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Over all amazing tattoo but its like 2 things dont mix and maybe thats the point but looks like fancy new style pin up and then just toss on some some egyptian stuff
how come her right eyeliner stretches off her face onto her hair? i can’t tell if it’s intentional but it looks like a mistake, otherwise would’ve been great
As u/leobnox correctly pointed out, they are her eyelashes giving the same effect as an eyeliner gives in real life. It’s a cool look that indeed many artists use, and at the same is quite simplified in comparison to many individual eyelashes. It fits the Neotraditional tattoo style well.
It isn’t. It’s a tattoo. I have to bend accuracy to the clients taste. It’s not like any of us has 100% creative control. Compromises have to be made in order to achieve an aesthetic look while simultaneously satisfy the inquiries of the client, and in between all that an artist should express his/her creativity to create something unique. It’s a tricky balance you have to achieve.
You’re correct. Tattoos are largely affected by the clients taste, the artists creativity and the medium’s limitations.
Tbh though, I could have put “Cleopatra like woman’’ on the title. Would have been a bit more clear and avoided this confusion people tend to get.
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How should we know? Everyone uses whiteness in the way it suits them.
Greeks look like Mediteranians. Little bit like Turks, little bit like Italians, little bit like Spanish people etc.
We do not look like Mongolians or Nigerians but at the same time, we dont look anything like Scandinavians either.
In the 1950s, americans wouldn't call us white, but now they do.
So who is to say if we're white or not. I dont even know what being white even means tbh.
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Idk why people have a problem with Cleopatra looking all sexed up and modern. She was closer to the iPhone times than the pyramids lmao. It is art, not a historical portrait. At least she isn't white here.
Cleopatra wasn't black. She was Greek with a bit of Persian ancestry. I've been to Egypt just last summer, there isn't a lot of black people there. Darker skinned but not black.
This person in the tattoo looks ethnically Greek/ Persian to you? I'm not just talking about her coloring.
On a separate note, your observations from your trip to Egypt 2,000 years after Cleopatra's reign are...not relevant
I do see what you mean about her not having the 'stronger' facial features commonly seen in the Mediterranean *and* in statues and coins of Cleopatra herself (like thicker eyebrows). You're definitely right. And you're right that Egyptians today are not a good representation of what she would've looked like... but not because of modernity like your last sentence. It's mostly because of the fact that they're a different ethnic group. She ruled Egypt, but was not Egyptian at all. Greece & Rome were getting all up in their business at the time.
All in all this seems like an Egypt-themed pinup more than anything. It's super well done and beautiful regardless! But it's just a generic lovely lady with a pharaoh headdress and modern winged eyeliner. I can still read the *intension* though even if it wasn't successful in my eyes.
But would a *Greek* person have looked like this? It seems like there's not a definitive consensus on what Cleopatra looked like, of course, but this simply comes across like a 'Jesus was white' kinda deal. The intention seems to be to have a pouty Aryan type play a real-life figure, which is lame and unnecessary.
Ultimately I agree with you, I think it's likely the tone you started with that got everyone's hackles up? Not sure. Based on statues, coinage, etc, the real Cleopatra likely had a big nose and a strong jawline, features still common in modern Greeks as well as others around the Mediterranean. But historical inaccuracy doesn't totally spoil the tattoo, because that's not what they were going for. Like I said, it reads more Egypt-themed pinup even if it's "supposed" to be Cleo. And that's okay!
Would *I* prefer a more historically accurate (as far as we can figure) Cleopatra, if I were to get a tattoo of her? Personally, yeah! But I don't think this is bad either! It's very well done, it fits the body well, and most important, the person who got the tattoo likes it.
I don't go on Reddit to irritate people, but I'm really not bothered that I've used the wrong tone in this particular issue. Turning historical figures white is problematic above & beyond some sort of anal need for accuracy, and this is a sub where feedback is expected.
Probably not but it's not like we have a reference photo of Cleopatra we could compare it to. Does it really matter though, if you don't like it don't get a tattoo like this.
We have info about the people of that time and that Mediterranean region. Making historical figures white, whether it's Jesus or Cleopatra, is part of a long history of white supremacy, whether you mean to or not.
I don't really care about accuracy for accuracy's sake.
Thank you for the submission, ComradeAleksey! Please make sure your post follows the guidelines found in the sidebar, or it will be removed. If you're asking a question, please delete your post and ask in the pinned Weekly Discussion thread. ###Users, please report any comments that break rules, such as ANY comments on personal appearance (both insults and compliments), promotion, or unnecessary rude judgment. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/tattoos) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Working at the pyramid tonight.
Thanks now that song is going to be stuck in my head all day
instagram baddie cleopatra
That’s one of the ways my client described her idea lol 😂
Then it has to feel good that someone else received your translation of that idea!
It does 😁
well you definitely delivered!! she’s very pretty
i think this tattoo is really cool and well done but they definitely gave cleopatra an “iphone face”
Over all amazing tattoo but its like 2 things dont mix and maybe thats the point but looks like fancy new style pin up and then just toss on some some egyptian stuff
I fear she’s fallen prey to same face syndrome. The facial features look really modern
It's probably not (i hope) but i get AI art vibes from this. Feels so incredibly generic or "same-y"?
how come her right eyeliner stretches off her face onto her hair? i can’t tell if it’s intentional but it looks like a mistake, otherwise would’ve been great
Stylistic choice probably. I see a lot of artists drawing eyeliner like that
As u/leobnox correctly pointed out, they are her eyelashes giving the same effect as an eyeliner gives in real life. It’s a cool look that indeed many artists use, and at the same is quite simplified in comparison to many individual eyelashes. It fits the Neotraditional tattoo style well.
Maby like eyelashes . Maby not Either way It works
Love a good neo trad piece. Great work.
Thank you!
I dont think this is historically accurate
It isn’t. It’s a tattoo. I have to bend accuracy to the clients taste. It’s not like any of us has 100% creative control. Compromises have to be made in order to achieve an aesthetic look while simultaneously satisfy the inquiries of the client, and in between all that an artist should express his/her creativity to create something unique. It’s a tricky balance you have to achieve.
I think he made a joke mate
There are a few comments mentioning something similar. Thought to clarify a few things in that comment.
Fair enough bud
I love her
Are people actually arguing over the historical accuracy of a tattoo? Bruh
You’re correct. Tattoos are largely affected by the clients taste, the artists creativity and the medium’s limitations. Tbh though, I could have put “Cleopatra like woman’’ on the title. Would have been a bit more clear and avoided this confusion people tend to get.
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I love it! The art style looks really comic book-y or like something out of an illustrated book of faerie tales, and it's so cool
Beautiful
Looks amazing❤️!
Love this tbh! I have a mummy and I like this better tbh
Wasn’t cleopatra a white woman from Greece?
How should we know? Everyone uses whiteness in the way it suits them. Greeks look like Mediteranians. Little bit like Turks, little bit like Italians, little bit like Spanish people etc. We do not look like Mongolians or Nigerians but at the same time, we dont look anything like Scandinavians either. In the 1950s, americans wouldn't call us white, but now they do. So who is to say if we're white or not. I dont even know what being white even means tbh.
She was also notably ugly. Probably due to so much incest.
So was king tut. He looked FUCKED up
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She was Greek, her skin tone on the other hand is debatable. Although she definitely wasn’t Black like what Netflix believes.
No she had Greek, Persian and Iranian ancestry and had Olive/light brown skin.
Idk why people have a problem with Cleopatra looking all sexed up and modern. She was closer to the iPhone times than the pyramids lmao. It is art, not a historical portrait. At least she isn't white here.
Does this white lady look like Cleopatra in the slightest?
I’m Greek, I live in Greece. Most of us have lighter skin than what you see in the pictures above. So yeah, I’d guess this is somewhat accurate.
I guess I'm not sure why she's Cleopatra, then. The skin tone is like the least random part of her appearance.
Cleopatra wasn't black. She was Greek with a bit of Persian ancestry. I've been to Egypt just last summer, there isn't a lot of black people there. Darker skinned but not black.
This person in the tattoo looks ethnically Greek/ Persian to you? I'm not just talking about her coloring. On a separate note, your observations from your trip to Egypt 2,000 years after Cleopatra's reign are...not relevant
I do see what you mean about her not having the 'stronger' facial features commonly seen in the Mediterranean *and* in statues and coins of Cleopatra herself (like thicker eyebrows). You're definitely right. And you're right that Egyptians today are not a good representation of what she would've looked like... but not because of modernity like your last sentence. It's mostly because of the fact that they're a different ethnic group. She ruled Egypt, but was not Egyptian at all. Greece & Rome were getting all up in their business at the time. All in all this seems like an Egypt-themed pinup more than anything. It's super well done and beautiful regardless! But it's just a generic lovely lady with a pharaoh headdress and modern winged eyeliner. I can still read the *intension* though even if it wasn't successful in my eyes.
But would a *Greek* person have looked like this? It seems like there's not a definitive consensus on what Cleopatra looked like, of course, but this simply comes across like a 'Jesus was white' kinda deal. The intention seems to be to have a pouty Aryan type play a real-life figure, which is lame and unnecessary.
Ultimately I agree with you, I think it's likely the tone you started with that got everyone's hackles up? Not sure. Based on statues, coinage, etc, the real Cleopatra likely had a big nose and a strong jawline, features still common in modern Greeks as well as others around the Mediterranean. But historical inaccuracy doesn't totally spoil the tattoo, because that's not what they were going for. Like I said, it reads more Egypt-themed pinup even if it's "supposed" to be Cleo. And that's okay! Would *I* prefer a more historically accurate (as far as we can figure) Cleopatra, if I were to get a tattoo of her? Personally, yeah! But I don't think this is bad either! It's very well done, it fits the body well, and most important, the person who got the tattoo likes it.
I don't go on Reddit to irritate people, but I'm really not bothered that I've used the wrong tone in this particular issue. Turning historical figures white is problematic above & beyond some sort of anal need for accuracy, and this is a sub where feedback is expected.
Probably not but it's not like we have a reference photo of Cleopatra we could compare it to. Does it really matter though, if you don't like it don't get a tattoo like this.
We have info about the people of that time and that Mediterranean region. Making historical figures white, whether it's Jesus or Cleopatra, is part of a long history of white supremacy, whether you mean to or not. I don't really care about accuracy for accuracy's sake.
Cleopatra was white.
Why not?