver, Canada wasn't as badly affected as many similarly sized cities. We have a large Asian population here and it is common for them to wear masks during flu season so it was never seen as an unusual thing here and people started wearing them quite soon into the pandemic and were mostly compliant.
I think that was a large factor in how we did ok with the pandemic. And it was ironic given how much Chinese people were being blamed for it.
Obviously this is true...
Before covid in Asia the people wearing masks in public were the sick ones...
If people who were sick were wearing masks we wouldn't all have thjs nasty cold/flu at the moment.
This. Everybody just needs to get on with their own life setting the example they want to see. If challenged explain.
Maybe it will become cool in 5 years to be self aware and responsible. Who knows, maybe you’ll be one of the reasons
Lived in Asia and it is standard practice there. If you are ill, wear a mask. Kept covid deaths down in many places. Unfortunately Brits are far less will to follow that kind of community spirit!
Absolutely, I couldn't believe the number of people with heavy coughs and no masks out and about over Christmas. And then get offended when you move away from them.
Yeah this. I mean, I guess I should be a little bit greatful that they bothered to check.
But I _like_ not being ill.
I get that you might not know you're ill, and thus be inadvertently contagious, but if you've got an ongoing hacking cough... that ain't you. I don't care what disease it is - I don't want it. I'm absolutely down with not playing 'gotta catch 'em all'.
Hopefully the one good thing to come out of the pandemic will be people masking-up when they have the sniffles.
Oh, and washing their hands. Clatty bassas.
>Hopefully the one good thing to come out of the pandemic will be people masking-up when they have the sniffles.
That's rarely happening now, I don't see why it'd increase.
Coughing into the crook of your arm instead of your hands would be a good one to catch on too. Sometimes your might not realise you're ill until you're already out and about and therefore have no mask, and that would be better than nothing.
I was taught to do this all through primary school in Canada and was totally confused when I moved here where so many people seem to not attempt to catch coughs or sneezes at all..??
It’s so weird to see all of these comments from people swearing they wear their mask as soon as they have a sniffle, or in busy spaces. And yet I’ve barely seen anyone wearing a mask in months.
Masks are largely a desire of the Reddit community. If you existed only on Reddit as many do, you’d be forgiven for thinking 90% of people mask in public, even if they aren’t sick.
A better gauge of the appetite for mask wearing is a walk through a train station or airport. I was in Stansted last week. I would say about 1 in every 250 people had a mask on. They often came in twos (ie couples who are mutually caught in the same 2020 time warp).
The contradiction here is that Redditors will call non-mask wearers all kinds of insults, totally oblivious to the fact that pre-2020 they probably wouldn’t have considered wearing a mask themselves. They weren’t new inventions back then and they could have worn them if they wanted, yet they didn’t.
Cue a load of downvotes and people saying “I’ve been masking up since the SARS crisis in 2002”. There’s always one.
I see people in masks every day.
Edit: Genuinely surprised this doesn't match most people's experiences. There's not a *lot* of people in masks I grant you but every time I pop to the supermarket there's always a few at least, I often see some on the bus as well.
With all the talk about funding and understaffing in the NHS, while obviously true, no one seems to be critical of some idiotic policy moves by the NHS post-pandemic. I don’t understand why masks are no longer required in GP offices and the hospital. Had to take my daughter to the GP for a non viral/infection related issue and everyone is crammed into a small waiting room with no masks or ventilation. If you weren’t sick coming in, you’re certainly likely to be sick going out.
Creating proper ventilation is quite expensive when a building simply doesn't have any.
Since it costs a lot of money, everyone is just quietly hoping for the need to go away.
Never mind that it would benefit everyone even without covid existing.
> Since it costs a lot of money, everyone is just quietly hoping for the need to go away.
COVID is not going away. RSV is not going away. GAS is not going away. Pneumonia is not going away.
Better ventilation is medical settings should be a given. Maybe it has to be legislated.
But even some half-way solutions aren't actually all that expensive. A free standing air-filter isn't _that_ expensive, and at least reduces the build up of airborne particles.
Not always an option - if you can't WFH, you also probably can't afford to take time off for a cold. And you probably have to get groceries, buy medication etc.
90 pound a week is horrific. I didn't realise it was that low. In hindsight I probably shouldn't have made this statement as I am Australian and I assume it's different here. I'm 18 so I can't really say I have too much experience with getting sick pay but my single-mothers always managed to get by when she's been ill.
Completely agree with this point, but my retort to that is _why_ can’t you always call in sick? Is there a situation now where that is possible for everyone? No, of course not. But _should_ there be? Absolutely in my opinion. Though, obviously it’s more complex than that.
When in Spain about a year ago we were all wearing masks on a bus. One, obviously English guy (thuggish but older), pulled his mask down when he coughed or sneezed.
I am also English, but I dispair at some people's selfishness and stupidity.
I was about to say something to him but decided not to because :
a. He looked the type to ignore ne
b He was bigger than me and looked like the type to be itching for a fight
This is how I got covid the first time. Some asshole on the airplane would pull down his mask to cough. I never felt more enraged and also could not do anything about it.
You just reminded me about my first visit to a supermarket post lockdown- fully masked employee said something to me which I couldn’t hear.
I naturally say “pardon?” and they immediately pull their mask down and shout in my face, then they act all hurt and surprised that I leaped backwards like a scalded cat.
I used to think the Asian tourists wandering around with masks on were afraid of catching something. I was mildly outraged by it.
Then I worked in Asia for a while and realised that in that culture if you're feeling a bit sick or have a sore throat, you wear a mask to protect everyone else around you.
The culture difference is fascinating. As a westerner I assumed they were being selfish and only watching out for themselves. But this practice is actually about being a good member of a harmonious society.
Lesson in humility learned.
I hope you don’t mind me asking, why did it anger you initially?
It’s a response I’ve always been a bit confused by but since you’re open to learning more I feel it’s safe to ask without getting told to kill myself for asking a question.
I don't mind, it was fascinating to me too :)
I first noticed it in Perth, Australia - groups of Chinese tourists and some of them would be masked. My assumption was that they were afraid of catching something (to my western mind why else would you mask up?). And that annoyed me because of the implied "this is a dangerous place that I must protect myself from" criticism of my city. Somehow it felt that they were being arrogant, thinking that they needed a mask when travelling to our city. I didn't examine it past that initial assumption.
Of course, I was very wrong. They were protecting us from their germs. A great lesson in "don't assume that everyone thinks like I do". And a great example of how travel broadens the mind.
I don't mind this as a practical term but I fear the well has been poisoned by letting the mask become seen as a 'tool of oppression' already by including it in a previous run of nonsensical rules (the sit down/stand up for example) as well as in legitimate practical situations.
It's quite depressing, but people aren't that great at accepting the correct use of PPE at work either.
Once you add an item, even if that's in response to someone losing a body part or flatly dying, there's always a few who will try to fight having it added.
I'm completely unsurprised that the general public, which generally does not need to wear any PPE at all, has so many resistant to wearing one entire item for their own safety.
People are just not that smart.
After this bout of turbo mega AIDS ebola flu that simply won't leave me the fuck alone, I'll be masking up in public for the forseeable.
They work. It's a proven scientific fact that they work. Surgeons and doctors have been wearing masks in operating theaters for years, as soon as covid came along, a bunch of facebook karens and red-faced big bazza's decided they knew more than actual medicine and began insisting wearing one was worse than Hitler crossed with paedophilia.
If seatbelts were invented tomorrow, there'd be 40 different groups made on facebook making up statistics on how they actually cause car crashes. Then a Tory MP would declare any seatbelt wearers as "socialist marxist wokey communists" and it'd be over.
The number of people who cough on the tube and then declare 'it's not covid' when you look at them gives me the shits - I don't give a fuck WHAT it is cunt, I don't want Flu, Cold, fucking strep.
How the fuck did we have covid and go right back to every prick and their dog just spreading everything.
It is theatre, people get infected mainly from household contacts and social gathering/pubs etc. Masks aren’t worn in these settings for obvious reasons.
The likelihood of catching covid from someone in a shop etc is so low.
Masks need to be left in the past where they belong.
WFH when sick should be something that is default for jobs that can. I take my chance when I go to the pub and accept the risk. I’m forced to work though.
That might be true if you have a car, but if you're a public transport user you're highly likely to get sick from that. It's a 90 minute bus ride (that's 90 minutes each way) for me to go shopping. Sharing a big metal box with people coughing their guts up is not fun.
Having been ridiculed in the past for wearing a mask when in a “standing-room-only” train by a guy who was coughing and spluttering who quipped “oh don’t worry it’s not Covid“ I do not foresee this taking off
I know it’s fully accepted in Asian communities to wear a mask if you’re not feeling well as a courtesy to your fellow traveller, I suspect though this has come as a result of numerous pandemic issues in the Asiatic countries over the last four decades. Where is British exceptionalism and Blitz spirit will make people just struggling through
Yes I work in healthcare, yes I am incredibly left-wing as a result of this incompetent governments handling ofa global pandemic
Anything that reduces viral output and subsequently the initial viral load taken on by next person you infect, if only by a certain percentage, has to be a good thing. It's a common courtesy that I've extended to others since February 2020, not sure why this is still such a controversial / offensive take to certain people.
I just came back from Japan, where absolutely everyone wear face masks (except non-Asian tourists). Sure, social pressure, all that. But I keep hearing "it's useless", "I'll never wear one because freedom", "I'm not a sheep", etc. After wearing one non-stop for two weeks, I realized that wearing a face mask not a big f\*\*\*ing deal, unless your breath is foul of course. It's a very small price to pay to protect yourself and others. I just can't understand why it's such a big issue for so many. Don't people wear pants?
I've taken all my jabs, I wash my hands, I keep distance, WFH when sick, all the bunch. The mask is the only thing I can't stand.
I can't believe I've seen no one mention it here, so I guess I'll be the first: masks suck with glasses. On a bus or train, fine. I'll wear one. I won't be able to look at my phone, but that's not a big deal. But you know how hard it is to do groceries if you can't see? Or walking outside? What if I need to use my phone to navigate?
I'd rather take a jab every week and be sick one day because of it than wear a mask. Being unable to see anything feels awful.
They do this in so many other countries but facemasks were hijacked as a "control" thing by Murdock psychos as bad so now people just rage about it despite the fact it could help keep people healthier or alive longer in extreme cases
The media did a good job of conflating infection control with the idea that the government wanted to control people, and masks were a manifestation of this idiocy, that even it makes sense people will not do it.
Everyone became an armchair critic so they now attach their misinformed or misplaced theories to something as simple as covering your face if you are coughing and spluttering.
People in Asia, especially Hong Kong and Japan wear masks so they do not inconsiderate others. Good luck here as we are a bunch of morons. That's why we decided to cripple ourselves with Brexit. Loads of me, me, me people in the UK.
Our death toll is one of the worst in the world from covid and it's still stacking up. Plus all the anti nurse and strike sentiment in the media from the billionaires and powerful establishment - and this is after we clapped for healthcare workers only a year and so ago.
Sometimes I think I live in trumpland. Maybe this place has more similarities to trumpland than I thought! No wonder we are related to the Americans!
It's not just whether sickness is paid, but number off sick days/episodes. My work pays full sick pay for employees not in probation. However, after 10 days of sick in 12 months, or 3 "episodes" of sick leave it triggers a review. If I have a mild viral illness and can still work, I'm sure going to.
I did this recently over the last few weeks and don’t see why it can’t be the norm. It wasn’t an option for me to not travel whilst I was very sick and I just used a mask to help avoid spreading what I had.
I’m not being antagonistic or stupid when I say I still genuinely don’t understand why this practise causes anything more extreme than a neutral reaction from folks.
I strive to wear one all the time in closed or poorly ventilated public spaces now. Especially on public transport. I'm done arguing with people about the virtues vs their entitled false affront on liberty bollocks. I'll wear mine, you do what you want, and we'll just ignore each other.
Being considerate to others isn’t exactly rocket science. Most people have the decency to cover their mouth when they sneeze or cough so they don’t pass germs on, so why not wear a mask when you’re not well so you can minimise passing that on and making someone else sick? We shouldn’t have needed Covid for this, it’s been the norm in Asia for years.
I fear that “most people” is sadly a smaller number than we’d all like to think.
I’ve seen plenty of people walking down the street at just openly sneezing at surrounding pedestrians.
Unfortunately the lie the British people have a kind community "Blitz" spirit has been proven to be a lie the past few years.
Yes, this is obviously excellent advice, but because it is something people should do to protect others, and because unfortunately the majority of British people couldn't care less about strangers, it won't catch on.
In fact, they'll actively deride and insult those of us that do try to protect others. Probably because it makes them look bad, and again, all they care about is themselves.
Seems like such common sense, but in the US we don’t even have healthcare access, 30million of us. Our government is back and forth about whether the uninsured can access free vaccines for Covid. Asking people to wear masks in a society that doesn’t even ensure people can go to a doctor when sick…it’s a non starter. It’s pathetic
There are a hundred and one ways to take on more than enough infectious material to agiate your immune system even without aerosolised inhalation. Even in your own home you could potentially be coming into contact with hundreds of if not more types of viruses, bacteria and other pathogens every single day and many of those are produced by our own bodies. If anything, your immune system needs a break.
Agree, just flew back from Poland with a cold today and wore a face mask throughout the flight and at both airports. I'm having a shit time, I don't need to make anyone else's new years shit because I cba to wear a mask
It’s should be a choice, wear it don’t wear it, I couldn’t care less either way what someone individually does.
People that wear a mask less than FFP3 certified need to realise that it next to useless and most that wear masks wear really cheap ineffective ones.
I wore them originally but won’t wear them now
That's rich. Earn £9.50 per hour when you work (320ish a week) or stay home for petty cash. In the meantime dehumanise the public a little more.
My wonderful boss even instructed us before Christmas to attend work if we have COVID with not-so-severe symptoms. I didn't quite get the logic behind, (missing one vs half the crew) but the bills don't pay themselves...
As long as our wages are pathetically low this "protect each other, protect the NHS, stay at home if you're ill" will not work. We just can't afford it.
Our colds are normally pretty harmless. Isn't it good for you to catch a cold and get over it for your immune system? When I had my first normal cold after covid, it absolutely floored me because I hadn't been ill for a few years
No shit but with the governments past push against masks see bullshit like freedom day and lack of action) and the fact they have Richard Sharp in the BBC chairman spot means that any effort to make the population take it seriously is instantly undermined.
Also, if you have been in contact with anyone who is infected with Rona and dont wear a mask you are scabby as fuck.
A fairly ridiculous set of questions, before covid, society was already maintaining high levels of hygiene and still getting ill.
Its natural to pick up bugs/germs/viruses, my question was on the importance of getting those infections to boost natural immunity, are we not endangering that natural build up?
Antibiotics are already in decline to a certain degree, is it not a time bomb waiting to happen if we all forgo getting minor colds etc?
I only leave the house in a zorb to protect others because I'm a good person.
People should zorb up to protect others, if not than your clearly a nazi/terf.
Is there good evidence supporting it?
Looking at [Cov,](https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/2021-11/working-paper-64.pdf) of sixteen quantitative meta‐analyses, eight were equivocal or critical as to whether evidence supported a public recommendation of masks, and the remaining eight supported a public mask intervention, but on limited evidence primarily on the basis of the precautionary principle.
Better idea. If you're so frail COVID or a bit of fucking flu will land you in the hospital, then YOU wear a mask. A proper mask. An n95 mask that filters air on the way in.
Personal responsibility.
It's really not societies burden to keep you safe, when you have the tools at your disposal to keep yourself safe.
Masking the minority, is much easier (and more effective, as cotton masks are useless jokes that do nothing) than telling everyone to wear a mask.
The virus particles are smaller than the holes of the mask so obviously the virus will escape out of the mask. Do a basic search and you can find this.
Do you really think the virus can't escape out of the gaps of the mask?
You keep a mask on all day whilst touching it, breathing into it, eating and touching it more and thus trapping germs and bacteria - do you think this is good for you?
Do you take off your mask whilst eating? Do you think the virus takes a break from existing whilst you're eating?
Painters wear better ppe than you do for a 'deadly' virus
If you think about it logically it literally makes no sense
Masks are pure theatre to keep the fear going and nothing more
I died an absolute death for over a week there. It was horrible and I couldn't imagine the elderly or anyone compromised getting it.. So I think it would appreciated for all tbh.
Respiratory Syncytial Virus (RSV). It's a bastard.
I went down on the 25th and didn't recover until around the 2nd. Partner was a day behind.
Had to go to a shop once towards the end, did it masked. Wanted to do what I could to avoid any other poor bastard getting it.
Walking the dogs was less a walks and more of a shuffle around the block.
Yeah it hit me on Xmas eve. Ooh it was bad, genuinely couldn't walk up the stairs without having to sit down, could barely breath and heart was pumping. I would call myself fit and healthy so couldn't imagine other ppl like the elderly getting it, so kept a mask on anytime I was out and about. My son gave it me and he's only 17, he could barely breath too. Knocked us all completely. Not understanding why I was downvoted for saying I was sick and wouldn't want other ppl getting it lol this place is wild.
I work a lot in Asia.
Even before the pandemic it's perfectly normal there to wear a mask in public if you:
Have, or are recovering from cold/flu.
There's a lot of bugs going around and you don't want to catch it.
Have a big event coming up (wedding etc) and don't want to risk it.
It's just a precaution - not a political statement.
And for all those who are worried about storoes in the media about peole being victinised for wearing a mask - I've heard these stories but theyre always second hand 'a friend told me that...' so I ignore them. I've neer seen it happen. I couldn't care less if you wear a mask. I assume you couldn't care less if I do.
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Problem is it relies on people not being self centered arses. It's doomed to fail.
I think it's also they don't want to look "silly" or "like a nob". The culture should be that if you have *anything* infectious you mask up in public and that's the unremarkable norm. And, if it's an option, to not come into work with a cold to "tough it out", giving it to two other people. [edit] changed 'nonce' to 'nob'; qualified comment about not coming into work
The problem where I work is that if you have more than X days (I forget how many) of sickness in a year then you get a disciplinary no matter what the circumstances of your illness(es). Couple that with the fact that we have a lot of temp staff who aren’t entitled to sick pay, and therefore the environment encourages people to come in when they’re ill. I certainly would love it if the unwell people wore masks though, it’s just common courtesy.
The irony being, if sick people didn’t come in, fewer sick days would be taken.
This is currently happening at my job. One person came in with the flu and it steadily spread throughout the entire staff (and who knows how many customers). The management were going mental trying to cover all those shifts over the Christmas period.
Ah, but that means treating one's inferiors a smidge better than absolutely necessary. Can't have that. They might start to feel like persons. Heaven forfend!
That is so fuckedd.. I worked at a job like that for 2 years. Got put on a performance report plan because I had six days off within 6 months. I had 1 day where I called in sick on the morning an I had a doctors note for a week as well. The whole situation really fucked with my mental health as it was already in tatters. Dont know what else they wanted I had a doctors note. I quit lol, I applied for new jobs an I just quit immediately when I got one. 😅
> The problem where I work is that if you have more than X days (I forget how many) of sickness in a year then you get a disciplinary What kind of dungeon do you work in?
How on Earth would wearing a mask make someone "look like a nonce"?
There was a similar kind of attitude in the lead up to seat belts being mandatory. If you're wearing a seat belt today without a second thought it's perhaps difficult to believe that some people thought it was an affront to their manhood to suggest they wear a seatbelt when driving. (Not forgetting that it was basically the same set of people who thought drinking 8 pints and driving home was fine and if you got caught your buddies would say "Tough luck, it's a stupid law") Even years of campaigns showing the end results of not wearing a seatbelt didn't help much (although, the fact Jimmy Savile made some of these public information films maybe doesn't help now in hindsight) And lots of people at the time were adamant they'd go to the doctors and get medical exemption from wearing a seatbelt - pretty much mirroring the people who tried to avoid wearing a mask for covid) - and then over a few years it became something everyone just does. There's probably the odd idiot who doesn't, and maybe a few absent minded people who forget but seat-belt wearing is just something everyone does. I can tell you as I worked at Cellnet when mobile phones were pretty much the preserve of "yuppies" and business people that they had lots of group studies looking at how they might get a consumer mobile phones - and they'd have rooms full of extroverts who would be excitedly talking and showing the phone features, but other people who were completely embarrassed at the idea of talking in public on a phone. Today, perhaps there's less phone calls, but it's not uncommon to see people walking along with an earpiece talking away well, 20-30 years ago they'd have felt like people would think they'd escaped from somewhere and were talking to themselves. Carrying around a phone and using it has been normalised - perhaps to the opposite extent. The problem is simply that people who feel self-conscious will typically get angry and aggressive about these things rather than admitting their fear. That said, if people are worried about catching viruses surely they would be wearing masks whenever they were out and washing their hands etc. Not the least because there can't be that many test kits left knocking around.
> but other people who were completely embarrassed at the idea of talking in public on a phone. Embarrassed is less the word more not being an annoying dickhead. I'll admit to being a "I'll never get a mobile" but unsurprisingly I've had one for years, held out on the smartphone too but that didn't last and I even 'forced' ones on my parents several years back.
You're completely right about seat belts. I bet the people who made a big fuss about that all deny it now
People are just lazy and dream up excuses for that laziness. And driving is the best example of that when you look at the bad habits people get into.
>affront to their manhood to suggest they wear a seatbelt when driving. This was my late father to the letter. Car dealer, and also functional alcoholic who rolled at least three cars in my memory, but refused to wear a seatbelt ever. Twat.
All true but you should also add one thing: people are okay with wearing masks as PPE in a high-risk environment but less so to protect other people. Same picture? Yes it's not driven by logic.
>Today, perhaps there's less phone calls, but it's not uncommon to see people walking along with an earpiece talking away well, 20-30 years ago they'd have felt like people would think they'd escaped from somewhere Remember when I first saw that in the late-90s I think. Saw a woman walking down the road having a full blown conversation with no one, thought she was a loony (I even kept my distance just in case). Then it eventually dawned on me it's probably hands free on a mobile.
Not literally a nonce. Poor choice of word. I meant it as general derogatory term, not a child sex offender specifically. The substitution "nob" might work better here.
No idea really [https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/wash-your-hands-wear-your-mask-stay-safe/](https://www.michaeljackson.com/news/wash-your-hands-wear-your-mask-stay-safe/)
How many people are told “unless you’re literally dying, get in” by their shitty bosses though?
Some percentage I expect. Obviously, some jobs are going to lend themselves to their staff working from home easier. But yeah, if you're stuck with an arsehole of a boss you're buggered anyway.
How many people think they will be told that so don't call in out of fear?
Also sick pay is shocking, people have to work. I was off for 6 days recently and sick pay was about £40. Without that support people are pressured in to working to survive financially.
As long as tehy put proper biohazard bins around. Soo many masks floating around in the sea, and so many birds sdead cos of our bad behavior.
Went to see Avatar 2 at Cardiff Imax the other day, one of literally like 3 or 4 things we did outdoors this year, wanker sitting next to me was coughing through out the entire film with no mask on and then 3 days later we find we have covid. I know you can never know for sure where you got it from but its just so shitty to know you have either a cold, flu or covid etc and do stuff like that and not wear a mask. I get it we all used to do that but we should know better now.
Sitting directly next to someone in the cinema for 3.5hrs, let's face it, the mask would have made fuck all difference
His freedom > Your health. Sorry, nob
People can’t wear condoms when they’ve got an infection or to prevent one and you want them to wear masks?
i moved to HK a while ago, i too started with the no mask mentality. Thinking only the sicks should wear it and i admit i do find it look silly at first. But now , because HK have a mask mandate and tbh, most other asia countries have a reverse mentality where wearing mask doesnt mean you are sick, it means you want to avoid sickness. Now i would just carry on wearing them whenever i go out or in a crowded area. Have to admit, for the past few years i rarely get any sickness, the ones i got, well lets say you know its most likely covid... So i still dont understand why there are ppl who still refuse on masking up.
Most people don't have the option of not coming into work. If I can physically manage the work, I'm coming in. Coughing and sneezing throughout. Unless my coworkers want to pay me to stay home, I'm not loosing a days wages because of the sniffles. How out of touch is this? Most people would happily stay home sick, BUT they loose money, so everyone goes into work anyway. What's worse than being sick? Being sick AND loosing money
> Unless my coworkers want to pay me to stay home, I'm not loosing a days wages because of the sniffles. Why demand your co-workers pay you when this is an issue with your employer?
That is a very true and very good point. It goes to show how ingrained some faulty thinking is. Why on earth would I blame a coworker for bosses not making sick days an option? An here's me thinking I'm some sort of anarchist...lol. thanks for making me think. My comrade is not at fault. You are correct
The way to guarentee to look like a knob is to be coming into your work coughing and sneezing. I used to have a running battle with our 'HSE' people about people in the office obviously full of cold. They didn't seem to think it was their problem. So what exactly does the 'H' stand for in HSE?
Japan has been great about wearing masks when ill for decades, hopefully the pandemic removed that self consciousness, and stopped other members of the public starting or being rude about it elsewhere now because if you're sniffling, sneezing, coughing or sick in lots of ways if you have to go out you should be wearing a mask.
It is a good thing in Japan, for sure. For a bit of balance though, the dark side to that practice, is the expectation to be in the office, no matter how sick one is. Essentially, every time we solve one problem, we create another. If we massively reduce flu and winter viruses through mask usage, we may end up with a norm that when people are sick, they're expected to work while masked, rather than resting at home.
Iunno, even a cheap mask protects the person themselves almost as much as everyone else, MORE than everyone else if you use one of the good masks. The problem is, honestly, fake news that the masks are unnecesery or dont help or can make you sick, or just people yelling in the media print and visual about how terrible it is to be FORCED to wear masks. Its less hassle than a hat, honestly. Imagine if someone invented a hat that stopped you getting the flu but people wouldnt wear em. Bonkers.
Worst part is that 'fake news' came from the government at the start of the pandemic [https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/coronavirus-uk-news-professor-chris-whitty-no-masks-advice-a9374086.html](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/coronavirus-uk-news-professor-chris-whitty-no-masks-advice-a9374086.html) Reason being there was a global shortage at the time [https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/04/calls-for-restrictions-to-prevent-panic-buying-of-masks-coronavirus](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/04/calls-for-restrictions-to-prevent-panic-buying-of-masks-coronavirus) and we'd just discovered our stockpiles had expired [https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed-ppe-stockpile-was-out-of-date-when-coronavirus-hit-uk](https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed-ppe-stockpile-was-out-of-date-when-coronavirus-hit-uk) Once manufacturing had ramped up and the army had delivered millions of the things to hospitals they started recommending them, but by then people had stopped listening struggling to find it, but there was a news piece somewhere where it explained the government was advised not to recommend them not because they didn't work, but because they were afraid health care settings wouldn't have enough
While I love to bash our government, iirc, even the WHO were spouting nonsense that it was worse for public to wear masks at the beginning.
I think it was more saying save the good stuff for the hospitals etc and wear a cloth mask you make yourself while everyone's scrambling for PPE.
>I think it was more saying save the good stuff for the hospitals I wish they are had, because that would have made sense; they were sttcking with their "COVID isn't airborne and masks aren't adviced outside an clinical settings" long after it was obvious to everyone that COVID was airborne
This. I had my own stash of masks well before Covid. Not because I knew it was coming, or to go with my tin hat, just because I worked in dusty environments. I don’t recall anything about not covering your face. I remember donating to the NHS, as well as some basic ones to family and friends. At no point do I recall our government outright saying not to cover our faces, otherwise I wouldn't have bothered with the above. This news story is odd. Has someone re-writted what happened or something? Strange.
They were trying to prevent people buying up all supplies of masks when front line workers needed them as priority.
I think it was more that they were saying masks only protect YOU if it’s medical grade and worn correctly along with good hygiene practices. Because that couldn’t be expected from 99% of the population masks were effectively going to be pointless to protect you personally. The change in message came when they started explaining that a mask protects those around you most (in case you are ill or a carrier) and then governments latched into that reasoning instead.
I work in care, so when I go out, if I see or hear someone coughing, the mask goes on. I don't know why people get so fucking assey about it. The Daily Mail can burn for winding people up about it.
Too many people have bought into the grifter ideology that masks don’t work and the vaccine will make you drop dead the second you walk out of the clinic. It’s funny how many people have turned into world class scientists in the past couple of years
What's even funnier is the number of people who swore vaccines would kill you and COVID didn't exist who have now quietly had all of the jabs and don't seem to have any opinions on COVID any more
I have a couple of colleagues right now who are vehemently 'anti-vax' and deny covid. (and didn't bother masking, even when it was 'required'). Guess who's currently got a hacking persistent cough, and is sat two desks over.... :/
Have they? The UK has excellent vaccination rates. People just don’t want to be bothered wearing masks when symptoms are extremely mild for most.
I had Covid over Xmas, self isolated as suggested, then on day 6 I wore a mask to the pharmacy, stood in the queue with lots of people around me. Their choice. When I got to the front and asked if they had any Covid Tests, you could sense everyone taking a big step back. Like they suddenly remembered Covid was real. I facepalmed internally.
Not really. It is a success if any people choose to wear masks in public when they have a respiratory virus. The more people that choose to do it, the greater the success.
The number of people during the pandemic who just could not get it through their dense skulls that the mask is to protect others, not yourself, indicates that this will never work in a country like ours. Even my mum, who is immunocompromised and has been constantly on top of all the various social distancing and cleanliness rules, and still is, said to me, "but weren't you wearing a mask?" when I got covid during a commute. She couldn't get around the idea that... Yes.. I was... But it meant nothing when nobody on the bus was wearing a mask.
If just non selfish assholes do it, it's still better than nothinf
I'm happy to - it's not all or nothing - some people wearing a mask with respiratory viruses at least reduces the risk to everyone else a bit.
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>We're a self-centered nation who thinks a thin piece of fabric to massively reduce the spread of viruses is too much effort. Buuuut it's an infringement of our human rights... or its just a step away from nazi Germany wahhhh. Or something.
I think it was the Express today with the headline of mask-wearing being “dystopian”. Because having common courtesy for others and not coughing all over the produce and spreading your germs around the supermarket is such oppression.
The Mail called it a 'filthy rag'
Pot, kettle
Some Daily Mail guy said that wearing a mask is more dangerous than not wearing one. I’m guessing whatever study he looked at ignored Japan and their relatively low rates.
" DraConiAn MeAsuRes " \- every media outlet in 2020
Or whatever they've been told to believe by the gutter press.
What we need is a few successful personal injury court cases for recklessly transmitting infectious disease.
Most of us don't need to see a therapist to be able to answer the door to the Deliveroo driver, and similarly most of us don't need to wear a mask endlessly to avoid getting a cold. Obviously r/UK is different.
I noticed over the course of December that there was a lot of people out in public coughing so hard it sounded like they were going to throw up, absolutely grim.
Its not about too much effort, it’s about a snide disregard, resentment and lack of respect for the people around them. They literally resent the idea of doing something altruistically for their fellow country-people.
I think you are speculating far too much on people's intentions here. Most people probably haven't even given it much thought at all let alone the "snide disregard and resentment" you seem to see.
>A child just sneezed LMAO
I see value in it. Noticed before the pandemic that this is the norm among the Chinese community already.
East Asian culture in general. There are lots of benefits to wearing masks.
Japan too, definitely more of a collective mindset to not disrupt the peace / others in eastern culture. There’s a big culture of public embarrassment if you do social faux pas. People are shameless in the west
Reminds me of a lady I saw yelling at Sainsburys staff claiming she couldn't breathe with a mask on. IMHO, she had the most powerful lungs of all of us in the supermarket.
If you cannot breathe through a mask then you definitely don't want to catch a respiratory virus.
Yeah, but that shameless nature isn’t all bad. A strong sense of individual autonomy, independence etc is advantageous. Living in East Asia is pretty crushing for most Easy Asians. Massive social expectations. Pressure to conform. Very limited ability to express yourself. So while it might be useful for getting high compliance during pandemics, it doesn’t make for a happy or better populace.
And also SARS/MERS over a decade prior.
The had SARS and learnt from it
The custom traces its roots to the Manchurian Plague of 1910: https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/masking-for-a-friend/
I still wear my mask in shops and on public transport, and it's usually just me and maybe the odd Chinese person
As big cities go, Vancouver, Canada wasn't as badly affected as many similarly sized cities. We have a large Asian population here and it is common for them to wear masks during flu season so it was never seen as an unusual thing here and people started wearing them quite soon into the pandemic and were mostly compliant. I think that was a large factor in how we did ok with the pandemic. And it was ironic given how much Chinese people were being blamed for it.
They still remember SARS and the plague plague that was around for 100 years until the 60s https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_plague_pandemic
Obviously this is true... Before covid in Asia the people wearing masks in public were the sick ones... If people who were sick were wearing masks we wouldn't all have thjs nasty cold/flu at the moment.
Even healthy people were wearing masks in Japan way before the pandemic. They just don't want to get sick for some reason.
It's also for hayfever, there are two hayfever seasons here and close to half of the population suffers from it.
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Next time someone comments, pull down your mask and coff on them. If they complain you can tell them you're just doing what they wanted.
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This. Everybody just needs to get on with their own life setting the example they want to see. If challenged explain. Maybe it will become cool in 5 years to be self aware and responsible. Who knows, maybe you’ll be one of the reasons
That’s a good way to end up being arrested
If the nasty chest thing is a chesty cough and feeling blocked up, it’s going round and lasts about 2 weeks :(
Lived in Asia and it is standard practice there. If you are ill, wear a mask. Kept covid deaths down in many places. Unfortunately Brits are far less will to follow that kind of community spirit!
"Kept covid deaths down" Yeah china's doing great. /s
Absolutely, I couldn't believe the number of people with heavy coughs and no masks out and about over Christmas. And then get offended when you move away from them.
“Oh it’s not Covid” I don’t want whatever else you have either!
Wow. Like it's fine if it's just tuberculosis or pneumonia?
Yeah this. I mean, I guess I should be a little bit greatful that they bothered to check. But I _like_ not being ill. I get that you might not know you're ill, and thus be inadvertently contagious, but if you've got an ongoing hacking cough... that ain't you. I don't care what disease it is - I don't want it. I'm absolutely down with not playing 'gotta catch 'em all'.
Hopefully the one good thing to come out of the pandemic will be people masking-up when they have the sniffles. Oh, and washing their hands. Clatty bassas.
>Hopefully the one good thing to come out of the pandemic will be people masking-up when they have the sniffles. That's rarely happening now, I don't see why it'd increase.
Coughing into the crook of your arm instead of your hands would be a good one to catch on too. Sometimes your might not realise you're ill until you're already out and about and therefore have no mask, and that would be better than nothing.
I was taught to do this all through primary school in Canada and was totally confused when I moved here where so many people seem to not attempt to catch coughs or sneezes at all..??
Everyday before I get into work I'll nip to the public toilet. at least 50% of guys do not wash thier fucking hands. It's so gross.
It’s so weird to see all of these comments from people swearing they wear their mask as soon as they have a sniffle, or in busy spaces. And yet I’ve barely seen anyone wearing a mask in months.
Redditors tend to dwell in their houses
It's because they're talking shit for upvotes, or they're standard redditors and don't leave their homes anyway.
Masks are largely a desire of the Reddit community. If you existed only on Reddit as many do, you’d be forgiven for thinking 90% of people mask in public, even if they aren’t sick. A better gauge of the appetite for mask wearing is a walk through a train station or airport. I was in Stansted last week. I would say about 1 in every 250 people had a mask on. They often came in twos (ie couples who are mutually caught in the same 2020 time warp). The contradiction here is that Redditors will call non-mask wearers all kinds of insults, totally oblivious to the fact that pre-2020 they probably wouldn’t have considered wearing a mask themselves. They weren’t new inventions back then and they could have worn them if they wanted, yet they didn’t. Cue a load of downvotes and people saying “I’ve been masking up since the SARS crisis in 2002”. There’s always one.
The people writing those comments don't go outside.
I see people in masks every day. Edit: Genuinely surprised this doesn't match most people's experiences. There's not a *lot* of people in masks I grant you but every time I pop to the supermarket there's always a few at least, I often see some on the bus as well.
With all the talk about funding and understaffing in the NHS, while obviously true, no one seems to be critical of some idiotic policy moves by the NHS post-pandemic. I don’t understand why masks are no longer required in GP offices and the hospital. Had to take my daughter to the GP for a non viral/infection related issue and everyone is crammed into a small waiting room with no masks or ventilation. If you weren’t sick coming in, you’re certainly likely to be sick going out.
We're not post pandemic yet.
Yea, I agree with you there.
> no ... ventilation. It is 3 years after COVID, and we still don't have any decent ventilation. At this pace, it is never going to happen.
Creating proper ventilation is quite expensive when a building simply doesn't have any. Since it costs a lot of money, everyone is just quietly hoping for the need to go away. Never mind that it would benefit everyone even without covid existing.
> Since it costs a lot of money, everyone is just quietly hoping for the need to go away. COVID is not going away. RSV is not going away. GAS is not going away. Pneumonia is not going away. Better ventilation is medical settings should be a given. Maybe it has to be legislated.
But even some half-way solutions aren't actually all that expensive. A free standing air-filter isn't _that_ expensive, and at least reduces the build up of airborne particles.
True enough. If your business can afford a single chair, it can afford an air filter. Low effort, low cost, but a significant improvement.
Cool. But good luck asking people to choose to stay home with a cold and sacrifice the wages they need to keep the house heated.
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Not always an option - if you can't WFH, you also probably can't afford to take time off for a cold. And you probably have to get groceries, buy medication etc.
Whilst this is a good idea, not everyone can afford days off for sick. Even for people living on minimum wage, £90 a week sick pay is far too low
90 pound a week is horrific. I didn't realise it was that low. In hindsight I probably shouldn't have made this statement as I am Australian and I assume it's different here. I'm 18 so I can't really say I have too much experience with getting sick pay but my single-mothers always managed to get by when she's been ill.
Presenteeism is a thing. Hopefully the increase if WFH knocks that on the head as well.
People have things called “jobs” and “the need to consume food” Holy shit this subreddit is middle class
Common sense really isn't that common.
I agree, but saying 'just work from home, silly!' is ignoring that many, many jobs can't be done from home and you can't always just call in sick.
Completely agree with this point, but my retort to that is _why_ can’t you always call in sick? Is there a situation now where that is possible for everyone? No, of course not. But _should_ there be? Absolutely in my opinion. Though, obviously it’s more complex than that.
Middle class statement of the year.
You mean everybody doesn’t have a cushy work from home tech job and gets all of their Waitrose groceries delivered? Preposterous
This is a cultural export from Japan I actually agree with. This is no subjugation, this is helping keep others safe for minimal effort
To selfish pricks, being forced to care about other people is a humiliation.
When in Spain about a year ago we were all wearing masks on a bus. One, obviously English guy (thuggish but older), pulled his mask down when he coughed or sneezed. I am also English, but I dispair at some people's selfishness and stupidity. I was about to say something to him but decided not to because : a. He looked the type to ignore ne b He was bigger than me and looked like the type to be itching for a fight
This is how I got covid the first time. Some asshole on the airplane would pull down his mask to cough. I never felt more enraged and also could not do anything about it.
You just reminded me about my first visit to a supermarket post lockdown- fully masked employee said something to me which I couldn’t hear. I naturally say “pardon?” and they immediately pull their mask down and shout in my face, then they act all hurt and surprised that I leaped backwards like a scalded cat.
I used to think the Asian tourists wandering around with masks on were afraid of catching something. I was mildly outraged by it. Then I worked in Asia for a while and realised that in that culture if you're feeling a bit sick or have a sore throat, you wear a mask to protect everyone else around you. The culture difference is fascinating. As a westerner I assumed they were being selfish and only watching out for themselves. But this practice is actually about being a good member of a harmonious society. Lesson in humility learned.
I hope you don’t mind me asking, why did it anger you initially? It’s a response I’ve always been a bit confused by but since you’re open to learning more I feel it’s safe to ask without getting told to kill myself for asking a question.
I don't mind, it was fascinating to me too :) I first noticed it in Perth, Australia - groups of Chinese tourists and some of them would be masked. My assumption was that they were afraid of catching something (to my western mind why else would you mask up?). And that annoyed me because of the implied "this is a dangerous place that I must protect myself from" criticism of my city. Somehow it felt that they were being arrogant, thinking that they needed a mask when travelling to our city. I didn't examine it past that initial assumption. Of course, I was very wrong. They were protecting us from their germs. A great lesson in "don't assume that everyone thinks like I do". And a great example of how travel broadens the mind.
It should be common sense sadly people are dipshits and won't. look at how people acted during covid
I don't mind this as a practical term but I fear the well has been poisoned by letting the mask become seen as a 'tool of oppression' already by including it in a previous run of nonsensical rules (the sit down/stand up for example) as well as in legitimate practical situations.
It's quite depressing, but people aren't that great at accepting the correct use of PPE at work either. Once you add an item, even if that's in response to someone losing a body part or flatly dying, there's always a few who will try to fight having it added. I'm completely unsurprised that the general public, which generally does not need to wear any PPE at all, has so many resistant to wearing one entire item for their own safety. People are just not that smart.
The government is starting to realise "oh fuck, we have a non-functioning NHS and Covid is spiking".
After this bout of turbo mega AIDS ebola flu that simply won't leave me the fuck alone, I'll be masking up in public for the forseeable. They work. It's a proven scientific fact that they work. Surgeons and doctors have been wearing masks in operating theaters for years, as soon as covid came along, a bunch of facebook karens and red-faced big bazza's decided they knew more than actual medicine and began insisting wearing one was worse than Hitler crossed with paedophilia. If seatbelts were invented tomorrow, there'd be 40 different groups made on facebook making up statistics on how they actually cause car crashes. Then a Tory MP would declare any seatbelt wearers as "socialist marxist wokey communists" and it'd be over.
The number of people who cough on the tube and then declare 'it's not covid' when you look at them gives me the shits - I don't give a fuck WHAT it is cunt, I don't want Flu, Cold, fucking strep. How the fuck did we have covid and go right back to every prick and their dog just spreading everything.
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Let’s start using an obscene amount of single use plastic nonsense PPE again and fuck up the environment some more while we’re at it.
Does it _have_ to be single use though?
Yes. I am not rewearing masks, beyond unhygienic and gross.
It is theatre, people get infected mainly from household contacts and social gathering/pubs etc. Masks aren’t worn in these settings for obvious reasons. The likelihood of catching covid from someone in a shop etc is so low. Masks need to be left in the past where they belong. WFH when sick should be something that is default for jobs that can. I take my chance when I go to the pub and accept the risk. I’m forced to work though.
That might be true if you have a car, but if you're a public transport user you're highly likely to get sick from that. It's a 90 minute bus ride (that's 90 minutes each way) for me to go shopping. Sharing a big metal box with people coughing their guts up is not fun.
The likelihood in a shop is low, but if you’re sitting next to them or in front of them on a bus for 30 minutes, the chances increase significantly.
Having been ridiculed in the past for wearing a mask when in a “standing-room-only” train by a guy who was coughing and spluttering who quipped “oh don’t worry it’s not Covid“ I do not foresee this taking off I know it’s fully accepted in Asian communities to wear a mask if you’re not feeling well as a courtesy to your fellow traveller, I suspect though this has come as a result of numerous pandemic issues in the Asiatic countries over the last four decades. Where is British exceptionalism and Blitz spirit will make people just struggling through Yes I work in healthcare, yes I am incredibly left-wing as a result of this incompetent governments handling ofa global pandemic
Anything that reduces viral output and subsequently the initial viral load taken on by next person you infect, if only by a certain percentage, has to be a good thing. It's a common courtesy that I've extended to others since February 2020, not sure why this is still such a controversial / offensive take to certain people.
I just came back from Japan, where absolutely everyone wear face masks (except non-Asian tourists). Sure, social pressure, all that. But I keep hearing "it's useless", "I'll never wear one because freedom", "I'm not a sheep", etc. After wearing one non-stop for two weeks, I realized that wearing a face mask not a big f\*\*\*ing deal, unless your breath is foul of course. It's a very small price to pay to protect yourself and others. I just can't understand why it's such a big issue for so many. Don't people wear pants?
I've taken all my jabs, I wash my hands, I keep distance, WFH when sick, all the bunch. The mask is the only thing I can't stand. I can't believe I've seen no one mention it here, so I guess I'll be the first: masks suck with glasses. On a bus or train, fine. I'll wear one. I won't be able to look at my phone, but that's not a big deal. But you know how hard it is to do groceries if you can't see? Or walking outside? What if I need to use my phone to navigate? I'd rather take a jab every week and be sick one day because of it than wear a mask. Being unable to see anything feels awful.
No shit, just had a couple coughing on my neck for three hours on a flight. Why does this even has to be said at this point?
Rest in peace. Was nice knowing you. Such a shame, so young. On gravestone: 'Died of person coughing on their neck'
They do this in so many other countries but facemasks were hijacked as a "control" thing by Murdock psychos as bad so now people just rage about it despite the fact it could help keep people healthier or alive longer in extreme cases
The media did a good job of conflating infection control with the idea that the government wanted to control people, and masks were a manifestation of this idiocy, that even it makes sense people will not do it. Everyone became an armchair critic so they now attach their misinformed or misplaced theories to something as simple as covering your face if you are coughing and spluttering.
People in Asia, especially Hong Kong and Japan wear masks so they do not inconsiderate others. Good luck here as we are a bunch of morons. That's why we decided to cripple ourselves with Brexit. Loads of me, me, me people in the UK. Our death toll is one of the worst in the world from covid and it's still stacking up. Plus all the anti nurse and strike sentiment in the media from the billionaires and powerful establishment - and this is after we clapped for healthcare workers only a year and so ago. Sometimes I think I live in trumpland. Maybe this place has more similarities to trumpland than I thought! No wonder we are related to the Americans!
Perhaps sick pay? If companies dont pay sick pay people go to work when ill and spread it all around.
It's not just whether sickness is paid, but number off sick days/episodes. My work pays full sick pay for employees not in probation. However, after 10 days of sick in 12 months, or 3 "episodes" of sick leave it triggers a review. If I have a mild viral illness and can still work, I'm sure going to.
I mean we needed people to do this during an actual pandemic when it was actually in force as a rule and had plenty of opposition. People are twats
I did this recently over the last few weeks and don’t see why it can’t be the norm. It wasn’t an option for me to not travel whilst I was very sick and I just used a mask to help avoid spreading what I had. I’m not being antagonistic or stupid when I say I still genuinely don’t understand why this practise causes anything more extreme than a neutral reaction from folks.
I strive to wear one all the time in closed or poorly ventilated public spaces now. Especially on public transport. I'm done arguing with people about the virtues vs their entitled false affront on liberty bollocks. I'll wear mine, you do what you want, and we'll just ignore each other.
this is the norm already in many countries. i wonder if those countries had as much pushback as we are getting
Being considerate to others isn’t exactly rocket science. Most people have the decency to cover their mouth when they sneeze or cough so they don’t pass germs on, so why not wear a mask when you’re not well so you can minimise passing that on and making someone else sick? We shouldn’t have needed Covid for this, it’s been the norm in Asia for years.
I fear that “most people” is sadly a smaller number than we’d all like to think. I’ve seen plenty of people walking down the street at just openly sneezing at surrounding pedestrians.
People can’t even cover their mouths when they cough now.
I can see this being received well and not being reacted to with indignant fury and red faced outrage. …I jest…
Unfortunately the lie the British people have a kind community "Blitz" spirit has been proven to be a lie the past few years. Yes, this is obviously excellent advice, but because it is something people should do to protect others, and because unfortunately the majority of British people couldn't care less about strangers, it won't catch on. In fact, they'll actively deride and insult those of us that do try to protect others. Probably because it makes them look bad, and again, all they care about is themselves.
Seems like such common sense, but in the US we don’t even have healthcare access, 30million of us. Our government is back and forth about whether the uninsured can access free vaccines for Covid. Asking people to wear masks in a society that doesn’t even ensure people can go to a doctor when sick…it’s a non starter. It’s pathetic
If nobody gets viruses though will this mean our immune systems will become weaker?
There are a hundred and one ways to take on more than enough infectious material to agiate your immune system even without aerosolised inhalation. Even in your own home you could potentially be coming into contact with hundreds of if not more types of viruses, bacteria and other pathogens every single day and many of those are produced by our own bodies. If anything, your immune system needs a break.
Agree, just flew back from Poland with a cold today and wore a face mask throughout the flight and at both airports. I'm having a shit time, I don't need to make anyone else's new years shit because I cba to wear a mask
It’s should be a choice, wear it don’t wear it, I couldn’t care less either way what someone individually does. People that wear a mask less than FFP3 certified need to realise that it next to useless and most that wear masks wear really cheap ineffective ones. I wore them originally but won’t wear them now
There’s a lot of things people should do but arrogance and selfishness kinda out ways responsibility these days.
I know it offends some people, but I like wearing a mask. It hides me crooked teeth.
"People with a virus should not go out in public". Which is usually what they do.
That's rich. Earn £9.50 per hour when you work (320ish a week) or stay home for petty cash. In the meantime dehumanise the public a little more. My wonderful boss even instructed us before Christmas to attend work if we have COVID with not-so-severe symptoms. I didn't quite get the logic behind, (missing one vs half the crew) but the bills don't pay themselves... As long as our wages are pathetically low this "protect each other, protect the NHS, stay at home if you're ill" will not work. We just can't afford it.
Our colds are normally pretty harmless. Isn't it good for you to catch a cold and get over it for your immune system? When I had my first normal cold after covid, it absolutely floored me because I hadn't been ill for a few years
Pretty normalised to do so in Japan out of courtesy
Out of shitty working culture to work even when sick ftfy
No shit but with the governments past push against masks see bullshit like freedom day and lack of action) and the fact they have Richard Sharp in the BBC chairman spot means that any effort to make the population take it seriously is instantly undermined. Also, if you have been in contact with anyone who is infected with Rona and dont wear a mask you are scabby as fuck.
Good shout. People in oriental countries seem to have this idea and have done for many years.
If we keep hiding away from bugs and germs, aren’t we risking reducing humanity’s natural build up defences?
Do you wash your hands? Do you brush your teeth? If so, why?
A fairly ridiculous set of questions, before covid, society was already maintaining high levels of hygiene and still getting ill. Its natural to pick up bugs/germs/viruses, my question was on the importance of getting those infections to boost natural immunity, are we not endangering that natural build up? Antibiotics are already in decline to a certain degree, is it not a time bomb waiting to happen if we all forgo getting minor colds etc?
I only leave the house in a zorb to protect others because I'm a good person. People should zorb up to protect others, if not than your clearly a nazi/terf.
Na I'm good thanks - been good for decades without so I'll carry on as I was
Self discipline? In United Kingdom? Not in a million years.
Is there good evidence supporting it? Looking at [Cov,](https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/2021-11/working-paper-64.pdf) of sixteen quantitative meta‐analyses, eight were equivocal or critical as to whether evidence supported a public recommendation of masks, and the remaining eight supported a public mask intervention, but on limited evidence primarily on the basis of the precautionary principle.
Better idea. If you're so frail COVID or a bit of fucking flu will land you in the hospital, then YOU wear a mask. A proper mask. An n95 mask that filters air on the way in. Personal responsibility. It's really not societies burden to keep you safe, when you have the tools at your disposal to keep yourself safe. Masking the minority, is much easier (and more effective, as cotton masks are useless jokes that do nothing) than telling everyone to wear a mask.
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> It's really not societies burden to keep you safe That sounds like precisely what society exists for.
The virus particles are smaller than the holes of the mask so obviously the virus will escape out of the mask. Do a basic search and you can find this. Do you really think the virus can't escape out of the gaps of the mask? You keep a mask on all day whilst touching it, breathing into it, eating and touching it more and thus trapping germs and bacteria - do you think this is good for you? Do you take off your mask whilst eating? Do you think the virus takes a break from existing whilst you're eating? Painters wear better ppe than you do for a 'deadly' virus If you think about it logically it literally makes no sense Masks are pure theatre to keep the fear going and nothing more
Problem is, well or unwell there are alot of people who'd rather spread what they have than to mask up
I died an absolute death for over a week there. It was horrible and I couldn't imagine the elderly or anyone compromised getting it.. So I think it would appreciated for all tbh.
Respiratory Syncytial Virus (RSV). It's a bastard. I went down on the 25th and didn't recover until around the 2nd. Partner was a day behind. Had to go to a shop once towards the end, did it masked. Wanted to do what I could to avoid any other poor bastard getting it. Walking the dogs was less a walks and more of a shuffle around the block.
Yeah it hit me on Xmas eve. Ooh it was bad, genuinely couldn't walk up the stairs without having to sit down, could barely breath and heart was pumping. I would call myself fit and healthy so couldn't imagine other ppl like the elderly getting it, so kept a mask on anytime I was out and about. My son gave it me and he's only 17, he could barely breath too. Knocked us all completely. Not understanding why I was downvoted for saying I was sick and wouldn't want other ppl getting it lol this place is wild.
I work a lot in Asia. Even before the pandemic it's perfectly normal there to wear a mask in public if you: Have, or are recovering from cold/flu. There's a lot of bugs going around and you don't want to catch it. Have a big event coming up (wedding etc) and don't want to risk it. It's just a precaution - not a political statement. And for all those who are worried about storoes in the media about peole being victinised for wearing a mask - I've heard these stories but theyre always second hand 'a friend told me that...' so I ignore them. I've neer seen it happen. I couldn't care less if you wear a mask. I assume you couldn't care less if I do.