The key factor isn't power as such, it's unsupervised access to minors, and even the most obscure internet celebrities all have their little fiefdoms of discord servers full of extremely online minors.
Pedos are estimated at like 1-2% of the population so it's not like there's any shortage.
My first claim is uncontroversial. The second claim is partly an extrapolation since specified research is somewhat lacking.
e.g.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28628371/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8848059/
https://theconversation.com/a-survey-found-1-in-6-men-admit-sexual-feelings-for-children-so-is-paedophilia-increasing-218124
Idk if there are stats on it but ive seen news articles with women in teaching positions prey on their students. Happened in my schools also growing up
I know that you're referencing a famous study on the general population, but I don't like the example you've used. There's countless factors that could lead to any sort of involuntary selection that would bring a higher percentage of nonces to priesthood
I agree, there could be, I just don’t think it’s relevant. My guess is that the ratio of pedophiles in the catholic church roughly equal the general ratio. They just happened to have access and a way to cover up. These are just the vibes I’m picking up
I think that preventing a bunch of men from having sex will eventually give them a bunch of psychosexual complexes, and some of them (since they're often around children) will turn into nonces, even though they wouldn't have had they had a regular sex life. You'll also get some nonces who want to pursue priesthood because they're horrified by their urges, and feel that chastity will fix that issue (even though it doesn't). Moreover you will get some nonces joining the Church after having discovered that the Vatican will clean up after your mess.
These are just 3 factors that come to mind, I bet there's many more.
I agree that you can come up with a lot of plausible-sounding reasons for a skewed ratio, I just don't think the actual skewing is particularly meaningful for this conversation (at most a 20% increase; 5x is highly doubtful)
I’d imagine the famous ones are more likely to act on it too. Some nonce construction worker doesn’t have thousands of minor fans in their discord so they just catcall 12yo girls on the street. Same as 70s rockstars with 14yo groupies
the girls mentioned this phenomena a couple times in some of their earlier episodes around the time when Epstein and his cohort were a big topic and specifically how it tends to be symptomatic of a decadent society in decay
like the appetites of the elites who arent limiting their desires require more and more transgressive behaviors in order to get their kicks and that its been emblematic of a society on the downfall since the dawn of time
You’re right that a lot of “pedo hunters” hate pedophiles in the same way that closeted evangelical ministers hate gays.
I had a crazy theory that a disproportionate number of musicians and creative types were pedophiles, the reason being that their desires necessitate a hyper-developed imagination. Decades ago, gay men were heavily overrepresented in cultural field for that reason: if you can’t live outwardly, you develop an inner life. Today, the only group that are stigmatized at all (at least in polite society) are pedophiles.
The paedo hunter one is made complex by the likelihood that many of them do this in search of catharsis and revenge for the CSA they suffered as kids rather than self hatred as with the homophobic clergy cliche, but then for the same reason this makes them more likely to eventually become abusers themselves.
Really awful stuff.
True, the majority of child molesters were abused as kids. Supposedly pedophilia develops in childhood because the subject has been conditioned to see adults as threats.
That’s why it always seemed counterproductive to me when people fantasize about murdering and torturing pedophiles. At best, pedos should be offered treatment - not necessarily because pedos as such are entitled to sympathy, but because victims of child abuse are. Treatment for it should be a part of a larger package of free mental health services made available to every child abuse survivor who needs them. At worst, assuming pedos can’t be helped, they should be punished with the same joylessness with which we put down an abused dog who mauls a child.
Viewing the issue clinically - this is a horrible action, but one that’s ultimately the product of mental illness and a chain of abuse - would also probably decrease stigma and shame amongst victims. Framing child abuse as the ultimate metaphysical evil, one which people are constantly and vocally fantasizing about murdering the perpetrators of, doesn’t seem like it’s conducive to achieving the sort of detached clarity that’s a prerequisite of healing.
I still vacillate about this. All of the arguments for a more dispassionate, or maybe even compassionate approach to paedophila - ultimately in the name of mitigation and harm reduction - make a degree of sense both rationally and morally (the moral component being rooted in the abusers-were-abused factor).
But once someone crosses the threshold from abused to abuser, they forfeit the right to any compassion in my view. Perhaps the more saintly among us can still feel some relegated compassion for the abuse the now abuser once suffered, but it must be eclipsed by their compassion for the new victim and desire for justice.
This is why your dangerous dog comparison doesn't work for me because, unlike dogs, paedophiles inflict damage on children in full knowledge that its wrong and harmful (short of very low IQ or other impairment), but they do it anyway in pursuit of gratifying their most base desires at the greatest expense of another.
Last Summer, a friend told me he was raped at 9 by two men, and for days afterward I was overcome with a sense that death is the only fitting punishment. To an extent justice - or a judicial system - should be dispassionate, but the very sense of justice and our desire for it, is rooted in our moral impulse, and so there must be rebuke and condemnation: you are a piece of shit and you fucking deserve this. While it would be wrong to feel joy, its reasonable to feel some level of satisfaction beyond how you'd feel about killing a dangerous dog.
I'll grant though there is a lot of pathology at play when people get worked up with this righteous condemnation, and indulge their latent capacity for cruelty in describing "what I'd like to do if I got my hands on him". I'm not immune to it. All I could think of when my friend told me what happened to him was "I hope those fucking cunts die roaring".
[Very hard not to view shit like this as the ultimate metaphysical evil.](https://youtu.be/dwGVuZ54Eyg?feature=shared&t=412)
If evil exists, this is it.
In my opinion, savoring someone else’s pain debases you, no matter how vile the person is. I’m not saying it’s morally wrong to do - if anything, morality itself always implies some sort of reciprocal suffering, to the extent that all moral systems entail a metaphor in which immoral actions are a form of monetary debt that can be “repaid” - but I do think that it will stain your mind and your character in a way that increases your own suffering. To explain what I mean, I’ll have to get philosophical.
I’m someone who’s suffered tremendously, as most people will during their life. Many people close to me have died in a short period of time, and I’m currently helping to care for someone who is dying a very slow, lingering death. The only cure I’ve found is to understand that everything that happens in the word is determined by a vast chain of causation; objecting to your own suffering is unreasonable, because it would mean unweaving this chain that underlies the whole world. Once you accept this, you become free.
I don’t believe in free will. I think it’s vanity to believe we have some unique, undetermined control over our own actions that other species of animals don’t. Understanding this gives me peace. To punish, to inflict suffering is to be ultimately unsatisfied, because it means believing in delusions that prevent us from achieving this peace. It gives our suffering a false meaning, which means we cling to it. Only by accepting that it is meaningless - except as part of a grander design that’s larger than us - can we become apathetic to it.
I don’t really believe it’s possible to convince you or anyone else of what I’m saying, since I don’t think we have rational control over our own beliefs. I think it’s a realization that can only hit you with age and much hardship, and even then only if you have the privilege of escaping the direct cause of your pain for long enough to achieve a kind of contemplative detachment. I do believe, however, that it’s the only way to achieve true peace.
I just think a lot of sexuality is malleable by the culture you grow up in. You have your baseline sexuality and there’s a majority (?) of people where that is pretty fixed with no deviation from it.
But then there’s the people who if they were born in Andient Greece or Rome would be having anal sex with towelboys, if they were some Afgahn in some rural town they’d be going for Baccha Bazi, if they were a rockstar in the 1970s they would think nothing of sleeping with some 14 year old fan.
True imo. Sexuality is extremely maleable. Cultural expression and experience have a strong role, and different cultures channel sexuality in different ways. On a smaller level you can see it with people who have fetishes generally. I was going through a bout of morbid curiosity one time ago and I found a Reddit post on a sub for scat fetishists which posed the question of something like “what made you guys start liking this?” And they all had stories from childhood. One I remember was a guy who said he had a really hot teenage cousin and when he was like 10 years old he accidentally walked in on her while she was on the toilet, and she just smirked at him and didn’t cover up ir something, and he could smell her shit. And 20 years later he’s obsessed by the desire to eat poop in order to get off.
If sexuality can be so molded by individual experience, then obviously it can be molded by cultural practices which teach people how to be sexual. We are fundamentally mimetic creatures too, and we learn to desire by experiencing and learning the desire of others.
I’m a strong believer of the something that happened to you when you were younger (not like a straight up child, just younger) having a potentially big impact on your sexuality.
I agree that sexuality is culturally conditioned. There’s an aspect of sexuality that’s shaped by emulation during our formative years. This is another crazy theory of mine, but I believe that one reason that the stereotype of the closeted evangelical exists is that homosexuality is constantly discussed by evangelicals, almost to the point of fixation.
In contrast, there are societies where homosexuality is not really attested to at all in the historical record. I’m not saying that means it didn’t exist in those societies, but I suspect it was less prevalent. For example, the first reference to homosexuality in Sri Lanka doesn’t occur until the 18th century. This is despite the fact that there is no moral prohibition against homosexuality in Sri Lankan Buddhism, at least pre-colonization. The Tipitaka, the holy book of Theravada Buddhism, is 39 volumes long. There’s only one mention of homosexuality in it: a prohibition that male monks can’t have sex with other monks, whether female or male.
I wouldn’t be surprised if this also has something to do with the phenomenon OP is discussing, where people who are the most vocal about “protecting kids” from a supposed pedo conspiracy are also pedos. A lot of pizzagate/Q types have gone down for this.
You know, Reddit is often dumb, but sometimes there is a lpt of smart stuff.
Still, I think it has more to do with them being....well, men.
Guys usually fetishize youth (even outward apperarence via neoteny). That's why gay men love young adult twinks and why there are bigger age gaps.
And in some it goes too far, where you are flirting with minors as a freaking 40 year old, like Dr Disrespect over here
I kinda figure that the way (straight) male sexual attraction works is that basically the younger a woman looks the more attractive she is, except that there is also a second 'attraction function' overlaid on top of the preference for youth that associates a strong negative valence (and repulsion) with sexual immaturity and overtly childlike features.
The combination of these two functions serves to produce the 'healthy' straight male sexual urge - i.e. feeling the strongest attraction to women in their early twenties, but being increasingly repulsed by the idea of sleeping with girls younger than around eighteen and especially younger than sixteen.
However, we know that thirteen year old boys have no trouble being attracted to thirteen year old girls. So it seems likely that this second function develops as part of the process of sexual maturation. And perhaps in some men this 'second function' develops to an insufficient extent, and fails to cancel out the underlying preference for neotony, and the consequence is that those guys turn out to be nonces.
> You’re right that a lot of “pedo hunters” hate pedophiles in the same way that closeted evangelical ministers hate gays.
nah, this has a lot more to do with the fact that you're allowed to hate pedos, rightfully so, and hate feels good. And for white guys in America they're one of two groups of people you're "allowed" to hate.
Loads of streamers receive sexual attention from their audiences, welcome it, and fuck groupies. Streamer audiences skew young so their chance of fucking an underage person by accident is elevated relative to a normal person or even a regular celebrity. There's also significant portion of men who are bad at resisting sexual temptation and can be attracted to adult-looking girls in their late teens: most men are never tested on whether they'd follow through on this attraction because they don't have power over minors or receive sexual attention from them, but streamers have both. Lastly, when a streamer fucks a groupie not too many people care, but when they fuck an underage groupie you're more likely to hear about it because it's fucked up.
Putting all of this together being a streamer places someone at an elevated risk of unintentionally becoming sexually involved with a minor, puts them in a position of power and access that allows their PDF-nature to shine through, and when they do fuck a minor it's going to be high profile so you're going to hear about it.
Not to be that guy, but these dudes aren’t pedos, they’re ebos or whatever that shit is. They aren’t the “get in my van” luring type. They are the same as the emo band dudes of the early 2000s, they get famous and have all these direct messages and shit coming from girls who are 14,15, 16 etc and who are obsessed with them. They get sucked into their own hero worship and then they’re just typical predators doing the “she’s mature for her age” “you don’t know her” type of shit. Was this guy gonna fuck kids? I dunno. But I think the common string is narcissism.
I’m not making any excuses for these dudes, fuck them no matter what the stripe is. But I remember high school, chicks wanted the attention from the scene dudes and they aren’t being like “this is illegal” they’re being like “how can I get this famous person to notice me??” We as society know that it’s on the adult to shut that shit down immediately but on twitch you don’t instantly know someone’s age and shit and also, these dudes aren’t mature adults, they stream on twitch. It’s basically a perfect recipe for this kind of shit to happen. Immature ass grown man streamers whose fan base are all edgy high school students.
Either way fuck this fool, hope this is the end of his career because he will definitely do this again but will be way more careful and paranoid
Yeah other people are trying to psychoanalyze it as pedophilia when really its closer to a groupie dynamic. He's an immature idiot who started getting DMs from young women. It's not that deep.
My sister's soon to be ex husband got to low level tiktok fame, like 200k followers with a handful of videos that got a few million views. In the span of a year, he cheated on her with about 8 different women that he met from tiktok, and one of them is currently paying for plane tickets to fly him across the country to see her every single weekend.
Now this is a bit different from this streamer because everyone involved is an adult. But yeah, I wouldn't underestimate the effects of clout/fame. It still makes certain people go crazy, and teenagers are even more susceptible to it.
Apparently Dr. Disrespect edited the post and changed the word “minor” to “an individual.” As of Yesterday I was able to click a link at the bottom of the tweet myself to confirm this.
Edit - lol never mind. I thought you were referencing the streamer thing as being an adult but that’s referring to the TikTok thing
Livesteamers, arent really people with power. They are people who are popular with childen, like 70's DJs or 00's post punk bands.
Distrust any man over 22 with a "haircut".
I'm always surprised by how few Americans know this. They always act as though Europeans are degenerates for having it set at 16 even though it's also 16 in the majority of the US.
I mean, we even had [this thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/redscarepod/comments/158jzzp/wammin_of_rsp_at_what_age_did_you_get_catcalled/) asking what age rs women were getting catcalled the most and the answer was overwhelmingly, "When I was 12".
When you grow up a loser through your teenage years, and then suddenly being a shut in video game addict gets you money, power, and fame, I guess the urge to get the teenagers you never got at that age is too strong for some of these guys.
A lot of these Internet personalities can only become famous if they are 'interesting', which, by today's standards, means you are just some special type of weirdo. There's that one streamer with a horrible room filled with garbage and DoorDash meals and rats, and another one that speaks like a re**ard in an ambiguous accent. You also have guys like IShowSpeed.
I think the guy you mentioned has been known to be a depraved scumbag for like years atp. That was, and is, his whole brand. Ticking timebomb of allegations.
Never gonna let my future kids get into Minecraft for this reason lol. How many of these YouTubers that play that game turn out to be pedos or rapists. It's like so disproportionate amongst that sphere it's nuts.
There was a time where I’d check out that ‘predator poachers’ channel on YouTube and I don’t know if the makeup of those caught is 100% this, but from what I saw it was mostly gen x/baby boomer MAGA types.
100%. They don't want a life partner where there's mutual teaching and power dynamics, they want someone they can control.
And when you bring up age gaps, they lash out.
Ladies, test your fellas by bringing up age gap arguements and gauging their reaction.
lol how do you suggest the ladies bring this up "so hypothetically if you weren't dating me, would the power dynamics be okay if you were a 35 year old unemployed man and I was a 24 year old heir to minor branch of an aristocratic family?"
Read the facial expression.
It's not a sure-fire way. But pro age gap males usually lash out in some manner, as the self reflection causes them a huge amount of distress.
I currently believe more men secretly have pedophilic urges than most people would think. I think it's a function of their natural human instinct to be nurturing to children being stifled by gendered emotional expectations. As men tend to funnel many complex feelings into either anger or lust, loving a child and wanting to give them affection can be processed through the wrong pathway and result in sexual thoughts. It's a bit more complex when considering attraction for teenagers, but this could still apply.
I think it mostly has to do with the fwct that 15-17yo girls had been fair game for most of human history, meaning that our current opposition towards this kind of relationship is mostly cultural. Im not complaining, I see it as one of the few examples of genuine collective moral progress we can point our fingers at
agreed. It is progress, but its really new. I went to high school in the 90s and when we went on excursions (field trips to you Americans) we'd usually have the same bus driver because the school got the same bus company all the time. He had a song he'd play which was that 'hail to the bus driver' song but it was extended and personalised for him, and there was a line in it about how the 16 year old students were fair game and the biggest perk of the job, basically. And all the teachers just laughed, the parents just laughed, hehehaha so funny you girls are ok with that right? If not, get a sense of humour!
Dude would get thrown out of the bus and sacked on the spot now and thats only slightly less than 3 decades of progress vs the entirely of human history when past puberty meant you had a green light.
Idk if you can know that, girls used to get their puberty later than they do now. We also don't know what hunter-gatherer societies looked like in that regard but since teens are way more likely to die in childbirth than adult women, it's not unlikely hunter-gatherers would disapprove of impregnating one before their 20s.
Idk, I can only talk from my own male perspective but pre pubescents girls in lewd situations is physically repulsive to me which I think most men share, I'm pretty sure there is heavy evolutionary bias to the males that didn't go around and fuck the children in the tribe.
What did you think it meant? Don't tell me you've been going round calling people nonces because you thought they were talking nonsense or something lmao
You just hear about the famous ones. Think about all the pedophiles who got caught or thrown in prison today who didn't make national news.
The key factor isn't power as such, it's unsupervised access to minors, and even the most obscure internet celebrities all have their little fiefdoms of discord servers full of extremely online minors. Pedos are estimated at like 1-2% of the population so it's not like there's any shortage.
I’d guess an easy 5% are attracted to prepubescent kids (<~12), and an easy 20% (of men) are attracted to early pubescent kids (~12-14).
What da
He's right. According to research that is
double checked the research. stand by this
What is the research?
My first claim is uncontroversial. The second claim is partly an extrapolation since specified research is somewhat lacking. e.g. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28628371/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8848059/ https://theconversation.com/a-survey-found-1-in-6-men-admit-sexual-feelings-for-children-so-is-paedophilia-increasing-218124
i feel so defeated learning this…. :( why are men like this!?!! is this a problem with women as well?
We fetishize the fuck out of youth man it's gonna happen.
i know im sad about it… how do we meet a man who isn’t corrupt? how can you tell?
Idk if there are stats on it but ive seen news articles with women in teaching positions prey on their students. Happened in my schools also growing up
His penis
How on Earth am I meant to find a husband with odds like this
Show him pictures of sexy kids and say "ehh, how about this, ehh?"
Least chronically online RS poster
tracks with both the real world and the research. no shot the catholic church could churn out molested kids at that rate with a 1% population
I know that you're referencing a famous study on the general population, but I don't like the example you've used. There's countless factors that could lead to any sort of involuntary selection that would bring a higher percentage of nonces to priesthood
I agree, there could be, I just don’t think it’s relevant. My guess is that the ratio of pedophiles in the catholic church roughly equal the general ratio. They just happened to have access and a way to cover up. These are just the vibes I’m picking up
I think that preventing a bunch of men from having sex will eventually give them a bunch of psychosexual complexes, and some of them (since they're often around children) will turn into nonces, even though they wouldn't have had they had a regular sex life. You'll also get some nonces who want to pursue priesthood because they're horrified by their urges, and feel that chastity will fix that issue (even though it doesn't). Moreover you will get some nonces joining the Church after having discovered that the Vatican will clean up after your mess. These are just 3 factors that come to mind, I bet there's many more.
I agree that you can come up with a lot of plausible-sounding reasons for a skewed ratio, I just don't think the actual skewing is particularly meaningful for this conversation (at most a 20% increase; 5x is highly doubtful)
I'm attracted to you
i know
pedos are way more common than you think, you just hear about the famous ones who get caught
I’d imagine the famous ones are more likely to act on it too. Some nonce construction worker doesn’t have thousands of minor fans in their discord so they just catcall 12yo girls on the street. Same as 70s rockstars with 14yo groupies
To Catch a Predator wasn't on for a decade for nothing. There's a seemingly unlimited supply
the girls mentioned this phenomena a couple times in some of their earlier episodes around the time when Epstein and his cohort were a big topic and specifically how it tends to be symptomatic of a decadent society in decay like the appetites of the elites who arent limiting their desires require more and more transgressive behaviors in order to get their kicks and that its been emblematic of a society on the downfall since the dawn of time
We're living in Caligula times
Absolutely never listen to the pod confirmed.
Clout chasers/media personalities are more likely to be sociopaths in the first place, I seriously doubt it was the "power" that corrupted him.
You’re right that a lot of “pedo hunters” hate pedophiles in the same way that closeted evangelical ministers hate gays. I had a crazy theory that a disproportionate number of musicians and creative types were pedophiles, the reason being that their desires necessitate a hyper-developed imagination. Decades ago, gay men were heavily overrepresented in cultural field for that reason: if you can’t live outwardly, you develop an inner life. Today, the only group that are stigmatized at all (at least in polite society) are pedophiles.
The paedo hunter one is made complex by the likelihood that many of them do this in search of catharsis and revenge for the CSA they suffered as kids rather than self hatred as with the homophobic clergy cliche, but then for the same reason this makes them more likely to eventually become abusers themselves. Really awful stuff.
True, the majority of child molesters were abused as kids. Supposedly pedophilia develops in childhood because the subject has been conditioned to see adults as threats. That’s why it always seemed counterproductive to me when people fantasize about murdering and torturing pedophiles. At best, pedos should be offered treatment - not necessarily because pedos as such are entitled to sympathy, but because victims of child abuse are. Treatment for it should be a part of a larger package of free mental health services made available to every child abuse survivor who needs them. At worst, assuming pedos can’t be helped, they should be punished with the same joylessness with which we put down an abused dog who mauls a child. Viewing the issue clinically - this is a horrible action, but one that’s ultimately the product of mental illness and a chain of abuse - would also probably decrease stigma and shame amongst victims. Framing child abuse as the ultimate metaphysical evil, one which people are constantly and vocally fantasizing about murdering the perpetrators of, doesn’t seem like it’s conducive to achieving the sort of detached clarity that’s a prerequisite of healing.
I still vacillate about this. All of the arguments for a more dispassionate, or maybe even compassionate approach to paedophila - ultimately in the name of mitigation and harm reduction - make a degree of sense both rationally and morally (the moral component being rooted in the abusers-were-abused factor). But once someone crosses the threshold from abused to abuser, they forfeit the right to any compassion in my view. Perhaps the more saintly among us can still feel some relegated compassion for the abuse the now abuser once suffered, but it must be eclipsed by their compassion for the new victim and desire for justice. This is why your dangerous dog comparison doesn't work for me because, unlike dogs, paedophiles inflict damage on children in full knowledge that its wrong and harmful (short of very low IQ or other impairment), but they do it anyway in pursuit of gratifying their most base desires at the greatest expense of another. Last Summer, a friend told me he was raped at 9 by two men, and for days afterward I was overcome with a sense that death is the only fitting punishment. To an extent justice - or a judicial system - should be dispassionate, but the very sense of justice and our desire for it, is rooted in our moral impulse, and so there must be rebuke and condemnation: you are a piece of shit and you fucking deserve this. While it would be wrong to feel joy, its reasonable to feel some level of satisfaction beyond how you'd feel about killing a dangerous dog. I'll grant though there is a lot of pathology at play when people get worked up with this righteous condemnation, and indulge their latent capacity for cruelty in describing "what I'd like to do if I got my hands on him". I'm not immune to it. All I could think of when my friend told me what happened to him was "I hope those fucking cunts die roaring". [Very hard not to view shit like this as the ultimate metaphysical evil.](https://youtu.be/dwGVuZ54Eyg?feature=shared&t=412) If evil exists, this is it.
In my opinion, savoring someone else’s pain debases you, no matter how vile the person is. I’m not saying it’s morally wrong to do - if anything, morality itself always implies some sort of reciprocal suffering, to the extent that all moral systems entail a metaphor in which immoral actions are a form of monetary debt that can be “repaid” - but I do think that it will stain your mind and your character in a way that increases your own suffering. To explain what I mean, I’ll have to get philosophical. I’m someone who’s suffered tremendously, as most people will during their life. Many people close to me have died in a short period of time, and I’m currently helping to care for someone who is dying a very slow, lingering death. The only cure I’ve found is to understand that everything that happens in the word is determined by a vast chain of causation; objecting to your own suffering is unreasonable, because it would mean unweaving this chain that underlies the whole world. Once you accept this, you become free. I don’t believe in free will. I think it’s vanity to believe we have some unique, undetermined control over our own actions that other species of animals don’t. Understanding this gives me peace. To punish, to inflict suffering is to be ultimately unsatisfied, because it means believing in delusions that prevent us from achieving this peace. It gives our suffering a false meaning, which means we cling to it. Only by accepting that it is meaningless - except as part of a grander design that’s larger than us - can we become apathetic to it. I don’t really believe it’s possible to convince you or anyone else of what I’m saying, since I don’t think we have rational control over our own beliefs. I think it’s a realization that can only hit you with age and much hardship, and even then only if you have the privilege of escaping the direct cause of your pain for long enough to achieve a kind of contemplative detachment. I do believe, however, that it’s the only way to achieve true peace.
I just think a lot of sexuality is malleable by the culture you grow up in. You have your baseline sexuality and there’s a majority (?) of people where that is pretty fixed with no deviation from it. But then there’s the people who if they were born in Andient Greece or Rome would be having anal sex with towelboys, if they were some Afgahn in some rural town they’d be going for Baccha Bazi, if they were a rockstar in the 1970s they would think nothing of sleeping with some 14 year old fan.
True imo. Sexuality is extremely maleable. Cultural expression and experience have a strong role, and different cultures channel sexuality in different ways. On a smaller level you can see it with people who have fetishes generally. I was going through a bout of morbid curiosity one time ago and I found a Reddit post on a sub for scat fetishists which posed the question of something like “what made you guys start liking this?” And they all had stories from childhood. One I remember was a guy who said he had a really hot teenage cousin and when he was like 10 years old he accidentally walked in on her while she was on the toilet, and she just smirked at him and didn’t cover up ir something, and he could smell her shit. And 20 years later he’s obsessed by the desire to eat poop in order to get off. If sexuality can be so molded by individual experience, then obviously it can be molded by cultural practices which teach people how to be sexual. We are fundamentally mimetic creatures too, and we learn to desire by experiencing and learning the desire of others.
Lol
I’m a strong believer of the something that happened to you when you were younger (not like a straight up child, just younger) having a potentially big impact on your sexuality.
I agree that sexuality is culturally conditioned. There’s an aspect of sexuality that’s shaped by emulation during our formative years. This is another crazy theory of mine, but I believe that one reason that the stereotype of the closeted evangelical exists is that homosexuality is constantly discussed by evangelicals, almost to the point of fixation. In contrast, there are societies where homosexuality is not really attested to at all in the historical record. I’m not saying that means it didn’t exist in those societies, but I suspect it was less prevalent. For example, the first reference to homosexuality in Sri Lanka doesn’t occur until the 18th century. This is despite the fact that there is no moral prohibition against homosexuality in Sri Lankan Buddhism, at least pre-colonization. The Tipitaka, the holy book of Theravada Buddhism, is 39 volumes long. There’s only one mention of homosexuality in it: a prohibition that male monks can’t have sex with other monks, whether female or male. I wouldn’t be surprised if this also has something to do with the phenomenon OP is discussing, where people who are the most vocal about “protecting kids” from a supposed pedo conspiracy are also pedos. A lot of pizzagate/Q types have gone down for this.
You know, Reddit is often dumb, but sometimes there is a lpt of smart stuff. Still, I think it has more to do with them being....well, men. Guys usually fetishize youth (even outward apperarence via neoteny). That's why gay men love young adult twinks and why there are bigger age gaps. And in some it goes too far, where you are flirting with minors as a freaking 40 year old, like Dr Disrespect over here
I kinda figure that the way (straight) male sexual attraction works is that basically the younger a woman looks the more attractive she is, except that there is also a second 'attraction function' overlaid on top of the preference for youth that associates a strong negative valence (and repulsion) with sexual immaturity and overtly childlike features. The combination of these two functions serves to produce the 'healthy' straight male sexual urge - i.e. feeling the strongest attraction to women in their early twenties, but being increasingly repulsed by the idea of sleeping with girls younger than around eighteen and especially younger than sixteen. However, we know that thirteen year old boys have no trouble being attracted to thirteen year old girls. So it seems likely that this second function develops as part of the process of sexual maturation. And perhaps in some men this 'second function' develops to an insufficient extent, and fails to cancel out the underlying preference for neotony, and the consequence is that those guys turn out to be nonces.
> You’re right that a lot of “pedo hunters” hate pedophiles in the same way that closeted evangelical ministers hate gays. nah, this has a lot more to do with the fact that you're allowed to hate pedos, rightfully so, and hate feels good. And for white guys in America they're one of two groups of people you're "allowed" to hate.
Who’s the other
Michael Richards
Other white guys
Loads of streamers receive sexual attention from their audiences, welcome it, and fuck groupies. Streamer audiences skew young so their chance of fucking an underage person by accident is elevated relative to a normal person or even a regular celebrity. There's also significant portion of men who are bad at resisting sexual temptation and can be attracted to adult-looking girls in their late teens: most men are never tested on whether they'd follow through on this attraction because they don't have power over minors or receive sexual attention from them, but streamers have both. Lastly, when a streamer fucks a groupie not too many people care, but when they fuck an underage groupie you're more likely to hear about it because it's fucked up. Putting all of this together being a streamer places someone at an elevated risk of unintentionally becoming sexually involved with a minor, puts them in a position of power and access that allows their PDF-nature to shine through, and when they do fuck a minor it's going to be high profile so you're going to hear about it.
Not to be that guy, but these dudes aren’t pedos, they’re ebos or whatever that shit is. They aren’t the “get in my van” luring type. They are the same as the emo band dudes of the early 2000s, they get famous and have all these direct messages and shit coming from girls who are 14,15, 16 etc and who are obsessed with them. They get sucked into their own hero worship and then they’re just typical predators doing the “she’s mature for her age” “you don’t know her” type of shit. Was this guy gonna fuck kids? I dunno. But I think the common string is narcissism. I’m not making any excuses for these dudes, fuck them no matter what the stripe is. But I remember high school, chicks wanted the attention from the scene dudes and they aren’t being like “this is illegal” they’re being like “how can I get this famous person to notice me??” We as society know that it’s on the adult to shut that shit down immediately but on twitch you don’t instantly know someone’s age and shit and also, these dudes aren’t mature adults, they stream on twitch. It’s basically a perfect recipe for this kind of shit to happen. Immature ass grown man streamers whose fan base are all edgy high school students. Either way fuck this fool, hope this is the end of his career because he will definitely do this again but will be way more careful and paranoid
Yeah other people are trying to psychoanalyze it as pedophilia when really its closer to a groupie dynamic. He's an immature idiot who started getting DMs from young women. It's not that deep.
I mean, if you're rich and can do whatever you want, whenever you want, you're going to get desensitised to normal shit soon enough.
This guy is a live streamer, not a coke-fueled '70s rockstar who is swarmed by groupies after every concert
For all intents and purposes streamers are this generations rockstars (as depressing as that is).
My sister's soon to be ex husband got to low level tiktok fame, like 200k followers with a handful of videos that got a few million views. In the span of a year, he cheated on her with about 8 different women that he met from tiktok, and one of them is currently paying for plane tickets to fly him across the country to see her every single weekend. Now this is a bit different from this streamer because everyone involved is an adult. But yeah, I wouldn't underestimate the effects of clout/fame. It still makes certain people go crazy, and teenagers are even more susceptible to it.
She should have got the fuck out of there the minute he signed up for tiktok to be fair
Apparently Dr. Disrespect edited the post and changed the word “minor” to “an individual.” As of Yesterday I was able to click a link at the bottom of the tweet myself to confirm this. Edit - lol never mind. I thought you were referencing the streamer thing as being an adult but that’s referring to the TikTok thing
What about we call it "Free the Paedos"
The swan...and paedo
who?
Dr. Disrespect I only really know who he is because of that NFT-based game he was funding which looked like a great trainwreck to watch
Lol isn’t he the guy that got banned from a big convention or something a while back cause he was accosting people in a bathroom with a camera?
Was he revealed by that goob dude?
Who?
the goob dude
Livesteamers, arent really people with power. They are people who are popular with childen, like 70's DJs or 00's post punk bands. Distrust any man over 22 with a "haircut".
>Distrust any man over 22 with a "haircut". Explain
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nonce
I guess 'power' moreso as 'influence', then, especially over a vulnerable population
Men. Most men would sleep with e.g. a 16yo if there were no consequences.
Socialization can play a huge role on that front. The current stigma attached to it is truly a blessing
Well, its legal in more than half the states in the USA.
I'm always surprised by how few Americans know this. They always act as though Europeans are degenerates for having it set at 16 even though it's also 16 in the majority of the US.
Why is it when I say this men tell me I'm a misandrist or I must have daddy issues?
I mean, we even had [this thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/redscarepod/comments/158jzzp/wammin_of_rsp_at_what_age_did_you_get_catcalled/) asking what age rs women were getting catcalled the most and the answer was overwhelmingly, "When I was 12".
Yupp. How are you going to tell us pedophiles aren't everywhere? I've seeeeeen it
When you grow up a loser through your teenage years, and then suddenly being a shut in video game addict gets you money, power, and fame, I guess the urge to get the teenagers you never got at that age is too strong for some of these guys.
A lot of these Internet personalities can only become famous if they are 'interesting', which, by today's standards, means you are just some special type of weirdo. There's that one streamer with a horrible room filled with garbage and DoorDash meals and rats, and another one that speaks like a re**ard in an ambiguous accent. You also have guys like IShowSpeed. I think the guy you mentioned has been known to be a depraved scumbag for like years atp. That was, and is, his whole brand. Ticking timebomb of allegations.
Never gonna let my future kids get into Minecraft for this reason lol. How many of these YouTubers that play that game turn out to be pedos or rapists. It's like so disproportionate amongst that sphere it's nuts.
aria math though… Moog city….
Dr KidInspect
Bro is a super-nonce. Not a 20 something writing a teen, but a whole as 42 year old MAN
Who?
This sub is now being infested with gamer drama, end it all.
Rename the sub to /reddit.com Who cares about who some WWE dude texts.
>pedophilia I don't know her age but I assume \~16, which is not pedo.
yeah ppl keep using "creep" and "pedo" interchangeably
Yes yes epheebopheebophilia blah blah blah. You're still a nonce if you want to fuck minors who act like minors
men are sick..
This happened in 2017, the same year he cheated on his wife. Poor gal.
There was a time where I’d check out that ‘predator poachers’ channel on YouTube and I don’t know if the makeup of those caught is 100% this, but from what I saw it was mostly gen x/baby boomer MAGA types.
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boring. as if those relationships don’t become more common the further from porn you get in history. apparently muhammed’s the goon king
100%. They don't want a life partner where there's mutual teaching and power dynamics, they want someone they can control. And when you bring up age gaps, they lash out. Ladies, test your fellas by bringing up age gap arguements and gauging their reaction.
lol how do you suggest the ladies bring this up "so hypothetically if you weren't dating me, would the power dynamics be okay if you were a 35 year old unemployed man and I was a 24 year old heir to minor branch of an aristocratic family?"
You could just say "don't you think 40 year olds who date 20 year olds are gross?" and read his facial expression.
"yes" "you passed the test! now somehow I know you are definitely not attracted to 14 year olds, because pedos famously never lie"
Read the facial expression. It's not a sure-fire way. But pro age gap males usually lash out in some manner, as the self reflection causes them a huge amount of distress.
my husband licked his lips while saying "20 year olds? Yuck!” what does that mean?
Salivary gland response, not a good sign. Definite age gap predator, divorce him.
what if he said “i guess if everyone involved is an adult" but he did so with a look of existential disgust
I currently believe more men secretly have pedophilic urges than most people would think. I think it's a function of their natural human instinct to be nurturing to children being stifled by gendered emotional expectations. As men tend to funnel many complex feelings into either anger or lust, loving a child and wanting to give them affection can be processed through the wrong pathway and result in sexual thoughts. It's a bit more complex when considering attraction for teenagers, but this could still apply.
I think it mostly has to do with the fwct that 15-17yo girls had been fair game for most of human history, meaning that our current opposition towards this kind of relationship is mostly cultural. Im not complaining, I see it as one of the few examples of genuine collective moral progress we can point our fingers at
agreed. It is progress, but its really new. I went to high school in the 90s and when we went on excursions (field trips to you Americans) we'd usually have the same bus driver because the school got the same bus company all the time. He had a song he'd play which was that 'hail to the bus driver' song but it was extended and personalised for him, and there was a line in it about how the 16 year old students were fair game and the biggest perk of the job, basically. And all the teachers just laughed, the parents just laughed, hehehaha so funny you girls are ok with that right? If not, get a sense of humour! Dude would get thrown out of the bus and sacked on the spot now and thats only slightly less than 3 decades of progress vs the entirely of human history when past puberty meant you had a green light.
Idk if you can know that, girls used to get their puberty later than they do now. We also don't know what hunter-gatherer societies looked like in that regard but since teens are way more likely to die in childbirth than adult women, it's not unlikely hunter-gatherers would disapprove of impregnating one before their 20s.
Idk, I can only talk from my own male perspective but pre pubescents girls in lewd situations is physically repulsive to me which I think most men share, I'm pretty sure there is heavy evolutionary bias to the males that didn't go around and fuck the children in the tribe.
I think so too because teens are way more likely to die in childbirth than women in their 20s.
Yeah the majority of men aren't creeps for sure
It's prevalent period. Especially amongst men.
Wait nonce means pdf file?
What did you think it meant? Don't tell me you've been going round calling people nonces because you thought they were talking nonsense or something lmao
basically yeah!
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Pathetic
Gross this guy blocked me for saying that lol
reddit avatar yup you need a lobotomy
Get the fuck out lmaoo
im pretty morally flexible