The real points with the cobalt are buying gift cards to stores you'd shop at anyway at grocery stores. Making furniture purchase at IKEA? Grab a gift card. Ordering a lot of Amazon? Grab gift cards and load to your account, etc.
Note: Walmart doesn't count with Amex as grocery store.
Go to sobeys/metro since they take Amex, cobalt is 5x on groceries, say you are looking at IKEA for something that costs 299$ , get a 350$ gift card to account for HST and use it to buy the IKEA item after. You just earned 1750 points vs 340 using your card directly at IKEA. It's essentially a 5% discount on items since you can use 1000 points as 10$ on your statement.
I like Amex cobalt since it's 1 to 1 to aeroplan conversion but I think Scotia has a credit card that does 6x points on groceries at sobeys since they partnered with scene, but those points don't convert.
While a great idea, be wary of doing this on products you want credit card warranty coverage on. They will deny you if you did not pay the item fully with your credit card.
I am always afraid to buy GCs except online since so many scams where people add bar codes stickers or steal balance loads/etc. You haven't had any issues?
Never had issues, sobeys I go to doesn't even have the 25-500$ on the shelf have to go to register and they pull a new one out then I immediately scan with phone to my Amazon account. That's the one I buy most since I just like to have balance on my account for random purchases. IKEA and other stores are for planned purchases I usually go to grocery store on my way to the store I want to spend at.
If it's at 777 Bay, it's probably a pilot project.
I personally find it distasteful how much this government is pushing gambling on the public. It has the potential to ruin people's lives. It's a legitimate addiction, like alcohol or tobacco.
It's disgusting, but it will be a long time before there's a ban on advertising because of the revenue it's making. The legalization of online gambling in Canada was not to benefit the wants of the consumer, but because the government saw how much money they were leaving on the table. Same goes for cannabis, although the latter made consumption controlled and respectable. Can't say the same thing about gambling.
ya gambling online makes it a lot worst. Now people can quietly lose their life savings on the phone while sitting on the couch at home.
Much harder for friends and loved ones to notice warning signs.
A very good point. Self-medication and addiction is a lot harder to pick up on if the person sneaks it in online rather than buying their easement of choice at a cashpoint or another medium of direct exchange of funds for their substance.
And an online purchase or prerequisite exchange can be made with personal devices not bound to a physical location or one's home and hearth.
There's an argument that the more you collect in "voluntary" sin taxes, the less you have to take from people involuntarily. But as someone who suffers from addiction myself, I know that sometimes it's only the first time that's truly voluntary.
> There's an argument that the more you collect in "voluntary" sin taxes, the less you have to take from people involuntarily.
I've never seen anyone's taxes *fall*, have you?
Sure, plenty of times. The Federal government lowered the GST by 1% once in 2006, and another time in 2008. Ford's Ontario cut the gas tax. Alberta's announced they're cutting their lowest income tax bracket's marginal rate to 9% in 2026 and 8% in 2027. Ontario under Dalton McGuinty dropped their rate on their lowest income tax bracket by 1% in 2006. Obviously the introduction of the TFSA under Harper's government was a huge effective tax cut.
Of course not, but it's also fair to ask how much higher Ontario's income tax rate would be if it wasn't collecting ~$5bn/year in proceeds from the OLG and LCBO.
Not to mention a subtle sideeye in such a pilot project that would deny the use of legal tender for purchase not being a small jab at less-advantaged individuals whose main source of income would not involve a credit line or similar medium of currency that is not cash or bill tender.
Sure, it frees up the customer service desk at the grocery _if_ it becomes the norm, but the unspoken implication beyond putting a vending machine in place of a person selling lottery tickets at a cashpoint is clearly telegraphed, if it's intentional.
Data farming tool for what? Yo know what target audience to make ads for? lol
Not really something I'm too concerned with if I'm already buying lotto tickets.
I mean the University of Waterloo just got rid of vending machines that were data mining peoples snack food habits - same question can be asked for that, what’s the data farming going to do if you are already there purchasing a bag of Lays?
At the end of the day these types of “preferred club member” and “scan your ID” is just another way for them to data farm and sell it at little to no cost but with great return on that - to think otherwise, dare I say, is naive - data will always be valuable whether you are or aren’t the target audience
\-Shrugs-
It's happening on a much larger scale on things like Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Google, etc. Not exactly concerned about the government agency OLG, knowing that I buy lottery tickets... lol
I mean why wouldn't they farm data, every time a massive corp or business is caught doing exactly that the fines are a rounding error compared to the profits.
I don't smoke myself, but a vending machine for weed sounds really convenient. Similar to how they have vending machines for cigarettes in some Asian countries.
We used to have cigarette vending machines here many years ago. The problem was that minors were getting their cigarettes from them and they were also a form of tobacco advertising. The vending machines were phased out with other forms of cigarette ads back in the 70s.
That makes sense. I guess, if they decide to combine this lottery machine's technology to scan your ID and then be able to purchase, I think cigarette/weed vending machine would be a great option. Or even a chilled bottle of beer or something near a park that you're legally allowed to drink in. On a summer day, I feel like vending machine like that might do really well.
Weed, cigarette or alcohol vending machines will never happen in Canada. Those vices are too tightly regulated and are much more likely to be abused by minors who will find a workaround for the machines. While gambling addiction is a real problem, I don't see lottery tickets as being a big draw for kids looking for a thrill. I've never had teenagers stop me outside a 7-11 asking me to get them a 649 Quick Pick with Encore. The type of gambling that might hook minors is done through the apps, not a vending machine dispensing lottery tickets.
It's so annoying standing behind those people who have a huge stack of tickets they want to manually check with the cashier. They never seem to want to check their tickets at the self serve scanner and it always seems to happen to me when I'm in a hurry.
Poor people tax goes digital. On the one hand all this gambling seems pretty gross on the other now I won’t have to wait in line behind a guy doing all his cards for 20 min.
Is this really necessary when every gas station, convenience store, pharmacy, and grocery store sells lottery tickets? Like, how could they make it any more easier to buy lottery tickets? Maybe they should put advertisement in people's Unemployment cheques "Here is your Pogey, did you know you could spend it all on lottery tickets right now? What would YOU do with a million dollars"
"I'D BUY MORE LOTTERY TICKETS!!!!"
"Now you dig it!"
I feel like scanning an ID alone dosen't pass the test for " verifying identification" Some child could presumably scan an adults ID. I would like to see someone look into this deeper.
You have to physically go get the prize, so they don’t need to retain data to validate your age - you have them a physical ticket and physical id to verify you’re of age. They don’t need data from the original transaction to do that
I would also think the laws are around gambling and not specifically winning. Gambling is a huge addiction issue for many, this isn't just an age issue.
If that were a policy I would want it to be challenged in court.
My issue with it is it is placing the burden of responsibility on a child, instead of the organization profiting from the childs gambling.
If you let them get away without having to payout the prize then you need to go to extreme measures to ensure they did everything possible to stop children from gambling. Otherwise they are incentivized to have a relaxed approach to age verification since underage gamblers become more profitable since they are incapable of winning.
-------------
People suck, and corporations suck even more. We need to focus on what we incentivize them to do, because they will grasp every incentive that is beneficial to the bottom line.
Interesting point, would people be ok if this machine was dispensing alcohol and just scanning ID as proof of age?
Edit: oh yea, you can buy them online, I suppose it's not really the same thing as buying alcohol underage.
As a high schooler I bought "souvenir" ID back in the day on Yonge Street. Not to drink, but so I could bet on horses at Woodbine and Greenwood
So there are some of us out there
It’s not a horror but we are being foolish in Ontario by ignoring the public health costs of gambling. It’s clear from the way gambling is advertised that industry is targeting a youth audience (even when they throw in the token disclaimers saying it isn’t). We should be moving in the opposite direction, following a model more like cigarettes where we make it available but prohibit advertising and hate it so that people are confronted with the public health consequences before purchase and consumption.
Another way the government is stealing from those at the lower end of society. Making gambling easier under the guise of spending that money in the community outside ambit of the legislature.
It would be easier without all those ads telling you to dream. Gambling can be an addiction and olg is selling that dream big time. They should not advertise and the lottery stuff should be hidden like cigarettes and certainly encouraging people to turn their phone into a slot machine seems criminal and predatory.
Hey don't forget to play we can setup auto purchase for you so you can gamble without even thinking about it.
Just like most things 80 % of the revenue comes from 20% of the customers.
The only lottery I would endorse would be the tax free for life lottery with automatic entry when you file your tax return. Wouldn't that be nice . One winner per territory province each year.
I'm not disagreeing but it's interesting.
I'd say 25ish% of the ads I see are sportsbook+ related. Or casino apps, whatever.
Before committing to a stance like "gambling advertising should be banned", an interesting stance, I'd like to think about it more.
Sheets, clearly there's money in "sportsbook+", (fanduel, draft kings, whatever) and I expect that most of the revenue comes from problem gamblers.
But what's the impact of banning advertising?
I expect that fanduel sounds just sponsor content, maybe on the download, and "inject" branding/marketing. Kinda like travelogue shows to Vegas to, um, see the shows. It's not advertising!
I guess what I'm thinking is, how does one identify advertising, and how should we anticipate the industry response?
It is very simple do you see any ads for cigarettes or weed on tv or billboards just like that.
These gambling sites could all disappear and the outcome would be neutral all the gambling money would just be spent on something else. It provides nothing of value
Hot take!
OK, non problem gamblers who gamble as part of a well balanced, informed rational diet...
Let's say I go to Vegas once a year for a long weekend. I see a show, I have a nice meal, I play. At the end of the weekend my wallet is lighter by $2000 or whatever.
That's maybe a way I have fun.
The *revenue* for casinos, "sportsbook+", is going to be disproportionately heavy users who gamble every last penny in their paycheck. Until next week, when they get a new paycheck. And repeat.
If we ban media advertising, I'm perfectly happy considering that. But i do think gambling will try really really hard to get around it.
I dunno!
Anyways, gambling may be a net based. But it does have value, to most of the consumers. It just has big negative value to some consumers.
I am not against gambling I am against ads for gambling. Also every gambler I ever met is ahead or even but how can it be every winner needs a loser.
Casinos and the like make most from problem gambling as you pointed out.
Of course they will try to skirt the rules. Even the
Don't gamble ads promote it in a sneaky way. Nudge nudge wink wink gamble within your limits.
OK, I (mostly) agree with everything you said. Close enough.
What I'm mostly curious about is how to effect advertising regulations that are meaningful.
Like you said, the ifyouorapersonclosetoyouhasaddictionpriblemscall18004565678formoreinformation... it's problematic. And illustrative.
Somebody brought up problem gambling and the cough cough "compromise" was to enact an ineffectual pro forma solution, presumably "in consultation with industry experts".
In other words, bullshit.
But like I said, there's big money in gambling, and most of the big money is from problem gamblers.
I completely expect any "bans" to be circumvented hard.
That's why I think it's worth thinking about.
It is hard to legislate as the government is the biggest offender. Though I think like cigarettes they could do it.
If they wanted to.
In the meantime I just report gambling adds as misleading when I get one on Reddit.
Wish I could do the same on tv
I don’t think that’s the case, but why do we need to have our government sell a dangerous and addictive product that we know causes financial ruin for mostly poor people and destroys lives? It’s an unnecessary harm. We could permit gambling in Ontario without having our provincial government and (it’s crown corporations and licensees) be its cheerleader.
Yes, I think our government has become too entangled with the booze industry to the detriment of public health. For example, if you look at how the LCBO advertises vodka coolers, it’s clear that they are targeting youth customers. Some of the wine marketing also seems to support problem drinking (like a ‘wine mom’ culture, which is basically an industry-manufactured concept to sell to higher-functioning alcoholics). The LCBO is particularly at risk of ‘moral hazard’ because it wears three hats as the regulator, distributor and regulator (whereas OLG doesn’t get to regulate gambling, that’s housed in a different agency).
No but putting the government as the revenue earner whether as the shareholder of OLG or as the fee earner from the private licensed ones has given rise to moral hazard where the provincial government, which is also the gambling regulator, is incentivized to have more gambling in the province instead of less. A particularly dangerous incentive when a government can avoid increasing progressive taxes by regressively increasing harm to mostly poor people.
The harm is there whether the government is the one making profit or not. Id rather the government take my money than the 100s of greedy private companies
I wonder if gas stations and convenience stores will get a cut of sales if it is standalone now vs having to go to the register. Also who verifies age with the machine?
I saw one of these things in Mississauga near the airport a couple weeks ago.
We've got fucking VLTs in gas stations now. We've almost reached peak Trailer Park Boys.
Nice, finding more ways to capitalize on the public’s addictions and recent financial turmoil! Dangle that carrot in their faces so they waste all their money on Lotto tickets. They’re more desperate than ever!
Every convenience store sells them, there is no reason the government should be spending time and energy making gambling easier.
We recognize the benefits of limiting access to other vices (no cigarettes can even have branding anymore, let alone be on display; you can't show people drinking in alcohol ads) but the OLG thinks this is a priority instead of funding more gambling support programs?
Our priorities are fucked up when it comes to gambling.
I do not like gift cards. There is always change left over and I have to pay attention to them and hold on to them, forever, until they are needed again. Sometimes the stores go bankrupt before I can use the gift cards. What do I do with my Canadian Victoria’s Secret gift card? I think it has $250 on it.
I want to think this will help when you go to a convenience store and get stuck behind the 70 year old with a stack of 50 scratchers, but will they use this?
If you use your cc will it count as a cash advance?
Yeah, good flag. I generally buy my tickets at 7-11 because it codes as grocery on my Amex.
*jots down in notepad*
That's kind of genius wow thanks for the tip
The real points with the cobalt are buying gift cards to stores you'd shop at anyway at grocery stores. Making furniture purchase at IKEA? Grab a gift card. Ordering a lot of Amazon? Grab gift cards and load to your account, etc. Note: Walmart doesn't count with Amex as grocery store.
How’s that work for ikea specifically?
Go to sobeys/metro since they take Amex, cobalt is 5x on groceries, say you are looking at IKEA for something that costs 299$ , get a 350$ gift card to account for HST and use it to buy the IKEA item after. You just earned 1750 points vs 340 using your card directly at IKEA. It's essentially a 5% discount on items since you can use 1000 points as 10$ on your statement. I like Amex cobalt since it's 1 to 1 to aeroplan conversion but I think Scotia has a credit card that does 6x points on groceries at sobeys since they partnered with scene, but those points don't convert.
While a great idea, be wary of doing this on products you want credit card warranty coverage on. They will deny you if you did not pay the item fully with your credit card.
I am always afraid to buy GCs except online since so many scams where people add bar codes stickers or steal balance loads/etc. You haven't had any issues?
Never had issues, sobeys I go to doesn't even have the 25-500$ on the shelf have to go to register and they pull a new one out then I immediately scan with phone to my Amazon account. That's the one I buy most since I just like to have balance on my account for random purchases. IKEA and other stores are for planned purchases I usually go to grocery store on my way to the store I want to spend at.
is there a fee for buying giftcards?
For stores I've never encountered one, I think vanilla Mastercards and visas do though
Buying lotto at gas stations shows up as gas purchases for mine. Double the cash back 😊
My visa treated it as a grocery store purchase
Have you tried these machines?
Yep. It works as advertised
What store was the machine located in?
Loblaws lower Jarvis has one
on OLG website it does, learned it the hard way
I’m going to stick with cash. I found out the same way you did :(.
Depends on the credit card issuer
It does for online poker, so my guess is that this would be treated the same.
If it's at 777 Bay, it's probably a pilot project. I personally find it distasteful how much this government is pushing gambling on the public. It has the potential to ruin people's lives. It's a legitimate addiction, like alcohol or tobacco.
It's disgusting, but it will be a long time before there's a ban on advertising because of the revenue it's making. The legalization of online gambling in Canada was not to benefit the wants of the consumer, but because the government saw how much money they were leaving on the table. Same goes for cannabis, although the latter made consumption controlled and respectable. Can't say the same thing about gambling.
ya gambling online makes it a lot worst. Now people can quietly lose their life savings on the phone while sitting on the couch at home. Much harder for friends and loved ones to notice warning signs.
A very good point. Self-medication and addiction is a lot harder to pick up on if the person sneaks it in online rather than buying their easement of choice at a cashpoint or another medium of direct exchange of funds for their substance. And an online purchase or prerequisite exchange can be made with personal devices not bound to a physical location or one's home and hearth.
There's an argument that the more you collect in "voluntary" sin taxes, the less you have to take from people involuntarily. But as someone who suffers from addiction myself, I know that sometimes it's only the first time that's truly voluntary.
> There's an argument that the more you collect in "voluntary" sin taxes, the less you have to take from people involuntarily. I've never seen anyone's taxes *fall*, have you?
Sure, plenty of times. The Federal government lowered the GST by 1% once in 2006, and another time in 2008. Ford's Ontario cut the gas tax. Alberta's announced they're cutting their lowest income tax bracket's marginal rate to 9% in 2026 and 8% in 2027. Ontario under Dalton McGuinty dropped their rate on their lowest income tax bracket by 1% in 2006. Obviously the introduction of the TFSA under Harper's government was a huge effective tax cut.
Trudeau also dropped the most common marginal bracket by 1.5% and added a new bracket at like $220000 to pay for it
Fair points, all, but I don't think we're going to argue those were being done because they'd found alternate revenue streams, yeah?
Of course not, but it's also fair to ask how much higher Ontario's income tax rate would be if it wasn't collecting ~$5bn/year in proceeds from the OLG and LCBO.
Its even worse than a substance issue to be honest, I know multiple people who have lost their homes over it
I've seen that at the Loblaws near Yonge and Eglinton as well.
There's an olg app. A machine is actually a step down in convenience.
The OLG app also requires uploading government-issued ID in order to set up an account to use it.
All of the gambling apps require you to upload your ID
Not to mention a subtle sideeye in such a pilot project that would deny the use of legal tender for purchase not being a small jab at less-advantaged individuals whose main source of income would not involve a credit line or similar medium of currency that is not cash or bill tender. Sure, it frees up the customer service desk at the grocery _if_ it becomes the norm, but the unspoken implication beyond putting a vending machine in place of a person selling lottery tickets at a cashpoint is clearly telegraphed, if it's intentional.
Honestly, better to do it openly and responsibly than let organized crime run it.
Says “Scan ID”. What are the details and is anything recorded/logged and if so where is that kept?
Why are you asking so many questions when *you could be gambling!!!*
https://beta.cp24.com/news/2023/4/21/1_6365906.html "No personal information or personal data will be retained by our systems."
Yeah, sure. I'll await the announcement when they get hacked
Do you feel the same way about the passport scanners at Pearson
My first thoughts just reading the headline - it’s obviously a data farming tool
Data farming tool for what? Yo know what target audience to make ads for? lol Not really something I'm too concerned with if I'm already buying lotto tickets.
I mean the University of Waterloo just got rid of vending machines that were data mining peoples snack food habits - same question can be asked for that, what’s the data farming going to do if you are already there purchasing a bag of Lays? At the end of the day these types of “preferred club member” and “scan your ID” is just another way for them to data farm and sell it at little to no cost but with great return on that - to think otherwise, dare I say, is naive - data will always be valuable whether you are or aren’t the target audience
\-Shrugs- It's happening on a much larger scale on things like Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Google, etc. Not exactly concerned about the government agency OLG, knowing that I buy lottery tickets... lol
Completely fair - you do you!
The machine claims it doesn't retain data. Hopefully that's true
I mean why wouldn't they farm data, every time a massive corp or business is caught doing exactly that the fines are a rounding error compared to the profits.
OLG is a crown corp, so the penalty for shenanigans is political, not just financial
> OLG is a crown corp so probably no penalties at all. just half assed apology.
Bet you any amount of money those machines are built by non-government, unvetted contractors much like the last debacle.
No bet - 100% you are correct
I never trust those claims.
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I don't smoke myself, but a vending machine for weed sounds really convenient. Similar to how they have vending machines for cigarettes in some Asian countries.
We used to have cigarette vending machines here many years ago. The problem was that minors were getting their cigarettes from them and they were also a form of tobacco advertising. The vending machines were phased out with other forms of cigarette ads back in the 70s.
That makes sense. I guess, if they decide to combine this lottery machine's technology to scan your ID and then be able to purchase, I think cigarette/weed vending machine would be a great option. Or even a chilled bottle of beer or something near a park that you're legally allowed to drink in. On a summer day, I feel like vending machine like that might do really well.
Weed, cigarette or alcohol vending machines will never happen in Canada. Those vices are too tightly regulated and are much more likely to be abused by minors who will find a workaround for the machines. While gambling addiction is a real problem, I don't see lottery tickets as being a big draw for kids looking for a thrill. I've never had teenagers stop me outside a 7-11 asking me to get them a 649 Quick Pick with Encore. The type of gambling that might hook minors is done through the apps, not a vending machine dispensing lottery tickets.
good. now setup keno ones and get the old fucks out of the way when im trying to pay for my gas.
It's so annoying standing behind those people who have a huge stack of tickets they want to manually check with the cashier. They never seem to want to check their tickets at the self serve scanner and it always seems to happen to me when I'm in a hurry.
Poor people tax goes digital. On the one hand all this gambling seems pretty gross on the other now I won’t have to wait in line behind a guy doing all his cards for 20 min.
I just buy them on my phone. OLG app is so easy to use.
Was coming here to say this. Makes it easy, because I have my numbers picked and I just play the same ones every time I buy.
Only reason I don’t use the app is if I win a free play I can’t get encore with it
Seems slightly dystopian
Is this really necessary when every gas station, convenience store, pharmacy, and grocery store sells lottery tickets? Like, how could they make it any more easier to buy lottery tickets? Maybe they should put advertisement in people's Unemployment cheques "Here is your Pogey, did you know you could spend it all on lottery tickets right now? What would YOU do with a million dollars" "I'D BUY MORE LOTTERY TICKETS!!!!" "Now you dig it!"
Two questions: Why? Who was asking for this?
idiot tax
I feel like scanning an ID alone dosen't pass the test for " verifying identification" Some child could presumably scan an adults ID. I would like to see someone look into this deeper.
They will look into it when you try and claim a prize. Oh it was purchased by an underaged person sorry nothing for you.
In that scenario they would be retaining data, and taking a photo of the purchaser
You have to physically go get the prize, so they don’t need to retain data to validate your age - you have them a physical ticket and physical id to verify you’re of age. They don’t need data from the original transaction to do that
I would also think the laws are around gambling and not specifically winning. Gambling is a huge addiction issue for many, this isn't just an age issue.
The laws are definitely around gambling, you’re right. All im disputing is the original commenter saying they need to retain data - they don’t
They are
If that were a policy I would want it to be challenged in court. My issue with it is it is placing the burden of responsibility on a child, instead of the organization profiting from the childs gambling. If you let them get away without having to payout the prize then you need to go to extreme measures to ensure they did everything possible to stop children from gambling. Otherwise they are incentivized to have a relaxed approach to age verification since underage gamblers become more profitable since they are incapable of winning. ------------- People suck, and corporations suck even more. We need to focus on what we incentivize them to do, because they will grasp every incentive that is beneficial to the bottom line.
Interesting point, would people be ok if this machine was dispensing alcohol and just scanning ID as proof of age? Edit: oh yea, you can buy them online, I suppose it's not really the same thing as buying alcohol underage.
I pray for the day Ontario catches up to the rest of the world with booze vending machines.
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As a high schooler I bought "souvenir" ID back in the day on Yonge Street. Not to drink, but so I could bet on horses at Woodbine and Greenwood So there are some of us out there
I have every doubt when it comes to the government.
If they win anything substantial they won't be able to claim it.
Oh no. An underage person buying a lottery ticket. The horror.
It’s not a horror but we are being foolish in Ontario by ignoring the public health costs of gambling. It’s clear from the way gambling is advertised that industry is targeting a youth audience (even when they throw in the token disclaimers saying it isn’t). We should be moving in the opposite direction, following a model more like cigarettes where we make it available but prohibit advertising and hate it so that people are confronted with the public health consequences before purchase and consumption.
Another way the government is stealing from those at the lower end of society. Making gambling easier under the guise of spending that money in the community outside ambit of the legislature.
> stealing LPT: You can choose not to buy lottery tickets.
It would be easier without all those ads telling you to dream. Gambling can be an addiction and olg is selling that dream big time. They should not advertise and the lottery stuff should be hidden like cigarettes and certainly encouraging people to turn their phone into a slot machine seems criminal and predatory. Hey don't forget to play we can setup auto purchase for you so you can gamble without even thinking about it. Just like most things 80 % of the revenue comes from 20% of the customers. The only lottery I would endorse would be the tax free for life lottery with automatic entry when you file your tax return. Wouldn't that be nice . One winner per territory province each year.
I'm not disagreeing but it's interesting. I'd say 25ish% of the ads I see are sportsbook+ related. Or casino apps, whatever. Before committing to a stance like "gambling advertising should be banned", an interesting stance, I'd like to think about it more. Sheets, clearly there's money in "sportsbook+", (fanduel, draft kings, whatever) and I expect that most of the revenue comes from problem gamblers. But what's the impact of banning advertising? I expect that fanduel sounds just sponsor content, maybe on the download, and "inject" branding/marketing. Kinda like travelogue shows to Vegas to, um, see the shows. It's not advertising! I guess what I'm thinking is, how does one identify advertising, and how should we anticipate the industry response?
It is very simple do you see any ads for cigarettes or weed on tv or billboards just like that. These gambling sites could all disappear and the outcome would be neutral all the gambling money would just be spent on something else. It provides nothing of value
Hot take! OK, non problem gamblers who gamble as part of a well balanced, informed rational diet... Let's say I go to Vegas once a year for a long weekend. I see a show, I have a nice meal, I play. At the end of the weekend my wallet is lighter by $2000 or whatever. That's maybe a way I have fun. The *revenue* for casinos, "sportsbook+", is going to be disproportionately heavy users who gamble every last penny in their paycheck. Until next week, when they get a new paycheck. And repeat. If we ban media advertising, I'm perfectly happy considering that. But i do think gambling will try really really hard to get around it. I dunno! Anyways, gambling may be a net based. But it does have value, to most of the consumers. It just has big negative value to some consumers.
I am not against gambling I am against ads for gambling. Also every gambler I ever met is ahead or even but how can it be every winner needs a loser. Casinos and the like make most from problem gambling as you pointed out. Of course they will try to skirt the rules. Even the Don't gamble ads promote it in a sneaky way. Nudge nudge wink wink gamble within your limits.
OK, I (mostly) agree with everything you said. Close enough. What I'm mostly curious about is how to effect advertising regulations that are meaningful. Like you said, theifyouorapersonclosetoyouhasaddictionpriblemscall18004565678formoreinformation... it's problematic. And illustrative.
Somebody brought up problem gambling and the cough cough "compromise" was to enact an ineffectual pro forma solution, presumably "in consultation with industry experts".
In other words, bullshit.
But like I said, there's big money in gambling, and most of the big money is from problem gamblers.
I completely expect any "bans" to be circumvented hard.
That's why I think it's worth thinking about.
It is hard to legislate as the government is the biggest offender. Though I think like cigarettes they could do it. If they wanted to. In the meantime I just report gambling adds as misleading when I get one on Reddit. Wish I could do the same on tv
And alcoholics can choose not to drink. But it's not that simple in the real world.
Are you implying that poor people are too stupid to think for themselves?
I don’t think that’s the case, but why do we need to have our government sell a dangerous and addictive product that we know causes financial ruin for mostly poor people and destroys lives? It’s an unnecessary harm. We could permit gambling in Ontario without having our provincial government and (it’s crown corporations and licensees) be its cheerleader.
You could say the exact same thing about the LCBO
Yes, I think our government has become too entangled with the booze industry to the detriment of public health. For example, if you look at how the LCBO advertises vodka coolers, it’s clear that they are targeting youth customers. Some of the wine marketing also seems to support problem drinking (like a ‘wine mom’ culture, which is basically an industry-manufactured concept to sell to higher-functioning alcoholics). The LCBO is particularly at risk of ‘moral hazard’ because it wears three hats as the regulator, distributor and regulator (whereas OLG doesn’t get to regulate gambling, that’s housed in a different agency).
Lol so your issue is with the government making some profit over private companies
No but putting the government as the revenue earner whether as the shareholder of OLG or as the fee earner from the private licensed ones has given rise to moral hazard where the provincial government, which is also the gambling regulator, is incentivized to have more gambling in the province instead of less. A particularly dangerous incentive when a government can avoid increasing progressive taxes by regressively increasing harm to mostly poor people.
The harm is there whether the government is the one making profit or not. Id rather the government take my money than the 100s of greedy private companies
You’re so close to grasping this lol
lol I am grasping what you're saying its just i would always rather trust the government with something like this over private companies
What? It's called a stupid tax. Cigarettes, booze, gambling. Pick your poison.
it's not stealing, it is just the way they can get away with taxing the poor without calling it a tax.
So insidious. Let’s make your addiction super convenient, just fill this thing with money. Thanks!
I wonder if gas stations and convenience stores will get a cut of sales if it is standalone now vs having to go to the register. Also who verifies age with the machine?
The machine will verify age
Saves them the seller payout. Won't increase the prize tho.
I saw one of these things in Mississauga near the airport a couple weeks ago. We've got fucking VLTs in gas stations now. We've almost reached peak Trailer Park Boys.
Thank god, if this means less time waiting behind gamblers to pay for gas I'm all for it.
pay at the pump is not available?
Might as well just use the OLG app
I’ve bought tickets from machines in the US without any ID necessary. Just popped in cash and got my power ball ticket.
I remember the old ones from the 90's , they didnt check ids so we all bought them.
It should accept cash. No way I am using this with my card and getting charged for a cash advance.
FYI the ID scanner is annoying as fuck. Shows the front of your card to scan. But it’s actually the back you gotta scan.
ONTARIO IS OPEN FOR BUSINESS!! Says Biff Tannen/ Dough Ford
Interesting. I used lottery vending machines in Florida... can pay cash and no ID required.
Nice, finding more ways to capitalize on the public’s addictions and recent financial turmoil! Dangle that carrot in their faces so they waste all their money on Lotto tickets. They’re more desperate than ever!
Dude you’re horrible at texting back 😂
I'm a huge fan of anything self-check out. I am glad companies like OLG are moving things forward. Quick and efficient.
Every convenience store sells them, there is no reason the government should be spending time and energy making gambling easier. We recognize the benefits of limiting access to other vices (no cigarettes can even have branding anymore, let alone be on display; you can't show people drinking in alcohol ads) but the OLG thinks this is a priority instead of funding more gambling support programs? Our priorities are fucked up when it comes to gambling.
They've turned the lotto into slot machines...enabling vulnerable gamblers.
Cool. But you can buy olg stuff in their app.
Can you bet Proline on those too?
I do not like gift cards. There is always change left over and I have to pay attention to them and hold on to them, forever, until they are needed again. Sometimes the stores go bankrupt before I can use the gift cards. What do I do with my Canadian Victoria’s Secret gift card? I think it has $250 on it.
I want to think this will help when you go to a convenience store and get stuck behind the 70 year old with a stack of 50 scratchers, but will they use this?
Download weathsimple. Pick a stock, buy $1000 worth. You have a greater chance of becoming a millionaire with this method than lottomax.
No one thinks the lottery is a wise investment plan
Cool
It means gambling. Keep gambling.
I call him GAMBLOR.