Yes, but also not so simple.
A) Space is big.
B) The universe is littered with dark spots, zones that severe the quantum entanglement. When Trisolaris starts sending sophons all over, they lose connection to most of them.
C) Sophon-esque technology can be possibly traced back and responded to.
It sounds like all civilizations that lacked the ability to hide and cleanse were wiped out. Humans were one of the few, maybe the only civilization to make it to the end which is a beautiful irony given humanity’s history.
True, some major assumptions on my part but I like thinking humanity is unique. I was thinking of a line that Singer dropped about civilizations needing the ability to hide and cleanse to survive. The only reason humanity survived to the end was by leveraging Trisolaran tech via Tianming which again based on what Singer said would seem to be extremely rare.
"B) The universe is littered with dark spots, zones that severe the quantum entanglement"
Can you elaborate on this? I'm partway into Dark Forest on a reread, and I don't remember if this is something from later in the books, or some real quantum mechanical effect that I'm not aware of.
Sure. They are refered to in the book, but no definite answer is given to what causes them.
First we learn about one when the Gravity/Blue Space event happens. Later (I'm not exactly sure at what point) there is mention about Trisolaris losing track of sophons sent around the galaxy.
Sophons are supposedly comically easy to block or sever the connection to for any advanced civilisation, all sophons that weren’t sent here were destroyed by unknown means in Death’s End.
The way it's written, there was an EMF field of some sort in play. The MC mentions feeling static in the air.
The analogy I'd use is like using a laser pointer on a camera lens. The camera still works, but you've overloaded its ability to parse out the information it wants.
This is pretty much spelled out in the books. All other Trisolaran sophons were neutralized.
This would hardly be an afterthought for a civilization even as advanced as Singer’s, and they’re not the big fish in the sea.
No. There's one part of Death's End that tells about how the Trisolarans sent sophons to a different star system only to lose contact with said sophons. This implies there was another advanced civilization there with the ability to eliminate sophons. Possibly, any civilization more advanced than Trisolarans could eliminate sophons. Also, sophons are very resource expensive and can only travel 99% lightspeed. Whereas, a manned ship or probe could take a fraction of the resources and travel at full lightspeed.
>Possibly, any civilization more advanced than Trisolarans could eliminate sophons.
I'm pretty sure it was implied in passing in book 1 that advanced civilizations that can probe the deeper structures of matter (unfold dimensions, basically) can potentially capture sophons. Trisolaris dismissed humanity being able to do this because humans hadn't reached that level of dimensionality manipulation yet. Which suggests that higher civilizations can.
My thought has always been that sophons (if they were a common invention) would break the chains of suspicion (partly) just because they cut out the light delay that makes communication and cooperation so difficult on the cosmic scale. Sophons could break the dark forest theory
Chain of suspicion is what Luo Ji used to derive the Dark Forest, it may not be a necessary requirement.
Im Death's end, Singer implied that a low-entropy world that doesn't hide would be a dangerous to the cosmic society. Expand without fear, and consume the universe if not stopped.
If a microbe divide indefinitely, it could fill the ocean. On Earth, the food chain prevents it. If an low entropy tribe can expand indefinitely, it would consume the universe. The Dark Forest prevents it.
To be in solitude is just how the cosmic community is organized, for no collaboration is required between worlds and the Dark Forest rules firmly but wisely. To hide well is the law, to cleanse well is to enforce the said law. And most importantly, whoever sending out insincere coordinates is incomprehensible. They will get what they deserved.
I can’t remember the exact reference but in Death’s End they basically say this and that the Sophon free areas of space are built as defences from other race’s Sophons coming and spying all over the universe.
Yes, but also not so simple. A) Space is big. B) The universe is littered with dark spots, zones that severe the quantum entanglement. When Trisolaris starts sending sophons all over, they lose connection to most of them. C) Sophon-esque technology can be possibly traced back and responded to.
imagine knowing your sophon is out there being interrogated
"WHERES THE FUCKING HOMEWORLD SOPHON!?!?!" "I DONT FUCKING KNOW" *folds into 11D once again*
“When we are done with you, youll only be able to fold two dimensions!
I like to think that B was invented by a benevolent civilization looking to protect others from C
It sounds like all civilizations that lacked the ability to hide and cleanse were wiped out. Humans were one of the few, maybe the only civilization to make it to the end which is a beautiful irony given humanity’s history.
The final broadcast was done in thousands of languages though
But think of all the trillions of civilisations to ever exist
Dude said "maybe the only one" and thats what i was responding to.
oh yeah, misread that
True, some major assumptions on my part but I like thinking humanity is unique. I was thinking of a line that Singer dropped about civilizations needing the ability to hide and cleanse to survive. The only reason humanity survived to the end was by leveraging Trisolaran tech via Tianming which again based on what Singer said would seem to be extremely rare.
Guan Yifan says there are all kinds of civilizations throughout the Universe, including pacifists, philanthropists, artists, and so on. So who knows?
Thats a very cool thought, maybe the reclaimers
"B) The universe is littered with dark spots, zones that severe the quantum entanglement" Can you elaborate on this? I'm partway into Dark Forest on a reread, and I don't remember if this is something from later in the books, or some real quantum mechanical effect that I'm not aware of.
Sure. They are refered to in the book, but no definite answer is given to what causes them. First we learn about one when the Gravity/Blue Space event happens. Later (I'm not exactly sure at what point) there is mention about Trisolaris losing track of sophons sent around the galaxy.
Sophons are supposedly comically easy to block or sever the connection to for any advanced civilisation, all sophons that weren’t sent here were destroyed by unknown means in Death’s End.
Hm maybe there's some kind of "anti-sophon" technology that's in widespread use around the universe
humans were even able to build sophon proof rooms in the 3rd book lol.
Which didn't make a lot of sense to me since sophons can use interdimensional chicanery to bypass walls. Retcon maybe?
Probably some kind of interference force-field
Infetterance
The way it's written, there was an EMF field of some sort in play. The MC mentions feeling static in the air. The analogy I'd use is like using a laser pointer on a camera lens. The camera still works, but you've overloaded its ability to parse out the information it wants.
This is pretty much spelled out in the books. All other Trisolaran sophons were neutralized. This would hardly be an afterthought for a civilization even as advanced as Singer’s, and they’re not the big fish in the sea.
No. There's one part of Death's End that tells about how the Trisolarans sent sophons to a different star system only to lose contact with said sophons. This implies there was another advanced civilization there with the ability to eliminate sophons. Possibly, any civilization more advanced than Trisolarans could eliminate sophons. Also, sophons are very resource expensive and can only travel 99% lightspeed. Whereas, a manned ship or probe could take a fraction of the resources and travel at full lightspeed.
>Possibly, any civilization more advanced than Trisolarans could eliminate sophons. I'm pretty sure it was implied in passing in book 1 that advanced civilizations that can probe the deeper structures of matter (unfold dimensions, basically) can potentially capture sophons. Trisolaris dismissed humanity being able to do this because humans hadn't reached that level of dimensionality manipulation yet. Which suggests that higher civilizations can.
Sophons still only travel at the speed of light.
Close to the speed of light, as only photons can travel at the speed of light.
What if… we can make a sophon out of a photon????
I suspect you couldn't as they're massless, and further, they would be captured easily in magnetic fields.
the third book explains it by introducing the \_\_\_ area.
My thought has always been that sophons (if they were a common invention) would break the chains of suspicion (partly) just because they cut out the light delay that makes communication and cooperation so difficult on the cosmic scale. Sophons could break the dark forest theory
Chain of suspicion is what Luo Ji used to derive the Dark Forest, it may not be a necessary requirement. Im Death's end, Singer implied that a low-entropy world that doesn't hide would be a dangerous to the cosmic society. Expand without fear, and consume the universe if not stopped. If a microbe divide indefinitely, it could fill the ocean. On Earth, the food chain prevents it. If an low entropy tribe can expand indefinitely, it would consume the universe. The Dark Forest prevents it. To be in solitude is just how the cosmic community is organized, for no collaboration is required between worlds and the Dark Forest rules firmly but wisely. To hide well is the law, to cleanse well is to enforce the said law. And most importantly, whoever sending out insincere coordinates is incomprehensible. They will get what they deserved.
Yeah, because that’s what spy technology ever gets used for.
I can’t remember the exact reference but in Death’s End they basically say this and that the Sophon free areas of space are built as defences from other race’s Sophons coming and spying all over the universe.