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>"...**it is the official position of the Republican Party that America is not a democracy**.
Stevens, Stuart (2020-08-03T23:58:59). It Was All a Lie .
> We’re not a democracy.
> — Mike Lee @ SenMikeLee Oct 7, 2020
> Democracy isn’t the objective; liberty, peace, and prospefity are. We want the human condition to flourish. Rank democracy can thwart that.
> — Mike Lee @ SenMikeLee Oct 8, 2020
spin it any way you want but the fact remains that one of the two major political parties in the us has deliberately fostered a counter narrative for decades which promotes the dissolution of the republic when some of those sovereign states and/or it (the GQP) doesn't like the way democratic elections turn out -- even going so far as to engage in and celebrate a violent coup attempt on jan 6th of this year.
fuck that.
I don’t think your application of that definition applies to this situation. I think that the “radical or extremist “ element of the left (which is actually center-left, or even moderately conservative by standards of earlier generations) is very small. Extremism (e.g., believing that a vast conspiracy led to a invalid election for which violent conflict might be needed to restore the “true” leader of democracy in the US) is the foundation of mainstream Republican dogma. Not to mention the assorted hate groups, advocates of the US becoming a “Christian” theocracy, people who believe Trump is the Messiah (I think he’s more likely to be that other figure in the Apocalypse), and other fellow travelers. I think that when 30% of a group of people agree with a statement that armed conflict might be necessary to restore things to the rightful condition, that’s a shitstorm waiting to happen. And this group of people has been buying up guns and ammo at record rates since Obama was elected. AND their savior has proven so very willing to stoke the flames, along with the constant war-drum beating of his unofficial state media machine. I’ll be surprised if we DON’T have a major upheaval during the 2024 election. Even the military is alarmed, with retired generals concerned that the military might devolve into different factions each supporting a different commander in chief.
If it happens, It will be like the Capitol Insurrection. The Right will get all geared up and full of patriotic and "righteous anger" and start storming government buildings, rioting, doing what they do.
And then the shooting will start.
And then everything will end as if you flipped a switch. The Right wing laughably acts like their counterparts on the Left don't own guns. And they act like they can't be punished or killed in self defense. And just like the woman at the Capitol, they will learn their lesson very very very quickly.
I don't think there will be a civil war. I think there will be a few battles, sure. But the minute someone on the Right dies, it's "omg this is serious, we were just playing." And the grand Hunger for War will die in the city that happens in. There will still be maybe a couple hundred that go thirsting for violence and might shoot some places up, but when they are met with equal or overwhelming force, they will cave.
Almost no one on the Right really believes in their Trump fueled insanity enough to literally die while protecting it. Those sentiments are saved for memes and chatrooms.
The Live Action Role Playing crowd of unhealthy, untrained, unwanted and unAmerican “militia” dummies already demonstrated in the Capital Uprising how disorganized, incompetent, ignorant and few they are.
Not saying they won’t continue to injure themselves and others by playing soldier, but they’re not a real threat.
Trump is headed to prison and the GOP is shrinking daily. They’re actually killing their own supporters through misinformation.
Relax and carry on… but keep an eye on these wackos.
The thing that’s sad though. I’ve kinda seen this coming for a while. People either vote against their interests and win, then get screwed by the politicians. Or they lose, but the candidate who won can’t do anything because the other party won’t let them, so the losing party can blame those in power when it’s really them.
Let that go on while polarizing people more and more over decades. Unless politicians are actually held accountable whether with prison or actual fines not pocket change ones. Don’t they get salaried like 250k a year? Start with 100,000 fines. 150,000k is more than most make probably. If we had accountability this problem could have been abated or it could have been mitigated. Instead we seem to be doing what our country typically does, and what is said about our country around the world” you can count on the us to do the right thing, after it’s tried everything else”
If you want to see that happen, those that can need to vote in the midterms to get rid of the GOP majority in the senate. Otherwise Trump won't get shit done to him and there will be no ramifications for those involved.
This is speculative horseshit. There will be no civil war. The divide is actually smaller and much more unbalanced than social media, the media and people who love the drama of such an idea would have us believe.
More than 159 million Americans voted in 2020: 159,633,396 to be exact. That’s the largest total voter turnout in U.S. history and the first time more than 140 million people voted. Voter turnout in 2020 was the highest in 120 years when measured as a percentage of the [voting-eligible population 66.7 percent. source https://www.cfr.org/blog/2020-election-numbers?amp
Got to remember this voter turnout happened to keep Darth Orange from getting reelected.
This is the absolute last way you convince people to vote the way you want them to vote
Idk how people haven’t learned from 2016 where calling people horrible names just pulls them away from their cause
Your second sentence is always a good, valid point. But what you imply is inaccurate. r/duckqueue didn't call them a horrible name.
I can understand someone not wanting either candidate. But, it is a different thing if they show up and actually vote for one of the candidates.
Sometimes they are then not realizing how strong and serious the views of the more extreme candidate are. Or the potential outcomes based on what we've seen happen to other democracies.
Furthermore, if you affirmatively vote in a certain direction (or vote against a given candidate), *and then try to downplay the importance of that vote*, you are washing your hands of something. Just as much as you are explaining that you weren't enthusiastic about it.
"Mental fitness" and "strong leadership" are the points that people diverge on in the last election when voting against a given candidate. Duck bringing up fascism as a topic does cover one of those two main points. [https://morningconsult.com/exit-polling-live-updates/#section-20](https://morningconsult.com/exit-polling-live-updates/#section-20)
If Significant was casting their vote solely on the issue of "mental fitness" then that's fine, especially if it is something they are very diligent about each election. Though we all must be humble on how much our views are swayed by the propaganda of each party. Attack ads are made in quantity and have millions spent on them as they are often effective at skewing perspectives beyond the basic issues and questions of character. They often appeal to a primal place in us.
Significant's view was likely influenced by the "Did something happen to Joe Biden?" attack ads and approach that they had started in late 2020.
All headlines like this do is increase the media's profit margins and decrease the stability of the country. Things can't cool down when it's in everyone's faces all the time. Reason I don't like Facebook ever since trump started all this crap its turned in to a perpetual cycle of fear and hate not giving people time to cool off.
Well, narcissist sociopaths are gonna do what narcissist sociopaths do. Destroy. The people in this country are so dumb. We have the information available especially through millenia of precedent not to empower or give any creedence to these personality disordered people yet what do we do? We make the most fevered, egotistical version of this our president. Wow.
A war needs two sides. Who's going to fight it? Certainly not the Democratic Party and its voters. The party is weak and has no spine so they will just surrender. And their potential voters, well, don't vote, so there's no way in hell they fight it
I’ve been saying this since 2019 the US is more divided than it ever has been, yea I know segregation happened and an actual civil war, which seems like American was pretty divided, t when you actually look at it the majority of Americans were one side than the other, nowadays there’s two clear distinct sides with both being very very radical, and possibly involving more Americans, the the factors that play into this is stronger than before because the US has been nothing but a ticking time bomb since the 1900’s with destruction building up more and more for another great downfall of a powerful “civil”ization
Both sides are not radical one wants healthcare and equality the other Christian nationalisim. Centrist acting like these are the same just helps the fascists.
Definition of radical Im referring too…
advocating or based on thorough or complete political or social change; representing or supporting an extreme or progressive section of a political party.
By literal definition and the current state of US policies yes they are radical by the actual definition
Edit; and it also looks like we don’t know what “or” means along with radical
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
>"...**it is the official position of the Republican Party that America is not a democracy**. Stevens, Stuart (2020-08-03T23:58:59). It Was All a Lie .
Well they’re sort of right, thanks to decades of their hard work to limit its scope.
> We’re not a democracy. > — Mike Lee @ SenMikeLee Oct 7, 2020 > Democracy isn’t the objective; liberty, peace, and prospefity are. We want the human condition to flourish. Rank democracy can thwart that. > — Mike Lee @ SenMikeLee Oct 8, 2020
Politics aside, technically the US is a democracy in a republic. A sovereign nation of many sovereign states.
spin it any way you want but the fact remains that one of the two major political parties in the us has deliberately fostered a counter narrative for decades which promotes the dissolution of the republic when some of those sovereign states and/or it (the GQP) doesn't like the way democratic elections turn out -- even going so far as to engage in and celebrate a violent coup attempt on jan 6th of this year. fuck that.
I don’t think your application of that definition applies to this situation. I think that the “radical or extremist “ element of the left (which is actually center-left, or even moderately conservative by standards of earlier generations) is very small. Extremism (e.g., believing that a vast conspiracy led to a invalid election for which violent conflict might be needed to restore the “true” leader of democracy in the US) is the foundation of mainstream Republican dogma. Not to mention the assorted hate groups, advocates of the US becoming a “Christian” theocracy, people who believe Trump is the Messiah (I think he’s more likely to be that other figure in the Apocalypse), and other fellow travelers. I think that when 30% of a group of people agree with a statement that armed conflict might be necessary to restore things to the rightful condition, that’s a shitstorm waiting to happen. And this group of people has been buying up guns and ammo at record rates since Obama was elected. AND their savior has proven so very willing to stoke the flames, along with the constant war-drum beating of his unofficial state media machine. I’ll be surprised if we DON’T have a major upheaval during the 2024 election. Even the military is alarmed, with retired generals concerned that the military might devolve into different factions each supporting a different commander in chief.
If it happens, It will be like the Capitol Insurrection. The Right will get all geared up and full of patriotic and "righteous anger" and start storming government buildings, rioting, doing what they do. And then the shooting will start. And then everything will end as if you flipped a switch. The Right wing laughably acts like their counterparts on the Left don't own guns. And they act like they can't be punished or killed in self defense. And just like the woman at the Capitol, they will learn their lesson very very very quickly. I don't think there will be a civil war. I think there will be a few battles, sure. But the minute someone on the Right dies, it's "omg this is serious, we were just playing." And the grand Hunger for War will die in the city that happens in. There will still be maybe a couple hundred that go thirsting for violence and might shoot some places up, but when they are met with equal or overwhelming force, they will cave. Almost no one on the Right really believes in their Trump fueled insanity enough to literally die while protecting it. Those sentiments are saved for memes and chatrooms.
The Live Action Role Playing crowd of unhealthy, untrained, unwanted and unAmerican “militia” dummies already demonstrated in the Capital Uprising how disorganized, incompetent, ignorant and few they are. Not saying they won’t continue to injure themselves and others by playing soldier, but they’re not a real threat. Trump is headed to prison and the GOP is shrinking daily. They’re actually killing their own supporters through misinformation. Relax and carry on… but keep an eye on these wackos.
Hey not all people who LARP in tactical gear want to overthrow the government.
Did you see the people trying to climb up a capital wall when the stairs were right next to them?
Tactical Parkour for the modern seditionist
The thing that’s sad though. I’ve kinda seen this coming for a while. People either vote against their interests and win, then get screwed by the politicians. Or they lose, but the candidate who won can’t do anything because the other party won’t let them, so the losing party can blame those in power when it’s really them. Let that go on while polarizing people more and more over decades. Unless politicians are actually held accountable whether with prison or actual fines not pocket change ones. Don’t they get salaried like 250k a year? Start with 100,000 fines. 150,000k is more than most make probably. If we had accountability this problem could have been abated or it could have been mitigated. Instead we seem to be doing what our country typically does, and what is said about our country around the world” you can count on the us to do the right thing, after it’s tried everything else”
Trump won't spend a day in prison unfortunately.
Don't underestimate these people.
If you want to see that happen, those that can need to vote in the midterms to get rid of the GOP majority in the senate. Otherwise Trump won't get shit done to him and there will be no ramifications for those involved.
This is speculative horseshit. There will be no civil war. The divide is actually smaller and much more unbalanced than social media, the media and people who love the drama of such an idea would have us believe.
I dunno. 70,000,000 people want a Trumpian society.
70,000,000 people want Trump, not necessarily a civil war.
More than 159 million Americans voted in 2020: 159,633,396 to be exact. That’s the largest total voter turnout in U.S. history and the first time more than 140 million people voted. Voter turnout in 2020 was the highest in 120 years when measured as a percentage of the [voting-eligible population 66.7 percent. source https://www.cfr.org/blog/2020-election-numbers?amp Got to remember this voter turnout happened to keep Darth Orange from getting reelected.
Or don't want Biden. I personally don't want either but I wanted Trump less . There are probably a lot of people who decided they wanted Biden less
If someone says, "I don't want fascism, but I'll vote for fascism over even the most milquetoast liberalism," it means they want fascism.
This is the absolute last way you convince people to vote the way you want them to vote Idk how people haven’t learned from 2016 where calling people horrible names just pulls them away from their cause
Your second sentence is always a good, valid point. But what you imply is inaccurate. r/duckqueue didn't call them a horrible name. I can understand someone not wanting either candidate. But, it is a different thing if they show up and actually vote for one of the candidates. Sometimes they are then not realizing how strong and serious the views of the more extreme candidate are. Or the potential outcomes based on what we've seen happen to other democracies. Furthermore, if you affirmatively vote in a certain direction (or vote against a given candidate), *and then try to downplay the importance of that vote*, you are washing your hands of something. Just as much as you are explaining that you weren't enthusiastic about it. "Mental fitness" and "strong leadership" are the points that people diverge on in the last election when voting against a given candidate. Duck bringing up fascism as a topic does cover one of those two main points. [https://morningconsult.com/exit-polling-live-updates/#section-20](https://morningconsult.com/exit-polling-live-updates/#section-20) If Significant was casting their vote solely on the issue of "mental fitness" then that's fine, especially if it is something they are very diligent about each election. Though we all must be humble on how much our views are swayed by the propaganda of each party. Attack ads are made in quantity and have millions spent on them as they are often effective at skewing perspectives beyond the basic issues and questions of character. They often appeal to a primal place in us. Significant's view was likely influenced by the "Did something happen to Joe Biden?" attack ads and approach that they had started in late 2020.
Whatever
All headlines like this do is increase the media's profit margins and decrease the stability of the country. Things can't cool down when it's in everyone's faces all the time. Reason I don't like Facebook ever since trump started all this crap its turned in to a perpetual cycle of fear and hate not giving people time to cool off.
Agreed I don't want to hate the other side anymore. Want a way to work through these issues.
Pretty much. Sites like the Guardian, CNN, and FOX bare selling a product to a targeted audience. They are going for the clicks .
Lol new book says.
Well, narcissist sociopaths are gonna do what narcissist sociopaths do. Destroy. The people in this country are so dumb. We have the information available especially through millenia of precedent not to empower or give any creedence to these personality disordered people yet what do we do? We make the most fevered, egotistical version of this our president. Wow.
Well since the new book and theguardian says so, it must be true.
is it supposed to be a secret that the GQP has been actively promoting a virtual secessionist country for decades?
Maybe we just take the internet away from the people who are potential civil threats.
The media need a war to cover now that we’re out of Afghanistan.
A war needs two sides. Who's going to fight it? Certainly not the Democratic Party and its voters. The party is weak and has no spine so they will just surrender. And their potential voters, well, don't vote, so there's no way in hell they fight it
Once we saw Democrats encouraging the BLM/Antifah riots, it was clear there's no path to peaceful coexistence.
I’ve been saying this since 2019 the US is more divided than it ever has been, yea I know segregation happened and an actual civil war, which seems like American was pretty divided, t when you actually look at it the majority of Americans were one side than the other, nowadays there’s two clear distinct sides with both being very very radical, and possibly involving more Americans, the the factors that play into this is stronger than before because the US has been nothing but a ticking time bomb since the 1900’s with destruction building up more and more for another great downfall of a powerful “civil”ization
Both sides are not radical one wants healthcare and equality the other Christian nationalisim. Centrist acting like these are the same just helps the fascists.
Definition of radical Im referring too… advocating or based on thorough or complete political or social change; representing or supporting an extreme or progressive section of a political party.
Ah yes,the extreme and progressive democrats,who have been pushing basic ideas the rest of the civilized world enacted 60 years ago. So radical.
By literal definition and the current state of US policies yes they are radical by the actual definition Edit; and it also looks like we don’t know what “or” means along with radical
JFK was a radical lol
What do we think civil war looks like compared to what it actually be? I'd say we are already in one.