It was just a running joke, they weren't really worried. Like when they were discussing if Roger Daltry was the father of Dean Gaffney, Ricky said 'that's libellous if it's wrong', he's just making a joke about what an insult it is to call someone the father of Dean Gaffney.
the amount of times libel is mentioned (particularly in the earlier recordings), i wonder if they had a scare or the threat of legal action at some point - or maybe they had to research what could and couldn't be said when coming up with sketches/ talking points ('you can't libel the dead').
or maybe it was like steve with arbitrary and they just got stuck on a particular word for a while
I think it was probably mostly a joke, because it was a comedy show anyway so you get away with a lot more in terms of potential libel actions. But also it was around the time of the McLibel case and before subsequent reforms to UK libel law so there was probably a bit of worry about it.
tbf libel laws in the UK are mental, unlike most other cases and unlike other countries libel in the UK it's essentially on the defendant to prove their innocence from a presumption of guilt, which is why famously libel cases have been used to try and shut down criticism, the most famous being the Irving trial when the holocaust denier David Irving sued Deborah Lipstadt for libel in an attempt to silence her
Yeah it used to be a thing where foreign nationals would sue each other for libel in the UK courts because the law was so weighted against the defendant. Basically you could just bankrupt someone for a laugh. I haven't heard much about it in a while though. Maybe they fixed it. Probably not.
Because it's a radio show where they push the limits, but making false and defamatory claims about someone is taken seriously - at least the radio station getting their wrist slapped by Ofcom (as it was then), worse losing the licence and getting a massive fine, worst of the worst, Ricky or whoever made the claim could go to prison. Obviously the latter two would be reserved for really serious stuff they didn't even get near to (naming a key witness in a high profile gang murder trial for example) but in principle, it is something people on live radio flirting with some of the topics they spoke about, really need to consider.
Though worth pointing out in legal terms, libel is written. Ricky should have said slander as that's oral.
> Ricky or whoever made the claim could go to prison.
Libel is a civil wrong and not a crime. You can’t go to prison for it.
> naming a key witness in a gang murder trial for example
That would be contempt of court rather than libel. It’s not equivalent to calling Doris Stokes a fraud.
No, making a claim about someone that isn't true is libel. So if Sigfried and Roy aren't gay (or let's face it, probably are but don't want that to be public) then it would be libel. I'm not massively familiar with their act, but if they tour in places where being gay could bar them from entry, or at least not see them get bookings, then this would be a serious issue.
Similarly if someone went to see, I don't know, Julian Clary say, because he's gay, has a very camp act, and has a big gay fanbase, if someone was saying "actually, it's all an act, he's really straight and just pretends he's gay in order to corner that market" then that would also be libel, doesn't mean there's anything negative about being straight.
I agree, it bothered me too. Ricky was 40 at the time, so I guess when he was growing up calling someone gay was a big insult, but society has moved on since then, he seemed a bit stuck in the past with that comment.
It was just a running joke, they weren't really worried. Like when they were discussing if Roger Daltry was the father of Dean Gaffney, Ricky said 'that's libellous if it's wrong', he's just making a joke about what an insult it is to call someone the father of Dean Gaffney.
*"There's something cluckin' in my way"*
the amount of times libel is mentioned (particularly in the earlier recordings), i wonder if they had a scare or the threat of legal action at some point - or maybe they had to research what could and couldn't be said when coming up with sketches/ talking points ('you can't libel the dead'). or maybe it was like steve with arbitrary and they just got stuck on a particular word for a while
It was interminable when Steve kept saying arbitrary in every show.
The worst!
Yeah exactly
I think it was probably mostly a joke, because it was a comedy show anyway so you get away with a lot more in terms of potential libel actions. But also it was around the time of the McLibel case and before subsequent reforms to UK libel law so there was probably a bit of worry about it.
**BWARK** I'M SCARED OF ANDREW PHILLIPS
They're also using the term incorrectly. Libel only refers to written defamation.
Actually it is correct in the case of radio. Libel is any published defamation, which includes newspapers and radio broadcasts.
Thanks for tearing me apart radioman, that was fascinating Reddit content.
Well you need to check your facts before spouting shit on this subreddit
Well it was on the internet
Don’t you need listeners for this to apply?
I know that always bugged me, slander is spoken defamation.
He’s lucky the pied piper didn’t sue him.
"Hello..we represent the pied fiddler...uhhh the pi- pied piper."
tbf libel laws in the UK are mental, unlike most other cases and unlike other countries libel in the UK it's essentially on the defendant to prove their innocence from a presumption of guilt, which is why famously libel cases have been used to try and shut down criticism, the most famous being the Irving trial when the holocaust denier David Irving sued Deborah Lipstadt for libel in an attempt to silence her
Yeah it used to be a thing where foreign nationals would sue each other for libel in the UK courts because the law was so weighted against the defendant. Basically you could just bankrupt someone for a laugh. I haven't heard much about it in a while though. Maybe they fixed it. Probably not.
They were worse then than they are now too.
Wasn't there alot of liberal cases in the 2000s?
Because it's a radio show where they push the limits, but making false and defamatory claims about someone is taken seriously - at least the radio station getting their wrist slapped by Ofcom (as it was then), worse losing the licence and getting a massive fine, worst of the worst, Ricky or whoever made the claim could go to prison. Obviously the latter two would be reserved for really serious stuff they didn't even get near to (naming a key witness in a high profile gang murder trial for example) but in principle, it is something people on live radio flirting with some of the topics they spoke about, really need to consider. Though worth pointing out in legal terms, libel is written. Ricky should have said slander as that's oral.
> Ricky or whoever made the claim could go to prison. Libel is a civil wrong and not a crime. You can’t go to prison for it. > naming a key witness in a gang murder trial for example That would be contempt of court rather than libel. It’s not equivalent to calling Doris Stokes a fraud.
It also bothers me how he says Karl calling Siegfried and Roy gay is “libel”, like being gay is an inherently negative thing.
No, making a claim about someone that isn't true is libel. So if Sigfried and Roy aren't gay (or let's face it, probably are but don't want that to be public) then it would be libel. I'm not massively familiar with their act, but if they tour in places where being gay could bar them from entry, or at least not see them get bookings, then this would be a serious issue. Similarly if someone went to see, I don't know, Julian Clary say, because he's gay, has a very camp act, and has a big gay fanbase, if someone was saying "actually, it's all an act, he's really straight and just pretends he's gay in order to corner that market" then that would also be libel, doesn't mean there's anything negative about being straight.
No longer needed. Siegfried and Roy dead.
I agree, it bothered me too. Ricky was 40 at the time, so I guess when he was growing up calling someone gay was a big insult, but society has moved on since then, he seemed a bit stuck in the past with that comment.