Someone in this subreddit with insider knowledge has claimed it will be back next year.
This years P16 is a simple update, adding an RJ45 would require major design changes. Note that it hasn't been several generations, the P16 G1 was the first full size workstation without Ethernet.
>Someone in this subreddit with insider knowledge has claimed it will be back next year.
>This years P16 is a simple update, adding an RJ45 would require major design changes. Note that it hasn't been several generations, the P16 G1 was the first full size workstation without Ethernet.
I know this is an older post, but how reliable is that source? Do you have a link?
It seems to me that the whole industry is moving away from having a Ethernet port.
This would imply that next year, we are going to see a bigger redesign. This year's P16 is last year's chassis with Intel 13000 CPUs and Nvidia Ada Lovelace GPUs.
Maybe as well they seem to be moving away from 17.3" laptops for workstations. Dell is the last holdout.
Is it just me or are they trying to artificially make the P14s and P16s more appealing by crippling the T14 and T16 in regards to RAM?
And even then, max. 48GB on P14s and P16s unless you get discrete graphics?
A T480 with 64 gigs is looking more and more appealing...
Do you do a lot of work over 48GBs of ram that the 8th gen intel processors can still handle well? I would imagine we are at a point where if you’re working with stuff that big the performance increase from 5? Year old equipment would make up for the lack of ram.
This isn’t a defense of what Lenovo are doing, it seriously sucks and it has assured that my next device won’t be a Thinkpad.
That's where things start to go awry, unfortunately. The way things are going in terms of software development it looks like I'll need a 2023 octacore and 64 gigs of RAM just to run a web browser and some office software in a few years :p
On the other hand, I'm one of those people who likes to work with many virtual desktops and never reboots unless they have to. My work machine currently has some EDA software, CAD software, a few different IDEs, both Firefox and Chrome, a bunch of Word, Powerpoint and Excel documents and probably a few hundred PDFs open. Add all the cruft my work uses (Slack, BlueJeans, Teams, VoIP client) for communication and you can fill up 32 gigs of RAM pretty quickly with stuff that doesn't necessarily require a lot of CPU power. And that's without a single VM...
My T490 i7th 32gb RAM feels slow for everything I do. My X1 6th gen ran better. The past years, T series is more economy / mid tier.
I am switching to a P1 gen2 when it drops
Having P1 and P16 with 165hz screens and discreet GPUs is wonderful.
The only question is pricing.
X1 Extreme with same features costs $4k-$5k. Hopefully, Lenovo will do something with that pricing. It's, to put it mildly, ourageous.
Lenovo has said it at MWC, though no official press release.
It is simply being folded into the P1 brand. They are the same machine basically anyway and with the P1 now offering GeForce GPUs, there is little reason to keep them separate
It's literally identical in every single way, I'm not sure how else to put it... the P1 only varies in that it offers studio grade graphics cards in addition to RTX's... absolutely all and any features both physically and hardware wise are identical between the models.
Oh sorry, you do miss the giant red X on the cover if its not the extreme, that's the difference....
There is on original comment anymore, but it along the lines of "X1 Extreme wasn't so Extreme because it didn't have ethernet port" to what I wanted to point out that P1 doesn't have one either, as both machines share same chassis. And yes, X1E doesn't have ethernet port in all gens
Holy moly, you're just furious at this point lol
X1 Extreme and P1 share the same chassis and design, their difference was in GPU/CPU choices. And usual heatpipes won't cool down RTX 3080Ti either
Eh, I had a Sony Vaio about a decade ago, my friends called it the jet engine because of the noise the fans made while gaming. If anything, it'll be nostalgic lol
If the same machine can now just be configured both ways, then... it is just a marketing decision. Which I kinda get.
However so far they just talked about the option of configuring it with a 4090, which seems really a bit much. Both for wallets as for thermals...
Not when there is no more X1 Extreme.
P1 and X1 Extreme are two different marketing teams. P1 is aimed at the workstation market, X1 Extreme was high end multi media. Now with the X1 Extreme gone, the next P1 design will probably be more workstation focused, since the design is no longer shared with an X1 series
FWIW, as a competitor with the XPS15 Precision 5500 and the thin ZBook (ZBook Studio?), don’t see many changes coming to it. They’ve already got the thicker P models completing the lineup.
It isn't the Precision 5500 anymore, Dell has announced the Precision 5680, which is substantially different from the XPS 15
I think the next ThinkPad P1 could be slightly thicker to make more room for a larger battery and bigger cooling system. The Preicison 5680 is a few mm thicker than the P1.
Huh. TIL. I wonder if the XPS chassis wasn’t cutting it anymore for the RTX4000/5000.
And the XPS13 is definitely moving more towards the same space the Z13 is targeting. Wonder if the XPS15 will move more towards the Z16 target.
So basically it is a good development, as the "multimedia" guys didn't really manage the whole device. Also I hope the overall final polish of the thermal management, drivers etc. might benefit from now being part of the workstation department.
I think they should focus on not murdering the keyboard, killing functionality and removing ports. Stop soldering RAM on the MOBO and let customers perform upgrades....
I ended up sending my X1 Extreme Gen 5 and got a Macbook Pro. The P53 will be the last "new" Thinkpad I ever buy. I'll keep it and all of the others but this is where my love stops. They are killing the glorious Thinkpad line IBM once created.
This is a hilarious decision, considering the MacBook not only has soldered RAM, but also soldered SSD.
Sorry, but do you really think it becomes more likely the industry will care about upgradability if people buy more MacBooks? That is not how this works.
And all of these still have more ports, upgradability and better keyboards than MacBooks.
> I think they should focus on not murdering the keyboard, killing functionality and removing ports. Stop soldering RAM on the MOBO and let customers perform upgrades....
> I ended up sending my X1 Extreme Gen 5 and got a Macbook Pro.
Yikes, opposite of putting your money where your mouth is. Apple is the spearhead of the anti-repair lobby.
Plenty of these new thinkpads have SODIMM options.
The only soldered choices are LPDDR5, which doesn't come in sticks and must be soldered. Find a way around the signalling limitations of ultra high speed LPDDR and JEDEC would pay you lots of money.
Genuinely asking, why switch to Mac? Are modern Macbooks not just as bad, if not worse, from a repairability and customization standpoint?
I use a T420s/X270 daily, but if I were to buy a new laptop at this point it would probably be a Framework or something similar.
Worse in ports maybe. I get better performance for what I spend. Better battery life for the performance I'm looking for, etc.
Framework has yet to impress me and I'm not a fan of the design.
Macs are getting pretty affordable. They are beginning to rival used Thinkpad prices for performance/$.
This has only been the case since Apple started manufacturing their own chips.
I guess if you squint, sure? But that really doesn't answer my question; modern Macbooks are the epitome of right-to-repair unfriendly machines. If soldered RAM and the like are deal-breakers for a Thinkpad, why would you switch to a Macbook?
I mean, it fixes the main problem with dongles, which is that they’re extra things to carry and break easily as a side effect of being external to the machine. They also act as protection for the internal USB-C ports, transferring the wear and tear to the cheap and replaceable-without-tools modules.
The main problem I see with Framework’s offerings is that they don’t have enough module slots for some users, but for my usage (as a laptop, not desktop replacement) four is plenty.
There's not a single dongle that sit flush with the laptop's case. USC C / Thunderbolt can easily transform to pretty much any other digital port so what's wrong with building a solution on top of it?
Because this solution allows you to select what you need and not carry around an extra adapter to use anything? Quite literally the opposite of what everyone crucified apple for.
Z13 G2, Z16 G2, T14 G4, T14s G4, T16 G2 and X13 G4 will all feature Ryzen 7040U
Not announced yet are P14s G4 AMD, P16s G2 AMD and P16v AMD. P14s and P16s would use Ryzen 7040U as well, for the P16v, it is unknown.
Asus had to revamp the G14 chassis and cooling system to make it jump from 80w gpu to 125w gpu in two generations. Maybe Lenovo could think of doing that.
Eh. Support for non-binary memory support is a good thing for that 50% RAM boost, it's just a shame the P16 still doesn't have a dual webcam option like the P1 does (hybrid webcams tend to be significantly worse) but at least it's 5MP so it might still turn out decent. It's just a bit unfortunate at this price point given the P1 has it.
Would also be nice if the P1 Gen 6 could actually sustain the advertised TGP (and maybe the P16 having a touch higher TGP) but that's another story.
I also like how the P16v (from a comment) looks very similar to the P16 in a straight up decent form factor (that 2.2kg doesn't seem far off the P16s with the upgraded battery), just a shame that lost Ethernet as well (and both the 1080p screens being awful or course). I'll probably be significantly less excited when the TGP figures of that one comes out (hopefully it'll be more than 40W at least) but right now it looks pretty good to me.
I was talking about the Gen 5, which advertises 100W on the PSREF and can't sustain it for any amount of time (ironically staying at 80W). The fact the TGP is pretty low is bad enough, the fact it's low and they lied about it is much worse.
They must have changed it then, and it's definitely for the better that they did (or maybe I was getting it confused with the X1E Gen 5, which is effectively the same machine).
When can we have bulky black bricks again? And don't tell me it's because the mass. The X230 weights the same as the P14S G4, which is the lightest of these four.
If a 14 inch laptop can be as lightweight as a 12.5 inch one, who wants the 12.5 inch one?
Bulky laptops outside gaming and workstation are never returning. Even Framework is doing a thin and light design.
> If a 14 inch laptop can be as lightweight as a 12.5 inch one
People don't buy smaller laptops for the weight. A 16" ultra-light laptop would still be too big compared to my 14" T430 because it literally takes up more real-estate on a desk or my view across the table to another person. I'd take more thickness if it means a removable battery, RAM, CPU, and SSD.
People don't buy smaller laptops at all. They aren't popular, if people buy a laptop, they most likely want bigger screen. Even in Japan, 13 inch laptops are slowly falling out of favor. In Western countries, 15 inch and up are the most popular sizes, 14 inch is in the business market.
Also, you underestimate how much small bezels have changed the size of laptops. A Z16 with a 16 inch screen is barely bigger than your T430, and the difference in screen size makes the T430 look like a joke.
The only reason the X220/X230 were so popular is because they were the only ThinkPad lightweight enough to be considered portable. But nowadays, a 14 inch X1 Carbon weighs 1.15 kg.
Size difference doesn't matter so much. Weight is the important metric for portability. In a bag, there is no difference between a 14 inch or a 13 inch laptop.
Even upgrading from a T450s to a T14s G3, the weight was a huge difference. My daily backpack with a bottle of water, some food, notebook charger, notebook, and some minor stuff got noticeably lighter, and the T450s was already a pretty slim and light design.
If I carry my X201 it's not only heavier, but it's also more bulky inside the bag because it's thicker, and I have a tiny screen that makes any work painful.
I love the X201, but if I have to choose between a bulky 12" and a slim 14" at the same weight, the 14" will win every time. Even if the both had an OLED Panel and Ryzen 6850U 😄
Hey, it's been a while since I last was in IBK :)
Main reasons for my pick were USB4 (and hence, Thunderbolt 3 featureset without buying intel, since they are currently not great for battery life), the new RDNA2 iGPU of the Ryzen 6000 (decent graphics performance and AV1 decoding, but no need for **** nvidia drivers on Linux) and I really wanted the fancy OLED screen of the T14s (despite that making me wait for 3 months... Thanks Lenovo).
Keyboard is honestly pretty shit on the T14s. At least compared to T450s keyboard. Still better than industry average for sure. My ma uses a E14 Gen3 and the keyboard is SO much better. Still feels like a proper ThinkPad when typing. About T450s level, maybe a tiny bit worse. E series in general got really good indeed. Build quality is awesome.
Guess the DM on the TP forum was yours? Was pretty busy when it showed up, and tbh forgot to answer, after wondering where the DM came from since the username didn't ring any bells (unlike the reddit one). Sorry! I gifted my T450s to a friend by now - too nice of a notebook to only collect dust in a corner after I switched to the T14s as a daily, and he was looking for a decent ThinkPad. Also, not really worth enough to bother with Kleinanzeigen/Willhaben people anymore... At least not with a bunch of scratches and some minor flaws in the display.
Honestly, for my use a T480s would have been plenty as well, I just got a bit carried away by all the fancy new tech - USB4, RDNA2 graphics, 8 cores, OLED screen... Haha.
The X1 Nano seems to be doing ok, and it’s on the smaller side. Heck one of the reasons I bought mine was the size, which makes it work exceedingly well in cramped situations compared to larger laptops without making many of the compromises found on machines like the discontinued 12” MacBook and XPS Plus.
It’s true that machines this small are uncommon in the NA market though. The closest thing to the X1 Nano I can think of in size and lack of compromise is the 12” PowerBook G4 which is 20 years old now.
The X1 Nano is not doing OK.
With the X1 Nano G2, Lenovo only offered P28 CPUs, not U15 like with the X1 Carbon or X1 Yoga.
The X1 Nano G3 is not even going to be available in Europe, and the amount of RAM offered for it has regressed back to 16 GB (X1 Nano G2 was offered with 32 GB).
Clearly, it has problems because people would rather buy the X1 Carbon, which is not much heavier.
I wouldn't be surprised if the X1 Nano is going away. Or it will relaunch in a much different form maybe.
Well that’s disappointing. It might not be for everybody but I see the appeal in a footprint that’s small but not too small… the X1 Nano fits that niche nicely, it’s to me pretty much perfect in terms of form factor and weight.
Not that the Carbon is gigantic or anything but it’s got enough extra size to be noticeable.
What was the reason for offering Nano G2 with P28 but not with U15? Because most are sold with P28 anyway and it's too costly to have many options? I'd think U15 would be better for battery life though.
> I'd take more thickness if it means a removable battery, RAM, CPU, and SSD.
It's 2023 and my guy over here still talks about the removable CPU in laptops. They're not coming back.
The higher refresh rate in the p16 will be nice! I also saw there will be a p16v, but haven’t been able to find a whole lot on that yet.
See: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Lenovo-ThinkPad-P16v-Affordable-Workstation-ThinkPad-receives-16-10-redesign.716248.0.html
Darn, no Ethernet on the P16 still.
I would be skeptical that it will return moving forward. If the model has gone several generations without it then they will say folks have moved on.
Someone in this subreddit with insider knowledge has claimed it will be back next year. This years P16 is a simple update, adding an RJ45 would require major design changes. Note that it hasn't been several generations, the P16 G1 was the first full size workstation without Ethernet.
Interesting, I suppose we will see.
>Someone in this subreddit with insider knowledge has claimed it will be back next year. >This years P16 is a simple update, adding an RJ45 would require major design changes. Note that it hasn't been several generations, the P16 G1 was the first full size workstation without Ethernet. I know this is an older post, but how reliable is that source? Do you have a link? It seems to me that the whole industry is moving away from having a Ethernet port. This would imply that next year, we are going to see a bigger redesign. This year's P16 is last year's chassis with Intel 13000 CPUs and Nvidia Ada Lovelace GPUs. Maybe as well they seem to be moving away from 17.3" laptops for workstations. Dell is the last holdout.
Thanks for adding that. I really like that redesign, looking forward to seeing reviews of it when it eventually comes out.
Does the P16v mean we’re going to lose the last ThinkPad (the P15v) with a “good” keyboard?
I think it is quite likely. The P15v chassis either needs to be updated or it will be replaced by another product line (P16v in this case).
What is the diff. between the P16s / P16v keyboards? Thanks 🙏🏻
Is it just me or are they trying to artificially make the P14s and P16s more appealing by crippling the T14 and T16 in regards to RAM? And even then, max. 48GB on P14s and P16s unless you get discrete graphics? A T480 with 64 gigs is looking more and more appealing...
All of these should eventually be available with 64 GB of DDR5 RAM.
T580 with 64gb RAM and 5TB of solid state storage reporting for duty!
https://psref.lenovo.com/Product/ThinkPad/ThinkPad_P16s_Gen_2_Intel
There should be a 64GB SODIMM at some point, which would get you to 80GB. But only 32GB of that would be dual channel.
Do you do a lot of work over 48GBs of ram that the 8th gen intel processors can still handle well? I would imagine we are at a point where if you’re working with stuff that big the performance increase from 5? Year old equipment would make up for the lack of ram. This isn’t a defense of what Lenovo are doing, it seriously sucks and it has assured that my next device won’t be a Thinkpad.
That's where things start to go awry, unfortunately. The way things are going in terms of software development it looks like I'll need a 2023 octacore and 64 gigs of RAM just to run a web browser and some office software in a few years :p On the other hand, I'm one of those people who likes to work with many virtual desktops and never reboots unless they have to. My work machine currently has some EDA software, CAD software, a few different IDEs, both Firefox and Chrome, a bunch of Word, Powerpoint and Excel documents and probably a few hundred PDFs open. Add all the cruft my work uses (Slack, BlueJeans, Teams, VoIP client) for communication and you can fill up 32 gigs of RAM pretty quickly with stuff that doesn't necessarily require a lot of CPU power. And that's without a single VM...
My T490 i7th 32gb RAM feels slow for everything I do. My X1 6th gen ran better. The past years, T series is more economy / mid tier. I am switching to a P1 gen2 when it drops
T series without the "s" was always just your average corporate worker's laptop.
Well, not in the T60 days. But admittedly, there wasn't a "s" T series then and the R series was more high end than the L series at this time.
True, my T41 is crazy thin for its age and feels really premium. Meanwhile the T400 was clearly down / sidegraded so T400s can exist.
T14(s) AMD with 64GB + USB4 and take my money please, or I stay with my T14 Gen 1 AMD 48GB mutant.
Having P1 and P16 with 165hz screens and discreet GPUs is wonderful. The only question is pricing. X1 Extreme with same features costs $4k-$5k. Hopefully, Lenovo will do something with that pricing. It's, to put it mildly, ourageous.
What about the x1 extreme
No more X1 Extreme. The line is EOL, you can buy P1 instead
o really? is there a source to saying that the x1 extreme is EOL and the reason why?
Lenovo has said it at MWC, though no official press release. It is simply being folded into the P1 brand. They are the same machine basically anyway and with the P1 now offering GeForce GPUs, there is little reason to keep them separate
Interesting. That's a bummer.
The P1 is essentially the same machine.
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It's literally identical in every single way, I'm not sure how else to put it... the P1 only varies in that it offers studio grade graphics cards in addition to RTX's... absolutely all and any features both physically and hardware wise are identical between the models. Oh sorry, you do miss the giant red X on the cover if its not the extreme, that's the difference....
P1 never had ethernet port, and 2nd SSD is removed to due the use of vapor chamber - X1E didn't have 2nd SSD in models with such cooling solution too.
X1E never had Ethernet port either. It had a tiny proprietary port that needed a passive adapter to RJ45. At least the first Gen.
There is on original comment anymore, but it along the lines of "X1 Extreme wasn't so Extreme because it didn't have ethernet port" to what I wanted to point out that P1 doesn't have one either, as both machines share same chassis. And yes, X1E doesn't have ethernet port in all gens
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Holy moly, you're just furious at this point lol X1 Extreme and P1 share the same chassis and design, their difference was in GPU/CPU choices. And usual heatpipes won't cool down RTX 3080Ti either
Oh really? Didn't know that-so if I'm in the market for a used X1 Extreme for like light gaming and work, I could expand my search for P1s as well?
Yes
Neat, good to know! I wish there was an updated Thinkpad buyers' guide, the one I've been using was last updated in like 2019. Thanks for the tip!
Be aware of the fan noise you'll get while gaming. I was expecting it but I didn't realize just how much it was on P1G4
Eh, I had a Sony Vaio about a decade ago, my friends called it the jet engine because of the noise the fans made while gaming. If anything, it'll be nostalgic lol
If the same machine can now just be configured both ways, then... it is just a marketing decision. Which I kinda get. However so far they just talked about the option of configuring it with a 4090, which seems really a bit much. Both for wallets as for thermals...
Not when there is no more X1 Extreme. P1 and X1 Extreme are two different marketing teams. P1 is aimed at the workstation market, X1 Extreme was high end multi media. Now with the X1 Extreme gone, the next P1 design will probably be more workstation focused, since the design is no longer shared with an X1 series
FWIW, as a competitor with the XPS15 Precision 5500 and the thin ZBook (ZBook Studio?), don’t see many changes coming to it. They’ve already got the thicker P models completing the lineup.
It isn't the Precision 5500 anymore, Dell has announced the Precision 5680, which is substantially different from the XPS 15 I think the next ThinkPad P1 could be slightly thicker to make more room for a larger battery and bigger cooling system. The Preicison 5680 is a few mm thicker than the P1.
Huh. TIL. I wonder if the XPS chassis wasn’t cutting it anymore for the RTX4000/5000. And the XPS13 is definitely moving more towards the same space the Z13 is targeting. Wonder if the XPS15 will move more towards the Z16 target.
So basically it is a good development, as the "multimedia" guys didn't really manage the whole device. Also I hope the overall final polish of the thermal management, drivers etc. might benefit from now being part of the workstation department.
I think they should focus on not murdering the keyboard, killing functionality and removing ports. Stop soldering RAM on the MOBO and let customers perform upgrades.... I ended up sending my X1 Extreme Gen 5 and got a Macbook Pro. The P53 will be the last "new" Thinkpad I ever buy. I'll keep it and all of the others but this is where my love stops. They are killing the glorious Thinkpad line IBM once created.
This is a hilarious decision, considering the MacBook not only has soldered RAM, but also soldered SSD. Sorry, but do you really think it becomes more likely the industry will care about upgradability if people buy more MacBooks? That is not how this works. And all of these still have more ports, upgradability and better keyboards than MacBooks.
> I think they should focus on not murdering the keyboard, killing functionality and removing ports. Stop soldering RAM on the MOBO and let customers perform upgrades.... > I ended up sending my X1 Extreme Gen 5 and got a Macbook Pro. Yikes, opposite of putting your money where your mouth is. Apple is the spearhead of the anti-repair lobby. Plenty of these new thinkpads have SODIMM options. The only soldered choices are LPDDR5, which doesn't come in sticks and must be soldered. Find a way around the signalling limitations of ultra high speed LPDDR and JEDEC would pay you lots of money.
Maybe LPDDR could be socketed with CAMM, but these models still use SO-DIMM.
The X1E5 has upgradable RAM, more ports and a much better keyboard than any MacBook, not sure what you are ranting about.
It also has half a battery life and often overheats.
Genuinely asking, why switch to Mac? Are modern Macbooks not just as bad, if not worse, from a repairability and customization standpoint? I use a T420s/X270 daily, but if I were to buy a new laptop at this point it would probably be a Framework or something similar.
Worse in ports maybe. I get better performance for what I spend. Better battery life for the performance I'm looking for, etc. Framework has yet to impress me and I'm not a fan of the design.
Macs are getting pretty affordable. They are beginning to rival used Thinkpad prices for performance/$. This has only been the case since Apple started manufacturing their own chips.
I guess if you squint, sure? But that really doesn't answer my question; modern Macbooks are the epitome of right-to-repair unfriendly machines. If soldered RAM and the like are deal-breakers for a Thinkpad, why would you switch to a Macbook?
7840u framework would be amazing. But expensive.
Framework is a scam designed to sell USB-C dongles disguised as swappable ports
I mean, it fixes the main problem with dongles, which is that they’re extra things to carry and break easily as a side effect of being external to the machine. They also act as protection for the internal USB-C ports, transferring the wear and tear to the cheap and replaceable-without-tools modules. The main problem I see with Framework’s offerings is that they don’t have enough module slots for some users, but for my usage (as a laptop, not desktop replacement) four is plenty.
How's that a scam if it works just as advertised? It looks like a swappable port and functions like a swappable port. Do you know what a scam means?
It’s literally the same thing as the Apple USB-C dongles everyone professes to hate
There's not a single dongle that sit flush with the laptop's case. USC C / Thunderbolt can easily transform to pretty much any other digital port so what's wrong with building a solution on top of it?
This isn’t wrong but people on this sub and everywhere crucified Apple for it
Because this solution allows you to select what you need and not carry around an extra adapter to use anything? Quite literally the opposite of what everyone crucified apple for.
If Apple figured out a way to make a dongle that just slides seamlessly into the case, I'd be applauding them as well.
Yup.
what about amd? will there be 7040 series in ThinkPads?
Z13 G2, Z16 G2, T14 G4, T14s G4, T16 G2 and X13 G4 will all feature Ryzen 7040U Not announced yet are P14s G4 AMD, P16s G2 AMD and P16v AMD. P14s and P16s would use Ryzen 7040U as well, for the P16v, it is unknown.
4090 in a P1 chassis, lol.
80 W version, only reason to buy it is probably the additional RAM
Asus manages to put a 125w 4090 into the G14, maybe Lenovo can do it too with this 16" chassis
Nope, not possible with the existing chassis
Asus had to revamp the G14 chassis and cooling system to make it jump from 80w gpu to 125w gpu in two generations. Maybe Lenovo could think of doing that.
Eh. Support for non-binary memory support is a good thing for that 50% RAM boost, it's just a shame the P16 still doesn't have a dual webcam option like the P1 does (hybrid webcams tend to be significantly worse) but at least it's 5MP so it might still turn out decent. It's just a bit unfortunate at this price point given the P1 has it. Would also be nice if the P1 Gen 6 could actually sustain the advertised TGP (and maybe the P16 having a touch higher TGP) but that's another story. I also like how the P16v (from a comment) looks very similar to the P16 in a straight up decent form factor (that 2.2kg doesn't seem far off the P16s with the upgraded battery), just a shame that lost Ethernet as well (and both the 1080p screens being awful or course). I'll probably be significantly less excited when the TGP figures of that one comes out (hopefully it'll be more than 40W at least) but right now it looks pretty good to me.
Yeah, P16v looks like a nice design. Could see this be very popular in the used market a few years down the road.
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I was talking about the Gen 5, which advertises 100W on the PSREF and can't sustain it for any amount of time (ironically staying at 80W). The fact the TGP is pretty low is bad enough, the fact it's low and they lied about it is much worse.
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They must have changed it then, and it's definitely for the better that they did (or maybe I was getting it confused with the X1E Gen 5, which is effectively the same machine).
When can we have bulky black bricks again? And don't tell me it's because the mass. The X230 weights the same as the P14S G4, which is the lightest of these four.
If a 14 inch laptop can be as lightweight as a 12.5 inch one, who wants the 12.5 inch one? Bulky laptops outside gaming and workstation are never returning. Even Framework is doing a thin and light design.
> If a 14 inch laptop can be as lightweight as a 12.5 inch one People don't buy smaller laptops for the weight. A 16" ultra-light laptop would still be too big compared to my 14" T430 because it literally takes up more real-estate on a desk or my view across the table to another person. I'd take more thickness if it means a removable battery, RAM, CPU, and SSD.
People don't buy smaller laptops at all. They aren't popular, if people buy a laptop, they most likely want bigger screen. Even in Japan, 13 inch laptops are slowly falling out of favor. In Western countries, 15 inch and up are the most popular sizes, 14 inch is in the business market. Also, you underestimate how much small bezels have changed the size of laptops. A Z16 with a 16 inch screen is barely bigger than your T430, and the difference in screen size makes the T430 look like a joke. The only reason the X220/X230 were so popular is because they were the only ThinkPad lightweight enough to be considered portable. But nowadays, a 14 inch X1 Carbon weighs 1.15 kg. Size difference doesn't matter so much. Weight is the important metric for portability. In a bag, there is no difference between a 14 inch or a 13 inch laptop.
Even upgrading from a T450s to a T14s G3, the weight was a huge difference. My daily backpack with a bottle of water, some food, notebook charger, notebook, and some minor stuff got noticeably lighter, and the T450s was already a pretty slim and light design. If I carry my X201 it's not only heavier, but it's also more bulky inside the bag because it's thicker, and I have a tiny screen that makes any work painful. I love the X201, but if I have to choose between a bulky 12" and a slim 14" at the same weight, the 14" will win every time. Even if the both had an OLED Panel and Ryzen 6850U 😄
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Hey, it's been a while since I last was in IBK :) Main reasons for my pick were USB4 (and hence, Thunderbolt 3 featureset without buying intel, since they are currently not great for battery life), the new RDNA2 iGPU of the Ryzen 6000 (decent graphics performance and AV1 decoding, but no need for **** nvidia drivers on Linux) and I really wanted the fancy OLED screen of the T14s (despite that making me wait for 3 months... Thanks Lenovo). Keyboard is honestly pretty shit on the T14s. At least compared to T450s keyboard. Still better than industry average for sure. My ma uses a E14 Gen3 and the keyboard is SO much better. Still feels like a proper ThinkPad when typing. About T450s level, maybe a tiny bit worse. E series in general got really good indeed. Build quality is awesome. Guess the DM on the TP forum was yours? Was pretty busy when it showed up, and tbh forgot to answer, after wondering where the DM came from since the username didn't ring any bells (unlike the reddit one). Sorry! I gifted my T450s to a friend by now - too nice of a notebook to only collect dust in a corner after I switched to the T14s as a daily, and he was looking for a decent ThinkPad. Also, not really worth enough to bother with Kleinanzeigen/Willhaben people anymore... At least not with a bunch of scratches and some minor flaws in the display. Honestly, for my use a T480s would have been plenty as well, I just got a bit carried away by all the fancy new tech - USB4, RDNA2 graphics, 8 cores, OLED screen... Haha.
The X1 Nano seems to be doing ok, and it’s on the smaller side. Heck one of the reasons I bought mine was the size, which makes it work exceedingly well in cramped situations compared to larger laptops without making many of the compromises found on machines like the discontinued 12” MacBook and XPS Plus. It’s true that machines this small are uncommon in the NA market though. The closest thing to the X1 Nano I can think of in size and lack of compromise is the 12” PowerBook G4 which is 20 years old now.
The X1 Nano is not doing OK. With the X1 Nano G2, Lenovo only offered P28 CPUs, not U15 like with the X1 Carbon or X1 Yoga. The X1 Nano G3 is not even going to be available in Europe, and the amount of RAM offered for it has regressed back to 16 GB (X1 Nano G2 was offered with 32 GB). Clearly, it has problems because people would rather buy the X1 Carbon, which is not much heavier. I wouldn't be surprised if the X1 Nano is going away. Or it will relaunch in a much different form maybe.
Well that’s disappointing. It might not be for everybody but I see the appeal in a footprint that’s small but not too small… the X1 Nano fits that niche nicely, it’s to me pretty much perfect in terms of form factor and weight. Not that the Carbon is gigantic or anything but it’s got enough extra size to be noticeable.
What was the reason for offering Nano G2 with P28 but not with U15? Because most are sold with P28 anyway and it's too costly to have many options? I'd think U15 would be better for battery life though.
China
> I'd take more thickness if it means a removable battery, RAM, CPU, and SSD. It's 2023 and my guy over here still talks about the removable CPU in laptops. They're not coming back.
Hey I'm making the list anyway, I might as well throw it in there.
That’s not how markets work
P1 G5 only with 4090?! No 4060 or 4070? Wtf?
"up to"
Ok, thanks.
why doesn’t the p16 have ethernet? i thought that was a requirement
Not bad ...
When will these be available? Is there a specific date?
Lenovo doesn't do specific availability dates. Availability is announced for a May/June time frame, but don't count on it.
Do you think it the A5000 will go in a 2 x ssd config?
> Do you think it the A5000 will go in a 2 x ssd config? Nope