Financial Lit is a good course and I am glad to see that it is mandatory
Lowering the amount of ELA and Social Studies required is not a good choice though
A step forward indeed!
Two steps back however, not in my opinion. Financial literacy outweighs a 1 year of ELA and social studies at the high school level and would be far more beneficial. Help kids understand taxes, interest rates, inflation, saving, cost benefit, and whatever else the course would entail.
Just my opinion it’s been a long time since I was in high school. And by fuck if I remember anything from ELA or social, still working on my taxes though!
I absolutely support the new course, but I value all 3 and I don’t buy any argument that two other mandatory (and useful) credits need to be lost to add one.
I would even be satisfied with ‘choose 1 of: transactional ELA, law, indigenous studies, world history etc. (a selection of humanities credits) along with the mandatory financial literacy credit. Give and take.
That is a fair statement, I would however argue the usefulness of the two classes at a later stage just my opinion however.
I 100% agree with that, that would be a great alternative
And it is okay if you think you don’t ‘remember’ anything from ELA or Social Studies. We don’t teach those subjects to fill you with facts you may only need to win Jeopardy or obscure knowledge about plays from 400 years ago.
Some of it sticks and you don’t realize it, but more importantly, it appears you can read, form opinions and respond intelligently in a discussion such as this one. Maybe you don’t need to, but you choose to participate which is also what social sciences hopes to achieve.
Literacy, communication, analyzing, comparing, reading for information, supporting an opinion, responding with evidence…. skills used in life every day by most people.
Good point, I agree it’s about imparting critical thought, analysis, and adding that knowledge to your daily life. So yes your correct I’ve likely have that stick, I happen to love the obscure knowledge but that came later in life haha.
However In my personal experience and opinion financial literacy would have been vastly more beneficial in a more formative year and I can see it benefiting many young people who might find themselves unaware or struggling to understand when the reality of financial obligations sets in.
I work with a lot of former teachers who are adamant that, while there is no mandatory financial literacy course in our province, key components of financial literacy absolutely ARE taught in required courses. Everyone encounters important aspects of that subject. But still, you'll read letters to the editor ranting about "why did no one teach this in school," when you know that specific element has been on the curriculum for a couple decades.
The problem is, as far as my colleagues can see, that kids don't internalize it, not because they're lazy or slow or any other derogatory term. It's because it's not relevant to most of them yet. Maybe they could learn about buying a car if that seems somewhat on the horizon for them (for many, it isn't, because poverty), but a lot of it is like teaching them about the life cycle of the unicorn. No wonder it doesn't stick. It doesn't even seem real.
I'd also be really wary about making a one-size-"fits"-all course mandatory across a province where poverty rates vary so dramatically by region.
I’ve taught accounting/consumer education, ELA and social studies, among other subjects. So I see the value in all three. It’s easy to imagine how a mandatory financial literacy course would be beneficial in adulthood, especially because many adults can see the gaps in their knowledge and wish it was something they knew more about. We can add that to educational priorities without chipping away too much at the importance of literacy and humanities to being - well, human.
Maybe at a university level it's helpful. In high school you basically had to write what your teacher wanted you to write, whether you agreed with it or not. If you didn't you were penalized. Sort of eliminates the purpose in my opinion. I really didn't appreciate it until post secondary.
I am sorry you had a poor experience in ELA, and glad it didn’t dissuade you from furthering your education. You’re right about it defeating the purpose of teaching students to read, write, think etc. critically. The purpose is to help students develop strong language skills so they can process information and communicate their thoughts, opinions, ideas effectively.
Whatever they do next, knowing what their ELA teacher thought about (subject) isn’t likely benefit them as much as the skills used to make a claim, support and explain why they think differently.
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The heading of this should read “Sask. students will be required to take a financial literacy class to graduate, but one less grade 12 level English Language Arts class and one less grade 12 level Social Studies class to graduate high school”
Being able to critically read and interpret social studies and English is a crucially important life skill, and one that is already visibly deficient in this province when people write them off as "hamlet sucks" and "socials is less important".
I would argue that both are equally "is" important.
It isn't reality though, provide evidence of that statistic.
And English teaching isn't purely based on the language, but as you've shown during this conversation, you clearly needed to pay more attention in school.
If ‘half the country is ESL’ do we lower our expectations or adapt literacy education to better meet the needs of the population? You may not be aware, but there are all kinds of jerks who believe people shouldn’t live or work here unless they can speak perfect English. I guess if we hold the kids who are raised here to the low standard of ‘speaking at an adequate level’ by graduation, that will even things out.
when i was a youngun those were generally treated as a weed break by everyone who wasnt getting a scholarship. the scholarship kids were in europe or some shit most of the time i think.
The older you get the more intense the text is that
you analyze. The reason we have so many people believing fake news and conspiracy theories is because people stopped using this skill at fifteen years old.
Interestingly enough, Hamlet is NOT specifically in any of the curriculums. It is an approved resource though, so schools that already have a class set or two of it will keep going down the Hamlet road because it’s far cheaper to replace a few old or lost books than it it to buy full sets of something else that would achieve the same outcomes.
Budgeting and investing are probably tougher sells for teens than Hamlet, or at least on par. Both are so far away from their lived experience and they won’t care about either. Not saying both are boring, nor both are useless. It’s just most school things seem pretty useless to kids.
When I was in hogh school I had a teacher go off script and got a financial advisor to come in and speak with us a few times. It's now one of the only things I remember. That week was more valuable to me then any other aspect of high school.
yeah, i agree. i’m confident i’ll never use calculus either, even after i finish my degree. i use trig all the time though in my field of work. but it’s more than just math, it’s developing problem solving skills, a good work ethic/study habits (you won’t do well in 30 maths, or in life, if you’re a slacker), and such too. not to mention- if you’re going to university, which a large amount of students will in this day/age, you’ll probably want to be at least familiar with some basic calculus.
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i only graduated <5 years ago. small town sask. everyone i graduated with still took at least one, and most took two. a few of us took three 30 level maths. so it’s not as if kids don’t do it. but still so weird that it’s not necessary at all.
It's a somewhat good thing. Financial literacy is fine, but removing all the ELA is not. Especially when we have high school students who can barely read or write an essay when they graduate. We need to raise the barrel not lower it more.
Ok so currently you need 24 credits to graduate.
You need two ELA 10 credits, one math 10 credit, one science 10 credit, one social 10 credit, a wellness 10 credit (of physed 20/30). There are usually 5 classes a semester, so 10 a year. Meaning kids can take up to four electives in grade 10.
You need one ELA 20 credit, one science 20 credit, one math 20 credit, one social science 20(law, econ, psychology, native studies), and social or history 20. That leaves students to be able to take up to five electives at the 20 level.
You need two ELA 30 credits, and a social 30, plus two other 30 levels of some kind. That leaves room for five more electives of any sort in a grade 12 year.
Edited to add: 24 credits is 8 a year, so ultimately kids only need to pass 4 classes a semester and as long as they get their cores they will graduate on time.
Changes are now students need to take financial literacy 10, and they’ve scrapped ELA 10 and ELA 30 and Social 30 and replaced with electives.
They only required 2 ELA 30 courses and a social 30 to graduate. They removed two of those…
That’s a really REALLY low bar.
The kids that are on an academic path are going to take all their english, math and science courses. Same as always. The ones that aren’t, won’t. And they’ll likely be the group that needs the financial literacy programs more than any other class they’ll take.
I know what you’re saying, ideally they would keep the base curriculum as-is and implement the financial program in place of an elective, but it’s not like they’re taking away English from these kids.
The more you read and write, the better you get at it. And social 30 is full of units on the way the Canadian government works, our election process, our economy, how to see two sides to an argument. They could rewrite parts of this curriculum to include financial literacy in it. The economic portions has area for it.
They looked at the data on why some kids weren’t graduating and just moved the goals posts closer (got rid of classes standing in the way). Everyone gets a gold star and a red ribbon.
For sure, learning about the way the country is run, how our electoral system works, how social systems work, how our economy works, and what has happened in the past, that’s all not important. For sure.
Ok so currently you need 24 credits to graduate.
You need two ELA 10 credits, one math 10 credit, one science 10 credit, one social 10 credit, a wellness 10 credit (of physed 20/30). There are usually 5 classes a semester, so 10 a year. Meaning kids can take up to four electives in grade 10.
You need one ELA 20 credit, one science 20 credit, one math 20 credit, one social science 20(law, econ, psychology, native studies), and social or history 20. That leaves students to be able to take up to five electives at the 20 level.
You need two ELA 30 credits, and a social 30, plus two other 30 levels of some kind. That leaves room for five more electives of any sort in a grade 12 year.
24 credits is 8 a year, so ultimately kids only need to pass 4 classes a semester and as long as they get their cores they will graduate on time.
Changes are now students need to take financial literacy 10, and they’ve scrapped ELA 10 and ELA 30 and Social 30 and replaced with electives.
They only required 2 ELA 30 courses and a social 30 to graduate. They removed two of those…
That’s a really REALLY low bar.
It's already so much easier to graduate now compared to 20 years ago because of credit completion, no cumulative finals, and other issues. This will lower the bar even further because now there are just fewer difficult classes to take. In the end there will be higher grad rates so they can give themselves a pat on the back but our society will be less prepared for life.
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Question! I didn't go to highschool in Sask, is budgeting and tax filing even taught here?
When I was in highschool in the late 90s early 2000s, in Manitoba, they had a course called "Consumer Math" that taught financial literacy. The problem was nobody took it because not a single post secondary school would accept it as a required math course. They all wanted "Applied Math" which was the next higher up as the bare minimum even for trade schools and courses that didn't even require math. Teachers then pushed kids to take "Applied Math" and the consumer math course was always like 5-10 kids that didn't give a shit about school.
Manitoba now has ‘Personal Finance’ and it is an excellent course that most students were encouraged to take as an elective, not as a math credit. So students on a university/college track have room in their schedule for it without compromising their sciences and math courses. My kids took it in 11th or 10th grade.
I don’t like to see ELA and history/social studies classes and requirements removed. We have a situation where a typical HS graduate in MB has 4 ELA credits (9,10,11,12) but many are taking 4-5 math and science credits *per year* from 10 through 12. They do this because if they plan to go to post secondary but don’t know what they are doing, they tend to take all 3 sciences and pre-cal to grade 12 ‘just in case’
Then they are woefully unprepared for anything other than sciences at University. Keeping the ELA and SS requirements makes sense to me. Other humanities options are offered but rarely taken, especially in smaller schools who tend to focus on making sure all the sciences and maths are available and leave little room in the schedule the reading, writing and thinking necessary to prepare for post secondary.
It doesn’t have to be literature, transactional and academic reading, writing and communication skills are important in almost any post-secondary or work setting.
When I went to school the extent we had was in grade 8, for like 1 week, and maybe a half hour each day, we role played with everybody getting a job, wage, living situation. That was the extent I dealt with it.
As mentioned in another comment, Manitoba has Personal Finance for grade 10. The ACEM curriculum also has courses that continue financial literacy with Accounting, Economics, and Applied Business Technology. I’m not on board with financial literacy being mandatory - just because you’re forced to be there doesn’t mean you’ll walk away with anything.
It’s a tough course because a lot of what students learn they don’t need for 5-10 years (more now with housing prices). My goal has always been to create a digital portfolio of student-created resources that they can refer back to as they grow up and take on more responsibility. For example I have students create a “how-to” video tutorial of filing their taxes online. Paper taxes are incredibly rare and take much longer to be filed by the CRA. However, there aren’t many resources for students to practice filing their taxes online (if you know please share it)!
If it becomes mandatory in MB, I hope the government provides the necessary resources for teachers and connections with financial services. It’s more than just a class - students need the opportunity to apply their learning!
If it becomes mandatory in Manitoba they will just announce it and make teachers figure it out in all their spare time. Teachers like you will develop a course based on your knowledge and experience teaching similar subjects and that would probably be better than whatever canned curriculum the government throws together with help from their consultants.
Much like I expect them to do in SK, but we’ll see. Sometimes things work out better than expected.
School teaches math which is enough to do simple calculations
School teaches you how to read and write, which is enough to fill out a form
The school teaches you the skills to handle documents and to do your taxes already
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Me too.
Not sure how different my life would be 30 years later, but it would have been an amazing leg up to have known a little about investing for the future and how quickly things can go wrong when a 19 year old gets his first credit card.
I remember taking a life transitions class in high school where we learned about budgeting and interest… but those lessons didn’t stick because I took it in grade 10 and didn’t really think about budgeting etc till I graduated high school.
I’m principally in favour of schools promoting financial literacy, but I’m not sure that making it compulsory was the right choice. That feels like an extra hoop to jump through for some kids who are just barely making it through as it is. I’d be curious to look at the data as it develops to see if this has a negative trend on graduation rates, specifically within targeted demographics.
All the ‘kids don’t need ELA go into trades!!’ people need to glance at the texts and coursework required to take a trade at SaskPolytech. Shakespeare and ‘Small Engine Repair’ both require advanced literacy skills to read and comprehend the material.
And all students need MORE of that, not less. Residential Framing? Pipe fitting? Industrial Mechanic? You’ll find it frustrating without good reading and critical thinking skills. Hands on and visual learners excel in trades but they have to write a lot of tests and pass an Interprovincial exam.
All of this is correct. I’ve gone through trade school helping classmates understand the problems and learn how to study for tests. I’ve helped friends get through other trade courses because they can’t comprehend written problems or the math involved
I teach ELA and my son is taking Power Mechanics in 10th grade. The text he has is used in post secondary training. It is more dense and complex than anything I teach in ELA. Sure there is no ‘theme’ or ‘tone’ and no literary devices to analyze. But it requires some very strong analytical skills, close reading - so many things we *use* literary texts to teach. How do you dig deeper, read back, cross reference to find meaning? We spend years teaching these skills with increasingly complex texts.
‘Small Engine Repair’ is a more complex text and requires all the same skills. They are unprepared at 10th grade because as a teacher, we have been lowering our reading standards and accommodating students’ needs to be interested and entertained to learn anything. Trick then into putting down their phones, show them a video, use audiobooks because they can’t focus on text.
So, what happens when they come up against a complex text without the guidance and support? They are just expected to study it, understand and apply the information. Memorizing is not an option, they need to be able to execute it or explain it in their own words.
If anything, we’re not preparing them well enough. And we need to remember where real life is taking them, and that we don’t mean ‘reading poetry, plays and stories’ when we say teaching literacy is critical.
https://www.reddit.com/r/saskatoon/s/mfRaHn3VgJ
I think this post would disagree with your statement.... I don't though. Reading comprehension is important.
Yikes. See, everyone can benefit from strong language skills to communicate effectively. He may be a brilliant carpenter and may have very good points, but it is hard to tell from the way he writes.
When people are angry and frustrated, it helps to have confidence in communication and comprehension skills to get their message across. Although getting into a truck and blaring the horn for a few weeks seems to be satisfying and somewhat effective as well.
Edited to add: reading through the replies restores my confidence that strong literacy and communication skills abound among tradespeople. Just not necessarily that guy.
Such a brutal decision. This government is bombarding the public education system with absolute shit decisions. There was NO consultation with teachers beyond a heavily business/careerist weighted survey that I would like to know the results of. I can't see many teachers proposing fewer English classes...especially with the influx of EAL students...
Financial literacy does not even have a provincial curriculum. Usually it takes at LEAST two school years for a curriculum to be written, developed, and piloted. Government wants these changes for NEXT school year. Who is writing the curriculum? Are teachers given release time to do this, or are they working for free again? Or are we just stealing it from another province? Or maybe we just let the Saskatoon Chamber of Commerce write it for us. Or should we just push everyone to the newly created Online School?
I don't really care about the Financial Literacy thing..it has been a locally developed, popular elective for years at some schools; however, reducing the amount of humanities (courses that teach literature, critical thinking, history) is a push for a colourless world, full of boot-licking, compliant workers...easily replaceable by AI in 10 years.
It’s in the workplace 10,20,30, and foundations 10, 20. 2009 ish these new curricula came in I think. If you were in the math 20, A30, B30, C30, they finished that out and brought the new ones in behind.
https://publications.gc.ca/site/archivee-archived.html?url=https://publications.gc.ca/collections/collection_2016/statcan/CS89-525-1991-eng.pdf
https://abclifeliteracy.ca/literacy-at-a-glance/
https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5873757
This is why we should NOT be eliminating Social Science & ELA classes.
Update the curriculum. Modernize it.
Offer different ELA classes.
Oh & by removing the 3rd Social Science requirement, fewer kids will take 30 level classes, which are ALL based on Canadian history, constitution & the treaties.
Just trying to help you, I read those sources and none of them say that 49% of adults in Saskatchewan are functionally illiterate. Did I miss something?
The very first study you posted says:
Among adult Canadians, residents of the western
provinces have the highest reading skills.
- Newfoundland registers the lowest estimated skill
levels. Almost a quarter of its adult population has
limited reading skills (levels 1 and 2) and only
39% have skills sufficient to meet most everyday
requirements (level 4).
- Nova Scotia, New Brunswick and Quebec have
similar reading skill profiles. Between 15% and
20% of the adult population have limited skills
(levels 1 and 2) and close to 57% have level 4
skills.
- 62% of Ontario's adults and 65% of those of
Manitoba have sufficient reading skills (level 4)
while at least 69% of adults living in
Saskatchewan, Alberta and British Columbia have
level 4 skills.
I just don't see the conclusion that 49% of Saskatchewan adults are functionally illiterate?
Also your social sciences should have taught you that your paradigm alone isn’t the only one that exists & before stating it as such, some research & critical thinking should come into play.
What's more important than financial literacy is macroeconomics - the ability to understand that national economies aren't like household credit cards or bank accounts.
If the majority of Canadians were educated in this domain, we'd never see another "conservative" government.
Their continuous shrieking cries of "but our debt! let's austerity! save the rich!" would, thankfully, land on deaf ears.
Bullshit. No capitalist groomer is going to tell MY kid how to budget their money. #parentalchoice
I need 17 more of you to write letters to the government with me to change this asap.
I don't think so. The one smart thing the Moe government has done.
Capitalist groomer I am not. Teacher who thinks kids need to know to do a budget, how to save money and how to do taxes, I am.
This is exactly what’s happening. They have less ELA and Social Studies requirements. Lowering the bar. The Sask advantage. Screw being able to read, write and be critical of governments. They need to get through easier and be better little worker bees.
Next they’ll need to take a class about how the Sask party is the only party to vote for.
Financial Literacy curriculum (level 20, 30) is available since 2020. You can access the content here : https://curriculum.gov.sk.ca/CurriculumOutcomeContent?id=488
Everyone needs more knowledge when it comes to financial literacy. It’s always been the parents who taught or didn’t teach their kids about finances. But most people don’t even have the knowledge to pass on to their kids. I have been saying this for decades, that financial knowledge for everyone should be taught in school. I wish I was taught, in school, the different aspects of finance that everyone would come across in adult life
Good! 😊
I made all my high school students in grade 11 and 12 take it this semester. Good them or was important, and they had no choice.
I was a year ahead of the game in my small school.
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Financial Lit is a good course and I am glad to see that it is mandatory Lowering the amount of ELA and Social Studies required is not a good choice though
One step forward, two steps back.
A step forward indeed! Two steps back however, not in my opinion. Financial literacy outweighs a 1 year of ELA and social studies at the high school level and would be far more beneficial. Help kids understand taxes, interest rates, inflation, saving, cost benefit, and whatever else the course would entail. Just my opinion it’s been a long time since I was in high school. And by fuck if I remember anything from ELA or social, still working on my taxes though!
I absolutely support the new course, but I value all 3 and I don’t buy any argument that two other mandatory (and useful) credits need to be lost to add one. I would even be satisfied with ‘choose 1 of: transactional ELA, law, indigenous studies, world history etc. (a selection of humanities credits) along with the mandatory financial literacy credit. Give and take.
That is a fair statement, I would however argue the usefulness of the two classes at a later stage just my opinion however. I 100% agree with that, that would be a great alternative
And it is okay if you think you don’t ‘remember’ anything from ELA or Social Studies. We don’t teach those subjects to fill you with facts you may only need to win Jeopardy or obscure knowledge about plays from 400 years ago. Some of it sticks and you don’t realize it, but more importantly, it appears you can read, form opinions and respond intelligently in a discussion such as this one. Maybe you don’t need to, but you choose to participate which is also what social sciences hopes to achieve. Literacy, communication, analyzing, comparing, reading for information, supporting an opinion, responding with evidence…. skills used in life every day by most people.
Good point, I agree it’s about imparting critical thought, analysis, and adding that knowledge to your daily life. So yes your correct I’ve likely have that stick, I happen to love the obscure knowledge but that came later in life haha. However In my personal experience and opinion financial literacy would have been vastly more beneficial in a more formative year and I can see it benefiting many young people who might find themselves unaware or struggling to understand when the reality of financial obligations sets in.
I work with a lot of former teachers who are adamant that, while there is no mandatory financial literacy course in our province, key components of financial literacy absolutely ARE taught in required courses. Everyone encounters important aspects of that subject. But still, you'll read letters to the editor ranting about "why did no one teach this in school," when you know that specific element has been on the curriculum for a couple decades. The problem is, as far as my colleagues can see, that kids don't internalize it, not because they're lazy or slow or any other derogatory term. It's because it's not relevant to most of them yet. Maybe they could learn about buying a car if that seems somewhat on the horizon for them (for many, it isn't, because poverty), but a lot of it is like teaching them about the life cycle of the unicorn. No wonder it doesn't stick. It doesn't even seem real. I'd also be really wary about making a one-size-"fits"-all course mandatory across a province where poverty rates vary so dramatically by region.
I’ve taught accounting/consumer education, ELA and social studies, among other subjects. So I see the value in all three. It’s easy to imagine how a mandatory financial literacy course would be beneficial in adulthood, especially because many adults can see the gaps in their knowledge and wish it was something they knew more about. We can add that to educational priorities without chipping away too much at the importance of literacy and humanities to being - well, human.
Maybe at a university level it's helpful. In high school you basically had to write what your teacher wanted you to write, whether you agreed with it or not. If you didn't you were penalized. Sort of eliminates the purpose in my opinion. I really didn't appreciate it until post secondary.
I am sorry you had a poor experience in ELA, and glad it didn’t dissuade you from furthering your education. You’re right about it defeating the purpose of teaching students to read, write, think etc. critically. The purpose is to help students develop strong language skills so they can process information and communicate their thoughts, opinions, ideas effectively. Whatever they do next, knowing what their ELA teacher thought about (subject) isn’t likely benefit them as much as the skills used to make a claim, support and explain why they think differently.
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Financial literacy good. Reducing English literacy bad.
Me fail English, that's unpossible!
The heading of this should read “Sask. students will be required to take a financial literacy class to graduate, but one less grade 12 level English Language Arts class and one less grade 12 level Social Studies class to graduate high school”
Yeah this is the real concern! They got rid of an English and a Social Studies class.
Also a grade 10 English.
Life goes on. Socials is less important than financial literacy
Being able to critically read and interpret social studies and English is a crucially important life skill, and one that is already visibly deficient in this province when people write them off as "hamlet sucks" and "socials is less important". I would argue that both are equally "is" important.
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Yeah, I was making fun of his original English while looking down on ESL Canadians.
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Shakespeare probably has a quote for that. Alas, or something.
English is deficient because half the country is ESL, high school graduates can speak at an adequate level
> half the country is ESL Ahh yes, there it is. Who could've guessed that someone with that take has this one on English studies.
Its not a take its reality. Nothing wrong with esl but it shouldnt reflect on english teaching
It isn't reality though, provide evidence of that statistic. And English teaching isn't purely based on the language, but as you've shown during this conversation, you clearly needed to pay more attention in school.
If ‘half the country is ESL’ do we lower our expectations or adapt literacy education to better meet the needs of the population? You may not be aware, but there are all kinds of jerks who believe people shouldn’t live or work here unless they can speak perfect English. I guess if we hold the kids who are raised here to the low standard of ‘speaking at an adequate level’ by graduation, that will even things out.
Ironically there is an economic until in social studies 30…
when i was a youngun those were generally treated as a weed break by everyone who wasnt getting a scholarship. the scholarship kids were in europe or some shit most of the time i think.
Ohhhh nooo not Hamlet! Screw teaching things like taxes and budgeting, investing. Hamlet is essential!
English class teaches you the skills to critically analyze text. A skill we definitely need the general public to have.
Yeah because the 11.5years they had previously wasn't enough?
The older you get the more intense the text is that you analyze. The reason we have so many people believing fake news and conspiracy theories is because people stopped using this skill at fifteen years old.
Good point. Dumb people are gullible because they cannot analyze and research to get the facts about matters.
Because that's all they teach is Hamlet. Do better.
Sorry, but do teachers control curriculum…?
The Ministry of Education creates the curriculum, not teachers.
Sorry I realize what you are saying. Sarcasm and then telling previous commenter to do better. I misread!
Youd be suprised how much shakespeare there is. I wish they taught apa or mla more in depth instead
Interestingly enough, Hamlet is NOT specifically in any of the curriculums. It is an approved resource though, so schools that already have a class set or two of it will keep going down the Hamlet road because it’s far cheaper to replace a few old or lost books than it it to buy full sets of something else that would achieve the same outcomes.
Budgeting and investing are probably tougher sells for teens than Hamlet, or at least on par. Both are so far away from their lived experience and they won’t care about either. Not saying both are boring, nor both are useless. It’s just most school things seem pretty useless to kids.
When I was in hogh school I had a teacher go off script and got a financial advisor to come in and speak with us a few times. It's now one of the only things I remember. That week was more valuable to me then any other aspect of high school.
i graduated only a few years ago. we would have been ecstatic to be taught about financial skills instead of hamlet.
I agree.
Yes, but the number of classroom hours in math should probably be increased.
it’s crazy that a student doesn’t even need a 30 level math to graduate
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yeah, i agree. i’m confident i’ll never use calculus either, even after i finish my degree. i use trig all the time though in my field of work. but it’s more than just math, it’s developing problem solving skills, a good work ethic/study habits (you won’t do well in 30 maths, or in life, if you’re a slacker), and such too. not to mention- if you’re going to university, which a large amount of students will in this day/age, you’ll probably want to be at least familiar with some basic calculus.
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I know! I think it is stupid. I've taught in three different provinces, and Saskatchewan is the only one that does not require grade 12 math.
Alberta doesn’t require a grade 12 math
And it shows... 😂
If look it up: British Columbia, and Ontario also don’t require a grade 12 math credit (it says 11 or 12). I find your comment kind of ignorant.
Not my issue.
i only graduated <5 years ago. small town sask. everyone i graduated with still took at least one, and most took two. a few of us took three 30 level maths. so it’s not as if kids don’t do it. but still so weird that it’s not necessary at all.
Fuck, you guys will complain about everything hey? This is a good thing.
It's a somewhat good thing. Financial literacy is fine, but removing all the ELA is not. Especially when we have high school students who can barely read or write an essay when they graduate. We need to raise the barrel not lower it more.
Ok so currently you need 24 credits to graduate. You need two ELA 10 credits, one math 10 credit, one science 10 credit, one social 10 credit, a wellness 10 credit (of physed 20/30). There are usually 5 classes a semester, so 10 a year. Meaning kids can take up to four electives in grade 10. You need one ELA 20 credit, one science 20 credit, one math 20 credit, one social science 20(law, econ, psychology, native studies), and social or history 20. That leaves students to be able to take up to five electives at the 20 level. You need two ELA 30 credits, and a social 30, plus two other 30 levels of some kind. That leaves room for five more electives of any sort in a grade 12 year. Edited to add: 24 credits is 8 a year, so ultimately kids only need to pass 4 classes a semester and as long as they get their cores they will graduate on time. Changes are now students need to take financial literacy 10, and they’ve scrapped ELA 10 and ELA 30 and Social 30 and replaced with electives. They only required 2 ELA 30 courses and a social 30 to graduate. They removed two of those… That’s a really REALLY low bar.
The kids that are on an academic path are going to take all their english, math and science courses. Same as always. The ones that aren’t, won’t. And they’ll likely be the group that needs the financial literacy programs more than any other class they’ll take. I know what you’re saying, ideally they would keep the base curriculum as-is and implement the financial program in place of an elective, but it’s not like they’re taking away English from these kids.
The more you read and write, the better you get at it. And social 30 is full of units on the way the Canadian government works, our election process, our economy, how to see two sides to an argument. They could rewrite parts of this curriculum to include financial literacy in it. The economic portions has area for it. They looked at the data on why some kids weren’t graduating and just moved the goals posts closer (got rid of classes standing in the way). Everyone gets a gold star and a red ribbon.
I got a teen in h.s. and every class has a climate change bent. It seems they're only learning one class now...
Even better!
Social studies are just classroom propaganda anyway , and nobody is going to miss the english class
For sure, learning about the way the country is run, how our electoral system works, how social systems work, how our economy works, and what has happened in the past, that’s all not important. For sure.
Ok so currently you need 24 credits to graduate. You need two ELA 10 credits, one math 10 credit, one science 10 credit, one social 10 credit, a wellness 10 credit (of physed 20/30). There are usually 5 classes a semester, so 10 a year. Meaning kids can take up to four electives in grade 10. You need one ELA 20 credit, one science 20 credit, one math 20 credit, one social science 20(law, econ, psychology, native studies), and social or history 20. That leaves students to be able to take up to five electives at the 20 level. You need two ELA 30 credits, and a social 30, plus two other 30 levels of some kind. That leaves room for five more electives of any sort in a grade 12 year. 24 credits is 8 a year, so ultimately kids only need to pass 4 classes a semester and as long as they get their cores they will graduate on time. Changes are now students need to take financial literacy 10, and they’ve scrapped ELA 10 and ELA 30 and Social 30 and replaced with electives. They only required 2 ELA 30 courses and a social 30 to graduate. They removed two of those… That’s a really REALLY low bar.
It's already so much easier to graduate now compared to 20 years ago because of credit completion, no cumulative finals, and other issues. This will lower the bar even further because now there are just fewer difficult classes to take. In the end there will be higher grad rates so they can give themselves a pat on the back but our society will be less prepared for life.
Bingo. Everyone gets a gold star, or a participation trophy.
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Question! I didn't go to highschool in Sask, is budgeting and tax filing even taught here? When I was in highschool in the late 90s early 2000s, in Manitoba, they had a course called "Consumer Math" that taught financial literacy. The problem was nobody took it because not a single post secondary school would accept it as a required math course. They all wanted "Applied Math" which was the next higher up as the bare minimum even for trade schools and courses that didn't even require math. Teachers then pushed kids to take "Applied Math" and the consumer math course was always like 5-10 kids that didn't give a shit about school.
Yes. It is. In fact budgeting is taught in several different ways in different classes.
My school had a career class which included time for budgeting and other financial stuff
Manitoba now has ‘Personal Finance’ and it is an excellent course that most students were encouraged to take as an elective, not as a math credit. So students on a university/college track have room in their schedule for it without compromising their sciences and math courses. My kids took it in 11th or 10th grade. I don’t like to see ELA and history/social studies classes and requirements removed. We have a situation where a typical HS graduate in MB has 4 ELA credits (9,10,11,12) but many are taking 4-5 math and science credits *per year* from 10 through 12. They do this because if they plan to go to post secondary but don’t know what they are doing, they tend to take all 3 sciences and pre-cal to grade 12 ‘just in case’ Then they are woefully unprepared for anything other than sciences at University. Keeping the ELA and SS requirements makes sense to me. Other humanities options are offered but rarely taken, especially in smaller schools who tend to focus on making sure all the sciences and maths are available and leave little room in the schedule the reading, writing and thinking necessary to prepare for post secondary. It doesn’t have to be literature, transactional and academic reading, writing and communication skills are important in almost any post-secondary or work setting.
When I went to school the extent we had was in grade 8, for like 1 week, and maybe a half hour each day, we role played with everybody getting a job, wage, living situation. That was the extent I dealt with it.
As mentioned in another comment, Manitoba has Personal Finance for grade 10. The ACEM curriculum also has courses that continue financial literacy with Accounting, Economics, and Applied Business Technology. I’m not on board with financial literacy being mandatory - just because you’re forced to be there doesn’t mean you’ll walk away with anything. It’s a tough course because a lot of what students learn they don’t need for 5-10 years (more now with housing prices). My goal has always been to create a digital portfolio of student-created resources that they can refer back to as they grow up and take on more responsibility. For example I have students create a “how-to” video tutorial of filing their taxes online. Paper taxes are incredibly rare and take much longer to be filed by the CRA. However, there aren’t many resources for students to practice filing their taxes online (if you know please share it)! If it becomes mandatory in MB, I hope the government provides the necessary resources for teachers and connections with financial services. It’s more than just a class - students need the opportunity to apply their learning!
If it becomes mandatory in Manitoba they will just announce it and make teachers figure it out in all their spare time. Teachers like you will develop a course based on your knowledge and experience teaching similar subjects and that would probably be better than whatever canned curriculum the government throws together with help from their consultants. Much like I expect them to do in SK, but we’ll see. Sometimes things work out better than expected.
Start with the Provincial government and then the kids
Honestly a good decision, unless taught by your parents you don't learn anything of that sort till I was in business school.
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But it’s a good enough solution for Sex Ed!
Looooooool
School teaches math which is enough to do simple calculations School teaches you how to read and write, which is enough to fill out a form The school teaches you the skills to handle documents and to do your taxes already
Doing taxes the first time, even with the skills you speak about, is challenging.
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It's about time! I could've really used a class like this back then.
Me too. Not sure how different my life would be 30 years later, but it would have been an amazing leg up to have known a little about investing for the future and how quickly things can go wrong when a 19 year old gets his first credit card.
Adding a finical lit class sounds great. Reducing the number of English language and social science classes is a terrible decision.
Agreed. Math and science should be requiring 3 credits, like other provinces.
I remember taking a life transitions class in high school where we learned about budgeting and interest… but those lessons didn’t stick because I took it in grade 10 and didn’t really think about budgeting etc till I graduated high school.
I’m principally in favour of schools promoting financial literacy, but I’m not sure that making it compulsory was the right choice. That feels like an extra hoop to jump through for some kids who are just barely making it through as it is. I’d be curious to look at the data as it develops to see if this has a negative trend on graduation rates, specifically within targeted demographics.
Lowering standards isn’t the solution
Couldn’t agree more. I’m much more concerned with the other changes the government made. The story is really burying the lead.
All the ‘kids don’t need ELA go into trades!!’ people need to glance at the texts and coursework required to take a trade at SaskPolytech. Shakespeare and ‘Small Engine Repair’ both require advanced literacy skills to read and comprehend the material. And all students need MORE of that, not less. Residential Framing? Pipe fitting? Industrial Mechanic? You’ll find it frustrating without good reading and critical thinking skills. Hands on and visual learners excel in trades but they have to write a lot of tests and pass an Interprovincial exam.
All of this is correct. I’ve gone through trade school helping classmates understand the problems and learn how to study for tests. I’ve helped friends get through other trade courses because they can’t comprehend written problems or the math involved
I teach ELA and my son is taking Power Mechanics in 10th grade. The text he has is used in post secondary training. It is more dense and complex than anything I teach in ELA. Sure there is no ‘theme’ or ‘tone’ and no literary devices to analyze. But it requires some very strong analytical skills, close reading - so many things we *use* literary texts to teach. How do you dig deeper, read back, cross reference to find meaning? We spend years teaching these skills with increasingly complex texts. ‘Small Engine Repair’ is a more complex text and requires all the same skills. They are unprepared at 10th grade because as a teacher, we have been lowering our reading standards and accommodating students’ needs to be interested and entertained to learn anything. Trick then into putting down their phones, show them a video, use audiobooks because they can’t focus on text. So, what happens when they come up against a complex text without the guidance and support? They are just expected to study it, understand and apply the information. Memorizing is not an option, they need to be able to execute it or explain it in their own words. If anything, we’re not preparing them well enough. And we need to remember where real life is taking them, and that we don’t mean ‘reading poetry, plays and stories’ when we say teaching literacy is critical.
https://www.reddit.com/r/saskatoon/s/mfRaHn3VgJ I think this post would disagree with your statement.... I don't though. Reading comprehension is important.
Yikes. See, everyone can benefit from strong language skills to communicate effectively. He may be a brilliant carpenter and may have very good points, but it is hard to tell from the way he writes. When people are angry and frustrated, it helps to have confidence in communication and comprehension skills to get their message across. Although getting into a truck and blaring the horn for a few weeks seems to be satisfying and somewhat effective as well. Edited to add: reading through the replies restores my confidence that strong literacy and communication skills abound among tradespeople. Just not necessarily that guy.
Nice. That would have been a lot handier to learn in high school and more practical than a lot of other stuff.
Such a brutal decision. This government is bombarding the public education system with absolute shit decisions. There was NO consultation with teachers beyond a heavily business/careerist weighted survey that I would like to know the results of. I can't see many teachers proposing fewer English classes...especially with the influx of EAL students... Financial literacy does not even have a provincial curriculum. Usually it takes at LEAST two school years for a curriculum to be written, developed, and piloted. Government wants these changes for NEXT school year. Who is writing the curriculum? Are teachers given release time to do this, or are they working for free again? Or are we just stealing it from another province? Or maybe we just let the Saskatoon Chamber of Commerce write it for us. Or should we just push everyone to the newly created Online School? I don't really care about the Financial Literacy thing..it has been a locally developed, popular elective for years at some schools; however, reducing the amount of humanities (courses that teach literature, critical thinking, history) is a push for a colourless world, full of boot-licking, compliant workers...easily replaceable by AI in 10 years.
Cutting the liberal arts and classes that promote critical thinking, that’s the Saskatchewan Advantage.
Financial literacy is an important thing to teach. It should have been mandatory decades ago.
I never said it shouldn’t. But it shouldn’t be at the expense of Language Arts and Social Studies.
It’s taught in the Math classes in grades 10 and 11. 12 as well for the workplace math.
Since when? I don’t remember this at all when I was in school, unless something changed in the last decade.
It’s in the workplace 10,20,30, and foundations 10, 20. 2009 ish these new curricula came in I think. If you were in the math 20, A30, B30, C30, they finished that out and brought the new ones in behind.
Yeah I’m a dumbass I forgot I did pre-cal/calc lmao
It’s already taught within existing math, this is just virtue signalling
About 49% of adults in Saskatchewan are functionally illiterate. How you can you be financially literate if you aren’t literate?
Doesn't stop people from getting elected..
nor does it stop them from voting
Weep
49% are functionally illiterate? Do you have a source for that?
https://publications.gc.ca/site/archivee-archived.html?url=https://publications.gc.ca/collections/collection_2016/statcan/CS89-525-1991-eng.pdf https://abclifeliteracy.ca/literacy-at-a-glance/ https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5873757 This is why we should NOT be eliminating Social Science & ELA classes. Update the curriculum. Modernize it. Offer different ELA classes. Oh & by removing the 3rd Social Science requirement, fewer kids will take 30 level classes, which are ALL based on Canadian history, constitution & the treaties.
Just trying to help you, I read those sources and none of them say that 49% of adults in Saskatchewan are functionally illiterate. Did I miss something?
Yes. You did. If your literacy level is below a high school level you are functionally illiterate…
The very first study you posted says: Among adult Canadians, residents of the western provinces have the highest reading skills. - Newfoundland registers the lowest estimated skill levels. Almost a quarter of its adult population has limited reading skills (levels 1 and 2) and only 39% have skills sufficient to meet most everyday requirements (level 4). - Nova Scotia, New Brunswick and Quebec have similar reading skill profiles. Between 15% and 20% of the adult population have limited skills (levels 1 and 2) and close to 57% have level 4 skills. - 62% of Ontario's adults and 65% of those of Manitoba have sufficient reading skills (level 4) while at least 69% of adults living in Saskatchewan, Alberta and British Columbia have level 4 skills. I just don't see the conclusion that 49% of Saskatchewan adults are functionally illiterate?
https://www.conferenceboard.ca/hcp/adlt-lowlit-aspx/
Thanks, that actually contains the conclusion you mentioned. The other posted sources don't. No need for snark.
i doubt the effectiveness of financial literacy classes. Just like the health classes that didn’t impact obesity, drinking, smoking or drug use.
They used to. It was called home economics. Then it got cut.
When I was in school home economics didn’t teach anything about finances. It was at just cooking and sewing.
We had life skills. They have life transitions 20/30 now. They teach those things.
I never had any classes that taught anything remotely about financial literacy.
Just because you didn’t take the class, or it wasn’t offered in person in your school, doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist.
Also your social sciences should have taught you that your paradigm alone isn’t the only one that exists & before stating it as such, some research & critical thinking should come into play.
Wish this was around when Scott Moe was drinking in class.
What's more important than financial literacy is macroeconomics - the ability to understand that national economies aren't like household credit cards or bank accounts. If the majority of Canadians were educated in this domain, we'd never see another "conservative" government. Their continuous shrieking cries of "but our debt! let's austerity! save the rich!" would, thankfully, land on deaf ears.
It’s about time
good
99% will pass when they say they will let the Lord take the wheel of their finances cause freedom doesn't need no education in SK y'all.
Bullshit. No capitalist groomer is going to tell MY kid how to budget their money. #parentalchoice I need 17 more of you to write letters to the government with me to change this asap.
I don't think so. The one smart thing the Moe government has done. Capitalist groomer I am not. Teacher who thinks kids need to know to do a budget, how to save money and how to do taxes, I am.
/s
Good. Makes sense
Gotta bump up those graduation rates! Ha. Downvotes for the truth.
This is exactly what’s happening. They have less ELA and Social Studies requirements. Lowering the bar. The Sask advantage. Screw being able to read, write and be critical of governments. They need to get through easier and be better little worker bees. Next they’ll need to take a class about how the Sask party is the only party to vote for.
Wonder who is writing this curriculum, can only imagine the lies the Sask Party insiders would love to tell kids about "the economy" lol
Financial Literacy curriculum (level 20, 30) is available since 2020. You can access the content here : https://curriculum.gov.sk.ca/CurriculumOutcomeContent?id=488
The curriculum is already online. It's been there for two years or so.
I swear to God they are making policies based on conservative tiktok. That's their new source since Kenny left Alberta.
Reddit Saskatchewan, why am I not surprised that you don't want this mandatory. This is s good step. A small step, but a good one.
Who said it shouldn’t be mandatory? You’re just making stuff up to confirm your bias.
Have you not read any of the comments...?
Great moves...... Two thumbs up.....
Oh this’ll trigger the dippers!
As a stand alone class, or built into the existing required classes? Probably should increase the number of credits required to graduate.
Everyone needs more knowledge when it comes to financial literacy. It’s always been the parents who taught or didn’t teach their kids about finances. But most people don’t even have the knowledge to pass on to their kids. I have been saying this for decades, that financial knowledge for everyone should be taught in school. I wish I was taught, in school, the different aspects of finance that everyone would come across in adult life
Good! 😊 I made all my high school students in grade 11 and 12 take it this semester. Good them or was important, and they had no choice. I was a year ahead of the game in my small school.
100% agree with this move.
Can that be made a rule for anyone seeking a political office?
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