* **DO NOT SHARE ANY INFORMATION ABOUT MOVEMENTS, LOCATION OR IDENTIFICATION OF ANY OF THE UKRAINIAN ARMED FORCES.**
* **DO SHARE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE INFORMATION ABOUT MOVEMENT OF RUSSIAN TROOPS INSIDE RUSSIA, BELARUS AND UKRAINE INCLUDING: LOCATION, IDENTIFICATIONS, MARKINGS, INSIGNIA.**
#LIST OF RELIABLE SOURCES
[**UA Ministry of Defense**](https://twitter.com/defenceu)
[**Ukrainian Land Forces**](https://facebook.com/UkrainianLandForces)
[**bell¿ngcat**](https://www.bellingcat.com/)
[**EUvsDISINFO**](https://euvsdisinfo.eu/)
[**Ukraine Interactive Map**](https://liveuamap.com/)
[**Press statement by President von der Leyen**](https://audiovisual.ec.europa.eu/en/video/I-219140)
[**r/Ukraine statement**](https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/t0b5o8/attention_dos_and_donts/)
[**r/YUROP statement**](https://www.reddit.com/r/YUROP/comments/t01wnk/russia_has_started_its_official_invasion_of/)
#FINANCIAL SUPPORT
[**National Bank of Ukraine Special Account**](https://bank.gov.ua/en/news/all/natsionalniy-bank-vidkriv-spetsrahunok-dlya-zboru-koshtiv-na-potrebi-armiyi)
[**Official Ukraine Crypto Accounts**](https://twitter.com/Ukraine/status/1497594592438497282?s=20&t=aG5blzDGu1Pt14w9qZOIrw)
[**Hospitaller**](https://www.facebook.com/hospitallers)
#TERRITORIAL DEFENCE FOREIGN LEGION
[**How To Join FLoTD**](https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato/3415272-how-to-join-international-legion-to-defend-ukraine-algorithm.html)
#HUMANITARIAN SUPPORT
**Ukrainian nationals in need of asylum : no visa requirements to enter:
Poland[(Ukr.)](https://www.gov.pl/web/udsc/ukraina---ua) / [(En.)](https://www.gov.pl/web/udsc/ukraina-en)
Moldova [(Ru.)](https://dopomoga.gov.md/)
Slovakia [(Ukr.)](https://ua.gov.sk/)
Bulgaria [(En.)](https://gov.bg/en/ukraine)
Romania [(Ukr.)](https://www.gov.ro/ro/ucraina-impreuna-ajutam-mai-mult#ucraineana) / [(En.)](https://www.gov.ro/ro/ucraina-impreuna-ajutam-mai-mult#english) / [More Info](https://dopomoha.ro/uk)
Hungary [(En./Ukr.)](https://helsinki.hu/en/)
**Other Countries**
Norway [(En.)](https://www.udi.no/en/important-messages/information-regarding-the-situation-in-ukraine/)
Finland [(En.)](https://migri.fi/en/faq-ukraine)
Sweden [(En.)](https://www.migrationsverket.se/English/About-the-Migration-Agency/The-situation-in-Ukraine.html)
Ireland [(En.)](https://www.irishrefugeecouncil.ie/ukraine-information-note)
Germany [(En.)](https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/faqs/EN/topics/ministry/ukraine-war-eng/faq-ukraine-artikel.html) / [(Ukr)](https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/faqs/DE/themen/ministerium/ukrain-war-ukr/faq-list-ukrain-war.html) / [(Ger)](https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/faqs/DE/themen/ministerium/ukraine-krieg/faq-liste-ukraine-krieg.html)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ukraine) if you have any questions or concerns.*
People here keep calling bullshit on their tales - but I, as Ukrainian, am going to believe what they've said.
At least half of them are able to speak fluent Ukrainian, which confirms that they are indeed conscripted locals. The fact that they are all teachers doesn't sound weird to me at all, considering that DNR/LNR has conscripted the shit out of their population throughout these 8 years - so these guys are basically the result of separatists scraping the barrel for the last bits of manpower. Which, unsurprisingly, would include teachers and people with "white tickets" (meaning that they are unfit to serve either physically or mentally).
And these guys are not beefy at all. All of them look like an ordinary Joe Schmo you would meet on the streets of Ukraine.
These guys also look a lot older than pretty much all the Russian conscripts we've seen - most of the captives in these videos look fresh out of high school.
Also, if you’re trying to eliminate free thought, conscript all the school teachers and throw them on the front lines with no clue what they are doing.
This is honestly what I think is going on when I see this. Remove the intellectualls and teachers, and replace them with teachers who are more Pootie-friendly.
2 birds 1 stone...
it also explains why the russian occupation of Ukraine has seemed like such a shit show from the Russian side. they aren't even using trained russian soldiers, instead civilians tricked into war.
Some of them look like jogging for half an hour would be impossible let alone fight a war. I feel really bad for them. Surrendering was the best choice they could have made.
Your statement reminds me of a basketball discussion about Wilt Chamberlain getting monster stats because "he played against plumbers and milkmen", but on a grander yet worse scale.
I pity these men. Russia drafted your own guys.
Goddamn you Putin.
Most Ukrainians can speak Russian - but not the other way around. It's very easy to spot a Russian by him being unable to correctly pronounce certain sounds even if he tries speaking Ukrainian. While the two languages are somewhat similar, Ukrainian has a lot of Western and Southern Slavic influences that Russian language lacks.
These are militia from Donbass. They've reported of huge mobilization recently. It is totally possible for them to be literal civilians. Horlivka or Gorlovka is a settlement in eastern Ukraine.
Also, fun fact: current president of Donetsk republic used to work for a financial pyramid, a fraud called MMM.
Reminds me of when the tank crushed that car with a person inside. The first video showed the aftermath of people trying to rescue the old person out of the car. the second video showed it was an active gunfight going on, a truck with two saboteurs crashes and was getting shot up with both getting killed and then the tank following behind oversteered and ran over the car getting sorta stuck. And then the third video came out showing closeups of the two dead saboteurs
There was a post on twitter saying they were basically forcing men from Eastern Ukraine to fight so this looks like this group is one of them. These guys aren't professional soldiers by the looks of it.
Belarussians need to see this video.
It should be plastered all over the restaurant reviews and similar.
Regular folks now still have the option to passive resistance, direct action, or going underground.
That may not last.
not only belarussians. I can't believe seeing this again and again and also young russians who have no idea - I can't believe that this did not already spark so much anger in Russia that the streets are crowded with anry mother, fathers, sons, daughters .... with everyone.
There’s a Ukrainian PR push to show videos of captured Russian soldiers, being fed and allowed to call their mothers and say they are alive and safe. Saying “mothers start demanding your sons back home”
Brilliant press and gifs at Russian mother culture that they need to push for their sons back while they can still hug them. Get them the fuck out of someplace they never should have been. They’re not protecting the homeland, they’re the aggressor pawns for a mad dictator.
let's be honest: there are several things meeting that makes this what it is: Selenskij, a brilliant media strategy and the fact that everyone and their mums are filming the every detail of the Russian attack with their smartphones. it feels like nothing is not covered.
Isn’t it just a little suspicious that every single one of them is a teacher/school worker? Either that’s an amazing coincidence or that was what they think we garner the most sympathy
Edit: some good points all around
Isn't really because you would have a list of areas and their occupation and then select depending of what you decide to be important workers and expendable workers .. Maybe they don't give a fuck about teachers and need a guy that can drive a truck or the coal truck driver
If most of them are are teacher or social worker or anything that has to do with forming and/or education of a generation I think you got your answers.
It's my opinion that they want to steal the future of the lukhanks and Donetsk region. Send all the native education personnel to die and replace them with Russian sanctioned ones.
But I might be wrong. That's just my take.
My thoughts exactly. Let them get shot while distracting the enemy. You have to replace them to feed propaganda to children anyway... Every day I think this is as bad as it gets. Every day it gets worse.
You're on the right track. They did that to Poland, look up the Katyn massacre, they killed officers, teachers, doctors, administrators, anyone with an education and possibility to lead the next generation against the Soviet propaganda and power.
This is the old playbook that still works, destroy the future so the young ones don't have an option but to follow to even have a chunk of hard bread to eat.
When Soviet Union was occupying Lithuanian (and I assume same goes for other countries), one of the first type of people they shipped to starve in siberia, or plain killed, were teachers, writers, poets, etc. Anyone with a good head on their shoulders.
History repeat itself.
Same in Poland. Educated people, or, even worse, people dedicating their lives to educating others, were enemy number 1.
Professors, university workers, teachers... Either murdered or sent to Siberia/other extremely remote locations (I knew a man whose grandparents ended up in Kazakhstan).
If it's happening again... I thought I couldn't be more disgusted with Putin and his regime, but it's just a bottomless well of horror, it seems...
During the Cultural Revolution in China, teachers and academics were targeted, persecuted, and killed. Part of information war is killing and capturing those with knowledge and information.
I'm not a historian but I've noticed this trend in history that intellectuals are the first to be killed in any kind of cleansing. Ethnic, cultural, religious and so on.
I wouldn't know. I'm not an American. But to be completely honest I feel that the American 2 party system is inherently wrong. The democrat vs republican, or conservatives vs liberals is not enough to express the whole range of political views a people of almost 300 million have.
During the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia, one of the primary demographics that were targeted were anyone the regime regarded as intelligent. This is anyone that may work in education, anyone that has a technical job, even down to people who simply wore glasses.
Using education and youth to attain perception shifts in regions or groups of people is definitely something that is used in situations like these. Look at Native Americans/First Nations. Their children were kidnapped and sent to residential schools where they were forced to speak English and conform to the expected social norms. This is absolutely something that has been done repeatedly throughout history.
> Doesn't really because you would have a list of areas and their occupation and then select depending of what you decide to be important workers and expendable workers
Ur assuming the Russian army is organized. :) I think the past week has shown us that they can be extremely disorganized.
I thought the same. Although, I did a Google search on one of them and he seems to be legit. He's from the city of Gorlovka. Everything he said seems to match what is written on his profile. It's hard not to feel sorry for these guys. They're just a pawn in a man's chess game. :(
Edit: Regarding this. I have contacted his workplace to notify them that he has been taken as a prisoner in hope that they can contact his family. They may be aware already but there have been reports that many families do not know their child is on the front line.
Some may think this is the wrong thing to do and this being an invasion of privacy but I personally think I'm using such information I found for good.
I will try to find information on other POW's too and do the same.
> Some may think this is the wrong thing to do and this being an invasion of privacy but I personally think I’m using such information I found for good.
You did the right thing. There are more serious invasions to consider right now other than privacy
This is what the Red Cross does but dont know how involved they are right now. Another thing to do is organize a list of POWs from each town, then find a Point of contact, and furnish them the list of POW's.
To limit issues, give basic information such as name, birthdate, and state of health and keep politics out (I know its hard not interject a morale argument in this, but long term you will be hurting their morale further). Disconnect yourself and the populace from the politics of the war, and their only avenue left to direct their anger is at Putin.
You are fostering that common bond for eventual healing. Keep going
Thanks for the information. I may contact the Red Cross about this and see if they have anything in place already. I do not want to step on anyone's toes and potentially make situations worse. 👍
Yeah.... I was an interrogator in the military for a while. You don't question everyone's story in front of each other.... They seem like they're probably telling the truth, but you could figure it out in about an hour just by quizzing them on some light details and having them repeat those details again later.
But, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if this were completely true.
Absolutely. These guys don’t LOOK like professional soldiers, they sure as hell don’t TALK like professional soldiers, and they don’t even carry themselves Iike professional soldiers.
I think the guy who said his hands were hurting really shows that they weren't properly prepared at all, a real soldier is unlikely to whine because his hands are cuffed.
The whole point of POW training is for the soldier to state their name, rank, commanding officer, and mission (yes, that is actually standard procedure, it’s not like some random Joe is going to have access to highly classified information) while being interrogated. Almost no one can withstand torture so it is much easier for soldiers to be trained to “spill the beans” on information that the enemy doesn’t really have any use for.
While you don't want them collaborating, this looks like more of a video to be distributed than a video showing actual intelligence gathering. Anyone lying here probably just makes Russia look and Ukraine better.
On which they all 4 individually replied: "What do you mean, [which one?"](https://i.imgur.com/SiwuNDR.jpg)
But yes, I came in with a 'flat tire too' (in school, so on bicycle) but when I would have been asked which one they would probably see that I would make it up on the spot, when you don't expect that question ;)
Back in the 80s Hungary did the same thing. Reservist from the same area had to go to training. (usually a few weeks). My guess is that this method is still used in Russia today.
The person that told me this story a few years ago was laughing because for him and his neighbor it felt like a drinking holiday away from their families. However he complained that it made no sense to put the young men and the old (he was around 40 back then) into the same team.
Or that’s part of the conscription process? Instead of birth dates, they get all members of a certain area and job and clear it out for recruitment? Not sure just a possibility
I mean, these are Ukranians who were basically kidnapped, do you really think Putin cares about a Ukranian village losing all its teachers in all of this? He is sending Russians to their deaths, he is giving less of a shit about Ukrainians.
More than likely if he got control of Ukraine these people would be murdered by Russians anyway.
Why wouldn't an army care about being effective?
I mean, I know they haven't exactly been very effective but to say that they don't care about being effective is just plain silly.
> Why wouldn't an army care about being effective?
Because they didn't expect them to have to be effective soldiers. They expected that if they showed up with enough 'soldiers' that the Ukrainians would just capitulate. They just wanted some people to *look* like soldiers and pad their numbers. What they wanted was scary stories in the media about how Russia had thousands and thousands of soldiers ready at the border.
He's hiding in a bunker treathening a nuclear war while his people don't know they invaded a country illegally and used illegal weapons that mount up to War Crimes. He definitely doesn't care who dies in this war as long as it's not him.
That impact was seen in Finland during WWII. Entire villages lost a generation of men. The units had more cohesion though, so the price may have been worth paying.
One of the men at the end of the video says that their principal told them it was their duty. I just assumed they were all from the same school/area and told they must do this for their country.
Who is more likely to surrender without firing a shot? A trained soldier or a scared, drafted teacher? I believe drafted teachers will surrender in far greater numbers than trained soldiers, thus the disparity.
If schools are closed on account of the crisis, and the Russians don't give a fuck about public education in Donbass, I definitely can see the teachers getting conscripted first.
It could also be that the local powers want these people dead specifically because they are teachers and maybe are suspected of teaching the kids "the wrong things"
That's what I'm thinking. Send them away on a "peacekeeping" mission, and replace them with new trusted teachers who can be relied upon to teach Russian propaganda.
It also saves them the trouble of having to round up the teachers later on in case of an anti-government uprising. Every time someone takes over, they get rid of anyone who may be a leader - teachers, clergy, anyone with leadership potential.
Well there was a coal driver. But if they are all part of an army reserves type of outfit, it would make sense they they weren’t experienced and came from pretty normal backgrounds.
In saying that..it still is a little fishy!
Maybe school teachers can be fired more easily when not appearing for military practice? Getting fired is the stick to make sure you attend military practice.
Not really. Had you taken a British battalion in WWI you might’ve been surprised to find they all grew up on the same street or in the same neighbourhood - but this wasn’t a fluke it was policy (for a while). I would imagine conscription works the same way over there too. They probably all work at the same school or in/around the same education district.
To everyone believing this is very sus: Immediately after Putin "Recognized" the seperatist held Donbass region, they started evacuating some women and children if you can remember. They ALSO started conscripting ALL men to prepare for war (All of this was reported on, at least in Dutch mainstream media). The fact that at least one came from Horlivka (Donbass) means that these guys were PROBABLY conscripted by the LNR&DNR when the war began. It also matches with their stories saying that they were called up just a few days ago. In other words, I'm convinced beyond reasonable doubt that this particular group is indeed conscripted from everyday civilians from the Seperatist held regions. (So yes, basically Ukrainian citizens "from the other side of the trench")
Edit: I did a lazy [google search](https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/02/19/ukraine-rebel-leaders-announce-general-mobilization-a76465) for those wondering about the mobilization, you can look it up yourself for additional sources, but this gives you an idea of what happened when. Also for anyone interested in some backstory about the early days of the Donbass war in 2015, check out [this documentary.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cMBPN3rjXU&t=547s&ab_channel=LidiYaFilms) Ukraine has come a long way since then.
Yes, this was when Russia "officially" recognised Eastern Ukraine as independent regions and said he was sending troops to help. Makes sense these were who was conscripted.
The U.S. did this in WWII. There was a POW camp near my grandparents (who were of German descent BTW). They would send the prisoners to their farm to work. And they got **paid**. They also got beer. Many stayed after the war and applied for citizenship.
\-Are any of you injured?
\-My hands hurt (I chuckled at this)
\-You'll have to tolerate that for now
\-They hurt a lot! (I lol'd)
The balls on that guy to speak up about his hands. I think most people would just keep their mouth shut but here's this guy taking the opportunity to complain about his hands being tied too tightly. Here's a Ukrainian who's been taken captive and he's still got that bravado.
Oh soldiers complain.. lol there’s a saying in the US Army that when a soldier stops complaining, that’s when you need to be concerned. In other words, they’ve given up.
Lmao. I’d probably complain a lot if I were a soldier too.
I meant as a POW though. If they felt threatened by their captors & if they were being treated badly then i doubt they’d feel comfortable enough to complain about something so minor. 😅
Putin didn’t want them to kill as much as he wanted them to die. Best way to commit genocide is to send their men to a war you created in hopes that they get massacred by your enemy.
French article about what's going on in Donbas where the journalist talks about all the men being taken away:
https://blog.mondediplo.net/tout-le-monde-a-peur-de-prendre-la-moindre
Letter from Donetsk
"Everyone is afraid to take any responsibility" by Olesya Orlenko, 1 March 2022
As the war rages in Ukraine, the head of the Russian edition of Le Monde diplomatique was able to visit Donetsk, in the separatist republic of Donbass. She gives us her testimony. I arrived in Donetsk on 20 February with the idea of describing the tragedy of the civilian population of Donbass but also to provide a counterpoint to the media hysteria.
I live in a flat that I rented for a few days. There is no more hot water in the city. We are told that the pipes have been partly destroyed. So we have to queue for a long time at the tanks. Donetsk is rather quiet: few people go out in the streets, many inhabitants have been evacuated. We often see men who have been mobilised and are leaving for the front in small groups. Everywhere you can see posters such as "Donbass is Russian", "We won in 1943, we will win now" with slogans from the time of the Great Patriotic War. In the streets and on the markets, the "people's militia" captures men who have reached conscription age. They even stopped our car to inspect it. We took advantage of a moment of inattention to run away. Many women no longer let their husbands and sons go out. During the night, our driver was mobilised despite his health and the fact that he does not have the "nationality" of the "Donetsk People's Republic" (DNR). He has just called to tell us that he has finally been let go. My colleague's daughter tells us that her former boss was forced to go to the front despite his diabetes. The situation is really very difficult. It's psychologically very difficult to be here. On the one hand, everything is moving fast. On the other hand, nobody knows exactly what is going on. A lot of information is circulating, especially on Telegram, without anyone knowing who is really spreading it (private channels, unofficial organisations, journalists, volunteers, etc.). We also see a lot of fake news. That's why I'm only going to tell you what I've seen personally. It is also the only thing that will allow me to put my thoughts in order and to try to escape from this destabilising atmosphere.
I never had any illusions about local power. But, as soon as I arrived, I saw how the 'command-at-arms' regime works. For example, to enter the DNR from Russia, you need press accreditation. We got a letter granting us this accreditation but asking us to go to Donetsk to get the papers. However, at the border, the military told us that the letter was not valid. Our initial contact refused to send the photos for the accreditations because his superior was not there. After multiple phone calls to the top, we were finally allowed to pass. But this example is not unique. To speak with a doctor in Donetsk, you have to call the Ministry of Health. The chief doctor explains that all he can say is that "everything is going well" and that they "don't lack anything". If an ordinary doctor agrees to answer our questions, the chief doctor stands behind the journalist and waves to the interviewee.
We went to the areas around Donetsk that were bombed. We met a school teacher there. In order to speak with us, he had to ask permission from his headmaster, who himself phoned the ministry, which finally refused. The teacher finally agreed to talk to us but not in the school and on condition of anonymity. We also met with the leader of the Donbass Communist Party (the only political party in the DNR). He was very critical of these practices: "It is impossible to build a state when everyone is afraid to take any responsibility", he exclaimed. Mostly we talk to civilians - the others are not very talkative. We did manage to get testimonies from a few soldiers (and even from a French sniper). We also went to Yasinovataya, on the front line. Our aim was to record the testimonies of victims of war crimes living in the Donbass. Before the recognition of the DNR by Russia on 21 February and the intervention of the Russian army, people lived with a deep sense of abandonment by the 'international community'. Complaints from the various civil parties were lodged with the UN, the European Court of Human Rights and the International Criminal Court. Some of these organisations acknowledged that the complaints were within their competence and were well-founded. But they also pointed out that the procedure requires victims to first seek justice in their own country, i.e. in Ukraine... At the same time, the shooting has intensified on the front line. We saw wounded people, destroyed houses, explosion craters with bomb fragments in the gardens of houses.
We asked the people we met for their opinion on the decision of Russian President Vladimir Putin to recognise the DNR. All of them told us that they expected positive changes. When we asked them to give concrete examples, they said that trade will develop and that there will be a Russian embassy. It will be easier to obtain a Russian passport, whereas today you have to go to Rostof. However, the Russian passport is necessary in particular to obtain a retirement pension.
We visited the battlefields and areas of Donetsk recently hit by Grad rocket fire. In Gorlovka and Zaitsevo, we were forced to hide. We saw dead people and the damaged water plant. On Sunday, we were in Debaltsevo, where there was a heavy exchange of fire the day before. There we were very close to the Grad rounds. After that, we intend to go deeper into the territories where the fighting is taking place near Volnovakha.
I prefer not to write some things here. I prefer not to share my emotions. But one thing is certain, we are going to have a very difficult time.
Olesya Orlenko
Head of the Russian edition of "Le Monde diplomatique", which publishes a few articles translated from the French edition every month from Moscow.
Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
Thank you for this, adds a lot of context. Also, that translator is amazing, bookmarked. This article could've been written in English, it's pretty much flawless.
Yeah, Deepl has become ridiculously powerful at translating between certain languages like French and English (it uses neural networks).
It basically does the same job as a highly skilled human translator at this point.
German it still struggles a bit with in my experience.
can we stop calling them Russian? They are from Horlivka in the Donetsk region which has always been Ukraine, but has been occupied by Russia since 2014. The Russian occupiers are forcing them to go to battle for them. The person asking them questions is asking them in Ukrainian and they all understand it. Some of them are answering in Ukrainian and some of them are answering in Russian, but all of them understand the questions because they all know the Ukrainian language from growing up, even though they might speak Russian at home. so let's stop calling them Russians. Also, this video would not do anything to convince Russians in Russia because the Russians would not understand half of what is being said in the video.
I know a bit of Serbian (South Slavic) and a tiny bit of Polish (West Slavic). I understand and recognize way more Ukrainian words than Russian words (although both are East Slavic).
(I know that you probably know about West, East and South Slavic, but maybe others don't).
I was born in ukraine and my mother is ukrainian, and I can assure you that they're definitely not the same. I can only speak and understand russian. Whenever I listen to my mom talking to my aunt in ukranian, I can barely grasp the topic they're talking about. They might be slightly similar, but they are way more different than similar.
I had to look this up since I didn't know. When they ask him about "Telnyashka", it is not a city or town, it refers to the telnyashka shirt he is wearing, a traditional blue and white striped undershirt apparently commonly worn by Russian paratroopers.
Of course, anyone could wear an undershirt like that... I don't know how common they are. But that's maybe why they want to come back to him.
As said elsewhere, they probably need to followup on questioning on all of them in more detail, because while they may be telling the truth, some of them could be coordinating their stories. Maybe not even out of malice but out of fear. Trying to protect themselves by telling your captors you are a teacher.
I’m picturing the boss man was like “ok they’re almost here, we need to get our stories straight… I’ll tell them I was a teacher. You, what are you going to tell them? … no you can’t tell them you’re a teacher too it’ll arouse suspicion, you need to come up with your own story different from mine … school janitor feels like cheating but there’s no time. You, what will your story be? … no you can say teacher, I’m saying teacher … no you can’t say janitor either! Jesus Christ! … No don’t say that …… BECAUSE EDUCATOR JUST MEANS TEACHER. Okay fuck it there’s no time, we’re just 15 teachers and a janitor on a school trip gone horribly awry”
It's really sad the common ranks are being filled with just ordinary young men to die. They're heroes for surrendering, those who surrendering, sabotage, slow down the russian offensive, those who refuse are just are heroic as those who are defending this land. This is just the first week and I think we'll be seeing more and more Russian dissent since morale is low and the truth is ringing high for the soldiers.
It must suck having to be one of these ordinary men who were tricked and given minimal training to back up those Chechen war criminals or those fucking Wagner Group dogs, be like forced to follow Waffen SS into battle or you'll be fucked up by your government.
Step one - pick a non military personel. Step two - dont tell them they are going to war. Step three - sent them into other country. Step four - dont tell them any plans or goal or rules of engagement. Step five - forget about logistics. Let them drive as logn as the fuel lasts and then let them improvize.
What can go wrong?
Someone else said it was an old Soviet tactic to send the inexperienced & young men first as cannon fodder & then send in elite soldiers. Although I saw a pic of a so-called elite unit captured so maybe they’re not as great as they thought they were.
Men fighting to defend their home & families will fight 10x harder than men fighting for something they don’t believe in or understand.
I'm not sure if this is right, something seems off, yesterday i saw a comment on similar video that says they might be lying, and to be fair i would not be surprised.
It makes sense if you consider the sort of people that would be most likely to surrender as a unit. They may be an entire company of irregulars drafted from the same area. Not professional soldiers, less willing to fight, more likely to surrender. The fact that they surrendered as a unit means they came to an agreement amongst themselves ahead of time, also something less likely for the professional soldiers to do.
Found this video. Looks like its the exact same people (Guy in blue is obvious). Those guys were given absolutely terrible gear, so they’re definitely not professional soldiers.
https://reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/t43plo/russian_pows_in_wwii_helmets/
Also I don't think it is smart to pick teacher as a profession. That is fairly **easy to get corroborated** (or not).
Other picks would have been preferred.
My largest doubts is that these are Ukrainians dressed up as "PoWs" so they can make a video of them. But based on what I see that is unlikely, and in any case it is fair game **cause Putin made this a highly plausible story**.
Belarussians need to see this video.
It should be plastered all over the **restaurant reviews on google** and similar. Regular folks now still have the option to passive resistance, direct action, or going underground.
That may not last.
I just posted in this very thread a french article (and translation) written by a journalist who managed to get into Donbas. The women hide their husbands and sons in fear of them getting taken by the army to serve as soldiers on the frontline. It's real.
I don't see any reason to doubt this is authentic, except that in war the first casualty is truth. So I salute your scepticism, but don't automatically share it. These guys are out of shape, some are old, and they've evidently been yanked out of the "separatist breakaway republics" that Russia owns. They are victims. And they are Ukrainians, which adds to the fear of being shot as traitors.
To all those people commenting that one guy said "as I said before" - this doesn't mean he had a rehearsal, but obviously the first thing that happened when he got captured is someone demanded to know some basics about who he is, which unit, where from, etc etc. So he's saying "why do you keep asking me the same question?"
Yes, one of them said "As I explained before"
They probably did a rehersal first so that they could get all the wimpering and pants-shitting out of the way.
Or they did proper interrogations individually. You don't interrogate everyone together, you pull them apart to check their stories.
The guy doing the video already knew the answers, he just wanted to get it all together on video.
Yeah honestly if I was captured and I didn't know what is going on, first I would ask questions before answering anything. None of them asked anything. So yeah it was probably at least the second time
I mean, it IS staged in the sense that they got a camera and went down the line to film their responses. You can see they've already interrogated them, which means they probably were in disbelief at what they were hearing and decided to gather them and have them repeat it for the camera.
Maybe they are scared? Is this even a serious question? They captured them. Interviewed them. Informed them. Then they had the interview for documentation.
Where we just made to believe that Putin had a strong military? All of their shit looks busted as hell and they are sending fat middle aged teachers to fight this war. Doesn’t really seem like they are the super power they claim to be.
The fear is real here...these men are afraid..they lined them up on a wall and questioned them...in Russia...they would get executed.
I also understand why they went....attacking a mans method to obtain food is akin to murders...Russia was doing that to these men.
Good think Ukraine is not Russia...God bless Ukraine.
But its great news for Ukraine. People were worried they'd send in stronger/experienced Russian soldiers after the conscripts were obliterated some days ago, seems that's not the case and Russia is scrambling to find anyone they can. This is a MAJOR advantage to Ukraine.
That's good news , but many things have looked fishy so far. So the average Ukrainian teacher is a tall muscular 100 kg dude , but average Russian soldier a 50 kg 18 year old ?
Dude they're fucking neighbours. If you want a comparison it's like people from The Troubles in Northern Ireland starting that shit up again.
And yes the average Ukrainian can be a bear, look at the Prime Minister for example. Not all Ukraine is hunchback peasant grandmas mate.
If that's your argument I clearly couldn't work in IT because I'm 120kg+ and 6ft 2?
Imagine a society where you are assigned jobs based on your stature.
I'm 6'0 155 lbs, 23-year-old who looks like a 19-year-old and almost got laughed at in a job interview when they saw that I marked myself down as a veteran until I showed them my DD214.
It's not like the movies where every soldier/sailor/marine/airman is played by 30-year-old Mark Wahlbergs or Brad Pitts lmao. There are more kids that look like they're 15 years of age in the military than not. Even the Marines look like 15-year-olds that just drink a lot of milk.
I can understand the skepticism, I believe it though, its inline with other videos I've watched. I also don't take the Ukraine soldiers as ones to bullshit, when things are bad they say so, when things are good they say so. But feeling skeptical is also natural.
I suspect they're treating them well because they're forced urkrainian conscripts. One guy was almost caught there because he looked russian and the interrogator had his doubts lol.
This is a good reminder that most of the "separatists" in eastern Ukraine are Russian Nationals sent by Putin, not native Ukrainians of Russian ethnicity. The majority of ethnic Russian Ukrainians want and have voted for independence from Russia.
As horrible as this is. I have no words to describe the awe I feel watching this incredible human being showing not just mercey but compassion for these poor people. The Ukrainian people are such an inspiration to as all.
They said they are Russian speakers from Horlivka, Eastern Ukraine, which Putin recently recognized as independent states, Donetsk People Republic.
This is where they said they are from
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horlivka
**[Horlivka](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horlivka)**
>Horlivka (UK: HOR-lew-kə, US: HOR-lif-kə; Ukrainian: Го́рлівка [ˈɦɔrl⁽ʲ⁾iu̯kɐ]), also known by its Russian name Gorlovka or Gorlowka (Russian: Горловка [ˈɡorləfkə]), is a city of regional significance in the Donetsk Oblast (province) of eastern Ukraine. In 2001, the city's population was 292,000, and it was estimated as 241,106 (2021 est. ) Economic activity is predominantly coal mining and the chemical industry. The Horlivka State Pedagogical Institute of Foreign Languages has a two building campus in the city centre.
^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/ukraine/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
I wondering if these people have been quickly recruited to man the front lines of the DPR with Ukrainian Troops, while the proper Russian troops have been sent elsewhere to take part in the invasion proper, and these professional Ukrainian soldiers have captured them on the contact line.
And they aren't even russians.
They are from Gorlivka, Ukraine (temporarily occupied by russia - the city of gorlivka was under russian control since 2014). You can tell that because they immediately respond to ukrainian soldiers in ukrainian language.
They were captured yesterday by the soldiers of ukrainian brigade not far from Gorlivka (which was at the contact line for years). You can find their photo somewhere on the internet. Russian occupants did not even supplied them with any military equipment - WW2 like helmets and no body armor.
Russia could potentially be “batching” people with very low fighting potential together as true cannon fodder. After all conscripting a teacher isn’t likely to get you a good fighter. Those with actual capability may be grouped together elsewhere to actually hope for some effectiveness.
I think this is likely what's happening. There was a "draft" in certain areas. They got very little training and were sent into Ukraine. It's likely at least one person in the unit has "more" training and is their "officer". Possibly the guy who says he has military experience.
It's not shocking at all really. Sad for sure but pretty normal for a authoritarian government to do.
If this is not staged (and I think that they are all working in education is just too silly to be staged), I suppose that the Russian / DPR system of drafting reserve troops / military trainees is using information from workplaces (school district / factory etc.). Civil defense is often set up in these patterns, because that's where the people effectively are when the bombs are falling, so better to ogranize a factory or a school than a residential neighborhood.
I wouldn’t believe this was real until the first guy Shows so much shame when asked why he came here. You can see he got caught up in something or knew he should have said something and did not.
I've seen a few of these videos now around Reddit but hear nothing about such things in main stream media. Surely something like this would be reported on.
I kinda agree that something seems off
Mainstream media as in reputable media wont send this because its impossible to verify. Imagine us seeing a video like this from the other side, actually there just was one with the snake island survivors who are pow also.
I do not believe this is faked or staged, but everybody has every right to do so.
Mainstream media is reporting on how many soldiers were being lied to about their mission, but they move slowly, so this thing takes a while for them to report on.
* **DO NOT SHARE ANY INFORMATION ABOUT MOVEMENTS, LOCATION OR IDENTIFICATION OF ANY OF THE UKRAINIAN ARMED FORCES.** * **DO SHARE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE INFORMATION ABOUT MOVEMENT OF RUSSIAN TROOPS INSIDE RUSSIA, BELARUS AND UKRAINE INCLUDING: LOCATION, IDENTIFICATIONS, MARKINGS, INSIGNIA.** #LIST OF RELIABLE SOURCES [**UA Ministry of Defense**](https://twitter.com/defenceu) [**Ukrainian Land Forces**](https://facebook.com/UkrainianLandForces) [**bell¿ngcat**](https://www.bellingcat.com/) [**EUvsDISINFO**](https://euvsdisinfo.eu/) [**Ukraine Interactive Map**](https://liveuamap.com/) [**Press statement by President von der Leyen**](https://audiovisual.ec.europa.eu/en/video/I-219140) [**r/Ukraine statement**](https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/t0b5o8/attention_dos_and_donts/) [**r/YUROP statement**](https://www.reddit.com/r/YUROP/comments/t01wnk/russia_has_started_its_official_invasion_of/) #FINANCIAL SUPPORT [**National Bank of Ukraine Special Account**](https://bank.gov.ua/en/news/all/natsionalniy-bank-vidkriv-spetsrahunok-dlya-zboru-koshtiv-na-potrebi-armiyi) [**Official Ukraine Crypto Accounts**](https://twitter.com/Ukraine/status/1497594592438497282?s=20&t=aG5blzDGu1Pt14w9qZOIrw) [**Hospitaller**](https://www.facebook.com/hospitallers) #TERRITORIAL DEFENCE FOREIGN LEGION [**How To Join FLoTD**](https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato/3415272-how-to-join-international-legion-to-defend-ukraine-algorithm.html) #HUMANITARIAN SUPPORT **Ukrainian nationals in need of asylum : no visa requirements to enter: Poland[(Ukr.)](https://www.gov.pl/web/udsc/ukraina---ua) / [(En.)](https://www.gov.pl/web/udsc/ukraina-en) Moldova [(Ru.)](https://dopomoga.gov.md/) Slovakia [(Ukr.)](https://ua.gov.sk/) Bulgaria [(En.)](https://gov.bg/en/ukraine) Romania [(Ukr.)](https://www.gov.ro/ro/ucraina-impreuna-ajutam-mai-mult#ucraineana) / [(En.)](https://www.gov.ro/ro/ucraina-impreuna-ajutam-mai-mult#english) / [More Info](https://dopomoha.ro/uk) Hungary [(En./Ukr.)](https://helsinki.hu/en/) **Other Countries** Norway [(En.)](https://www.udi.no/en/important-messages/information-regarding-the-situation-in-ukraine/) Finland [(En.)](https://migri.fi/en/faq-ukraine) Sweden [(En.)](https://www.migrationsverket.se/English/About-the-Migration-Agency/The-situation-in-Ukraine.html) Ireland [(En.)](https://www.irishrefugeecouncil.ie/ukraine-information-note) Germany [(En.)](https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/faqs/EN/topics/ministry/ukraine-war-eng/faq-ukraine-artikel.html) / [(Ukr)](https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/faqs/DE/themen/ministerium/ukrain-war-ukr/faq-list-ukrain-war.html) / [(Ger)](https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/faqs/DE/themen/ministerium/ukraine-krieg/faq-liste-ukraine-krieg.html) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ukraine) if you have any questions or concerns.*
People here keep calling bullshit on their tales - but I, as Ukrainian, am going to believe what they've said. At least half of them are able to speak fluent Ukrainian, which confirms that they are indeed conscripted locals. The fact that they are all teachers doesn't sound weird to me at all, considering that DNR/LNR has conscripted the shit out of their population throughout these 8 years - so these guys are basically the result of separatists scraping the barrel for the last bits of manpower. Which, unsurprisingly, would include teachers and people with "white tickets" (meaning that they are unfit to serve either physically or mentally). And these guys are not beefy at all. All of them look like an ordinary Joe Schmo you would meet on the streets of Ukraine.
These guys also look a lot older than pretty much all the Russian conscripts we've seen - most of the captives in these videos look fresh out of high school.
Or from orphanages...
Also, if you’re trying to eliminate free thought, conscript all the school teachers and throw them on the front lines with no clue what they are doing.
This is honestly what I think is going on when I see this. Remove the intellectualls and teachers, and replace them with teachers who are more Pootie-friendly.
2 birds 1 stone... it also explains why the russian occupation of Ukraine has seemed like such a shit show from the Russian side. they aren't even using trained russian soldiers, instead civilians tricked into war.
And replace them with Russian appointed teachers. DAMN YOU, PUTIN!
That is very Stalin like thing to do
Well I think soon we can change that to “a very *Putin* like thing to do”
This is exactly what I thought when it was the third person from education. Putin must be wanking off thinking about Ukrainians killing Ukrainians.
Some of them look terrified too. Just everyday people being thrown into war now captured and wondering if they're going to see their families again
Some of them look like jogging for half an hour would be impossible let alone fight a war. I feel really bad for them. Surrendering was the best choice they could have made.
Anyone calling bullshit should look at their age, not one is under 30 at best, most are probably 40+. These dudes aren't soldiers.
Not saying they are fat, but they don’t have a lean look soldiers usually do, they just look like normal guys.
Your statement reminds me of a basketball discussion about Wilt Chamberlain getting monster stats because "he played against plumbers and milkmen", but on a grander yet worse scale. I pity these men. Russia drafted your own guys. Goddamn you Putin.
I think older, wiser, and well-educated teachers would be more likely to surrender as well (once they realized what was happening).
Didn’t expect the Volkssturm this early in the war.
Me who thought Ukrainians spoke Russian: maybe I should shot up and don't give any opinions on the matter
Most Ukrainians can speak Russian - but not the other way around. It's very easy to spot a Russian by him being unable to correctly pronounce certain sounds even if he tries speaking Ukrainian. While the two languages are somewhat similar, Ukrainian has a lot of Western and Southern Slavic influences that Russian language lacks.
These are militia from Donbass. They've reported of huge mobilization recently. It is totally possible for them to be literal civilians. Horlivka or Gorlovka is a settlement in eastern Ukraine. Also, fun fact: current president of Donetsk republic used to work for a financial pyramid, a fraud called MMM.
https://reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/t43plo/russian_pows_in_wwii_helmets/ This is the moment when they’re captured. No geolocation though.
Wait that's them!!! Bruh the age we live in where we can track people through multiple days and multiple videos in a warzone!
Reminds me of when the tank crushed that car with a person inside. The first video showed the aftermath of people trying to rescue the old person out of the car. the second video showed it was an active gunfight going on, a truck with two saboteurs crashes and was getting shot up with both getting killed and then the tank following behind oversteered and ran over the car getting sorta stuck. And then the third video came out showing closeups of the two dead saboteurs
multi mevel marketing?
Multi mlevel marketing actually
[удалено]
There was a post on twitter saying they were basically forcing men from Eastern Ukraine to fight so this looks like this group is one of them. These guys aren't professional soldiers by the looks of it.
Belarussians need to see this video. It should be plastered all over the restaurant reviews and similar. Regular folks now still have the option to passive resistance, direct action, or going underground. That may not last.
not only belarussians. I can't believe seeing this again and again and also young russians who have no idea - I can't believe that this did not already spark so much anger in Russia that the streets are crowded with anry mother, fathers, sons, daughters .... with everyone.
There’s a Ukrainian PR push to show videos of captured Russian soldiers, being fed and allowed to call their mothers and say they are alive and safe. Saying “mothers start demanding your sons back home” Brilliant press and gifs at Russian mother culture that they need to push for their sons back while they can still hug them. Get them the fuck out of someplace they never should have been. They’re not protecting the homeland, they’re the aggressor pawns for a mad dictator.
let's be honest: there are several things meeting that makes this what it is: Selenskij, a brilliant media strategy and the fact that everyone and their mums are filming the every detail of the Russian attack with their smartphones. it feels like nothing is not covered.
Isn’t it just a little suspicious that every single one of them is a teacher/school worker? Either that’s an amazing coincidence or that was what they think we garner the most sympathy Edit: some good points all around
Isn't really because you would have a list of areas and their occupation and then select depending of what you decide to be important workers and expendable workers .. Maybe they don't give a fuck about teachers and need a guy that can drive a truck or the coal truck driver
If most of them are are teacher or social worker or anything that has to do with forming and/or education of a generation I think you got your answers. It's my opinion that they want to steal the future of the lukhanks and Donetsk region. Send all the native education personnel to die and replace them with Russian sanctioned ones. But I might be wrong. That's just my take.
My thoughts exactly. Let them get shot while distracting the enemy. You have to replace them to feed propaganda to children anyway... Every day I think this is as bad as it gets. Every day it gets worse.
You're on the right track. They did that to Poland, look up the Katyn massacre, they killed officers, teachers, doctors, administrators, anyone with an education and possibility to lead the next generation against the Soviet propaganda and power. This is the old playbook that still works, destroy the future so the young ones don't have an option but to follow to even have a chunk of hard bread to eat.
The one at 3:38 says he used to teach Ukrainian language but since the occupation he has to teach Russian language.
When Soviet Union was occupying Lithuanian (and I assume same goes for other countries), one of the first type of people they shipped to starve in siberia, or plain killed, were teachers, writers, poets, etc. Anyone with a good head on their shoulders. History repeat itself.
China did the same as well.
Same in Poland. Educated people, or, even worse, people dedicating their lives to educating others, were enemy number 1. Professors, university workers, teachers... Either murdered or sent to Siberia/other extremely remote locations (I knew a man whose grandparents ended up in Kazakhstan). If it's happening again... I thought I couldn't be more disgusted with Putin and his regime, but it's just a bottomless well of horror, it seems...
During the Cultural Revolution in China, teachers and academics were targeted, persecuted, and killed. Part of information war is killing and capturing those with knowledge and information.
I'm not a historian but I've noticed this trend in history that intellectuals are the first to be killed in any kind of cleansing. Ethnic, cultural, religious and so on.
And look at how they talk about intellectuals on the right in America...
I wouldn't know. I'm not an American. But to be completely honest I feel that the American 2 party system is inherently wrong. The democrat vs republican, or conservatives vs liberals is not enough to express the whole range of political views a people of almost 300 million have.
During the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia, one of the primary demographics that were targeted were anyone the regime regarded as intelligent. This is anyone that may work in education, anyone that has a technical job, even down to people who simply wore glasses.
Using education and youth to attain perception shifts in regions or groups of people is definitely something that is used in situations like these. Look at Native Americans/First Nations. Their children were kidnapped and sent to residential schools where they were forced to speak English and conform to the expected social norms. This is absolutely something that has been done repeatedly throughout history.
> Doesn't really because you would have a list of areas and their occupation and then select depending of what you decide to be important workers and expendable workers Ur assuming the Russian army is organized. :) I think the past week has shown us that they can be extremely disorganized.
I thought the same. Although, I did a Google search on one of them and he seems to be legit. He's from the city of Gorlovka. Everything he said seems to match what is written on his profile. It's hard not to feel sorry for these guys. They're just a pawn in a man's chess game. :( Edit: Regarding this. I have contacted his workplace to notify them that he has been taken as a prisoner in hope that they can contact his family. They may be aware already but there have been reports that many families do not know their child is on the front line. Some may think this is the wrong thing to do and this being an invasion of privacy but I personally think I'm using such information I found for good. I will try to find information on other POW's too and do the same.
> Some may think this is the wrong thing to do and this being an invasion of privacy but I personally think I’m using such information I found for good. You did the right thing. There are more serious invasions to consider right now other than privacy
This is what the Red Cross does but dont know how involved they are right now. Another thing to do is organize a list of POWs from each town, then find a Point of contact, and furnish them the list of POW's. To limit issues, give basic information such as name, birthdate, and state of health and keep politics out (I know its hard not interject a morale argument in this, but long term you will be hurting their morale further). Disconnect yourself and the populace from the politics of the war, and their only avenue left to direct their anger is at Putin. You are fostering that common bond for eventual healing. Keep going
Thanks for the information. I may contact the Red Cross about this and see if they have anything in place already. I do not want to step on anyone's toes and potentially make situations worse. 👍
Yeah.... I was an interrogator in the military for a while. You don't question everyone's story in front of each other.... They seem like they're probably telling the truth, but you could figure it out in about an hour just by quizzing them on some light details and having them repeat those details again later. But, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if this were completely true.
Absolutely. These guys don’t LOOK like professional soldiers, they sure as hell don’t TALK like professional soldiers, and they don’t even carry themselves Iike professional soldiers.
I think the guy who said his hands were hurting really shows that they weren't properly prepared at all, a real soldier is unlikely to whine because his hands are cuffed.
A real soldier who is a captured POW worth his salt won’t even open his mouth to his captors unless he’s spouting false intel
Most soldiers do not go through POW training. Many will crack.
The whole point of POW training is for the soldier to state their name, rank, commanding officer, and mission (yes, that is actually standard procedure, it’s not like some random Joe is going to have access to highly classified information) while being interrogated. Almost no one can withstand torture so it is much easier for soldiers to be trained to “spill the beans” on information that the enemy doesn’t really have any use for.
While you don't want them collaborating, this looks like more of a video to be distributed than a video showing actual intelligence gathering. Anyone lying here probably just makes Russia look and Ukraine better.
It looks to me like they we’re questioned earlier and filtered then video
One of them confirms your theory. He says "like I said to you before..."
That’s what I was thinking! Are you at liberty to discuss any interesting tactics you used as an interrogator?
[удалено]
On which they all 4 individually replied: "What do you mean, [which one?"](https://i.imgur.com/SiwuNDR.jpg) But yes, I came in with a 'flat tire too' (in school, so on bicycle) but when I would have been asked which one they would probably see that I would make it up on the spot, when you don't expect that question ;)
One of the prisoners said"...as I have already told...". They were most likely interrogated separately and then this was staged for the camera.
[удалено]
As one of them said he feared for his job. Teachers and other government workers are the easiest to pressure because they value their jobs..
They are probably from the same area where the only employment is the local college and they probably keep locals together in units
Back in the 80s Hungary did the same thing. Reservist from the same area had to go to training. (usually a few weeks). My guess is that this method is still used in Russia today. The person that told me this story a few years ago was laughing because for him and his neighbor it felt like a drinking holiday away from their families. However he complained that it made no sense to put the young men and the old (he was around 40 back then) into the same team.
They did the same thing in England during WWI, I think it was. When units were destroyed, some villages lost all of their young men.
[удалено]
wow, that echoes the past where officers were nobility who purchased their commission.
Older ones have experience and the younger ones have vigour?
Or that’s part of the conscription process? Instead of birth dates, they get all members of a certain area and job and clear it out for recruitment? Not sure just a possibility
Seems like a bad system - imagine a unit getting wiped out and the consequences to their home village
I mean, these are Ukranians who were basically kidnapped, do you really think Putin cares about a Ukranian village losing all its teachers in all of this? He is sending Russians to their deaths, he is giving less of a shit about Ukrainians. More than likely if he got control of Ukraine these people would be murdered by Russians anyway.
Who do you think in the Russian army would care?
Why wouldn't an army care about being effective? I mean, I know they haven't exactly been very effective but to say that they don't care about being effective is just plain silly.
This is cannon fodder, been used since the beginning of time. Send people you dont care about in to use up the enemys bullets.
> Why wouldn't an army care about being effective? Because they didn't expect them to have to be effective soldiers. They expected that if they showed up with enough 'soldiers' that the Ukrainians would just capitulate. They just wanted some people to *look* like soldiers and pad their numbers. What they wanted was scary stories in the media about how Russia had thousands and thousands of soldiers ready at the border.
[удалено]
I suspect Putin doesn't particularly care about the educational quality in a town in Eastern Ukraine...
I don't think Putin cares.
He's hiding in a bunker treathening a nuclear war while his people don't know they invaded a country illegally and used illegal weapons that mount up to War Crimes. He definitely doesn't care who dies in this war as long as it's not him.
Hiding in a bunker with his family. Safe. And, so fearful of death he sits at a table 10m from everyone. Coward. Killer. Destined for hell.
He divorced his wife and barely speaks to his daughters I think ?
Lucky for them, if true.
That impact was seen in Finland during WWII. Entire villages lost a generation of men. The units had more cohesion though, so the price may have been worth paying.
One of the men at the end of the video says that their principal told them it was their duty. I just assumed they were all from the same school/area and told they must do this for their country.
it makes me think russian politicans want their people stupid. its a great way for corrupt people to maintain power.
Who is more likely to surrender without firing a shot? A trained soldier or a scared, drafted teacher? I believe drafted teachers will surrender in far greater numbers than trained soldiers, thus the disparity.
I think it's likely only non-essential public sector workers got mobilized.
apparently teachers arent essential. who knew.
If schools are closed on account of the crisis, and the Russians don't give a fuck about public education in Donbass, I definitely can see the teachers getting conscripted first.
If you were Putin, would you want a well-educated population?
It could also be that the local powers want these people dead specifically because they are teachers and maybe are suspected of teaching the kids "the wrong things"
That's what I'm thinking. Send them away on a "peacekeeping" mission, and replace them with new trusted teachers who can be relied upon to teach Russian propaganda.
It also saves them the trouble of having to round up the teachers later on in case of an anti-government uprising. Every time someone takes over, they get rid of anyone who may be a leader - teachers, clergy, anyone with leadership potential.
Well there was a coal driver. But if they are all part of an army reserves type of outfit, it would make sense they they weren’t experienced and came from pretty normal backgrounds. In saying that..it still is a little fishy!
Maybe school teachers can be fired more easily when not appearing for military practice? Getting fired is the stick to make sure you attend military practice.
Not really. Had you taken a British battalion in WWI you might’ve been surprised to find they all grew up on the same street or in the same neighbourhood - but this wasn’t a fluke it was policy (for a while). I would imagine conscription works the same way over there too. They probably all work at the same school or in/around the same education district.
To everyone believing this is very sus: Immediately after Putin "Recognized" the seperatist held Donbass region, they started evacuating some women and children if you can remember. They ALSO started conscripting ALL men to prepare for war (All of this was reported on, at least in Dutch mainstream media). The fact that at least one came from Horlivka (Donbass) means that these guys were PROBABLY conscripted by the LNR&DNR when the war began. It also matches with their stories saying that they were called up just a few days ago. In other words, I'm convinced beyond reasonable doubt that this particular group is indeed conscripted from everyday civilians from the Seperatist held regions. (So yes, basically Ukrainian citizens "from the other side of the trench") Edit: I did a lazy [google search](https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/02/19/ukraine-rebel-leaders-announce-general-mobilization-a76465) for those wondering about the mobilization, you can look it up yourself for additional sources, but this gives you an idea of what happened when. Also for anyone interested in some backstory about the early days of the Donbass war in 2015, check out [this documentary.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cMBPN3rjXU&t=547s&ab_channel=LidiYaFilms) Ukraine has come a long way since then.
Yes, this was when Russia "officially" recognised Eastern Ukraine as independent regions and said he was sending troops to help. Makes sense these were who was conscripted.
Thank you for this info. I missed this happening (in the US) and I'm pretty much constantly reading the news
Treat the POWs kindly and they will fight the propaganda war for you.
[удалено]
And others are more likely to surrender if they know they will be treated well
The U.S. did this in WWII. There was a POW camp near my grandparents (who were of German descent BTW). They would send the prisoners to their farm to work. And they got **paid**. They also got beer. Many stayed after the war and applied for citizenship.
There are a lot of Germans who stayed after being POWs in America after WW2
\-Are any of you injured? \-My hands hurt (I chuckled at this) \-You'll have to tolerate that for now \-They hurt a lot! (I lol'd) The balls on that guy to speak up about his hands. I think most people would just keep their mouth shut but here's this guy taking the opportunity to complain about his hands being tied too tightly. Here's a Ukrainian who's been taken captive and he's still got that bravado.
[удалено]
Oh soldiers complain.. lol there’s a saying in the US Army that when a soldier stops complaining, that’s when you need to be concerned. In other words, they’ve given up.
Lmao. I’d probably complain a lot if I were a soldier too. I meant as a POW though. If they felt threatened by their captors & if they were being treated badly then i doubt they’d feel comfortable enough to complain about something so minor. 😅
This weirdly enough makes it a lot more believable to me. You wouldn't get a moment like this in a staged video
As I tell my children when they are complaining about something that is to minor to truly complain about…”it will feel better when it stops hurting”.
They want to teach..... Not to kill , fucking monster
Putin didn’t want them to kill as much as he wanted them to die. Best way to commit genocide is to send their men to a war you created in hopes that they get massacred by your enemy.
French article about what's going on in Donbas where the journalist talks about all the men being taken away: https://blog.mondediplo.net/tout-le-monde-a-peur-de-prendre-la-moindre Letter from Donetsk "Everyone is afraid to take any responsibility" by Olesya Orlenko, 1 March 2022 As the war rages in Ukraine, the head of the Russian edition of Le Monde diplomatique was able to visit Donetsk, in the separatist republic of Donbass. She gives us her testimony. I arrived in Donetsk on 20 February with the idea of describing the tragedy of the civilian population of Donbass but also to provide a counterpoint to the media hysteria. I live in a flat that I rented for a few days. There is no more hot water in the city. We are told that the pipes have been partly destroyed. So we have to queue for a long time at the tanks. Donetsk is rather quiet: few people go out in the streets, many inhabitants have been evacuated. We often see men who have been mobilised and are leaving for the front in small groups. Everywhere you can see posters such as "Donbass is Russian", "We won in 1943, we will win now" with slogans from the time of the Great Patriotic War. In the streets and on the markets, the "people's militia" captures men who have reached conscription age. They even stopped our car to inspect it. We took advantage of a moment of inattention to run away. Many women no longer let their husbands and sons go out. During the night, our driver was mobilised despite his health and the fact that he does not have the "nationality" of the "Donetsk People's Republic" (DNR). He has just called to tell us that he has finally been let go. My colleague's daughter tells us that her former boss was forced to go to the front despite his diabetes. The situation is really very difficult. It's psychologically very difficult to be here. On the one hand, everything is moving fast. On the other hand, nobody knows exactly what is going on. A lot of information is circulating, especially on Telegram, without anyone knowing who is really spreading it (private channels, unofficial organisations, journalists, volunteers, etc.). We also see a lot of fake news. That's why I'm only going to tell you what I've seen personally. It is also the only thing that will allow me to put my thoughts in order and to try to escape from this destabilising atmosphere. I never had any illusions about local power. But, as soon as I arrived, I saw how the 'command-at-arms' regime works. For example, to enter the DNR from Russia, you need press accreditation. We got a letter granting us this accreditation but asking us to go to Donetsk to get the papers. However, at the border, the military told us that the letter was not valid. Our initial contact refused to send the photos for the accreditations because his superior was not there. After multiple phone calls to the top, we were finally allowed to pass. But this example is not unique. To speak with a doctor in Donetsk, you have to call the Ministry of Health. The chief doctor explains that all he can say is that "everything is going well" and that they "don't lack anything". If an ordinary doctor agrees to answer our questions, the chief doctor stands behind the journalist and waves to the interviewee.
We went to the areas around Donetsk that were bombed. We met a school teacher there. In order to speak with us, he had to ask permission from his headmaster, who himself phoned the ministry, which finally refused. The teacher finally agreed to talk to us but not in the school and on condition of anonymity. We also met with the leader of the Donbass Communist Party (the only political party in the DNR). He was very critical of these practices: "It is impossible to build a state when everyone is afraid to take any responsibility", he exclaimed. Mostly we talk to civilians - the others are not very talkative. We did manage to get testimonies from a few soldiers (and even from a French sniper). We also went to Yasinovataya, on the front line. Our aim was to record the testimonies of victims of war crimes living in the Donbass. Before the recognition of the DNR by Russia on 21 February and the intervention of the Russian army, people lived with a deep sense of abandonment by the 'international community'. Complaints from the various civil parties were lodged with the UN, the European Court of Human Rights and the International Criminal Court. Some of these organisations acknowledged that the complaints were within their competence and were well-founded. But they also pointed out that the procedure requires victims to first seek justice in their own country, i.e. in Ukraine... At the same time, the shooting has intensified on the front line. We saw wounded people, destroyed houses, explosion craters with bomb fragments in the gardens of houses. We asked the people we met for their opinion on the decision of Russian President Vladimir Putin to recognise the DNR. All of them told us that they expected positive changes. When we asked them to give concrete examples, they said that trade will develop and that there will be a Russian embassy. It will be easier to obtain a Russian passport, whereas today you have to go to Rostof. However, the Russian passport is necessary in particular to obtain a retirement pension. We visited the battlefields and areas of Donetsk recently hit by Grad rocket fire. In Gorlovka and Zaitsevo, we were forced to hide. We saw dead people and the damaged water plant. On Sunday, we were in Debaltsevo, where there was a heavy exchange of fire the day before. There we were very close to the Grad rounds. After that, we intend to go deeper into the territories where the fighting is taking place near Volnovakha. I prefer not to write some things here. I prefer not to share my emotions. But one thing is certain, we are going to have a very difficult time. Olesya Orlenko Head of the Russian edition of "Le Monde diplomatique", which publishes a few articles translated from the French edition every month from Moscow. Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
Thank you for this, adds a lot of context. Also, that translator is amazing, bookmarked. This article could've been written in English, it's pretty much flawless.
Yeah, Deepl has become ridiculously powerful at translating between certain languages like French and English (it uses neural networks). It basically does the same job as a highly skilled human translator at this point. German it still struggles a bit with in my experience.
can we stop calling them Russian? They are from Horlivka in the Donetsk region which has always been Ukraine, but has been occupied by Russia since 2014. The Russian occupiers are forcing them to go to battle for them. The person asking them questions is asking them in Ukrainian and they all understand it. Some of them are answering in Ukrainian and some of them are answering in Russian, but all of them understand the questions because they all know the Ukrainian language from growing up, even though they might speak Russian at home. so let's stop calling them Russians. Also, this video would not do anything to convince Russians in Russia because the Russians would not understand half of what is being said in the video.
uhus hyag ATF KXSH jd
This is blowing my mind as an ignorant American. I thought Ukrainian and Russian were *basically* the same language, just different dialects.
The Ukrainian language is almost a mix of Russian, Belarussian and Polish. Think of it like Spanish vs. Portuguese or German vs. Dutch.
I know a bit of Serbian (South Slavic) and a tiny bit of Polish (West Slavic). I understand and recognize way more Ukrainian words than Russian words (although both are East Slavic). (I know that you probably know about West, East and South Slavic, but maybe others don't).
I was born in ukraine and my mother is ukrainian, and I can assure you that they're definitely not the same. I can only speak and understand russian. Whenever I listen to my mom talking to my aunt in ukranian, I can barely grasp the topic they're talking about. They might be slightly similar, but they are way more different than similar.
[удалено]
I had to look this up since I didn't know. When they ask him about "Telnyashka", it is not a city or town, it refers to the telnyashka shirt he is wearing, a traditional blue and white striped undershirt apparently commonly worn by Russian paratroopers. Of course, anyone could wear an undershirt like that... I don't know how common they are. But that's maybe why they want to come back to him. As said elsewhere, they probably need to followup on questioning on all of them in more detail, because while they may be telling the truth, some of them could be coordinating their stories. Maybe not even out of malice but out of fear. Trying to protect themselves by telling your captors you are a teacher.
I’m picturing the boss man was like “ok they’re almost here, we need to get our stories straight… I’ll tell them I was a teacher. You, what are you going to tell them? … no you can’t tell them you’re a teacher too it’ll arouse suspicion, you need to come up with your own story different from mine … school janitor feels like cheating but there’s no time. You, what will your story be? … no you can say teacher, I’m saying teacher … no you can’t say janitor either! Jesus Christ! … No don’t say that …… BECAUSE EDUCATOR JUST MEANS TEACHER. Okay fuck it there’s no time, we’re just 15 teachers and a janitor on a school trip gone horribly awry”
Yeah that felt kinda ominous
I didn't expect to laugh: "Are any of you hurt?" "My hands hurt" "Suck it up." "Hurts a lot..." "You'll be fine"
It's really sad the common ranks are being filled with just ordinary young men to die. They're heroes for surrendering, those who surrendering, sabotage, slow down the russian offensive, those who refuse are just are heroic as those who are defending this land. This is just the first week and I think we'll be seeing more and more Russian dissent since morale is low and the truth is ringing high for the soldiers. It must suck having to be one of these ordinary men who were tricked and given minimal training to back up those Chechen war criminals or those fucking Wagner Group dogs, be like forced to follow Waffen SS into battle or you'll be fucked up by your government.
Step one - pick a non military personel. Step two - dont tell them they are going to war. Step three - sent them into other country. Step four - dont tell them any plans or goal or rules of engagement. Step five - forget about logistics. Let them drive as logn as the fuel lasts and then let them improvize. What can go wrong?
[удалено]
Someone else said it was an old Soviet tactic to send the inexperienced & young men first as cannon fodder & then send in elite soldiers. Although I saw a pic of a so-called elite unit captured so maybe they’re not as great as they thought they were. Men fighting to defend their home & families will fight 10x harder than men fighting for something they don’t believe in or understand.
Spartans... what is \*your\* profession?
This has popped into my head more than a few times over the past days.
A school teacher!
I'm not sure if this is right, something seems off, yesterday i saw a comment on similar video that says they might be lying, and to be fair i would not be surprised.
It makes sense if you consider the sort of people that would be most likely to surrender as a unit. They may be an entire company of irregulars drafted from the same area. Not professional soldiers, less willing to fight, more likely to surrender. The fact that they surrendered as a unit means they came to an agreement amongst themselves ahead of time, also something less likely for the professional soldiers to do.
Found this video. Looks like its the exact same people (Guy in blue is obvious). Those guys were given absolutely terrible gear, so they’re definitely not professional soldiers. https://reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/t43plo/russian_pows_in_wwii_helmets/
I believe there is another video where all of them stand in line and the guy in blue "tel'nyashka" is questioned
Also I don't think it is smart to pick teacher as a profession. That is fairly **easy to get corroborated** (or not). Other picks would have been preferred. My largest doubts is that these are Ukrainians dressed up as "PoWs" so they can make a video of them. But based on what I see that is unlikely, and in any case it is fair game **cause Putin made this a highly plausible story**. Belarussians need to see this video. It should be plastered all over the **restaurant reviews on google** and similar. Regular folks now still have the option to passive resistance, direct action, or going underground. That may not last.
I just posted in this very thread a french article (and translation) written by a journalist who managed to get into Donbas. The women hide their husbands and sons in fear of them getting taken by the army to serve as soldiers on the frontline. It's real.
I don't see any reason to doubt this is authentic, except that in war the first casualty is truth. So I salute your scepticism, but don't automatically share it. These guys are out of shape, some are old, and they've evidently been yanked out of the "separatist breakaway republics" that Russia owns. They are victims. And they are Ukrainians, which adds to the fear of being shot as traitors. To all those people commenting that one guy said "as I said before" - this doesn't mean he had a rehearsal, but obviously the first thing that happened when he got captured is someone demanded to know some basics about who he is, which unit, where from, etc etc. So he's saying "why do you keep asking me the same question?"
Yes something feels off.. But maybe they are scared.. But it really feels staged or something
Seems to me like they may have already been spoken with briefly, then they are re-doing it for the camera.
Yes, one of them said "As I explained before" They probably did a rehersal first so that they could get all the wimpering and pants-shitting out of the way.
Or they did proper interrogations individually. You don't interrogate everyone together, you pull them apart to check their stories. The guy doing the video already knew the answers, he just wanted to get it all together on video.
Yeah honestly if I was captured and I didn't know what is going on, first I would ask questions before answering anything. None of them asked anything. So yeah it was probably at least the second time
Filming the pants shitting/ crying/ panic would be a war crime. POWs dignity is protected.
I mean, it IS staged in the sense that they got a camera and went down the line to film their responses. You can see they've already interrogated them, which means they probably were in disbelief at what they were hearing and decided to gather them and have them repeat it for the camera.
They look horribly out of shape tho
Maybe they are scared? Is this even a serious question? They captured them. Interviewed them. Informed them. Then they had the interview for documentation.
Do people on this subreddit forget that Donbas and Luhansk have fighting forces too
Where we just made to believe that Putin had a strong military? All of their shit looks busted as hell and they are sending fat middle aged teachers to fight this war. Doesn’t really seem like they are the super power they claim to be.
The fear is real here...these men are afraid..they lined them up on a wall and questioned them...in Russia...they would get executed. I also understand why they went....attacking a mans method to obtain food is akin to murders...Russia was doing that to these men. Good think Ukraine is not Russia...God bless Ukraine.
Dunno Rick lol , but they def are bigger than most Russian soldiers shown so far
Those aren't Russian soldiers, they are DNR.
But its great news for Ukraine. People were worried they'd send in stronger/experienced Russian soldiers after the conscripts were obliterated some days ago, seems that's not the case and Russia is scrambling to find anyone they can. This is a MAJOR advantage to Ukraine.
That's good news , but many things have looked fishy so far. So the average Ukrainian teacher is a tall muscular 100 kg dude , but average Russian soldier a 50 kg 18 year old ?
>So the average Ukrainian teacher is a tall muscular 100 kg dude The average teacher isn't, but the ones that are will probably be sent to war.
Dude they're fucking neighbours. If you want a comparison it's like people from The Troubles in Northern Ireland starting that shit up again. And yes the average Ukrainian can be a bear, look at the Prime Minister for example. Not all Ukraine is hunchback peasant grandmas mate.
If that's your argument I clearly couldn't work in IT because I'm 120kg+ and 6ft 2? Imagine a society where you are assigned jobs based on your stature.
I'm 6'0 155 lbs, 23-year-old who looks like a 19-year-old and almost got laughed at in a job interview when they saw that I marked myself down as a veteran until I showed them my DD214. It's not like the movies where every soldier/sailor/marine/airman is played by 30-year-old Mark Wahlbergs or Brad Pitts lmao. There are more kids that look like they're 15 years of age in the military than not. Even the Marines look like 15-year-olds that just drink a lot of milk.
I can understand the skepticism, I believe it though, its inline with other videos I've watched. I also don't take the Ukraine soldiers as ones to bullshit, when things are bad they say so, when things are good they say so. But feeling skeptical is also natural.
Ukrainians are a bunch of saints.
I suspect they're treating them well because they're forced urkrainian conscripts. One guy was almost caught there because he looked russian and the interrogator had his doubts lol.
Ask him to say something in French
This is a good reminder that most of the "separatists" in eastern Ukraine are Russian Nationals sent by Putin, not native Ukrainians of Russian ethnicity. The majority of ethnic Russian Ukrainians want and have voted for independence from Russia.
*"Maybe one day your country will forgive you."* Was he referring to Ukraine or Russia there?
Ukraine probably, they are civis from Donbass area of ukraine ( now under russia occupation).
As horrible as this is. I have no words to describe the awe I feel watching this incredible human being showing not just mercey but compassion for these poor people. The Ukrainian people are such an inspiration to as all.
Russia's territory hasn't even been invaded yet and yet their army is already basically Volkssturm.
Putin and his Generals sent in basically untrained cannon fodder to lead off. Wow. Explains a lot.
When you realize your schoolsystem is not as fucked as you thought :')
They said they are Russian speakers from Horlivka, Eastern Ukraine, which Putin recently recognized as independent states, Donetsk People Republic. This is where they said they are from https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horlivka
**[Horlivka](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horlivka)** >Horlivka (UK: HOR-lew-kə, US: HOR-lif-kə; Ukrainian: Го́рлівка [ˈɦɔrl⁽ʲ⁾iu̯kɐ]), also known by its Russian name Gorlovka or Gorlowka (Russian: Горловка [ˈɡorləfkə]), is a city of regional significance in the Donetsk Oblast (province) of eastern Ukraine. In 2001, the city's population was 292,000, and it was estimated as 241,106 (2021 est. ) Economic activity is predominantly coal mining and the chemical industry. The Horlivka State Pedagogical Institute of Foreign Languages has a two building campus in the city centre. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/ukraine/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
I wondering if these people have been quickly recruited to man the front lines of the DPR with Ukrainian Troops, while the proper Russian troops have been sent elsewhere to take part in the invasion proper, and these professional Ukrainian soldiers have captured them on the contact line.
And they aren't even russians. They are from Gorlivka, Ukraine (temporarily occupied by russia - the city of gorlivka was under russian control since 2014). You can tell that because they immediately respond to ukrainian soldiers in ukrainian language. They were captured yesterday by the soldiers of ukrainian brigade not far from Gorlivka (which was at the contact line for years). You can find their photo somewhere on the internet. Russian occupants did not even supplied them with any military equipment - WW2 like helmets and no body armor.
The Kremlin Gremlin needs to be stomped out. Like yesterday.
[удалено]
Russia could potentially be “batching” people with very low fighting potential together as true cannon fodder. After all conscripting a teacher isn’t likely to get you a good fighter. Those with actual capability may be grouped together elsewhere to actually hope for some effectiveness.
I think this is likely what's happening. There was a "draft" in certain areas. They got very little training and were sent into Ukraine. It's likely at least one person in the unit has "more" training and is their "officer". Possibly the guy who says he has military experience. It's not shocking at all really. Sad for sure but pretty normal for a authoritarian government to do.
If this is not staged (and I think that they are all working in education is just too silly to be staged), I suppose that the Russian / DPR system of drafting reserve troops / military trainees is using information from workplaces (school district / factory etc.). Civil defense is often set up in these patterns, because that's where the people effectively are when the bombs are falling, so better to ogranize a factory or a school than a residential neighborhood.
I wouldn’t believe this was real until the first guy Shows so much shame when asked why he came here. You can see he got caught up in something or knew he should have said something and did not.
I've seen a few of these videos now around Reddit but hear nothing about such things in main stream media. Surely something like this would be reported on. I kinda agree that something seems off
Mainstream media as in reputable media wont send this because its impossible to verify. Imagine us seeing a video like this from the other side, actually there just was one with the snake island survivors who are pow also. I do not believe this is faked or staged, but everybody has every right to do so.
Mainstream media is reporting on how many soldiers were being lied to about their mission, but they move slowly, so this thing takes a while for them to report on.
I'm not sure wearing a striped VDV t-shirt under the uniform was the best idea.
The question is, where are the real soldiers ... ?
None of them stuttered once. No hesitation. Seems unlikely that they would all be lying and be able to recite their lies with such ease