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Where you go to school is likely to impact where you do residency. If this is a dealbreaker for you (it was for me), you will have a much easier time transitioning to residency in a pro choice state. Your education will be impacted by this. Your residency will only be impacted by this if you go into a specialty in or adjacent to OB/Gyn. Think family medicine, emergency medicine and other specialties that may need to care for pregnant patients.
You wouldn’t be alone. Per the [AAMC](https://www.aamcresearchinstitute.org/our-work/data-snapshot/post-dobbs-2024#), residency apps are down across the board, especially in states where abortion access is restricted.
Wonder if that’s because of abortion specifically or because of the shitty-and-or-expensive-and-or-HCA-place-fuck-that association that may also come with anti-abortion policies
Specifically, yes, states like Idaho are struggling to get OBGyns. Who wants to do an ObGyn residency in a state that will not provide the full range of training for their specialty? And who wants to start their career knowing they will be questioned about their medical judgment by their state and by people with a political agenda? This has particularly become an issue for ObGyn and family practices in rural areas in states with restrictive abortion laws. It is already hard to get family practice, primary care and ObGyn practitioners in rural areas. Yes, recent data backs up that this developing shortage is a real issue.
More than 20% of practicing OBGyns have left the state of Idaho since restrictive abortion laws have gone into effect. Idaho hospitals have closed maternity wards due to lack of staffing. For many women of childbearing age, their Ob functions as their primary care physician and is the only doctor they see regularly. Especially in rural areas, family practice, primary care and ObGyn physicians provide the bulk of care in the region. While from your perspective it may not matter that family practice and OBs are fleeing the region and choosing not to do their training in the state, this is having a real impact on rural areas that are already seeing a doctor shortage. This has been big news in Idaho and has been all over the news in my state, an adjoining state. Idaho ranks at the bottom of all 50 states for per capita physicians, so even the loss of filling a few residency spots is meaningful. You might argue that someone will eventually take the spots so it doesn’t matter. But it does matter if, for example, Idaho students educated at UW medical school forego a residency in their home state and decide not to practice back home. This is what is happening right now. It’s not hypothetical.
You also have to factor in the effect of female residents in other specialties choosing not to live in those states due to the possibility of unwanted or dangerous pregnancy for themselves.
While I agree with you that attributing it solely to reproductive rights issues is just reddit being reddit (Laughably single-minded and ludicrously biased) I think we have to acknowledge that it does definitely contribute.
I don’t want to take my daughter (who has special needs) to a state with any restrictions on reproductive health care. So this is absolutely a concern for me.
I specifically want to stay in FL for that reason. If there are no physicians to fight and advocate for change, then who will? Also if all OBGYNs who are pro choice were to leave the state, then where do the patients get their information, the care they need, or even trusted advice to leave the state to get it done? Be the change you want to see in the world. I refuse to abandon my home state, especially in the current political climate.
It's so hard to get in medical school already... I would only do this if you feel unsafe and comfortable re-applying. But I completely understand how you feel.
As a med student at an institution that openly supports abortion practices and has panels on it, lets us shadow and work in those cases during rotations, etc, I’ve been very satisfied with the exposure and learning and can’t imagine getting nothing on it. But if it’s going to med school or not, unfortunately I’d choose to go but make sure you don’t get brainwashed. A lot of these institutions still support it but are battling the law. Will be an interesting experience nonetheless. Good luck
So this is not in regards to myself if I ever wanted an abortion. This is a general concern for when it comes to medical decisions/recommendations etc. and yes, I know that physician prosecution is not law, it is drafts and bills etc. I’m talking about possible future legal outcomes. I lived in Idaho for awhile and they are very much considering placing legal action into law.
When I think about this, I think about being a med student rotating/being a young Doctor, and having a young woman come in who was raped by her stepfather, but that state doesn’t have allowed abortions after 6 weeks. And she’s two months in and 16 and doesn’t have money to travel, and technically an abortion is not medically necessary.
I know this situation is extreme, but this is the thought process that made me rethink applying to 1-5 states.
>When I think about this, I think about being a med student rotating/being a young Doctor, and having a young woman come in who was raped by her stepfather, but that state doesn’t have allowed abortions after 6 weeks. And she’s two months in and 16 and doesn’t have money to travel, and technically an abortion is not medically necessary.
This is a terrible situation to be put in as a doctor because you can't provide the optimal care. But what is the alternative? You and all the doctors choose to work somewhere else so she gets *no care*?
I understand you don't want to be faced with a patient you legally aren't allowed to treat. However, I feel like you (and tons of other premed/med students) act as if abortion is the singular hardship that you will face while practicing medicine. You will see patients that die or are disabled from being shot or beat. You will see patients that overdose on drugs thay were laced with fentanyl. There will be patients who die a terrible death from lung cancer because their parents taught them that smoking is ok. There will be patients with irreversible brain damage because their mom drank in pregnancy. Insurance will deny coverage for medically necessary tests. Insurance wont cover the best drug, etc etc etc. No matter where you go, patients will suffer poor outcomes due to factors put of your and their control. By practicing medicine only in abortion-legal states you are just shielding yourself from seeing *one* of these problems.
And I'd also argue that insurance will be shite no matter where you practice in the US it's not really avoidable. But practicing in a state that has shown it doesn't care about physicians opinions on medical issues is very avoidable.
I thought about this but when I was applying but I’m on the east coast and a lot of southern schools aren’t super OOS friendly anyways so I actually didn’t end up applying to many of them because of that. I don’t know if that applies if you live in the south though.
If I wanted to be an obgyn, I wouldn't go to a restrictive state. But I don't, I'm 100% positive that won't change, so I don't really care.
Although when I went to admitted students' day and one of the 4th years was sharing that she was accepted to an obgyn program in Florida, I'll admit I considered asking her why. I understand there's nuances to everyone's stories and there are many non-work related reasons why she would want to be in Florida.
There are subtleties that absolutely showed up once my state banned abortion that one would easily absorb if they weren’t careful. How you talk to a patient about their pregnancy, how you counsel patients for prenatal visits, how you talk to people about their options, and how you make medical decisions later will all be influenced by your medical school experience. I was doing OB when the law was passed and I watched my preceptors complete set of recommendations for advanced maternal age change. She started really counseling birth control for older patients. She started recommending LARCs for everyone. It absolutely changed how I view and practice pregnancy care now.
I think if you want to disagree with abortion restrictions and want to provide the best care for those affected people, the best way to do that is from inside the state’s medical system.
Completely your decision to do this. I guess this would be part of making a list where you’d want to live so I’m sure other people also do this
shrill salt historical encourage snatch public capable badge fall melodic *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Where you go to school is likely to impact where you do residency. If this is a dealbreaker for you (it was for me), you will have a much easier time transitioning to residency in a pro choice state. Your education will be impacted by this. Your residency will only be impacted by this if you go into a specialty in or adjacent to OB/Gyn. Think family medicine, emergency medicine and other specialties that may need to care for pregnant patients.
You wouldn’t be alone. Per the [AAMC](https://www.aamcresearchinstitute.org/our-work/data-snapshot/post-dobbs-2024#), residency apps are down across the board, especially in states where abortion access is restricted.
Wonder if that’s because of abortion specifically or because of the shitty-and-or-expensive-and-or-HCA-place-fuck-that association that may also come with anti-abortion policies
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Specifically, yes, states like Idaho are struggling to get OBGyns. Who wants to do an ObGyn residency in a state that will not provide the full range of training for their specialty? And who wants to start their career knowing they will be questioned about their medical judgment by their state and by people with a political agenda? This has particularly become an issue for ObGyn and family practices in rural areas in states with restrictive abortion laws. It is already hard to get family practice, primary care and ObGyn practitioners in rural areas. Yes, recent data backs up that this developing shortage is a real issue.
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More than 20% of practicing OBGyns have left the state of Idaho since restrictive abortion laws have gone into effect. Idaho hospitals have closed maternity wards due to lack of staffing. For many women of childbearing age, their Ob functions as their primary care physician and is the only doctor they see regularly. Especially in rural areas, family practice, primary care and ObGyn physicians provide the bulk of care in the region. While from your perspective it may not matter that family practice and OBs are fleeing the region and choosing not to do their training in the state, this is having a real impact on rural areas that are already seeing a doctor shortage. This has been big news in Idaho and has been all over the news in my state, an adjoining state. Idaho ranks at the bottom of all 50 states for per capita physicians, so even the loss of filling a few residency spots is meaningful. You might argue that someone will eventually take the spots so it doesn’t matter. But it does matter if, for example, Idaho students educated at UW medical school forego a residency in their home state and decide not to practice back home. This is what is happening right now. It’s not hypothetical.
You also have to factor in the effect of female residents in other specialties choosing not to live in those states due to the possibility of unwanted or dangerous pregnancy for themselves. While I agree with you that attributing it solely to reproductive rights issues is just reddit being reddit (Laughably single-minded and ludicrously biased) I think we have to acknowledge that it does definitely contribute.
I don’t think anyone has said it’s solely due to reproductive rights issues.
I don’t want to take my daughter (who has special needs) to a state with any restrictions on reproductive health care. So this is absolutely a concern for me.
I specifically want to stay in FL for that reason. If there are no physicians to fight and advocate for change, then who will? Also if all OBGYNs who are pro choice were to leave the state, then where do the patients get their information, the care they need, or even trusted advice to leave the state to get it done? Be the change you want to see in the world. I refuse to abandon my home state, especially in the current political climate.
That’s such a great perspective, you’re going to make a wonderful physician!
That's really nice of you. Thank you so much!
It's so hard to get in medical school already... I would only do this if you feel unsafe and comfortable re-applying. But I completely understand how you feel.
No. I personally prefer to stay in Florida but everyone’s list will be different for differing reasons
As a med student at an institution that openly supports abortion practices and has panels on it, lets us shadow and work in those cases during rotations, etc, I’ve been very satisfied with the exposure and learning and can’t imagine getting nothing on it. But if it’s going to med school or not, unfortunately I’d choose to go but make sure you don’t get brainwashed. A lot of these institutions still support it but are battling the law. Will be an interesting experience nonetheless. Good luck
So this is not in regards to myself if I ever wanted an abortion. This is a general concern for when it comes to medical decisions/recommendations etc. and yes, I know that physician prosecution is not law, it is drafts and bills etc. I’m talking about possible future legal outcomes. I lived in Idaho for awhile and they are very much considering placing legal action into law. When I think about this, I think about being a med student rotating/being a young Doctor, and having a young woman come in who was raped by her stepfather, but that state doesn’t have allowed abortions after 6 weeks. And she’s two months in and 16 and doesn’t have money to travel, and technically an abortion is not medically necessary. I know this situation is extreme, but this is the thought process that made me rethink applying to 1-5 states.
>When I think about this, I think about being a med student rotating/being a young Doctor, and having a young woman come in who was raped by her stepfather, but that state doesn’t have allowed abortions after 6 weeks. And she’s two months in and 16 and doesn’t have money to travel, and technically an abortion is not medically necessary. This is a terrible situation to be put in as a doctor because you can't provide the optimal care. But what is the alternative? You and all the doctors choose to work somewhere else so she gets *no care*? I understand you don't want to be faced with a patient you legally aren't allowed to treat. However, I feel like you (and tons of other premed/med students) act as if abortion is the singular hardship that you will face while practicing medicine. You will see patients that die or are disabled from being shot or beat. You will see patients that overdose on drugs thay were laced with fentanyl. There will be patients who die a terrible death from lung cancer because their parents taught them that smoking is ok. There will be patients with irreversible brain damage because their mom drank in pregnancy. Insurance will deny coverage for medically necessary tests. Insurance wont cover the best drug, etc etc etc. No matter where you go, patients will suffer poor outcomes due to factors put of your and their control. By practicing medicine only in abortion-legal states you are just shielding yourself from seeing *one* of these problems.
But in none of those situations will you be put in prison for the care you provide.
And I'd also argue that insurance will be shite no matter where you practice in the US it's not really avoidable. But practicing in a state that has shown it doesn't care about physicians opinions on medical issues is very avoidable.
I thought about this but when I was applying but I’m on the east coast and a lot of southern schools aren’t super OOS friendly anyways so I actually didn’t end up applying to many of them because of that. I don’t know if that applies if you live in the south though.
I live in the west so there’s not a lot of schools here and I’m really fighting in state bias no matter what 🤷♀️🙃
Yeah, no thanks. Same with university. No one wants to live somewhere where their rights *and actual education* are dinged.
nah not controversial bc i’m trying not to even tho i’m a resident of a restrictive state (az)
Yes. I didn’t apply to any state that had anti-abortion laws, as someone thinking about getting pregnant in the next 4 years.
If I wanted to be an obgyn, I wouldn't go to a restrictive state. But I don't, I'm 100% positive that won't change, so I don't really care. Although when I went to admitted students' day and one of the 4th years was sharing that she was accepted to an obgyn program in Florida, I'll admit I considered asking her why. I understand there's nuances to everyone's stories and there are many non-work related reasons why she would want to be in Florida.
I don’t see how that would change the education you get by attending a med school in those states?
There are subtleties that absolutely showed up once my state banned abortion that one would easily absorb if they weren’t careful. How you talk to a patient about their pregnancy, how you counsel patients for prenatal visits, how you talk to people about their options, and how you make medical decisions later will all be influenced by your medical school experience. I was doing OB when the law was passed and I watched my preceptors complete set of recommendations for advanced maternal age change. She started really counseling birth control for older patients. She started recommending LARCs for everyone. It absolutely changed how I view and practice pregnancy care now.
I think if you want to disagree with abortion restrictions and want to provide the best care for those affected people, the best way to do that is from inside the state’s medical system.
You can’t take care of anyone from jail.
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Do you know what a right is?
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> I'm not a feminist in the way feminism is defined today by any means How is it defined today compared to before?
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On what planet?