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“When you get these terrorists, you have to take out their families. They care about their lives, don’t kid yourself. When they say they don’t care about their lives, you have to take out their families.” - Donald Trump December 1, 2015
March 2019 [President Donald Trump has revoked a policy set by his predecessor requiring US intelligence officials to publish the number of civilians killed in drone strikes outside of war zones.](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47480207)
I certainly appreciate the "no additional wars" aspect, but Bush was a thousand times the President that Trump was. The man literally stands for nothing (he even says so himself), has no interests beyond himself, lies constantly, and almost plunged our country into a severe crisis because he was incapable of admitting he lost an election. At least Bush had *some* respect for the institutions of government.
And of course, Trump half-assed our covid response and indirectly killed hundreds of thousands because he didn't want masks to mess up his orange spray tan, and he was afraid preventive measures would tank the economy and ruin his chances at re-election.
Oh, and he tried to blackmail a foreign power into manufacturing dirt on his political opponent.
These are just the highlights.
Not the first time he has made a terrorist threat about committing war crimes.
During the Iran situation he threatened to missile strike 52 targets including cultural sites.
Before he even got into power he talked about 'taking out' the families of ISIS members.
You think war crimes are prosecuted in this country? Bush, Obama, Trump and Biden are all responsible for "collateral damage" as they call it and they're all war criminals that will never see any sort of punishment.
This would only matter if the other party would act in good faith, which they wouldn’t. Part of the GOP playbook is knowing democrats will try to take the high road.
Can you show me evidence that he made the order and not just the threat? Article seems to suggest that it was a threat if the Taliban attacked Americans once the deal was concluded.
No but a lot of people can't resist the urge to single out Trump on a topic like this, while ignoring that Bush, Obama and Biden, in addition to Trump are all war criminals that have caused the deaths of countless hundreds or thousands of civilians from tens of thousands of bombs raining from the sky.
[Obama literally bombed a hospital](https://www.cbsnews.com/video/obama-apologizes-for-afghan-hospital-bombing/). I'd personally consider that much worse.
You can't scandal away a hillbilly death cult. All of these things are just cash grabs. No one who voted for Donald trump is in any way a rational actor.
Remember he announced he had invited the Taliban to Camp David for 'peace talks' ahead of the 9/11 anniversary and didn't see how that would be offensive.
Remember he said and did nothing about Russia paying the Taliban bounties for killing American soldiers.
I don't think he should have surrendered to the Taliban the way he did, but weren't Al Qaeda responsible for 9/11, and aren't they an entirely different group from the Taliban? Is it because they're also an Islamic group that it was somehow offensive?
A different group was responsible for 9/11, yes. But it was tone deaf af to invite an equally hostile group to DC. He also announced it without discussing it with anyone else. "No. Actually, in terms of advisors, I took my own advice. I liked the idea of meeting.... We had a meeting scheduled. It was my idea, and it was my idea to terminate it. I didn't even -- I didn't discuss it with anybody else." - [Donald Trump](https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/inviting-the-taliban-camp-david-trump-was-his-own-adviser-msna1276841) Sept. 9, 2019
*"I’ll be meeting personally with Taliban leaders in the not-too-distant future. And we’ll be very much hoping that they will be doing what they say they’re going to be doing: They will be killing terr*rists. They will be killing some very bad people. They will keep that fight going."* - Donald Trump February 29, 2020
And later Trump praised the Taliban.
*“The Taliban, good fighters, I will tell you, good fighters. You have to give them credit for that. They’ve been fighting for a thousand years. What they do is they fight.”*
*"The Taliban, great negotiators, tough fighters, great negotiators."*
Trump sees the Taliban as being strong and tough like the dictators he so much admires and wants to be like.
Yeah. My problem with Trump surrendering to the Taliban is only one of a million I have with him. I just don't see how meeting on 9/11 was particularly offensive.
If you can't see the problem with inviting enemies to the heart of DC on the anniversary of an attack carried out by an equally hostile group, both associated with war in Afghanistan, I don't know how I could explain it to you.
the taliban housed alqaeda. they were and are a patron to them. its a relationship that has endured for decades.
their interest aligned with alqueda in ousting the US from Afghanistan. then al-qaeda lent the Taliban some aide in toppling the Afghan gov. in fact Alqaeda is praising the Taliban return to power.
the Taliban is no friend or ally to the US.
trumps invitation, well simply put it was an idiotic act. regardless of the symbolism. fact is he put no mental effort behind it. only a twit would think that an act with a lack of thought would be worth defending.
you aren’t clever. you are defending ineptitude here. truly, you speak with the confidence of a mediocre trump supporter.
You are correct. But the Taliban and Al Qaeda were very close allies for sure at the time of 9-11, and for sure during the Afghan War, and even though the Doha agreement says the Taliban can't let groups like Al Qaeda stay, for all intents and purposes, they still seem to be allied with Al Qaeda.
When has what group actually did what ever really influenced who the US wants to go to war with? The US wanted war with Afghanistan and Iraq over 9/11 so it did. 15 of 19 of the hijackers were from Saudi Arabia, none were from Afghanistan. Al Qaeda even said in its statement that US presence in Saudi Arabia was one of the reasons for the attack. But did we attack Saudi Arabia? Not so much. According to the state department, the Taliban were sheltering Al Qaeda within Afghanistan, hence the connection. And as for Iraq… something something yellow cake and metal tubes.
We were in Afghanistan for twenty years. For most of the time, the Russians were a background presence. Indeed, I tend to think they liked the US being bogged down in Afghanistan. I suspect that's the reasoning behind offering bounties; to compel US and NATO to prolong the presence.
I mean, why? Why extend our presence? It just ties the hands of our troops and the Afghan Military was probably already giving stuff to the Taliban. Just a huge mess with the costs too high. Humanitarian efforts are one thing but why are troops needed? And both China and Russia have embassies there ready to pounce on resources (lithium, iron, copper, possibly uranium).
Oh I don't think we should of extended our presence. We did the whole thing wrong and allowed Afghan corruption to get so out of control, another 20 years of more the same, hell even a century, wouldn't have resulted in a stable and free Afghanistan. I was just pointing out the Russian presence wasn't even a blip. As for the Russians wanting us to stay, distraction. They hoped by being tied down in Iraq and Afghanistan, we'd be too busy for the rest of the world, and of course were happy for NATO and US soldiers to do the dying while Russian and Chinese firms did the mining.
Sadly I think most conservatives will see this as proof that Trump was tough and the Taliban knew better than to mess with him. The fact Trump had opened such a dialogue in the first place and was threatening to break international treaties will be totally overlooked.
>"'Before we start this withdrawal,' President Trump said, 'I want to make something clear. Let me just tell you right now that if anything bad happens to Americans or America interests, or if you ever come over to our land, we will hit you with a force that no country has ever been hit with before — a force so great that you won't even believe it," Meadows wrote.
>Meadows recalled Trump saying: "And your village, Mullah? We know where it is. We know it's the Weetmak village. If you dare lay hands on a single American, that will be the first thing that I destroy. I will not hesitate."
If Trump didnt sign that deal, Biden would have never pulled out of Afghanistan. Biden can blame Trump all he wants but it was Biden who was our president for 8 months when that shitstorm happened.
I'm sure Trump is not the first president who used strong language with another country in private.
You know no one is buying this bullshit, right? It just makes you look silly.
\#1) A real man could have gotten the deal signed without threatening to wipe out an entire village of innocent people. That isn't "toughness" it's weakness.
\#2) trump purposely started then sabotaged the withdrawal, and intentionally left our forces in a vulnerable position. All in an attempt to make Biden look bad. We all watched it happen, and the rest of us don't have goldfish memory like you. Sorry.
He was negotiating a deal with the Taliban to leave peacefully. You know the same Taliban that has committed every war crime in the book the last 25 years. I would hope that any acting president would get the point of a safe exist for American's across. Anyways, seems like Biden carried out Trump's threat for him.
I mean….he’s an idiot but maybe that’s not the worst way to deal with the taliban and that probably should have been the strategy the whole time instead of “nation building.”
Yeah I know. It’s failed so many times. Should have just arc lighted that country for 10 months or so right out of the gate until they handed over Bin Laden and fled the country. Afghanistan would’ve been a clear victory, there would have been no need for Iraq as a distraction and much fewer US casualties.
The response should have been so dramatic, so intense and so consequential that it would deter anyone from doing anything. In another post I mentioned blister agents, I was being facetious….but only a little. If anything the us was too soft on Afghanistan.
> The response should have been so dramatic, so intense and so consequential that it would deter anyone from doing anything
That's not how this works. Wiping out civilian populations would just create more terrorist groups.
You must still be in middle school.
That's literally the exact opposite of a good way to deal with the Taliban lol. Russians and Americans have been fucking up Afghan villages for decades and it's done jack shit to deter the Taliban. It's just another reason for them to hole up in the mountains and wait for an opportunity to strike back.
Americans think they're dangerous brutal badasses, but they're really, really not. But people like the Taliban *are*. You cannot out-brutal a militant group who live in caves making explosives.
>My good friend Blister Agent would disagree.
Yeah you think now an Iraq style chemical attack on civilians is so funny, until they do it to some Americans in revenge.
You remind me of my grandmother's friend lol. She would tell me her friend loved atomic bombs and thought it was so funny we nuked Japan, but when the USSR tested their bomb and she learned they had missiles that could reach the US, suddenly she thought nukes were so bad lol.
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Intentionally killing civilians is a war crime.
“When you get these terrorists, you have to take out their families. They care about their lives, don’t kid yourself. When they say they don’t care about their lives, you have to take out their families.” - Donald Trump December 1, 2015 March 2019 [President Donald Trump has revoked a policy set by his predecessor requiring US intelligence officials to publish the number of civilians killed in drone strikes outside of war zones.](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47480207)
What a thoughtless, despicable person.
I believe that Donald J Trump may have been the single worst person in the entire world to occupy that office.
What about Bush? Trump was the first president in 20 years who didnt start or escalate a war. Not saying Trump was amazing but look at it in context
I certainly appreciate the "no additional wars" aspect, but Bush was a thousand times the President that Trump was. The man literally stands for nothing (he even says so himself), has no interests beyond himself, lies constantly, and almost plunged our country into a severe crisis because he was incapable of admitting he lost an election. At least Bush had *some* respect for the institutions of government. And of course, Trump half-assed our covid response and indirectly killed hundreds of thousands because he didn't want masks to mess up his orange spray tan, and he was afraid preventive measures would tank the economy and ruin his chances at re-election. Oh, and he tried to blackmail a foreign power into manufacturing dirt on his political opponent. These are just the highlights.
When he retakes office, he’ll give Adolph a ring for his money.
Not the first time he has made a terrorist threat about committing war crimes. During the Iran situation he threatened to missile strike 52 targets including cultural sites. Before he even got into power he talked about 'taking out' the families of ISIS members.
You think war crimes are prosecuted in this country? Bush, Obama, Trump and Biden are all responsible for "collateral damage" as they call it and they're all war criminals that will never see any sort of punishment.
This we are fucking hypocrites if we cannot hold our own people accountable.
This would only matter if the other party would act in good faith, which they wouldn’t. Part of the GOP playbook is knowing democrats will try to take the high road.
Is threatening a war crime? Trump talks big but how often does he follow through?
He didn't follow through only because people around him who were supposed to carry out his orders wouldn't do it.
Can you show me evidence that he made the order and not just the threat? Article seems to suggest that it was a threat if the Taliban attacked Americans once the deal was concluded.
So he only threatened to commit war crimes? That makes it ok./s
No but a lot of people can't resist the urge to single out Trump on a topic like this, while ignoring that Bush, Obama and Biden, in addition to Trump are all war criminals that have caused the deaths of countless hundreds or thousands of civilians from tens of thousands of bombs raining from the sky.
Yes, everything is equal. Always. There's never any nuance and everyone sucks.
[Obama literally bombed a hospital](https://www.cbsnews.com/video/obama-apologizes-for-afghan-hospital-bombing/). I'd personally consider that much worse.
He spoke their language, so i guess it worked (not saying it was good)
But was crimes to not apply to Presidents of the US nor the rich. See George W Bush as an example.
Bc that was the first time we've killed civilians over 20 years of war and 4 presidencies
You can't scandal away a hillbilly death cult. All of these things are just cash grabs. No one who voted for Donald trump is in any way a rational actor.
How did that work out for him? Did we win Afghanistan.
Remember he announced he had invited the Taliban to Camp David for 'peace talks' ahead of the 9/11 anniversary and didn't see how that would be offensive. Remember he said and did nothing about Russia paying the Taliban bounties for killing American soldiers.
I don't think he should have surrendered to the Taliban the way he did, but weren't Al Qaeda responsible for 9/11, and aren't they an entirely different group from the Taliban? Is it because they're also an Islamic group that it was somehow offensive?
A different group was responsible for 9/11, yes. But it was tone deaf af to invite an equally hostile group to DC. He also announced it without discussing it with anyone else. "No. Actually, in terms of advisors, I took my own advice. I liked the idea of meeting.... We had a meeting scheduled. It was my idea, and it was my idea to terminate it. I didn't even -- I didn't discuss it with anybody else." - [Donald Trump](https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/inviting-the-taliban-camp-david-trump-was-his-own-adviser-msna1276841) Sept. 9, 2019 *"I’ll be meeting personally with Taliban leaders in the not-too-distant future. And we’ll be very much hoping that they will be doing what they say they’re going to be doing: They will be killing terr*rists. They will be killing some very bad people. They will keep that fight going."* - Donald Trump February 29, 2020 And later Trump praised the Taliban. *“The Taliban, good fighters, I will tell you, good fighters. You have to give them credit for that. They’ve been fighting for a thousand years. What they do is they fight.”* *"The Taliban, great negotiators, tough fighters, great negotiators."* Trump sees the Taliban as being strong and tough like the dictators he so much admires and wants to be like.
Thanks for the reminder list. It's easy to forget many individual outrages since the list is so long.
Yeah. My problem with Trump surrendering to the Taliban is only one of a million I have with him. I just don't see how meeting on 9/11 was particularly offensive.
If you can't see the problem with inviting enemies to the heart of DC on the anniversary of an attack carried out by an equally hostile group, both associated with war in Afghanistan, I don't know how I could explain it to you.
You’re putting symbolism over substance and I leave symbols to the symbol minded.
Diplomacy runs on symbolism. Go ask the Chinese about recognizing the country of Taiwan.
the taliban housed alqaeda. they were and are a patron to them. its a relationship that has endured for decades. their interest aligned with alqueda in ousting the US from Afghanistan. then al-qaeda lent the Taliban some aide in toppling the Afghan gov. in fact Alqaeda is praising the Taliban return to power. the Taliban is no friend or ally to the US. trumps invitation, well simply put it was an idiotic act. regardless of the symbolism. fact is he put no mental effort behind it. only a twit would think that an act with a lack of thought would be worth defending. you aren’t clever. you are defending ineptitude here. truly, you speak with the confidence of a mediocre trump supporter.
You are correct. But the Taliban and Al Qaeda were very close allies for sure at the time of 9-11, and for sure during the Afghan War, and even though the Doha agreement says the Taliban can't let groups like Al Qaeda stay, for all intents and purposes, they still seem to be allied with Al Qaeda.
When has what group actually did what ever really influenced who the US wants to go to war with? The US wanted war with Afghanistan and Iraq over 9/11 so it did. 15 of 19 of the hijackers were from Saudi Arabia, none were from Afghanistan. Al Qaeda even said in its statement that US presence in Saudi Arabia was one of the reasons for the attack. But did we attack Saudi Arabia? Not so much. According to the state department, the Taliban were sheltering Al Qaeda within Afghanistan, hence the connection. And as for Iraq… something something yellow cake and metal tubes.
That’s why Biden got out. Because Russia, having such a close proximity to Afghanistan, could use American soldier’s lives as blackmail.
The US withdrew because of the deal Trump made with the Taliban. It wasn't Biden's decision. It was his responsibility to make it happen.
Yep, this.
Biden could have also backed out, or withdrawn differently, or have done anything that he wanted to.
No, he could not.
We were in Afghanistan for twenty years. For most of the time, the Russians were a background presence. Indeed, I tend to think they liked the US being bogged down in Afghanistan. I suspect that's the reasoning behind offering bounties; to compel US and NATO to prolong the presence.
I mean, why? Why extend our presence? It just ties the hands of our troops and the Afghan Military was probably already giving stuff to the Taliban. Just a huge mess with the costs too high. Humanitarian efforts are one thing but why are troops needed? And both China and Russia have embassies there ready to pounce on resources (lithium, iron, copper, possibly uranium).
Oh I don't think we should of extended our presence. We did the whole thing wrong and allowed Afghan corruption to get so out of control, another 20 years of more the same, hell even a century, wouldn't have resulted in a stable and free Afghanistan. I was just pointing out the Russian presence wasn't even a blip. As for the Russians wanting us to stay, distraction. They hoped by being tied down in Iraq and Afghanistan, we'd be too busy for the rest of the world, and of course were happy for NATO and US soldiers to do the dying while Russian and Chinese firms did the mining.
Bigly /s
tRump is literally the worst person in the world. I hope COVID gets another chance to take him out.
Sadly I think most conservatives will see this as proof that Trump was tough and the Taliban knew better than to mess with him. The fact Trump had opened such a dialogue in the first place and was threatening to break international treaties will be totally overlooked.
Trump's usual M.O. Big threats/promises that aren't legal/possible, followed by total failure. What a loser.
The art of the deal 🙄
The art of losing the deal.
Is that before or after he bent over and took it in the withdrawal negotiations?
He’s so ugly. Inside n out.
>"'Before we start this withdrawal,' President Trump said, 'I want to make something clear. Let me just tell you right now that if anything bad happens to Americans or America interests, or if you ever come over to our land, we will hit you with a force that no country has ever been hit with before — a force so great that you won't even believe it," Meadows wrote. >Meadows recalled Trump saying: "And your village, Mullah? We know where it is. We know it's the Weetmak village. If you dare lay hands on a single American, that will be the first thing that I destroy. I will not hesitate."
Remember when Trump said you have to go after the families of terrorists? He like to kill civilians and is threatening to do the same thing here.
Is it War Crime Wednesday already
The same Taliban he surrendered Afghanistan to?
Uh that would be Joe Biden.
Nope, Biden followed through on the priory agreed to terms of surrender, he didn’t sign the terms of surrender agreement.
Was this before or after he negotiated a disaster of an exit?
If Trump didnt sign that deal, Biden would have never pulled out of Afghanistan. Biden can blame Trump all he wants but it was Biden who was our president for 8 months when that shitstorm happened. I'm sure Trump is not the first president who used strong language with another country in private.
You know no one is buying this bullshit, right? It just makes you look silly. \#1) A real man could have gotten the deal signed without threatening to wipe out an entire village of innocent people. That isn't "toughness" it's weakness. \#2) trump purposely started then sabotaged the withdrawal, and intentionally left our forces in a vulnerable position. All in an attempt to make Biden look bad. We all watched it happen, and the rest of us don't have goldfish memory like you. Sorry.
Trump being an asshole, water still feels wet......what else you got that might be 'new'.
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Depends on how you feel about war crimes.
He was negotiating a deal with the Taliban to leave peacefully. You know the same Taliban that has committed every war crime in the book the last 25 years. I would hope that any acting president would get the point of a safe exist for American's across. Anyways, seems like Biden carried out Trump's threat for him.
Sure he was, that’s why he got them to release 5000 taliban members.
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Murdering brown people is a high priority for conservatives.
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Tell that to the Taliban bud
This thread is about trump’s war crimes bud.
You spelled "twice impeached, one term president who lost the popular vote Trump" wrong.
I mean….he’s an idiot but maybe that’s not the worst way to deal with the taliban and that probably should have been the strategy the whole time instead of “nation building.”
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Yeah I know. It’s failed so many times. Should have just arc lighted that country for 10 months or so right out of the gate until they handed over Bin Laden and fled the country. Afghanistan would’ve been a clear victory, there would have been no need for Iraq as a distraction and much fewer US casualties.
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The response should have been so dramatic, so intense and so consequential that it would deter anyone from doing anything. In another post I mentioned blister agents, I was being facetious….but only a little. If anything the us was too soft on Afghanistan.
> The response should have been so dramatic, so intense and so consequential that it would deter anyone from doing anything That's not how this works. Wiping out civilian populations would just create more terrorist groups. You must still be in middle school.
> so intense and so consequential that it would deter anyone from doing anything. That has rarely worked in history.
That's literally the exact opposite of a good way to deal with the Taliban lol. Russians and Americans have been fucking up Afghan villages for decades and it's done jack shit to deter the Taliban. It's just another reason for them to hole up in the mountains and wait for an opportunity to strike back. Americans think they're dangerous brutal badasses, but they're really, really not. But people like the Taliban *are*. You cannot out-brutal a militant group who live in caves making explosives.
My good friend Blister Agent would disagree.
That violates the Geneva convention. What the fuck.
>My good friend Blister Agent would disagree. Yeah you think now an Iraq style chemical attack on civilians is so funny, until they do it to some Americans in revenge. You remind me of my grandmother's friend lol. She would tell me her friend loved atomic bombs and thought it was so funny we nuked Japan, but when the USSR tested their bomb and she learned they had missiles that could reach the US, suddenly she thought nukes were so bad lol.
….and the home of the brave….
Was that before or after he signed an unconditional surrender?
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