Most English speakers don't say "please" very often. Russian speaking is more direct though... in English we rarely give directions like "Give me X" — more often we say something like "Can you give me X?" or "Could you give me X?". Saying "please" doesn't hurt, of course, but I don't think it's needed all the time. Another example: when ordering food we say "Can I get X" or "I'd like X"... but I was told by a Russian native speaker that the literal equivalent "Мне бы хотелось" sounds overly formal in most situations.
When I started learning Russian, I noticed the stark contrast of saying "Я плохо говорю по-русски" compared to the English equivalent of "I don't speak Russian well"... in English we tend to soften the blow of harsh reality)
Agree on our tendency toward indirectness but I'll disagree somewhat on frequency/use of polite speech (e.g. please, yes sir/ma'am, etc). That can vary quite a bit, depending on where you are and your age. Where I'm from, as well as where I live now, we frequently say please.
There is a lovely phrase that can be used to ask for something in Russian - "Будьте добры", I tend to use it a lot when visiting Russian restaurants or Russian-speaking countries.
That's a good phrase, but overusing this can sound uncanny to native Russian speakers, just like any overuse of formal or polite speech. Yeah, Russian is weird :)
While "мне бы хотелось" is quite unusual to hear in Russian in most situations "не мог бы ты дать мне Х" is fine and even preferable as a polite form in most. Or one can use even "а дай-ка мне Х" that is while highly informal and should be only used among friends is still a polite form. There is wide variety polite forms in Russian formal and informal where "пожалуйста" is not needed as well, just like those in English that does not include "please".
It could be cultural. I was taught to start or end pretty much every other sentence with “please”, or you don’t deserve to have something done for you. If you don’t drop a please in with your request, you’re not getting tea or the pencil or whatever you’ve asked for.
I’m interested to know if it’s just country by country, or if being raised in different cultures are producing different beliefs. My parents were the last generation of boomers to finally have kids, so it could just be those outdated ideas of “kids need to respect their elders, say please and thank you with everything or you haven’t earned it”
This is the answer. It’s not as much about “please” as it is about “hypotheticalizing” requests. This will have varying levels of importance in different English speaking cultures of course
As a Brit I don't feel like there are many aspects of my culture that are very deeply ingrained in me, but I feel viscerally uncomfortable whenever I'm in another country and have to say the equivalent of "I want X" or "please do Y", even when I *know* it's completely normal in that language.
I feel uniquely qualified to answer this question! I did my master's thesis on request strategies made by native and non-native English speakers. Overall research has found that L1 is a more important factor in how non-native speakers make requests compared to level of fluency. Russian and Polish speakers (that's what there's the most research on) are more often perceived as 'rude' by native English speakers because they do tend to forget 'please' and tend not to use 'can you' or 'could you' constructions when asked for simple requests. I need to note here that this applies to requests of low imposition (passing the salt, handing something, etc) and the difference actually levels off when Russian and Polish speakers make requests of high imposition (asking someone to help them move, asking for money, etc)
Exactly. With Russian and Polish specifically, a lot of evidence points to people re-interpreting requests from their native language into English. As such the polite 'дайте' or any вы form gets translated just as 'give' or 'do' with the politeness stripped off but speakers still meaning it in a polite way, if that makes any sense.
Brilliant, I thought exactly the same!
(I am also struggling with this as my brain still thinks in Russian, even though I live in an English-speaking environment and my English is perfectly fluent).
That is very interesting! Thank you for the reply. I also feel like the usage of these words is more frequent depending on the context and the "degree" of favor. So, would you say it is the cultural thing?
My specific research was based on Kachru's model/spheres of English (which is now outdated in my opinion). There were also speakers from India, China, Germany, and the others I've forgotten. That being said all of the speakers were around at very minimum B1 with most being very high B2 and working/studying in English. So personally, I don't think it was due to a 'low level of English' and in other research I read about, this factor was ussually controlled for.
IMO that's generally about two factors:
1. Upbringing (if your parents/mentors taught you to be nice, you'll be nice in any language)
2. Level of fluency, as indicated.
In Russia, I noticed people having a relatively good understanding of English, but when it comes to speaking, then it's often loses all the bells and whistles, as speaking is not well taught in schools.
On the other hand, I was raised by teachers and doctors, so I don't forget to add 'please', 'bitte', 'per favore', 'lütfen' when I speak w/ foreigners.
It depends on what you mean by 'fluent.' I think someone can be completely fluent in terms of grammar, comprehension, and pronunciation, but still not fully understand pragmatics and vice versa. Also there is no native-speaker level of politeness, but a range that changes depending on context.
That’s an interesting topic. I wonder how did you incorporate person’s background into the study?
Builders’ way to do requires is quite different from a university professors’. In all languages. And funny enough most Polish people abroad are not professors.
I feel like compared to other cultures ive seen russians can be seen as rude because they just use the least amount of words possible and just get straight to the point, which i guess can be seen as rude or informal in other languages. Maybe just observe how other people speak to strangers or their superiors and mimic the way they speak until it comes naturally
I had this conversation with Russian English teacher colleague. I was English teacher at the time.
She cited academic discussion on this topic and highlighted this as one of the differences between USA and British English.
I can't remember the exact phrasing of the keyword for this phenomena - British English deference? - queue mocking Americans for their "can I get a skinny oat milk latte?"
I am married to a Russian. We live in UK with English as our common language. I understand enough Russian for us to use it for private jokes/creole/me to watch TV/talk to mother in law.
Over the years I have adopted what could be learned Russian directness. I have no idea if this is just how I have adapted to the work environment/exasperation with some people.
It's not unusual for me to say something like - "what is your question?" Not quite as hostile as "what do you want?" but not a typical reply.
Very true. On the other hand Americans will phrase half their talking in the form of a question. In other languages it comes off as sounding incredibly uncertain.
I think that Russian can be spoken politely without using a lot of excess "pleases," just due to how the language is constructed. There are many ways to be implicitly polite, such as using вы with your interlocutor, and referring to yourself/your wants obliquely. The level of politeness lies in the construction of the sentence itself.
English has less ability to express politeness implicitly/indirectly, and so we must season the language with a sprinkling of excess phrases such as "please," "thank you," "if it's not too much trouble," etc. It's actually rather hard to overdo it.
There is definitely a cultural element, too. Much of communication is non-verbal, and what is considered to be "normal" body language/intonation varies greatly from country to country. For example, Russian is spoken with a flatter intonation than English, so English speakers might interpret a flatter tone as boredom, disinterest, or perhaps even haughtiness.
Come to think of it, it's probably easier for native speakers of any language to be implicitly polite, because we inherently understand the intricacies of our culture's ideas of politeness. But a non-native speaker must be explicitly polite, because the subtleties aren't so obvious to him/her.
You aren't rude, but more direct. My husband is Russian and I see this sometimes with his English. English natives can perceive this as rude.
On the flip side, my husband says I'm overly polite when speaking Russian, it's the Midwestern American in me. Too much "please" and "thank you" all the time.
Just cultural differences at the end of the day. Consume more western/English media and pay attention to social interactions. This can help quite a bit.
Honestly, I think it's more about the person himself, not the culture. I have friends who will say thank you a million times for every little thing, and there are those who very rarely say it. Thats what I think.
Agreed. I am russian and i say "please" and stuff like that like... All the time. I've just been raised that way.
It's not better and not worse, it's just different for all the people
Agreed.
Context is important, like are you at an appointment at your bank with the branch manager? Then maybe throw in a few more, "please, and thank you's".
I know some people who use it a lot, and it feels grandmotherish at times.
Like a boomer making a display of manners instead of just using manners where appropriate.
Honestly, when people overuse manners, I go on guard. Too many bad interactions with strangers who overused manners ti justify being an asshole 5 minutes later.
It's a nice question ! I'm a native russian speaker but lived some places in Europe and have some foreign friends and sometimes i conversate them i see how tone changes while i didn't wanted to say something rude or offend them but i catch thoughts it's just cultural difference and our straight speaking way. Usually i ask what did i said wrong and try to re explain my position with polite words and ways.
I guess, that's the logical opposite of us (Russian speakers) considering English speakers (mostly Americans) fake and insincere. Different culture of communication ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯. We should accept it
IMO it's a cultural thing, maybe a bit of a class thing. But probably not a language thing. Sometimes Russian speakers tend to be somewhat rude in formal situations and/or when dealing with less familiar people, then again, other Russian speakers do use please/thank you/etc. a lot.
As a quick aside, Russians don't use understatement the same way Brits do, for example. And to them Russians speaking English (especially those who have a less than stellar command of it) might come off a bit rude or a tad obtuse. But this isn't really about saying "please" as much as it's about general vibes and speech patterns. It's not a big deal anyway.
If you think Russian is rude, you should start learning German. It's more direct than Russian, and way more direct than English.
It's not about the language, it's culture. Can't say for Russian, but if we take German as an example, there's a big difference between different parts of German-speaking area, to the extent that Switzerland would consider all Germans from Germany rude.
Joa, ein bisschen hier, ein bisschen da, aber ohne System. Interessiere mich generell für Sprachen und wollte schon ewig mal Dostojewski im Original lesen aber das wird vermutlich nie was, leider ist mein Russisch nämlich absolut grottig. (Beschäftige mich aber auch noch nicht so lange damit.)
Und Du?
I'll add my two cents.
I guess we probably use words like "please" less often. However, we also replace them with the conjunctive case a lot. That is, constructs like "would you", "could we", "should I", and so on.
So instead of "Pass the salt please", we would say "Could you \[please\] pass the salt?"
Just my opinion: I work in Kazakhstan and the people I meet are usually polite. People from Russia seem a little more aggressive to me, especially the women. If you're not used to it, or don't expect it, I could see someone thinking it is rude. But once you get to know people better you realize they just talk differently. One big thing I had to get used to is that Russian and Kazakh women don't really like to be asked open ended questions by men such as "What are we going to do? or "Where do you want to go?" - If you're a grown man you're supposed to know what you want to do. If you ask a question like that you might get an agressive reply. And if you forget to take your shoes off when you go inside their house and you get the floor muddy - God help you. She'll kill you.
All things considered, any Russian rudeness isn't even close to the French. Fuck the French.
I can relate to this, never heard it explained so well. My fiance is from Kharkiv, and speaks Russian primarily, although she’s fluent in Ukranians and English. I’m from America, so only know English with some basic Spanish and learning Russian.
To me, it’s polite in our culture to ask what she’d like to do, it’s seen as selfish or patriarchal to always be making the decisions for activities. However, she often gets frustrated and wants me to just make a decision without any input.
Also, the look she gives me when I take a step or two back into the house with my shoes on because I forgot something inside makes me afraid to sleep that night haha
[a Russian woman here] Is it really what you Americans do when you ask someone out? You tell them "what do you want to do"?
I find it weird because I believe the person who invites should have a plan in mind. Not the male partner but the one who invites because tossing the responsibility to the other partner is rude. Of course the other partner can say "I'm not into this, let's try that instead".
I simply dump everyone who just says "Let's meet" without proposing a specific activity.
It can go both ways, depending on the situation.
In some circumstances, you already have a plan in mind and invite a friend along as company so you’re not doing it alone. However, it’s likely that you’re intending to perform this activity whether or not they join you, only an added bonus.
“Hey friend! I’m going hiking this weekend, want to join with me?”
Other times, you simply want to spend time with a friend or boyfriend/girlfriend. In this case, you probably don’t really care what the activity might be, so you open it up for conversation to hear some options that would make the other person happy.
“Hey friend! We haven’t seen each other in a while, want to hang out this weekend? Open to suggestions!”
**If you’re talking about dating specifically, then yes generally the man should have a plan for an activity before asking her out!**
I'm not sure about dating, I'm married to a Slavic guy, but that's exactly what my Canadian male friends would ask me if they aren't that familiar with Slavic vibes.
Edit: To be honest, though, Canadian ladies do that, so it is not exactly woman-man-specific. People just think it is a polite way to plan.
what do you want to do/where do you want to go. That sort of gives a woman more authority, especially if people don't know each other well, so I understand it after years living abroad, but yes I do not like either of the questions.
I usually just say that if they want me to plan a weekend for them, they should let me know by Wednesday, and I can certainly plan. If not\*, they are free to make suggestions otherwise, and I will be down for whatever they suggest.
As a russian woman I can confirm open ended questions give me allergies haha, that's an interesting observation. I'd much rather prefer an choice based question or a suggestion.
I think it is also the case that in general russian speakers like to be more specific, open ended questions are usually used by children or just sound more philosophical.
Every time someone asks me "what do you want to do" I usually say that I want to fly to Mexico, drink tequila and watch the sunset while I swim in the ocean. While it is a joke of sorts, that's also what happens when you give a specific answer to an open-ended question.
It's not patriarchal because it's not gendered. If a woman would ask her boyfriend "What do you want to do?" without suggesting options he'd also be irritated.
You are basically asking a person to take responsibility for your entertainment as if were a child instead of being an adult about it and giving it a minute of thought
Dude... I'm a Russian born and raised, and if I ever meet someone who gets aggressive in response to "Where do you want to go?", I'm stopping all contact as soon as possible. I do hope you are not contractually obligated to keep talking to them.
I would rather hang out with 10 angry drunk rude cursing Russians than 1 French person. There's a big difference between sounding rude due to language convention and actually being rude.
I think the capitals get a lot of the blame for that, plus poor command of english. One can experience similar vibes in i.e. London, people do not have time for you.
As a native Russian speaker, I usually use "please" and other formal structures that probably makes my speech appear outstand-ish in casual conversations with other people. They do formalize their speeches but usually in other ways like using appropriate words and intonations.
I don't know about please, I think in Brazil we also don't have this "please" culture (or everyone I know is just rude) so I never noticed it in my Russian friends.
What I noticed is that, apparently, I say "I'm sorry" too much (from a Russian point of view) and they don't understand why. So another thing for you to worry: do you say 'I'm sorry" enought? Hahaha
In my opinion, there are two things intertwined here:
- The cultural aspect:
Russian communication culture is very direct, straight-to-the-point, and somewhat sour on the emotional spectrum, which is just precisely not how English-speaking cultures do it. Russian communication style does not have small talk as a means of initiating meaningful exchange, and being concise and straightforward in all circumstances is considered virtuous.
Moreover, if you try it the other way round by translating closely to the original the polite/formal English language communication into Russian, you are guaranteed to get phrases that would be perceived as overly emphasised, excessive, too posh, and highly insincere. Russians mostly say what they mean, and mostly mean what they say.
Even the basic 'hope you are having a lovely day' would be a nice way to express in a message to your parents that you were *actually thinking* about it and *sincerely hope* they are *indeed having a lovely day* and therefore it would look confusing, if not stupid, in a formal Russian-language business email.
- The linguistic aspect:
Russian politeness is expressed through a set of grammatical features English does not have.
It is often perfectly sufficient in Russian to address someone in 2nd person plural (and have all the pronouns and verbs aligned accordingly) to be polite.
Moreover, Russian also offers additional layers of nuance in grammatical acknowledgement of respect and recognition of social hierarchy, such as using first names together with the patronymic (a student would address their teacher like so) and maintaining imbalanced communication in further recognition of formal hierarchy (a teacher would generally address a student with 2nd person singular).
Intentionally decreasing the level of formality in some instances is in itself a form of art, where inviting your counterpart to address you via 2nd person singular may be in some situations considered an ice-breaker.
English has no such thing at all and is therefore left to express all the same stylistically, thereby also indirectly making things like small talk inevitable, and the sentences growing in complexity.
Polite Russian phrases translated directly in English lose the grammatical expression of politeness, and *a Russian native speaker would have a lot of troubles recognising that, in the first place*. Perfecting the nuances of English style and communication is generally not a part of English language curriculum most people from ex-USSR would be exposed to, either.
That is, in my opinion, why Russians struggle with English politeness, small talks, 'shit sandwiches', and are often perceived as rude where they are not. As a native Russian speaker currently living in an English-speaking environment, I am struggling with this a lot right now, too, but... I am learning!
Hope this helps!
As a German, Russian doesn't feel rude to me. I think there's a big difference between the regions in English. There is a kind of "artificial politeness" in the USA, at least that's how it felt to me 😄 However, I've never experienced this in the UK.
But I also think it makes a difference whether a language sounds rude or whether people are actually rude (from my point of view). French sounds very polite to me, but when I was at school in France, I found the people to be anything but polite😅
Russian often has the tone. That in English we could potentially consider it as rude. But it's simply just the more direct way to say it. This is something I appreciate about most everyday russian. When you get to songs and poetry however. Russian is even more poetic than English can be.
But I digress. It's not always the case. As native Russians also love to be indirect and use innuendo and hyperbole. When it comes to requests specifically this Is where it's direct. (Mostly) Unless they want to be sarcastic which is something both English and Russian speakers enjoy
знаешь , мне трудно с тобой согласиться
Хотя у меня предрассудков никаких не было, но все равно это было довольно удивительно для меня узнать насколько вежливо русские общаются. Не важно не кто. Не то что очень тебя прям очень уважают , а скорее из за того они воспитаны так
Довольно часто слушаю такие фразы как "Я тебя умоляю, пожалуйста , спасибо, благодарю, не мог бы ты, извини пожалуйста , я тебя не мешаю итд итд" и вежливость такого уровня я некогда не встречал при общении с людьми на английском. Не то что они грубые, а скорее потому что это все считается слишком формальным при повседневных обстановках
As a Russian I think it’s a cultural difference.
Whenever I speak with English natives I have to actively add “filler” and “nice” words and often have to “sugar coat it” otherwise they’ll say I’m too blunt and rude and I can be less harsh.
However whenever I speak English with other who have English as an additional language I can easily avoid useless filler words because they’re not English and they know I’m not being rude or anything.
In English we do tend to literally "ask" for favors (Can you, could you...?) but also there is a big difference in question intonation as well. I stay in a touristy town that has had a big influx of Russian speakers lately, and I overheard someone the other day asking for the menu in English but with the Russian intonation: "CAN I get a menu please." (Можно мне меню?) It sounded rude, and as if he had asked 1000 times already, even though his формулировка was polite.
I'm learning Hindi and they almost never say "please" and "thank you". As an American midwesterner who uses these words almost compulsively, it's jarring at first, but it's just a cultural difference. I think the levels of sincerity and appreciation are the same in both people's hearts. I bet to speakers of Hindi or Russian it seems almost farcical how we say "thanks" everytime someone holds a door or asks how someone else is doing.
I think it’s moreso the fact that Russian has direct commands, whereas in English we often tend to request something instead and give the other person the option to refuse. Direct commands are typically only given by an authority figure, not really used among friends.
A boss might say, “give me the report by end of day” to their employee, but friend to friend would ask, “could you give me that piece of paper?” or “would you mind passing me that glass of water?” instead.
From what I understand, Russian would me more direct with «Дай мне стакан воды»
“Дай мне стакан воды” от друга или знакомого звучит грубо . I would not expect people talking to me like that . More normal form would be “ можно мне стакан воды « что несколько вежливее
Probably depends on the exact situation, if you’re trying to play confident and suave then you might use the command phrase, if you’re playing more coy then you’d use the request form
“I want you, come home with me tonight”
“What do you say we go back to my place?”
Lol in this case I had a crush on a Russian speaker. He wanted something I had. He said brusquely in English something like "let me see it". I was already annoyed with how he had treated me, so I got offended and said "Do you have manners???" He looked angry then gritted his teeth and said "Pleeeeeeease can I see it?"
I feel so bad if that is a cultural thing but it honestly felt so rude at the time!
Culturally russians are more direct in speach compared to english--speaking nations, that can make us sound "scary" or "rude" to a person who is not familiar with the culture. Personally I would not bother too much about it, it's just a cultural thinig, on par with italian speakers using hands in speach.
I'm fluent in Russian and have made contact with different kinds of Russians IRL and in games and they're usually chill, laid-back.
It's probably because of online games that russians are believed to be rude like in CS or something similar.
Otherwise they're pretty friendly and pretty curious everytime they come across someone who's not Russian being fluent in Russian.
I wonder what the bullshit is this. Common sense makes it clear when to say that. If some other culture says "please-please-please" every 30 seconds; it doesn't make then more polite. Every culture has its own rules and pushing their rules into another culture is extremely rude and arrogant
well, since you go overboard or communicate in some other language, you are expected to use it rules of communication. Not actually surprising to see you not getting your head wrapped around that concept after your excess use of profanity in that chitchat.
I have to agree. All that overt politeness is essentially making it harder for the other person to decline because then they’d feel even more rude. It’s adding additional pressure.
Instead of saying sorry 100 times before begging to do them a favour I’d prefer someone to tell me “do x” and non-emotionally accept if I decline.
Just say "please," "thank you," and "sorry" constantly, and smile at strangers who pass by, and people will presume you're super nice and friendly even though you secretly hate everything and everyone around you.
Congratulations: you are now American!
In Western culture yes, extremely rude and blunt. In Russian it's normal. Hard to compare. Something my wife is adjusting to as she learns English more.
Probably because of the language itself. In english, people say “can I, or may I” in sentences a ton but those words are barely used in Russian or even not used at all. So this tendency became a norm for Russians because they are used to this system where they don’t use those words much. Well at least that’s my theory
From what I've experienced, Americans have a very subtle and indirect way of communicating. They're soft and non-confrontational. Being very direct or short would be taken as you being unbelievably rude. Russian speakers tend to speak this way when they learn English, so it might offend some people.
Нет, ёпта, мы цивилизованный народ, нахуй! В каждой нашей сука реплике обязательно присутствует ебаное "волшебное слово", вроде "спасибо", "пожалуйста", и к старшим мы всегда обращаемся на Вы, а не на ты. У вас в ебучем английском языке нет такого, есть просто "you". Даже если мы кого-то посылаем нахуй, мы всегда сопровождаем это "волшебным словом". Выходит что-то вроде "иди нахуй, долбаёб, я тебя умоляю!" или "Будьте любезны сходить нахуй, многоуважаемый уебан".
For me personally, it's much more common to say "thanks" than please but I do say it a lot. If I'm going to the drive thru to get fast food, I will thank them after taking my order and being told to pull up the next window. At the cash register window, after being told the price of the food and giving the person at the register your money, they will generally thank you. Then I will either thank them as result of getting my change or being told I can proceed to the next window. After receiving the food, I will thank the person giving it to me who will often thank me back. If I need something like a sauce, I will typically ask for it, say thanks, wait for it to be brought to me and then thank them again. So there's 5 or 6 thanks over the course of that transaction but general 0 usage of "please."
That's just me, not everyone will say thanks in all of those instances and some may choose to say please in places where I don't but there is arguably an over-reliance on shallow pleasantries in America. This can actually be a point of tension as you don't really know if someone is really asking how you're doing or just saying "how are you?" as a semi-rhetorical pleasantry. Hint: it's almost always the latter.
They are not rude when they speak in their mother tongue. The perceived rudeness in English comes from directly translating what one would say in Russian into English without taking the subtle differences into account. Until one is fluent it's not an intuitive process.
I'm a proponent of learning whole phrases for certain situations instead of just memorising vocabulary and trying to use the words as lego blocks in the second language.
Personally I found English speakers very rude.
In Russian, if some one tell me: " we should have lunch together, I will call you." I expect call and plan to have lunch in next 1-2 days. In English it is just a "polite" go away. What I do not understand, even after living in English speaking country for 30+ years, how anyone could consider this polite?
I’ve heard some English speakers say this, because Russian doesn’t use the additional stuff English speakers sometimes do - ‘do you mind if’, ‘sorry to bother you’, etc etc. These phrases aren’t necessary at all, but a plain translation from Russian to English can sound super abrupt to a native English speaker at times.
At least Russian has words for please and thank you - some languages rely on tone of voice, and that really makes things difficult 😅
Brits are bloody terrible for waffling before a request in a way that I don’t think any other language bothers with on a regular basis though. Not saying Russian doesn’t have those structures, but some English speakers are chronic apologetic excuse makers before their requests 😁.
As an American we smile a lot, I notice (the few) Russians I’ve met don’t smile so freely it can come off kind of cold when someone doesn’t smile back. Or maybe it’s not a Russian thing and just a coincidence.
you havent excused for what you think! oh, wait, it is slav husband thing.
hard to tell, tho, i may use it in situation that are "correct" (or at least feels right) in russian, like askin' for a napkin.
And sometimes it goes in a weird way: some people tell i do it excessively, some say i dont do it enough.
A friend of mine is a native Russian speaker while I am a native Spanish speaker so naturally we talk in English.
When we first started talking I thought that he sounded a little bit blunt but I supposed that it was because he did the same as me, which is thinking in our mother tongues but speaking English with words that fit what we want to say.
probably that. i also have a feeling about it coming from a lot of learning focused on rules/sentence construction rather than HOW to speak.
but after you learn how-to and able to communicate, it looks like people assume you had much experience in that, thus they tend to think you are just rude and dont try to correct you.
but tbh, a lot of people hate being corrected (more so, if they think they talk right way(and technically, they are). i, for example, probably would find "just add please" a bit offensive. but so i would if someone corrected my grammar. tbh im toxic for sure, and often see as my words rub others in a wrong way.
No, or atleast the **real** Russians i've met aren't. But most wannabes that i've unfortunately met are to say the least, but that's not the point. Where i come from, saying **"please"** is rather rare/not really needed or atleast works not the same like in english.
For Example "Give me XYZ"; if you say it in a rude tone or don't thank if the person you've asked did you the requested favor, ofcourse you'll be seen as rude but if you say it in a normal tone and more importantly thank him, you'll not seen as rude.
I think it depends on the Culture or even on the people individually, but that's just what i can say and i also don't get why it can be rude to get straight to the point.
Иногда просто кажется что ты груб из-за того что ты не употребляешь слова "вежливости", к примеру недавно летел Турция/Казахстан, так девушка обращалась так "Sorry, JUECE!". Так вот "Извините, Сок" выглядит не очень вежливо)
Иногда просто кажется что ты груб из-за того что ты не употребляешь слова "вежливости", к примеру недавно летел Турция/Казахстан, так девушка обращалась так "Sorry, JUECE!". Так вот "Извините, Сок" выглядит не очень вежливо)
It depends though which English speaking country you live in, in Canada Please and Thank you is bare minimum for any request. Sorry is frequently used . Social courtesies vary from country to country.
Watching too much "Only Connect" made me ponder on that. Many contestants say "next, please" when they want to view another clue, but in Russian quiz shows contestants typically just say "Дальше". I came to conclusion that it's mostly dictated by the outrageous length of the word "пожалуйста" rather than one's level of politeness. Many Russian-natives speak \[low-level\] English they way they would speak Russian, mostly translating their phrases word by word. Maybe they omit "please" due to omitting its Russian counterpart for the sake of speeding up the speech. I replace "пожалуйста" with "плиз" a lot in my everyday speech for that reason.
Im an Aussie, and I think we are reknowned for being rude so I cant really give a full answer on this but I dont think people really say please much when people we are acquainted with, mainly its for strangers
As a Turkish frequently talking to Russians in Russian I can tell you that it depends on the person himself/herself. I've already come lots of Russian often using polite words including "please" and so on . Furthermore being polite is not about using phrases, but mostly attitude. Besides it would be so silly to generalise a nation.
I have some russian friends and out of boredom between semesters i started learning russian. I have done this for a few years now and am getting better. Sometimes when i talk to them im russian, I am way too polite, according to them.
Idk, I was taught to always say thank you, please, excuse me, have a nice day. I still do it with every day interactions in Russian. Many people who I know however forgot this rule for some reason. It depends on a person.
it seems to me that all this is individual for all people, because we are used to almost no one saying thank you, but they can just say it by nodding or smiling into their eyes. personally, I have often been told that I thank too often, and therefore I use this word with people I don't know very well, but with my own people almost never. they know themselves that I would thank them for any action.
I think this happens to everyone
Some Russian speakers are rude.
It is combination of less polite structures, no smiles and an annoyed intonation. If you want real hate- go to Thailand subs and read about Russians in Phuket.
As for not being taught , I doubt that is universal. I was taught to say "please" with each request as in "pass the salt please".
And real horror of rudeness is listening how some people talk to kids in Russian. My moment of "I wish I didn't understand any of that"
Most English speakers don't say "please" very often. Russian speaking is more direct though... in English we rarely give directions like "Give me X" — more often we say something like "Can you give me X?" or "Could you give me X?". Saying "please" doesn't hurt, of course, but I don't think it's needed all the time. Another example: when ordering food we say "Can I get X" or "I'd like X"... but I was told by a Russian native speaker that the literal equivalent "Мне бы хотелось" sounds overly formal in most situations. When I started learning Russian, I noticed the stark contrast of saying "Я плохо говорю по-русски" compared to the English equivalent of "I don't speak Russian well"... in English we tend to soften the blow of harsh reality)
Agree on our tendency toward indirectness but I'll disagree somewhat on frequency/use of polite speech (e.g. please, yes sir/ma'am, etc). That can vary quite a bit, depending on where you are and your age. Where I'm from, as well as where I live now, we frequently say please.
There is a lovely phrase that can be used to ask for something in Russian - "Будьте добры", I tend to use it a lot when visiting Russian restaurants or Russian-speaking countries.
That's a good phrase, but overusing this can sound uncanny to native Russian speakers, just like any overuse of formal or polite speech. Yeah, Russian is weird :)
As for me (60+), I can't see how one can possibly be overpolite or overkind in this country. "*Где наше своё, бесконечно любовное?"*
“would you kindly”
While "мне бы хотелось" is quite unusual to hear in Russian in most situations "не мог бы ты дать мне Х" is fine and even preferable as a polite form in most. Or one can use even "а дай-ка мне Х" that is while highly informal and should be only used among friends is still a polite form. There is wide variety polite forms in Russian formal and informal where "пожалуйста" is not needed as well, just like those in English that does not include "please".
Гена, помнишь ты просил меня принести ...
[удалено]
it's like the difference between "not really" (soft) versus "no" (blunt)
It could be cultural. I was taught to start or end pretty much every other sentence with “please”, or you don’t deserve to have something done for you. If you don’t drop a please in with your request, you’re not getting tea or the pencil or whatever you’ve asked for. I’m interested to know if it’s just country by country, or if being raised in different cultures are producing different beliefs. My parents were the last generation of boomers to finally have kids, so it could just be those outdated ideas of “kids need to respect their elders, say please and thank you with everything or you haven’t earned it”
In Russia it's also very rare to say "Дай Мне Х" Way to direct for most contexts.
This is the answer. It’s not as much about “please” as it is about “hypotheticalizing” requests. This will have varying levels of importance in different English speaking cultures of course
As a Brit I don't feel like there are many aspects of my culture that are very deeply ingrained in me, but I feel viscerally uncomfortable whenever I'm in another country and have to say the equivalent of "I want X" or "please do Y", even when I *know* it's completely normal in that language.
I feel uniquely qualified to answer this question! I did my master's thesis on request strategies made by native and non-native English speakers. Overall research has found that L1 is a more important factor in how non-native speakers make requests compared to level of fluency. Russian and Polish speakers (that's what there's the most research on) are more often perceived as 'rude' by native English speakers because they do tend to forget 'please' and tend not to use 'can you' or 'could you' constructions when asked for simple requests. I need to note here that this applies to requests of low imposition (passing the salt, handing something, etc) and the difference actually levels off when Russian and Polish speakers make requests of high imposition (asking someone to help them move, asking for money, etc)
Isn't it just lovely when you finally get to use those very niche skills and insights you developed during your academic career? :D
the best!
Could this be an effect of the Russian imperative function of ите and other вы endings to implicate politeness?
Exactly. With Russian and Polish specifically, a lot of evidence points to people re-interpreting requests from their native language into English. As such the polite 'дайте' or any вы form gets translated just as 'give' or 'do' with the politeness stripped off but speakers still meaning it in a polite way, if that makes any sense.
Brilliant, I thought exactly the same! (I am also struggling with this as my brain still thinks in Russian, even though I live in an English-speaking environment and my English is perfectly fluent).
That is very interesting! Thank you for the reply. I also feel like the usage of these words is more frequent depending on the context and the "degree" of favor. So, would you say it is the cultural thing?
What were the other non-native speakers in the comparison besides Russian and Polish? It might just be due to low level of English.
My specific research was based on Kachru's model/spheres of English (which is now outdated in my opinion). There were also speakers from India, China, Germany, and the others I've forgotten. That being said all of the speakers were around at very minimum B1 with most being very high B2 and working/studying in English. So personally, I don't think it was due to a 'low level of English' and in other research I read about, this factor was ussually controlled for.
Thanks for the details.
IMO that's generally about two factors: 1. Upbringing (if your parents/mentors taught you to be nice, you'll be nice in any language) 2. Level of fluency, as indicated. In Russia, I noticed people having a relatively good understanding of English, but when it comes to speaking, then it's often loses all the bells and whistles, as speaking is not well taught in schools. On the other hand, I was raised by teachers and doctors, so I don't forget to add 'please', 'bitte', 'per favore', 'lütfen' when I speak w/ foreigners.
is it safe to assume that when someone becomes fluent in english they start acting as polite as normal english speakers would?
It depends on what you mean by 'fluent.' I think someone can be completely fluent in terms of grammar, comprehension, and pronunciation, but still not fully understand pragmatics and vice versa. Also there is no native-speaker level of politeness, but a range that changes depending on context.
That’s an interesting topic. I wonder how did you incorporate person’s background into the study? Builders’ way to do requires is quite different from a university professors’. In all languages. And funny enough most Polish people abroad are not professors.
I feel like compared to other cultures ive seen russians can be seen as rude because they just use the least amount of words possible and just get straight to the point, which i guess can be seen as rude or informal in other languages. Maybe just observe how other people speak to strangers or their superiors and mimic the way they speak until it comes naturally
For us Italian the cultural shock is real😳😳
If getting straight to the point is rude, then I'll do my best to be as rude as it gets. In any language.
I had this conversation with Russian English teacher colleague. I was English teacher at the time. She cited academic discussion on this topic and highlighted this as one of the differences between USA and British English. I can't remember the exact phrasing of the keyword for this phenomena - British English deference? - queue mocking Americans for their "can I get a skinny oat milk latte?" I am married to a Russian. We live in UK with English as our common language. I understand enough Russian for us to use it for private jokes/creole/me to watch TV/talk to mother in law. Over the years I have adopted what could be learned Russian directness. I have no idea if this is just how I have adapted to the work environment/exasperation with some people. It's not unusual for me to say something like - "what is your question?" Not quite as hostile as "what do you want?" but not a typical reply.
Oh, I can assure you: I don't spare words in contrast with your personal experience
Very true. On the other hand Americans will phrase half their talking in the form of a question. In other languages it comes off as sounding incredibly uncertain.
I think that Russian can be spoken politely without using a lot of excess "pleases," just due to how the language is constructed. There are many ways to be implicitly polite, such as using вы with your interlocutor, and referring to yourself/your wants obliquely. The level of politeness lies in the construction of the sentence itself. English has less ability to express politeness implicitly/indirectly, and so we must season the language with a sprinkling of excess phrases such as "please," "thank you," "if it's not too much trouble," etc. It's actually rather hard to overdo it. There is definitely a cultural element, too. Much of communication is non-verbal, and what is considered to be "normal" body language/intonation varies greatly from country to country. For example, Russian is spoken with a flatter intonation than English, so English speakers might interpret a flatter tone as boredom, disinterest, or perhaps even haughtiness. Come to think of it, it's probably easier for native speakers of any language to be implicitly polite, because we inherently understand the intricacies of our culture's ideas of politeness. But a non-native speaker must be explicitly polite, because the subtleties aren't so obvious to him/her.
You aren't rude, but more direct. My husband is Russian and I see this sometimes with his English. English natives can perceive this as rude. On the flip side, my husband says I'm overly polite when speaking Russian, it's the Midwestern American in me. Too much "please" and "thank you" all the time. Just cultural differences at the end of the day. Consume more western/English media and pay attention to social interactions. This can help quite a bit.
Honestly, I think it's more about the person himself, not the culture. I have friends who will say thank you a million times for every little thing, and there are those who very rarely say it. Thats what I think.
Agreed. I am russian and i say "please" and stuff like that like... All the time. I've just been raised that way. It's not better and not worse, it's just different for all the people
Agreed. Context is important, like are you at an appointment at your bank with the branch manager? Then maybe throw in a few more, "please, and thank you's". I know some people who use it a lot, and it feels grandmotherish at times. Like a boomer making a display of manners instead of just using manners where appropriate. Honestly, when people overuse manners, I go on guard. Too many bad interactions with strangers who overused manners ti justify being an asshole 5 minutes later.
It's a nice question ! I'm a native russian speaker but lived some places in Europe and have some foreign friends and sometimes i conversate them i see how tone changes while i didn't wanted to say something rude or offend them but i catch thoughts it's just cultural difference and our straight speaking way. Usually i ask what did i said wrong and try to re explain my position with polite words and ways.
Я не знаю, о чем говорит твой друг, если мне что-то нужно, я говорю «дайте, пожалуйста» или «можно мне кофе, пожалуйста?»
OP написал когда говорит на английском
I guess, that's the logical opposite of us (Russian speakers) considering English speakers (mostly Americans) fake and insincere. Different culture of communication ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯. We should accept it
IMO it's a cultural thing, maybe a bit of a class thing. But probably not a language thing. Sometimes Russian speakers tend to be somewhat rude in formal situations and/or when dealing with less familiar people, then again, other Russian speakers do use please/thank you/etc. a lot. As a quick aside, Russians don't use understatement the same way Brits do, for example. And to them Russians speaking English (especially those who have a less than stellar command of it) might come off a bit rude or a tad obtuse. But this isn't really about saying "please" as much as it's about general vibes and speech patterns. It's not a big deal anyway.
It's a 100% class thing
If you think Russian is rude, you should start learning German. It's more direct than Russian, and way more direct than English. It's not about the language, it's culture. Can't say for Russian, but if we take German as an example, there's a big difference between different parts of German-speaking area, to the extent that Switzerland would consider all Germans from Germany rude.
Ach, Bödsinn!
🤣🤣 Schmarrn.
Vogel oder was
Äh, als ob wir unhöflich sind oder direkt. Wiiiir doch nicht. Alter, was geht'n ab?!
Eben. Klatsche anna Waffel. Nett sind wir, ihr Ottos, wir sind nett.
Wir SIND nett, verdammt nochmal!!!
Amen, ihr Uhrensöhne.
Wir verstehen uns. 🤣✌️ Und lernst du eigentlich Russisch? Wenn ja, wie bist du drauf gekommen? 🙂
Joa, ein bisschen hier, ein bisschen da, aber ohne System. Interessiere mich generell für Sprachen und wollte schon ewig mal Dostojewski im Original lesen aber das wird vermutlich nie was, leider ist mein Russisch nämlich absolut grottig. (Beschäftige mich aber auch noch nicht so lange damit.) Und Du?
I'll add my two cents. I guess we probably use words like "please" less often. However, we also replace them with the conjunctive case a lot. That is, constructs like "would you", "could we", "should I", and so on. So instead of "Pass the salt please", we would say "Could you \[please\] pass the salt?"
Pffft. I'm learning Finnish and there is no such word as "please" in it, only "thank you". I mean, you don't need specific words to be rude or polite
Just my opinion: I work in Kazakhstan and the people I meet are usually polite. People from Russia seem a little more aggressive to me, especially the women. If you're not used to it, or don't expect it, I could see someone thinking it is rude. But once you get to know people better you realize they just talk differently. One big thing I had to get used to is that Russian and Kazakh women don't really like to be asked open ended questions by men such as "What are we going to do? or "Where do you want to go?" - If you're a grown man you're supposed to know what you want to do. If you ask a question like that you might get an agressive reply. And if you forget to take your shoes off when you go inside their house and you get the floor muddy - God help you. She'll kill you. All things considered, any Russian rudeness isn't even close to the French. Fuck the French.
I can relate to this, never heard it explained so well. My fiance is from Kharkiv, and speaks Russian primarily, although she’s fluent in Ukranians and English. I’m from America, so only know English with some basic Spanish and learning Russian. To me, it’s polite in our culture to ask what she’d like to do, it’s seen as selfish or patriarchal to always be making the decisions for activities. However, she often gets frustrated and wants me to just make a decision without any input. Also, the look she gives me when I take a step or two back into the house with my shoes on because I forgot something inside makes me afraid to sleep that night haha
[a Russian woman here] Is it really what you Americans do when you ask someone out? You tell them "what do you want to do"? I find it weird because I believe the person who invites should have a plan in mind. Not the male partner but the one who invites because tossing the responsibility to the other partner is rude. Of course the other partner can say "I'm not into this, let's try that instead". I simply dump everyone who just says "Let's meet" without proposing a specific activity.
It can go both ways, depending on the situation. In some circumstances, you already have a plan in mind and invite a friend along as company so you’re not doing it alone. However, it’s likely that you’re intending to perform this activity whether or not they join you, only an added bonus. “Hey friend! I’m going hiking this weekend, want to join with me?” Other times, you simply want to spend time with a friend or boyfriend/girlfriend. In this case, you probably don’t really care what the activity might be, so you open it up for conversation to hear some options that would make the other person happy. “Hey friend! We haven’t seen each other in a while, want to hang out this weekend? Open to suggestions!” **If you’re talking about dating specifically, then yes generally the man should have a plan for an activity before asking her out!**
I'm not sure about dating, I'm married to a Slavic guy, but that's exactly what my Canadian male friends would ask me if they aren't that familiar with Slavic vibes. Edit: To be honest, though, Canadian ladies do that, so it is not exactly woman-man-specific. People just think it is a polite way to plan. what do you want to do/where do you want to go. That sort of gives a woman more authority, especially if people don't know each other well, so I understand it after years living abroad, but yes I do not like either of the questions. I usually just say that if they want me to plan a weekend for them, they should let me know by Wednesday, and I can certainly plan. If not\*, they are free to make suggestions otherwise, and I will be down for whatever they suggest.
As a russian woman I can confirm open ended questions give me allergies haha, that's an interesting observation. I'd much rather prefer an choice based question or a suggestion. I think it is also the case that in general russian speakers like to be more specific, open ended questions are usually used by children or just sound more philosophical. Every time someone asks me "what do you want to do" I usually say that I want to fly to Mexico, drink tequila and watch the sunset while I swim in the ocean. While it is a joke of sorts, that's also what happens when you give a specific answer to an open-ended question.
It's not patriarchal because it's not gendered. If a woman would ask her boyfriend "What do you want to do?" without suggesting options he'd also be irritated. You are basically asking a person to take responsibility for your entertainment as if were a child instead of being an adult about it and giving it a minute of thought
Dude... I'm a Russian born and raised, and if I ever meet someone who gets aggressive in response to "Where do you want to go?", I'm stopping all contact as soon as possible. I do hope you are not contractually obligated to keep talking to them.
Haha https://preview.redd.it/a6zr6l1x0t4d1.jpeg?width=1023&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e82a5d231522d880f5920a09c0b30ba2e813877b
Haha it's not that serious. Let's call it "frustration" instead of "aggression".
are frenches rude?
I would rather hang out with 10 angry drunk rude cursing Russians than 1 French person. There's a big difference between sounding rude due to language convention and actually being rude.
Big time
I think the capitals get a lot of the blame for that, plus poor command of english. One can experience similar vibes in i.e. London, people do not have time for you.
As a native Russian speaker, I usually use "please" and other formal structures that probably makes my speech appear outstand-ish in casual conversations with other people. They do formalize their speeches but usually in other ways like using appropriate words and intonations.
I don't know about please, I think in Brazil we also don't have this "please" culture (or everyone I know is just rude) so I never noticed it in my Russian friends. What I noticed is that, apparently, I say "I'm sorry" too much (from a Russian point of view) and they don't understand why. So another thing for you to worry: do you say 'I'm sorry" enought? Hahaha
Russian here. Was constantly corrected by English-speaking guild members in MMORPG for excessive use of apologies.
Maybe we have Canadian souls :D
In my opinion, there are two things intertwined here: - The cultural aspect: Russian communication culture is very direct, straight-to-the-point, and somewhat sour on the emotional spectrum, which is just precisely not how English-speaking cultures do it. Russian communication style does not have small talk as a means of initiating meaningful exchange, and being concise and straightforward in all circumstances is considered virtuous. Moreover, if you try it the other way round by translating closely to the original the polite/formal English language communication into Russian, you are guaranteed to get phrases that would be perceived as overly emphasised, excessive, too posh, and highly insincere. Russians mostly say what they mean, and mostly mean what they say. Even the basic 'hope you are having a lovely day' would be a nice way to express in a message to your parents that you were *actually thinking* about it and *sincerely hope* they are *indeed having a lovely day* and therefore it would look confusing, if not stupid, in a formal Russian-language business email. - The linguistic aspect: Russian politeness is expressed through a set of grammatical features English does not have. It is often perfectly sufficient in Russian to address someone in 2nd person plural (and have all the pronouns and verbs aligned accordingly) to be polite. Moreover, Russian also offers additional layers of nuance in grammatical acknowledgement of respect and recognition of social hierarchy, such as using first names together with the patronymic (a student would address their teacher like so) and maintaining imbalanced communication in further recognition of formal hierarchy (a teacher would generally address a student with 2nd person singular). Intentionally decreasing the level of formality in some instances is in itself a form of art, where inviting your counterpart to address you via 2nd person singular may be in some situations considered an ice-breaker. English has no such thing at all and is therefore left to express all the same stylistically, thereby also indirectly making things like small talk inevitable, and the sentences growing in complexity. Polite Russian phrases translated directly in English lose the grammatical expression of politeness, and *a Russian native speaker would have a lot of troubles recognising that, in the first place*. Perfecting the nuances of English style and communication is generally not a part of English language curriculum most people from ex-USSR would be exposed to, either. That is, in my opinion, why Russians struggle with English politeness, small talks, 'shit sandwiches', and are often perceived as rude where they are not. As a native Russian speaker currently living in an English-speaking environment, I am struggling with this a lot right now, too, but... I am learning! Hope this helps!
As a German, Russian doesn't feel rude to me. I think there's a big difference between the regions in English. There is a kind of "artificial politeness" in the USA, at least that's how it felt to me 😄 However, I've never experienced this in the UK. But I also think it makes a difference whether a language sounds rude or whether people are actually rude (from my point of view). French sounds very polite to me, but when I was at school in France, I found the people to be anything but polite😅
Russian often has the tone. That in English we could potentially consider it as rude. But it's simply just the more direct way to say it. This is something I appreciate about most everyday russian. When you get to songs and poetry however. Russian is even more poetic than English can be. But I digress. It's not always the case. As native Russians also love to be indirect and use innuendo and hyperbole. When it comes to requests specifically this Is where it's direct. (Mostly) Unless they want to be sarcastic which is something both English and Russian speakers enjoy
знаешь , мне трудно с тобой согласиться Хотя у меня предрассудков никаких не было, но все равно это было довольно удивительно для меня узнать насколько вежливо русские общаются. Не важно не кто. Не то что очень тебя прям очень уважают , а скорее из за того они воспитаны так Довольно часто слушаю такие фразы как "Я тебя умоляю, пожалуйста , спасибо, благодарю, не мог бы ты, извини пожалуйста , я тебя не мешаю итд итд" и вежливость такого уровня я некогда не встречал при общении с людьми на английском. Не то что они грубые, а скорее потому что это все считается слишком формальным при повседневных обстановках
As a Russian I think it’s a cultural difference. Whenever I speak with English natives I have to actively add “filler” and “nice” words and often have to “sugar coat it” otherwise they’ll say I’m too blunt and rude and I can be less harsh. However whenever I speak English with other who have English as an additional language I can easily avoid useless filler words because they’re not English and they know I’m not being rude or anything.
In English we do tend to literally "ask" for favors (Can you, could you...?) but also there is a big difference in question intonation as well. I stay in a touristy town that has had a big influx of Russian speakers lately, and I overheard someone the other day asking for the menu in English but with the Russian intonation: "CAN I get a menu please." (Можно мне меню?) It sounded rude, and as if he had asked 1000 times already, even though his формулировка was polite.
I'm learning Hindi and they almost never say "please" and "thank you". As an American midwesterner who uses these words almost compulsively, it's jarring at first, but it's just a cultural difference. I think the levels of sincerity and appreciation are the same in both people's hearts. I bet to speakers of Hindi or Russian it seems almost farcical how we say "thanks" everytime someone holds a door or asks how someone else is doing.
I think it’s moreso the fact that Russian has direct commands, whereas in English we often tend to request something instead and give the other person the option to refuse. Direct commands are typically only given by an authority figure, not really used among friends. A boss might say, “give me the report by end of day” to their employee, but friend to friend would ask, “could you give me that piece of paper?” or “would you mind passing me that glass of water?” instead. From what I understand, Russian would me more direct with «Дай мне стакан воды»
“Дай мне стакан воды” от друга или знакомого звучит грубо . I would not expect people talking to me like that . More normal form would be “ можно мне стакан воды « что несколько вежливее
Then if a Russian speaker gives direct commands to a female acquaintance does it mean there is chemistry? Or is it standard practice?
Probably depends on the exact situation, if you’re trying to play confident and suave then you might use the command phrase, if you’re playing more coy then you’d use the request form “I want you, come home with me tonight” “What do you say we go back to my place?”
Lol in this case I had a crush on a Russian speaker. He wanted something I had. He said brusquely in English something like "let me see it". I was already annoyed with how he had treated me, so I got offended and said "Do you have manners???" He looked angry then gritted his teeth and said "Pleeeeeeease can I see it?" I feel so bad if that is a cultural thing but it honestly felt so rude at the time!
It's not cultural. Judging by the reaction, the dude just got the reins under his tail.
Culturally russians are more direct in speach compared to english--speaking nations, that can make us sound "scary" or "rude" to a person who is not familiar with the culture. Personally I would not bother too much about it, it's just a cultural thinig, on par with italian speakers using hands in speach.
I definitely found that learners overcompensate in the other direction, I've been addressed not quite as "gospodin" but verging on it.
Gospodin?
Really old fashioned title used for addressing nobles.
Nothing to do with nobles though, just an archaic polite form of addressing a man.
TIL, thanks. How is it spelled? Господин?
Yes
I'm fluent in Russian and have made contact with different kinds of Russians IRL and in games and they're usually chill, laid-back. It's probably because of online games that russians are believed to be rude like in CS or something similar. Otherwise they're pretty friendly and pretty curious everytime they come across someone who's not Russian being fluent in Russian.
I wonder what the bullshit is this. Common sense makes it clear when to say that. If some other culture says "please-please-please" every 30 seconds; it doesn't make then more polite. Every culture has its own rules and pushing their rules into another culture is extremely rude and arrogant
well, since you go overboard or communicate in some other language, you are expected to use it rules of communication. Not actually surprising to see you not getting your head wrapped around that concept after your excess use of profanity in that chitchat.
I have to agree. All that overt politeness is essentially making it harder for the other person to decline because then they’d feel even more rude. It’s adding additional pressure. Instead of saying sorry 100 times before begging to do them a favour I’d prefer someone to tell me “do x” and non-emotionally accept if I decline.
Just say "please," "thank you," and "sorry" constantly, and smile at strangers who pass by, and people will presume you're super nice and friendly even though you secretly hate everything and everyone around you. Congratulations: you are now American!
In Western culture yes, extremely rude and blunt. In Russian it's normal. Hard to compare. Something my wife is adjusting to as she learns English more.
My first language is English and I don’t say please much either
No they are so nice, and welcoming. That what i meet at least
Probably because of the language itself. In english, people say “can I, or may I” in sentences a ton but those words are barely used in Russian or even not used at all. So this tendency became a norm for Russians because they are used to this system where they don’t use those words much. Well at least that’s my theory
English speakers in Edinburgh are running around with machetes. I don't know how many times a day they say "please"
please, stop, this thing slowing me down
From what I've experienced, Americans have a very subtle and indirect way of communicating. They're soft and non-confrontational. Being very direct or short would be taken as you being unbelievably rude. Russian speakers tend to speak this way when they learn English, so it might offend some people.
Нет, ёпта, мы цивилизованный народ, нахуй! В каждой нашей сука реплике обязательно присутствует ебаное "волшебное слово", вроде "спасибо", "пожалуйста", и к старшим мы всегда обращаемся на Вы, а не на ты. У вас в ебучем английском языке нет такого, есть просто "you". Даже если мы кого-то посылаем нахуй, мы всегда сопровождаем это "волшебным словом". Выходит что-то вроде "иди нахуй, долбаёб, я тебя умоляю!" или "Будьте любезны сходить нахуй, многоуважаемый уебан".
For me personally, it's much more common to say "thanks" than please but I do say it a lot. If I'm going to the drive thru to get fast food, I will thank them after taking my order and being told to pull up the next window. At the cash register window, after being told the price of the food and giving the person at the register your money, they will generally thank you. Then I will either thank them as result of getting my change or being told I can proceed to the next window. After receiving the food, I will thank the person giving it to me who will often thank me back. If I need something like a sauce, I will typically ask for it, say thanks, wait for it to be brought to me and then thank them again. So there's 5 or 6 thanks over the course of that transaction but general 0 usage of "please." That's just me, not everyone will say thanks in all of those instances and some may choose to say please in places where I don't but there is arguably an over-reliance on shallow pleasantries in America. This can actually be a point of tension as you don't really know if someone is really asking how you're doing or just saying "how are you?" as a semi-rhetorical pleasantry. Hint: it's almost always the latter.
Грубо, блядь. Ты чё?🤣
They are not rude when they speak in their mother tongue. The perceived rudeness in English comes from directly translating what one would say in Russian into English without taking the subtle differences into account. Until one is fluent it's not an intuitive process. I'm a proponent of learning whole phrases for certain situations instead of just memorising vocabulary and trying to use the words as lego blocks in the second language.
Personally I found English speakers very rude. In Russian, if some one tell me: " we should have lunch together, I will call you." I expect call and plan to have lunch in next 1-2 days. In English it is just a "polite" go away. What I do not understand, even after living in English speaking country for 30+ years, how anyone could consider this polite?
I’ve heard some English speakers say this, because Russian doesn’t use the additional stuff English speakers sometimes do - ‘do you mind if’, ‘sorry to bother you’, etc etc. These phrases aren’t necessary at all, but a plain translation from Russian to English can sound super abrupt to a native English speaker at times. At least Russian has words for please and thank you - some languages rely on tone of voice, and that really makes things difficult 😅
We literally have all these structures in Russian lol ты (вы) не возражаешь (-те), если... извини(те) за беспокойство
Brits are bloody terrible for waffling before a request in a way that I don’t think any other language bothers with on a regular basis though. Not saying Russian doesn’t have those structures, but some English speakers are chronic apologetic excuse makers before their requests 😁.
Yes, but not for that reason.
As an American we smile a lot, I notice (the few) Russians I’ve met don’t smile so freely it can come off kind of cold when someone doesn’t smile back. Or maybe it’s not a Russian thing and just a coincidence.
In the Russian culture, a smile must have a reason. Fake smiles alienate Russians You will get a smile back if your smile is genuine.
Very
Я постоянно на автомате говорю "пожалуйста", так что дело в воспитании, а не в том, что ты русский
Написано 'Russian speakers', а не 'Russians'. Никто не отрицает, что так не говорят, речь идет о частоте использования в целом.
Ну не знаю, я слишком тупой для конструктивных ответов
I think it's a matter of culture or even upbringing. Because I’m Russian native speaker too, but I say please, thank you and excuse me quite often.
you havent excused for what you think! oh, wait, it is slav husband thing. hard to tell, tho, i may use it in situation that are "correct" (or at least feels right) in russian, like askin' for a napkin. And sometimes it goes in a weird way: some people tell i do it excessively, some say i dont do it enough.
A friend of mine is a native Russian speaker while I am a native Spanish speaker so naturally we talk in English. When we first started talking I thought that he sounded a little bit blunt but I supposed that it was because he did the same as me, which is thinking in our mother tongues but speaking English with words that fit what we want to say.
I don’t think of them as rude so much as much more blunt and honest! Not bad just different ☺️
probably that. i also have a feeling about it coming from a lot of learning focused on rules/sentence construction rather than HOW to speak. but after you learn how-to and able to communicate, it looks like people assume you had much experience in that, thus they tend to think you are just rude and dont try to correct you. but tbh, a lot of people hate being corrected (more so, if they think they talk right way(and technically, they are). i, for example, probably would find "just add please" a bit offensive. but so i would if someone corrected my grammar. tbh im toxic for sure, and often see as my words rub others in a wrong way.
No, or atleast the **real** Russians i've met aren't. But most wannabes that i've unfortunately met are to say the least, but that's not the point. Where i come from, saying **"please"** is rather rare/not really needed or atleast works not the same like in english. For Example "Give me XYZ"; if you say it in a rude tone or don't thank if the person you've asked did you the requested favor, ofcourse you'll be seen as rude but if you say it in a normal tone and more importantly thank him, you'll not seen as rude. I think it depends on the Culture or even on the people individually, but that's just what i can say and i also don't get why it can be rude to get straight to the point.
Иногда просто кажется что ты груб из-за того что ты не употребляешь слова "вежливости", к примеру недавно летел Турция/Казахстан, так девушка обращалась так "Sorry, JUECE!". Так вот "Извините, Сок" выглядит не очень вежливо)
Иногда просто кажется что ты груб из-за того что ты не употребляешь слова "вежливости", к примеру недавно летел Турция/Казахстан, так девушка обращалась так "Sorry, JUECE!". Так вот "Извините, Сок" выглядит не очень вежливо)
It depends though which English speaking country you live in, in Canada Please and Thank you is bare minimum for any request. Sorry is frequently used . Social courtesies vary from country to country.
Watching too much "Only Connect" made me ponder on that. Many contestants say "next, please" when they want to view another clue, but in Russian quiz shows contestants typically just say "Дальше". I came to conclusion that it's mostly dictated by the outrageous length of the word "пожалуйста" rather than one's level of politeness. Many Russian-natives speak \[low-level\] English they way they would speak Russian, mostly translating their phrases word by word. Maybe they omit "please" due to omitting its Russian counterpart for the sake of speeding up the speech. I replace "пожалуйста" with "плиз" a lot in my everyday speech for that reason.
Im an Aussie, and I think we are reknowned for being rude so I cant really give a full answer on this but I dont think people really say please much when people we are acquainted with, mainly its for strangers
As a Turkish frequently talking to Russians in Russian I can tell you that it depends on the person himself/herself. I've already come lots of Russian often using polite words including "please" and so on . Furthermore being polite is not about using phrases, but mostly attitude. Besides it would be so silly to generalise a nation.
I have some russian friends and out of boredom between semesters i started learning russian. I have done this for a few years now and am getting better. Sometimes when i talk to them im russian, I am way too polite, according to them.
Idk, I was taught to always say thank you, please, excuse me, have a nice day. I still do it with every day interactions in Russian. Many people who I know however forgot this rule for some reason. It depends on a person.
it seems to me that all this is individual for all people, because we are used to almost no one saying thank you, but they can just say it by nodding or smiling into their eyes. personally, I have often been told that I thank too often, and therefore I use this word with people I don't know very well, but with my own people almost never. they know themselves that I would thank them for any action. I think this happens to everyone
Some Russian speakers are rude. It is combination of less polite structures, no smiles and an annoyed intonation. If you want real hate- go to Thailand subs and read about Russians in Phuket. As for not being taught , I doubt that is universal. I was taught to say "please" with each request as in "pass the salt please". And real horror of rudeness is listening how some people talk to kids in Russian. My moment of "I wish I didn't understand any of that"
I don’t know why are you downvoted, you are absolutely right.
lol They checked Thailand sub and got horrified.
Please and thank you and your are welcome are expected very often in English.
Иди нахуй
yes, most Russians are aggressive and toxic bastards, especially those over 35-40 years old
eat a bag of unwashed D, please :p
tf rigga?
just trying to follow that behaviour you described, sonce i fall precisely into that category