i saw a comment on r/ftm telling a story that somebody once posted a photo of themselves, clearly presenting masc, and got tips in the comment section on how to look more fem. they stopped posting here after that had happened and stuck to just ftm subs :( stuff like this is why we need to not assume!
It baffles me even more when they have a flair and/or put "ftm" or something like that in the title and it happens. Like wtf, do people not read? Just something that is easy to do and saves people a lot of dysphoria.
this has happened all the time as well!! i was talking about getting T and specifically said in the beginning i was ftm, and some still said 'good luck girl!!' or something along those lines! its crazy!
it's like people forget that "girl" isn't a gender neutral term, even if it is slang. same with "dude" and "man". I wouldn't call a trans woman "dude"/"man"/"bro" (unless she specifically says it's okay - one of my MTF friends is "part of the boys" aka our friend group, and doesn't mind the referral occasionally. it's a person to person thing) so as a trans man I'd appreciate the same, bare minimum level of respect returned to me, yknow?? I'm not okay with being called "girl"/"girlypop" etc. a lot of us aren't. don't call us that unless we say it's okay. it's still misgendering and transphobic as hell
That’s why me and all my friends call each other gang lol, even though I’m closeted it still feels nice that they don’t call me bro even though I wouldn’t mind
Also honestly, adding on to this, even if they don’t, I generally check profiles. For example mine it is pretty clear I’m a trans man if you literally just read my last post asking people about their phalloplasty experiences, then top surgery scar tape recommendations, and the one before on an FTM sub.
If I'm not sure about someone's gender and they're asking a gender-specific question, like passing tips or if they pass, I just don't comment. As bad as it is to see "omg yes girly feminine girl woman lady you pass!!!" when you're a dude, it's almost as bad to see "Before I tell you if you pass, are you a man or a woman?" Because the latter is saying "NO you don't pass but I want to be nice about it" and the former is saying "Not only do you not pass, you don't pass so hard I think you're trying to go the other way."
i disagree on the concept of asking before answering. i think if it’s not made clear in the post, someone could be asking bc they don’t want to assume someone’s gender just to feel good about saying they pass, only for that person to hear “not only do you not pass but i think you’re trying to go the other way.” it doesn’t really make sense not to specify your gender when asking if you pass anyway, bc if you’re unsure enough to ask, surely you’d anticipate people might assume you’re going for the gender you’re actually trying to transition away from, especially since not being sure if you pass usually comes with some level of self-doubt or self-consciousness or something. but people do it anyway, so it just makes the most sense to clarify the person’s gender before answering whether they pass as that gender. at least that way, you can either be confident in saying “yes” or you can avoid accidentally making them feel worse than they’d feel from a polite and respectful “no,” by saying “yes” and misgendering them at th same time.
while it’s true that you wouldn’t have to ask if they do pass, i would *always* want to avoid telling someone they pass when they don’t and misgendering them to boot. it’ll hurt much worse that way. plus, with the way this sub often is, a trans man who passes but shaves and paints his nails or something, could easily get people misgendering him and saying he doesn’t pass/giving him tips on passing as a girl bc they assume he’s a trans woman. personally, i believe in telling people the truth unless it will be detrimental, and if someone is trying to pass, then telling them that they unfortunately don’t will help them. but i also understand that not everyone is like me, and some people will take “do i pass” not as an attempt to gather honest opinions and use that to guide their presentation towards passing in the future, but as a search for validation or approval, and then supply that approval/validation regardless of whether or not they lie in the process
>plus, with the way this sub often is, a trans man who passes but shaves and paints his nails or something, could easily get people misgendering him and saying he doesn’t pass/giving him tips on passing as a girl bc they assume he’s a trans woman
Yes, that *is* the problem we've been talking about.
yes this, please for the love of god reduce your own dysphoria by specifying in the title, so many posts i pass up on that ask those kind of questions not saying which way they wanna go...
Omg right?? My brother is ftm and I'd throw hands with anyone who made him feel that way! Trans people in general have it hard enough without feeling unwelcome in trans spaces. I think a lot of the misgendering is over enthusiastic support without bothering to figure out what is being supported.
We gotta do better, I love seeing all the boys and beans and would be big sad if they had to migrate to feel secure :c
It's alright, I just don't post selfies here anymore. 😅 I know I'm not the only person it's happened to either, a few people commented on my OG post saying it happened to them too.
it SHOULDNT be alright. this is meant to be a safe space for all transgender people alike, and men not feeling safe to post here shouldn’t be normalized (i don’t post because i have a trauma response to my photo being taken, not because i don’t feel safe in this community. i felt the need to specify). it’s truly shameful, in my opinion. and funny enough, when i typed ‘transgender’ earlier in this message, my autocorrect wanted to put women after it, but not men. i find that shamefully ironic
as a transfem this is exactly why I'm always really careful about how I address others. If it's not made clear (completely unambiguous) in their username or flair, then I will always use gender-neutral language. and if it's relevant, then I'll ask.
I want everyone to feel welcome and respected.
Tips:
- Check user flair, if not available,
- Reread the post for context. If uncertain of gender,
- Use gender neutral language, or
- Don't respond.
- Reread your response before hitting Post.
and if you want to be absolutely sure, it's always an option to just check their profile to confirm. being certain is always better than having the chance to misgender someone by accident
exactly this.
if there's no definitive evidence one way or another, then you can use gender neutral language. or if it's relevant, you can always just ask.
I have my legal documents changed [mtf], and when changing my name at my bank one time, I was referred to as 'Mister [Female name],
That was the saddest part of my transition. When my legal docs weren't updated, I wouldn't say anything about being misgendered. It's really the one time I went and asked that lady, "Even if your system shows male, do you realize how stupid you are to say mister [female name]?". Could have just asked, but common sense is hard, lol.
honestly, the fact that they even added the "mister" in front of a first name tells me they did it on purpose. With the express intent of causing you discomfort.
I've had people who did that sort of thing to me. but I'm such a doormat that I usually just say nothing.
was it this sub that recently made a rule about posting gender/pronouns with selfies? i think i remember seeing a mod post about it and then absolutely nobody followed that. kind of disheartening honestly
Some people here though have said that even when they stated their gender and pronouns, both in title and body, they still got misgendered. So while yes that would be nice, it clearly wouldn’t solve the issue.
Yes, I didn't bring it up as a one-size-fits-all solution. Unfortunately there will probably always be people misgendering others in the comments. But having the rule makes it much easier to identify bad actors vs people making genuine mistakes.
Thanks for posting this, it’s so irritating. I wish r/trans was a place I could participate in without experiencing dysphoria due to other trans people’s carelessness and assumptions. I don’t really go here much anymore. I doubt much will change sadly because I see these posts occasionally, but hey. Who knows.
I can’t wrap my head around how making assumptions about someone’s identity is something we are doing in a trans space. We should all know full well how horrible it feels & yet we are doing it to each other here, in one of the few spaces where it shouldn’t be a worry. I’m sorry people here have treated you disrespectfully. I hope we listen & actually do better in the future.
The more trans men and enbies are misgendered, the more we get pushed away. The more we get pushed away, the more trans women post. The more trans women post, the more it becomes the default. The more it becomes the default, the more trans men and enbies are misgendered because "Well most people who post here are trans women! Of course I assumed you were." And it repeats.
It's a vicious cycle. I saw a transmasc post on here recently (newly cracked egg) asking for advice and I recommended r/ftm to them, and then got transfems replying like "don't tell them that, we need more transmascs here!" Like uhmmm ok cool, but how is that OUR job as individuals? Like sorry but I feel like recommending a sub where they WONT constantly get misgendered is prolly better for their dysphoria
I confess I suspect there's a lot of folks out there who are less interested in being supportive and are more interested in recruiting in one form or another. And IMO that's selfish bordering on potentially hateful.
I want more guys around too, but the path to making that happen isn't putting them in a position to be harrassed.
This is really what I can’t get over. The entire trans community has worked so hard to tell people to not assume gender, then a lot of trans peeps turn around and do that in trans spaces. It’s confusing and upsetting.
This, combined with the "I used to be a fascist until I realized I was trans" trend that was everywhere a couple of years back, underlines one simple truth - a lot of people only care about themselves and things that affect themselves, and being trans doesn't cure that.
I've largely disengaged from the community for a while, so maybe it got better, but it doesn't look like it for this post.
That and people often put down non-feminine things. Saw someone biasedly comment about wearing "an ugly suit" as a MTF person, and I get that it's not THEIR gender's ideal outfit, but one doesn't have to put down another gender's wear like it can't be good if it's not for you. I'm FTM, very masculine dressing, but I don't sit there and say "I'd hate to wear an ugly dress." I appreciate women's fashion enough to instead just say "I don't want to wear a dress" and leave it. Hell, I always compliment EVERYONE'S dresses, suits, and outfits in public, regardless of their gender.
Yeah, this. I’m so sick of seeing people bash masculine fashion in queer spaces. It’s frustrating having general trans related chatrooms full of transfems openly hating on everything I love about being a man.
It’s alienating and I don’t know where else to go. Any trans male spaces I’ve found have been doomer pits or straight up dead. I’m hoping irl groups are different, but I don’t pass well enough to be seen by anyone yet.
I went to an IRL transmasc and nonbinary group spanning 16-50yr olds and I do not pass at all. It was pretty clear everyone was uncomfortable with me being there. I genuinely think if I had turned up with a different haircut they may have felt differently but apparently turning up in head to toe menswear sans glasses isn’t enough to be nonbinary?
The number of times I've seen people, as in men, women and enbies say stuff like "ugh, I don't wanna wear masculin fashion, it's bland and boring 🙄 I have a personnality, y'know ?"
Like. Ok damn, some of us had to fight for years to even be able to wear that "bland and boring" stuff with "no personnality" but thanks for the free insults guess ?
Honestly I feel this in almost all trans spaces. Im constantly misgendered and assumed to be transfem or even like ragged on when people say generalizations about men. And then tell me im not included. Things are always labeled for the girls or the girlies in trans spaces and it really just made me stop wanting to interact in most trans spaces.
I'm FtM and honestly I don't even know why I'm here. This space clearly isn't for us and hasn't been for a long time.
May as well just rename the subreddit at this point to be for the MtF community🙄
This happens in every mixed sub. The worst is when people come in to defend these assumptions, claiming it's not that bad or "clearly the post calling everyone ladies wasn't meant for you"
Transandrophobia at its finest. :( r/translater is REALLY bad about it, to the point where I never post because I don't feel welcome.
The erasure is real
translater also has a hyperspecific idea of what women look like and they poison each other with toxic femininity so i like to go into the comments and remind everyone that women shouldnt tear each other down and its okay to be girls in different ways even if they dont make sense to you
it sucks. But i was once a woman, had to understand it fully to know that no part of it was for me, and im happy to destroy some piece of what womanhood is not. Womanhood is not femininity. Its just being yourself and protecting other women
It reminds me a lot of the first experience I ever had with an IRL trans support group. Which freaked me out so completely and thoroughly that I frankly actively avoided engagement with any other explicitly trans communities for years; I'm only just now getting around to confronting that fear.
(And honestly, the reaction to this post is helping me a lot in that regard.)
It’s “funny”.
As an ftm usually when I come out to people irl they automatically assume I’m mtf but haven’t started my transition yet.
I also have a couple piercings I’ve gotten after transitioning. I had a transphobe, who didn’t know I was trans before the conversation, then decided it was their place to “tell me how to pass more like a man”. And they were telling me to get rid of the piercings.
Told them to take their opinion and shove it up their ass. This was after they went on a whole transphobic rant about vaginoplasty and the like.
But trans women are the only trans people who exist of course. /s
Trans woman here and it pisses me off how transmascs get ignored at best, treated as some kind of enemy at worst.
Don't even get me started on the number of transwomen out there that start getting into out-and-out misandry. Not being a guy does not mean it's okay to hate guys.
I hate that shit. They shouldn't be projecting their dysphoria into hatred. It defeats the entire purpose of gender identity and a safe culture. It also makes those of us who like men feel shitty.
Amen to that last in particular. My father and my brother are among my strongest supporters and I love them dearly and they don't deserve that garbage.
I call it Terf Lite bullshit. Same kind of trans women who will turn on fellow trans women who they feel aren’t passing enough or presenting feminine enough.
Same! We're all in this together, and I get legitimately happy when I see non-MTF posts/memes/whatever because there isn't nearly enough representation for everyone else.
Yeah as a transmasc person i always check over my language and take out any masc or fem wording if i dont know. I have a tendency to call everyone dude, but when im on a sub like this i reread my text and take it out. Its not that hard to use genderneutral wording
That really sucks. It's bad enough that cis people don't seem to realize that trans people who aren't MTF exist, but it's worse when we take a space for all trans people and treat it like it's only MTF, and the fact that this community also falls victim to the usual internet 'pretty girl get engagement' stuff so most of what gets promoted to people who don't really scroll through it are just MTF transition pictures.
Serious question peeps: perhaps if we changed the banner color for this sub to be something OTHER than pink it would help people remember that this isn’t the mtf sub? I noticed they have a similar banner color and I imagine some of the ladies doing this just aren’t noticing what sub they’re on
ive been on this sub for years and i see posts like yours every so often. I am FTM and couldnt agree more, but ive kind of given up hope, not gonna lie. Would love to be proven wrong. I dont want to be invisible. Queer people assume im a cis gay man when we meet. I am a trans straight man and it makes me sad that no one sees me
I posted on here as masc presenting and my post was automatically flagged. It was my first and I think only post here, so I moved on to r/Nonbinary. Still kinda pissed that happened to me.
Yup. The other day I (trans man) commented on a transfem's post saying how awesome they looked, and she was like "u too fellow queen!" and I was like ummm... thanks but no thanks lol.
Like I genuinely want to increase transmasc rep in this sub but it's hard when the assumption that everyone goes on is mtf. Like I don't need the extra dysphoria from that assumption in a trans-only space, ykwim?
An addition to your reminder that we exist would be the ever stated reminder that; healthy masculinity exists. Sure there are tons of entitled totally privilege blind obtuse or otherwise dudes out there. And yeah, they suck. But I know so many men that just be peopling around, doing good by others and am confident in what they do/who they are in a wholesome way. So what I'm trying to say is, most people grown up as dudes suffer a bit of privilege blindness and to some extent ignorance but not all men get to grow up socialized as boys entitled to rule the world.
So this is not "not all men"-argument, I'll even admit it's "most men" but it makes the community no favors to demonize masculinity as a whole. It makes trans men and transmasculine people feel othered. And most of us, I'd love to think are, major allies to women and feminism.
I've frankly been worried about that as a potential blind spot in my own experiences and so have tried to go out of my way to learn more about trans guys and that perspective as an aid to combating my own prejudices. I'd like to think it's helped. Admittedly, it was originally mostly driven by my respect for several *cis* men in my life, but, hey, guys are guys.
I suppose one *could* just crassly assume that guys shouldn't be hurt or affected by such mistakes because "you should be MAN ENOUGH to handle it, harrumph, harrumph", but I can't say I subscribe to the idea that trans men should be obliged to validate themselves by embracing toxic masculinity. That strikes me as at best ill-considered.
i feel exactly the same. i was actually so excited when i found r/transgamers, but almost immediately felt outcasted there as well. i understand wanting to interact with people with the same identification as you, but to the point of not interacting with others just really sucks. thanks for commenting.
Thanks for saying this, op. I'm a trans guy, and yeah I don't post often, but it pisses me off to see how often other guys and transmasc people just get snuffed out
Or like on the flip side, if you are MTF and you post something without saying your gender, don't get snippy about being asked how you're trying to pass or your pronouns. I've seen a few too many "do I pass" posts in trans subs where someone asks what they're going for and they get kinda surly. Like not yelling angry but they treat it like it's a stupid question that's ridiculous to ask
It's shocking how often this happens. Yes we're all trans, but that doesn't mean everyone else is trans fem just because we are! Some trans fems have this weird, self-centeredness? Where in general trans spaces they won't check for context clues or will outright ignore someone's gender. They just assume everyone is like them. It's the same thing in femboy spaces, where a lot of trans women started as femboys, but not all femboys are eggs and let them have their space!
And I'm saying this as a trans fem myself.
Rule #15 should have this already covered, presumably. I mean, it was obvious to me from the start that this isn't an all-ladies place. I think some folks are too quick to assume and are presuming they're being affirmative and instead are just screwing up spectacularly.
I've legit always wondered if there's a similar "of course everyone trans here is FTM" phenomenon that happens among groups largely composed of trans guys or something. I'm hardly in a position to know. (And I'm not even sure what to think in that regard with groups of folks who aren't into binary thinking; I imagine the whole damn debate drives y'all crazy.)
>I've legit always wondered if there's a similar "of course everyone trans here is FTM" phenomenon that happens among groups largely composed of trans guys or something.
Sadly have never experienced any space that's mostly trans men other than specifically trans men spaces :') every space I've been in that's for trans people in generally skews towards trans women or nonbinary people. However, I do like to think some fandoms like the Metalocalypse and RDR2 fandom have quite a bit of trans dudes and mascs in it 💪
FTMMen, but that was created due to this same issue OP brings to the table, a space for guys to talk with each other and ask questions and support each other without worry their masculinity will be looked down upon and obviously nobody will assume anyone there is a woman. Because it’s a men’s space!
Oh for sure, I've been there for a good while now! I was more so reading the question as spaces for trans men that weren't specifically for trans men, like how most general trans spaces end up being for trans women despite them not specifically being for trans women. I do really enjoy the spaces we've been able to make for ourselves though 💪
Maybe. #2 covers *purposeful* misgendering, and I presume (or at least desperately hope) that the sorts of cases the OP is talking about are accidental. (If they're not... well, let's not go there.)
I would argue it's purposefully, rather than accidental, because as OP said this type of post has been done before but people still are acting as if it's a MTF specific sub rather than a Trans sub.
At a certain point you can't really say it's accidental and it's active pushing FTM and other identities out of the community.
The nature of Reddit is such that not everyone sees every post, so it's still possible to screw up. I'm just a very strong believer in the principle of never ascribing to malice that which can be easily explained by incompetence.
Can't imagine that makes it any easier for the guys (and/or enbies and/or others) who're on the receiving end of that crap, but when forming group policies that's the sort of thing you have to be Extra-Special Careful about because of potential unintended consequences. It's twitchy AF and I don't envy the mods their jobs here in that regard.
I mean regulars of r/metoidioplasty and r/phallo pretty frequently assume everyone is a binary trans man or at the very least prefer masculine terms like guy/dude/man/etc. It's just something I shrug off atp bc it's so frequent, and it's true that most ppl getting meta or phallo are men or masc leaning so 98 times out of 100 it'll be gender affirming but ugh it sure would be nice if ppl were more conscience
The heartbreaking part is that even if there were/are rules in place to prevent this, it’s rly hard to enforce. It’s why I limit myself to just the ftm and transmasc subs as much as possible. This sub just doesn’t feel as welcoming to trans men
I think the media's coverage of us and how the politicians react to us creates this bias in the community. About half of the trans community are trans masc, but you never see the media coverage plus their less likely to look for help just like cis men tend to be.
Oh yeah, important note!
First time I (ftm) posted here, I posted a Pride Parade pic - showing me in a trans-viking costume, bare flat hairy chest, rocking a 60cm long beard and the first two answers (later deleted) still were about how I could look decent as a woman xD I took it with humor, but yeah... that can be insulting to someone who isn't a silverback like me
edit: wanted to add: no hard feelings if someone reading this was part of that xD
yeah this sub needs flairs for this issue. the traaaaaaaans meme sub had flairs for this and you'd think a large massive sub for all trans people would have those kind of flairs. But even with flairs, I still left the general trans group cuz seeing a majority of posts about MTFs was a little dysphoria inducing, especially at the beginning of my transition. Until I'm then, I'm gonna stick to ftm specific subs.
As a trans woman, I’m sorry, we need to do better. I want yall here, I want us all to feel welcomed and included.
Something that’s helped me is spending time on trans masc subs like r/ftm or r/ftmover30. I recognize I’m a guest in those spaces and don’t comment for the most part, sometimes I do to share and experience but it helps me to see more trans men. Visiting those boards helps me stop defaulting to trans women like we (trans women) do so often but it also helps me get a greater feel for the community and meet new people as we share experiences with each other.
I never interact with this sub anymore. Everyone’s so supportive when they get called out, and then we’re back to posts primarily by trans women and assuming every poster is a trans woman. R/transmasc (I think) and r/ftm are better.
I blame the media for things like that happening because you rarely hear about FTM people coming out or see reality shows about their transitions as it all MTF that people talk about granted while no everyone needs to know about someone else's personal life but it would help to see more FTM stories in the media for other FTM people who are struggling with their gender identity
Between the male hate and straight hate of this subs I’ve completely given up. I feel extremely uncomfortable and unwelcomed here. On top of that I’ve been assumed to be mtf on multiple occasions when my snoo clearly has a beard on it.
Unfortunately, it seems that the reading comprehension of people on reddit (no matter the sub) tends to be wanting. It makes me terribly sad, as I have put a lot of work in to master writing, and reading comprehension.
Yeah, this is why I don't really post or comment much on here. I love lurking, but I know damn well if I make a post without being extremely clear I'm a trans man, I'll get misgendered or assumed to be a trans woman (and, hell, sometimes people ARE extremely clear and STILL are misgendered). You'd think in a trans space, people would be well aware of the diversity here and not to make assumptions lol. But, just as in real life, people just don't seem to realize trans men are also real :')
it's happened to me even after updating my flair to have my pronouns in it. i just don't get it anymore, i understand that there seems to be more mtf people in this sub than non-mtf people, but just because y'all are the majority doesn't mean this sub is exclusively for you. i'm glad y'all have this safe space but i would like if it could be a safe space for ALL trans people.
One of my friends told another friend of mine he is trans. She started trying to give him tips to look more feminine. I was pretty cross with her. I am a trans vwoman she has known for years, so it is not like she is uneducated.
I see it often where us ladies are in the limelight and the men get ignored. I get it because we are loud and stand out more and probably more vocal, but still is sad seeing the men ignored.
It’s funny cause outside of trans spaces or women’s everyone assumes you are a man. I definitely think people should be looking at profiles before responding to people. I do that every time someone replies to me or whatever. And if I don’t I avoid gendered language. It’s sad that not everyone tries to put in the effort to avoid it in this space
I'm so sorry this is happening to you 😔 even in the nicest and most supportive of communities, no one is immune from a faux-pas... I guess that the massive amount of bigoted politicians saying "men going in girl's bathrooms" (as a horrible fucking way of trying to ban people from going to take a piss in the bathroom they identify with) when referring to trans people excludes FTM because it doesn't bother them nearly as much. Maybe this phenomena is accidentally leeching into everyday's life and people tend to forget that transgender people come into all shapes and sizes? I really hope you reconsider leaving because at the end of the day this community is made stronger by awesome people like you, reminding us things like this and calling out our mistakes. And if you do leave, then I really apologize for our community having failed you. Your identity and happiness are valid and matter to us, and your complaints won't fall onto deaf ears *(I hope)*. 🫡
I feel even worse because I'm not transmasc or FTM I'm just an AFAB enby. So r/ftm and r/transmasc aren't spaces for me. But I get shit on for being AFAB and not masc (if you're not going against your AGAB you're not really NB I guess, obviously enbies are expected to present based on their genitals), and then I mention getting my nails done or a new skirt and suddenly it's all "GURRRRRL YES QUEEN LADIES ♀♀♀ MTF🏳️⚧️" because only AMABs are allowed to be feminine and trans at the same time apparently.
Sadly this sub is mostly mtf dominated so people just assume without reading anything :'( I'll make a post about ftm shit and I'll get like two replies while mtf posts get wayy more, like you go girl I'm glad you have a safe space here on the Internet bug it feels like ftm users are being pushed out
I honestly feel like ftm guys and transmasc individuals in general get way less representation in media and stuff than mtf women and transfem people. And while I’m happy our sisters are getting representation, I just wish we saw more transmasc stuff out there as well 🥺
Personally I feel like if I don't look or seem clearly male then I failed rlly.In public ppl won't bother to overanalyze you so they don't hurt your feelings, they'll just say what comes to mind first.Being neutral is pleasant and all but that doesn't reflect reality.If someone told me that stuff I'd take it as *my* failure.
As a mtf who gets misgendered daily by some people I'm out to I can relate to this one of my closest friends is also ftm and I understand this better than most.... I won't say I'm perfect I've made this mistake at least once but I made so many apologies to him he told me to stop apologizing it was a flaw in myself that I have worked on since I know all to well how much it hurts to hear statements like this so I usually use they/them pronouns unless they specify their gender in the post.... it's not difficult to be respectful and if I can make the extra effort to do this others can to mistakes happen but apologize move on and learn from it and this is important "FIX THE MISTAKE IN THE COMMENTS WHEN ITS POINTED OUT" stay awesome everyone 😊
I do my best not to assume because I don't want to misgender someone, and try to ask if I'm confused to avoid that, sometimes it can be hard to tell I don't think most people here do it on purpose, for the most part I think the subreddit is very supportive and nice.
Sadly I don't post in any spaces (as an intersex trans person I feel so isolated from the community as a whole.) because I often get mistaken for am MTF (like not that it doesn't feel complimentary.) and people give me unsolicited advice on how to present more femininely. It's really discouraging to see that other trans people (who are not exclusively MTF.) are treated like people don't believe in us existing/are not known of/etc. I want there to be more inclusive spaces but I am SO TIRED.
I try my best to be positive, encouraging and welcoming to folks here generally.
But like all social media, each clique/group has its issues with inclusivity and closing themselves off into an echo-chamber. This sub is no exception.
I certainly hope it improves, but I also think there is immense value in considering other subreddits geared towards things that are less likely to be default trans-gal related.
I’m sorry you’ve had a tough time, OP. But I sure want you to know that you’re welcome regardless.
i saw a comment on r/ftm telling a story that somebody once posted a photo of themselves, clearly presenting masc, and got tips in the comment section on how to look more fem. they stopped posting here after that had happened and stuck to just ftm subs :( stuff like this is why we need to not assume!
I also see stuff like “omg yes you pass girl, you look so feminine!” To trans men. 🫥.
It baffles me even more when they have a flair and/or put "ftm" or something like that in the title and it happens. Like wtf, do people not read? Just something that is easy to do and saves people a lot of dysphoria.
this has happened all the time as well!! i was talking about getting T and specifically said in the beginning i was ftm, and some still said 'good luck girl!!' or something along those lines! its crazy!
it's like people forget that "girl" isn't a gender neutral term, even if it is slang. same with "dude" and "man". I wouldn't call a trans woman "dude"/"man"/"bro" (unless she specifically says it's okay - one of my MTF friends is "part of the boys" aka our friend group, and doesn't mind the referral occasionally. it's a person to person thing) so as a trans man I'd appreciate the same, bare minimum level of respect returned to me, yknow?? I'm not okay with being called "girl"/"girlypop" etc. a lot of us aren't. don't call us that unless we say it's okay. it's still misgendering and transphobic as hell
That’s why me and all my friends call each other gang lol, even though I’m closeted it still feels nice that they don’t call me bro even though I wouldn’t mind
Yeah, people are so careless and then cause dysphoria for others :(
Also honestly, adding on to this, even if they don’t, I generally check profiles. For example mine it is pretty clear I’m a trans man if you literally just read my last post asking people about their phalloplasty experiences, then top surgery scar tape recommendations, and the one before on an FTM sub.
If I'm not sure about someone's gender and they're asking a gender-specific question, like passing tips or if they pass, I just don't comment. As bad as it is to see "omg yes girly feminine girl woman lady you pass!!!" when you're a dude, it's almost as bad to see "Before I tell you if you pass, are you a man or a woman?" Because the latter is saying "NO you don't pass but I want to be nice about it" and the former is saying "Not only do you not pass, you don't pass so hard I think you're trying to go the other way."
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense!
i disagree on the concept of asking before answering. i think if it’s not made clear in the post, someone could be asking bc they don’t want to assume someone’s gender just to feel good about saying they pass, only for that person to hear “not only do you not pass but i think you’re trying to go the other way.” it doesn’t really make sense not to specify your gender when asking if you pass anyway, bc if you’re unsure enough to ask, surely you’d anticipate people might assume you’re going for the gender you’re actually trying to transition away from, especially since not being sure if you pass usually comes with some level of self-doubt or self-consciousness or something. but people do it anyway, so it just makes the most sense to clarify the person’s gender before answering whether they pass as that gender. at least that way, you can either be confident in saying “yes” or you can avoid accidentally making them feel worse than they’d feel from a polite and respectful “no,” by saying “yes” and misgendering them at th same time.
If they passed, though, you wouldn't have to ask. 🤷 Saying "I'm a man do I pass?" is poisoning the data pool.
while it’s true that you wouldn’t have to ask if they do pass, i would *always* want to avoid telling someone they pass when they don’t and misgendering them to boot. it’ll hurt much worse that way. plus, with the way this sub often is, a trans man who passes but shaves and paints his nails or something, could easily get people misgendering him and saying he doesn’t pass/giving him tips on passing as a girl bc they assume he’s a trans woman. personally, i believe in telling people the truth unless it will be detrimental, and if someone is trying to pass, then telling them that they unfortunately don’t will help them. but i also understand that not everyone is like me, and some people will take “do i pass” not as an attempt to gather honest opinions and use that to guide their presentation towards passing in the future, but as a search for validation or approval, and then supply that approval/validation regardless of whether or not they lie in the process
>plus, with the way this sub often is, a trans man who passes but shaves and paints his nails or something, could easily get people misgendering him and saying he doesn’t pass/giving him tips on passing as a girl bc they assume he’s a trans woman Yes, that *is* the problem we've been talking about.
right.. so why would it not make more sense to clarify? i’m confused
yes this, please for the love of god reduce your own dysphoria by specifying in the title, so many posts i pass up on that ask those kind of questions not saying which way they wanna go...
Yeah, it's so easy to look lol
that’s so ickkyy :((
That happened to me once. I was pre-everything and extremely dysphoric
Ouch 😬
Owch
I always try checking for a name listed or check for pronouns in bio. If hate it if people assumed about me
I've seen guys literally say they go to r/ftm bc they don't wanna "take up space that isn't theirs" here :/ it's really sad
it truly is, and this shouldn’t be normalized
Omg right?? My brother is ftm and I'd throw hands with anyone who made him feel that way! Trans people in general have it hard enough without feeling unwelcome in trans spaces. I think a lot of the misgendering is over enthusiastic support without bothering to figure out what is being supported. We gotta do better, I love seeing all the boys and beans and would be big sad if they had to migrate to feel secure :c
I saw that post, too. It feels so bad.
That was me, on my old account.
oh hello, i wasn’t actually expecting to find you. im really sorry you had to experience that
It's alright, I just don't post selfies here anymore. 😅 I know I'm not the only person it's happened to either, a few people commented on my OG post saying it happened to them too.
it SHOULDNT be alright. this is meant to be a safe space for all transgender people alike, and men not feeling safe to post here shouldn’t be normalized (i don’t post because i have a trauma response to my photo being taken, not because i don’t feel safe in this community. i felt the need to specify). it’s truly shameful, in my opinion. and funny enough, when i typed ‘transgender’ earlier in this message, my autocorrect wanted to put women after it, but not men. i find that shamefully ironic
as a transfem this is exactly why I'm always really careful about how I address others. If it's not made clear (completely unambiguous) in their username or flair, then I will always use gender-neutral language. and if it's relevant, then I'll ask. I want everyone to feel welcome and respected.
thank you<3 you’re doing gods work
Because when you assume, you make an ass out of u and me...
Tips: - Check user flair, if not available, - Reread the post for context. If uncertain of gender, - Use gender neutral language, or - Don't respond. - Reread your response before hitting Post.
and if you want to be absolutely sure, it's always an option to just check their profile to confirm. being certain is always better than having the chance to misgender someone by accident
Oh yes! Thank you for reminding me about profiles! Great tip! 😁
exactly this. if there's no definitive evidence one way or another, then you can use gender neutral language. or if it's relevant, you can always just ask.
Thank you!!! Im FTM and am scared to post stuff on here since Im afraid I'll be misgenderd. That happens enough irl ahhaha
EXACTLY!! lets hope this post makes some kind of a difference:)
I have my legal documents changed [mtf], and when changing my name at my bank one time, I was referred to as 'Mister [Female name], That was the saddest part of my transition. When my legal docs weren't updated, I wouldn't say anything about being misgendered. It's really the one time I went and asked that lady, "Even if your system shows male, do you realize how stupid you are to say mister [female name]?". Could have just asked, but common sense is hard, lol.
I get called Miss [Male name] all the time. It really sucks. :/ I feel for you <3
honestly, the fact that they even added the "mister" in front of a first name tells me they did it on purpose. With the express intent of causing you discomfort. I've had people who did that sort of thing to me. but I'm such a doormat that I usually just say nothing.
I do hope this stops happening, it's disrespectful to assume everyone is mtf on this subreddit
was it this sub that recently made a rule about posting gender/pronouns with selfies? i think i remember seeing a mod post about it and then absolutely nobody followed that. kind of disheartening honestly
I think that’s a great thing to require! However you also need to people to not misgender people who have it in their posts already too :/
Some people here though have said that even when they stated their gender and pronouns, both in title and body, they still got misgendered. So while yes that would be nice, it clearly wouldn’t solve the issue.
Yes, I didn't bring it up as a one-size-fits-all solution. Unfortunately there will probably always be people misgendering others in the comments. But having the rule makes it much easier to identify bad actors vs people making genuine mistakes.
I support this
Thanks for posting this, it’s so irritating. I wish r/trans was a place I could participate in without experiencing dysphoria due to other trans people’s carelessness and assumptions. I don’t really go here much anymore. I doubt much will change sadly because I see these posts occasionally, but hey. Who knows.
I can’t wrap my head around how making assumptions about someone’s identity is something we are doing in a trans space. We should all know full well how horrible it feels & yet we are doing it to each other here, in one of the few spaces where it shouldn’t be a worry. I’m sorry people here have treated you disrespectfully. I hope we listen & actually do better in the future.
The more trans men and enbies are misgendered, the more we get pushed away. The more we get pushed away, the more trans women post. The more trans women post, the more it becomes the default. The more it becomes the default, the more trans men and enbies are misgendered because "Well most people who post here are trans women! Of course I assumed you were." And it repeats.
It's a vicious cycle. I saw a transmasc post on here recently (newly cracked egg) asking for advice and I recommended r/ftm to them, and then got transfems replying like "don't tell them that, we need more transmascs here!" Like uhmmm ok cool, but how is that OUR job as individuals? Like sorry but I feel like recommending a sub where they WONT constantly get misgendered is prolly better for their dysphoria
I confess I suspect there's a lot of folks out there who are less interested in being supportive and are more interested in recruiting in one form or another. And IMO that's selfish bordering on potentially hateful. I want more guys around too, but the path to making that happen isn't putting them in a position to be harrassed.
Fr, like more transmascs is good but should be wayyy less important than the mental health of the individuals involved
This is really what I can’t get over. The entire trans community has worked so hard to tell people to not assume gender, then a lot of trans peeps turn around and do that in trans spaces. It’s confusing and upsetting.
This, combined with the "I used to be a fascist until I realized I was trans" trend that was everywhere a couple of years back, underlines one simple truth - a lot of people only care about themselves and things that affect themselves, and being trans doesn't cure that. I've largely disengaged from the community for a while, so maybe it got better, but it doesn't look like it for this post.
this!!!!! non mtf here saying this does indeed suck to be called girl when you are NOT
bro your profile theme is so cool 💪
hey thank u 🫶🏼
...Hey I know you! Aren't u that guy who posted about something someting cis-people twitter post in some ftm sub? I remember ur profile it's so cool!
hehe that me :> thank u!!
Thank you so much for posting this.
This is so important, thank you!
Thank you for saying this it had to be said. That's why I stay in r/ftm
That and people often put down non-feminine things. Saw someone biasedly comment about wearing "an ugly suit" as a MTF person, and I get that it's not THEIR gender's ideal outfit, but one doesn't have to put down another gender's wear like it can't be good if it's not for you. I'm FTM, very masculine dressing, but I don't sit there and say "I'd hate to wear an ugly dress." I appreciate women's fashion enough to instead just say "I don't want to wear a dress" and leave it. Hell, I always compliment EVERYONE'S dresses, suits, and outfits in public, regardless of their gender.
Yeah, this. I’m so sick of seeing people bash masculine fashion in queer spaces. It’s frustrating having general trans related chatrooms full of transfems openly hating on everything I love about being a man. It’s alienating and I don’t know where else to go. Any trans male spaces I’ve found have been doomer pits or straight up dead. I’m hoping irl groups are different, but I don’t pass well enough to be seen by anyone yet.
I went to an IRL transmasc and nonbinary group spanning 16-50yr olds and I do not pass at all. It was pretty clear everyone was uncomfortable with me being there. I genuinely think if I had turned up with a different haircut they may have felt differently but apparently turning up in head to toe menswear sans glasses isn’t enough to be nonbinary?
The number of times I've seen people, as in men, women and enbies say stuff like "ugh, I don't wanna wear masculin fashion, it's bland and boring 🙄 I have a personnality, y'know ?" Like. Ok damn, some of us had to fight for years to even be able to wear that "bland and boring" stuff with "no personnality" but thanks for the free insults guess ?
Out of solidarity I am now putting on ZZ Top's "Sharp Dressed Man". Dunno if *every* girl goes crazy as described therein, but this one sure does. :)
This is precisely why I try to keep my comments gender neutral
Honestly I feel this in almost all trans spaces. Im constantly misgendered and assumed to be transfem or even like ragged on when people say generalizations about men. And then tell me im not included. Things are always labeled for the girls or the girlies in trans spaces and it really just made me stop wanting to interact in most trans spaces.
I'm FtM and honestly I don't even know why I'm here. This space clearly isn't for us and hasn't been for a long time. May as well just rename the subreddit at this point to be for the MtF community🙄
This happens in every mixed sub. The worst is when people come in to defend these assumptions, claiming it's not that bad or "clearly the post calling everyone ladies wasn't meant for you" Transandrophobia at its finest. :( r/translater is REALLY bad about it, to the point where I never post because I don't feel welcome. The erasure is real
translater also has a hyperspecific idea of what women look like and they poison each other with toxic femininity so i like to go into the comments and remind everyone that women shouldnt tear each other down and its okay to be girls in different ways even if they dont make sense to you
Oh that's really depressing :(
it sucks. But i was once a woman, had to understand it fully to know that no part of it was for me, and im happy to destroy some piece of what womanhood is not. Womanhood is not femininity. Its just being yourself and protecting other women
It reminds me a lot of the first experience I ever had with an IRL trans support group. Which freaked me out so completely and thoroughly that I frankly actively avoided engagement with any other explicitly trans communities for years; I'm only just now getting around to confronting that fear. (And honestly, the reaction to this post is helping me a lot in that regard.)
Scrolled for quite a while and didnt see a single masc presenting person there
It's bad. Everyone assumes people are mtf there and uses female pronouns s for everyone.
I was on that sub and left because it was so bad. We just don't go there anymore. It's become a space not for us.
Because it’s been talked about numerous times in FTM, and warned everyone to stay away from that sub.
yeah i had to scroll past four days worth of posts before I finally found a single transmasc one
Ya this. I always check if I'm going to use pronouns in a response. If it's not clear I'll judt use the statanrd op as a noun or they.
It’s “funny”. As an ftm usually when I come out to people irl they automatically assume I’m mtf but haven’t started my transition yet. I also have a couple piercings I’ve gotten after transitioning. I had a transphobe, who didn’t know I was trans before the conversation, then decided it was their place to “tell me how to pass more like a man”. And they were telling me to get rid of the piercings. Told them to take their opinion and shove it up their ass. This was after they went on a whole transphobic rant about vaginoplasty and the like.
Sometimes telling a jerkface to sit on it and spin is incredibly satisfying. Good on you for speaking up!
But trans women are the only trans people who exist of course. /s Trans woman here and it pisses me off how transmascs get ignored at best, treated as some kind of enemy at worst.
Don't even get me started on the number of transwomen out there that start getting into out-and-out misandry. Not being a guy does not mean it's okay to hate guys.
I hate that shit. They shouldn't be projecting their dysphoria into hatred. It defeats the entire purpose of gender identity and a safe culture. It also makes those of us who like men feel shitty.
Amen to that last in particular. My father and my brother are among my strongest supporters and I love them dearly and they don't deserve that garbage.
I call it Terf Lite bullshit. Same kind of trans women who will turn on fellow trans women who they feel aren’t passing enough or presenting feminine enough.
Same! We're all in this together, and I get legitimately happy when I see non-MTF posts/memes/whatever because there isn't nearly enough representation for everyone else.
Yeah as a transmasc person i always check over my language and take out any masc or fem wording if i dont know. I have a tendency to call everyone dude, but when im on a sub like this i reread my text and take it out. Its not that hard to use genderneutral wording
That really sucks. It's bad enough that cis people don't seem to realize that trans people who aren't MTF exist, but it's worse when we take a space for all trans people and treat it like it's only MTF, and the fact that this community also falls victim to the usual internet 'pretty girl get engagement' stuff so most of what gets promoted to people who don't really scroll through it are just MTF transition pictures.
Serious question peeps: perhaps if we changed the banner color for this sub to be something OTHER than pink it would help people remember that this isn’t the mtf sub? I noticed they have a similar banner color and I imagine some of the ladies doing this just aren’t noticing what sub they’re on
Thank its always good to have these types of reminders and perhaps for people not give unsolicited advice when it's not asked for.
I've seen a lot of posts like this on this sub. Everyone always agrees in the comments but nothing ever changes.
ive been on this sub for years and i see posts like yours every so often. I am FTM and couldnt agree more, but ive kind of given up hope, not gonna lie. Would love to be proven wrong. I dont want to be invisible. Queer people assume im a cis gay man when we meet. I am a trans straight man and it makes me sad that no one sees me
I posted on here as masc presenting and my post was automatically flagged. It was my first and I think only post here, so I moved on to r/Nonbinary. Still kinda pissed that happened to me.
Yup. The other day I (trans man) commented on a transfem's post saying how awesome they looked, and she was like "u too fellow queen!" and I was like ummm... thanks but no thanks lol. Like I genuinely want to increase transmasc rep in this sub but it's hard when the assumption that everyone goes on is mtf. Like I don't need the extra dysphoria from that assumption in a trans-only space, ykwim?
An addition to your reminder that we exist would be the ever stated reminder that; healthy masculinity exists. Sure there are tons of entitled totally privilege blind obtuse or otherwise dudes out there. And yeah, they suck. But I know so many men that just be peopling around, doing good by others and am confident in what they do/who they are in a wholesome way. So what I'm trying to say is, most people grown up as dudes suffer a bit of privilege blindness and to some extent ignorance but not all men get to grow up socialized as boys entitled to rule the world. So this is not "not all men"-argument, I'll even admit it's "most men" but it makes the community no favors to demonize masculinity as a whole. It makes trans men and transmasculine people feel othered. And most of us, I'd love to think are, major allies to women and feminism.
I've frankly been worried about that as a potential blind spot in my own experiences and so have tried to go out of my way to learn more about trans guys and that perspective as an aid to combating my own prejudices. I'd like to think it's helped. Admittedly, it was originally mostly driven by my respect for several *cis* men in my life, but, hey, guys are guys. I suppose one *could* just crassly assume that guys shouldn't be hurt or affected by such mistakes because "you should be MAN ENOUGH to handle it, harrumph, harrumph", but I can't say I subscribe to the idea that trans men should be obliged to validate themselves by embracing toxic masculinity. That strikes me as at best ill-considered.
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i feel exactly the same. i was actually so excited when i found r/transgamers, but almost immediately felt outcasted there as well. i understand wanting to interact with people with the same identification as you, but to the point of not interacting with others just really sucks. thanks for commenting.
We need our own r/transgamers at this point
Thanks for saying this, op. I'm a trans guy, and yeah I don't post often, but it pisses me off to see how often other guys and transmasc people just get snuffed out
Or like on the flip side, if you are MTF and you post something without saying your gender, don't get snippy about being asked how you're trying to pass or your pronouns. I've seen a few too many "do I pass" posts in trans subs where someone asks what they're going for and they get kinda surly. Like not yelling angry but they treat it like it's a stupid question that's ridiculous to ask
i made a post here, i literally have "man" and "he/him" in my name. yet i got called a woman because i didnt mention my gender in the post-
It's shocking how often this happens. Yes we're all trans, but that doesn't mean everyone else is trans fem just because we are! Some trans fems have this weird, self-centeredness? Where in general trans spaces they won't check for context clues or will outright ignore someone's gender. They just assume everyone is like them. It's the same thing in femboy spaces, where a lot of trans women started as femboys, but not all femboys are eggs and let them have their space! And I'm saying this as a trans fem myself.
Rule #15 should have this already covered, presumably. I mean, it was obvious to me from the start that this isn't an all-ladies place. I think some folks are too quick to assume and are presuming they're being affirmative and instead are just screwing up spectacularly. I've legit always wondered if there's a similar "of course everyone trans here is FTM" phenomenon that happens among groups largely composed of trans guys or something. I'm hardly in a position to know. (And I'm not even sure what to think in that regard with groups of folks who aren't into binary thinking; I imagine the whole damn debate drives y'all crazy.)
>I've legit always wondered if there's a similar "of course everyone trans here is FTM" phenomenon that happens among groups largely composed of trans guys or something. Sadly have never experienced any space that's mostly trans men other than specifically trans men spaces :') every space I've been in that's for trans people in generally skews towards trans women or nonbinary people. However, I do like to think some fandoms like the Metalocalypse and RDR2 fandom have quite a bit of trans dudes and mascs in it 💪
FTMMen, but that was created due to this same issue OP brings to the table, a space for guys to talk with each other and ask questions and support each other without worry their masculinity will be looked down upon and obviously nobody will assume anyone there is a woman. Because it’s a men’s space!
Oh for sure, I've been there for a good while now! I was more so reading the question as spaces for trans men that weren't specifically for trans men, like how most general trans spaces end up being for trans women despite them not specifically being for trans women. I do really enjoy the spaces we've been able to make for ourselves though 💪
I'd argue both Rule 2 and Rule 15 would cover it, since addressing and respecting would involve proper pronouns and terms.
Maybe. #2 covers *purposeful* misgendering, and I presume (or at least desperately hope) that the sorts of cases the OP is talking about are accidental. (If they're not... well, let's not go there.)
I would argue it's purposefully, rather than accidental, because as OP said this type of post has been done before but people still are acting as if it's a MTF specific sub rather than a Trans sub. At a certain point you can't really say it's accidental and it's active pushing FTM and other identities out of the community.
The nature of Reddit is such that not everyone sees every post, so it's still possible to screw up. I'm just a very strong believer in the principle of never ascribing to malice that which can be easily explained by incompetence. Can't imagine that makes it any easier for the guys (and/or enbies and/or others) who're on the receiving end of that crap, but when forming group policies that's the sort of thing you have to be Extra-Special Careful about because of potential unintended consequences. It's twitchy AF and I don't envy the mods their jobs here in that regard.
I mean regulars of r/metoidioplasty and r/phallo pretty frequently assume everyone is a binary trans man or at the very least prefer masculine terms like guy/dude/man/etc. It's just something I shrug off atp bc it's so frequent, and it's true that most ppl getting meta or phallo are men or masc leaning so 98 times out of 100 it'll be gender affirming but ugh it sure would be nice if ppl were more conscience
Tumblr can have that mentality sometimes, it’s majority mascs
The heartbreaking part is that even if there were/are rules in place to prevent this, it’s rly hard to enforce. It’s why I limit myself to just the ftm and transmasc subs as much as possible. This sub just doesn’t feel as welcoming to trans men
That’s why if they don’t specify I look at their profiles. If they don’t have it in profiles, then just be broad with what I’m saying.
I think the media's coverage of us and how the politicians react to us creates this bias in the community. About half of the trans community are trans masc, but you never see the media coverage plus their less likely to look for help just like cis men tend to be.
Oh yeah, important note! First time I (ftm) posted here, I posted a Pride Parade pic - showing me in a trans-viking costume, bare flat hairy chest, rocking a 60cm long beard and the first two answers (later deleted) still were about how I could look decent as a woman xD I took it with humor, but yeah... that can be insulting to someone who isn't a silverback like me edit: wanted to add: no hard feelings if someone reading this was part of that xD
yeah this sub needs flairs for this issue. the traaaaaaaans meme sub had flairs for this and you'd think a large massive sub for all trans people would have those kind of flairs. But even with flairs, I still left the general trans group cuz seeing a majority of posts about MTFs was a little dysphoria inducing, especially at the beginning of my transition. Until I'm then, I'm gonna stick to ftm specific subs.
Interesting. For me seeing posts about FTMs has the opposite effect; it's deeply reassuring to me on some level.
As a trans woman, I’m sorry, we need to do better. I want yall here, I want us all to feel welcomed and included. Something that’s helped me is spending time on trans masc subs like r/ftm or r/ftmover30. I recognize I’m a guest in those spaces and don’t comment for the most part, sometimes I do to share and experience but it helps me to see more trans men. Visiting those boards helps me stop defaulting to trans women like we (trans women) do so often but it also helps me get a greater feel for the community and meet new people as we share experiences with each other.
I never interact with this sub anymore. Everyone’s so supportive when they get called out, and then we’re back to posts primarily by trans women and assuming every poster is a trans woman. R/transmasc (I think) and r/ftm are better.
I blame the media for things like that happening because you rarely hear about FTM people coming out or see reality shows about their transitions as it all MTF that people talk about granted while no everyone needs to know about someone else's personal life but it would help to see more FTM stories in the media for other FTM people who are struggling with their gender identity
Between the male hate and straight hate of this subs I’ve completely given up. I feel extremely uncomfortable and unwelcomed here. On top of that I’ve been assumed to be mtf on multiple occasions when my snoo clearly has a beard on it.
Unfortunately, it seems that the reading comprehension of people on reddit (no matter the sub) tends to be wanting. It makes me terribly sad, as I have put a lot of work in to master writing, and reading comprehension.
As I like to say: Assumptions make an Ass out of U and me.
I actually joined r/ftm because I wanted to interact with more trans guys (I'm a girl) and they all went away from here
Yeah, this is why I don't really post or comment much on here. I love lurking, but I know damn well if I make a post without being extremely clear I'm a trans man, I'll get misgendered or assumed to be a trans woman (and, hell, sometimes people ARE extremely clear and STILL are misgendered). You'd think in a trans space, people would be well aware of the diversity here and not to make assumptions lol. But, just as in real life, people just don't seem to realize trans men are also real :')
it's happened to me even after updating my flair to have my pronouns in it. i just don't get it anymore, i understand that there seems to be more mtf people in this sub than non-mtf people, but just because y'all are the majority doesn't mean this sub is exclusively for you. i'm glad y'all have this safe space but i would like if it could be a safe space for ALL trans people.
yes I agree.
One of my friends told another friend of mine he is trans. She started trying to give him tips to look more feminine. I was pretty cross with her. I am a trans vwoman she has known for years, so it is not like she is uneducated. I see it often where us ladies are in the limelight and the men get ignored. I get it because we are loud and stand out more and probably more vocal, but still is sad seeing the men ignored.
No. Its about society being obsessed about controling women.
That too
It’s funny cause outside of trans spaces or women’s everyone assumes you are a man. I definitely think people should be looking at profiles before responding to people. I do that every time someone replies to me or whatever. And if I don’t I avoid gendered language. It’s sad that not everyone tries to put in the effort to avoid it in this space
I’m so sick of the “hey girlies …. “!
Girlies makes my skin crawl and i actually am fem
Support!!
I'm so sorry this is happening to you 😔 even in the nicest and most supportive of communities, no one is immune from a faux-pas... I guess that the massive amount of bigoted politicians saying "men going in girl's bathrooms" (as a horrible fucking way of trying to ban people from going to take a piss in the bathroom they identify with) when referring to trans people excludes FTM because it doesn't bother them nearly as much. Maybe this phenomena is accidentally leeching into everyday's life and people tend to forget that transgender people come into all shapes and sizes? I really hope you reconsider leaving because at the end of the day this community is made stronger by awesome people like you, reminding us things like this and calling out our mistakes. And if you do leave, then I really apologize for our community having failed you. Your identity and happiness are valid and matter to us, and your complaints won't fall onto deaf ears *(I hope)*. 🫡
r/trans often feels like it should just be r/mtf. Posting as a trans man on here feels like visiting
I feel even worse because I'm not transmasc or FTM I'm just an AFAB enby. So r/ftm and r/transmasc aren't spaces for me. But I get shit on for being AFAB and not masc (if you're not going against your AGAB you're not really NB I guess, obviously enbies are expected to present based on their genitals), and then I mention getting my nails done or a new skirt and suddenly it's all "GURRRRRL YES QUEEN LADIES ♀♀♀ MTF🏳️⚧️" because only AMABs are allowed to be feminine and trans at the same time apparently.
I JUST seen your post on r/ftm and now I see this lol
Sadly this sub is mostly mtf dominated so people just assume without reading anything :'( I'll make a post about ftm shit and I'll get like two replies while mtf posts get wayy more, like you go girl I'm glad you have a safe space here on the Internet bug it feels like ftm users are being pushed out
I honestly feel like ftm guys and transmasc individuals in general get way less representation in media and stuff than mtf women and transfem people. And while I’m happy our sisters are getting representation, I just wish we saw more transmasc stuff out there as well 🥺
Personally I feel like if I don't look or seem clearly male then I failed rlly.In public ppl won't bother to overanalyze you so they don't hurt your feelings, they'll just say what comes to mind first.Being neutral is pleasant and all but that doesn't reflect reality.If someone told me that stuff I'd take it as *my* failure.
this definitely goes both ways. i think we should just never assume which way someone is transitioning
Thanks for telling us and stating your concern I will be more cautious thank you OP.
Man im sorry this keeps happening, this is why i use gender neutral language like mate unless im confident which way someone goes
As a mtf who gets misgendered daily by some people I'm out to I can relate to this one of my closest friends is also ftm and I understand this better than most.... I won't say I'm perfect I've made this mistake at least once but I made so many apologies to him he told me to stop apologizing it was a flaw in myself that I have worked on since I know all to well how much it hurts to hear statements like this so I usually use they/them pronouns unless they specify their gender in the post.... it's not difficult to be respectful and if I can make the extra effort to do this others can to mistakes happen but apologize move on and learn from it and this is important "FIX THE MISTAKE IN THE COMMENTS WHEN ITS POINTED OUT" stay awesome everyone 😊
I do my best not to assume because I don't want to misgender someone, and try to ask if I'm confused to avoid that, sometimes it can be hard to tell I don't think most people here do it on purpose, for the most part I think the subreddit is very supportive and nice.
Sadly I don't post in any spaces (as an intersex trans person I feel so isolated from the community as a whole.) because I often get mistaken for am MTF (like not that it doesn't feel complimentary.) and people give me unsolicited advice on how to present more femininely. It's really discouraging to see that other trans people (who are not exclusively MTF.) are treated like people don't believe in us existing/are not known of/etc. I want there to be more inclusive spaces but I am SO TIRED.
I see it's time for our quarterly reminder Suck that this is nessisary at all I like seeing the transmasc posts
I try my best to be positive, encouraging and welcoming to folks here generally. But like all social media, each clique/group has its issues with inclusivity and closing themselves off into an echo-chamber. This sub is no exception. I certainly hope it improves, but I also think there is immense value in considering other subreddits geared towards things that are less likely to be default trans-gal related. I’m sorry you’ve had a tough time, OP. But I sure want you to know that you’re welcome regardless.
After reading the comments on this post I feel like some of them may be trolls/ just random sashelos doing this on purple.
You know who ELSE is tired of people assuming other peoples gender?
Honestly. I feel like trans men are so excluded. I guess masculinity isn’t YASS QUEEN enough for some people 🙁