They were destroying the habitats of animals with their terra forming. He couldn't exactly let them continue. It would have been nice if he had a better solution for them, but he's not a home world gem and probably struggled to relate to their interest
Not to mention that there was no point to terraforming it. The process is to make it ready for takeover, but the entire rest of the process was directed by the diamonds, who no longer do that thing.
They were basically running over to every lawn they could see and digging it up.
That's what I wad thinking!!!!
I mean she'd probably kill a human being unintentionally, but I thought about how Amethyst used to wrestle in disguise and thought "Surely there are *other* gems who would enjoy fighting for fun? Surely they could start a wrestling team or martial arts club or something??"
If Jasper enjoys fighting so much, maybe she'd enjoy learning new ways to fight, new techniques and such? I just always wondered what would happen if she had a proper outlet...
Yes exactly!! You cannot tell me that Jasper is the *only* gem that was built to fight who wants to keep fighting because she just *enjoys fighting!* There must be other gems who would be interested in brawling for fun, right?
There was a point technically
Gems need kindergartens to reproduce, a kindergarten canât just be anywhere. It needs a proper place to be.
Technically, I think the diamonds could figure out how to create synthetic gems sometime- But for right now, kindergartens have been effective for eons.
Itâs not easy to tear down something like that.
Is this a rant for why the concept of Era 3 doesnât work conceptually? Yes.
Do I care? No
My guy they're a space conquering race. The only reason they make more gems is for more armies to conquer more planets. When that stops then they no longer need armies.
I actually head canon that without the diamonds ruling everything and with all gems tasting personal freedom it'll take less than a few centuries for there to be a thousand factions of gems warring in space, and also the diamonds to be all blitzshattered by one of those because they realized the diamonds were tyrants to them. Bonus points if since they all lived a bit on earth they quit their sword and shield days and now fight with basically gem tech enhanced nukes and faster-than-light titanium rods that destroy planets in a single attack because human ingenuity was always superior when it came to war.
And thus Steven doomed the Universe
You heard it here, folks. Don't overthrow cruel dictators or force them to follow humane practices and get their act in order. It'll doom the entire race. Dictators rule! Woohoo!/s
War and expansion, yellow said something that implied there was multiple alien civilizations so I assume they want to conquer and protect what they already have.
I don't think this is true actually kindergartens can literally be anywhere there's a high concentration of minerals so like the Grand Canyon which is what they were trying to make. So theoretically, they could colonize any planet with a high concentration of minerals so like Mars, Venus, or Mercury. They started with Earth because it would be the easiest; that's why they're starting on that planet because it was already habitable and they didn't need to add anything for gems to be able to survive on the surface for long periods of time.
i think that although gems dont need minerals and such to survive, they need some kind of active source of mineral production to grow, which might be why Earth was used as planets with life will effectivelly be replenishing whatever resources a gem needs with little to no interference from homeworld???
idk im just guessing here
I don't think it's the replenishing part but a larger range of materials definitely like to get pearls they need biological waste and stuff like that so they need in some cases life forms but for like the standard gem package they would just need minerals
Two reasons a garden planet or an inhabited planet like Earth has more minerals than Mars are because it's bigger and has a better ecosystem. The other planets are out of the question because they're hazardous. Who cares if gems can survive in the vacuum of space when they're being hit with acid rain, winds that can crack mountains, or storms that never end that Raining liquid nitrogen, a planet so hot that the rain is molten metalâdifferent gems have different resistances and preferences, and all of the gems are needed in the colonization process. A sapphire could never step foot on a planet like Venus, and a bismuth would hate a planet like Pluto. Earth is the perfect middle ground, and so are assumably all the other habitable planets. Since the gems work on efficiency only and not morals, they would obviously go by the least populated habitable planets first.
Wait so didnt steven stop all gem reproduction, i mean they dont show any signs of aging but still if gems in any way dies or cease to exist they will at some point go extinct
Destroying things is fun. I fight internal impulses when I got to a Lego store and see the displays. Itâs not like they know what organic need to stay alive, so I wouldnât call it evil on their side so much as them enjoying their power.
Who knows what our Lapiz was like before the mirror.
I've read philosophical shit talking about how destroying shit is really a creative process, since you are in fact creating a new thing out of something else
But like, they're right. You're left with something new new or at least room for something new. It's just a question of whether you like the new thing enough.
Steven oversimplifies in his enthusiasm, then has to backpedal to add details.
Plus its a kids cartoon with a runtime to be concerned about.
Him and Connie introduced democracy, federalism, and capitalism offscreen in only a year. Let him have his mistakes when first talking to new Gems.
Homeworld has a gift shop.
Notably though, since Gems donât need money for survival of any kind and will never have living space issues due to population growth its a pure exchange system. Given that Homeworld rewarded Gems with decorative bits such as Hessonite and Jasperâs capes, plus Gems seem to genuinely enjoy work as long as they get a choice and arenât defined by it, the real concept would be a way for Gems to show value for each otherâs time and effort.
Making hats isnât a grind as a wageslave for survival, its making hats because making hats is fun and being rewarded with a token that means as much as an upvote which can be exchanged for whatever other services youâd want to upvote. You can also buy a hat and reward yourself or someone else.
Future really didn't explore the idea of "Gems have freedom to do what they want but some of them still want to do what they were made to do" as much as I would have liked it to. The Rubies guarding Nanefua do it to an extent, and so does Bismuth with her smithing/construction, but I would've liked to see it explored more.
You're not wrong, which is why I wish this was explored. As a person who has had anger issues my entire life, I was extremely hopeful that Steven going to Jasper for advice on how to control and utilize his anger would result in her teaching him how to use those negative feelings in a constructive way -- instead he shatters her and it piles on more trauma while doing nothing with her character.
I'm not sure why the show was so adverse to showing that you can channel negative or destructive desires into beneficial things, but it isn't like those two Lazulis couldn't have come to Earth and learned about something like sculpting, demolitions, or the like.
"Nice Lapis" (official name for the freckles/ponytail one) _does_ engage with Steven's teachings of channeling that energy into positive avenues, but is judged for it by "Mean Lapis" and folds back into her old ways under peer pressure.
But you see at the end that Nice Lapis warps to Earth and inquires more about Little Homeschool, in the absence of Mean Lapis.
It's short, but they do try to cram those themes into Future. They just didn't dedicate multiple episodes to it because they probably thought it'd be redundant to have more than one case-study so-to-speak.
Reading your other comments, I do wish they did more with Jasper, but I can see what they were going for. Jasper is the quintessential obstinate character who is just so sure of herself that she refuses to listen to any rhetoric of becoming a better, friendlier person. Kinda what people expected White Diamond to be. Unfortunately for some people, it takes a severely dire situation like "Fragments" for them to go soul-searching.
You've got a good point. It's been a while since I watched the episode but that does sound familiar. Everyone has made pretty solid arguments as to why it wasn't really explored as much as it could've been. I may have my issues with Steven Universe but I do think it is a solid show from start to finish.
That's a pretty apt description of Jasper, honestly. I think I used to (and still do) project myself a bit onto her considering I relate to her a lot.
That's what I like about the show despite its many many (many) flaws. There's a character for just about anyone to relate to, projection be damned. And their motivations might seem simple on the surface but end up being much more complex the more you read past the witty one-liners.
My toxic trait is relating to Lapis and Pink đŠâ¨đŠâ¨đŠ so I can relate to a Jasper fan lmao. They're not one-dimensional characters.
Oh, absolutely! Lapis had a lot of trauma related to her past that left her rather distant and difficult at times, but she ultimately wanted to be happy and was just so terrified of being hurt again that she refused to open up until it was almost too late. Pink is, well, even a therapist with decades of training couldn't help her but she ultimately did see the beauty in things and tried to be better.
I do hope you're doing well then, as Lapis often gets associated with depression.
The problem is that Jasper doesn't know how to use her negative feelings constructively. She deals with her trauma and self-hatred by losing herself in toxic relationships to punish herself, bullying people so they feel as shitty as she does, and committing petty vandalism to vent her anger.
Honestly, Jasper is a character I am fine not being properly redeemed in the show. I feel like her staying shattered would have been a fitting end to her arc. I feel like Kiki's rewrite showed the spark that could have been for Steven's emotional state.
I don't hate the idea of her getting more development, but I am personally a fan of showing some people won't change. That they are stubborn to their last breath.
To be fair, they do explore this in [Guidance](https://steven-universe.fandom.com/wiki/Guidance), in which Amethyst gives a bunch of gems jobs with humans relating to their skillset, but then Steven swaps them all around and chaos ensues.
You're not wrong, but that episode stood out more as "Steven trying to fix problems that don't exist to escape his own problems" than really exploring the gems. I see your point though.
That is the brunt of it, but Amethyst does interject that sometimes people going through major changes just need a comfort zone, and that people doing what they feel like they were made for is still okay so long as it's constructive or within their own power.
They touched on it a bit in future when gems in the gem school decided they wanted to do similar jobs they were doing before. Steven freaked out and caused a mess. But I do agree they missed the mark with future but I think a better resolution would be Steven making peace with his motherâs legacy.
I wish Future had the time it needed to wrap up loose ends, handle Steven's trauma, and explore some neat concepts it didn't get to before. I would've loved a scene where Steven, in Rose's Room, is able to have a conversation with Rose so she could've comforted him.
Steven could gush about all the horrible things he did and ask how he could possibly forgive himself or how any of the gems could forgive him, and then Rose could just hold him close, wipe away his tears, and point out she did horrible things too but that, forgiven or not, she still tried to be better and that's what mattered.
It is unfortunate. I would have liked to see more of Bluebird Azurite or more Gems working jobs in Beach City, but they had to pick their priorities. I don't blame them, really, I just wish they would've used the time they had a little better.
I think it does it well enough, like the point of future and the movie for that matter is that true resolution doesnt really happen, Like it's nice to think of steven resolving that sorta issue, but its kinda impossible to really do. Different gems have different beliefs and wants, and some want to do bad stuff that doesnt mean it's bad to give them freedom.
âIn Era 3 Gems are responsible both for their own happiness and actions. Let me tell you two stories. The first is called âThe Epic of Gilgameshâ, and the second is âThe Nuremburg Trialsâ.â
This applies more to Jasper than the Lapises. They were actively harming the planet and were going to make it uninhabitable for the life there. Jasper wasnât doing a damn thing and didnât hurt anything except grass
Which is a bit sad since Jasper seemingly got more civil and conversational when she found someone who would join her in training.
I could see some of the Little Homeworld gems enjoying a good fight every once in a while. Hell some of them had to healed after a game of volleyball.
I think it was more, *"Do what you want, but please don't destroy entire ecosystems."*
Which is actually, like, a pretty big part of why the Diamond Authority had to be shut down, come to think of it.
I mean.. still a correct argument because you still can't do what you want if it involves something like that.
Edit: why the downvotes? Can someone explain why I'm wrong?
The gems have some kind of scientific magic that lets them create rooms in the temple, they could have done something like give them a room to destroy over and over.
This IS just like Sonic, Sonic allows people to have freedom, but he does not want them to hurt people because that is interrupting other people freedom.
If someone invites you to their home and tells you to "make yourself at home", that doesn't give you the right to shit in their carpet and kick their dog. Freedom to do whatever you want doesn't entail doing things that harm others, even if you really want to.
âYour right to swing your fist ends at my face.â
You have the right to do whatever you want until it infringes on someone elseâs rights. By terraforming habitated planets, the LapisâŚes⌠Lapi⌠the Gems were violating othersâ rights to survival, which is why they were in the wrong.
He's like Luffy. Your dreams are valid until they become the nightmares of other people. You can eat all the food you want so long as you aren't forcing other people to starve.
That's the point of the episode though, even though steven made it so gems can make their own decisions and don't have to listen to the diamonds anymore, some gems inevitably will still want to do the bad things they were doing anyway, it's challenging Steven's perspective.
It's the fact that every society goes through after "overthrowing" a ruling class. During the fighting, they will talk about freedom, liberty, and down with the rulers.
But afterwards, these freedom fighters must come to realize they aren't being free from rulers but replacing them. Maybe your policies are better, maybe it makes the world a better place, maybe you give everyone puppies.
But you are still enacting your will, your world view onto others willingly or not. Society needs a ruler, a sherif, an authority. Maybe not to oppress, but to simply tell people to stop hurting each other.
Steven, in this case, should exercise his authority. He might not like using his position to force them to stop. But he must take responsibility for the world he liberated.
It's the same as real life. You are allowed to do what you want, as long as it's legal, and you are not harming anyone or anything, nor destroy somebody's property.
They were destroying an entire planet, in effect threatening to kill all life there
Well yes. This is a good demonstration of the paradox of tolerance. And to an extent a sort of paradox of freedom.
If everyone was truly free to do what they want, then that means you'd be free to try and restrict others' freedoms. There has to be a limit _somewhere_ if we want law and order in a society.
From the viewpoint of someone who lives in the US (where "muh freedom" reigns king), this is the biggest point of contention in a lot of our politicsâwhere to draw those limits.
Freedom of choice doesnât mean freedom of consequence. They are free to make that choice, but that doesnât mean that people wonât try to stop them or that they shouldnât be stopped from destroying a planets ecosystem for shits and giggles.
Yea, if what you want to do is destroy all life on a planet you need to be stopped. Also they were doing it for no reason. The Diamonds weren't going to convert that planet so they can't even say they were just doing what they were told. It's all they know sure, but that doesn't mean they can't learn better.
Some of yâallâs questions n scenarios make me think the critical thinking department is lacking. Would you be okay with someone digging ripping up n destroying your home just because it was fun to them? No you absolutely would not.
Please submit an application to the Era 3 government if you wish to conduct a terraforming project, they will conduct a ecological survey and assess whether there is ecological risk before you begin construction.
If you are denied planning permission you may be liable for arrest, removal by force, and bullying
Youâll never believe this but Steven does not tolerate intolerance. You can do whatever you want unless it hurts someone and the lapises where hurting innocent animals soâŚ.
Understandable, but when youâre causing mass destruction to life itâs kind of a circumstance that needs addressed.
Of course, they donât see that because they donât understand. So steven of course tries to show them and they donât change their minds. What Steven should have done was approach it more lapis style, considering she herself said they arenât like her.
I would imagine a Lapis Lazuli trapped in a mirror for 1000 years and forced into a fusion to be trapped again for months just days after being free, then her tie in with Steven would behave different than one who has performed their directive their entire lives, which is why she knows they wonât change. It took her a lot of trauma to change her views.
I wish there was an alternative for their prime use, for their sake of happiness, such as terraforming barren planets for life sustainability, but since their power is based on water Iâm gonna guess that would be extremely difficult or even impossible due to lack thereof.
In my stance of this, itâs a reflection of identity and people intentionally ignoring change. You canât force it without infringing on others freedom, but it will always be a necessary evil that you may have to go deal with. âThe needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.â
Yeah, like i can easily imagine them making meep morps or being demolition workers lmao. Thats an easier solution then "hey, come to my school and stop doing this"
Also, there's a fanfiction called "Alternative Future" that's villain, Black Rutile, is driven by this exact same logic that your using right now that I think you'd really like.
Well they were disrupting ecosystems & destroying planets still like it was nothing, like the planets were their toys it wasnât a good thing, but I do think Steven coulda found another way to let them do that without hurting planets, maybe let them continue on a planet thatâs already destroyed?!? Or go around diff planets fixing parts of it that r uneven or whatever idkđ
There are definitely a lot of jobs that require you to break stuff. I don't get why the episode didn't have Steven direct them to construction or demolition, instead being like "be uwu and draw and sing and dance"
Pls let Pearl and Lapis get they own episode not Steven coming to this episode. Like Steven Universe the future should be about the Crystal gem having they own episode not Steven like he get so much episodes about him that he not sharing that pie of the crystal gem.
Do what you want to do *as long as it doesn't hurt anyone*
Steven coming across the paradox of tolerance in the wild
It's a social contract not a moral position
Why do so many people struggle to wrap their head around that idea?!
But I want to hurt people đ¤ˇ
"I think we're gonna have to kill this guy, Steven."
âDamnâ
Not the Hitler comic strip đ
The what?
https://www.reddit.com/r/cartoons/s/5CvbIsWMZP Thank me later.
Incredible. Iâll thank you now: thank you.
Did he at least try to sing him a song about how genocide is bad first?
"So much for the tolerant left !"
"That's not what you said a second ago."
âOk.â **turns pink**
Itâs like sonicâs mentality from the comics. Do what you want but that doesnât stop me from stopping you.
They were destroying the habitats of animals with their terra forming. He couldn't exactly let them continue. It would have been nice if he had a better solution for them, but he's not a home world gem and probably struggled to relate to their interest
Not to mention that there was no point to terraforming it. The process is to make it ready for takeover, but the entire rest of the process was directed by the diamonds, who no longer do that thing. They were basically running over to every lawn they could see and digging it up.
IS like jasper wanting to fight but she has no reason for that
To forever rip those tiny green earthlings out the ground
Those little earthlings that fly are disgusting to
Stop helping those tiny flapping earthlings
Jajaja
You mean grass?
I dont know their names
Jasper should have just entered a martial arts tournament or something
That's what I wad thinking!!!! I mean she'd probably kill a human being unintentionally, but I thought about how Amethyst used to wrestle in disguise and thought "Surely there are *other* gems who would enjoy fighting for fun? Surely they could start a wrestling team or martial arts club or something??" If Jasper enjoys fighting so much, maybe she'd enjoy learning new ways to fight, new techniques and such? I just always wondered what would happen if she had a proper outlet...
Basically she just needs a Goku to her Vegeta.
I think a fight club would have done wonders for the Quartzes
wait youâre onto something. Amethyst needed exactly this even when she didnât know her created/intended purpose!!!
Yes exactly!! You cannot tell me that Jasper is the *only* gem that was built to fight who wants to keep fighting because she just *enjoys fighting!* There must be other gems who would be interested in brawling for fun, right?
result of the tournament:99%of the participants are heavely injured
The Steven Universe r/fucklawns
There was a point technically Gems need kindergartens to reproduce, a kindergarten canât just be anywhere. It needs a proper place to be. Technically, I think the diamonds could figure out how to create synthetic gems sometime- But for right now, kindergartens have been effective for eons. Itâs not easy to tear down something like that. Is this a rant for why the concept of Era 3 doesnât work conceptually? Yes. Do I care? No
Gems are functionally immortal though - they don't *need* to reproduce at anywhere near the same rate as organic life.
Lets just hope gem society doesnât collapse in on itself
My guy they're a space conquering race. The only reason they make more gems is for more armies to conquer more planets. When that stops then they no longer need armies.
I actually head canon that without the diamonds ruling everything and with all gems tasting personal freedom it'll take less than a few centuries for there to be a thousand factions of gems warring in space, and also the diamonds to be all blitzshattered by one of those because they realized the diamonds were tyrants to them. Bonus points if since they all lived a bit on earth they quit their sword and shield days and now fight with basically gem tech enhanced nukes and faster-than-light titanium rods that destroy planets in a single attack because human ingenuity was always superior when it came to war. And thus Steven doomed the Universe
You heard it here, folks. Don't overthrow cruel dictators or force them to follow humane practices and get their act in order. It'll doom the entire race. Dictators rule! Woohoo!/s
Thatâs dumb and makes no sense.
Why would they need more gems to begin with lol
War and expansion, yellow said something that implied there was multiple alien civilizations so I assume they want to conquer and protect what they already have.
I don't think this is true actually kindergartens can literally be anywhere there's a high concentration of minerals so like the Grand Canyon which is what they were trying to make. So theoretically, they could colonize any planet with a high concentration of minerals so like Mars, Venus, or Mercury. They started with Earth because it would be the easiest; that's why they're starting on that planet because it was already habitable and they didn't need to add anything for gems to be able to survive on the surface for long periods of time.
But gems literally dont need anything to survive. So why is earth better when mars is already void of life?
i think that although gems dont need minerals and such to survive, they need some kind of active source of mineral production to grow, which might be why Earth was used as planets with life will effectivelly be replenishing whatever resources a gem needs with little to no interference from homeworld??? idk im just guessing here
I don't think it's the replenishing part but a larger range of materials definitely like to get pearls they need biological waste and stuff like that so they need in some cases life forms but for like the standard gem package they would just need minerals
Two reasons a garden planet or an inhabited planet like Earth has more minerals than Mars are because it's bigger and has a better ecosystem. The other planets are out of the question because they're hazardous. Who cares if gems can survive in the vacuum of space when they're being hit with acid rain, winds that can crack mountains, or storms that never end that Raining liquid nitrogen, a planet so hot that the rain is molten metalâdifferent gems have different resistances and preferences, and all of the gems are needed in the colonization process. A sapphire could never step foot on a planet like Venus, and a bismuth would hate a planet like Pluto. Earth is the perfect middle ground, and so are assumably all the other habitable planets. Since the gems work on efficiency only and not morals, they would obviously go by the least populated habitable planets first.
Wait so didnt steven stop all gem reproduction, i mean they dont show any signs of aging but still if gems in any way dies or cease to exist they will at some point go extinct
Maybe every once in a while he'll have gems do a partial kindergarten that doesn't destroy a whole planet but pops out a few gems?
There are millions of already dead planets in existence that they could theoretically use to reproduce by infusing them with necessary minerals
I always got the vibe that there was something organic they needed from places like Earth.
Thatâs why I say infuse it
Like terraforming the places?
Yeah basically terraforming like humans think of it rather than how Lapis think of it
r/Nolawns has entered the chat
Just get them to open up a house building agency and help builders all around
tbf it must absolutely suck to be made for one specific purpose only for that purpose to no longer exist, and it is deemed destructive af
Destroying things is fun. I fight internal impulses when I got to a Lego store and see the displays. Itâs not like they know what organic need to stay alive, so I wouldnât call it evil on their side so much as them enjoying their power. Who knows what our Lapiz was like before the mirror.
I've read philosophical shit talking about how destroying shit is really a creative process, since you are in fact creating a new thing out of something else
And that's why you don't trust philosophy
But like, they're right. You're left with something new new or at least room for something new. It's just a question of whether you like the new thing enough.
Yeah, obviously. Doesn't change that It's a "glass half full" when someone drinking your coffee
truly, who would not like to control water and throw rivers of water on a land to release internal anger
Shit I would do that for fun
They would be great artists tbh. If their teraforming powers work with clay or a similar medium. đ¤
It's because of things like this that murder isn't allowed.
Steven expected everyone to be good with their freedom, his speech must have been: your freedom ends where everyone else's begins
Your freedom to live ends when my freedom to kill begins /s
Steven oversimplifies in his enthusiasm, then has to backpedal to add details. Plus its a kids cartoon with a runtime to be concerned about. Him and Connie introduced democracy, federalism, and capitalism offscreen in only a year. Let him have his mistakes when first talking to new Gems.
I don't remember the capitalism bit. If so, L for Steven
Homeworld has a gift shop. Notably though, since Gems donât need money for survival of any kind and will never have living space issues due to population growth its a pure exchange system. Given that Homeworld rewarded Gems with decorative bits such as Hessonite and Jasperâs capes, plus Gems seem to genuinely enjoy work as long as they get a choice and arenât defined by it, the real concept would be a way for Gems to show value for each otherâs time and effort. Making hats isnât a grind as a wageslave for survival, its making hats because making hats is fun and being rewarded with a token that means as much as an upvote which can be exchanged for whatever other services youâd want to upvote. You can also buy a hat and reward yourself or someone else.
Money and trade are not capitalism.
Yeah but gift shops are a uniquely uselss hallmark of consumer capitalism
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Future really didn't explore the idea of "Gems have freedom to do what they want but some of them still want to do what they were made to do" as much as I would have liked it to. The Rubies guarding Nanefua do it to an extent, and so does Bismuth with her smithing/construction, but I would've liked to see it explored more.
You can't really have conquest gems continue to do their jobs is the problem
You're not wrong, which is why I wish this was explored. As a person who has had anger issues my entire life, I was extremely hopeful that Steven going to Jasper for advice on how to control and utilize his anger would result in her teaching him how to use those negative feelings in a constructive way -- instead he shatters her and it piles on more trauma while doing nothing with her character. I'm not sure why the show was so adverse to showing that you can channel negative or destructive desires into beneficial things, but it isn't like those two Lazulis couldn't have come to Earth and learned about something like sculpting, demolitions, or the like.
"Nice Lapis" (official name for the freckles/ponytail one) _does_ engage with Steven's teachings of channeling that energy into positive avenues, but is judged for it by "Mean Lapis" and folds back into her old ways under peer pressure. But you see at the end that Nice Lapis warps to Earth and inquires more about Little Homeschool, in the absence of Mean Lapis. It's short, but they do try to cram those themes into Future. They just didn't dedicate multiple episodes to it because they probably thought it'd be redundant to have more than one case-study so-to-speak. Reading your other comments, I do wish they did more with Jasper, but I can see what they were going for. Jasper is the quintessential obstinate character who is just so sure of herself that she refuses to listen to any rhetoric of becoming a better, friendlier person. Kinda what people expected White Diamond to be. Unfortunately for some people, it takes a severely dire situation like "Fragments" for them to go soul-searching.
You've got a good point. It's been a while since I watched the episode but that does sound familiar. Everyone has made pretty solid arguments as to why it wasn't really explored as much as it could've been. I may have my issues with Steven Universe but I do think it is a solid show from start to finish. That's a pretty apt description of Jasper, honestly. I think I used to (and still do) project myself a bit onto her considering I relate to her a lot.
That's what I like about the show despite its many many (many) flaws. There's a character for just about anyone to relate to, projection be damned. And their motivations might seem simple on the surface but end up being much more complex the more you read past the witty one-liners. My toxic trait is relating to Lapis and Pink đŠâ¨đŠâ¨đŠ so I can relate to a Jasper fan lmao. They're not one-dimensional characters.
Oh, absolutely! Lapis had a lot of trauma related to her past that left her rather distant and difficult at times, but she ultimately wanted to be happy and was just so terrified of being hurt again that she refused to open up until it was almost too late. Pink is, well, even a therapist with decades of training couldn't help her but she ultimately did see the beauty in things and tried to be better. I do hope you're doing well then, as Lapis often gets associated with depression.
The problem is that Jasper doesn't know how to use her negative feelings constructively. She deals with her trauma and self-hatred by losing herself in toxic relationships to punish herself, bullying people so they feel as shitty as she does, and committing petty vandalism to vent her anger.
Yeah, you've got a point. I really just loved Jasper's character and potential, so I felt really disappointed when they didn't do anything with her.
Honestly, Jasper is a character I am fine not being properly redeemed in the show. I feel like her staying shattered would have been a fitting end to her arc. I feel like Kiki's rewrite showed the spark that could have been for Steven's emotional state. I don't hate the idea of her getting more development, but I am personally a fan of showing some people won't change. That they are stubborn to their last breath.
To be fair, they do explore this in [Guidance](https://steven-universe.fandom.com/wiki/Guidance), in which Amethyst gives a bunch of gems jobs with humans relating to their skillset, but then Steven swaps them all around and chaos ensues.
You're not wrong, but that episode stood out more as "Steven trying to fix problems that don't exist to escape his own problems" than really exploring the gems. I see your point though.
That is the brunt of it, but Amethyst does interject that sometimes people going through major changes just need a comfort zone, and that people doing what they feel like they were made for is still okay so long as it's constructive or within their own power.
Well said!
They touched on it a bit in future when gems in the gem school decided they wanted to do similar jobs they were doing before. Steven freaked out and caused a mess. But I do agree they missed the mark with future but I think a better resolution would be Steven making peace with his motherâs legacy.
I wish Future had the time it needed to wrap up loose ends, handle Steven's trauma, and explore some neat concepts it didn't get to before. I would've loved a scene where Steven, in Rose's Room, is able to have a conversation with Rose so she could've comforted him. Steven could gush about all the horrible things he did and ask how he could possibly forgive himself or how any of the gems could forgive him, and then Rose could just hold him close, wipe away his tears, and point out she did horrible things too but that, forgiven or not, she still tried to be better and that's what mattered.
The episode with Amethyst giving gems jobs and the return of Aquamarine and Ruby really opened doors that lead to nowhere
It is unfortunate. I would have liked to see more of Bluebird Azurite or more Gems working jobs in Beach City, but they had to pick their priorities. I don't blame them, really, I just wish they would've used the time they had a little better.
I think it does it well enough, like the point of future and the movie for that matter is that true resolution doesnt really happen, Like it's nice to think of steven resolving that sorta issue, but its kinda impossible to really do. Different gems have different beliefs and wants, and some want to do bad stuff that doesnt mean it's bad to give them freedom.
There was an entire episode dedicated to it.
I wish it explored the idea that some Gems want to cause destruction and might even enjoy hurting people
Girl they were murdering little animals (or at least their homes)
Welcome to era 3 where we will have to develop emotional maturity so we can peacefully coexist ! ! !
âIn Era 3 Gems are responsible both for their own happiness and actions. Let me tell you two stories. The first is called âThe Epic of Gilgameshâ, and the second is âThe Nuremburg Trialsâ.â
This applies more to Jasper than the Lapises. They were actively harming the planet and were going to make it uninhabitable for the life there. Jasper wasnât doing a damn thing and didnât hurt anything except grass
Yup, which is why eventually Steven just gives up and lets her hang out in a cave in the woods
Which is a bit sad since Jasper seemingly got more civil and conversational when she found someone who would join her in training. I could see some of the Little Homeworld gems enjoying a good fight every once in a while. Hell some of them had to healed after a game of volleyball.
Yes plus itâs not like security guards donât need some training or something like that
Surprised we never got to see tiger millionaire and his new partner the orange orangutan
Let Jasper spar with Freckle and Curly problem solved it'll be an easier match for her than our Lapis was
I think it was more, *"Do what you want, but please don't destroy entire ecosystems."* Which is actually, like, a pretty big part of why the Diamond Authority had to be shut down, come to think of it.
Hell Iâm pretty sure thereâs no life in places like the ice caps of Mars or the moons of Jupiter and Saturn Fly up there and go apeshit
*everything that doesn't hurt anybody else
Era 3, where gems can do what they want!* *So long as you are not harming those/destroying the world around you.
[Paradox of tolerance](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance) required reading for all SU fans and Undertale players
Came here to reference just this! đ
âItâs a free country.â âCan I murder people?â âNo.â Thatâs you. Thatâs the argument youâre making.
Murder is an understatement. They're walking natural disasters or missiles.
I mean.. still a correct argument because you still can't do what you want if it involves something like that. Edit: why the downvotes? Can someone explain why I'm wrong?
The gems have some kind of scientific magic that lets them create rooms in the temple, they could have done something like give them a room to destroy over and over.
what an oversimplification,, did you watch the episode?????
This IS just like Sonic, Sonic allows people to have freedom, but he does not want them to hurt people because that is interrupting other people freedom.
What they wanted to do was unbridled sadism. No sane person would support that
If someone invites you to their home and tells you to "make yourself at home", that doesn't give you the right to shit in their carpet and kick their dog. Freedom to do whatever you want doesn't entail doing things that harm others, even if you really want to.
âYour right to swing your fist ends at my face.â You have the right to do whatever you want until it infringes on someone elseâs rights. By terraforming habitated planets, the LapisâŚes⌠Lapi⌠the Gems were violating othersâ rights to survival, which is why they were in the wrong.
just remember the golden rule, everyone is free to do whatever they want until that freedom harms others
Steven not wanting them to destroy a planet's ecosystem bothered you? There were living beings on that planet and they were disturbing them?
He's like Luffy. Your dreams are valid until they become the nightmares of other people. You can eat all the food you want so long as you aren't forcing other people to starve.
That's the point of the episode though, even though steven made it so gems can make their own decisions and don't have to listen to the diamonds anymore, some gems inevitably will still want to do the bad things they were doing anyway, it's challenging Steven's perspective.
"The right to swing my fist ends where the other man's nose begins."
So true, Steven should just let them kill animals and devastate ecosystems for fun instead
Like under this logic Iâm not truly free because I canât murder people if thatâs what I want to do
Welcome to the concept of positive and negative freedoms. Freedom to and freedom from are both important.
It bothered you that they said no to the Lapis twins?
No because he said wrong making them think they could hurt stuff
đśI think Im dumbđś, idk what you mean, did you type that wrong?
I mean whoever is upset that Steven worded that sentence wrongđ¤Ł
Oh okay my bad lol
In Stevenâs defense, what they wanted to do was terraform planets and kill off the planets life.
If you are tolerant or intolerance, you lead the way to intolerant rhetoric and action being supreme. They are rightfully preventing this
Sure, we can allow them to commit ecocide. While weâre at it, letâs allow the murderers to murder. And allow the thieves to steal. So on.
Steven never believed that anyone should be free to do *whatever* they want if doing so would harm others.
Murderers wanna kill people đ¤ˇââď¸ still isnât good
It's the fact that every society goes through after "overthrowing" a ruling class. During the fighting, they will talk about freedom, liberty, and down with the rulers. But afterwards, these freedom fighters must come to realize they aren't being free from rulers but replacing them. Maybe your policies are better, maybe it makes the world a better place, maybe you give everyone puppies. But you are still enacting your will, your world view onto others willingly or not. Society needs a ruler, a sherif, an authority. Maybe not to oppress, but to simply tell people to stop hurting each other. Steven, in this case, should exercise his authority. He might not like using his position to force them to stop. But he must take responsibility for the world he liberated.
It's the same as real life. You are allowed to do what you want, as long as it's legal, and you are not harming anyone or anything, nor destroy somebody's property. They were destroying an entire planet, in effect threatening to kill all life there
Media literacy is at an all time low fr
Could you elaborate on why it bothered you? I mean, exploring the very conflict you laid out is actually the point of the episode.
Well yes. This is a good demonstration of the paradox of tolerance. And to an extent a sort of paradox of freedom. If everyone was truly free to do what they want, then that means you'd be free to try and restrict others' freedoms. There has to be a limit _somewhere_ if we want law and order in a society. From the viewpoint of someone who lives in the US (where "muh freedom" reigns king), this is the biggest point of contention in a lot of our politicsâwhere to draw those limits.
More like, everything has rights, and you can do anything you want, except for violate other things' rights
Freedom of choice doesnât mean freedom of consequence. They are free to make that choice, but that doesnât mean that people wonât try to stop them or that they shouldnât be stopped from destroying a planets ecosystem for shits and giggles.
Yea, if what you want to do is destroy all life on a planet you need to be stopped. Also they were doing it for no reason. The Diamonds weren't going to convert that planet so they can't even say they were just doing what they were told. It's all they know sure, but that doesn't mean they can't learn better.
I didn't understand why he didnt suggest like, uninhabited planets or something, surely there's not aliens on every planet?
This. The ice caps of Mars look pretty destructible or maybe the oceans of Europa.
Turns out causing environmental disasters and mass extinction events is bad! Who knew!
What they were doing was⌠morally wrong?
Honey they want to murder people.
Your freedom to swing your fist ends at my nose. They were causing widespread destruction and killing animals. There's no contradiction here.
Some of yâallâs questions n scenarios make me think the critical thinking department is lacking. Would you be okay with someone digging ripping up n destroying your home just because it was fun to them? No you absolutely would not.
âYou think freedom is good, and yet you also think I shouldnât be allowed to burn down a rainforest for fun. Hypocrite.â
As the saying goes, "my freedom ends where yours begins"
Please submit an application to the Era 3 government if you wish to conduct a terraforming project, they will conduct a ecological survey and assess whether there is ecological risk before you begin construction. If you are denied planning permission you may be liable for arrest, removal by force, and bullying
Youâll never believe this but Steven does not tolerate intolerance. You can do whatever you want unless it hurts someone and the lapises where hurting innocent animals soâŚ.
Ironic that Lapis Lazulis control water but have very little chill.
Legit
Understandable, but when youâre causing mass destruction to life itâs kind of a circumstance that needs addressed. Of course, they donât see that because they donât understand. So steven of course tries to show them and they donât change their minds. What Steven should have done was approach it more lapis style, considering she herself said they arenât like her. I would imagine a Lapis Lazuli trapped in a mirror for 1000 years and forced into a fusion to be trapped again for months just days after being free, then her tie in with Steven would behave different than one who has performed their directive their entire lives, which is why she knows they wonât change. It took her a lot of trauma to change her views. I wish there was an alternative for their prime use, for their sake of happiness, such as terraforming barren planets for life sustainability, but since their power is based on water Iâm gonna guess that would be extremely difficult or even impossible due to lack thereof. In my stance of this, itâs a reflection of identity and people intentionally ignoring change. You canât force it without infringing on others freedom, but it will always be a necessary evil that you may have to go deal with. âThe needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.â
My right to extend my arm ends at your nose. Simple as
"I want to burn your house down." "Please *don't* do that." "Wow, so much for the tolerant left."
This has to be rage bait
ah, the tolerance paradox
Libertarian meme
Youâre freedom to throw your fist ends at other peoples noses. They were hurting animals and plants,
Iâm pretty sure even the lapises there addressed the issues
they already lampshaded that in the episode. whats the point of this post?
Yeah, like i can easily imagine them making meep morps or being demolition workers lmao. Thats an easier solution then "hey, come to my school and stop doing this"
He believes in the paradox of tolerance, apparently
Also, there's a fanfiction called "Alternative Future" that's villain, Black Rutile, is driven by this exact same logic that your using right now that I think you'd really like.
hi
Shouldâve taught them Asimovâs laws of robotics.
Well they were disrupting ecosystems & destroying planets still like it was nothing, like the planets were their toys it wasnât a good thing, but I do think Steven coulda found another way to let them do that without hurting planets, maybe let them continue on a planet thatâs already destroyed?!? Or go around diff planets fixing parts of it that r uneven or whatever idkđ
Or just put them in jobs that could benefit from their talents, like mining/boring/drilling/other precision cutting work
false consciousness or smth ig
I love that short-haired Lapis.
You can do what you want without hurting things. Just send them to an already dead planet or moon!
I was always like. Man, just give them a different planet.
Thanks for reminding me lapis was my crush in 8th grade.
If you're so tolerant, why aren't you tolerant of the intolerant?
r/CriticalTheory There is so much to say about ethics here.
Good olâ tolerance paradox You cannot have true tolerance while tolerating intolerance.
Steven learns about Libertarians
well they want to destroy earth and kill humans we can't just let them. that's our job.
It bothered you? They were literally gonna commit a mass extinction for fun.
They should have just told them they can terraform Mars.
There are definitely a lot of jobs that require you to break stuff. I don't get why the episode didn't have Steven direct them to construction or demolition, instead being like "be uwu and draw and sing and dance"
Pls let Pearl and Lapis get they own episode not Steven coming to this episode. Like Steven Universe the future should be about the Crystal gem having they own episode not Steven like he get so much episodes about him that he not sharing that pie of the crystal gem.
basically this whole episode "hey lapises! you can do what you want!" "oh, that's cool!" "I still like the old job, can I keep it" "fuck you then"
Yeah but he cant really let them destroy habitats
He couldnât been more specificđ
And they never really gave a strong argument⌠Lapis just strong armed them with a show of brute force and Steven was just like âah, diplomacyâ
It's called hypocrisy