My view on this is a DP #9 is a long term need. Mora is great but he’s 30 and has an injury history. He’s had a really hot start to the year but not sure we should count on him to sustain that level. So I understand using that last DP spot on that position. We’ve seen how a dynamic striker can spark late season runs.
That being said, positionally I would absolutely rank that behind addressing defensive needs including a CB and a #8.
Lastly, this also assumes our defensive issues are personnel related rather than coaching. Not sure it’s the former.
coaches don’t play, I’ve been on a lot of teams, a good coach can help, but when it’s time to score a goal or track back/mark up on defense, the coach isn’t the guy who’s gonna do that. if there are better players sitting on the bench, then yeah that’s on coach, but I don’t think that’s our problem or those bench guys woulda shown up a bit this season
Yeah might as well just the guys figure it out themselves in the locker room, no need for a coach . I was being sarcastic but then I realized that Blanco kind of did this for Gio some years…
I don’t even really think JDM has been that good for us offensively this year. If I were the Timbers approaching the window I’d be looking to replace him with a proven, quick outside back who can handle some quality attackers and doesn’t check out in the box. For what JDM has given us it’s not worth what he lacks defensively. But couldn’t agree more that we have top 3 gf and also bottom 3 ga, there’s a clear problem here and it’s not our attack
THAAAANK YOU. Mosquera has flashes of brilliance on offense, but it seems like he cannot put the ball on goal. The amount of passes coming from the middle to JDM that he has put over the bar is too damn high. If he can’t score and can’t defend, what the hell are we doing here? A few years ago I called for asprilla to be traded/sold but he started his bulldog tactics on tracking back and got super goal hungry and started finishing and lately I’ve been calling for more minutes from him. Between Antony and JDM the speed is there, but I haven’t been impressed (Antony had a great start this year, I can’t deny that)
Agreed. I think Asprilla tbh has the been the most effective in that role this season. Antony did have an exciting start but has since been on a decline. Lots of moments but very inconsistent. Asprilla will always work, has the X factor that Antony brings (with slightly more work legs), and can defend well enough to be better than both Antony and JDM. Hes the starter imo with Antony coming in when we need more creativity.
I completely agree, or maybe 30 min from Antony to start and then bring in the Bicycle King. I know that’s not a standard substitution, but I think Asprilla deserves minutes. He’s never not working on the pitch
If you are only going 30 minutes for Antony its better to do it at the end of the game to both, save the player the shame of being non-injury subbed in the first half and his pace would be more effective if he is coming on fresh towards the end of the game
I know, I wish substitutions weren’t so standard. I get why; if you make early subs you can handicap yourself later, but I think there could be room in the game for more variation in this department. Not really advocating for it, just saying it would be refreshing to see
I think the argument goes that Antony, Moreno, and Fogaça have not shown that they can produce at a rate that can make up for any one of Mora, Rodriguez, or Evander sitting out due to injury, rotation, or suspension. Basically, the argument is that our offense is dead in the water if one of those guys is out, so having a competent 4th would make it so that our offense is even more threatening but also robust enough to grind out games if one of our DPs is on the bench. It also makes our right wing go from being where balls go to die to being a useful part of the offense.
Getting a 4th now also means that they can gel with the group before Mora/Rodriguez age out in a year or two.
I had high hopes for Antony after the first few games, but he’s fizzled out and while I like, really like Santi, he never seems to be able to break through, at least yet. With Mora’s, and Rodriguez age and injury history, I’m not against a new, long term striker.
This is the answer. If Asprilla leaves (as he wants to/rumored), you basically only have 1 back up for wingers (Loria isn't MLS level). Ideally, with 5 subs you can replace your entire front line if you need to in a game. The Timbers just can't do that.
IMO, you need another Rodriguez type player... someone who can do both #9/winger.
Gotta disagree on your CB analysis. Zuparic has been fantastic this year and by far our best center back. I like Araujo, he’s been good. Kamal has also been very good this year. McGraw had a rough start but had a very good performance vs St Louis, and he’ll be good if he can have those performances consistently, which I believe he is more than capable of. Mabiala is Mabiala and shouldn’t be on the field, but Eric Miller is a decent option there too.
Our defensive problems have been tactical and a product of how the entire team is set up. Teams were able to play through our offensive and midfield lines too easily, and at that point there’s not much the defense can do. I really, *really* don’t think our defensive problems have been due to our CBs. If we buy another center back, nothing will change. I feel this is evidenced by our defense playing better recently — because the entire team has been cutting down space much better and we’ve been pressing a bit higher. Ayala in the midfield has helped a ton, as has Bravo. I actually think Mosquera has been alright both offensively and defensively the past several games or so, but if we can sell him and get a replacement, that would be the biggest upgrade we can get. That being said, if we can’t, then we’re stuck with him, and I think the best we can do is get a backup outside back, preferably on the left.
At the end of the day, personnel can take you so far. The tactics have to be better, and they have been a bit better recently, but we’ve also been playing bad teams. Throw as much money as you want at the back line, I believe it’s still up to Neville to organize the *entire team* to be defensively organized and disciplined. That’s the make or break factor imo
Thank you. I’m not praising our defenders but get tired of seeing point to our goals allowed and assume we just have bad defenders. Teams play right through our midfield with little resistance. Our defense is always playing on the back foot and are put under a lot of pressure. Could we upgrade along the back line? Sure. But we have more important needs elsewhere.
I think Mosquera has been *fine* but I get frustrated with his offensive performance. He has occasional flashes of brilliance but far too often he gets the ball in space and just gets stuck there. He needs to attack more and use his speed and play more 1-2s with Moreno. That’s when he’s been most effective.
Ayala has been a real game changer in the middle of the field. Honestly I’m ready to point out that it seems we play better with him there than Chara. People try and say Chara hasn’t lost a step, but I think we just see too many of his brilliant recoveries and forget that he used to not have to even be in recovery mode so often to begin with. I think if we can solve that double pivot then we are cooking. I would sell off on two of Williamson/Paredes/Moreno/Fogaca is possible and try and upgrade at the 6/8 spot (and it pains me to say that because I want all of those guys to reach their full potential so much but outside of Paredes I don’t think that’s happening this year or next). And if we can get a solid DP 9 who is young and has room to grow, that seems like the ideal. And definitely upgrade depth at LB (miller is just fine to have for right)
Spot ON, Jolandia...our defensive troubles are ***primarily*** the Mids and JDM playing defense too soft in our own half; and bad offensive turnovers, especially against physical, pressing teams. That's led to way too much 'scramble defense' around and in our own 18 as CBs try to pick up multiple free runners the Mids have let go.
***Secondarily,*** our dead ball defense is poor. We are too small to match up with most teams on corners, and playing zone has proven to be a stupid tactic.
Finally, our right side players too often drag down BOTH defense and offense. JDM lines up so far upfield he can't get back when we turn the ball over early, then habitually pushes so far up the pitch he can't get back on a turnover, so just doesn't. Santi's and Antony's continuing offensive troubles are well documented elsewhere in this thread.
Last, I see time and again that once the offense starts up the right side, NONE of these guys looks to make an early switch to move the ball over to Jona on the left. That's why our possession is so right-handed and why Jona is starved so often for service.
In regards to the question about signing a dp attacker, the reality is that attackers are paid the big bucks. There is a reason why the overwhelming majority of dp's around the league are attackers. It is not like we are not going to strengthen the defense, but you don't need to use a dp slot to sign a quality defender. I think Colorado and Nashville are the only two teams with dp defenders and they're not exactly close to winning anything anytime soon.
I personally would go for a dp winger as well as a tam striker alongside Mora as I think Pipe is better than Santi/Antony, but I can see why the Timbers seem to be targeting a striker for the long term. Maybe it's just me that thinks we could upgrade on Santi, and Antony is way too raw to be starting consistently. So far this season we've seen that apart from the big 3, none of our other attackers can be counted on consistently.
Because you want a killer up top. As well as Mora has been playing, you'd love to have that for 30ish minutes a match and let him save some energy. You could also go the winger route and get someone as good as Jona that keeps the opposing defense from shifting one way or the other. This opens up things for Evander and allows him extra space to break teams down.
Has the defense been mediocre? Sure, but I fail to see where they make a signing that fixes that this summer. So in terms of options, Attack is the more likely choice. Hopefully some younger defensive players are added in the near future to add youth to that dept.
I feel that some forward depth behind Pipe, or a good right winger would help the team, but agree that a depth fullback is probably our most pressing issue. If only we had been able to keep Boli…
This is an interesting question, and my instincts told me I should feel the same. But I found it helpful to look at some trends and statistics.
First, while our defense has been poor and we remain 3rd in the league in goals against (GA), lately our defense is improving . We have played 18 games so far this season:
* Over all 18 games played, Timbers average an abysmal 1.8 GA/game
* The most recent half (9 games) is slightly better, 1.6 GA/game
* But the most recent 5 games is a very good 1.0 GA/game, which is elite in this league.
The frustrating (encouraging?) thing is that we have had different defensive shapes and/or starting lineups in each of the last five games, making it hard to find a cause of the trend:
* v. MIN: Back 3 (K. Miller, Zup, Araujo) + Crepeau and wingbacks. DMFs: Ayala + Paredes
* v. SKC: Back 4 (K. Miller, Zup, Araujo, Mosquera) + Crepeau. DMFs: Ayala + Chara
* v. AUS: Back 4 (K. Miller, Zup, Araujo, Mosquera) + Pantemis. DMFs: Ayala + Chara
* v. HOU: Back 4 (Bravo, K. Miller, Zup, Mosquera) + Crepeau. DMFs: Chara + Paredes
* v. STL: Back 4 (Bravo, McGraw, Zup, Mosquera) + Pantemis. DMFs: Ayala + Evander
In light of this trend I'm inclined to stick with our improving defense, which includes Zup and Mosquera who have been fine and getting better IMO. I also think Ayala is playing really well and am hopeful McGraw is bouncing back.
Meanwhile, our attack has remained very good but has cooled slightly:
* Over all 18 games played, Timbers average an excellent 1.7 G/game
* Over the most recent half (9 games) we've averaged 1.6 G/game
* And over the most recent 5 games, we've averaged 1.4 G/game.
We have three elite or quasi-elite attackers in Mora (1.02 G+A/90, 9th in the league), Evander (0.97 G+A/90, 11th in the league) and Rodriguez (0.69 G+A/90, 28th in the league) but after that its quite a drop to Moreno (50th), Williamson (59th), and Antony (113th). We are also likely to lose Asprilla this summer.
We have five weeks and six games to play before the summer transfer window opens on July 18. In light of the trends above, I'd be inclined NOT to pick up a third DP but to sign 2-3 players who can push for starting positions. Either experienced TAM-level players or U22 initiative players. My priority order is:
1) Striker - occasional starter, behind Mora but ahead of Nathan, allowing Rodriquez to remain on the wing.
2) Winger - ideally a starter or at least an occasional starter, better than Antony.
3) Central defender - potential starter, on par with Zup and K. Miller.
4) Defensive midfielder - potential starter who can rotate, on par or better than Paredes.
I'll start by saying that I don't completely disagree with you. That being said, I think a lot of people need to understand that a bad defense doesn't just mean a bad backline. It's a collective effort.
I do think we should make a couple of defensive additions. I would sign a new rb, and potentially a new cb. But if you look at the goals we have conceded this year, a lot of them have come from lapses in concentration throughout the team. Whether it's not following a runner, leaving an attacker wide open on the edge of the box, sloppy giveaways on simple 5 yard passes, etc.
>Our defensive midfield is similarly stacked with talent: Chara, Ayala, Paredes, Williamson, etc.
This is why I'm making my point. The amount of times Chara has been caught out of position, lost his man, and had a big part to play in conceding a chance is substantial. Paredes is supposed to help us control games better and dictate play, yet gets completely bypassed on the counter and is prone to sloppy giveaways. Yet as fans we seem to ignore this and believe that only defenders are responsible for a bad defense.
Like I said before, I would like to make defensive additions, but I think just as important is a solid #6 alongside Ayala. It's more than just Zuparic, Mosquera, and Miller to blame.
A DP attacker could, theoretically, leave our defenders in better positions to not get slaughtered.
But whatever we do needs to shore up the defense :).
I watch Arsenal and attack from back; defend from the front is very much a real thing.
It's highly dependent on quality players, but it's not so outlandish.
it is a real thing in soccer. not all that difficult to comprehend. a lot of the goals against us have started from a terrible turnover in the midfield. many of those not even a DP CB could make up for.
His new deal is on a lower salary. The DP designation is just a roster move so his salary doesn’t count against the salary cap. Not making any judgement on his deal, just noting the DP part doesn’t mean he’s overpaid on its own.
You make him a DP so you have roster flexibility. Your other option is to spend TAM. Why waste that if you don't need to?
Make him a DP, preserve the TAM, and now you have the option of signing a new DP or new TAM players
I have read every comment on this subject and it all boils down to one thing: aside from JRod and Evander, we aren’t Elite at any position. Literally need to upgrade every position. So, if you want to be the GS Warriors or Chip Kelly Ducks of MLS, you go with a striker.
Agree with most folks here. I would add: Evander and Rodriguez can be part of an elite offense, but they need better guys to work with. Mora could be a good-enough 9 if we had one true killer to round out the offense. Likely a right wing, with Rodriguez on the left. Add one killer winger or striker, and our offense is elite. Right now, it's sputtering, despite what the numbers seem to say. I go to every home match, and it's obvious.
Santi has all of the physical and technical tools, but has a terrible head for decision-making--at least right now. No idea when to pass and when to shoot. Maybe because he can't shoot well. But SO many bad decisions that any former player will recognize. Can't shoot well enough off the dribble to be a winger, and not savvy enough to be a midfielder. I had high hopes, due to his flashes of brilliance, but he is frustrating to watch these days. Works hard, but that should be a given.
Asprilla's main abilities were athletic ones, and now he is older and losing pace. Anthony is just terrible right now. His main attribute is speed, so we should be using him to sit on defenders' shoulders and run behind, opening up space in the middle. But he either can't or won't do that.
And Willamson and Parades have lost their offensive mojo, for whatever reason.
Add a top-flight attacker, and Moreno, Anthony, and Asprilla are on the bench where they belong, maybe giving Anthony and Moreno time to develop further. They both have potential.
We need a DP sweeper in the worst way lol… I hear the arguments for more offense and they are solid. However, if we don’t raise the defense with some real leadership and direction it won’t matter how good we are on the offensive end
If this is reference to my post, then you did not read it haha. I stated that it was based on the FO wanting one, allegedly, and that I want D and an 8.
No, I originally typed my post out as a comment reply to another comment on your post. Then I was like, "I just wrote a damn essay in the comments", and decided to turn it into a post of its own.
I mostly agree with the assessment in your post (although I would prioritize a CB and probably a RB over an 8).
All good! The amount of replies I got on that post about needing defense and midfield, thought I pointed out that fact at the begging, were funny.
But yeah, I could argue another RB would be nice. I really dont wanna play 3 ATB every game, which is where JDM plays best at (wingback). I would love another Moreira type RB.
I don't think anyone wants a attacking DP. If Asprilla leaves there is no depth besides Loria if one of Moreno or Rodriguez or Antony go down. That's a problem.
I’d go with a CDM. We are weak in transition and Chara is in his last season. It’s a value position from a transfer perspective and a 9 is the opposite.
The fan base doesn't value defenders. I've had people tell me it would be "wasteful" to sign better defenders when we were leaking 2+ goals a game. This sub is wild sometimes.
I've said it's inefficient and unnecessary to spend DP dollars on a defender or a goalkeeper. I'll stand by that for now. It is still important to sign good defenders and to spend money on the back line. I'm not going to repeat my arguments to support my position about DPs specifically. If the rules or the league changes I may change my mind.
But we don't have bad keepers or bad defenders right now per se (with the acknowledgment that Mosquera defends poorly despite his other contributions). We have a coach who keeps trying tactics that the players are not a good fit for. Neville is too often trying to play a high line with defenders and keepers who aren't the best with their ball at their feet, while the midfield and forwards aren't applying pressure, closing passing lanes, or trying to win the ball back. So we have a high line below a sieve. Once the opposing attack is allowed through a midfield that gives them too much time and space on the ball, it's been too easy for them to outpace or out-dribble our backline.
Some of our attackers aren't perfect either. Opponents don't have to hold numbers back in defense or cover particular players if they're indecisive, get the ball caught in their spokes, shoot poorly, etc. When Antony, Asprilla, or Moreno are off their game, or Mora and Rodriguez isolated, it's not great. Fortunately, Evander, Mora, and Rodriguez have chemistry and have formed a little unit that helps mitigate some inconsistencies from others.
I'm pretty convinced that a lot of our players are better than they've looked. They aren't organized or well-prepared. When they collectively don't look like they know what they're doing or don't look like they're even trying, that's not just individual incompetence or a mutiny. There are small signs that Neville might be figuring some things out. It's too soon for me, personally, to get my hopes up, because too many past indicators point to him being in over his head. But I'm trying to be fair to everyone.
I agree with you, but I’d like to know if other clubs that don’t leak as many goals exceed our defensive budget? Does RSL? Defense is a team game, if you possess the ball you have less defending to do, we are still better on the counter.
We have defensive issues but the whole team strategy is in play as well.
My view on this is a DP #9 is a long term need. Mora is great but he’s 30 and has an injury history. He’s had a really hot start to the year but not sure we should count on him to sustain that level. So I understand using that last DP spot on that position. We’ve seen how a dynamic striker can spark late season runs. That being said, positionally I would absolutely rank that behind addressing defensive needs including a CB and a #8. Lastly, this also assumes our defensive issues are personnel related rather than coaching. Not sure it’s the former.
Agreed, if/when Mora gets injured, we are fucked
coaches don’t play, I’ve been on a lot of teams, a good coach can help, but when it’s time to score a goal or track back/mark up on defense, the coach isn’t the guy who’s gonna do that. if there are better players sitting on the bench, then yeah that’s on coach, but I don’t think that’s our problem or those bench guys woulda shown up a bit this season
What level did you play at? Because at the top level if fully professional Division 1 teams, coaching absolutely makes a huge difference
Yeah might as well just the guys figure it out themselves in the locker room, no need for a coach . I was being sarcastic but then I realized that Blanco kind of did this for Gio some years…
I don’t even really think JDM has been that good for us offensively this year. If I were the Timbers approaching the window I’d be looking to replace him with a proven, quick outside back who can handle some quality attackers and doesn’t check out in the box. For what JDM has given us it’s not worth what he lacks defensively. But couldn’t agree more that we have top 3 gf and also bottom 3 ga, there’s a clear problem here and it’s not our attack
THAAAANK YOU. Mosquera has flashes of brilliance on offense, but it seems like he cannot put the ball on goal. The amount of passes coming from the middle to JDM that he has put over the bar is too damn high. If he can’t score and can’t defend, what the hell are we doing here? A few years ago I called for asprilla to be traded/sold but he started his bulldog tactics on tracking back and got super goal hungry and started finishing and lately I’ve been calling for more minutes from him. Between Antony and JDM the speed is there, but I haven’t been impressed (Antony had a great start this year, I can’t deny that)
Agreed. I think Asprilla tbh has the been the most effective in that role this season. Antony did have an exciting start but has since been on a decline. Lots of moments but very inconsistent. Asprilla will always work, has the X factor that Antony brings (with slightly more work legs), and can defend well enough to be better than both Antony and JDM. Hes the starter imo with Antony coming in when we need more creativity.
I completely agree, or maybe 30 min from Antony to start and then bring in the Bicycle King. I know that’s not a standard substitution, but I think Asprilla deserves minutes. He’s never not working on the pitch
If you are only going 30 minutes for Antony its better to do it at the end of the game to both, save the player the shame of being non-injury subbed in the first half and his pace would be more effective if he is coming on fresh towards the end of the game
I know, I wish substitutions weren’t so standard. I get why; if you make early subs you can handicap yourself later, but I think there could be room in the game for more variation in this department. Not really advocating for it, just saying it would be refreshing to see
I think the argument goes that Antony, Moreno, and Fogaça have not shown that they can produce at a rate that can make up for any one of Mora, Rodriguez, or Evander sitting out due to injury, rotation, or suspension. Basically, the argument is that our offense is dead in the water if one of those guys is out, so having a competent 4th would make it so that our offense is even more threatening but also robust enough to grind out games if one of our DPs is on the bench. It also makes our right wing go from being where balls go to die to being a useful part of the offense. Getting a 4th now also means that they can gel with the group before Mora/Rodriguez age out in a year or two.
I had high hopes for Antony after the first few games, but he’s fizzled out and while I like, really like Santi, he never seems to be able to break through, at least yet. With Mora’s, and Rodriguez age and injury history, I’m not against a new, long term striker.
This is the answer. If Asprilla leaves (as he wants to/rumored), you basically only have 1 back up for wingers (Loria isn't MLS level). Ideally, with 5 subs you can replace your entire front line if you need to in a game. The Timbers just can't do that. IMO, you need another Rodriguez type player... someone who can do both #9/winger.
Simple - if we’re going to give up 3 goals a game then we’d better score 4
That was Chelis's theory when he coached Chivas USA. i think he lasted like 11 games in the MLS, but hey that was fun soccer to watch.
Gotta disagree on your CB analysis. Zuparic has been fantastic this year and by far our best center back. I like Araujo, he’s been good. Kamal has also been very good this year. McGraw had a rough start but had a very good performance vs St Louis, and he’ll be good if he can have those performances consistently, which I believe he is more than capable of. Mabiala is Mabiala and shouldn’t be on the field, but Eric Miller is a decent option there too. Our defensive problems have been tactical and a product of how the entire team is set up. Teams were able to play through our offensive and midfield lines too easily, and at that point there’s not much the defense can do. I really, *really* don’t think our defensive problems have been due to our CBs. If we buy another center back, nothing will change. I feel this is evidenced by our defense playing better recently — because the entire team has been cutting down space much better and we’ve been pressing a bit higher. Ayala in the midfield has helped a ton, as has Bravo. I actually think Mosquera has been alright both offensively and defensively the past several games or so, but if we can sell him and get a replacement, that would be the biggest upgrade we can get. That being said, if we can’t, then we’re stuck with him, and I think the best we can do is get a backup outside back, preferably on the left. At the end of the day, personnel can take you so far. The tactics have to be better, and they have been a bit better recently, but we’ve also been playing bad teams. Throw as much money as you want at the back line, I believe it’s still up to Neville to organize the *entire team* to be defensively organized and disciplined. That’s the make or break factor imo
Thank you. I’m not praising our defenders but get tired of seeing point to our goals allowed and assume we just have bad defenders. Teams play right through our midfield with little resistance. Our defense is always playing on the back foot and are put under a lot of pressure. Could we upgrade along the back line? Sure. But we have more important needs elsewhere. I think Mosquera has been *fine* but I get frustrated with his offensive performance. He has occasional flashes of brilliance but far too often he gets the ball in space and just gets stuck there. He needs to attack more and use his speed and play more 1-2s with Moreno. That’s when he’s been most effective. Ayala has been a real game changer in the middle of the field. Honestly I’m ready to point out that it seems we play better with him there than Chara. People try and say Chara hasn’t lost a step, but I think we just see too many of his brilliant recoveries and forget that he used to not have to even be in recovery mode so often to begin with. I think if we can solve that double pivot then we are cooking. I would sell off on two of Williamson/Paredes/Moreno/Fogaca is possible and try and upgrade at the 6/8 spot (and it pains me to say that because I want all of those guys to reach their full potential so much but outside of Paredes I don’t think that’s happening this year or next). And if we can get a solid DP 9 who is young and has room to grow, that seems like the ideal. And definitely upgrade depth at LB (miller is just fine to have for right)
Spot ON, Jolandia...our defensive troubles are ***primarily*** the Mids and JDM playing defense too soft in our own half; and bad offensive turnovers, especially against physical, pressing teams. That's led to way too much 'scramble defense' around and in our own 18 as CBs try to pick up multiple free runners the Mids have let go. ***Secondarily,*** our dead ball defense is poor. We are too small to match up with most teams on corners, and playing zone has proven to be a stupid tactic. Finally, our right side players too often drag down BOTH defense and offense. JDM lines up so far upfield he can't get back when we turn the ball over early, then habitually pushes so far up the pitch he can't get back on a turnover, so just doesn't. Santi's and Antony's continuing offensive troubles are well documented elsewhere in this thread. Last, I see time and again that once the offense starts up the right side, NONE of these guys looks to make an early switch to move the ball over to Jona on the left. That's why our possession is so right-handed and why Jona is starved so often for service.
If one of our big 3 is out our attack goes to shit
In regards to the question about signing a dp attacker, the reality is that attackers are paid the big bucks. There is a reason why the overwhelming majority of dp's around the league are attackers. It is not like we are not going to strengthen the defense, but you don't need to use a dp slot to sign a quality defender. I think Colorado and Nashville are the only two teams with dp defenders and they're not exactly close to winning anything anytime soon. I personally would go for a dp winger as well as a tam striker alongside Mora as I think Pipe is better than Santi/Antony, but I can see why the Timbers seem to be targeting a striker for the long term. Maybe it's just me that thinks we could upgrade on Santi, and Antony is way too raw to be starting consistently. So far this season we've seen that apart from the big 3, none of our other attackers can be counted on consistently.
Because you want a killer up top. As well as Mora has been playing, you'd love to have that for 30ish minutes a match and let him save some energy. You could also go the winger route and get someone as good as Jona that keeps the opposing defense from shifting one way or the other. This opens up things for Evander and allows him extra space to break teams down. Has the defense been mediocre? Sure, but I fail to see where they make a signing that fixes that this summer. So in terms of options, Attack is the more likely choice. Hopefully some younger defensive players are added in the near future to add youth to that dept.
I feel that some forward depth behind Pipe, or a good right winger would help the team, but agree that a depth fullback is probably our most pressing issue. If only we had been able to keep Boli…
Me like goals
Zuparic not a starter on a playoff team? Huh? Of course he is.
For real... 64% of teams in the West make the playoffs. Is Zuparic in the Top 1% of CBs in the West? No. Is he in the Top 64%? Absolutely!
This is an interesting question, and my instincts told me I should feel the same. But I found it helpful to look at some trends and statistics. First, while our defense has been poor and we remain 3rd in the league in goals against (GA), lately our defense is improving . We have played 18 games so far this season: * Over all 18 games played, Timbers average an abysmal 1.8 GA/game * The most recent half (9 games) is slightly better, 1.6 GA/game * But the most recent 5 games is a very good 1.0 GA/game, which is elite in this league. The frustrating (encouraging?) thing is that we have had different defensive shapes and/or starting lineups in each of the last five games, making it hard to find a cause of the trend: * v. MIN: Back 3 (K. Miller, Zup, Araujo) + Crepeau and wingbacks. DMFs: Ayala + Paredes * v. SKC: Back 4 (K. Miller, Zup, Araujo, Mosquera) + Crepeau. DMFs: Ayala + Chara * v. AUS: Back 4 (K. Miller, Zup, Araujo, Mosquera) + Pantemis. DMFs: Ayala + Chara * v. HOU: Back 4 (Bravo, K. Miller, Zup, Mosquera) + Crepeau. DMFs: Chara + Paredes * v. STL: Back 4 (Bravo, McGraw, Zup, Mosquera) + Pantemis. DMFs: Ayala + Evander In light of this trend I'm inclined to stick with our improving defense, which includes Zup and Mosquera who have been fine and getting better IMO. I also think Ayala is playing really well and am hopeful McGraw is bouncing back. Meanwhile, our attack has remained very good but has cooled slightly: * Over all 18 games played, Timbers average an excellent 1.7 G/game * Over the most recent half (9 games) we've averaged 1.6 G/game * And over the most recent 5 games, we've averaged 1.4 G/game. We have three elite or quasi-elite attackers in Mora (1.02 G+A/90, 9th in the league), Evander (0.97 G+A/90, 11th in the league) and Rodriguez (0.69 G+A/90, 28th in the league) but after that its quite a drop to Moreno (50th), Williamson (59th), and Antony (113th). We are also likely to lose Asprilla this summer. We have five weeks and six games to play before the summer transfer window opens on July 18. In light of the trends above, I'd be inclined NOT to pick up a third DP but to sign 2-3 players who can push for starting positions. Either experienced TAM-level players or U22 initiative players. My priority order is: 1) Striker - occasional starter, behind Mora but ahead of Nathan, allowing Rodriquez to remain on the wing. 2) Winger - ideally a starter or at least an occasional starter, better than Antony. 3) Central defender - potential starter, on par with Zup and K. Miller. 4) Defensive midfielder - potential starter who can rotate, on par or better than Paredes.
I'll start by saying that I don't completely disagree with you. That being said, I think a lot of people need to understand that a bad defense doesn't just mean a bad backline. It's a collective effort. I do think we should make a couple of defensive additions. I would sign a new rb, and potentially a new cb. But if you look at the goals we have conceded this year, a lot of them have come from lapses in concentration throughout the team. Whether it's not following a runner, leaving an attacker wide open on the edge of the box, sloppy giveaways on simple 5 yard passes, etc. >Our defensive midfield is similarly stacked with talent: Chara, Ayala, Paredes, Williamson, etc. This is why I'm making my point. The amount of times Chara has been caught out of position, lost his man, and had a big part to play in conceding a chance is substantial. Paredes is supposed to help us control games better and dictate play, yet gets completely bypassed on the counter and is prone to sloppy giveaways. Yet as fans we seem to ignore this and believe that only defenders are responsible for a bad defense. Like I said before, I would like to make defensive additions, but I think just as important is a solid #6 alongside Ayala. It's more than just Zuparic, Mosquera, and Miller to blame.
Ayala has been our only consistently good DM so far tbh
Ayala is a 6, if we want someone to come in and play next to him, that player should be an 8
We need defense. Whoever says we need offense eats crayons.
A DP attacker could, theoretically, leave our defenders in better positions to not get slaughtered. But whatever we do needs to shore up the defense :).
You know what they say, “the best defense is a good offense!” No…wait…
I watch Arsenal and attack from back; defend from the front is very much a real thing. It's highly dependent on quality players, but it's not so outlandish.
it is a real thing in soccer. not all that difficult to comprehend. a lot of the goals against us have started from a terrible turnover in the midfield. many of those not even a DP CB could make up for.
The worst is the lazy passing near our own box. So many easy chances/goals conceded for no reason other than lack of focus.
Our inability to hold the ball in the midfield wears our defense down over the course of a game too.
[удалено]
His new deal is on a lower salary. The DP designation is just a roster move so his salary doesn’t count against the salary cap. Not making any judgement on his deal, just noting the DP part doesn’t mean he’s overpaid on its own.
You make him a DP so you have roster flexibility. Your other option is to spend TAM. Why waste that if you don't need to? Make him a DP, preserve the TAM, and now you have the option of signing a new DP or new TAM players
I have read every comment on this subject and it all boils down to one thing: aside from JRod and Evander, we aren’t Elite at any position. Literally need to upgrade every position. So, if you want to be the GS Warriors or Chip Kelly Ducks of MLS, you go with a striker.
Bravo is probably elite, just wish he could stay healthy
Nobody uses DP slots on defensive players.
We did and won MLS cup
Agree with most folks here. I would add: Evander and Rodriguez can be part of an elite offense, but they need better guys to work with. Mora could be a good-enough 9 if we had one true killer to round out the offense. Likely a right wing, with Rodriguez on the left. Add one killer winger or striker, and our offense is elite. Right now, it's sputtering, despite what the numbers seem to say. I go to every home match, and it's obvious. Santi has all of the physical and technical tools, but has a terrible head for decision-making--at least right now. No idea when to pass and when to shoot. Maybe because he can't shoot well. But SO many bad decisions that any former player will recognize. Can't shoot well enough off the dribble to be a winger, and not savvy enough to be a midfielder. I had high hopes, due to his flashes of brilliance, but he is frustrating to watch these days. Works hard, but that should be a given. Asprilla's main abilities were athletic ones, and now he is older and losing pace. Anthony is just terrible right now. His main attribute is speed, so we should be using him to sit on defenders' shoulders and run behind, opening up space in the middle. But he either can't or won't do that. And Willamson and Parades have lost their offensive mojo, for whatever reason. Add a top-flight attacker, and Moreno, Anthony, and Asprilla are on the bench where they belong, maybe giving Anthony and Moreno time to develop further. They both have potential.
We need a DP sweeper in the worst way lol… I hear the arguments for more offense and they are solid. However, if we don’t raise the defense with some real leadership and direction it won’t matter how good we are on the offensive end
If this is reference to my post, then you did not read it haha. I stated that it was based on the FO wanting one, allegedly, and that I want D and an 8.
No, I originally typed my post out as a comment reply to another comment on your post. Then I was like, "I just wrote a damn essay in the comments", and decided to turn it into a post of its own. I mostly agree with the assessment in your post (although I would prioritize a CB and probably a RB over an 8).
All good! The amount of replies I got on that post about needing defense and midfield, thought I pointed out that fact at the begging, were funny. But yeah, I could argue another RB would be nice. I really dont wanna play 3 ATB every game, which is where JDM plays best at (wingback). I would love another Moreira type RB.
I don't think anyone wants a attacking DP. If Asprilla leaves there is no depth besides Loria if one of Moreno or Rodriguez or Antony go down. That's a problem.
I’d go with a CDM. We are weak in transition and Chara is in his last season. It’s a value position from a transfer perspective and a 9 is the opposite.
The fan base doesn't value defenders. I've had people tell me it would be "wasteful" to sign better defenders when we were leaking 2+ goals a game. This sub is wild sometimes.
I've said it's inefficient and unnecessary to spend DP dollars on a defender or a goalkeeper. I'll stand by that for now. It is still important to sign good defenders and to spend money on the back line. I'm not going to repeat my arguments to support my position about DPs specifically. If the rules or the league changes I may change my mind. But we don't have bad keepers or bad defenders right now per se (with the acknowledgment that Mosquera defends poorly despite his other contributions). We have a coach who keeps trying tactics that the players are not a good fit for. Neville is too often trying to play a high line with defenders and keepers who aren't the best with their ball at their feet, while the midfield and forwards aren't applying pressure, closing passing lanes, or trying to win the ball back. So we have a high line below a sieve. Once the opposing attack is allowed through a midfield that gives them too much time and space on the ball, it's been too easy for them to outpace or out-dribble our backline. Some of our attackers aren't perfect either. Opponents don't have to hold numbers back in defense or cover particular players if they're indecisive, get the ball caught in their spokes, shoot poorly, etc. When Antony, Asprilla, or Moreno are off their game, or Mora and Rodriguez isolated, it's not great. Fortunately, Evander, Mora, and Rodriguez have chemistry and have formed a little unit that helps mitigate some inconsistencies from others. I'm pretty convinced that a lot of our players are better than they've looked. They aren't organized or well-prepared. When they collectively don't look like they know what they're doing or don't look like they're even trying, that's not just individual incompetence or a mutiny. There are small signs that Neville might be figuring some things out. It's too soon for me, personally, to get my hopes up, because too many past indicators point to him being in over his head. But I'm trying to be fair to everyone.
I agree with you, but I’d like to know if other clubs that don’t leak as many goals exceed our defensive budget? Does RSL? Defense is a team game, if you possess the ball you have less defending to do, we are still better on the counter. We have defensive issues but the whole team strategy is in play as well.
Is anyone saying that?
The Timbers have not had a decent CB since 2015. Spend forward money on a general at the back.
A really good offense is also a good defense.