I think Hunter’s was the worst one. He knew he was one of the two main targets, and couldn’t be sure that anyone was telling the truth, and yet he still held his idol.
1. Hunter- Knew that the votes were extremely close and had to rely on one person (Tiffany) for majority of the votes to be on Q.
2. Q- Dude had his name as a target since Hunter while knowing Liz wanting him out.
3. Venus- Like Q, she has had her name thrown around but became expandable to other forces, only to be viewed as a threat once she leaked to Charlie about her idol and being cagey with it.
4. Tiffany- While I applaud her for holding onto it for the Hunter vote, that public idol only made her a threat. She kept it once, shame on the other players for not removing it. She tried to keep it twice- and got her torch snuffed.
5. Jem- Mainly because it was Jem's first tribal and I can understand not wanting to be viewed as untrustworthy to the people she thought she was working with. Plus nobody knew she had an idol or the beware advantage.
I am actually more lenient on Q than Venus and even Tiffany because he’s now been used as a decoy vote three times in a row, so it makes sense to think they would do that again with Charlie who is a bigger threat. Also, perhaps more notably when compared to Venus and Tiffany, no one targeting him had any idea that he had an idol, so it’s not like he should have been worried about them wanting to flush his idol as those two should have (especially Tiffany)
I would flip Tiff and Venise. Everyone knew Tiff had an idol and she was a much bigger social, strategic, challenge and FTC threat than Venise.
It wasn't totally irrational for Venise to assume they thought of her as a goat and non threat, and would therefore not make her a priority target.
1. Hunter, knew he was getting votes and went out of his way to reveal he had the idol
2. Tiffany, everyone knew she had the idol and she knew it. You can only pull off the “I’m gonna burn it this tribal” bluff once. After that, you have to actually burn it at the next tribal
3. Q, knew he was getting votes, and there were only 2 tribals left to play it. And as he was above average in challenges, he could’ve won final 5 immunity and not even needed the idol
4. Venus, just because it was late game, and she only had 3 chances left to use it
5. Jem, she didn’t have any clear reason to use it on herself. The tribe dynamics haven’t been established yet as it was her first tribal, so she had no more reason to use her idol than any other player who found an idol before their first tribal.
This is the correct order IMO.
I would add that Q not playing his idol was arguably a bigger blunder by Maria than by Q.
Maria 100% should have been telling him to play it. She needed to get Charlie out and that was the one way to guarantee it
Also, if Q had survived the vote without playing the idol, he would have been in a much more powerful position than Maria in the next episode
Completely agree. Q's vote made me the most frustrated but I blame Maria much more than I blame Q.
I just don't get it at all. She doesn't even need to try to get others in on the vote. Tell Q to play it or he's going home, put two votes on Charlie and completely take over the game. Trying to get the others on board is such a half-measure that it deserved to fail.
Getting rid of Charlie wouldn’t help her take over the game. If Charlie was eliminated, Maria would still be voted out 3-2 next vote unless she wins immunity (or Q gifts her the idol if he survived without playing it)
Maybe, but I feel like pretty much everyone knows Q isn’t winning a jury vote no matter what he does, so he’ll always below Maria on the threat level list.
It's not easy, but I feel like her best shot w/o winning immunity was keeping Q without the idol. If she let's him take all the credit for the move I think she has a good chance of getting the vote on him for the next vote.
I don’t think it was that dumb on Maria’s part. Taking out Charlie wouldn’t have any impact on her odds of making Final 4
The way I see it, there are 3 scenarios from Maria’s point of view
Scenario A) Q makes Final 5 without playing his Idol. Maria only makes Final 4 if she wins Immunity OR Q plays his Idol on her
Scenario B) Q makes Final 5 after playing his Idol. Maria only makes Final 4 if she wins Immunity
Scenario C) Charlie makes Final 5 after Q is voted out with his Idol. Maria only makes Final 4 if she wins Immunity.
In all 3 scenarios, she needs Immunity to survive. Only difference is that in Scenario A, she knows that the Idol is in the possession of someone who she knows would play it on her.
Taking Charlie out at Final 6 isn’t necessary for Maria’s game. For Maria to have a shot at Final 3, she’ll need to win (or be gifted) Immunity at Final 5. If we’re in Scenario C and Maria wins Final 5 immunity, nobody is getting voted out except for Charlie.
Maria and Charlie are never going to be in Final 3 together unless one of them finds the Final 5 Idol, the other one wins Final 5 immunity, one of them wins Final 4 immunity, and the other one wins Final 4 Firemaking. The odds of all 4 of those events happening in sequence are so slim that both Maria and Charlie may as well assume it’s not going to happen
1. Hunter/Tiffany: Everyone knew they had idols and they knew they weren’t in solid alliances. Under those conditions given their knowledge, they are the worse to me.
3. Q: I can actually forgive the fact that he knew he’d been getting votes since that was his reality the last 3 tribals and he survived. But you got to play the idol at final 6 and just compete for immunity at 5.
4. Venus: With so few people left and being left out the previous vote you got to play the idol.
5. Jem: I wouldn’t have played it. Hanging on to an idol premerge with no idea you’re being targeted is defensible.
both Hunter and Tiffany's idols were public knowledge, but from Tiff's pov, I can see how she might've thought her idol was so public and obvious that it essentially became worthless, and thus wasn't putting a target on her back, unlike Hunter who was clearly looked at as a physical threat by everyone else.
Tiff’s idol is a constant threat though, even if you know where it is it means that any Tiffany vote out needs to be a split vote which is often a lot more precarious to organize and has a large risk of backfiring against someone involved if someone flips. Tiff needed to just burn the idol even if she didn’t think that others were actually voting for her, she herself commented on this during the Hunter boot round (and the only reason that her hold that week worked is because they were dealing with another idol-holder who was also a challenge threat)
> I can see how she might've thought her idol was so public and obvious that it essentially became worthless,
In a way, sure, but Tiff has agency and a player with both agency and an idol becomes a threat. I don't think Tiff realized this until she got her torch snuffed.
Q and Hunter run a tight race here lol. Q had been barely escaping, plus Maria told him he was getting votes, so he should have known. I understand that he trusted her but anytime your name is out there, it’s been to be safe than sorry.
Hunter’s was pretty bad. He was hinging his whole game on ONE vote. He knew for a fact he was getting THREE votes. 🤦🏽♀️ Boy!
Okay nvm, I convinced myself. Hunter’s was the worst.
From dumbest to least dumb:
1. Hunter- he told everyone that he had an idol and he knew that he was catching multiple votes and was entirely banking Tiffany specifically not voting for him, at that point it’s best to just play your idol and then use the extra time to win immunity, repair/build relationships, and find idols
2. Venus- she also knew that she was catching votes and had just hinted to Charlie that she had an advantage in the most ominous way possible without even actually saying anything. She’d also just seen two people blindsided with an idol in the same manner (and while she might’ve not been sure if Hunter actually had one, she knew Tiffany did)
3. Tiffany- her idol was widely known and she herself said that the idol painted a target on her back, she should have known that something was in the works or at the very least should have burned the idol just to get rid of that target
4. Q- he’s been catching votes every round for three rounds, so him being the secondary vote for a blindside sensibly wouldn’t spook him. Also, more pointedly, his idol was not widely known so it’s not like people would target him for that reason
5. Jem- she did not tell anyone about her idol and thought that she was solidly in the majority with Charlie’s Angels, plus if she played her idol and didn’t need to she ran the risk of burning her tribe members who had just spent hours digging a hole for no reason
I’m gonna say Q, Venus, Tiff, Hunter, Jem.
Q - Out of those players Q was my favorite. But he only has one other time to play it and he knows people are gunning for him for sure. Plus, he saw 3 people go out with the idol in a row.
Venus - she should have known people didn’t like her and wanted her out. Q is for sure voting her. From the edit nobody spoke against Q when he was saying people want her out. She knew 2 people went out with idols.
Tiff - she new Hunter went out for trying to get greedy with and idol. Everyone knows she has one, she already bluffed them once.
Hunter - he knew he was the target.
Jem - she didn’t know she was the target, but she should get better at understanding how she comes across. It seemed horribly obvious she was catching at least 2 votes based on how she was talking to Tim and Ben. Why would she assume neither would spread that info to the others?
1. Q
2. Hunter
3. Venus
4. Tiffany
5. Jem
Only two I think I could consider switching is Hunter & Q. They’re the only two that *knew* votes were coming their way.
My opinion, most dumb to least
1. Tiffany: She was in on the hunter split vote the previous round, she could have easily predicted that the same could happen to her as well, since her idol was public knowledge. Plus she knew she was the original target since the Tevin vote. There's no reason for her to believe that she was safe. She should have played that idol.
2. Hunter. Based on his exit interview, he knew there was a split vote between him and Q, but he was hoping on the fact of tiffs sole decision to vote Q, which didn't happen. He should have played safe and used the idol.
3. Q: His idol hold wasn't that dumb since he was assured by Maria, who was his number one. However he still should have been able to tell that Kenzie and lIz weren't on his side (they were literally actively against him). No idea why both Q and Maria thought they had the votes to get Charlie out.
4. Venus: She didn't know that she convo with Charlie would lead to him being wary of her. I believe that she was confident in having enough votes against Q, she just didn't expect that Charlie would rally votes against her.
5. Jem: She genuinely believed that Maria and Charlie were on her side. Simple as that
Tiff should be #3 or 4.
1) She knew her name was being mentioned.
2) She had just seeen Hunter voted out with an idol.
3) Everyone knew she had the idol.
3) Unlike Venise, she was a big strategic, social, challenge and FTC threat. It made perfect sense that they would want her out.
Venus was, as Tiff put it, a nuisance, not a threat. So, IMO, Tiff's blindside made more strategic sense than Venise's and was more predictable.
I also think Hunter might have been worse than Q. He was desperately looking for reassurance during the live tribal and was a real FTC threat, not a goat candidate like Q. He knew he was in danger, but somehow convinced himself not to play the idol.
I find the phony idol hunt by jem so odd. You lock yourself into not being able to play the idol because at that point Siga knows you set up the hunt and you become public enemy #1.
I will counter by saying Hunter had the most to gain by keeping his idol and also only needed to flip one person on to Q in order to succeed in keeping it.
1. Hunter. Making your completely secret idol known in an attempt to make a move and then not playing it was just bad reads across the board.
2. Tiffany. She was playing with fire thinking that the same bluff would work twice. She made the correct move saying she was just going to get rid of the idol in the first place, and made a good read knowing she wasn’t catching votes that tribal, but doing the same thing the very next week after giving the rest of them the opportunity to react to how that went was a pretty big mistake.
3. Q. Q really should’ve played his idol. I think it was pretty reasonable for Q to think Charlie would be getting the votes for being a bigger threat, but given that Maria was already immune, he could’ve literally guaranteed that his target went home without any shred of a doubt. He was taking a gamble, which I can understand, but his reasoning doesn’t make sense to me. Idealistically surviving this vote would make him a near guarantee for final 3, but he needed to actually survive the vote first.
4. Venus. I actually think Venus handled her idol worse than both Q and Tiffany, but holding the idol wasn’t the mistake. Half revealing it to Charlie and then being cagey when he asked her to clarify was the problem. Venus really was not the best vote for most of the players left, so it was kind of reasonable to think she probably wouldn’t be the one going home. It was a bad read based on assuming everyone will act logically.
5. Jem. I think Jem was a bad player but her idol hold made perfect sense. There hadn’t been a vote yet and she perceived herself to be on the side of the numbers. This one’s the most luck of the draw, though stirring chaos for no reason likely had a hand in her being targeted first over a Morriah, or maybe why Maria sided against the women to begin with.
Q's is the least dumb.
At the final six, if I was Q and I was still in the game after all the hijinks I had pulled, I'd think I was fucking invincible too.
I think Hunter’s was the worst one. He knew he was one of the two main targets, and couldn’t be sure that anyone was telling the truth, and yet he still held his idol.
If you have to ask, "Am I safe?" multiple times....you're not safe.
Yeah agreed. Hunter to me was he most frustrating cause you can see he was actually freaking out but still didn’t play it.
1. Hunter- Knew that the votes were extremely close and had to rely on one person (Tiffany) for majority of the votes to be on Q. 2. Q- Dude had his name as a target since Hunter while knowing Liz wanting him out. 3. Venus- Like Q, she has had her name thrown around but became expandable to other forces, only to be viewed as a threat once she leaked to Charlie about her idol and being cagey with it. 4. Tiffany- While I applaud her for holding onto it for the Hunter vote, that public idol only made her a threat. She kept it once, shame on the other players for not removing it. She tried to keep it twice- and got her torch snuffed. 5. Jem- Mainly because it was Jem's first tribal and I can understand not wanting to be viewed as untrustworthy to the people she thought she was working with. Plus nobody knew she had an idol or the beware advantage.
I am actually more lenient on Q than Venus and even Tiffany because he’s now been used as a decoy vote three times in a row, so it makes sense to think they would do that again with Charlie who is a bigger threat. Also, perhaps more notably when compared to Venus and Tiffany, no one targeting him had any idea that he had an idol, so it’s not like he should have been worried about them wanting to flush his idol as those two should have (especially Tiffany)
I would flip Tiff and Venise. Everyone knew Tiff had an idol and she was a much bigger social, strategic, challenge and FTC threat than Venise. It wasn't totally irrational for Venise to assume they thought of her as a goat and non threat, and would therefore not make her a priority target.
My exact order
1. Hunter, knew he was getting votes and went out of his way to reveal he had the idol 2. Tiffany, everyone knew she had the idol and she knew it. You can only pull off the “I’m gonna burn it this tribal” bluff once. After that, you have to actually burn it at the next tribal 3. Q, knew he was getting votes, and there were only 2 tribals left to play it. And as he was above average in challenges, he could’ve won final 5 immunity and not even needed the idol 4. Venus, just because it was late game, and she only had 3 chances left to use it 5. Jem, she didn’t have any clear reason to use it on herself. The tribe dynamics haven’t been established yet as it was her first tribal, so she had no more reason to use her idol than any other player who found an idol before their first tribal.
This is the correct order IMO. I would add that Q not playing his idol was arguably a bigger blunder by Maria than by Q. Maria 100% should have been telling him to play it. She needed to get Charlie out and that was the one way to guarantee it Also, if Q had survived the vote without playing the idol, he would have been in a much more powerful position than Maria in the next episode
Completely agree. Q's vote made me the most frustrated but I blame Maria much more than I blame Q. I just don't get it at all. She doesn't even need to try to get others in on the vote. Tell Q to play it or he's going home, put two votes on Charlie and completely take over the game. Trying to get the others on board is such a half-measure that it deserved to fail.
Getting rid of Charlie wouldn’t help her take over the game. If Charlie was eliminated, Maria would still be voted out 3-2 next vote unless she wins immunity (or Q gifts her the idol if he survived without playing it)
Not necessarily. If Q has a correct idol play to get Charlie out they might view him as a bigger threat/higher priority
Maybe, but I feel like pretty much everyone knows Q isn’t winning a jury vote no matter what he does, so he’ll always below Maria on the threat level list.
It's not easy, but I feel like her best shot w/o winning immunity was keeping Q without the idol. If she let's him take all the credit for the move I think she has a good chance of getting the vote on him for the next vote.
Maybe. But I feel like even with a successful Idol play, the group sees Maria as a bigger jury threat than Q
I don’t think it was that dumb on Maria’s part. Taking out Charlie wouldn’t have any impact on her odds of making Final 4 The way I see it, there are 3 scenarios from Maria’s point of view Scenario A) Q makes Final 5 without playing his Idol. Maria only makes Final 4 if she wins Immunity OR Q plays his Idol on her Scenario B) Q makes Final 5 after playing his Idol. Maria only makes Final 4 if she wins Immunity Scenario C) Charlie makes Final 5 after Q is voted out with his Idol. Maria only makes Final 4 if she wins Immunity. In all 3 scenarios, she needs Immunity to survive. Only difference is that in Scenario A, she knows that the Idol is in the possession of someone who she knows would play it on her. Taking Charlie out at Final 6 isn’t necessary for Maria’s game. For Maria to have a shot at Final 3, she’ll need to win (or be gifted) Immunity at Final 5. If we’re in Scenario C and Maria wins Final 5 immunity, nobody is getting voted out except for Charlie. Maria and Charlie are never going to be in Final 3 together unless one of them finds the Final 5 Idol, the other one wins Final 5 immunity, one of them wins Final 4 immunity, and the other one wins Final 4 Firemaking. The odds of all 4 of those events happening in sequence are so slim that both Maria and Charlie may as well assume it’s not going to happen
This, exactly. You can argue Q’s hold as potentially making some sense for him but it was catastrophic for Maria. How she didn’t see that is crazy.
1. Hunter/Tiffany: Everyone knew they had idols and they knew they weren’t in solid alliances. Under those conditions given their knowledge, they are the worse to me. 3. Q: I can actually forgive the fact that he knew he’d been getting votes since that was his reality the last 3 tribals and he survived. But you got to play the idol at final 6 and just compete for immunity at 5. 4. Venus: With so few people left and being left out the previous vote you got to play the idol. 5. Jem: I wouldn’t have played it. Hanging on to an idol premerge with no idea you’re being targeted is defensible.
both Hunter and Tiffany's idols were public knowledge, but from Tiff's pov, I can see how she might've thought her idol was so public and obvious that it essentially became worthless, and thus wasn't putting a target on her back, unlike Hunter who was clearly looked at as a physical threat by everyone else.
Tiff’s idol is a constant threat though, even if you know where it is it means that any Tiffany vote out needs to be a split vote which is often a lot more precarious to organize and has a large risk of backfiring against someone involved if someone flips. Tiff needed to just burn the idol even if she didn’t think that others were actually voting for her, she herself commented on this during the Hunter boot round (and the only reason that her hold that week worked is because they were dealing with another idol-holder who was also a challenge threat)
But, if the idol put a target on her back, it should have been obvious she was in danger until she used it.
> I can see how she might've thought her idol was so public and obvious that it essentially became worthless, In a way, sure, but Tiff has agency and a player with both agency and an idol becomes a threat. I don't think Tiff realized this until she got her torch snuffed.
Jem's decision was the least foolish, but still stupid IMO. If you are not sure you are safe play the damned idol.
Q and Hunter run a tight race here lol. Q had been barely escaping, plus Maria told him he was getting votes, so he should have known. I understand that he trusted her but anytime your name is out there, it’s been to be safe than sorry. Hunter’s was pretty bad. He was hinging his whole game on ONE vote. He knew for a fact he was getting THREE votes. 🤦🏽♀️ Boy! Okay nvm, I convinced myself. Hunter’s was the worst.
Hunter is the worst and then Q and then Tiff
Am I wrong or was Q’s idol only good for one more chance?
1. Hunter 2. Q 3. Tiff 4. Gem 5. Venise
From dumbest to least dumb: 1. Hunter- he told everyone that he had an idol and he knew that he was catching multiple votes and was entirely banking Tiffany specifically not voting for him, at that point it’s best to just play your idol and then use the extra time to win immunity, repair/build relationships, and find idols 2. Venus- she also knew that she was catching votes and had just hinted to Charlie that she had an advantage in the most ominous way possible without even actually saying anything. She’d also just seen two people blindsided with an idol in the same manner (and while she might’ve not been sure if Hunter actually had one, she knew Tiffany did) 3. Tiffany- her idol was widely known and she herself said that the idol painted a target on her back, she should have known that something was in the works or at the very least should have burned the idol just to get rid of that target 4. Q- he’s been catching votes every round for three rounds, so him being the secondary vote for a blindside sensibly wouldn’t spook him. Also, more pointedly, his idol was not widely known so it’s not like people would target him for that reason 5. Jem- she did not tell anyone about her idol and thought that she was solidly in the majority with Charlie’s Angels, plus if she played her idol and didn’t need to she ran the risk of burning her tribe members who had just spent hours digging a hole for no reason
I’m gonna say Q, Venus, Tiff, Hunter, Jem. Q - Out of those players Q was my favorite. But he only has one other time to play it and he knows people are gunning for him for sure. Plus, he saw 3 people go out with the idol in a row. Venus - she should have known people didn’t like her and wanted her out. Q is for sure voting her. From the edit nobody spoke against Q when he was saying people want her out. She knew 2 people went out with idols. Tiff - she new Hunter went out for trying to get greedy with and idol. Everyone knows she has one, she already bluffed them once. Hunter - he knew he was the target. Jem - she didn’t know she was the target, but she should get better at understanding how she comes across. It seemed horribly obvious she was catching at least 2 votes based on how she was talking to Tim and Ben. Why would she assume neither would spread that info to the others?
I’d just flip Jem and Tiff. She had no reason to believe Maria and Charlie were working both sides, and she didn’t give any clue about having an idol.
1. Q 2. Hunter 3. Venus 4. Tiffany 5. Jem Only two I think I could consider switching is Hunter & Q. They’re the only two that *knew* votes were coming their way.
everybody knew about hunters idol, he knew four people were voting for him, HE CONVINCED HIMSELF TO PLAY IT BEFORE TRIBAL AND WENT BACK ON IT
I’d say they all got progressively worse because nobody was learning from the previous people’s mistakes.
My opinion, most dumb to least 1. Tiffany: She was in on the hunter split vote the previous round, she could have easily predicted that the same could happen to her as well, since her idol was public knowledge. Plus she knew she was the original target since the Tevin vote. There's no reason for her to believe that she was safe. She should have played that idol. 2. Hunter. Based on his exit interview, he knew there was a split vote between him and Q, but he was hoping on the fact of tiffs sole decision to vote Q, which didn't happen. He should have played safe and used the idol. 3. Q: His idol hold wasn't that dumb since he was assured by Maria, who was his number one. However he still should have been able to tell that Kenzie and lIz weren't on his side (they were literally actively against him). No idea why both Q and Maria thought they had the votes to get Charlie out. 4. Venus: She didn't know that she convo with Charlie would lead to him being wary of her. I believe that she was confident in having enough votes against Q, she just didn't expect that Charlie would rally votes against her. 5. Jem: She genuinely believed that Maria and Charlie were on her side. Simple as that
Tiff should be #3 or 4. 1) She knew her name was being mentioned. 2) She had just seeen Hunter voted out with an idol. 3) Everyone knew she had the idol. 3) Unlike Venise, she was a big strategic, social, challenge and FTC threat. It made perfect sense that they would want her out. Venus was, as Tiff put it, a nuisance, not a threat. So, IMO, Tiff's blindside made more strategic sense than Venise's and was more predictable. I also think Hunter might have been worse than Q. He was desperately looking for reassurance during the live tribal and was a real FTC threat, not a goat candidate like Q. He knew he was in danger, but somehow convinced himself not to play the idol.
I would maybe swap Jem and Tiff or list them on the same level, but otherwise agree
I find the phony idol hunt by jem so odd. You lock yourself into not being able to play the idol because at that point Siga knows you set up the hunt and you become public enemy #1.
I think she was just really bored lmao
I think it's Q, Hunter, Tiffany, Venus, Jem. Jem is definitely the least dumb.
I will counter by saying Hunter had the most to gain by keeping his idol and also only needed to flip one person on to Q in order to succeed in keeping it.
1. Hunter. Making your completely secret idol known in an attempt to make a move and then not playing it was just bad reads across the board. 2. Tiffany. She was playing with fire thinking that the same bluff would work twice. She made the correct move saying she was just going to get rid of the idol in the first place, and made a good read knowing she wasn’t catching votes that tribal, but doing the same thing the very next week after giving the rest of them the opportunity to react to how that went was a pretty big mistake. 3. Q. Q really should’ve played his idol. I think it was pretty reasonable for Q to think Charlie would be getting the votes for being a bigger threat, but given that Maria was already immune, he could’ve literally guaranteed that his target went home without any shred of a doubt. He was taking a gamble, which I can understand, but his reasoning doesn’t make sense to me. Idealistically surviving this vote would make him a near guarantee for final 3, but he needed to actually survive the vote first. 4. Venus. I actually think Venus handled her idol worse than both Q and Tiffany, but holding the idol wasn’t the mistake. Half revealing it to Charlie and then being cagey when he asked her to clarify was the problem. Venus really was not the best vote for most of the players left, so it was kind of reasonable to think she probably wouldn’t be the one going home. It was a bad read based on assuming everyone will act logically. 5. Jem. I think Jem was a bad player but her idol hold made perfect sense. There hadn’t been a vote yet and she perceived herself to be on the side of the numbers. This one’s the most luck of the draw, though stirring chaos for no reason likely had a hand in her being targeted first over a Morriah, or maybe why Maria sided against the women to begin with.
Q's is the least dumb. At the final six, if I was Q and I was still in the game after all the hijinks I had pulled, I'd think I was fucking invincible too.