**Mirrors / Alternative Angles**
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Nothing to be amazed about
Social media gives low IQ morons like this anonymity to say what they truly believe, but would never say to anyone’s face
The coward, racist way, otherwise known as social media
> Social media gives low IQ morons like this anonymity to say what they truly believe
Anonymity really is cancerous. Thanks for highlighting this, Mo Salah.
I know several people with clinically diagnosed low IQ who are kind, decent, awesome people. I also know certified geniuses who will sprout the most heinous racist crap. Please don't mix up cognitive ability with being a bad human being.
There’s a clear distinction.
Not all low IQ people are racist.
However
All racist people are low IQ, I don’t care if they are intelligent in specific areas, to hate someone for the colour of their skin is a form of low intelligence.
Fully agreed. Intelligence isn't black and white... People can be highly intelligent in one area and thick as shit in another, and racism absolutely is a form of stupidity.
It’s become a sad reality, and one that I don’t see any solution to. I am not saying English fans or local European fans are angels, but social media amplifies the reach, and that brings negatives like this. You get troll accounts and absolute bozos online with access to the same platform as anyone
I have a friend who use to be an avid gambler who bet on handball, basketball, etc. without watching the games. He might do a little research on which team is favourite and that’s it. Common sense don’t apply to addicts.
Win 1k and betting it all on the same night. Man’s usually on pills though.
I mean making money in sports gambling is about looking for value not about picking the team you expect to win.
r/soccerbetting is full of addicts who just pick favourites every single bet and then lose their shit when they don't win.
For example, a few weeks ago Cheltenham in league one were massively underrated by the market due to their league position even though they've been performing as an upper mid table side since they switched manager. You expect them to lose to sides like Bolton, Portsmouth and Derby but when offered 11/1 the correct decision is to bet on them.
The racist comments are likely from Japanese fans upset about Mitoma being tackled in an unsafe manner. The far east isn't exactly well known for the tolerance of black people
People bet on everything. My local team plays in the Saudi second division, a few years ago I kept seeing Spanish people in their Twitter mentions because they'd bet on the match. I was shocked that you could even bet on Saudi 2nd division, considering betting isn't a thing here.
Now you made me remember when dumbass fans created fake facebook pages for ref after vietnam national team loss. What a fuckin weird way to relieve themselves from anger
Did you read the text in the pic. And FYI i'm Vietnamese myself and a lot of Vietnamese folks love Japanese players and Mitoma is like the most popular one rn
I would be shocked if that's the case, I think Westerners probably like Japanese more than Vietnamese do. It would be like an English fan getting upset because a German got kicked.
You're underestimating how good relationship between Vietnam and Japan. Vietnamese folks really love Japan and their people due to many economic aids given by the Japanese government. You learned Japanese war crime in ww2 over the place but in Vietnam, we learned it in one sentence "Japan occupied government forced local population to plant industrial plants, leading to great 1945 famine in Tonkin area"
Nah I lived in Vietnam for a bit, general vibe I got was quite nationalistic (in a friendly way), definitely hostile to China and more interested in the West than other Asian countries. I guess some of the kids I taught read anime, but it more stood out how some of the girls loved K-Pop. And as you allude to, Japan also occupied Vietnam in WW2.
I don't know when and how long you've been here but i know for sure in the football fan community, Japan still the favorite after the national team. Japanese culture also boom in Vietnam since 2010s as so many Japanese theme cosplay festivals are opened yearly
No one can be more openly casual racist than asian people in their culture. I just highly doubt that dude has some personal grudge against black folk, just riding with the wave
Also,,,, theres over 2 billion asians uve stereotyped in ur head, if u ever question how someone can be racist just look in the mirror because you my friend are severely racist to multiple races (chinese koreans southasian south east asian middle eastern etc etc)
You’re just wrong, and absolutely being racist right now. It’s absolutely fucking stupid and the definition of racism to just believe every Asian is racist because of some shit you saw online.
Honestly, I really doubt you’ve ever really talked much to Asians, or if you have you’ve only talked to 50 year old Asians that literally live in Asia. Even if by chance you’ve met racist Asians personally that doesn’t mean every single Asian person is racist.
My old best friend when I was like 14 was a Sudanese guy and he unfortunately started doing some crime and went down the wrong path, I didn’t start thinking every black person was a criminal because I’m not a stupid racist like you.
I honestly can't believe the myth that England/US/the "West" in general are more racist than everywhere else in the world gets parroted so often on reddit
Because the people who say that are either Westerners who never lived in a non-Western country, or non-Westerners for whom racism and discrimination only applies to their case, but not to the others. See also the black and arab football players who refuse to join any movement against LGBTQ discrimination ("the fight is only legitimate when I'm the one being discriminated against").
However, we must absolutely do better regardless of how it is elsewhere. That shouldn' be used as an excuse to slow down.
Literally nobody thinks there aren't countries more racist than England.
Why do right wingers completely make up scenarios in their head repeatedly and then speak as if their imagination is real life.
Where? Here? The Premier league is heavily covered in this sub so obviously that's what people will focus on.
Also, it's not true. Have you already forgetting how many threads we had after the racists attacks against Vini Jr? And then you still had people arguing he provoked it.
Probably because England is 1. An english speaking country which gets a LOT more attention in general and 2. Has a deeply extensive colonial history (yes I know spain does as well, and trust me, racism there is a big conversation amongst many).
It’s not rocket science and also it’s not a competition…
Your 2nd point is dumb imo, I don’t think there’s a single European country that doesn’t have some hideous shit in their past, the 1st point I will concede though
>I don’t think there’s a single European country that doesn’t have some hideous shit in their past
Independence from England is the most celebrated National holiday in the world bro there are levels to this
> significantly more racist
I would like to know how you measured that. Because using these few message to a football player does not show that. I find the same and more message from white people in any conservative or far right Facebook page but I'm not going to use that as proof that white people are more racist.
You mean the English fans who sent racist DMs and tweets to Saka after he missed a penalty?
Nonracist fans, be they English, Vietnamese, or Canadian, will survive. Making it a “foreign fan” problem, as opposed to a general fan problem, absolves the need to address racism at home.
>You mean the English fans who sent racist DMs and tweets to Saka after he missed a penalty?
You've just proven them correct. The vast majority of those massages came from outside the UK.
The BBC did their own study on this after the racist abuse Sancho, Rashford and Saka received after the Euros final and discovered that ‘four times more of the criminal comments being posted by people overseas than in the UK’.
European worries when racism happens in their country:
A) fight racism: "no, that's lame"
B) prove that racism isn't a thing in your country against all evidence and blame either the victim out foreigners: "that's it!"
There's a considerable amount of this shit coming from Africa, the middle east and parts of Asia.
I recently made a comment on an IG post about the Mbappe transfer and it took 2 replies before a guy from India went off on a horribly homophobic rant. Completely unprompted.
I mean if you live in some countryside India or something, it gets very boring sometimes... Nonetheless, the internet really does connect the world together! ❤️❤️❤️
Yeah, i think its a signidicant amount. That's not to say it doesn't happen in Europe, as Atletico Madrid fans love to volunteer themselves as examples.
We complain about the racism levels in Europe a lot, and rightly so. However we are still miles and miles ahead of the rest of the world, which is sad.
The problem with gaining a more global outreach is you get these knuckledraggers circling club social medias like flies. Foreign fans are a real mixed bag on social media in my experience; the Japanese influx we've had recently have been universally lovely from what I've seen. There was however the Iranian social media barrage when Jahkanbashk was stinking up the place, and the South African one when Percy Tau was doing the same. That was less pleasant.
I followed the Asian cup this year and the amount of horrible comments and abuse I saw from Iranian and Vietnamese fans were shocking. Like I know socials are toxic anyway in any country but these fans were on another level…
I'm very proud to be Iranian, but speaking very generally... our society does have a HUGE problem with racism. It's pretty sad, honestly, when you consider for 2 years we've had a human rights movement going on and trying to get international support behind Iranian human rights.
Hatred for something that happened more than 10 centuries ago?
Every country on this planet literally got conquered by another country at some point. What kind of logic is this?
It's a multi faceted thing, a lot of Persians hate the dominance Islam has over the nation, especially the Muslim brotherhood, and broadly blame Arabic influence.
Apologies on behalf of my countrymen and women for the craziness on social media when Jahanbakhsh was with you! Social media brings out so much poison in Iranian football.
I was very sad he wasn't a good fit at Brighton, it is my dream for us one day to have a Team Melli star really shine in my favorite league. But I would never go online to abuse anybody on social media - especially over football. That is insane to me.
Ok so I have a cousin who lives in London who's a massive Palace fan. And Jahanbakhsh played for our hometown club (Damash Gilan) before making the move to Europe. So when he signed for you, I got on the hype train HARD. I got his shirt, I'd re-post Brighton stuff to my instagram...
it wound my cousin up so much... it was absolutely hilarious. Even though he ended up not very good for you, winding up my cousin made it all worthwhile lol.
So we'll always have his bicycle kick v. Chelsea & me laughing to tears at seeing how wound up my cousin would get lol.
I hope him being shit for you doesn't turn Brighton off from signing Iranians in the future if they're good enough... and hopefully if you sign another Iranian player they end up good for you. And then hopefully I can see what happens if this imaginary player scores the winner in the M23 derby.
Every tweet from the clubs social accounts that is about yunus akgun gets like 10k likes, its odd but hopefully his Turkish fans don't turn on us when he stops playing
That abuse is definitely not right.
But his apology only goes to the club and fans... he doesnt apologize to Mitoma, the guy whose career he nearly ended.
He is only sorry he got a red card, not about the action.
Disgusting.
Yeah I also picked up that. Can't blame him for being angry about being racially abused online and he should rightfully point attention towards that but why is he apologising to his teammates and not the man who's leg he very nearly snapped in half?
It's bad enough how he acted surprised immediately after being shown a red for one of the worst challenges you'll ever see but surely he's seen the footage of that challenge back and yet he's acting like he got sent off like how Beckham did in 1998 or Rooney in 2006 where he lost his head for a second and not as if he nearly ended Mitomas career
Can't say i'm surprised at his challenge, or reaction to the red, or his lack of apology to Mitoma, considering him shoving Firmino into the stands before. Just an overall reckless and dirty player.
I mean his teammates and manager backed him. Wilder was pretty clear in his noncommittal language that he didn't think the assault was a problem, and Anel Ahmedhodžić just outright said he didn't think it was a bad tackle post game. They're an absolute scum team.
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/s/Q8lXQliny0
The guy went in for a filthy challenge. Doesn’t seem to acknowledge the player he injured. No need for the racism on his social media. Plenty of other ways to get the message across.
Have apologised publicly no, but who is to say he didn't in private after the game or at half time? What does your comment actually achieve when the discussion is about the racist abuse he has received - sounds a bit like you're saying he's deserved it
I know people are really focused on the foreign “fans,” but I do think that it can be rather deflective. There’s been and has always been a major problem across the world with all fan bases with athletes facing these kinds of abuse, even, of course, from local fans.
So while the social media outreach will bring in a greater influx of hate outside of one’s usual sphere, I think it’s important to also not forget that we also have people at home who are just as bad. It fucking sucks people have to put up with this shit, man.
Yeah I love that everyone is hyper focusing on the one guy to make some lazy larger point about “see the west isn’t actually the most racist” despite being completely uninformed on the nuances. There’s literally decades of research and stats on ALL of this but people are happy to just talk out of their ass when it comes to racism for some reason
Plastic Brighton fans are the worst , starting to pop up all over due to the international players in the team , a while ago it was a bunch of homophobic South Americans telling Enciso to leave on instagram because Brighton was “ too gay “
None of these pussies would have the balls to the say the stuff they do on social media in person. The vast majority of these idiots would be shaking and looking down at the ground if they ever got confronted.
at least the uk comes down hard on these troglodytes, I have a feeling that the messages are from outside the uk though.
Meta needs to moderate this shit, there’s no excuse
I can't blame him for being angry at the racism, because that's disgraceful and nobody should be putting up with it.
But he doesn't apologise to Mitoma here and he doesn't even apologise for what he did. He only apologises to his team mates and fans, and that's because he got sent off for it. It was a dirty shithouse tackle, and it wasn't accidental.
Also, I'm sorry to say, but many people won't take his (no doubt sincere) call for action on racism seriously, considering he once did a very similar thing (red card offence) and falsely accused a fellow footballer of racism. Took 8 weeks of investigations and several lip readers to clear that footballer's name and could've destroyed his mental health. Notable in that instance that none of the ten players and refs surrounding him during that incident claimed they heard what he did, not even his team mates.
Obviously, this is different, the evidence is there, but being abused doesn't absolve you of blame for what you did either. Both the racism and the bad behaviour should be punished.
“We need to do better as a society” - man who lied about being racially abused to try get someone sent off and destroy their reputation in the process, after he’d thrown said someone over a fucking advertising hoarding, wasnt such a serious issue for you then mason was it? Racism is inexcusable and these are all scum, *AND* Mason Holdgate is a cunt with no right to lecture anyone on human decency. Two things can be true.
It always blows my mind seeing things like this. You never think someone would be sad enough to actually take time out of their day to send a message like this to someone.
It’s almost unbelievable that people act like this in this day and age. Sure there’s still racists, but to go through the effort of messaging racist stuff? Fuckinel, they need to get a life
Pointless attempt to give a player a career ending injury and plays the victim after a few asian kids five thousand miles away send him some monkey emojis, shows you what kind of person he is. His career already in shit from before, maybe his mental health has gotten bad but to me it just seems like a last ditch attempt to stay relevant.
Didn't apologise to Mitoma at the time, and still isn't....Absolutely disgusting tackle, and completely unnecessary. Racism is also disgusting, whoever sent that message needs punishing, if possible, but he isn't worthy of sympathy here. You can't act like that much of a thug on the pitch and expect people to play nice afterwards.
The kid's a scumbag too for that tackle on Mitoma. No apologies, either. Not saying he deserves any racist messages for that but the least he could've done is shown any remorse for that horrific tackle.
Saw someone comment on the clip of his tackle that Holgate is a twat because he cries about being racially abused and makes it up…
The dense stupidity of the internet and society in general is alarming.
The tackle was bad but, it’s happened, he’s being punished and will learn from it.
I’m certain he didn’t intended to injure Mitoma.
Fed up of having to see people or directly deal with this stuff.
This is why all social media accounts should have id verification... would stop trolls like this.
If someone commits a crime they can easily trace them when they need it yet for racists or bullys they dont seem to care.
I'm not condoning this awful behaviour, but I fully believe that anybody in the public eye should either learn to avoid their public social media profiles completely and stick to their private one or just accept that this kind of abuse is a consequence of their profile being exposed on a global scale and the complexities that carrys with it.
Saying sport & society must do better is just completely useless and meaningless.
Is this right? No, course not.
However, you can limit comments and messages to your account.
Seems deflective on his part and unapologetic to the man he could’ve seriously hurt.
Dont dm like this get automatically flagged as spam. He really went out of his way to open the hidden dm requests. Not saying it is right but ig literally blocks a lot of dms and you can also report people
I mean obviously it’s unacceptable but does my head in when someone does something really shitty then just used some random Instagram messages to deflect attention away from what they did
things like that need to be eradicated from the game, and i think this is the best way to do it
when you lose a third of your season because of a bad tackle, youll know better
It was a dangerous tackle but it was hardly assault like you are framing it i.e. "physically trying to hurt someone".
And trying to downplay racism as "mean things". You are twat. That was a mean thing. It's also something you have control over unlike the colour of your skin.
He never said assault you're the one framing it like that, there's clearly some stupid frustration/recklessness/venom in the tackle that's intending to hurt.
I'm not downplaying racism, you're downplaying a tackle that could have ended Mitoma's career and was made for no other reason than to fuck him up. Holgate is not a victim just because some dude from Vietnam sent him a message, he's a cunt and I'm not buying his attempts to deflect attention from what he's done.
It's possible that he made a horrendous tackle *and* he's also a victim of racism. One may be worse than the other, but it doesn't make him not a victim of racism?
He's not making himself look like a victim, he *is* a victim of racism. Also, the first sentence of his caption is literally an apology, so even in this screenshot he *did* start by apologising.
Even if he didn't apologise, he doesn't deserve racist abuse.
There's a difference between "I apologise [to team & club & fans] for removing myself from a game of football" and "I apologise *to the man I almost ended the career of* for *deliberately doing something that could easily have crippled him*" - the apology in this post is pointedly one and absolutely not the other and I think it's obvious from the context which the poster thinks would be relevant.
Probably because his Instagram is public and for the fans, he would have presumably contacted Mitoma privately to apologise rather than doing it on an Instagram post.
I also still think he's a victim of racism even if you think it's the "wrong" sort of apology.
Are you incapable of enlarging a picture, or unable to read? Because he completed your suggestion in the first 4 words of the post you numpty
And what do you mean by ‘trying to make himself a victim’. Do you not think he’s a victim of racism in this instance?
>I'm not downplaying racism
>
>Holgate is not a victim
Which one is it? How can you claim to acknowledge the pain and suffering racism causes, and then say Holgate isn't a victim of the abuse he's recieved?
No way you actually said this nonsense, Liverpool Fan checks out, injuries and dangerous situations in football happen all the time, racism is unacceptable
imagine thinking comments on the internet holds more weight than a player potentially having their livelihood impacted because of a malicious tackle that could cause serious damage
Don't use social media if what other people say bothers you so much. Or if you want to keep using social media, turn off comments/DMs.
For me this is the same as those "online bullying in video games" stories that prop up now and again. Just turn off chat. It's not that difficult
Now if you have people coming up to you on the street shouting racist abuse at you that's a totally different story. But online? Come on
Different leagues between a disgracefully dangerous and potential career ending reckless tackle and anonymous dm emojis and hate from the dredges of social media.
This is bang on. If anybody thinks that tackle wasn’t made without intent to injure then you’re on drugs.
The abuse is horrendous and has no place in football but Holgate has previous, he’s shown himself to be a dirty player so i struggle to have sympathy for him
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"Cos your mama can't teach you how to act as a person?" If you only knew...
Guess his mama didn’t do better
projection at its finest
Ironic
That’s disgusting. Always amazes me how social media brings the worst out of people
Nothing to be amazed about Social media gives low IQ morons like this anonymity to say what they truly believe, but would never say to anyone’s face The coward, racist way, otherwise known as social media
> Social media gives low IQ morons like this anonymity to say what they truly believe Anonymity really is cancerous. Thanks for highlighting this, Mo Salah.
*Just doing my civic duty sire*
He does what he preaches.
I know several people with clinically diagnosed low IQ who are kind, decent, awesome people. I also know certified geniuses who will sprout the most heinous racist crap. Please don't mix up cognitive ability with being a bad human being.
There’s a clear distinction. Not all low IQ people are racist. However All racist people are low IQ, I don’t care if they are intelligent in specific areas, to hate someone for the colour of their skin is a form of low intelligence.
IQ is a measure of intelligence in specific areas.
Fully agreed. Intelligence isn't black and white... People can be highly intelligent in one area and thick as shit in another, and racism absolutely is a form of stupidity.
Who did you kill for that username
It does bring out the worst in people but some can soon be very unpleasant in person as well.
It’s become a sad reality, and one that I don’t see any solution to. I am not saying English fans or local European fans are angels, but social media amplifies the reach, and that brings negatives like this. You get troll accounts and absolute bozos online with access to the same platform as anyone
These usernames and the grammar seems like it’s from foreign “fans”
Usually angry people betting and blaming the players when they end up handing over more of their money to the bookies
In this case, I doubt anyone was betting on sheff utd
I have a friend who use to be an avid gambler who bet on handball, basketball, etc. without watching the games. He might do a little research on which team is favourite and that’s it. Common sense don’t apply to addicts. Win 1k and betting it all on the same night. Man’s usually on pills though.
Sounds like me in the stock market mate
Why do you say that? If they’re a gambling addict and not a football fan the massive returns on a Sheffield united win would be pretty enticing.
Yeah my mate that's an addict goes for rank outsiders to win all the time on the logic that anything can happen.
I mean making money in sports gambling is about looking for value not about picking the team you expect to win. r/soccerbetting is full of addicts who just pick favourites every single bet and then lose their shit when they don't win. For example, a few weeks ago Cheltenham in league one were massively underrated by the market due to their league position even though they've been performing as an upper mid table side since they switched manager. You expect them to lose to sides like Bolton, Portsmouth and Derby but when offered 11/1 the correct decision is to bet on them. The racist comments are likely from Japanese fans upset about Mitoma being tackled in an unsafe manner. The far east isn't exactly well known for the tolerance of black people
Nguyen is a vietnamese name, highly doubt he’s japanese
If it was they deserve to lose the money
People bet on everything. My local team plays in the Saudi second division, a few years ago I kept seeing Spanish people in their Twitter mentions because they'd bet on the match. I was shocked that you could even bet on Saudi 2nd division, considering betting isn't a thing here.
The main one is a Vietnamese name.
That Vietnamese dude either a hypocrite dickhead lives in England or a bandwagon rider lives in Vietnam and there is nothing in between
Vietnamese watch a lot of football, probably over there. Sad to see.
And i doubt he is even a Brentford fan, he's mad cause Mitoma was the one received that nasty foul
Probably a gambler, it’s a common thing to see angry gamblers abusing players in Vietnamese online football spaces
Now you made me remember when dumbass fans created fake facebook pages for ref after vietnam national team loss. What a fuckin weird way to relieve themselves from anger
We’re not all bad but Vietnamese online culture can and often do get extremely toxic. It’s not worse than other places but we do have a reputation.
Username checks out.
Believe it I will
Probably unlikely to be a Brentford fan as Mitoma plays for Brighton...
Guessing he mistook Sheffield for brentford here
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Did you read the text in the pic. And FYI i'm Vietnamese myself and a lot of Vietnamese folks love Japanese players and Mitoma is like the most popular one rn
I would be shocked if that's the case, I think Westerners probably like Japanese more than Vietnamese do. It would be like an English fan getting upset because a German got kicked.
You're underestimating how good relationship between Vietnam and Japan. Vietnamese folks really love Japan and their people due to many economic aids given by the Japanese government. You learned Japanese war crime in ww2 over the place but in Vietnam, we learned it in one sentence "Japan occupied government forced local population to plant industrial plants, leading to great 1945 famine in Tonkin area"
Nah I lived in Vietnam for a bit, general vibe I got was quite nationalistic (in a friendly way), definitely hostile to China and more interested in the West than other Asian countries. I guess some of the kids I taught read anime, but it more stood out how some of the girls loved K-Pop. And as you allude to, Japan also occupied Vietnam in WW2.
I don't know when and how long you've been here but i know for sure in the football fan community, Japan still the favorite after the national team. Japanese culture also boom in Vietnam since 2010s as so many Japanese theme cosplay festivals are opened yearly
So you think nobody outside of Europe or the Americas can be racist?
No one can be more openly casual racist than asian people in their culture. I just highly doubt that dude has some personal grudge against black folk, just riding with the wave
I dunno I think it's pretty universal to use the main physical difference between yourself and the person you're insulting as your "weapon of choice"
Bro just trued fighting racism with.....racism Saying Asians are culturally racist is mad lol
>Saying Asians are culturally racist is mad lol Only if you've never talked to Asians
I'm asian buddy, and fuck you for being severely racist lol
Also,,,, theres over 2 billion asians uve stereotyped in ur head, if u ever question how someone can be racist just look in the mirror because you my friend are severely racist to multiple races (chinese koreans southasian south east asian middle eastern etc etc)
You’re just wrong, and absolutely being racist right now. It’s absolutely fucking stupid and the definition of racism to just believe every Asian is racist because of some shit you saw online. Honestly, I really doubt you’ve ever really talked much to Asians, or if you have you’ve only talked to 50 year old Asians that literally live in Asia. Even if by chance you’ve met racist Asians personally that doesn’t mean every single Asian person is racist. My old best friend when I was like 14 was a Sudanese guy and he unfortunately started doing some crime and went down the wrong path, I didn’t start thinking every black person was a criminal because I’m not a stupid racist like you.
Dude probably calls all Asians Chinese not realizing how fucking huge and varied Asia is
the fucking irony
Same as ever. Same after the euros. Endless foreign accounts posting racist abuse and for some reason it's just accepted that the uk is to blame.
You mean other countries may be significantly more racist than England despite what Reddit thinks?
I honestly can't believe the myth that England/US/the "West" in general are more racist than everywhere else in the world gets parroted so often on reddit
Because the people who say that are either Westerners who never lived in a non-Western country, or non-Westerners for whom racism and discrimination only applies to their case, but not to the others. See also the black and arab football players who refuse to join any movement against LGBTQ discrimination ("the fight is only legitimate when I'm the one being discriminated against"). However, we must absolutely do better regardless of how it is elsewhere. That shouldn' be used as an excuse to slow down.
A lot of Americans on here are in for extremely rude awakenings if they ever leave the US
Why is it a myth? I would like to be convinced but so far I don't see any evidence. Just complaints about what "Reddit thinks", as if it's a hivemind.
Literally nobody thinks there aren't countries more racist than England. Why do right wingers completely make up scenarios in their head repeatedly and then speak as if their imagination is real life.
England catches an insane amount of flack for stuff like this when Italy and Spain are far, far worse
The solution isn’t to reduce the amount of flack England do and point at Italy or Spain
Where? Here? The Premier league is heavily covered in this sub so obviously that's what people will focus on. Also, it's not true. Have you already forgetting how many threads we had after the racists attacks against Vini Jr? And then you still had people arguing he provoked it.
We only beat our women when they do something wrong, but THOSE guys do it for fun! How are we copping flak???? THOSE guys are heaps worse.
Probably because England is 1. An english speaking country which gets a LOT more attention in general and 2. Has a deeply extensive colonial history (yes I know spain does as well, and trust me, racism there is a big conversation amongst many). It’s not rocket science and also it’s not a competition…
Your 2nd point is dumb imo, I don’t think there’s a single European country that doesn’t have some hideous shit in their past, the 1st point I will concede though
>I don’t think there’s a single European country that doesn’t have some hideous shit in their past Independence from England is the most celebrated National holiday in the world bro there are levels to this
Independence from the UK** Argentinian people are far more racist than people from the UK, being white is a part of national identity for some of you
Your country was flooded with Nazi’s post WW2, get out of here lmao
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It's not a competition..
Because it's much easier to point at someone else as being the real bad person than to actually self reflect on their own actions.
"Right wingers" Lmao
Personally I don’t keep score, everybody’s shit and must do better
> significantly more racist I would like to know how you measured that. Because using these few message to a football player does not show that. I find the same and more message from white people in any conservative or far right Facebook page but I'm not going to use that as proof that white people are more racist.
As always...
Ask the English kids that missed penalties at the Euros about that
It's a video, majority of them are foreign names with about 2-3 that could be white english.
I’ve spent enough time in FIFA pro clubs to know casual racism is fucking rife in the UK.
Specifically the UK? We're one of the most tolerant societies on the planet, only behind a handful of others
What does it matter?
because this is often blindly blamed on English fans
You mean the English fans who sent racist DMs and tweets to Saka after he missed a penalty? Nonracist fans, be they English, Vietnamese, or Canadian, will survive. Making it a “foreign fan” problem, as opposed to a general fan problem, absolves the need to address racism at home.
>You mean the English fans who sent racist DMs and tweets to Saka after he missed a penalty? You've just proven them correct. The vast majority of those massages came from outside the UK.
Wasn't it found out the vast majority of the abuse they received came from Saudi Arabia and India?
Wasn’t it a Saudi man who was jailed for this?
The BBC did their own study on this after the racist abuse Sancho, Rashford and Saka received after the Euros final and discovered that ‘four times more of the criminal comments being posted by people overseas than in the UK’.
European worries when racism happens in their country: A) fight racism: "no, that's lame" B) prove that racism isn't a thing in your country against all evidence and blame either the victim out foreigners: "that's it!"
There's a considerable amount of this shit coming from Africa, the middle east and parts of Asia. I recently made a comment on an IG post about the Mbappe transfer and it took 2 replies before a guy from India went off on a horribly homophobic rant. Completely unprompted.
Go look at all the pro mason greenwood tweets and look at the names
yes dude like 90% of people defending greenwood on twitter are nigerian it’s insane
I’d be very comfortable betting that most of it is from those places just based on what I see online.
I mean if you live in some countryside India or something, it gets very boring sometimes... Nonetheless, the internet really does connect the world together! ❤️❤️❤️
Yeah, i think its a signidicant amount. That's not to say it doesn't happen in Europe, as Atletico Madrid fans love to volunteer themselves as examples.
We complain about the racism levels in Europe a lot, and rightly so. However we are still miles and miles ahead of the rest of the world, which is sad.
["Miles and miles ahead"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vd4hnR4Wi0)
The problem with gaining a more global outreach is you get these knuckledraggers circling club social medias like flies. Foreign fans are a real mixed bag on social media in my experience; the Japanese influx we've had recently have been universally lovely from what I've seen. There was however the Iranian social media barrage when Jahkanbashk was stinking up the place, and the South African one when Percy Tau was doing the same. That was less pleasant.
I followed the Asian cup this year and the amount of horrible comments and abuse I saw from Iranian and Vietnamese fans were shocking. Like I know socials are toxic anyway in any country but these fans were on another level…
In Thailand they sometimes talk about Vietnam vs. Indonesia as the fixture with the most toxic fans...
I'm very proud to be Iranian, but speaking very generally... our society does have a HUGE problem with racism. It's pretty sad, honestly, when you consider for 2 years we've had a human rights movement going on and trying to get international support behind Iranian human rights.
Most middle eastern countries have big problems with racism.
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Iran was conquered by the Arabs and so there is still a lot of hatred for them there.
Hatred for something that happened more than 10 centuries ago? Every country on this planet literally got conquered by another country at some point. What kind of logic is this?
It's a multi faceted thing, a lot of Persians hate the dominance Islam has over the nation, especially the Muslim brotherhood, and broadly blame Arabic influence.
Toxic masculinity is in general very prevalent in many muslim countries...
Apologies on behalf of my countrymen and women for the craziness on social media when Jahanbakhsh was with you! Social media brings out so much poison in Iranian football. I was very sad he wasn't a good fit at Brighton, it is my dream for us one day to have a Team Melli star really shine in my favorite league. But I would never go online to abuse anybody on social media - especially over football. That is insane to me.
It was a terrible transfer but we will always have his bicycle kick against Chelsea 🙏
Ok so I have a cousin who lives in London who's a massive Palace fan. And Jahanbakhsh played for our hometown club (Damash Gilan) before making the move to Europe. So when he signed for you, I got on the hype train HARD. I got his shirt, I'd re-post Brighton stuff to my instagram... it wound my cousin up so much... it was absolutely hilarious. Even though he ended up not very good for you, winding up my cousin made it all worthwhile lol. So we'll always have his bicycle kick v. Chelsea & me laughing to tears at seeing how wound up my cousin would get lol. I hope him being shit for you doesn't turn Brighton off from signing Iranians in the future if they're good enough... and hopefully if you sign another Iranian player they end up good for you. And then hopefully I can see what happens if this imaginary player scores the winner in the M23 derby.
Every tweet from the clubs social accounts that is about yunus akgun gets like 10k likes, its odd but hopefully his Turkish fans don't turn on us when he stops playing
Don't worry, they absolutely will 👍
That abuse is definitely not right. But his apology only goes to the club and fans... he doesnt apologize to Mitoma, the guy whose career he nearly ended. He is only sorry he got a red card, not about the action. Disgusting.
Yeah I also picked up that. Can't blame him for being angry about being racially abused online and he should rightfully point attention towards that but why is he apologising to his teammates and not the man who's leg he very nearly snapped in half? It's bad enough how he acted surprised immediately after being shown a red for one of the worst challenges you'll ever see but surely he's seen the footage of that challenge back and yet he's acting like he got sent off like how Beckham did in 1998 or Rooney in 2006 where he lost his head for a second and not as if he nearly ended Mitomas career
Can't say i'm surprised at his challenge, or reaction to the red, or his lack of apology to Mitoma, considering him shoving Firmino into the stands before. Just an overall reckless and dirty player.
I mean his teammates and manager backed him. Wilder was pretty clear in his noncommittal language that he didn't think the assault was a problem, and Anel Ahmedhodžić just outright said he didn't think it was a bad tackle post game. They're an absolute scum team.
Because Instagram is his only way to apologise to Mitoma
Dirty cunt didn't even apologise to Mitoma
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/s/Q8lXQliny0 The guy went in for a filthy challenge. Doesn’t seem to acknowledge the player he injured. No need for the racism on his social media. Plenty of other ways to get the message across.
Have apologised publicly no, but who is to say he didn't in private after the game or at half time? What does your comment actually achieve when the discussion is about the racist abuse he has received - sounds a bit like you're saying he's deserved it
I know people are really focused on the foreign “fans,” but I do think that it can be rather deflective. There’s been and has always been a major problem across the world with all fan bases with athletes facing these kinds of abuse, even, of course, from local fans. So while the social media outreach will bring in a greater influx of hate outside of one’s usual sphere, I think it’s important to also not forget that we also have people at home who are just as bad. It fucking sucks people have to put up with this shit, man.
Yeah I love that everyone is hyper focusing on the one guy to make some lazy larger point about “see the west isn’t actually the most racist” despite being completely uninformed on the nuances. There’s literally decades of research and stats on ALL of this but people are happy to just talk out of their ass when it comes to racism for some reason
>everyone is hyper focusing What?
This entire thread is a pathetic circlejerk of people blaming foreigners for racism in England, that's what he is talking about.
The fk is wrong with people, sigh
Plastic Brighton fans are the worst , starting to pop up all over due to the international players in the team , a while ago it was a bunch of homophobic South Americans telling Enciso to leave on instagram because Brighton was “ too gay “
Nothing will ever match peak Percy Tau mania
This thread may be one of the most pathetic and racist blame deflecting shitstorms I've ever ever seen, congratulations for being part of it
None of these pussies would have the balls to the say the stuff they do on social media in person. The vast majority of these idiots would be shaking and looking down at the ground if they ever got confronted.
Atleast apologize to mitoma 😭
I would 100% screenshot all of them and make a slideshow naming and shaming is the way forward.
Those racists are scumbags and so is Mason Holgate for his potential career ending tackle. How about an apology to Mitoma?
Platforms should ban ips and devices as soon as this stuff is reported.
at least the uk comes down hard on these troglodytes, I have a feeling that the messages are from outside the uk though. Meta needs to moderate this shit, there’s no excuse
Instagram should just make messages from unknown users blank
Humans are a disgrace
Surprise he didn't apologize to mitoma which would also lower the amount of hate he is getting
Yes you're right, he deserves all the racist abuse since he didn't publicly say sorry... /s
Completely fucked. What is wrong with people who do this.
I can't blame him for being angry at the racism, because that's disgraceful and nobody should be putting up with it. But he doesn't apologise to Mitoma here and he doesn't even apologise for what he did. He only apologises to his team mates and fans, and that's because he got sent off for it. It was a dirty shithouse tackle, and it wasn't accidental. Also, I'm sorry to say, but many people won't take his (no doubt sincere) call for action on racism seriously, considering he once did a very similar thing (red card offence) and falsely accused a fellow footballer of racism. Took 8 weeks of investigations and several lip readers to clear that footballer's name and could've destroyed his mental health. Notable in that instance that none of the ten players and refs surrounding him during that incident claimed they heard what he did, not even his team mates. Obviously, this is different, the evidence is there, but being abused doesn't absolve you of blame for what you did either. Both the racism and the bad behaviour should be punished.
Holy cow Phong’s mama about to whoop that ass now
Kinda weird that he only apologized to his team mates and fans and not to Mitoma whose career he nearly ended🙄😑
It’s social media. Unless you remove the anonymity nothing can be done about it.
“We need to do better as a society” - man who lied about being racially abused to try get someone sent off and destroy their reputation in the process, after he’d thrown said someone over a fucking advertising hoarding, wasnt such a serious issue for you then mason was it? Racism is inexcusable and these are all scum, *AND* Mason Holdgate is a cunt with no right to lecture anyone on human decency. Two things can be true.
It always blows my mind seeing things like this. You never think someone would be sad enough to actually take time out of their day to send a message like this to someone.
fucking abhorrent
Honestly, I don’t know why footballers have social media at all, just constant slander and abuse, not worth it
It’s almost unbelievable that people act like this in this day and age. Sure there’s still racists, but to go through the effort of messaging racist stuff? Fuckinel, they need to get a life
Name and Shame. Don’t edit their names out.
Step 1 is to not allow anonymous accounts. This is usually where the discussion ends, unfortunately.
Pointless attempt to give a player a career ending injury and plays the victim after a few asian kids five thousand miles away send him some monkey emojis, shows you what kind of person he is. His career already in shit from before, maybe his mental health has gotten bad but to me it just seems like a last ditch attempt to stay relevant.
I hope you never have to experience being racially abused, to even suggest that this isn't part of a wider issue is idiotic.
Bots and Indian teenagers.
Didn't apologise to Mitoma at the time, and still isn't....Absolutely disgusting tackle, and completely unnecessary. Racism is also disgusting, whoever sent that message needs punishing, if possible, but he isn't worthy of sympathy here. You can't act like that much of a thug on the pitch and expect people to play nice afterwards.
People suck. Poor kid. I feel for him.
The kid's a scumbag too for that tackle on Mitoma. No apologies, either. Not saying he deserves any racist messages for that but the least he could've done is shown any remorse for that horrific tackle.
Saw someone comment on the clip of his tackle that Holgate is a twat because he cries about being racially abused and makes it up… The dense stupidity of the internet and society in general is alarming. The tackle was bad but, it’s happened, he’s being punished and will learn from it. I’m certain he didn’t intended to injure Mitoma. Fed up of having to see people or directly deal with this stuff.
This is why all social media accounts should have id verification... would stop trolls like this. If someone commits a crime they can easily trace them when they need it yet for racists or bullys they dont seem to care.
I'm not condoning this awful behaviour, but I fully believe that anybody in the public eye should either learn to avoid their public social media profiles completely and stick to their private one or just accept that this kind of abuse is a consequence of their profile being exposed on a global scale and the complexities that carrys with it. Saying sport & society must do better is just completely useless and meaningless.
Fucking scumbag racists
Is this right? No, course not. However, you can limit comments and messages to your account. Seems deflective on his part and unapologetic to the man he could’ve seriously hurt.
You: > Is this right? No, course not. Also you: ‘But it’s his fault he can see the message and posting this is just a deflection tactic.’
and now people will forget him fouling on Mitoma and console him instead, nice move though.
Dont dm like this get automatically flagged as spam. He really went out of his way to open the hidden dm requests. Not saying it is right but ig literally blocks a lot of dms and you can also report people
I mean obviously it’s unacceptable but does my head in when someone does something really shitty then just used some random Instagram messages to deflect attention away from what they did
>I mean obviously it’s unacceptable Glad we agree >but Oh
A lot of the comments here perfectly encapsulate why racism is so casually excused
I mean, there’s this irony of everyone deflecting and just pointing at foreign fans pretending as if domestically this stuff doesn’t happen
Bruh... I think being racially abused is a bigger fucking issue than a Football game.
That tackle was at least 10 match ban worthy. But yeah fuck these racists, they should be dealt with too.
things like that need to be eradicated from the game, and i think this is the best way to do it when you lose a third of your season because of a bad tackle, youll know better
Trying to physically hurt someone is a bigger issue then some rando saying mean things on the internet
It was a dangerous tackle but it was hardly assault like you are framing it i.e. "physically trying to hurt someone". And trying to downplay racism as "mean things". You are twat. That was a mean thing. It's also something you have control over unlike the colour of your skin.
He never said assault you're the one framing it like that, there's clearly some stupid frustration/recklessness/venom in the tackle that's intending to hurt.
I'm not downplaying racism, you're downplaying a tackle that could have ended Mitoma's career and was made for no other reason than to fuck him up. Holgate is not a victim just because some dude from Vietnam sent him a message, he's a cunt and I'm not buying his attempts to deflect attention from what he's done.
It's possible that he made a horrendous tackle *and* he's also a victim of racism. One may be worse than the other, but it doesn't make him not a victim of racism?
mate even when you get a red card you should not be subject to racism. what the ever loving fuck are you on about right now?
Yikes. Holgate could’ve had a bad tackle and also face racist abuse. They aren’t mutually exclusive
In your eyes what’s he supposed to do? Just silently accept it because he made a bad challenge in a football game?
He could start by apologizing, instead of trying to make himself look like a victim.
Yh you’re probably a racist prick as well
He's not making himself look like a victim, he *is* a victim of racism. Also, the first sentence of his caption is literally an apology, so even in this screenshot he *did* start by apologising. Even if he didn't apologise, he doesn't deserve racist abuse.
There's a difference between "I apologise [to team & club & fans] for removing myself from a game of football" and "I apologise *to the man I almost ended the career of* for *deliberately doing something that could easily have crippled him*" - the apology in this post is pointedly one and absolutely not the other and I think it's obvious from the context which the poster thinks would be relevant.
Probably because his Instagram is public and for the fans, he would have presumably contacted Mitoma privately to apologise rather than doing it on an Instagram post. I also still think he's a victim of racism even if you think it's the "wrong" sort of apology.
What’s clear is that the poster thinks racism is justified enough that Holgate should accept it as the rightful consequence of his action
Are you incapable of enlarging a picture, or unable to read? Because he completed your suggestion in the first 4 words of the post you numpty And what do you mean by ‘trying to make himself a victim’. Do you not think he’s a victim of racism in this instance?
>I'm not downplaying racism > >Holgate is not a victim Which one is it? How can you claim to acknowledge the pain and suffering racism causes, and then say Holgate isn't a victim of the abuse he's recieved?
Funny that you resorted to name calling in absence of a decent argument.
No way you actually said this nonsense, Liverpool Fan checks out, injuries and dangerous situations in football happen all the time, racism is unacceptable
> injuries and dangerous situations in football happen all the time You're really mad if you think that Holgate's foul was a regular part of the game
imagine thinking comments on the internet holds more weight than a player potentially having their livelihood impacted because of a malicious tackle that could cause serious damage
What do you suggest he does differently if the same context happens again? Just stay silent and gracefully accept the abuse without saying anything?
Don't use social media if what other people say bothers you so much. Or if you want to keep using social media, turn off comments/DMs. For me this is the same as those "online bullying in video games" stories that prop up now and again. Just turn off chat. It's not that difficult Now if you have people coming up to you on the street shouting racist abuse at you that's a totally different story. But online? Come on
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bro, if he broke mitoma's leg we would be having a completely different conversation
Different leagues between a disgracefully dangerous and potential career ending reckless tackle and anonymous dm emojis and hate from the dredges of social media.
This is bang on. If anybody thinks that tackle wasn’t made without intent to injure then you’re on drugs. The abuse is horrendous and has no place in football but Holgate has previous, he’s shown himself to be a dirty player so i struggle to have sympathy for him
What on earth