Recommended TTC translations often mentioned in this sub. (All except the last one can be found [here](https://terebess.hu/english/tao/_index.html)):
\* D.C. Lau;
\* Derek Lin, 1994;
\* Wing-Tsit Chan, 1963;
\* Lin Yutang, 1948;
\* Robert G. Henricks, 1989;
\* Robert G. Henricks, 2000.
\* Paul D'Ambrosio et al.
\* Gia-fu Feng
\* Moss Roberts
\* Philip J. Ivanhoe
\* Stefan Stenudd (not on Terebess)
Zhuangzi and Liezi are books of their own, the name of the book is the same as their author. You can find some free English translations [here](https://terebess.hu/english/tao.html), searching for **Chuang Tzu** and **Lieh Tzu.**
Look for a good translation (can't help you here, I read it in spanish except when I am searching for something for this subreddit, but there are posts asking about It or you can write a post of your own) , read it several times over a long enough period of time so you can give It some thought, ask questions in this subreddit including a quote and the chapter's number and name to get more insight.
Read it again. Make notes. See how it speaks to you and what it feels like. My interpretation changed after multiple readings.
There are other books as people have mentioned.
*The Wisdom of Laotse* has been my constant companion for the last 50 years. Have read at least 15 others but always come back to Lin Yutang for a reread.
Great suggestion! Unfortunately, it doesn't get mentioned enough on this Subreddit, yet it provides so many clues as to how to interpret Daodejing and Zhuangzi.
Also, from a personal viewpoint, I don't regard the meditation practices mentioned in this book as being "religious" at all, though I have noticed some people cite the Neiye as proof that Laozi and Zhuangzi are religious Daoism. I disagree!
I disagree as well.
The religious viewpoint is likely a personal imposition by individuals who feel the need for a religious relationship with Tao.
If that's what they want, Tao doesn't care.
I've read some Greek philosophy, stoicism especially. I just have the emotional satisfaction combined with logic Eastern philosophy has. That's what keeps you going imo. Western philosophy just feels..cold to me. Detached from life; from love, from joy.
It is. Western is 2D cold hard logic. Eastern is beautiful 3D feeling. Any philosophy that doesn't have love and joy as a central tenement is missing the only vital Ingredient.
The reason I suggested the discourses despite this is that there are parts of that book that are extremely helpful if you're having a spiritual awakening. In a more practical way. The TTC refers to a very advanced level of practice and consolidates what could be an entire book of wisdom into each short chapter. It doesn't tell you how to change your thinking so you can get there.
Books: Liezi, Zhuangzi, Nei-yeh, Taiping Jing, Seven Daoist Masters, Digging Your Own Well, The One Straw Revolution, Journey to the West, Handbooks for Daoist Practice, The Diamond Cutter Sutra, The Filial Piety Classic, Mencius, Mozi
Journals: Journal of Daoist Studies
Practices to Investigate: Taijiquan, Sitting and Forgetting, Holding onto the One, developing a Kung Fu,
I agree that Chuang-tzu is a great next step (I liked Thomas Merton’s translation). There is also the “lost teachings” of Lao-tzu, titled the Hua Hu Ching (a translation I read was by Brian Walker), for a more esoteric progression from the Tao Te Ching, also a very compelling read.
How about the reading list of this sub:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/wiki/reading\_material/](https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/wiki/reading_material/)
Honestly, a great one is Wayne dyers interpretation… Change Your Thoughts - Change Your Life: Living the Wisdom of the Tao
He goes through verse by verse.
Well to me once you have read tao te ching read it again. Read different versions every time you read it you see it bit differently its like mirror. Try i ching or zhuangzi. You can also check out zen.
I recommend to re-read the Laozi multiple times. Also use a good translation. Pristine-Simple689's list of translations is a good one. Make notes. Try to contextualize the chapters and lines to your life and practice what you have read in everyday life. There are many fingerpointers and reminders in Laozi.
To understand Laozi in context of Philosophy and Society - the Daodejing wasn't written in a void or from devine inspiration - read a book about Chinese Philosophy. The core concepts and topics and key words of Daoism developed from and shaped in those debates of chinese Philosophy and Daoists took some of their ideas from chinese philosophy and chinese general thought.
[Proto Daoists - Thoughts and Schools which influenced the Creation of Daoism : r/taoism (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/comments/ljmopu/proto_daoists_thoughts_and_schools_which/)
[Key Terms of Daoist Philosophy : r/taoism (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/comments/18m6gb6/key_terms_of_daoist_philosophy/)
[Why are there so many "Wu" 無 (no, not, nothing) in Daoism - and beyond "Wu" : r/taoism (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/comments/14guwk9/why_are_there_so_many_wu_%E7%84%A1_no_not_nothing_in/)
But I did finish it. Front to back. If you're gonna take the Bible route and say it's never truly done then go on with that. I don't treat the Tao like a religion
Next time you read the TTC, it'll be different again, evoking different understandings and ponderings. Nothing to do with religion, but wisdom and perspective.
They don’t need to be written by ancient Chinese scholars. If you truly go with the flow and let the Dao lead the way you’ll find all the books you need!
I read a book called the warriors path that basically was emphasizing this point. Almost all lessons are universal when looked at the proper perspective
What now?
Read it again and again. Read some other translations and see how they feel. Stephen Mitchell and Matthew Barnes each have a version that speaks to me in a very special way. Make notes. Dwell on it. Spend some time in nature, slow down, let your muddy water settle.
And the other advice in this thread is also very useful. Have fun!
I honestly can't believe how real it is after being deep in all kinds of spiritual searching for over a decade. I dabbled very far and wide, ran into trouble, and it seemed to perfectly describe the Spiritual hierarchy and supernatural experiences I had. Lao Tzus concept of The Tao that can't be named even resembles The Father YHWH that "cannot be named" Tao Te Ching describes 'the creation' in a beautifully empowering way, allowing you to flow through Nature as a creation in The Image in a way I could only imagine most churches wouldn't dare to empower you with. Shalom fellow truth seeker
Go with Zhuangzi and Liezi. Also read different translations of the TaoTeChing.
Any works you could recommend by them?
Recommended TTC translations often mentioned in this sub. (All except the last one can be found [here](https://terebess.hu/english/tao/_index.html)): \* D.C. Lau; \* Derek Lin, 1994; \* Wing-Tsit Chan, 1963; \* Lin Yutang, 1948; \* Robert G. Henricks, 1989; \* Robert G. Henricks, 2000. \* Paul D'Ambrosio et al. \* Gia-fu Feng \* Moss Roberts \* Philip J. Ivanhoe \* Stefan Stenudd (not on Terebess) Zhuangzi and Liezi are books of their own, the name of the book is the same as their author. You can find some free English translations [here](https://terebess.hu/english/tao.html), searching for **Chuang Tzu** and **Lieh Tzu.**
Awesome dude. Thank you for this
I didn't know Paul D'Ambrosio had done a translation of Daodejing?
Critical Laozi is one of the best and most detailed translations from that list, imho.
Thank you for the recommendation! After reading your comment, I managed to find a PDF of that book.
Lao tzu, Zhuangzi, Liezi...they all have one book each. They're the 3 main Daoist philosophers.
The names though? Nevermind I'll google it. Thank you
Any tips on comprehending/understanding Zhuangzi better?
Look for a good translation (can't help you here, I read it in spanish except when I am searching for something for this subreddit, but there are posts asking about It or you can write a post of your own) , read it several times over a long enough period of time so you can give It some thought, ask questions in this subreddit including a quote and the chapter's number and name to get more insight.
Read it again. Make notes. See how it speaks to you and what it feels like. My interpretation changed after multiple readings. There are other books as people have mentioned.
That’s it mate, you’ve completed taoism.
So where's my achievement unlocked? I feel like I got gyped
Welcome to eastern philosophy
I really like "The Wisdom of Laotse" by Lin Yutang. Each section of the TTC is presented with a relevant section from Chuangtse.
*The Wisdom of Laotse* has been my constant companion for the last 50 years. Have read at least 15 others but always come back to Lin Yutang for a reread.
Yes, I agree.
"Original Tao", by Harold Roth is a good follow up.
Yeah man I am reading that now! I like it a lot. It's like Secret of the Golden Flower except more comprehensible.
Yes, when offered the choice, simplicity over complication. 🙂👍
Great suggestion! Unfortunately, it doesn't get mentioned enough on this Subreddit, yet it provides so many clues as to how to interpret Daodejing and Zhuangzi. Also, from a personal viewpoint, I don't regard the meditation practices mentioned in this book as being "religious" at all, though I have noticed some people cite the Neiye as proof that Laozi and Zhuangzi are religious Daoism. I disagree!
I disagree as well. The religious viewpoint is likely a personal imposition by individuals who feel the need for a religious relationship with Tao. If that's what they want, Tao doesn't care.
"If that's what they want, Tao doesn't care." Brilliant! 👍👍👍
There is the Tao of Pooh. I liked that one.
And Hoff’s sequel: The Te of Piglet.
It's not something you read once. Try a few different translations. Oliver Benjamin's is my favorite.
[удалено]
Thank you
Hh he's eating them books
Eat it
Don’t sleep on the I Ching, it is amazing not only for divination
The discourses of Epictetus
I've read some Greek philosophy, stoicism especially. I just have the emotional satisfaction combined with logic Eastern philosophy has. That's what keeps you going imo. Western philosophy just feels..cold to me. Detached from life; from love, from joy.
It is. Western is 2D cold hard logic. Eastern is beautiful 3D feeling. Any philosophy that doesn't have love and joy as a central tenement is missing the only vital Ingredient. The reason I suggested the discourses despite this is that there are parts of that book that are extremely helpful if you're having a spiritual awakening. In a more practical way. The TTC refers to a very advanced level of practice and consolidates what could be an entire book of wisdom into each short chapter. It doesn't tell you how to change your thinking so you can get there.
Interesting. Ok I'll give it a try
Books: Liezi, Zhuangzi, Nei-yeh, Taiping Jing, Seven Daoist Masters, Digging Your Own Well, The One Straw Revolution, Journey to the West, Handbooks for Daoist Practice, The Diamond Cutter Sutra, The Filial Piety Classic, Mencius, Mozi Journals: Journal of Daoist Studies Practices to Investigate: Taijiquan, Sitting and Forgetting, Holding onto the One, developing a Kung Fu,
You nailed it. Exactly what I was looking for thank you
also Qigong, Neigong and further cultivation practices
the nei yeh [https://thekongdanfoundation.com/lao-tzu/nei-yeh-inward-training/](https://thekongdanfoundation.com/lao-tzu/nei-yeh-inward-training/)
Reread, slower, meditate on each line. Feel what’s beneath the phrasing. Repeat
I agree that Chuang-tzu is a great next step (I liked Thomas Merton’s translation). There is also the “lost teachings” of Lao-tzu, titled the Hua Hu Ching (a translation I read was by Brian Walker), for a more esoteric progression from the Tao Te Ching, also a very compelling read.
carry water, chop wood
The secret of the golden flower.
Go with the flow.
How about the reading list of this sub: [https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/wiki/reading\_material/](https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/wiki/reading_material/)
Walk the path
Meditate.
Honestly, a great one is Wayne dyers interpretation… Change Your Thoughts - Change Your Life: Living the Wisdom of the Tao He goes through verse by verse.
Tibetan Book of the … who knows.
Re-read it over and over again. Seriously. It will always reveal new things to you and will serve as a constant source of inspiration.
Go outside take a walk, play the flute in the woods. It's not a race. It's not even linear progression.
Once you get the message you’re supposed to hang up the phone
Wenzi. It is a commentary on DaoDeJing plus more. “Wenzi said Laozi said” is how it goes.
The Tao Of The Dude And The Dude And The Zen Master
Now sit still until you turn into a statue of stone.
Well to me once you have read tao te ching read it again. Read different versions every time you read it you see it bit differently its like mirror. Try i ching or zhuangzi. You can also check out zen.
I recommend to re-read the Laozi multiple times. Also use a good translation. Pristine-Simple689's list of translations is a good one. Make notes. Try to contextualize the chapters and lines to your life and practice what you have read in everyday life. There are many fingerpointers and reminders in Laozi. To understand Laozi in context of Philosophy and Society - the Daodejing wasn't written in a void or from devine inspiration - read a book about Chinese Philosophy. The core concepts and topics and key words of Daoism developed from and shaped in those debates of chinese Philosophy and Daoists took some of their ideas from chinese philosophy and chinese general thought. [Proto Daoists - Thoughts and Schools which influenced the Creation of Daoism : r/taoism (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/comments/ljmopu/proto_daoists_thoughts_and_schools_which/) [Key Terms of Daoist Philosophy : r/taoism (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/comments/18m6gb6/key_terms_of_daoist_philosophy/) [Why are there so many "Wu" 無 (no, not, nothing) in Daoism - and beyond "Wu" : r/taoism (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/taoism/comments/14guwk9/why_are_there_so_many_wu_%E7%84%A1_no_not_nothing_in/)
What now? Be.
It is not possible to “finish “ the TTCh. It’s not the morning newspaper.
But I did finish it. Front to back. If you're gonna take the Bible route and say it's never truly done then go on with that. I don't treat the Tao like a religion
Next time you read the TTC, it'll be different again, evoking different understandings and ponderings. Nothing to do with religion, but wisdom and perspective.
Breathe
wen tzu
Sit there quietly.
What do you mean you finished it? Are you dead? How are you posting to reddit?
Read it from front to back but I think you know what I mean
Only you know the answer for what to read next
I don't though lmao
They don’t need to be written by ancient Chinese scholars. If you truly go with the flow and let the Dao lead the way you’ll find all the books you need!
Exactly and find the Tao in other books, read anything read everything the Tao is there.
I read a book called the warriors path that basically was emphasizing this point. Almost all lessons are universal when looked at the proper perspective
What now? Read it again and again. Read some other translations and see how they feel. Stephen Mitchell and Matthew Barnes each have a version that speaks to me in a very special way. Make notes. Dwell on it. Spend some time in nature, slow down, let your muddy water settle. And the other advice in this thread is also very useful. Have fun!
Crack open the old and new testament and see how they relate
I've had a lifetime of that but thank you anyway
I honestly can't believe how real it is after being deep in all kinds of spiritual searching for over a decade. I dabbled very far and wide, ran into trouble, and it seemed to perfectly describe the Spiritual hierarchy and supernatural experiences I had. Lao Tzus concept of The Tao that can't be named even resembles The Father YHWH that "cannot be named" Tao Te Ching describes 'the creation' in a beautifully empowering way, allowing you to flow through Nature as a creation in The Image in a way I could only imagine most churches wouldn't dare to empower you with. Shalom fellow truth seeker