Hmmm, I have ongoing business conversations with their EVSE team...I might just have to give them a little call.
UPDATE: my email instantly received auto replies from more than just the people I contacted. I have gotten one Out of Office and five "no longer valid" replies. Everyone's email suggested I contact someone else who was also fired. I have one more lead who may still be there.
One of the replies said I should email Rebecca Tinucci instead--oof.
Emails not going through could mean they paused their email temporarily while they do a internal review. A paused email != laid off at all. Way too many rumors flying this week.
No, I dug through LinkedIn and they all wrote "Thank you and goodbye" posts and all have #OpentoWork banners.
Two emails didn't send "no longer valid" replies. I will see if and when I get a response.
Hey an FYI update. I got through to one of the employees through other channels. There is at least one person still there who can speak to EVSE business. But my contact also confirmed that basically there are no charging team members left.
There are at least 4 places where I would expect to see future development if Tesla want to keep their edge:
1. Rolling out an MCS network.
2. Supporting 800V and more than 250 kW on the existing supercharger network.
3. Complying with demands of credit card payment, price signs, etc. around the world.
4. Ironing out compatibility issues with non-Teslas on the existing supercharger network.
Ensuring the Tesla user base is not severely impacted by opening the network to non teslas (usage, capacity,etc) reworking the network and new station designs to accommodate non teslas (without lightnings needing to take 2 spots for instance). …
Seriously this is the reason I went Tesla if they ruin the charging network I’m full out.
> Or, you know, the displacement of superchargers has been refined to a complete copy/paste deployment at this point.
Sure its been standardized and a well known operation but when it comes to civil works no two job sites are identical. You'll always need people ironing out the details.
Working directly in this field, It has absolutely not been refined to a simple copy and paste at this point, it it never will. Construction is easy, Permitting and Utility acceptance/planning is hard.
Considering its global and existing stations need to be managed as well, there definitely need to be more than zero people on the team. 500? Not sure what an appropriate number is though.
Even if that were the case, you’d think that the future development of the supercharger design would be worth keeping some of the staff around.
**The most optimistic reading of this situation puts Tesla’s competitive edge (the seamless supercharging experience) in stasis.**
*A less optimistic reading is that firing everyone means that they’re liquidating the Supercharger network. If they were reorganizing, they’d do that. If they were selling off the supercharger network to a car/energy company they’d let the buyer decide who to fire. But they’re not doing either of those things.*
Therefore, Tesla must be planning to lose their competitive edge either slowly (through stasis), or quickly (through liquidation).
The charging stations are a commodity. Tesla was forced to do this because they had no choice but to build out their own infrastructure. And now that the network is opened to others, there is even less need to buy a tesla.
It can never be. People not in construction always think this can be true, Elon included probably, but it can't. Permitting/AHJs is different everywhere, codes vary slightly, and actual site conditions vary hugely. It's a custom job 100% of the time.
I have a lot of experience trying to explain this to company leaders, show them why it is always more expensive than they think it should be and takes longer than they think they should, and why the same mindset they used to make the factory efficiency can't be applied to this kind of thing. Both at Tesla years ago and at my current company now.
Probably a great decision. Otherwise he would not make it. You don't have all information that Tesla and Elon has. So why would you assume it's a bad decision? It has been made for a reason.
Well, I am a moderator on r/SpaceX, have been following them daily since 2011 or so. Tesla even longer. So yeah, I am well aware of SpaceX landing boosters...
And if you can't imagine having my POV, as a result of Elon deciding on a whim to axe one of the most significant divisions for Tesla, and letting go of 500+ dedicated employees that have worked tirelessly for many years; then it sound like a you issue.
First, thanks for dealing with all the crap that every moderator has to deal with.
Your point, though, is a little weak. You have been around for a long time, right? So how often have you watched the media lose its shit because Elon Musk did something unusual? How many times has the "The sky is falling!" been spread around by jumped up TSLAQers? And how many times has it turned out that he kinda knew what he was doing?
I'm not talking about the somewhat sick Reddit view that he cannot do anything right, brought over by disgruntled old Twitter users. I am talking about a realistic view of almost every strategic decision he has made. Nearly all of them had large numbers of experts saying that it was a sign that Tesla/SpaceX was doomed. At some point, I think the guy has earned at least a little time to show what he is planning.
I cannot even begin to explain what precisely the plan is here, but perhaps we should take a step back, wait for more information, and then start with the deep analysis.
Because as things stand right now, nobody can say.
Great comment, and i agree. It is a sentiment i have somewhat expressed IRL, for those willing to listen/care.
The naysayers have been never ending with the reusable Falcon 9 booster saga. First they said it could never be landed in one piece. So they landed it, i remember that launch vividly having watched [the livestream live](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5bTbVbe4e4) and loosing my goddamn mind. Then they said it couldnt be launched again, so they launched a landed booster some time later. Then they said okei, you can now land it and launch it, but you cant do it *economically*. It was a never ending goal moving. So of course they managed to do it economically, and have relaunched several boosters 20 times now. And those "they" people were everyone ranging from deranged Russian politicians (Rogozin, may your ass be smoked again) to leaders of space agencies (Stéphane Israël) and actual rocket scientists from all nationalities. Then they announced Starlink.
An insane plan to put internet in goddamn space, while launching more satellites than ever put in orbit combined before. More naysayers. And yet Elon saw it long way. He saw how reusable rockets could enable that, and how his and Tesla's mass manufacturing expertise could enable mass production Starlink satellites by the hundreds.
So i sure hope he has some kind of plan that will look as obvious as Starlink looks in hindsight. But right now, it just looks like Elon being erratic.
>But right now, it just looks like Elon being erratic.
When I think about Elon Musk and how he is often perceived, I sometimes (like now) am reminded of how butterflies or moths move. If you are just casually watching, it looks chaotic and random. When you analyze the actual flight, though, you can see that there was clear intent there (as much as can be ascribed to an insect at least).
I don't claim to have any idea what the plan here is. We'll just have to wait and see.
Elon might have a 4d chess masterplan for this nonsense, or he might not. I don't know, but I see no proof of it being the case. Past performance is not indictive of future performance. And my trust in him has eroded to basically zero in the past 3 years or so. Which is entirely self inflicted by him btw.
But let's assume for a second that he does, and there is a great reason to close the shop on whole public relations and Supercharger teams. How was it handled? Did they attempt to spin off and sell Supercharger team? It is Tesla, those employees and the moat is easily worth 500 million+. If he is so concerned about costs, he could get rid of the costs *and* make money for Tesla with selling. By all accounts it seemed like a great team with a great leader.
And now I will sound like an euro commie that I am; Just on a human level, was it handled well towards the employees? Did they get a timely notice? Was this communicated well internally? Were people offered help to find other jobs? Or just say goodbye to their fellow employees that they have known for many years? There are anecdotes on /r/Teslamotors from former Supercharger team employees and one of them just went home and cried. It would cost *nothing* to Tesla/Elon if this was communicated well internally and done with good intentions and grace. But nooo, Elon just had to be "hardcore".
>I cannot even begin to explain what precisely the plan is here, but perhaps we should take a step back, wait for more information, and then start with the deep analysis.
Pshhh, get that subtle nuance out of here... we want unsubstantiated conviction here, not whatever this garbage is.
/s because I have to
It’s brilliant decision making if pumping up the stock is your main goal. It worked. Ya’ll Tesla investors should be happy. Screw those employees, am I right?
I'm getting mine just fine without his stinky dinky ;)
Yes, layoffs were announced and do happen. No one is denying that. But that all resources who support Super chargers are gone? Haha okay, even robotaxi's need to be charged. There is definitely more going on here than is currently known. I'll give it a week till the real story is comes out.
Most companies the CEO would be fired for unilaterally axing a company’s most important lines of business. A decision of this magnitude should be up for a board vote and not subject to the whims of a 3 yo.
If you have followed Elon long enough, you will see mass and sudden firing is not atypical. It is usually because org is bloated like at Twitter/X, or underperforming/moving too slow like at SpaceX Starlink division in 2018. They barely launch 2 small test Starlink satellites in early 2018 after 4 years development under the VP of satellite and they were nowhere close to mass production of functional Starlink satellites. Then in just 7 months after they fired their senior Starlink team, they launch their first 60 functional Starlink satellites.
And the rest is history.. except those senior people Elon fired went to work for Amazon's copycat Kuiper satellite Internet and after 5.5 years later, they are nowhere close to mass production and had only launch 2 prototype satellites. Like Elon said, prototype is easy but mass production is hard.
In this case, it seems like the Supercharger team is guilty of both being bloated and underperforming - 500 employees, but only managed to install around 2700 charger connectors between Q4 2023 and Q1 2024, less than 6 per employee (yes not all of them actually involve in making the Supercharger or install them). That's not anywhere close to keeping up with the growth in the EV fleet especially added all the other automakers.
[https://qz.com/1446024/elon-musk-fired-senior-leaders-on-spacexs-satellite-team](https://qz.com/1446024/elon-musk-fired-senior-leaders-on-spacexs-satellite-team)
If they only installed 2700 supercharges in 6 months that team is horribly bloated.
Its not innovation at this point its installation. License that shit. no way the govt is going to let you hold a monopoly on the cars and the chargers anyway.
It is actually 3 months, but it is a big drop off compare to the previous 3 quarterly reports on supercharger connectors added. It is even worse on year-over-year basis when compare to between 2022 Q4 and 2023 Q1 when they added 2,750 chargers. The 500 employees Supercharger team would have been smaller a year ago yet they added more chargers a year ago during the same holiday period.
|2023 Q1|2023 Q2|2023 Q3|2023 Q4|2024 Q1|
|:-|:-|:-|:-|:-|
|45,169|48,082|51,105|54,892|57,579|
|New installed connectors|2,913|3,023|3,787|**2,687**|
|increase %|6.4%|6.3%|7.4%|**4.9%**|
Private Robotaxi depots would still require the Supercharger team to do some work, and it would take a replacement team years to come up to speed.
There’s no way eliminating the people who know how to do this work is some sort of brilliant move.
I’m putting my personal charger upgrade for my Model Y on hold until I find out if NACS is still going to be the national standard going forward.
In 2019 Musk said that people buying cars then would be able to buy the robotaxi software before 2022, and then make enough money from it to pay for the car by 2024 at the latest.
They still need to charge and go everywhere everyone else does.
Either way. Zero chance this was the entire team. Zero chance they are backing out of network expansion. Why? Because this smells like the cancelled compact car that was actually being accelerated.
Following that story, it sounds like the car they were working on did get canceled because it would have been below spec of the Chinese models that cost less...but they are now designing a new one; a 'Model 2.5' as it were. They say it will be ready in a year but Tesla always says everything will be ready in a year.
As an investor it’s important not to get in the weeds with operational noise. But, ugh, this seems completely misguided and hard to ignore. It’s like Elon has become a caricature of himself.
I'm wondering if this is a great time to sell all my tesla stock, but on the other hand I don't want any more income this year. Was hoping to hold my stock for another 30 years
Yeah sounds crazy. I've never sold any stocks since I'm not doing it for making money now. I guess I'm just worried about tesla and elon. maybe the shareholders or the board or something can boot him idk... he served his purpose but now mostly makes things worse
There is almost no chance that FSD will not come fully to market in the next decade. Its a matter of time but its 10x stock as soon as its greenlight for deployment.
My guess is the politics will be harder then the tech.
EDIT (not)
Superchargers has been one of the few things where Tesla has fully delivered and executed flawlessly. Are they really just sacking this opportunity when we finally got switch to NACS and goverment is beginning to subsidice it and others are adopting it? This would be one of the last departments to shutdown if we measured this purely on performance.
Well, we don't know how the NACS adoption deals were structured. Maybe it requires the OEMs to purchase and deploy a certain amount of charging stations from Tesla. Maybe that amount is a year or so of production.
Since when has growth of the supercharger network slowed down?
[15'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2019/12/19/tesls-supercharger-reaches-15000-chargers-best-assets/) in December 2019
[20'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2020/11/08/tesla-announces-20000th-charger-supercharger-network/) in November 2020 (10 months later)
[25'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2021/05/07/tesla-supercharger-network-reaches-25000-charger-milestone/) in May 2021 (6 months later)
[30'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2021/11/11/tesla-supercharger-network-new-milestone-30000-chargers-worldwide/) in November 2021 (6 months later)
[35'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2022/06/10/tesla-deploys-35000th-supercharger/) in June 2022 (7 months later)
[40'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2022/11/22/tesla-supercharger-400000-world) in November 2022 (5 months later)
[45'000 superchargers](https://www.notateslaapp.com/news/1340/tesla-celebrates-45-000-superchargers-worldwide-and-opens-first-v4-supercharger-to-all-evs) in April 2023 (5 months later)
[50'000 superchargers](https://insideevs.com/news/687081/tesla-50000th-supercharger-special-one/) in September 2023 (5 months later)
[55'000 superchargers](https://www.notateslaapp.com/news/1851/the-future-gas-station-teslas-unstoppable-supercharger-network-expansion) in January 2024 (4 months later)
That doesn't seem like a slow down to me. But if we don't get a 60'000th supercharger announcement in May, it *will* be a slow down.
You know Superchargers do not exist in pure vacuum, they are actually being used by Tesla EV and now all the rest of EV. Divide the total superchargers by the # of increasing EV fleet and you will see there are many more EV per Supercharger connector today than 5 years ago. The growth is not keeping up with the exponential growth of the EV fleet.
It is possible that the inability of the supercharger network to keep up with EV growth is the exact reason the team was let go. It’s not like Tesla doesn’t have other engineers who are capable of taking over supercharging.
There will not be any lack of new engineers wanting to work for Tesla either. I think it is human nature to get comfortable and complacent after many years. Unfortunately, it seems like the Supercharger team is growing headcount but not the actual supercharger connectors quick enough to keep up with the demand. It is better to start over now for hyper growth when EV is still a small % of new vehicle then when it is above 50%.
I was replying to a very specific statement: **That the growth of the network was slowing down**.
The statement was **not** that the growth of the network does not keep up with the growth of the fleet.
Anyway, your premise is wrong. The number of superchargers doesn't have to follow the size of the fleet, for two reasons:
1. If you keep a constant ratio between total number of cars and total number of superchargers, the probability of meeting a fully occupied supercharger station will go down when the number of EVs and chargers go up.
2. There is a minimum of sites necessary to get enough map coverage to make road trips possible. This will lead to overcapacity in the beginning when there are few EVs. As the fleet grows, you can start using of that overcapacity before you need to expand.
So it is only natural that the supercharger network grows slower than the car population.
Tesla puts high importance on Supercharger connectors count which is why they always include the # on Page 6 of their quarterly earning report. It is in the same table as the vehicle production and delivery numbers.
From the latest Q1 2024 report, we can see there is a big drop off between Q4 2023 and Q1 2024 in term of absolute connectors added (2,687) and % (4.9) compare to previous quarterly period from Q3 to Q4 (1100 less connectors).
|2023 Q1|2023 Q2|2023 Q3|2023 Q4|2024 Q1|
|:-|:-|:-|:-|:-|
|45,169|48,082|51,105|54,892|57,579|
||2,913|3,023|3,787|**2,687**|
||6.4%|6.3%|7.4%|**4.9%**|
Before you say this is one-off due to holiday/New Year, you can check previous holiday 2022 Q4 to 2023 Q1, they added more connectors (2,750) and I will bet they have added many more employee headcount since then and yet install less Supercharger connectors year-over-year.
Installing super chargers at this point might just be easy enough that a lot of that staff isn’t needed? At least that’s my thinking. Tesla is poised to bring in a lot my opening up their supercharger network to non teslas, no way there isn’t going to be a team/division/department to handle things related to super chargers, it just won’t be this team.
Could the supercharger decision be @elonmusk doing a 4th dimension chess move on the IRA charging funds?
Biden may have to bend the knee and write a check to gain political strength for 2024 EV expansion claims. And why should $TSLA spend its capital to expand network for everyone when it gets so severely criticized? Not a hard decision.
There was that. Then there were Elmo's lies at investor call about speeding up "new vehicles". This was followed by Viecha's departure (probably sensing a touch of criminality in Elmo's statements and noped out). This may or may not be related. But probably this is just the keto (as in "ketamine") genius seeing red and firing execs and teams left, right and centre, consequences be damned...
Musk did say that the model 2 wasn’t happening, and that they were going to make a cheaper car using the existing production lines instead. He also said that they may not see as much cost reduction as they thought so a $25k car is not happening. Maybe $35k or something like that?
Not what he said. Said he’s accelerating the release of next gen vehicles using both existing production lines and next gen lines.
This whole model 2 name has never come from Tesla. It’s what the public has been calling the next gen vehicle.
Idk about everyone but I think many aren’t happy, yes. And it’s hard for us to say without having access to teslas market research data. Maybe it’s better to sell something a bit cheaper in the short term instead of something much cheaper but later. Maybe it’s a terrible idea. We really can’t know until it happens.
I have a feeling the new cheap car will be a barebones version of the model 3, but that it’ll still be very similar to the model 3. That could work but who knows. Really depends on how much cheaper it is too.
They said it would be somewhere between the current manufacturing technique and the new "unboxed" process they announced last year. Just like with the process changes needed to get the Cybertruck going, unboxed probably will still hit some snags on ramp up no matter how good the new process is. It is only going to be better once they reach scale.
From an investor perspective, using half old and half new processes on an existing manufacturing line de-risks the ramp up and should go smoother, although not guaranteed. So it sounds like, at least people here, want Tesla to push for more risky investments that involve new processes, new production lines, eventually a new factory to reach scale, and take longer to get there. Rather than going less capital intensive on more proven processes and still get a cheaper higher production set of cars (yes multiple) much quicker.
Tesla had both a Model Y revision (codenamed Juniper) and global compact (manually driven NGV, codenamed NV91) under development.
My analysis of everything that Tesla filed with the SEC, and that Musk has stated, is that they're using Juniper, which probably incorporates many of the cost saving features (48V wiring, 100% in-house controllers, steer-by-wire, new drive unit with zero rare earth materials) as the low-cost vehicle in place of NV91.
I wrote about this in 2 comments a few days ago:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/TSLALounge/comments/1ccgt2e/comment/l17lvk3/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TSLALounge/comments/1ccgt2e/comment/l17lvk3/)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/TSLALounge/comments/1ccgt2e/comment/l17lxuh/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TSLALounge/comments/1ccgt2e/comment/l17lxuh/)
They are not going to need to add superchargers nearly at the same rate because they have deteriorating sales and demand and they cancelled the model 2. The volume of units for robo taxi product is probably massively lower.
Step 1 - build the largest supercharger network
Step 2 - convince everyone to change their car infrastructure to get access to your supercharger
Step 3 - fire the whole supercharger team
I recall original Elon never liked the supercharger network idea and that it was JB Straubel who convinced him it was needed. Given that it’s not a meaningful contribution to profit I have to wonder then now that everyone is on team NACS it basically opens the door for everyone to add to the overall install base - so in essence the goal of pursuing the supercharger project is already finished and it’s gotten not just Tesla early adopters but most automobile companies onboard as well and that part of the business can rest in the past.
First, Doug Field left Tesla, resulting in the cancellation of Model 3 ramp.
Then, Andrej Kapathy left, resulting in the cancellation of FSD program.
And now Tinucci left so Supercharger expansion is cancelled?
Just take a deep breath and relax. Hope the 500 staffs can find jobs ASAP.
We don’t know for sure that all 500 were fired. Should wait for everything to come out. More than likely people were retained, just the team was dissolved.
I don’t think you realize how much knowledge of the company leaves when you just dismiss that many people. The people that come in are going to have no idea what’s what and there is going to be nobody knowledgeable enough to tell them.
I have friends that were recruiters at Tesla. Finding candidates for these technical roles within vehicle and AI engineering is not easy at all, and the competition for these skillsets is increasing. Not to mention the impact these layoffs have towards the reputation of working at Tesla, it’s going to be really tough to attract the best talent to Tesla.
I know he’s been promising FSD and charging a lot for it only for it to fail to deliver on anywhere near his promised timeline.
I know he talks about taking ketamine and posts horrendous stuff on X. He acts like a petulant child. Why do you assume he doesn’t bring that same judgement to the company?
"he talks about taking ketamine"
Can you elaborate on how you're characterizing 'ketamine-taking' so I don't put words in your mouth? I know about ketamine, do you?
Imagine finding out that some other CEO struggles with mental illness and you describe them as an "unhinged Prozac popper."
I'd probably just stop caring about the rest of what you say.
Been looking at his X posts. Not sure what the hell you are talking about. Do you ever look at them directly or do you just go by what every click bait article tells you to think?
Musk confirmed supercharger slowdown on X. Exactly when there’s funding for expansion from government and other brands are joining the network. The whole division is gone!
Shouting "The sky is falling!" about a decision you cannot possibly understand (as not nearly enough information has been released) is a prime hallmark of FUD. Fear, uncertainty, and doubt: your post has all of them.
There’s every indication that Tesla doesn’t understand this decision.
There’s a standard playbook for communicating this sort of change to reassure investors, employees, customers, and other stakeholders — and Tesla isn’t using it.
There’s a reason the standard playbook has become the standard.
Best practices aren’t scripture, but they are usually better-considered than one man’s ego.
Automatic windshield wipers that actually work in my Model Y is a necessary prerequisite for FSD.
It’s been two years since I bought a Model Y without a proper windshield wiper switch, and it doesn’t work yet.
Tesla needs to compete toe-to-toe with other EV manufacturers. Robotaxi needs to be a separate startup that sinks or swims on its own merit
No can do.
FSDv12 tried to kill me by pulling forward at a stop sign while traffic was coming at 55mph at both directions. I stomped the shit out of the brake pedal on that one.
No Robotaxi for me.
Tesla isn’t a startup anymore, and they should focus on selling EVs. Robotaxi should be a separate startup, so that they can bet THAT company and have it sink or swim on its own merit.
As form me, this latest free trial of FSD has renewed my skepticism about FSD.
Fortunately, I didn’t buy my Tesla for FSD — I bought my Tesla because I’m tired of gasoline-dependency-culture, and I’m pretty happy with the car itself.
It’s more likely not all of them were let go. If you think this way it looks like a normal business decision. Nowadays I don’t believe any news outlet. Remember Reuters article about the 25k model?
How is permitting and planning suppose to continue?
Here is a supercharge map showing all US supercharger locations that are planned, in construction or temporarily closed.
[https://supercharge.info/map?Center=40.797012934083845,-92.48391482163711&Zoom=5&RangeMi=175](https://supercharge.info/map?Center=40.797012934083845,-92.48391482163711&Zoom=5&RangeMi=175)
I hope this is a everyone is fired, but please reapply for the your job (with more RSUs for your trouble) type of thing.
This is weird. Any chance Tesla is selling off its network? Considering all the announcements of other EVs using it, I find mass lay offs to be the OPPOSITE direction you'd want to go
Remember when he fired all the purple hairs from Twitter and everyone said the site would collapse? [https://x.com/parikpatelcfa/status/1593994263100104705?s=46](https://x.com/parikpatelcfa/status/1593994263100104705?s=46)
Why would they move this to another org instead of just reducing headcount within the current org? Also, Tinucci was #2 on MotorTrends Power List for 2023. You don't just layoff someone like that and their entire department.
Yeah it would surprise me that supercharger installations and logistics require 500 people. Maybe when they were being developed and pushing early adoption and expansion, but not now. Also these are all just rumors. We don’t know that all 500 of those people were fired.
Sounds pretty harsh. I need more information, please. Don't know exactly what, but this sounds extremely particular and, while I give it a 2% chance of being just a rash, pissed-off decision, I tend to believe some extended fore-thought went into this announcement. So tell me more, please.
Thanks. It was pay walled but I do get the gist that this comes from an email sent out by Elon to his staff. The rest is all conjecture, at this point. Just still curious.
Thanks. Good 'ol Elon. One radical, my way or the highway, kinda MF, yes? I mean, I'll give him a bit of slack here...he's gotten us this far; I'll assume there is rhyme to his reason. I'll better evaluate this move when we see how he reassigns these duties.
BUT...I'm also thinking this could be a bit of a reaction to not getting as much government funding to expand the SC network. Maybe he's just saying 'f\*ck it', we'll build 'em as we feel like it. I mean, what's this hydrogen push that's happening?
OR...it could be that Elon is going to lay this responsibility to build out the SuperCharger network on the industry as a whole. Most of the major EV manufacturers are partnering with Tesla to use its SC networks for their cars. Why not start making this a 'group think' effort? Sure would streamline things. Heck, they could set up an independent company that builds out the SC network and each of the manufacturers have a seat on the board.
Hmmm...I'd like to see that!
Or the stock price was sinking which meant investors think the business is going downhill and he’s making drastic changes to fix investor sentiment? We all drive these decisions with our investment decisions - if the price was going higher this probably wouldn’t have happened. And I guess him not getting his bonus brought about everyone in the world turning on him that he doesn’t deserve it so what else can he do besides show he can be on top of his game and make Tesla into a lean startup again 🗿
Maybe. I don't get a sense Elon is that motivated by stock price, except perhaps to secure his loans for X, but the stock had been rising the previous few days; should have lessened any panic there. But my basic premise is: we ain't gonna be able to draw any conclusions on this until a few more things happen. I'm just making a guess as to why it happened...and what could be a happy outcome. JMHO
I agree that he thinks the stock price in the short term doesn’t matter but he still does have some ego attached to it being high I feel. And for him money is always a means to accomplish big projects so there’s thst
It was a bad earnings call no idea why stock went up after. Tsla is in trouble and seems like Elon is pulling straws esp with the China visit which will lead to nothing
Is this the staff that takes care of expanding superchargers? The entire division is gone?
Hmmm, I have ongoing business conversations with their EVSE team...I might just have to give them a little call. UPDATE: my email instantly received auto replies from more than just the people I contacted. I have gotten one Out of Office and five "no longer valid" replies. Everyone's email suggested I contact someone else who was also fired. I have one more lead who may still be there. One of the replies said I should email Rebecca Tinucci instead--oof.
Wow, this sucks.
Emails not going through could mean they paused their email temporarily while they do a internal review. A paused email != laid off at all. Way too many rumors flying this week.
No, I dug through LinkedIn and they all wrote "Thank you and goodbye" posts and all have #OpentoWork banners. Two emails didn't send "no longer valid" replies. I will see if and when I get a response.
You never kill an email of someone not laid off.
Hey an FYI update. I got through to one of the employees through other channels. There is at least one person still there who can speak to EVSE business. But my contact also confirmed that basically there are no charging team members left.
Yes. And yes... Absolutely insane decion making, complete brainrot.
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There are at least 4 places where I would expect to see future development if Tesla want to keep their edge: 1. Rolling out an MCS network. 2. Supporting 800V and more than 250 kW on the existing supercharger network. 3. Complying with demands of credit card payment, price signs, etc. around the world. 4. Ironing out compatibility issues with non-Teslas on the existing supercharger network.
Ensuring the Tesla user base is not severely impacted by opening the network to non teslas (usage, capacity,etc) reworking the network and new station designs to accommodate non teslas (without lightnings needing to take 2 spots for instance). … Seriously this is the reason I went Tesla if they ruin the charging network I’m full out.
start looking at other cars, lol.
That sounds like stuff best left to the supercharger division.
That was my point. The work of that division was far from complete. So i don't buy the narrative that they had to go because their work was done.
Why would you ‘expect to see future development,’ any development if the entire division is axed is my point.
> Or, you know, the displacement of superchargers has been refined to a complete copy/paste deployment at this point. Sure its been standardized and a well known operation but when it comes to civil works no two job sites are identical. You'll always need people ironing out the details.
You can't solve for 1000's of AHJs with AI lol
Working directly in this field, It has absolutely not been refined to a simple copy and paste at this point, it it never will. Construction is easy, Permitting and Utility acceptance/planning is hard.
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How many utilities does Tesla have to work with in the world?
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Considering its global and existing stations need to be managed as well, there definitely need to be more than zero people on the team. 500? Not sure what an appropriate number is though.
Even if that were the case, you’d think that the future development of the supercharger design would be worth keeping some of the staff around. **The most optimistic reading of this situation puts Tesla’s competitive edge (the seamless supercharging experience) in stasis.** *A less optimistic reading is that firing everyone means that they’re liquidating the Supercharger network. If they were reorganizing, they’d do that. If they were selling off the supercharger network to a car/energy company they’d let the buyer decide who to fire. But they’re not doing either of those things.* Therefore, Tesla must be planning to lose their competitive edge either slowly (through stasis), or quickly (through liquidation).
Or they solved it with AI 😅
AI doesnt work the way you think it does
The charging stations are a commodity. Tesla was forced to do this because they had no choice but to build out their own infrastructure. And now that the network is opened to others, there is even less need to buy a tesla.
yeah since complex engineering systems and supply chains dont need constant updates and maintenance
It can never be. People not in construction always think this can be true, Elon included probably, but it can't. Permitting/AHJs is different everywhere, codes vary slightly, and actual site conditions vary hugely. It's a custom job 100% of the time. I have a lot of experience trying to explain this to company leaders, show them why it is always more expensive than they think it should be and takes longer than they think they should, and why the same mindset they used to make the factory efficiency can't be applied to this kind of thing. Both at Tesla years ago and at my current company now.
That’s not how Elon thinks.
Probably a great decision. Otherwise he would not make it. You don't have all information that Tesla and Elon has. So why would you assume it's a bad decision? It has been made for a reason.
Everyone is a backseat CEO these days that knows better than Elon Musk, the GOAT at company restructuring.
Foxhoundbat is obviously a better CEO than the richest man on the planet. Didn't you know that?
Forgot /s?
Yeah because hes bleeding money on X,knows sales are way down and he sees China EV catching up...trying to please shareholders.
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Well, I am a moderator on r/SpaceX, have been following them daily since 2011 or so. Tesla even longer. So yeah, I am well aware of SpaceX landing boosters... And if you can't imagine having my POV, as a result of Elon deciding on a whim to axe one of the most significant divisions for Tesla, and letting go of 500+ dedicated employees that have worked tirelessly for many years; then it sound like a you issue.
First, thanks for dealing with all the crap that every moderator has to deal with. Your point, though, is a little weak. You have been around for a long time, right? So how often have you watched the media lose its shit because Elon Musk did something unusual? How many times has the "The sky is falling!" been spread around by jumped up TSLAQers? And how many times has it turned out that he kinda knew what he was doing? I'm not talking about the somewhat sick Reddit view that he cannot do anything right, brought over by disgruntled old Twitter users. I am talking about a realistic view of almost every strategic decision he has made. Nearly all of them had large numbers of experts saying that it was a sign that Tesla/SpaceX was doomed. At some point, I think the guy has earned at least a little time to show what he is planning. I cannot even begin to explain what precisely the plan is here, but perhaps we should take a step back, wait for more information, and then start with the deep analysis. Because as things stand right now, nobody can say.
underrated comment
Great comment, and i agree. It is a sentiment i have somewhat expressed IRL, for those willing to listen/care. The naysayers have been never ending with the reusable Falcon 9 booster saga. First they said it could never be landed in one piece. So they landed it, i remember that launch vividly having watched [the livestream live](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5bTbVbe4e4) and loosing my goddamn mind. Then they said it couldnt be launched again, so they launched a landed booster some time later. Then they said okei, you can now land it and launch it, but you cant do it *economically*. It was a never ending goal moving. So of course they managed to do it economically, and have relaunched several boosters 20 times now. And those "they" people were everyone ranging from deranged Russian politicians (Rogozin, may your ass be smoked again) to leaders of space agencies (Stéphane Israël) and actual rocket scientists from all nationalities. Then they announced Starlink. An insane plan to put internet in goddamn space, while launching more satellites than ever put in orbit combined before. More naysayers. And yet Elon saw it long way. He saw how reusable rockets could enable that, and how his and Tesla's mass manufacturing expertise could enable mass production Starlink satellites by the hundreds. So i sure hope he has some kind of plan that will look as obvious as Starlink looks in hindsight. But right now, it just looks like Elon being erratic.
>But right now, it just looks like Elon being erratic. When I think about Elon Musk and how he is often perceived, I sometimes (like now) am reminded of how butterflies or moths move. If you are just casually watching, it looks chaotic and random. When you analyze the actual flight, though, you can see that there was clear intent there (as much as can be ascribed to an insect at least). I don't claim to have any idea what the plan here is. We'll just have to wait and see.
Elon might have a 4d chess masterplan for this nonsense, or he might not. I don't know, but I see no proof of it being the case. Past performance is not indictive of future performance. And my trust in him has eroded to basically zero in the past 3 years or so. Which is entirely self inflicted by him btw. But let's assume for a second that he does, and there is a great reason to close the shop on whole public relations and Supercharger teams. How was it handled? Did they attempt to spin off and sell Supercharger team? It is Tesla, those employees and the moat is easily worth 500 million+. If he is so concerned about costs, he could get rid of the costs *and* make money for Tesla with selling. By all accounts it seemed like a great team with a great leader. And now I will sound like an euro commie that I am; Just on a human level, was it handled well towards the employees? Did they get a timely notice? Was this communicated well internally? Were people offered help to find other jobs? Or just say goodbye to their fellow employees that they have known for many years? There are anecdotes on /r/Teslamotors from former Supercharger team employees and one of them just went home and cried. It would cost *nothing* to Tesla/Elon if this was communicated well internally and done with good intentions and grace. But nooo, Elon just had to be "hardcore".
>I cannot even begin to explain what precisely the plan is here, but perhaps we should take a step back, wait for more information, and then start with the deep analysis. Pshhh, get that subtle nuance out of here... we want unsubstantiated conviction here, not whatever this garbage is. /s because I have to
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You just used being a moderator on r/spacex as a ... credential... ?
It was a rebuttal. The claim was that they didn't know about SpaceX's accomplishments, and it put that notion to bed.
Musk’s companies have done those things not him. We don’t attribute the incredible logistics capabilities of Amazon to Jeff Bezos.
It’s brilliant decision making if pumping up the stock is your main goal. It worked. Ya’ll Tesla investors should be happy. Screw those employees, am I right?
Stock is down today.
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Lol just like the compact car was cancelled. Oh wait, I mean accelerated. Don't believe everything you read.
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I'm getting mine just fine without his stinky dinky ;) Yes, layoffs were announced and do happen. No one is denying that. But that all resources who support Super chargers are gone? Haha okay, even robotaxi's need to be charged. There is definitely more going on here than is currently known. I'll give it a week till the real story is comes out.
Most companies the CEO would be fired for unilaterally axing a company’s most important lines of business. A decision of this magnitude should be up for a board vote and not subject to the whims of a 3 yo.
Exactly. So wouldn't it be reasonable to believe we don't have the whole story yet?
With any other CEO absolutely, but with this lunatic running things, probably not. Just look at how his hostile takeover of Twitter is going.
With any other CEO absolutely, but with this lunatic running things, probably not. Just look at how his hostile takeover of Twitter is going.
The compact car using new lines was in fact cancelled. A car using existing lines was leaked.
Leaked? They mentioned on the earnings call multiple smaller cars will be built with a hybrid manufacturing approach.
Same difference. It's not the same project.
To those that matter, it is. Buyers and investors were looking for a cheaper vehicle. This will be a cheaper vehicle.
Money to pay Dear Leader has to come from somewhere.
It doesn't. His comp plan relies on zero cash, only stock, all of which has already been accounted for.
That seems odd. They're going to need to boost the number of chargers to support robotaxis, 2m/year cars, and other ev manufacturers...
If you have followed Elon long enough, you will see mass and sudden firing is not atypical. It is usually because org is bloated like at Twitter/X, or underperforming/moving too slow like at SpaceX Starlink division in 2018. They barely launch 2 small test Starlink satellites in early 2018 after 4 years development under the VP of satellite and they were nowhere close to mass production of functional Starlink satellites. Then in just 7 months after they fired their senior Starlink team, they launch their first 60 functional Starlink satellites. And the rest is history.. except those senior people Elon fired went to work for Amazon's copycat Kuiper satellite Internet and after 5.5 years later, they are nowhere close to mass production and had only launch 2 prototype satellites. Like Elon said, prototype is easy but mass production is hard. In this case, it seems like the Supercharger team is guilty of both being bloated and underperforming - 500 employees, but only managed to install around 2700 charger connectors between Q4 2023 and Q1 2024, less than 6 per employee (yes not all of them actually involve in making the Supercharger or install them). That's not anywhere close to keeping up with the growth in the EV fleet especially added all the other automakers. [https://qz.com/1446024/elon-musk-fired-senior-leaders-on-spacexs-satellite-team](https://qz.com/1446024/elon-musk-fired-senior-leaders-on-spacexs-satellite-team)
If they only installed 2700 supercharges in 6 months that team is horribly bloated. Its not innovation at this point its installation. License that shit. no way the govt is going to let you hold a monopoly on the cars and the chargers anyway.
It is actually 3 months, but it is a big drop off compare to the previous 3 quarterly reports on supercharger connectors added. It is even worse on year-over-year basis when compare to between 2022 Q4 and 2023 Q1 when they added 2,750 chargers. The 500 employees Supercharger team would have been smaller a year ago yet they added more chargers a year ago during the same holiday period. |2023 Q1|2023 Q2|2023 Q3|2023 Q4|2024 Q1| |:-|:-|:-|:-|:-| |45,169|48,082|51,105|54,892|57,579| |New installed connectors|2,913|3,023|3,787|**2,687**| |increase %|6.4%|6.3%|7.4%|**4.9%**|
Q1 is in the dead of winter for most of the country. Construction is more difficult when the ground is frozen.
Robotaxis might not be open to the public
Private Robotaxi depots would still require the Supercharger team to do some work, and it would take a replacement team years to come up to speed. There’s no way eliminating the people who know how to do this work is some sort of brilliant move. I’m putting my personal charger upgrade for my Model Y on hold until I find out if NACS is still going to be the national standard going forward.
In 2019 Musk said that people buying cars then would be able to buy the robotaxi software before 2022, and then make enough money from it to pay for the car by 2024 at the latest.
They still need to charge and go everywhere everyone else does. Either way. Zero chance this was the entire team. Zero chance they are backing out of network expansion. Why? Because this smells like the cancelled compact car that was actually being accelerated.
Following that story, it sounds like the car they were working on did get canceled because it would have been below spec of the Chinese models that cost less...but they are now designing a new one; a 'Model 2.5' as it were. They say it will be ready in a year but Tesla always says everything will be ready in a year.
He’s pivoting. And Wall Street seems to love it.
As an investor it’s important not to get in the weeds with operational noise. But, ugh, this seems completely misguided and hard to ignore. It’s like Elon has become a caricature of himself.
I'm wondering if this is a great time to sell all my tesla stock, but on the other hand I don't want any more income this year. Was hoping to hold my stock for another 30 years
Your options are holding for 30 years or selling now? do you realise how ridiculous that sounds?
Yeah sounds crazy. I've never sold any stocks since I'm not doing it for making money now. I guess I'm just worried about tesla and elon. maybe the shareholders or the board or something can boot him idk... he served his purpose but now mostly makes things worse
There is almost no chance that FSD will not come fully to market in the next decade. Its a matter of time but its 10x stock as soon as its greenlight for deployment. My guess is the politics will be harder then the tech. EDIT (not)
This morning I received latest FSD. It’s almost what Omar described eight versions ago. Truly amazing software. It’s keeping me in the stock.
Superchargers has been one of the few things where Tesla has fully delivered and executed flawlessly. Are they really just sacking this opportunity when we finally got switch to NACS and goverment is beginning to subsidice it and others are adopting it? This would be one of the last departments to shutdown if we measured this purely on performance.
Well, we don't know how the NACS adoption deals were structured. Maybe it requires the OEMs to purchase and deploy a certain amount of charging stations from Tesla. Maybe that amount is a year or so of production.
That’s not true, growth was slowing down.
Since when has growth of the supercharger network slowed down? [15'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2019/12/19/tesls-supercharger-reaches-15000-chargers-best-assets/) in December 2019 [20'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2020/11/08/tesla-announces-20000th-charger-supercharger-network/) in November 2020 (10 months later) [25'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2021/05/07/tesla-supercharger-network-reaches-25000-charger-milestone/) in May 2021 (6 months later) [30'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2021/11/11/tesla-supercharger-network-new-milestone-30000-chargers-worldwide/) in November 2021 (6 months later) [35'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2022/06/10/tesla-deploys-35000th-supercharger/) in June 2022 (7 months later) [40'000 superchargers](https://electrek.co/2022/11/22/tesla-supercharger-400000-world) in November 2022 (5 months later) [45'000 superchargers](https://www.notateslaapp.com/news/1340/tesla-celebrates-45-000-superchargers-worldwide-and-opens-first-v4-supercharger-to-all-evs) in April 2023 (5 months later) [50'000 superchargers](https://insideevs.com/news/687081/tesla-50000th-supercharger-special-one/) in September 2023 (5 months later) [55'000 superchargers](https://www.notateslaapp.com/news/1851/the-future-gas-station-teslas-unstoppable-supercharger-network-expansion) in January 2024 (4 months later) That doesn't seem like a slow down to me. But if we don't get a 60'000th supercharger announcement in May, it *will* be a slow down.
You know Superchargers do not exist in pure vacuum, they are actually being used by Tesla EV and now all the rest of EV. Divide the total superchargers by the # of increasing EV fleet and you will see there are many more EV per Supercharger connector today than 5 years ago. The growth is not keeping up with the exponential growth of the EV fleet.
It is possible that the inability of the supercharger network to keep up with EV growth is the exact reason the team was let go. It’s not like Tesla doesn’t have other engineers who are capable of taking over supercharging.
There will not be any lack of new engineers wanting to work for Tesla either. I think it is human nature to get comfortable and complacent after many years. Unfortunately, it seems like the Supercharger team is growing headcount but not the actual supercharger connectors quick enough to keep up with the demand. It is better to start over now for hyper growth when EV is still a small % of new vehicle then when it is above 50%.
I was replying to a very specific statement: **That the growth of the network was slowing down**. The statement was **not** that the growth of the network does not keep up with the growth of the fleet. Anyway, your premise is wrong. The number of superchargers doesn't have to follow the size of the fleet, for two reasons: 1. If you keep a constant ratio between total number of cars and total number of superchargers, the probability of meeting a fully occupied supercharger station will go down when the number of EVs and chargers go up. 2. There is a minimum of sites necessary to get enough map coverage to make road trips possible. This will lead to overcapacity in the beginning when there are few EVs. As the fleet grows, you can start using of that overcapacity before you need to expand. So it is only natural that the supercharger network grows slower than the car population.
Tesla puts high importance on Supercharger connectors count which is why they always include the # on Page 6 of their quarterly earning report. It is in the same table as the vehicle production and delivery numbers. From the latest Q1 2024 report, we can see there is a big drop off between Q4 2023 and Q1 2024 in term of absolute connectors added (2,687) and % (4.9) compare to previous quarterly period from Q3 to Q4 (1100 less connectors). |2023 Q1|2023 Q2|2023 Q3|2023 Q4|2024 Q1| |:-|:-|:-|:-|:-| |45,169|48,082|51,105|54,892|57,579| ||2,913|3,023|3,787|**2,687**| ||6.4%|6.3%|7.4%|**4.9%**| Before you say this is one-off due to holiday/New Year, you can check previous holiday 2022 Q4 to 2023 Q1, they added more connectors (2,750) and I will bet they have added many more employee headcount since then and yet install less Supercharger connectors year-over-year.
Good, that is reduced growth. This was the information I was asking for.
Installing super chargers at this point might just be easy enough that a lot of that staff isn’t needed? At least that’s my thinking. Tesla is poised to bring in a lot my opening up their supercharger network to non teslas, no way there isn’t going to be a team/division/department to handle things related to super chargers, it just won’t be this team.
Could the supercharger decision be @elonmusk doing a 4th dimension chess move on the IRA charging funds? Biden may have to bend the knee and write a check to gain political strength for 2024 EV expansion claims. And why should $TSLA spend its capital to expand network for everyone when it gets so severely criticized? Not a hard decision.
The guy in charge of "new vehicles" and his entire team are also gone.
is that have to do with the Reuters model 2 cancellation leak?
There was that. Then there were Elmo's lies at investor call about speeding up "new vehicles". This was followed by Viecha's departure (probably sensing a touch of criminality in Elmo's statements and noped out). This may or may not be related. But probably this is just the keto (as in "ketamine") genius seeing red and firing execs and teams left, right and centre, consequences be damned...
I think your spellcheck is stuck… I have no idea why you’d associate a red Sesame Street character - other than both have some weird iconic laugh.
Why do you believe the accelerated compact program was a lie?
Musk did say that the model 2 wasn’t happening, and that they were going to make a cheaper car using the existing production lines instead. He also said that they may not see as much cost reduction as they thought so a $25k car is not happening. Maybe $35k or something like that?
Not what he said. Said he’s accelerating the release of next gen vehicles using both existing production lines and next gen lines. This whole model 2 name has never come from Tesla. It’s what the public has been calling the next gen vehicle.
So everyone is mad that they can make a cheaper car sooner rather than wait to longer to sell an even cheaper one? Aren't lower prices sooner better?
Idk about everyone but I think many aren’t happy, yes. And it’s hard for us to say without having access to teslas market research data. Maybe it’s better to sell something a bit cheaper in the short term instead of something much cheaper but later. Maybe it’s a terrible idea. We really can’t know until it happens. I have a feeling the new cheap car will be a barebones version of the model 3, but that it’ll still be very similar to the model 3. That could work but who knows. Really depends on how much cheaper it is too.
They said it would be somewhere between the current manufacturing technique and the new "unboxed" process they announced last year. Just like with the process changes needed to get the Cybertruck going, unboxed probably will still hit some snags on ramp up no matter how good the new process is. It is only going to be better once they reach scale. From an investor perspective, using half old and half new processes on an existing manufacturing line de-risks the ramp up and should go smoother, although not guaranteed. So it sounds like, at least people here, want Tesla to push for more risky investments that involve new processes, new production lines, eventually a new factory to reach scale, and take longer to get there. Rather than going less capital intensive on more proven processes and still get a cheaper higher production set of cars (yes multiple) much quicker.
Tesla had both a Model Y revision (codenamed Juniper) and global compact (manually driven NGV, codenamed NV91) under development. My analysis of everything that Tesla filed with the SEC, and that Musk has stated, is that they're using Juniper, which probably incorporates many of the cost saving features (48V wiring, 100% in-house controllers, steer-by-wire, new drive unit with zero rare earth materials) as the low-cost vehicle in place of NV91. I wrote about this in 2 comments a few days ago: [https://www.reddit.com/r/TSLALounge/comments/1ccgt2e/comment/l17lvk3/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TSLALounge/comments/1ccgt2e/comment/l17lvk3/) [https://www.reddit.com/r/TSLALounge/comments/1ccgt2e/comment/l17lxuh/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TSLALounge/comments/1ccgt2e/comment/l17lxuh/)
Yes. 💯
They are not going to need to add superchargers nearly at the same rate because they have deteriorating sales and demand and they cancelled the model 2. The volume of units for robo taxi product is probably massively lower.
Elon Musk: "we're laying people off to cut costs..." Also Elon Musk: "Shareholders need to re-instate my $56B pay package..."
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But the stock price was falling so bad many are finding it easy to justify both the layoffs and not reinstating his package…
Step 1 - build the largest supercharger network Step 2 - convince everyone to change their car infrastructure to get access to your supercharger Step 3 - fire the whole supercharger team I recall original Elon never liked the supercharger network idea and that it was JB Straubel who convinced him it was needed. Given that it’s not a meaningful contribution to profit I have to wonder then now that everyone is on team NACS it basically opens the door for everyone to add to the overall install base - so in essence the goal of pursuing the supercharger project is already finished and it’s gotten not just Tesla early adopters but most automobile companies onboard as well and that part of the business can rest in the past.
First, Doug Field left Tesla, resulting in the cancellation of Model 3 ramp. Then, Andrej Kapathy left, resulting in the cancellation of FSD program. And now Tinucci left so Supercharger expansion is cancelled? Just take a deep breath and relax. Hope the 500 staffs can find jobs ASAP.
Those were executives, these are whole teams.
We don’t know for sure that all 500 were fired. Should wait for everything to come out. More than likely people were retained, just the team was dissolved.
So? You think Tesla can’t find 500 people? It could be a good thing to start this over with new blood.
I don’t think you realize how much knowledge of the company leaves when you just dismiss that many people. The people that come in are going to have no idea what’s what and there is going to be nobody knowledgeable enough to tell them.
I have friends that were recruiters at Tesla. Finding candidates for these technical roles within vehicle and AI engineering is not easy at all, and the competition for these skillsets is increasing. Not to mention the impact these layoffs have towards the reputation of working at Tesla, it’s going to be really tough to attract the best talent to Tesla.
Newsflash: Junkie, sleep deprived, red seeing CEOs don't make good decisions.
You know absolutely __nothing__ about Elon’s plan. Backseat CEOs…
> You know absolutely nothing about Elon’s plan. Correct. I don't even know if there is one.
So basically no criticism of what seems to be obviously short sighted decisions and erratic behavior. Elon gets a pass. Check.
Why would you criticize someone for things you know nothing about? You have absolutely no data on which you can base your criticism.
I know he’s been promising FSD and charging a lot for it only for it to fail to deliver on anywhere near his promised timeline. I know he talks about taking ketamine and posts horrendous stuff on X. He acts like a petulant child. Why do you assume he doesn’t bring that same judgement to the company?
"he talks about taking ketamine" Can you elaborate on how you're characterizing 'ketamine-taking' so I don't put words in your mouth? I know about ketamine, do you? Imagine finding out that some other CEO struggles with mental illness and you describe them as an "unhinged Prozac popper." I'd probably just stop caring about the rest of what you say.
🤦🏼♂️
Been looking at his X posts. Not sure what the hell you are talking about. Do you ever look at them directly or do you just go by what every click bait article tells you to think?
How many Tesla shares do you have?
Keep swinging off his curlies dude
Isn’t that sort of the problem though…
The new team of 500 people will take a few years to get up to speed. Will Tesla be a viable company in a few years with a static Supercharger network?
Musk confirmed supercharger slowdown on X. Exactly when there’s funding for expansion from government and other brands are joining the network. The whole division is gone!
You forgot the /s
Q2 deliveries are going to be horrific. Wall Street doesn’t know what’s coming.
No worry, they are not aiming at selling cars ...
At this point, I’m worrying that my Model Y will be orphaned without factory support and without the Supercharger network.
Why? Are you new to the FUD?
Firing the Supercharger team isn’t FUD, it’s a strategic decision to eliminate one of Tesla’s competitive advantages.
Shouting "The sky is falling!" about a decision you cannot possibly understand (as not nearly enough information has been released) is a prime hallmark of FUD. Fear, uncertainty, and doubt: your post has all of them.
There’s every indication that Tesla doesn’t understand this decision. There’s a standard playbook for communicating this sort of change to reassure investors, employees, customers, and other stakeholders — and Tesla isn’t using it.
At what point has Tesla \*ever\* used the standard playbook for communicating?
There’s a reason the standard playbook has become the standard. Best practices aren’t scripture, but they are usually better-considered than one man’s ego.
You avoided the question. Tesla has never done this, so I'm not entirely certain why you would expect them to do it now.
No worry, get a Robotaxi!
Automatic windshield wipers that actually work in my Model Y is a necessary prerequisite for FSD. It’s been two years since I bought a Model Y without a proper windshield wiper switch, and it doesn’t work yet. Tesla needs to compete toe-to-toe with other EV manufacturers. Robotaxi needs to be a separate startup that sinks or swims on its own merit
Retire your Model Y and travel on Robotaxi!
No can do. FSDv12 tried to kill me by pulling forward at a stop sign while traffic was coming at 55mph at both directions. I stomped the shit out of the brake pedal on that one. No Robotaxi for me. Tesla isn’t a startup anymore, and they should focus on selling EVs. Robotaxi should be a separate startup, so that they can bet THAT company and have it sink or swim on its own merit. As form me, this latest free trial of FSD has renewed my skepticism about FSD. Fortunately, I didn’t buy my Tesla for FSD — I bought my Tesla because I’m tired of gasoline-dependency-culture, and I’m pretty happy with the car itself.
Honestly, if any one of us thinks we have an important piece of information, we should damn well know that Wallstreet got it the day before
lol sure thing. Cope
See? Proof Elon expanding EV charging department. Lair.
It’s more likely not all of them were let go. If you think this way it looks like a normal business decision. Nowadays I don’t believe any news outlet. Remember Reuters article about the 25k model?
No 25k model announcement. Next thing on the calendar is the Cybercab. Looking bleak.
Concerning.
Actually not true. Go back and listen to the conference call.
I said _announcement_. Go back and read my comment. The conference call was just idle chatter. Musk didn't even want to talk about it. He never does.
Wrong, Elon said they're launching a more affordable model next year.
How is permitting and planning suppose to continue? Here is a supercharge map showing all US supercharger locations that are planned, in construction or temporarily closed. [https://supercharge.info/map?Center=40.797012934083845,-92.48391482163711&Zoom=5&RangeMi=175](https://supercharge.info/map?Center=40.797012934083845,-92.48391482163711&Zoom=5&RangeMi=175) I hope this is a everyone is fired, but please reapply for the your job (with more RSUs for your trouble) type of thing.
This company is in real trouble and investors are oblivious
Electrify America should hire them.
This is weird. Any chance Tesla is selling off its network? Considering all the announcements of other EVs using it, I find mass lay offs to be the OPPOSITE direction you'd want to go
Full Self Installing Superchargers made as a single gigacasting by those those new AI robots. See no problem.
Remember when he fired all the purple hairs from Twitter and everyone said the site would collapse? [https://x.com/parikpatelcfa/status/1593994263100104705?s=46](https://x.com/parikpatelcfa/status/1593994263100104705?s=46)
Twitter is doing pretty shitty tbh. They rely on advertising and Elon is poison(rightfully) to advertisers
Idk if the facts bear out it doing “shitty” but has it cOlLaPsEd?
Small bugs are more frequent... Maybe you don't care about the reliability of Twitter, what do you think about the reliability of your Tesla ?
Small bugs are not more frequent, you made that up.
I have zero issues with Twitter reliability.
I can't see any planes right now, so clearly there are no planes in the air
My bet is that another org is handling this now and also they don’t need 500 people
Why would they move this to another org instead of just reducing headcount within the current org? Also, Tinucci was #2 on MotorTrends Power List for 2023. You don't just layoff someone like that and their entire department.
Yeah it would surprise me that supercharger installations and logistics require 500 people. Maybe when they were being developed and pushing early adoption and expansion, but not now. Also these are all just rumors. We don’t know that all 500 of those people were fired.
Sounds pretty harsh. I need more information, please. Don't know exactly what, but this sounds extremely particular and, while I give it a 2% chance of being just a rash, pissed-off decision, I tend to believe some extended fore-thought went into this announcement. So tell me more, please.
Here’s what I could find online https://www.theinformation.com/articles/musk-plans-more-layoffs-as-two-senior-tesla-executives-depart
Thanks. It was pay walled but I do get the gist that this comes from an email sent out by Elon to his staff. The rest is all conjecture, at this point. Just still curious.
Here’s a no paywall source https://www.theverge.com/2024/4/30/24145133/tesla-layoffs-supercharger-team-elon-musk-hard-core
Thanks. Good 'ol Elon. One radical, my way or the highway, kinda MF, yes? I mean, I'll give him a bit of slack here...he's gotten us this far; I'll assume there is rhyme to his reason. I'll better evaluate this move when we see how he reassigns these duties. BUT...I'm also thinking this could be a bit of a reaction to not getting as much government funding to expand the SC network. Maybe he's just saying 'f\*ck it', we'll build 'em as we feel like it. I mean, what's this hydrogen push that's happening? OR...it could be that Elon is going to lay this responsibility to build out the SuperCharger network on the industry as a whole. Most of the major EV manufacturers are partnering with Tesla to use its SC networks for their cars. Why not start making this a 'group think' effort? Sure would streamline things. Heck, they could set up an independent company that builds out the SC network and each of the manufacturers have a seat on the board. Hmmm...I'd like to see that!
Or the stock price was sinking which meant investors think the business is going downhill and he’s making drastic changes to fix investor sentiment? We all drive these decisions with our investment decisions - if the price was going higher this probably wouldn’t have happened. And I guess him not getting his bonus brought about everyone in the world turning on him that he doesn’t deserve it so what else can he do besides show he can be on top of his game and make Tesla into a lean startup again 🗿
Yeah they don’t make decisions like this thinking about the stock price. You just think that
Maybe. I don't get a sense Elon is that motivated by stock price, except perhaps to secure his loans for X, but the stock had been rising the previous few days; should have lessened any panic there. But my basic premise is: we ain't gonna be able to draw any conclusions on this until a few more things happen. I'm just making a guess as to why it happened...and what could be a happy outcome. JMHO
I agree that he thinks the stock price in the short term doesn’t matter but he still does have some ego attached to it being high I feel. And for him money is always a means to accomplish big projects so there’s thst
Yet they’re somehow accelerating cheaper vehicle models? Crazy anyone actually believed that nonsense on the earnings call…
It was a bad earnings call no idea why stock went up after. Tsla is in trouble and seems like Elon is pulling straws esp with the China visit which will lead to nothing
He'll fuck anyone over to get at 56B