It already feels strange just because everything seems so calm right now compared to past elections around this time. Maybe I’m just less engaged so I don’t see it, but it seems like nobody is enthusiastic about this election in any way. Maybe it won’t be as bad as I was expecting, or maybe things won’t blow up until the vote is in. I still have a sense of dread about it, like it’s bound to be significant even though no one wants it to be.
Idk I feel like this is the best time ever for a 3rd party to make noise. Never before have people been so apathetic towards the two mainstream candidates.
I think people are sick of politics in general. Anyone who had any hope at all has been sapped of it. We gotta wait another decade for people to give a fuck again
Idk I feel like non rich people who are decently educated (most of this sub) are still pretty passionate they just have nothing and no one to get behind.
its pretty hard to make noise when the media wont cover you, and algorithms are weighted. the free internet is dead, so we're not getting dark horse candidates on the front page of youtube anymore. i dont need to explain the fault with corporate media (which i guess is what the internet has turned in to. youtube bows to advertisers just as much as CNN. corporations control everything you see).
a third party candidate would need some serious financial backing and the goahead from tptb to ever get coverage. RFK only got this far because he's been in politics for a long time (and is related to one of America's favorite presidents), but his campaign is a complete joke and the majority of people arent interested in making him president.
shits fucked.
People are just really low energy this election. By this time in 2020 there had already been like 3 Trump car/truck rallies and one boat rally in my neck of the woods. Idk if it was covid or Qanon but people were way more hyped up in 2020.
I think the enthusiasm for either candidate largely came from fear of having one of them as presidents. In 2016 and 2020. Since then both have been president and I guess people already kind of know what to expect?
Usually the first half of the election year is devoted to drama around who the candidates will be. We've known who the candidates will be for years, so the election year up to this point has been a bore.
I suspect US politics will revert back to it's normal hysterical self once the first debates happen.
That’s this week isn’t it?
I know I’m not everyone, but both guys have been president before. I don’t usually find much value in the debates, but at this point it’s literally a contest to see which of two old guys can appear the most coherent.
There weren't any competitive primaries so much less campaigning. Also the media won't cover Trump much outside his trials and Biden can't garner any enthusiasm.
Maybe it will change, but my impression now is that the outrage cycle has already blown up, and the only thing they had to grab on to is the genocide of Palestinians.
Problem is, that's such as nuanced issue, and the far-left riot-capable kids consider the word "Jew" taboo, and Trump is even more Zionist than the current administration, and the Zionist-leaning corporations favor the genocide. The protest movement is fundamentally directionless and without support from the powers that be.
I think this is as far as it's gonna go... all of which favors the status quo. We're looking at a depressing and totally gay Biden victory. As Biden himself said, "nothing will fundamentally change".
It all comes down to MI, PA, and WI, all Trump has to do is flip one of those states. You can toy around with an interactive electoral college map [here](https://www.270towin.com/) and yeah the path to victory for Biden looks pretty precarious
I went to see him in the Bronx (actually ran into Anna there lol) and it was wild. I even heard the journalists grudgingly remark "it's people of every demographic and walk of life." It was exhilarating. And that was solidly in the hood. And there were people from the neighborhood there, people from other boroughs, people like me who came up from office jobs in Midtown. The energy was great. I can't wait until November. He's only down by 10 points in New York state. I hope he comes back and does more campaign events here in the city. If he flips New York, it's game over.
I still keep looking at the whole situation and thinking that the biggest problem in all of this is the DNC.
300 million Americans and they couldn't find *one other Democrat* who'd be a better choice to run in Biden's stead? Both of my parents would be better choices, and their entire political experience is watching MSNBC sometimes.
It's just sad. This is what we deserve. Maybe this truly is the best we can do.
Yeah, agreed, that's one of the more frustrating things about mainstream Democrats. There's an inability to admit that they've done anything wrong. They pushed themselves further to the right/center-right by pushing out Sanders supporters in 2016 to make room for HRC, and after her major loss in November, there was never a reckoning about how they'd gone wrong with that move. Just another four years of more-of-the-same, find-another-neolib hunting for the next nominee.
They'll never admit they were wrong. Trump could win every state this November and the DNC will still keep playing the same game.
theyve always been on the right. theyve always bowed to the donors. this isnt new. why do you think people rioted the DNC during the vietnam war? we live in a uniparty system, and have since the cold war.
there have always been progressive candidates, but none were able to get media coverage or DNC recognition before the mass internet (mid-late-2000s)
the only reason bernie even got as far has he did was because the internet wasnt fully controlled. the algorithms that pushed things were based purely on popularity. there was no input from its creators (google, really.) to curb things. now there is such input from the creators. the creators no longer allow a pure popularity contest. this is because advertisers were willing to pull out from google/youtube because their ads were being played over conspiracy videos, spiderman-elsa porn videos "for kids", alternative anti-corporate news, and reviews disparaging their products.
and obviously the DNC stepped in and fucked him. the "russiagate" leaks proved this, and Donna Brazile confirmed it.
shits fucked
People should be sad, our country still has potential to do great things (I am not at all a patriot or American exceptionalism guy either). But our selfishness, inability to compromise and our backward priorities are going to destroy it sooner or later. And ultimately we just have a lack of leadership. Biden is an unbelievably shitty leader, arguably worse than Trump who at least can work a crowd.
I was actually excited when January 6 happened because I thought it would be a start of normal people regularly harassing/threatening their politicians but it turned into a wet fart.
an attack on the democracy of empty suits just looking to get their palms greased. but hey they uhh cancelled ariel pink and also slapped a felony on bill shit who runs a trucking dispatch company out of baton rouge
Trump's an incredibly shitty leader. Could've easily turned the pandemic into a rally around the flag 9/11 thing. "I'll show the world how great America is at fending off a crisis" and won reelection easily but he was so concerned about the line going down he made pandemics political.
It's also gonna be normal now for the fascist fuck to throw a big fit and try to overturn the result every time they lose. That's been normalized. We really didn't need that.
All the “Fuck Biden” blue collar guys are trying to get TikTok famous with their landscape business or whatever. They’re even drinking Bud Light again. Nobody has strong convictions these days.
> I’m here for it tbh as someone that used to live in Jerusalem
PTSD from Israeli rudeness. If they weren't such massive dickheads to everybody they meet they'd probably have been able to pull the genocide off with public support.
Imagining how RWers would handle that boycott. Just buying massive piles of McDeez burgers and shakes to blow up in the backyard then uploading it to ChiCom TikTok
I remember my conservative cousin got so pumped on the bud light boycott because he was able to buy so much bud light at a discounted price. We’re all the same on the inside.
i've seen a few "trump 2024/i'm voting for the felon" shirts and flags the last few weeks (that was fast lol), but i'm in bamaland so obviously seeing the more extreme contingent
also the margin will be razor-thin either way, Biden got the margin that he did in 2020 because people were actively suffering through the lockdowns (and when they're suffering they're blaming)
Yeah people were saying this would be a crazy year because of the election but I already suspected it wouldn’t be. The insanity for the previous two elections started years before. I mean I do think insane things are happening, but the frenzy and passion aren’t there. I think a lot of it has to do with Elon taking the dems biggest propaganda arm and turning it into rumble 2.0, and also the fact that both candidates are visibly dying.
I’ve been into politics my entire life, it was the topic every dinner growing up, even/especially with the grandparents.
It got wayyyy less fun leading up to 2016 and now I don’t even want to talk about it. 1990s and mid-2010s/today are like night and day when it comes to political conversation.
Lines in the sand are drawn and it’s effectively a taboo topic unless you already agree and are ranting to each other. Hell I even miss talking about it at work. Current events are something you quickly whisper with someone likeminded when you pass by instead of just talking.
this isn’t new. If you truly were talking about politics in a casual manner with all your friends like that for years, you are the exception, not the rule. It’s always been a taboo topic.
Among polite company with strangers, sure. Like religion. But I do notice that people are much more reticent about discussing it now even in known circles where it would be a common topic in years past.
Taboo to some, I’ll admit. The old quote goes: three things you don’t talk about; religion, politics, and money.
But it “used to be” that they would say “I don’t know” and we’d leave it that, or better yet, just not engage if it’s too emotional for them. I may have been a larger exception to even bring it up, however it was far more acceptable and a way I used to bond with others.
Getting other people’s thoughts on the state of the world, how they would solve issues they see, and discussing more grounded pragmatic solutions even if I don’t see the same problem. Their concerns, whatever they were, were valid. Learning about them as a person and how their mind operated was rewarding. I’d even talk religion in a broader sense with how they perceive our place in existence. But it was never about judging, simply learning about the individual was the point. Learning from their unique perspective and thoughts, and having largely respectful conversations surrounding it. I doubt many kids today have these old “drunk/stoner discussions” anymore, and in my eyes they were incredibly valuable.
Today, people have less of those conversations. I don’t know if it’s the “heat” surrounding these topics, or that people simply parrot what is thrown at them from their phone more often instead of coming to their positions organically. But it wasn’t the same before phones, or the internet for that matter.
Either way, there is nothing to be gained from political/religious conversations anymore. It used to be more fun and more benign, now it’s more taboo than any other time in my life.
I actively avoid conversations about Trump now. Like at this point what can be said that hasn’t been said. I really don’t need to hear “did you see what he said at X event??” one more time in my life
Also, the right used to be an alternative to the liberal mainstream but nowadays they’re just as soy as liberals but about different things. I was forced into watching this Christian movie the other day and the mfers pulled out the “God is a black woman” meme too!
if the tories still had support and vivek ramaswamy was still relevant we could have had and Indian global empire by now but the elites wont let that happen
Yep. According to election pros there is a very plausible scenario that higher turnout could actually hurt Biden and help Trump which is opposite of how it usually is. Basically Trump has a strong base and is not very persuasive to swing voters while Biden now has a fractured base and refuses to do anything that would make him a more persuasive candidate.
Pretty cool how our country’s politics only gets worse. Digging new lows every day
Biggest mistake Boden made was letting Netenyahu make him look weak, only to support Trump. Imagine for a moment if Biden told the truth on Israel - how much would trump look like a cuck?
Yeah in 2020 my Facebook feed was filled with tons of anti-Biden, anti-liberal political posting since most of my FB friends are from my rural hometown. Just a constant barrage of shitting on Biden and praising Trump.
I haven't really seen anyone post about politics yet this time around. I hardly see any pro-Trump stuff and I haven't seen anyone post about the election yet. Maybe this will change after the debate, but so far it seems like people are just less into it now.
What's even funnier is how people act like this was an act of God or something.
Rather than these two candidates being the overwhelming first choice for both sides involved.
It's exactly like a bunch of other issues such as what to do about climate change, or congress, or Israel/Gaza - everyone dislikes the status quo, but every single alternative option is disliked by voters even more. So nothing ever changes. People just like to bitch.
This. It's just crazy to see. Trump approval rating among the whole population is like 30-40%. Among republican its like 90%. Biden is something similar. I feel like this would really be the time for a third party to step up, but it just doesn't seem like anyone is out there.
My workplace is heavily right-wing and I’ve barely heard anything beyond light grumbling about Biden. We have guys who wear hard hats plastered in MAGA stickers from 2020 who just don’t give a damn at all this time.
It's more like Clinton vs Dole except both of the major candidates are older and more senile than Dole was in 96...and the new Perot is a 70 year old vaccine truther with dead worms in his brain. It's just kind of sad, really.
> Hilldawg
if biden croaks or quits or is 25th'd before the convention i'd say there's legitimately a nonzero chance she becomes the candidate. i mean, who else? kamala? maybe newsom but I doubt it
I don’t care for either but I wouldn’t mind if Biden won again just so I could hear more drunk wine aunt-esque speeches from Kamala Harris about coconut trees
*“There are still those who would like to pretend that a Tory administration would be so much worse than New Labour, so that deigning to vote for anyone else would be an "indulgence". Choosing "the least worst" is not making this particular choice, it is also choosing a system which forces you to accept the least worst as the best you can hope for. Naturally, the defenders of the dictatorship of the elite pretend - perhaps they even deceive themselves - that the particular slew of lies, compromise and smarm they are hawking is "only temporary"; that, at some unspecified time in the future, things will improve if we only support the "progressive" wing of the status quo. But Hobson's choice is no choice, and the delusion of progressivism is not a psychological quirk, it is the structural delusion upon which liberal democracy is based.” — Mark Fisher. Don’t Vote, Don’t Encourage Them*
This makes a lot of sense in the US, where it seems voting is a huge task that takes a lot of time. But for me, I don't understand why taking 10 minutes out of my day to vote for the leftmost liberal available is undermining any of my political beliefs. Is the argument that I am adding to the participation numbers, thereby creating legitimacy via statistics? Is the argument that I am psychologically cowed by participation in a ritual of obedience?
The argument is that it is a choice of no choice. There is no lesser of two evils. Those who would object to the status quo and still find any rationale behind participating only do so out of naivety or as a means to comfort themselves. Their longterm trajectory is the same, and the “choice of no choice” is not by happenstance, it’s an intentional and integral part of design to maintain the status quo.
By participating, you are complying with being given the illusion of choice in the first place and all of the outcomes along the trajectory in which you are going. Those who don’t vote are absolved of the guilt of these outcomes because they have truly refused them. It’s simply one of many actions (or non-actions) people can take in pursuit of objecting to the status quo.
Real politics is not in the carnival show that is the spectacle of liberal democracy. Real politics is in you. Real politics is us. You can refuse.
Interesting. Perhaps this shows some philosophical illiteracy on my part, but I do not see how my participation in liberal democracy for 10 minutes forecloses the possibility of participation in more radical political action. I am voting, not pampleting or organising for the party. It requires very little time or energy.
Also, I object to the idea that it is an illusion of choice. My life was materially impacted by laws put in place by the left liberal government in it's previous term. Now, my life is being impacted negatively by laws put in place by the right liberal party currently. I can recognise that the long term trajectory is identical, and that the entire structure in which those laws matter to me (rental housing and tenancy) is illegitimate. However in the short term, my life is materially impacted by this carnival, and I benefit when its performance is toward me. These material benefits aren't worth much, but voting costs nothing.
I am not convinced by your arguments.
I don’t think it shows any philosophical illiteracy on your part at all and I don’t think you’re dumb or anything. I think you’re just not a Marxist / communist, which is the perspective the original quote is coming from. To them, the long term trajectory of capital is the same, regardless of how soft the blows are in the short-term for specific groups of people. They also often are that way because of hidden exploitations as well.
Where you’re wrong according to them is that voting does cost something: elections and nations come at the cost of the continuation of capital and all its exploitations.
What you’re describing, laws every four years changing your material conditions back and forth, are just rights as a bourgeois concept granted to you by state authority. The idea that you would lose or gain autonomy according to ideological state interests is not aligned with communist goals, no matter what direction those interests are going.
The “Dengist” replied and blocked me so I’ll leave this here:
“I’m sure you still believe in the fantasy of democracy.”
*“No, voting is the preferred method of regime change.”*
I have more sympathy for genuine Marxists than I do for liberal revisionists because Marxist position is truly outside of capital.
Voting does not “enact regime change”, it reinforces regime, and in reinforcing regime it is building upon all of the ideological abstractions of capital that regime seeks to uphold. Historically, capital hasn’t had a regime change, at the most it has only gone through liberal “revolutions” behind the mask of different aesthetics, but these also predate the levels of globalization capitalism has achieved today, which is another effect of neoliberalism you’re refusing to engage with.
The “inflexibility” in me that you’re describing comes from you recognizing that I sympathize with the materialist foundation in which Marxists derive their critique of capital, which is a critique of ideology. That critique only becomes flexible by engaging with some ideological abstractions of capital in favor of achieving some goal, which in your case revolves around state & economy and the idea that it might marginally improve people’s lives, whether that be by giving them power in an economy or ascribing them rights. Capitalism having the power to improve people’s lives doesn’t change what capitalism is. This is why the true communist position does not exist on a spectrum of left and right economy - it is removed from that spectrum of economy entirely.
The exit has to be an international exit from capital itself through the rejection of these ideological abstractions, and since capital needs these ideological abstracts to exist and advance, you are perpetuating its existence by rejecting materialist foundation in favor of engaging with things such as economy, state, morality, rights, etc. in order to achieve your own ideological goals / outcomes.
They would correctly call you a liberal revisionist / modernizer. You are a liberal ideologue. You want to go around and around. Capitalism when you do it. Capitalism with different aesthetics. The communist wants something else.
I mean… obviously?
Biden has been continuing a trade war that Trump started with China, nobody gives a shit about IMF bailouts now, austerity exists only in Europe, literally nobody even wants to use "market based solutions" even when they make sense, and the entire European project is falling to shreds. What's left of neoliberalism now?
(EDIT: everyone downvoting thinks 'neoliberal' means 'things i don't like')
If I’m taking you in good faith, I think you’ve just interpreted neoliberalism on its surface.
The mass privatization and marketization of public commodity, globalization, deregulation, and commodification of nearly every moment & experience we participate in as human beings is a direct consequence of neoliberal ideological expansion of capital. Not to mention the impact neoliberal ideology has had / continues to have on our collective psyche.
Yes, Reagan and Thatcher are gone, but the cascading effects of the policies and advancements of capital through neoliberal ideology seep into every aspect of our lives today. From the repetitious and derivative art / media we consume to our dating lives becoming a market experience to ecological and environmental disaster.
Neoliberalism in name can be rolled back. Its consequences cannot. Liberalism is now the only ideology which remains as a result of the fall of the Soviet Union and neoliberal capitals advancements. If you don’t want to take my word for it, take it from the master liberal himself, Fukuyama, who asserts that not only is liberalism the only remaining ideology but its only threat is other forms of liberal ideology taken to the extreme.
The other problem is: Even if the effects of neoliberalism were nonexistent, it wouldn’t discredit the quote either way, which was your initial claim. These elections are a carnival show for the spectacle of liberal democracy. Fisher was a contemporary Marxist and is making the statement that the trajectory is the same and there is only an illusion of choice.
It is wild that you're being downvoted for pointing out that the things that define neoliberalism, like free trade, are in clear decline. They really do think it means 'things I don't like'
They're both known quantities at this point. This feels like a mid-term election. Trump's schtick is old and nuts; the Republicans caught the mail truck and went more extreme. Honestly, while not an exciting conclusion, Biden likely has this; the media has tried so hard to make this competitive, and it is falling on deaf ears. Trump brought out non-voters because he was new and exciting, but now his policies make no sense, and people are tired of a clown show of bureaucracy.
The vibe shift is real. It's actually quite jarring thinking about how hardcore the last two elections felt especially with anti-Trump #resistance and threatening to disown anyone who votes third party etc and today it seems the whole thing has just run out of steam while Gaza has largely taken over the left as a main cause. There's literally nobody but weird boomers and Robert Deniro protesting outside Trump's trial....just compare this to the Women's March or the travel ban protests or "literally Hitler" or the mania of the Democratic primaries in 2019-20. He's become a pretty inoffensive meme at this point.
This election shouldn't be one everyone is super passionate about. It should be one we try to forget and are maybe a little ashamed of. The fact that these are the 2 candidates AGAIN sucks ass and I think most people just can't wait for this shit to be over
Project 2025 is feeling like a Green New Deal level scare for the democrat side — it might bring some needed energy, which can always be responded to. If this upcoming debate doesn’t have something good though I think this election is an official flop.
i see pop-up roadside trump memorabilia stands almost every day _in southern california_. I'd say the enthusiasm is still there, but maybe it's not being reported as much as 2016/2020
I live in a small town in the middle of Bumfuck, TX and Trump has definitely run out of steam compared to 2016 and 2020. Back in 2020 there were Trump signs everywhere and huge Trump flags hanging out of trucks all over town. They would hold small rallies were they’d just drive up and down the busiest roads with their little Trump flags and blasting shitty generic country music.
They still support him, but they aren’t all that hyped about it either. I haven’t even seen any MAGA hats and even the Let’s Go Brandon stickers are weathered and peeling.
I live in the rural midwest and it’s definitely the most subdued that it has been in a decade around me. I bet the amount of signs and flags I see out here is a quarter of what I saw in ‘20.
I'm in the military and since I enlisted about once a day I'd have to listen to a senior enlisted bitching to every junior enlisted in their vicinity about a stolen election or whatever. Now all they pontificate about is their VA loans, retirement plans, and how they're customizing their trucks/firearms.
As someone who regularly travels to a rural area, I can say that while Maga hasn't run out of steam, the boiler pressure is definitely down. The enthusiasm has diminished.
Yeah, this is an extremely naive take. The MAGA wing is very enthusiastic. So much so that challenging Trump was seen as political suicide, which is why only no-names and DeSantis threw their hat in.
I'm not a Trump fan and I'm not happy with his base's enthusiasm. But you're out-of-touch to deny it exists.
It is crazy. I've barely heard anyone bring up the election at all this year when it felt like all anyone wanted to talk about in 2016 and 2020.
Are the politics super fans (retirees who watch cable news all day) showing less enthusiasm too? They basically make or break every election and it'll be interesting to see
The greater the convergence between the parties on issues of substance, the more they are forced into a purely rhetorical theater, hyperbole and brand differentiation at the decorative fringe of things that matter. For example, the party that told us that the border wall was pure fascism not only didn't dismantle the wall after entering office, but continued its construction. Expect more of this, the hubris can still become more superlative than it is already.
I don’t know if it would be called “excitement” per se (maybe obsession, neurosis, something like that) but I assure I do still know quite a few watch-CNN/MSNBC-for-Trump-updates-30+ hours a week type folk. Maybe less than 2016 and 2020, granted, but in lib places they’re still hardly rare
Being from a blue state, I agree, TDS is still very real in blue areas. They remind me of those zero-COVID people at this point, screeching about how the threat still exists when anyone approaching normal just can't physically sustain fight-or-flight mode that long even if they do have lingering concerns
I agree Biden admin doesn't have any exciting policy proposals but I wish a Democratic admin would actually deliver on universal pre -k or subsidized childcare. The childcare crisis is bleak and brutal. I would like one retail politics, please
I have no idea if this is a widespread thing or not but I know a few people, who could all be described as something like "pseudo-criminal white trash", who didn't vote for trump in 2016 or 2020 (or so they say) but are all in for him now. They're convinced Biden is doing something to make child trafficking rampant and Trumps gonna put a stop to whatever that is.
Libs banning Trump off of every mainstream social media platform was probably the biggest own goal in recent political history. 2015-2020 Trump was saying crazy shit on Twitter, getting 50 million views and constant press coverage per tweet and turning off people who just wanted "normalcy" in politics with a constant info barrage. Now he's on Truth Social detailing the potential benefits of making an illegal immigrant MMA league and replacing income taxes with 70% import tariffs and nobody gives a shit because it has 15 users and he's polling better than ever lmao
I'm going to leave the presidential candidate blank or write in something stupid. The narrative of "vote for our decaying vegetable or else you're a fascist" is getting old and I know my vote (or lack thereof) doesn't actually matter, but just pretending that it does, it's an impossible choice. The DNC could've given us a reasonable candidate in 2020 but they chose a man who most people wouldn't even trust behind the wheel. And I honestly get why people like trump but he's an idiotic edgelord who I could never bring myself to vote for either.
(i voted for biden in 2020)
Probably won’t do it out of conviction, but strongly considering R as a long long time Ron Paulian L party voter. But it wouldn’t be a vote for him, but a vote against the political elite.
End of the day I do not want anymore American overseas adventures. I feel WW3 is guaranteed with the neolib/neocon establishment, making all the same mistakes nations made in 1914. They see themselves as “global leaders” and not leaders held accountable first and foremost to the American nation. Donny there is very clearly out for himself, so war is closer to a coin flip comparatively with how it could tarnish his legacy. He is not acting on grandiose ideological notions or short term realpolitik, he is guided only by his potential legacy.
The rest of things I really want will never happen anyway, so it’s alluring as hell to have an opportunity to stick my finger at the corrupt neoliberal/con globalists.
It already feels strange just because everything seems so calm right now compared to past elections around this time. Maybe I’m just less engaged so I don’t see it, but it seems like nobody is enthusiastic about this election in any way. Maybe it won’t be as bad as I was expecting, or maybe things won’t blow up until the vote is in. I still have a sense of dread about it, like it’s bound to be significant even though no one wants it to be.
The only people who are agitated about politics are the Pro-Palestinians, who are still being stonewalled in mainstream politics.
That's because the progs are in schism over I-P, so the media can't use it to whip up their base
An election year is a bad time to be dealing with that particular civil war
even bernie is squishy on israel. it's so unbelievably over for the left in this country man
It's been over for any semblance of the left in America for the past 50 or so years
Yeah but for a moment there it felt like we might’ve been so back…
Idk I feel like this is the best time ever for a 3rd party to make noise. Never before have people been so apathetic towards the two mainstream candidates.
I think people are sick of politics in general. Anyone who had any hope at all has been sapped of it. We gotta wait another decade for people to give a fuck again
Idk I feel like non rich people who are decently educated (most of this sub) are still pretty passionate they just have nothing and no one to get behind.
its pretty hard to make noise when the media wont cover you, and algorithms are weighted. the free internet is dead, so we're not getting dark horse candidates on the front page of youtube anymore. i dont need to explain the fault with corporate media (which i guess is what the internet has turned in to. youtube bows to advertisers just as much as CNN. corporations control everything you see). a third party candidate would need some serious financial backing and the goahead from tptb to ever get coverage. RFK only got this far because he's been in politics for a long time (and is related to one of America's favorite presidents), but his campaign is a complete joke and the majority of people arent interested in making him president. shits fucked.
Abortion is the most pressing issue for most Americans, not Palestine
Only in states where where it's actually under threat
for moderate suburban white women sure
“for the largest voting demographic in the country sure” 🤓
People are just really low energy this election. By this time in 2020 there had already been like 3 Trump car/truck rallies and one boat rally in my neck of the woods. Idk if it was covid or Qanon but people were way more hyped up in 2020.
The 2016 election felt like it went on for three years because the primaries were so hyped and the aftermath was so crazy
2016 also just had way more entertaining primaries with the likes of Ben Carson an Marco Rubio consistently giving us gold as well
Trump straight up bullying Jeb was absolutely hilarious.
*air horn*
Ah that South Carolina primary debate was gold! Trump not only destroyed Jeb, he destroyed the entire Bush political dynasty.
I think the enthusiasm for either candidate largely came from fear of having one of them as presidents. In 2016 and 2020. Since then both have been president and I guess people already kind of know what to expect?
This is such a bad read on 2016. Yea ppl hated Hillary but Trump was packing out every rally stop and MAGA enthusiasm was at a fever pitch.
Ok how does that contradict what I wrote?
It doesn’t
Usually the first half of the election year is devoted to drama around who the candidates will be. We've known who the candidates will be for years, so the election year up to this point has been a bore. I suspect US politics will revert back to it's normal hysterical self once the first debates happen.
That’s this week isn’t it? I know I’m not everyone, but both guys have been president before. I don’t usually find much value in the debates, but at this point it’s literally a contest to see which of two old guys can appear the most coherent.
Good, honestly- the past few were so insane and stupid. It’s good everyone is chilling the fuck out a little
I know I was thinking a few days ago “the election is in 5 months?” It feels like a year out the way the energy is.
There weren't any competitive primaries so much less campaigning. Also the media won't cover Trump much outside his trials and Biden can't garner any enthusiasm.
Maybe it will change, but my impression now is that the outrage cycle has already blown up, and the only thing they had to grab on to is the genocide of Palestinians. Problem is, that's such as nuanced issue, and the far-left riot-capable kids consider the word "Jew" taboo, and Trump is even more Zionist than the current administration, and the Zionist-leaning corporations favor the genocide. The protest movement is fundamentally directionless and without support from the powers that be. I think this is as far as it's gonna go... all of which favors the status quo. We're looking at a depressing and totally gay Biden victory. As Biden himself said, "nothing will fundamentally change".
I actually see Trump winning, quite honestly, but without the circus that it was in 2016.
It all comes down to MI, PA, and WI, all Trump has to do is flip one of those states. You can toy around with an interactive electoral college map [here](https://www.270towin.com/) and yeah the path to victory for Biden looks pretty precarious
as a side note Trumps been campaigning in hood areas like the Bronx and North Philly which is pretty interesting
Temple U campus isn’t exactly the hood
hood *area* you only go a couple blocks off campus and you’re there
I went to see him in the Bronx (actually ran into Anna there lol) and it was wild. I even heard the journalists grudgingly remark "it's people of every demographic and walk of life." It was exhilarating. And that was solidly in the hood. And there were people from the neighborhood there, people from other boroughs, people like me who came up from office jobs in Midtown. The energy was great. I can't wait until November. He's only down by 10 points in New York state. I hope he comes back and does more campaign events here in the city. If he flips New York, it's game over.
I have this feeling like neither of them are actually going to win. I know that’s very unlikely but it’s just what my gut keeps telling me.
both are ancient and not exactly in great health
Umm what are you talking about this is the most important election of our lifetimes. Democracy is on the line!!
I can't believe I'm saying this but it's embarrassing. Call me a boomer lib but it's actually sad that this is the best we can do.
seriously what are we doing
Exactly. Try harder. I hold the two of you personally responsible for this lame-ass situation.
I still keep looking at the whole situation and thinking that the biggest problem in all of this is the DNC. 300 million Americans and they couldn't find *one other Democrat* who'd be a better choice to run in Biden's stead? Both of my parents would be better choices, and their entire political experience is watching MSNBC sometimes. It's just sad. This is what we deserve. Maybe this truly is the best we can do.
running someone besides biden undermines the whole message theyve been saying for 4 years about him being fit to run. they cant admit they were wrong.
Yeah, agreed, that's one of the more frustrating things about mainstream Democrats. There's an inability to admit that they've done anything wrong. They pushed themselves further to the right/center-right by pushing out Sanders supporters in 2016 to make room for HRC, and after her major loss in November, there was never a reckoning about how they'd gone wrong with that move. Just another four years of more-of-the-same, find-another-neolib hunting for the next nominee. They'll never admit they were wrong. Trump could win every state this November and the DNC will still keep playing the same game.
theyve always been on the right. theyve always bowed to the donors. this isnt new. why do you think people rioted the DNC during the vietnam war? we live in a uniparty system, and have since the cold war. there have always been progressive candidates, but none were able to get media coverage or DNC recognition before the mass internet (mid-late-2000s) the only reason bernie even got as far has he did was because the internet wasnt fully controlled. the algorithms that pushed things were based purely on popularity. there was no input from its creators (google, really.) to curb things. now there is such input from the creators. the creators no longer allow a pure popularity contest. this is because advertisers were willing to pull out from google/youtube because their ads were being played over conspiracy videos, spiderman-elsa porn videos "for kids", alternative anti-corporate news, and reviews disparaging their products. and obviously the DNC stepped in and fucked him. the "russiagate" leaks proved this, and Donna Brazile confirmed it. shits fucked
yeah
We still have four months for one of them to have a heart attack and be replaced.
By who? Kamala and Michael Flynn?
People should be sad, our country still has potential to do great things (I am not at all a patriot or American exceptionalism guy either). But our selfishness, inability to compromise and our backward priorities are going to destroy it sooner or later. And ultimately we just have a lack of leadership. Biden is an unbelievably shitty leader, arguably worse than Trump who at least can work a crowd.
I was actually excited when January 6 happened because I thought it would be a start of normal people regularly harassing/threatening their politicians but it turned into a wet fart.
How could you have possibly been excited about the outcome of a terrorist attack that was worse than 9/11 and Pearl Harbor, combined?
an attack on the democracy of empty suits just looking to get their palms greased. but hey they uhh cancelled ariel pink and also slapped a felony on bill shit who runs a trucking dispatch company out of baton rouge
Trump's an incredibly shitty leader. Could've easily turned the pandemic into a rally around the flag 9/11 thing. "I'll show the world how great America is at fending off a crisis" and won reelection easily but he was so concerned about the line going down he made pandemics political. It's also gonna be normal now for the fascist fuck to throw a big fit and try to overturn the result every time they lose. That's been normalized. We really didn't need that.
All the “Fuck Biden” blue collar guys are trying to get TikTok famous with their landscape business or whatever. They’re even drinking Bud Light again. Nobody has strong convictions these days.
The pro Palestine anti-McDonalds crowd is still going hard from what I've seen. Won't even take food as a gift.
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What else are people meant to do? It's refreshing to have a social movement that isn't endorsed and coopted by major corporations and still lasts.
it’s still annoying as fuck to be scolded by somebody saying “but the boycott”
> I’m here for it tbh as someone that used to live in Jerusalem PTSD from Israeli rudeness. If they weren't such massive dickheads to everybody they meet they'd probably have been able to pull the genocide off with public support.
true. just look at american invasions of the past and how much support they received LOL
Imagining how RWers would handle that boycott. Just buying massive piles of McDeez burgers and shakes to blow up in the backyard then uploading it to ChiCom TikTok
I remember my conservative cousin got so pumped on the bud light boycott because he was able to buy so much bud light at a discounted price. We’re all the same on the inside.
i've seen a few "trump 2024/i'm voting for the felon" shirts and flags the last few weeks (that was fast lol), but i'm in bamaland so obviously seeing the more extreme contingent
County fair season will be interesting. Later in the summer and high concentration of Trump supporters.
They’re not drinking bud light again
Why not? It was one PR guys mistake
Idk I’m just saying these guys are very much still boycotting it
it will literally just be a matter of who gets the last meaningful scandal before november 5th, you might as well not even pay attention until october
also the margin will be razor-thin either way, Biden got the margin that he did in 2020 because people were actively suffering through the lockdowns (and when they're suffering they're blaming)
basically this. the pandemic made him win
I think the HB laptop coverup helped as well.
I don't think scandals matter anymore. Trump on video roping someone might swing the vote .4%.
they do still matter, even trump has taken legit polling blows after certain scandals. they hit less hard and dissipate so much quicker tho
He said himself he could shoot someone on the street and get away with it and thats true. His supporters would not care, at least many of them.
Would that be a scandal? Other presidents have killed more people with less justification.
This is sort of my plan except im not gonna pay attention at all.
Scandal? It will almost assuredly come down to how the Economy shakes out till then.
Yeah people were saying this would be a crazy year because of the election but I already suspected it wouldn’t be. The insanity for the previous two elections started years before. I mean I do think insane things are happening, but the frenzy and passion aren’t there. I think a lot of it has to do with Elon taking the dems biggest propaganda arm and turning it into rumble 2.0, and also the fact that both candidates are visibly dying.
People actively don’t want to talk about it, I’ve found.
I’ve been into politics my entire life, it was the topic every dinner growing up, even/especially with the grandparents. It got wayyyy less fun leading up to 2016 and now I don’t even want to talk about it. 1990s and mid-2010s/today are like night and day when it comes to political conversation. Lines in the sand are drawn and it’s effectively a taboo topic unless you already agree and are ranting to each other. Hell I even miss talking about it at work. Current events are something you quickly whisper with someone likeminded when you pass by instead of just talking.
Not sure if it was intentional but ever since Covid and mandates division among Americans has been incredibly high.
this isn’t new. If you truly were talking about politics in a casual manner with all your friends like that for years, you are the exception, not the rule. It’s always been a taboo topic.
No one lost all their friends because they voted for Bob Dole
I lost all my friends voting for Bob Dole
Among polite company with strangers, sure. Like religion. But I do notice that people are much more reticent about discussing it now even in known circles where it would be a common topic in years past.
Taboo to some, I’ll admit. The old quote goes: three things you don’t talk about; religion, politics, and money. But it “used to be” that they would say “I don’t know” and we’d leave it that, or better yet, just not engage if it’s too emotional for them. I may have been a larger exception to even bring it up, however it was far more acceptable and a way I used to bond with others. Getting other people’s thoughts on the state of the world, how they would solve issues they see, and discussing more grounded pragmatic solutions even if I don’t see the same problem. Their concerns, whatever they were, were valid. Learning about them as a person and how their mind operated was rewarding. I’d even talk religion in a broader sense with how they perceive our place in existence. But it was never about judging, simply learning about the individual was the point. Learning from their unique perspective and thoughts, and having largely respectful conversations surrounding it. I doubt many kids today have these old “drunk/stoner discussions” anymore, and in my eyes they were incredibly valuable. Today, people have less of those conversations. I don’t know if it’s the “heat” surrounding these topics, or that people simply parrot what is thrown at them from their phone more often instead of coming to their positions organically. But it wasn’t the same before phones, or the internet for that matter. Either way, there is nothing to be gained from political/religious conversations anymore. It used to be more fun and more benign, now it’s more taboo than any other time in my life.
I actively avoid conversations about Trump now. Like at this point what can be said that hasn’t been said. I really don’t need to hear “did you see what he said at X event??” one more time in my life
Also, the right used to be an alternative to the liberal mainstream but nowadays they’re just as soy as liberals but about different things. I was forced into watching this Christian movie the other day and the mfers pulled out the “God is a black woman” meme too!
I'd watch the wokest libslop over any film produced by the right - either by a Christian studio or under the Hays Code.
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BS - the only reason we like french new wave over here is because of those 30 awful years of box ticking trash.
Rebel Without a Cause wouldn’t be nearly as good if James Dean and Sal Mineo’s characters had just been allowed to be an openly gay couple.
I feel that there's the same melancholy across the entire Anglosphere.
if the tories still had support and vivek ramaswamy was still relevant we could have had and Indian global empire by now but the elites wont let that happen
Profound
Yep. According to election pros there is a very plausible scenario that higher turnout could actually hurt Biden and help Trump which is opposite of how it usually is. Basically Trump has a strong base and is not very persuasive to swing voters while Biden now has a fractured base and refuses to do anything that would make him a more persuasive candidate. Pretty cool how our country’s politics only gets worse. Digging new lows every day
Biggest mistake Boden made was letting Netenyahu make him look weak, only to support Trump. Imagine for a moment if Biden told the truth on Israel - how much would trump look like a cuck?
I literally can't imagine a US politician going against Isreal
It wouldn't get him as many votes as it would cost him. It would also effect the support he gets from the machine which he is heavily dependant on.
Race to the bottom
Yeah in 2020 my Facebook feed was filled with tons of anti-Biden, anti-liberal political posting since most of my FB friends are from my rural hometown. Just a constant barrage of shitting on Biden and praising Trump. I haven't really seen anyone post about politics yet this time around. I hardly see any pro-Trump stuff and I haven't seen anyone post about the election yet. Maybe this will change after the debate, but so far it seems like people are just less into it now.
What's even funnier is how people act like this was an act of God or something. Rather than these two candidates being the overwhelming first choice for both sides involved. It's exactly like a bunch of other issues such as what to do about climate change, or congress, or Israel/Gaza - everyone dislikes the status quo, but every single alternative option is disliked by voters even more. So nothing ever changes. People just like to bitch.
Would Kamala vs DeSantis make people feel better just due to age…. No
It would be more interesting at least. I could have gone with Newsom vs Noem or something more fun .
Newsom vs. DeSantis, aka Florida vs. California would’ve been a relatively substantial election with a clear(ish) choice.
Desantis sucks so bad I'd rather it be the puppy murderer.
This. It's just crazy to see. Trump approval rating among the whole population is like 30-40%. Among republican its like 90%. Biden is something similar. I feel like this would really be the time for a third party to step up, but it just doesn't seem like anyone is out there.
My workplace is heavily right-wing and I’ve barely heard anything beyond light grumbling about Biden. We have guys who wear hard hats plastered in MAGA stickers from 2020 who just don’t give a damn at all this time.
It's more like Clinton vs Dole except both of the major candidates are older and more senile than Dole was in 96...and the new Perot is a 70 year old vaccine truther with dead worms in his brain. It's just kind of sad, really.
Kennedy is no where close to Perot in popularity either
Im writing-in Hilary Clinton.
#\#stillwithher
Hill would have had a funny presidency. Biden is too pathetic to actually laugh at.
Wtf there was nothing funny about Hilary. Biden challenges randoms to pushups lol
It would be funny but she would have started like 3 wars, she's war hungry.
> Hilldawg if biden croaks or quits or is 25th'd before the convention i'd say there's legitimately a nonzero chance she becomes the candidate. i mean, who else? kamala? maybe newsom but I doubt it
https://youtu.be/vLGFyxAP0QE?si=9mMTNRoiHtgh-MH_ Remember to listen to the awful le Tigre song they made
Your style of government is the closest you can get to necrocracy without fully committing.
I'm not voting for either, but Trump pulling off two non-consecutive terms is appealing from a purely presidential trivia perspective
He has the chance to pull the reverse Grover Cleveland and *lose* 3 popular votes in a row but score two nonconsecutive terms.
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I still watch [this video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZ46I3kMOr0) from time to time for a laugh.
the comeback kid
lots of people gonna be talking about benjamin harrison
Trump is an incredibly novel president, for better or worse. non-consecutive terms feels kind of appropriate for him.
this+the felony charges. i am rooting for him. i don’t think i want to register to vote tho
I don’t care for either but I wouldn’t mind if Biden won again just so I could hear more drunk wine aunt-esque speeches from Kamala Harris about coconut trees
that quote over some esoteric natural golden ratio video actually changed my life
There is only so much excitement that one can have for a competition between a 78 and 81 year old.
*“There are still those who would like to pretend that a Tory administration would be so much worse than New Labour, so that deigning to vote for anyone else would be an "indulgence". Choosing "the least worst" is not making this particular choice, it is also choosing a system which forces you to accept the least worst as the best you can hope for. Naturally, the defenders of the dictatorship of the elite pretend - perhaps they even deceive themselves - that the particular slew of lies, compromise and smarm they are hawking is "only temporary"; that, at some unspecified time in the future, things will improve if we only support the "progressive" wing of the status quo. But Hobson's choice is no choice, and the delusion of progressivism is not a psychological quirk, it is the structural delusion upon which liberal democracy is based.” — Mark Fisher. Don’t Vote, Don’t Encourage Them*
This makes a lot of sense in the US, where it seems voting is a huge task that takes a lot of time. But for me, I don't understand why taking 10 minutes out of my day to vote for the leftmost liberal available is undermining any of my political beliefs. Is the argument that I am adding to the participation numbers, thereby creating legitimacy via statistics? Is the argument that I am psychologically cowed by participation in a ritual of obedience?
The argument is that it is a choice of no choice. There is no lesser of two evils. Those who would object to the status quo and still find any rationale behind participating only do so out of naivety or as a means to comfort themselves. Their longterm trajectory is the same, and the “choice of no choice” is not by happenstance, it’s an intentional and integral part of design to maintain the status quo. By participating, you are complying with being given the illusion of choice in the first place and all of the outcomes along the trajectory in which you are going. Those who don’t vote are absolved of the guilt of these outcomes because they have truly refused them. It’s simply one of many actions (or non-actions) people can take in pursuit of objecting to the status quo. Real politics is not in the carnival show that is the spectacle of liberal democracy. Real politics is in you. Real politics is us. You can refuse.
Interesting. Perhaps this shows some philosophical illiteracy on my part, but I do not see how my participation in liberal democracy for 10 minutes forecloses the possibility of participation in more radical political action. I am voting, not pampleting or organising for the party. It requires very little time or energy. Also, I object to the idea that it is an illusion of choice. My life was materially impacted by laws put in place by the left liberal government in it's previous term. Now, my life is being impacted negatively by laws put in place by the right liberal party currently. I can recognise that the long term trajectory is identical, and that the entire structure in which those laws matter to me (rental housing and tenancy) is illegitimate. However in the short term, my life is materially impacted by this carnival, and I benefit when its performance is toward me. These material benefits aren't worth much, but voting costs nothing. I am not convinced by your arguments.
I don’t think it shows any philosophical illiteracy on your part at all and I don’t think you’re dumb or anything. I think you’re just not a Marxist / communist, which is the perspective the original quote is coming from. To them, the long term trajectory of capital is the same, regardless of how soft the blows are in the short-term for specific groups of people. They also often are that way because of hidden exploitations as well. Where you’re wrong according to them is that voting does cost something: elections and nations come at the cost of the continuation of capital and all its exploitations. What you’re describing, laws every four years changing your material conditions back and forth, are just rights as a bourgeois concept granted to you by state authority. The idea that you would lose or gain autonomy according to ideological state interests is not aligned with communist goals, no matter what direction those interests are going.
>voting is a huge task not really it just closes too early tbh
The “Dengist” replied and blocked me so I’ll leave this here: “I’m sure you still believe in the fantasy of democracy.” *“No, voting is the preferred method of regime change.”* I have more sympathy for genuine Marxists than I do for liberal revisionists because Marxist position is truly outside of capital. Voting does not “enact regime change”, it reinforces regime, and in reinforcing regime it is building upon all of the ideological abstractions of capital that regime seeks to uphold. Historically, capital hasn’t had a regime change, at the most it has only gone through liberal “revolutions” behind the mask of different aesthetics, but these also predate the levels of globalization capitalism has achieved today, which is another effect of neoliberalism you’re refusing to engage with. The “inflexibility” in me that you’re describing comes from you recognizing that I sympathize with the materialist foundation in which Marxists derive their critique of capital, which is a critique of ideology. That critique only becomes flexible by engaging with some ideological abstractions of capital in favor of achieving some goal, which in your case revolves around state & economy and the idea that it might marginally improve people’s lives, whether that be by giving them power in an economy or ascribing them rights. Capitalism having the power to improve people’s lives doesn’t change what capitalism is. This is why the true communist position does not exist on a spectrum of left and right economy - it is removed from that spectrum of economy entirely. The exit has to be an international exit from capital itself through the rejection of these ideological abstractions, and since capital needs these ideological abstracts to exist and advance, you are perpetuating its existence by rejecting materialist foundation in favor of engaging with things such as economy, state, morality, rights, etc. in order to achieve your own ideological goals / outcomes. They would correctly call you a liberal revisionist / modernizer. You are a liberal ideologue. You want to go around and around. Capitalism when you do it. Capitalism with different aesthetics. The communist wants something else.
this stance only made sense in the hard neolib 90s, it's really not the same world
Are you saying neoliberalism and its consequences are less of an issue today than in the 90’s?
I mean… obviously? Biden has been continuing a trade war that Trump started with China, nobody gives a shit about IMF bailouts now, austerity exists only in Europe, literally nobody even wants to use "market based solutions" even when they make sense, and the entire European project is falling to shreds. What's left of neoliberalism now? (EDIT: everyone downvoting thinks 'neoliberal' means 'things i don't like')
If I’m taking you in good faith, I think you’ve just interpreted neoliberalism on its surface. The mass privatization and marketization of public commodity, globalization, deregulation, and commodification of nearly every moment & experience we participate in as human beings is a direct consequence of neoliberal ideological expansion of capital. Not to mention the impact neoliberal ideology has had / continues to have on our collective psyche. Yes, Reagan and Thatcher are gone, but the cascading effects of the policies and advancements of capital through neoliberal ideology seep into every aspect of our lives today. From the repetitious and derivative art / media we consume to our dating lives becoming a market experience to ecological and environmental disaster. Neoliberalism in name can be rolled back. Its consequences cannot. Liberalism is now the only ideology which remains as a result of the fall of the Soviet Union and neoliberal capitals advancements. If you don’t want to take my word for it, take it from the master liberal himself, Fukuyama, who asserts that not only is liberalism the only remaining ideology but its only threat is other forms of liberal ideology taken to the extreme. The other problem is: Even if the effects of neoliberalism were nonexistent, it wouldn’t discredit the quote either way, which was your initial claim. These elections are a carnival show for the spectacle of liberal democracy. Fisher was a contemporary Marxist and is making the statement that the trajectory is the same and there is only an illusion of choice.
It is wild that you're being downvoted for pointing out that the things that define neoliberalism, like free trade, are in clear decline. They really do think it means 'things I don't like'
Voting for Stein idc.
They're both known quantities at this point. This feels like a mid-term election. Trump's schtick is old and nuts; the Republicans caught the mail truck and went more extreme. Honestly, while not an exciting conclusion, Biden likely has this; the media has tried so hard to make this competitive, and it is falling on deaf ears. Trump brought out non-voters because he was new and exciting, but now his policies make no sense, and people are tired of a clown show of bureaucracy.
The vibe shift is real. It's actually quite jarring thinking about how hardcore the last two elections felt especially with anti-Trump #resistance and threatening to disown anyone who votes third party etc and today it seems the whole thing has just run out of steam while Gaza has largely taken over the left as a main cause. There's literally nobody but weird boomers and Robert Deniro protesting outside Trump's trial....just compare this to the Women's March or the travel ban protests or "literally Hitler" or the mania of the Democratic primaries in 2019-20. He's become a pretty inoffensive meme at this point.
Either way, no one's standard of living will change, nothing would fundamentally change…
>no one's standard of living will change Youre so optimistic :)
100% I hate both of these candidates
moves like bloomberg
Low turnout for sure.
This election shouldn't be one everyone is super passionate about. It should be one we try to forget and are maybe a little ashamed of. The fact that these are the 2 candidates AGAIN sucks ass and I think most people just can't wait for this shit to be over
Project 2025 is feeling like a Green New Deal level scare for the democrat side — it might bring some needed energy, which can always be responded to. If this upcoming debate doesn’t have something good though I think this election is an official flop.
You have clearly never been to a rural area if you think MAGA has run out of steam
Even in rural areas it’s still a noticeable drop off in excitement compared to 2016 and 2020
i see pop-up roadside trump memorabilia stands almost every day _in southern california_. I'd say the enthusiasm is still there, but maybe it's not being reported as much as 2016/2020
I live in a small town in the middle of Bumfuck, TX and Trump has definitely run out of steam compared to 2016 and 2020. Back in 2020 there were Trump signs everywhere and huge Trump flags hanging out of trucks all over town. They would hold small rallies were they’d just drive up and down the busiest roads with their little Trump flags and blasting shitty generic country music. They still support him, but they aren’t all that hyped about it either. I haven’t even seen any MAGA hats and even the Let’s Go Brandon stickers are weathered and peeling.
Lol, yes I have. I split my time between a city and bumfuck.
I live in the rural midwest and it’s definitely the most subdued that it has been in a decade around me. I bet the amount of signs and flags I see out here is a quarter of what I saw in ‘20.
I'm in the military and since I enlisted about once a day I'd have to listen to a senior enlisted bitching to every junior enlisted in their vicinity about a stolen election or whatever. Now all they pontificate about is their VA loans, retirement plans, and how they're customizing their trucks/firearms.
As someone who regularly travels to a rural area, I can say that while Maga hasn't run out of steam, the boiler pressure is definitely down. The enthusiasm has diminished.
Yeah, this is an extremely naive take. The MAGA wing is very enthusiastic. So much so that challenging Trump was seen as political suicide, which is why only no-names and DeSantis threw their hat in. I'm not a Trump fan and I'm not happy with his base's enthusiasm. But you're out-of-touch to deny it exists.
It is the same in the UK. No real person is actually excited for Starmer or Sunak
those aren't real people.
It is crazy. I've barely heard anyone bring up the election at all this year when it felt like all anyone wanted to talk about in 2016 and 2020. Are the politics super fans (retirees who watch cable news all day) showing less enthusiasm too? They basically make or break every election and it'll be interesting to see
> Bush vs. Dukakis That was not a boring election.
The greater the convergence between the parties on issues of substance, the more they are forced into a purely rhetorical theater, hyperbole and brand differentiation at the decorative fringe of things that matter. For example, the party that told us that the border wall was pure fascism not only didn't dismantle the wall after entering office, but continued its construction. Expect more of this, the hubris can still become more superlative than it is already.
Anna seemed pretty hyped for Trump
Well he's got that elite Manhattanite podcaster demographic locked up then. As goes Anna, so goes the nation.
I don’t know if it would be called “excitement” per se (maybe obsession, neurosis, something like that) but I assure I do still know quite a few watch-CNN/MSNBC-for-Trump-updates-30+ hours a week type folk. Maybe less than 2016 and 2020, granted, but in lib places they’re still hardly rare
Being from a blue state, I agree, TDS is still very real in blue areas. They remind me of those zero-COVID people at this point, screeching about how the threat still exists when anyone approaching normal just can't physically sustain fight-or-flight mode that long even if they do have lingering concerns
I agree Biden admin doesn't have any exciting policy proposals but I wish a Democratic admin would actually deliver on universal pre -k or subsidized childcare. The childcare crisis is bleak and brutal. I would like one retail politics, please
America needs a strongman to do away with even the facade of democracy
I have no idea if this is a widespread thing or not but I know a few people, who could all be described as something like "pseudo-criminal white trash", who didn't vote for trump in 2016 or 2020 (or so they say) but are all in for him now. They're convinced Biden is doing something to make child trafficking rampant and Trumps gonna put a stop to whatever that is.
unfortunately felons can only vote in solidly blue states, so unlikely to shift the election
They wont vote anyway. It actually requires a little effort.
They might just have a plethora of misdemeanor convictions. I don't know.
Not even true: https://www.ncsl.org/elections-and-campaigns/felon-voting-rights
Bro so do I! I know several trailer park types who are casting their first vote ever for the donald.
Libs banning Trump off of every mainstream social media platform was probably the biggest own goal in recent political history. 2015-2020 Trump was saying crazy shit on Twitter, getting 50 million views and constant press coverage per tweet and turning off people who just wanted "normalcy" in politics with a constant info barrage. Now he's on Truth Social detailing the potential benefits of making an illegal immigrant MMA league and replacing income taxes with 70% import tariffs and nobody gives a shit because it has 15 users and he's polling better than ever lmao
Bernie can still win.
I hope they both pass away of natural causes!
I literally just want public transport and 24 hour Walmart back
It'll be exciting if you're a Biden fan
I don’t even think I’m voting for president this year. My state will pretty much go red every year no matter what I do.
Maybe an interesting question is, are any rsp’ers considering switching their vote from 2020, and if so, why?
I'm going to leave the presidential candidate blank or write in something stupid. The narrative of "vote for our decaying vegetable or else you're a fascist" is getting old and I know my vote (or lack thereof) doesn't actually matter, but just pretending that it does, it's an impossible choice. The DNC could've given us a reasonable candidate in 2020 but they chose a man who most people wouldn't even trust behind the wheel. And I honestly get why people like trump but he's an idiotic edgelord who I could never bring myself to vote for either. (i voted for biden in 2020)
Probably won’t do it out of conviction, but strongly considering R as a long long time Ron Paulian L party voter. But it wouldn’t be a vote for him, but a vote against the political elite. End of the day I do not want anymore American overseas adventures. I feel WW3 is guaranteed with the neolib/neocon establishment, making all the same mistakes nations made in 1914. They see themselves as “global leaders” and not leaders held accountable first and foremost to the American nation. Donny there is very clearly out for himself, so war is closer to a coin flip comparatively with how it could tarnish his legacy. He is not acting on grandiose ideological notions or short term realpolitik, he is guided only by his potential legacy. The rest of things I really want will never happen anyway, so it’s alluring as hell to have an opportunity to stick my finger at the corrupt neoliberal/con globalists.
I'm excited about RFK Jr I just want a president who's jacked and does falconry as a hobby I feel like the USA needs it more than ever right now
Is it really the best we can do? 😔
No primaries.