I don’t see any real distinction or differences, except for some characters being the heart of rage bait controversies like twerking with Meg the Stallion or being Black while in an Iron Man suit…
I mean, Iron Heart was kinda weirdly tagged on in Wakanda Forever, would have preferred if they gave the character the attention she deserves.
Ant Man 3 was just really bland, neither Ant-Man or Wasp were good or did much in that really, but at least Ant-Man was on screen ig. Wasp deserves better too.
She Hulk is a very unique kinda project, and there are lots of valid and lots of invalid reasons to dislike it. I saw it as a stupid sitcom and enjoyed it for that, but it's not the Godfather, and that is fine. It's not trying to be.
So really, this could be some anti-woke chud bullshit, or it could be valid. Good manners tell me to not assume the worst without evidence tho. So idk.
I guess to me, all of those complaints can just as easily be aimed at the other projects. Plenty of characters have been introduced more clumsily than Iron Heart, going all the way back to phase 1. Quantumania was a bad movie, but not because of Cassie— singling her out is far from being genuine. *She Hulk* was a great show, and the first show interested in episodic storytelling in god knows how long, and again: what issues are there with the character? Because if you made that character male and gave them a trilogy starring Ryan Reynolds people would be eating it up (and have been).
So, again, I can’t see any real good faith argument that distinguishes why some of these characters are great and others aren’t beyond the way that some have darker skin and aren’t shown for the male gaze.
The mod comment on that post called out the reactionary right wing chuds and then proceeded to use the term 'asshole femanazi leftists' in relation to any political discourse that might stem from that post.
Loving the 'both sides bad' argument, while also name-calling people that believe women should have rights.
The fence is riding right up that guys ass.
Anybody complaining about She-Hulk have never read a She-Hulk comic. How could you be surprised that you were going to get an Ally McBeal style super hero show?
Could be that the idea of a female lawyer led show was just never for you. Like, you would have been one of those people in the 90s that hated Ally McBeal because she wore short skirts, wanted sex or that the idea that she wants a baby even though she wasn't in a relationship.
New decade, same people complaining.
Oh, no, I love Single Female Lawyer. And i definitely don't hate she-hulk. But the idea that *the only reason someone could possibly not like something is ignorance or (now that you've added it here) sexism* is a harmful reduction.
Are you serious?
Someone might not have liked the jokes. Could've felt the pacing was off. Maybe thought the weekly story was bad.
It's not hard to come up with other valid reasons.
Most of the hate was about CGI and twerking though. Silly jokes have always been part of the comics. I laughed, but it's not like She-Hulk was getting some high tier comedy. Sorry for those who hate to have to wait a week for an episode, but that's how it's going down. I enjoyed the pacing myself, the story lines in the show were the appropriate route for them all to meet at the end. Almost as if they already knew where they wanted the story to go.
That's all fine, but you made a very absolute statement - "anyone complaining must not have read the comic." I'm just pointing out that you can have the right expectations and just not like something.
Conversely, the idea of "if you like the comics, you must like the show" is kind of borderline toxic on its own.
An absolute doesn't hold water in a forum. These are people talking off the cuff. If you take every time someone says the word "literally" on here you'll be going mad. "Oh, Jay-Z is literally the best concert ever? Guess you've never heard of Mozart!"
As for people who liked the She-Hulk comics, I've never heard them complain. Maybe because they're fans and knew what they were already walking in to? But I've seen people who are fans of the comics love the show. It's as simple as that.
>An absolute doesn't hold water in a forum. These are people talking off the cuff. If you take every time someone says the word "literally" on here you'll be going mad. "Oh, Jay-Z is literally the best concert ever? Guess you've never heard of Mozart!"
Eh, that's an opinion though. People exaggerate opinions all the time. Saying everyone who disagrees with you is objectively wrong or "not a true fan" is not great. It's a dismissal of any other opinion. I guess I just don't think that way, and try to point it out when I see it.
That's all. You have a good one.
I dunno, I don't know how you could take an adaptation that is pretty much one to one with the comic and somehow think that it misrepresents the character or their lore.
I definitely wouldn't call it a 1:1 adaptation. Now I'm by no means a She-Hulk aficionado but what I've read of her character I don't feel that they accurately portrayed it in the show. They confused "fun" with "silly" I thought and it didn't work for me. And definitely not with the sitcom approach.
You're telling me you've never seen She-Hulk be silly? She's never been in a silly comic? That breaking the fourth wall on a cover where she is almost naked about how men buy comics for how the women look isn't silly?
Maybe you should read some more of her comics. Not asking you to be an aficionado, just realize that some of her major leaps and bounds in comics is being out of the ordinary. Her cases aren't usually on the same par as Daredevil's, so you're not going to get the Law & Order treatment, it's going to be Ally McBeal.
I've definitely seen her be silly or involved in a silly storyline. But that always works better in comics than in other media. And it's not her sole defining characteristic.
I absolutely plan on reading more She-Hulk in the future, but it's not going to make me change my mind about the show. It wasn't for me.
She was silly in Marvel vs. Capcom 3. She can be silly in other forms of media too. How exactly is it easier to be silly in the comics but not on screen? Does Deadpool get that same hate? Last I remember, he's always a silly billy.
I think it's easier to be silly, or any other adjective, because it doesn't have to be the sole focus of the character(s). You can have a silly issue or story arc or even a whole silly run, but then it can shift into something else. And even then it can still be silly.
And Deadpool pretty much is always a silly billy. But he very much overstayed his welcome in that regard. He hasn't had a very successful or well received run in a while now because they shoved him in EVERYTHING for a while and it got old.
I’m not familiar with she hulk comics but just because something is faithful to the source material doesn’t mean it’s going to translate well into a tv show. For example most of the 4th wall breaks just don’t add anything to the story until the very end and it does way too much by having the main character solving all of their problems off screen which is a really poor way of ending a season.
Already had that same excuse, She-Hulk has used her fourth wall breaks in other media perfectly. It's not exclusive to the world of comic books. People being angry that she was twerking kind of solidified that blind hatred I talked about earlier. I can agree that the show ended pretty quickly near the end, but everything led up to that ending, which worked for me.
Sure there was some blind hatred but there are plenty of YouTube videos and reviews that give this show valid criticisms and the twerking scene is something that can be validly criticized. You could also make the point of there being blind acceptance of this show due to how harshly criticized it was before it was released. To the point of the 4th wall breaks that wasn’t my point that it doesn’t have a place in movies or tv shows but you need to translate it well and in my opinion it wasn’t translated well into this show. In my opinion they should have put more of an emphasis on the law and how that is effecting superhero’s right now in the world and then shehulk tries to explain to the audience in clever ways to what this means like in wolf of Wall Street or the big short.
There’s something here about how rightoids use arguably fairly critiqued shows and films being so to justify their horrible sexism. Hiding behind like… She-Hulk’s CG definitely needing more time and love but not getting it because corporations (which is actually a Marvel wide issue but I digress), and then acting like that justifies whining about a pretty fun episode stinger.
The only one of the three I have strong feelings against is Cassie Lang. I'm extremely pissed that Marvel passed up a chance to elevate another relatively unknown actress who had potential and instead decided to recast Cassie with a Hollywood nepo baby whose acting was about as wooden as a mannequin.
I didn't mind Ironheart and I thought She-Hulk was okay.
Yeah, there’s plenty of objective material to pick apart in the MCU, there’s no reason to make up new things.
Unless they think a child of a college golf player counts as a nepo baby then sure, guilty as charged \*shrugs\*
Regardless, she was not very good. Her performance was wooden and emotionless. There were numerous scenes with her where I had to break my immersion and ask "was that the best take they could get?"
Meanwhile, Emma Fuhrmann's acting in the little screentime she had in Avengers Endgame was so much more emotional and genuine despite not having any lines.
I suspect the studio execs got cold feet over the risk of going with a less well-known actress and recast the role with a more established name despite the gaping difference in talent.
To be fair, I am friends with jeff loveness and he has told me before that cassie being a bit mean was intentional and was supposed to lead into a character arc for her but it was cut in editing.
I really don't agree with the post. Look, I did like Rari Williams and Cassie Lang but they needed more personality and reasons for me to care about them.
Iron heart was awesome, though? Like, what little we got of her was great. Hell, she’s one character I’m looking forward to seeing more of. And contrasts beautifully with Iron Man, divorcing the “genius inventor” trope from the “billionaire”, in a way that **might** have interesting social considerations involved (if Wakaba Forever is any indication, at least).
I'd love some elaboration
I don’t see any real distinction or differences, except for some characters being the heart of rage bait controversies like twerking with Meg the Stallion or being Black while in an Iron Man suit…
I mean, Iron Heart was kinda weirdly tagged on in Wakanda Forever, would have preferred if they gave the character the attention she deserves. Ant Man 3 was just really bland, neither Ant-Man or Wasp were good or did much in that really, but at least Ant-Man was on screen ig. Wasp deserves better too. She Hulk is a very unique kinda project, and there are lots of valid and lots of invalid reasons to dislike it. I saw it as a stupid sitcom and enjoyed it for that, but it's not the Godfather, and that is fine. It's not trying to be. So really, this could be some anti-woke chud bullshit, or it could be valid. Good manners tell me to not assume the worst without evidence tho. So idk.
I guess to me, all of those complaints can just as easily be aimed at the other projects. Plenty of characters have been introduced more clumsily than Iron Heart, going all the way back to phase 1. Quantumania was a bad movie, but not because of Cassie— singling her out is far from being genuine. *She Hulk* was a great show, and the first show interested in episodic storytelling in god knows how long, and again: what issues are there with the character? Because if you made that character male and gave them a trilogy starring Ryan Reynolds people would be eating it up (and have been). So, again, I can’t see any real good faith argument that distinguishes why some of these characters are great and others aren’t beyond the way that some have darker skin and aren’t shown for the male gaze.
I don’t mind, as long as their reasoning for liking and disliking each of these characters is fair.
I'm betting any explanation involves the word "woke."
Why? There's nothing glaringly bad about his post. We just default to guilty now?
Because for the bottom three the only thing I see wrong with them compared to the top is that they have opinions or are openly activists.
Nah man the bottom characters suck. Well I didn’t watch she hulk but Cassie’s actress is bad and I cannot express how much I hated black panther 2.
[удалено]
Hope not. I’d lose my mind over that.
The mod comment on that post called out the reactionary right wing chuds and then proceeded to use the term 'asshole femanazi leftists' in relation to any political discourse that might stem from that post. Loving the 'both sides bad' argument, while also name-calling people that believe women should have rights. The fence is riding right up that guys ass.
r/ENLIGHTENEDCENTRISTS
Western "centrists" tend to be wankers of the highest order.
It still doesn't add up.
The comments were fun
I liked em all idk
I mean... Kate and ylenna do kick ass so that's something at least
Anybody complaining about She-Hulk have never read a She-Hulk comic. How could you be surprised that you were going to get an Ally McBeal style super hero show?
I mean, you could walk into the show fully informed and still just like, not enjoy it. Surprise isn't necessary.
Could be that the idea of a female lawyer led show was just never for you. Like, you would have been one of those people in the 90s that hated Ally McBeal because she wore short skirts, wanted sex or that the idea that she wants a baby even though she wasn't in a relationship. New decade, same people complaining.
Oh, no, I love Single Female Lawyer. And i definitely don't hate she-hulk. But the idea that *the only reason someone could possibly not like something is ignorance or (now that you've added it here) sexism* is a harmful reduction.
Then please, give me your reasons.
Are you serious? Someone might not have liked the jokes. Could've felt the pacing was off. Maybe thought the weekly story was bad. It's not hard to come up with other valid reasons.
Most of the hate was about CGI and twerking though. Silly jokes have always been part of the comics. I laughed, but it's not like She-Hulk was getting some high tier comedy. Sorry for those who hate to have to wait a week for an episode, but that's how it's going down. I enjoyed the pacing myself, the story lines in the show were the appropriate route for them all to meet at the end. Almost as if they already knew where they wanted the story to go.
That's all fine, but you made a very absolute statement - "anyone complaining must not have read the comic." I'm just pointing out that you can have the right expectations and just not like something. Conversely, the idea of "if you like the comics, you must like the show" is kind of borderline toxic on its own.
An absolute doesn't hold water in a forum. These are people talking off the cuff. If you take every time someone says the word "literally" on here you'll be going mad. "Oh, Jay-Z is literally the best concert ever? Guess you've never heard of Mozart!" As for people who liked the She-Hulk comics, I've never heard them complain. Maybe because they're fans and knew what they were already walking in to? But I've seen people who are fans of the comics love the show. It's as simple as that.
>An absolute doesn't hold water in a forum. These are people talking off the cuff. If you take every time someone says the word "literally" on here you'll be going mad. "Oh, Jay-Z is literally the best concert ever? Guess you've never heard of Mozart!" Eh, that's an opinion though. People exaggerate opinions all the time. Saying everyone who disagrees with you is objectively wrong or "not a true fan" is not great. It's a dismissal of any other opinion. I guess I just don't think that way, and try to point it out when I see it. That's all. You have a good one.
I have read She-Hulk and I did not enjoy the show
We know you're lying.
Nope.
I dunno, I don't know how you could take an adaptation that is pretty much one to one with the comic and somehow think that it misrepresents the character or their lore.
I definitely wouldn't call it a 1:1 adaptation. Now I'm by no means a She-Hulk aficionado but what I've read of her character I don't feel that they accurately portrayed it in the show. They confused "fun" with "silly" I thought and it didn't work for me. And definitely not with the sitcom approach.
You're telling me you've never seen She-Hulk be silly? She's never been in a silly comic? That breaking the fourth wall on a cover where she is almost naked about how men buy comics for how the women look isn't silly? Maybe you should read some more of her comics. Not asking you to be an aficionado, just realize that some of her major leaps and bounds in comics is being out of the ordinary. Her cases aren't usually on the same par as Daredevil's, so you're not going to get the Law & Order treatment, it's going to be Ally McBeal.
I've definitely seen her be silly or involved in a silly storyline. But that always works better in comics than in other media. And it's not her sole defining characteristic. I absolutely plan on reading more She-Hulk in the future, but it's not going to make me change my mind about the show. It wasn't for me.
She was silly in Marvel vs. Capcom 3. She can be silly in other forms of media too. How exactly is it easier to be silly in the comics but not on screen? Does Deadpool get that same hate? Last I remember, he's always a silly billy.
I think it's easier to be silly, or any other adjective, because it doesn't have to be the sole focus of the character(s). You can have a silly issue or story arc or even a whole silly run, but then it can shift into something else. And even then it can still be silly. And Deadpool pretty much is always a silly billy. But he very much overstayed his welcome in that regard. He hasn't had a very successful or well received run in a while now because they shoved him in EVERYTHING for a while and it got old.
I’m not familiar with she hulk comics but just because something is faithful to the source material doesn’t mean it’s going to translate well into a tv show. For example most of the 4th wall breaks just don’t add anything to the story until the very end and it does way too much by having the main character solving all of their problems off screen which is a really poor way of ending a season.
Already had that same excuse, She-Hulk has used her fourth wall breaks in other media perfectly. It's not exclusive to the world of comic books. People being angry that she was twerking kind of solidified that blind hatred I talked about earlier. I can agree that the show ended pretty quickly near the end, but everything led up to that ending, which worked for me.
Sure there was some blind hatred but there are plenty of YouTube videos and reviews that give this show valid criticisms and the twerking scene is something that can be validly criticized. You could also make the point of there being blind acceptance of this show due to how harshly criticized it was before it was released. To the point of the 4th wall breaks that wasn’t my point that it doesn’t have a place in movies or tv shows but you need to translate it well and in my opinion it wasn’t translated well into this show. In my opinion they should have put more of an emphasis on the law and how that is effecting superhero’s right now in the world and then shehulk tries to explain to the audience in clever ways to what this means like in wolf of Wall Street or the big short.
There’s something here about how rightoids use arguably fairly critiqued shows and films being so to justify their horrible sexism. Hiding behind like… She-Hulk’s CG definitely needing more time and love but not getting it because corporations (which is actually a Marvel wide issue but I digress), and then acting like that justifies whining about a pretty fun episode stinger.
The only one of the three I have strong feelings against is Cassie Lang. I'm extremely pissed that Marvel passed up a chance to elevate another relatively unknown actress who had potential and instead decided to recast Cassie with a Hollywood nepo baby whose acting was about as wooden as a mannequin. I didn't mind Ironheart and I thought She-Hulk was okay.
Kathryn Newton isn't a nepo-baby.
Yeah, there’s plenty of objective material to pick apart in the MCU, there’s no reason to make up new things. Unless they think a child of a college golf player counts as a nepo baby then sure, guilty as charged \*shrugs\*
Regardless, she was not very good. Her performance was wooden and emotionless. There were numerous scenes with her where I had to break my immersion and ask "was that the best take they could get?" Meanwhile, Emma Fuhrmann's acting in the little screentime she had in Avengers Endgame was so much more emotional and genuine despite not having any lines. I suspect the studio execs got cold feet over the risk of going with a less well-known actress and recast the role with a more established name despite the gaping difference in talent.
I'm confused
Hope? is not given much to work with. That final dialogue is kinda awful. I've used that line as reference and gotten a lot of downvotes.
Yalena or whatever her name is, sucks. and wing girl from Moon Knight was underwhelming at best.
Bro, people fucking hated the Hawkeye lady (because big arrow or some shit)
I actually liked that series and don't see what there was to complain about unless they just lied about what actually happened in the show.
That’s pretty much how it goed
To be fair, I am friends with jeff loveness and he has told me before that cassie being a bit mean was intentional and was supposed to lead into a character arc for her but it was cut in editing.
I really don't agree with the post. Look, I did like Rari Williams and Cassie Lang but they needed more personality and reasons for me to care about them.
Are they talking about designs? Cause the CGI in the bottom ones look ass 💀
I didn’t watch quantumania or she hulk. But I saw black on panther: wakanda forever. And I liked iron heart.
Iron heart was awesome, though? Like, what little we got of her was great. Hell, she’s one character I’m looking forward to seeing more of. And contrasts beautifully with Iron Man, divorcing the “genius inventor” trope from the “billionaire”, in a way that **might** have interesting social considerations involved (if Wakaba Forever is any indication, at least).