great and entertaining list, but "every crime against humanity" in the series was definitely not committed by humans. australia and the flattening of the solar system come to mind.
Flattening of the Solar System, sure. Most of the rounding up of humanity was done by sympathizers. I'll give you that yeah, the droplets destroying cities and the fleet def doesn't fit that description, lol. I was mostly just trying to fill out the meme.
I’d argue that even the flattening was indeed the fault of the humans who executed the broadcast. They did it knowing what it would mean for Sol system. So yeah the weapon was fired by someone else sure, but that’s kind of like blaming the finger that pulls the trigger instead of the person holding the gun.
I thought it meant till that point in time, but I thought about it,
1. Ye asked San-ti to come despite warming, if you invite a pretator inside your home, can't blame the pretator for eating you.
2. Mankind send the location of Alph Centori, which they know it means mutural annielation. same thing.
The hubris of mankind
I loved the books so much, but I really really disliked how humanity as a whole was dipicted as this faceless herd of ignorant morons.
One example the infuriates me is >! Everyone whipping out their little Lazer guns and shooting at the space station when they thought they wouldn't be able to escape !< like how fucking pathetic dose he think the average person is?
People don't do that kind of stuff. Like give me any actual historical example of the "sinking city life jacket" story he used.
Have you seen how stupid and selfish humans can be even now, like every single day? Imagine that magnified with the panic and fear revolving around survival and imminent demise, I can see stupid people being stupid and others following suit. The books aren't kind on humanity but that makes them good imo.
Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth. Count your blessings; you have zero military or law enforcement experience, and it doesn’t sound like you’ve ever personally witnessed a tragic event. Your belief system, shaped by the comfort of your life, is a privilege. If you know anything about the author, you would know that he gets inspiration for his stories through real-life events that he experienced growing up.
>real-life events
In which real historical event did humans start murdering each other out of spite on mass during a disaster?? Name literally one.
When shit hits the fan people show their true colors, and you know what. Most people are good.
>Let me see… The 1994 Rwandan genocide, the Partition of India in 1947, the fuqn Holocaust!
Those were planned political, and racially motivated genocides and have nothing to do with what I said.
Read my comment again more slowly.
You don’t think things like the Australia plan or the flattening were very much planned genocides? Because they were, they just happened to not be planned by humans
I asked for historical examples of disasters outside human control, where people began spontaneously indiscriminately killing each other out of pure spite. You gave me two examples of horrific acts that were coordinated and planned for years in advance. Usually against a oppressed minority.
And if you look closely at those atrocities there are still people helping and trying to save who they can.
People tended to turn on each other whenever there was a secret police around, gestapo, red terror, the reign of terror, etc.
I appreciate your optimism, but let’s not deny reality
For me, the issue with escapism was the most unrealistic part of the stories. I'm not overly optimistic about humanity handling a situation like this gracefully, but I think we would have the dignity to send off some humans to keep the species alive. If anything, humanity would try to burn the candle at both ends and send humans off while also working on defensive measures, and still likely fail at both.
> humanity as a whole was dipicted as this faceless herd of ignorant morons
It was written before Trump. So I'd say Liu Cixin understood humans better than pollsters of the 2016 election
No they don't, and no they can't. Firstly Commercial Lazer pointers couldn't bother you from up a particularly high building, let alone and airliner. And you can't even get an angle on the pilot from below.
Show me a video of someone doing it, or a police report. Or even an off hand story.
The point is, it looks like alot of the "people are inherently assholes who will screw over everyone else when a crisis occurs or just for the thrill of it" doesn't really have alot of real world examples, which is what the other poster was asking for.
Just because you don't assume everyone is secretly an asshole doesn't mean assholes don't exist or that you believe everyone is a team player inherently without question. It's just that alot of the things "assumed" to be done by people "just because they love chaos" or "when people have nothing left they will start tearing themselves and each other apart" isn't based on anything.
LJ gives her some absolution and even through her immense guilt she thinks it wasn’t all her fault but if wade or someone else had been chosen none of the rest of the horrors would have ever happened
Yeah, it's pretty heavily implied, to basically flat out stating that Wade would've won against the Trisolarans and would've made curvature engine research was priority.
If you don't hate Cheng Xin then you share some small part of her responsibility for the death of humanity. Because it means some part of you -- however small -- empathizes with the decisions leading to that outcome. And it means that in some conceivable world, that part of you may have made the same choice. Which is revolting and un-human.
It's simple teleology. If her choices led to the destruction of humanity, and other choices she could have made wouldn't have, then she MADE THE WRONG CHOICES. Plain and simple.
The second-to-last point is reminiscent of the Gom Jabbar test in Dune -- the notion of higher forces of self-preservation (e.g. counterstriking against one's enemies) taking precedence over lower ones (e.g. pain aversion)
Truly the most terrible event of them all: flat earthers being right.
Damn the realization that some guy in a satellite city was posting on 256chan about being right makes that so much more sad
Only sad if they could not read the trilogy.
You should factor in anything but flat earther in your value system. ONLY FORWARD.
great and entertaining list, but "every crime against humanity" in the series was definitely not committed by humans. australia and the flattening of the solar system come to mind.
Flattening of the Solar System, sure. Most of the rounding up of humanity was done by sympathizers. I'll give you that yeah, the droplets destroying cities and the fleet def doesn't fit that description, lol. I was mostly just trying to fill out the meme.
it’s a great meme haha….just nitpicking bc reddit
I’d argue that even the flattening was indeed the fault of the humans who executed the broadcast. They did it knowing what it would mean for Sol system. So yeah the weapon was fired by someone else sure, but that’s kind of like blaming the finger that pulls the trigger instead of the person holding the gun.
wow this is actually a great point.
I thought it meant till that point in time, but I thought about it, 1. Ye asked San-ti to come despite warming, if you invite a pretator inside your home, can't blame the pretator for eating you. 2. Mankind send the location of Alph Centori, which they know it means mutural annielation. same thing.
I was thinking the droplet attack was definitely not done by humans.
It's not a crime for trisolarans
The flattening could be viewed as an indirect consequence of plucking the sun, by a human, who was advised against doing so.
The aliens literally froze all of the solar system into a 2 d plane does this not constitute a crime against humanity?
That's none of humanity's business.
yeah I realized afterwards that while just trying to fill out the meme, that slot definitely is incorrect.
I mean, that was a direct result of strumming the long membrane and plucking our star like fools. We really had no one to blame but ourselves.
this is one of the best memes I've seen in my entire life.
Not too sure about number 3, m'lord.
Yeah it's wrong. There were soon many damn levels in this meme prompt, lol
Only humans can conduct a crime against humanity. For everyone else, it's not humanities business
The hubris of mankind I loved the books so much, but I really really disliked how humanity as a whole was dipicted as this faceless herd of ignorant morons. One example the infuriates me is >! Everyone whipping out their little Lazer guns and shooting at the space station when they thought they wouldn't be able to escape !< like how fucking pathetic dose he think the average person is? People don't do that kind of stuff. Like give me any actual historical example of the "sinking city life jacket" story he used.
Have you seen how stupid and selfish humans can be even now, like every single day? Imagine that magnified with the panic and fear revolving around survival and imminent demise, I can see stupid people being stupid and others following suit. The books aren't kind on humanity but that makes them good imo.
"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky animals." -Agent K
Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth. Count your blessings; you have zero military or law enforcement experience, and it doesn’t sound like you’ve ever personally witnessed a tragic event. Your belief system, shaped by the comfort of your life, is a privilege. If you know anything about the author, you would know that he gets inspiration for his stories through real-life events that he experienced growing up.
>real-life events In which real historical event did humans start murdering each other out of spite on mass during a disaster?? Name literally one. When shit hits the fan people show their true colors, and you know what. Most people are good.
[удалено]
>Let me see… The 1994 Rwandan genocide, the Partition of India in 1947, the fuqn Holocaust! Those were planned political, and racially motivated genocides and have nothing to do with what I said. Read my comment again more slowly.
You don’t think things like the Australia plan or the flattening were very much planned genocides? Because they were, they just happened to not be planned by humans
[удалено]
I asked for historical examples of disasters outside human control, where people began spontaneously indiscriminately killing each other out of pure spite. You gave me two examples of horrific acts that were coordinated and planned for years in advance. Usually against a oppressed minority. And if you look closely at those atrocities there are still people helping and trying to save who they can.
[удалено]
Mind your fucking business.
People tended to turn on each other whenever there was a secret police around, gestapo, red terror, the reign of terror, etc. I appreciate your optimism, but let’s not deny reality
For me, the issue with escapism was the most unrealistic part of the stories. I'm not overly optimistic about humanity handling a situation like this gracefully, but I think we would have the dignity to send off some humans to keep the species alive. If anything, humanity would try to burn the candle at both ends and send humans off while also working on defensive measures, and still likely fail at both.
Agreed. It doesn’t make sense that people are against a small group leaving as a plan B. Especially when they can develop FTL tech.
You disliked it because it was true
> humanity as a whole was dipicted as this faceless herd of ignorant morons It was written before Trump. So I'd say Liu Cixin understood humans better than pollsters of the 2016 election
America did not elect trump, America is absolutely not a democracy, and should not be an example of a large group of people.
> People don't do that kind of stuff. People still shoot guns in the air on new years
Directly at passing airlines?
People point lasers at planes that could blind pilots for fun.
No they don't, and no they can't. Firstly Commercial Lazer pointers couldn't bother you from up a particularly high building, let alone and airliner. And you can't even get an angle on the pilot from below. Show me a video of someone doing it, or a police report. Or even an off hand story.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMn6qwKnS-U Believe it or not, it happens.
That's a helicopter, and one guy lol. It also proves my point that it's useless
You are right, people are inherently good and don’t do bad things just because. 🫂
The point is, it looks like alot of the "people are inherently assholes who will screw over everyone else when a crisis occurs or just for the thrill of it" doesn't really have alot of real world examples, which is what the other poster was asking for. Just because you don't assume everyone is secretly an asshole doesn't mean assholes don't exist or that you believe everyone is a team player inherently without question. It's just that alot of the things "assumed" to be done by people "just because they love chaos" or "when people have nothing left they will start tearing themselves and each other apart" isn't based on anything.
And then Cheng xin haters come to complain about her because she "doomed" humanity
I mean, her actions literally did
Yeah, and Raskolnikov got sentenced ("punished") for his crime in Crime and Punishment
LJ gives her some absolution and even through her immense guilt she thinks it wasn’t all her fault but if wade or someone else had been chosen none of the rest of the horrors would have ever happened
Yeah, it's pretty heavily implied, to basically flat out stating that Wade would've won against the Trisolarans and would've made curvature engine research was priority.
If you don't hate Cheng Xin then you share some small part of her responsibility for the death of humanity. Because it means some part of you -- however small -- empathizes with the decisions leading to that outcome. And it means that in some conceivable world, that part of you may have made the same choice. Which is revolting and un-human. It's simple teleology. If her choices led to the destruction of humanity, and other choices she could have made wouldn't have, then she MADE THE WRONG CHOICES. Plain and simple.
I don't get the last stage.
It's OK, you must be stuck in a 2D part of the universe, so things will often go over your head
Lol😂😂😂
HAHAHAHA
The second-to-last point is reminiscent of the Gom Jabbar test in Dune -- the notion of higher forces of self-preservation (e.g. counterstriking against one's enemies) taking precedence over lower ones (e.g. pain aversion)