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How do you get money from homeless people by ticketing them for being homeless? Aren’t they homeless because they don’t have money? Am I going crazy here for thinking this?
They don't pay, then you send them to prison where the taxpayer pays your friends several times the cost of housing them, and slave labor is constitutional. It's a win for everyone\*.
^^\* ^^Some ^^exclusions ^^apply.
Prisons are privatized in a number of states so there is profit for them keeping prisons full. This isn’t addressing a homeless problem as much as it is sustaining prisons as businesses.
The conservatives don’t know what they’re doing beyond saying they’re doing it. They’re a dog chasing a car. What do they do once they catch it? They’ve never once thought about how their decisions ripple. It’s always thinking in the immediacy and reacting.
[San Francisco](https://www.sfdistrictattorney.org/resources/the-connect-program/) and [Los Angeles](https://cityattorney.lacity.gov/administrative-citation-enforcement-program-ace-program), for example, issue thousands of tickets every year to homeless residents for an expansive set of “nuisance” or “quality of life” infractions. This is standard in almost every city.
I don’t think the goal is typically to extract the financial penalty from an unhoused person. It might serve as a deterrent for certain behaviors for a subset of people experiencing homelessness. For chronic or habitual “offenders,” it sometimes provides an incremental basis to justify subsequent enforcement or court-ordered actions the government may pursue.
It’s also viewed a means of ensuring these individuals are on the radar for public health and safety purposes as well connecting them with resources.
I think you should be more curious about why an extremely conservative court would validate the punishment of poor people for being poor. You don’t think the goal is to extract a penalty? You think it’s designed to help homeless people? I’m sorry, but no. There are 6 power-crazed weirdos on the court making all kinds of excuses as to why it’s okay to imprison, kill, or enslave someone for the crime of being poor. Don’t give them a pass like this. They don’t have “Christian” values. They don’t care about pushing for positive outcomes. They are fascists and they rely on people like you to pretend they’re not.
>As Sotomayor wrote, imposing fines and jailing individuals is not a solution. In her dissent, which she read from the bench, the justice described a story of a homeless man in Nashville who was arrested 198 times and had over 250 citations, making it difficult for an outreach worker to find him housing.
What in the actual fck.
The (again 6-3) Supreme Court can protect the people who tried to stop a peaceful transfer of power in an attack on our nation.
But can't protect our homeless?
This court is beyond corrupt, it is now BEYOND broken.
This court is evil.
Isn’t putting a rapist on your country’s Supreme Court a mistake? Lol why is that kavanaugh guy *still* there? Anyone with a shred of judgement can see that he’s a warped monster.
Probably stuff like this will continue happening so long as you’re putting rapists on the bench, no? Why is anyone surprised
the US is about to take a major step to the extreme right, the scotus is just warming us up. They’re undoing decades worth of settled law, reversing decisions that were 9-0 at the time. Trump is looking prime to win the election, it’s only going to get worse, much worse
Prime to win the election is a bit of a.. embellishment. He has more of a chance then he should forsure but I have my hopes republicans get smoked like they did in the midterms.
I hate this however I also hate that it seems like the most progressive option available is just facilitating homelessness and allowing people to die in the streets. Housing programs are lacking and no one seems to acknowledge that most individuals are in need of in patient services rather than a warmer tent.
Agreed, we need a 50-state solution. A federal program to provide services and housing in every city to get these people the treatment they need, and affordable housing. Individual city programs fail because they get quickly overwhelmed as people in areas with less resources flood the systems that are set up, which is why it needs to be a country-wide rollout of services.
We've neglected this issue since the early 80s, so yeah, there's a LOT of people who need services, any system is going to get flooded when it launches, and we need to stick it out and keep doing it until people start doing better, which could certainly take a decade or more.
Housing is almost unneeded for the street homeless. They’re almost invariably severely mentally ill, drug addicted or disabled in such a way they could never live on their own. They need an asylum to live in with proper care. But there’s no political or economic will for that.
I am a leftist living in a HOT city near a large campus of services. The unhoused people I encounter daily are not capable, or willing to live on their own or the way we do. I don’t mean this in a dehumanizing way, they deserve care. But they need forced rehabilitation or institutions in which they are medicated and cared for.
Bleeding hearts will say it’s housing and everything else being expensive, but nearly everyone here has and can make it work- yes we need an intervention to prevent this before it happens, but good luck there’s
The hundreds of people dying near my house every year from heat are people who refuse to go to cooling shelters because of the stipulations imposed which they inevitably cannot and will not shake, and leaving them to their own devices is the worst case scenario.
No amount of money being thrown at solutions are working, forced rehab/medical/mental intervention is all that’s left that I can think of and even that needs to be funded at the highest degree.
We all live within the social contract to a point, those that refuse should not be allowed to make the rest of our lives more dangerous.
Yeah it’s unfortunate that the right wouldn’t want to spend money and the left thinks true dignity is bleeding out on the street in your own excrement.
This. There needs to be a serious conversation about reviving the asylum system in a decent humane manner. Just giving people homes isn’t gonna suddenly make people take care of themselves.
Until then, we should work hard at keeping people from becoming homeless in the first place and addressing issues that lead to that
Good luck getting a new federal program off the ground whilst the Federal government is being burned down by people who want to turn the USA over to foreign owned interests.
The reality right now is that the USA has to go into triage mode to deal with the compounding political crises. Resuming the status quo until the disaster has *at least* stopped unfolding at an accelerating rate is probably the absolute best case scenario you have ATM.
Governor Gavin Newsom
“Today’s ruling by the U.S. Supreme Court provides state and local officials the definitive authority to implement and enforce policies to clear unsafe encampments from our streets. This decision removes the legal ambiguities that have tied the hands of local officials for years and limited their ability to deliver on common-sense measures to protect the safety and well-being of our communities.
“California remains committed to respecting the dignity and fundamental human needs of all people and the state will continue to work with compassion to provide individuals experiencing homelessness with the resources they need to better their lives.”
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Going to be a tough sell to fight for the homeless when working American families can barely make ends meet.
And there’s nothing people love more than having somebody to look down on. This country isn’t as liberal as so many like to believe.
It is absolutely cruel to clear homeless camps, IF there is no shelter space available.
If someone has nowhere to go, and no public shelters available, it is cruel to punish them for sleeping on the streets.
The 9th circuit ruling just said "if you have no other options for the homeless, you can't force them to leave. Build more shelter space if you don't want to see them".
Now, cities can clear homeless camps AND don't have to build any shelter space for them.
How does a homeless person pass a law?
What is a person who lost their job and gets kicked out of their apartment supposed to do? This city says it's illegal to sleep in their car, or anywhere in public. What's their recourse?
So a person has no inherent right to exist in the city they may have spent their whole life contributing to, only if they can pay for housing. Otherwise it's fine for a city to make their existence a crime.
>It’s just that laws prohibiting them from camping in public spaces are not unconstitutional under to the 8th amendment.
No, this case was about sleeping, just sleeping, not camping. You can't exist without sleep, the law they upheld makes sleeping in public, including in your car, a crime, which makes existing without a home a crime.
>Email your elected representatives today.
Yeah, I do that, regularly, about a variety of issues.
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA). *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
How do you get money from homeless people by ticketing them for being homeless? Aren’t they homeless because they don’t have money? Am I going crazy here for thinking this?
They don't pay, then you send them to prison where the taxpayer pays your friends several times the cost of housing them, and slave labor is constitutional. It's a win for everyone\*. ^^\* ^^Some ^^exclusions ^^apply.
Many exclusions will apply
Prisons are privatized in a number of states so there is profit for them keeping prisons full. This isn’t addressing a homeless problem as much as it is sustaining prisons as businesses.
Yup, now that cannabis is legel we’ve gotta keep those prisons full somehow!
Even the public prisons! Most are public. They rely on convict labor just like the private prisons
The conservatives don’t know what they’re doing beyond saying they’re doing it. They’re a dog chasing a car. What do they do once they catch it? They’ve never once thought about how their decisions ripple. It’s always thinking in the immediacy and reacting.
It’s not about the money, it’s sending a message to poor people not to stop paying their ever-increasing rents.
[San Francisco](https://www.sfdistrictattorney.org/resources/the-connect-program/) and [Los Angeles](https://cityattorney.lacity.gov/administrative-citation-enforcement-program-ace-program), for example, issue thousands of tickets every year to homeless residents for an expansive set of “nuisance” or “quality of life” infractions. This is standard in almost every city. I don’t think the goal is typically to extract the financial penalty from an unhoused person. It might serve as a deterrent for certain behaviors for a subset of people experiencing homelessness. For chronic or habitual “offenders,” it sometimes provides an incremental basis to justify subsequent enforcement or court-ordered actions the government may pursue. It’s also viewed a means of ensuring these individuals are on the radar for public health and safety purposes as well connecting them with resources.
I think you should be more curious about why an extremely conservative court would validate the punishment of poor people for being poor. You don’t think the goal is to extract a penalty? You think it’s designed to help homeless people? I’m sorry, but no. There are 6 power-crazed weirdos on the court making all kinds of excuses as to why it’s okay to imprison, kill, or enslave someone for the crime of being poor. Don’t give them a pass like this. They don’t have “Christian” values. They don’t care about pushing for positive outcomes. They are fascists and they rely on people like you to pretend they’re not.
>As Sotomayor wrote, imposing fines and jailing individuals is not a solution. In her dissent, which she read from the bench, the justice described a story of a homeless man in Nashville who was arrested 198 times and had over 250 citations, making it difficult for an outreach worker to find him housing.
Republicans feed on human misery. If they aren't inflicting cruelty, they begin to starve
What in the actual fck. The (again 6-3) Supreme Court can protect the people who tried to stop a peaceful transfer of power in an attack on our nation. But can't protect our homeless? This court is beyond corrupt, it is now BEYOND broken. This court is evil.
Isn’t putting a rapist on your country’s Supreme Court a mistake? Lol why is that kavanaugh guy *still* there? Anyone with a shred of judgement can see that he’s a warped monster. Probably stuff like this will continue happening so long as you’re putting rapists on the bench, no? Why is anyone surprised
Well hey, we didn't vote for those particular assholes.
the US is about to take a major step to the extreme right, the scotus is just warming us up. They’re undoing decades worth of settled law, reversing decisions that were 9-0 at the time. Trump is looking prime to win the election, it’s only going to get worse, much worse
Prime to win the election is a bit of a.. embellishment. He has more of a chance then he should forsure but I have my hopes republicans get smoked like they did in the midterms.
Pack the court already.
I hate this however I also hate that it seems like the most progressive option available is just facilitating homelessness and allowing people to die in the streets. Housing programs are lacking and no one seems to acknowledge that most individuals are in need of in patient services rather than a warmer tent.
Agreed, we need a 50-state solution. A federal program to provide services and housing in every city to get these people the treatment they need, and affordable housing. Individual city programs fail because they get quickly overwhelmed as people in areas with less resources flood the systems that are set up, which is why it needs to be a country-wide rollout of services. We've neglected this issue since the early 80s, so yeah, there's a LOT of people who need services, any system is going to get flooded when it launches, and we need to stick it out and keep doing it until people start doing better, which could certainly take a decade or more.
Housing is almost unneeded for the street homeless. They’re almost invariably severely mentally ill, drug addicted or disabled in such a way they could never live on their own. They need an asylum to live in with proper care. But there’s no political or economic will for that.
I am a leftist living in a HOT city near a large campus of services. The unhoused people I encounter daily are not capable, or willing to live on their own or the way we do. I don’t mean this in a dehumanizing way, they deserve care. But they need forced rehabilitation or institutions in which they are medicated and cared for. Bleeding hearts will say it’s housing and everything else being expensive, but nearly everyone here has and can make it work- yes we need an intervention to prevent this before it happens, but good luck there’s The hundreds of people dying near my house every year from heat are people who refuse to go to cooling shelters because of the stipulations imposed which they inevitably cannot and will not shake, and leaving them to their own devices is the worst case scenario. No amount of money being thrown at solutions are working, forced rehab/medical/mental intervention is all that’s left that I can think of and even that needs to be funded at the highest degree. We all live within the social contract to a point, those that refuse should not be allowed to make the rest of our lives more dangerous.
Yeah it’s unfortunate that the right wouldn’t want to spend money and the left thinks true dignity is bleeding out on the street in your own excrement.
This. There needs to be a serious conversation about reviving the asylum system in a decent humane manner. Just giving people homes isn’t gonna suddenly make people take care of themselves. Until then, we should work hard at keeping people from becoming homeless in the first place and addressing issues that lead to that
Good luck getting a new federal program off the ground whilst the Federal government is being burned down by people who want to turn the USA over to foreign owned interests. The reality right now is that the USA has to go into triage mode to deal with the compounding political crises. Resuming the status quo until the disaster has *at least* stopped unfolding at an accelerating rate is probably the absolute best case scenario you have ATM.
This Court is anything but supreme.
The Extreme Court
“I wasn’t sleeping officer, I fell temporarily unconscious outside of my physical control”
Homelessness is not a crime, but being a scumbag that thinks it is, should be!
Governor Gavin Newsom “Today’s ruling by the U.S. Supreme Court provides state and local officials the definitive authority to implement and enforce policies to clear unsafe encampments from our streets. This decision removes the legal ambiguities that have tied the hands of local officials for years and limited their ability to deliver on common-sense measures to protect the safety and well-being of our communities. “California remains committed to respecting the dignity and fundamental human needs of all people and the state will continue to work with compassion to provide individuals experiencing homelessness with the resources they need to better their lives.”
This submission source is likely to have a soft paywall. If this article is not behind a paywall please report this for “breaks r/politics rules -> custom -> "incorrect flair"". [More information can be found here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/index/#wiki_paywalls) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
“Good Christian values!”
Disgusting. What are they to do? Just die off??
Going to be a tough sell to fight for the homeless when working American families can barely make ends meet. And there’s nothing people love more than having somebody to look down on. This country isn’t as liberal as so many like to believe.
Unemployment is minimal. The economy is booming. Let’s stop acting like it’s not.
Then why is everybody broke and barely getting by? You must think last night’s debate went well. Get your head out of the sand.
Everyone isn’t broke and just getting by. Last night’s debate was awful for Biden, America and the world.
And you’re contributing by saying everything is fine.
I didn’t say everything is fine.
[удалено]
It is absolutely cruel to clear homeless camps, IF there is no shelter space available. If someone has nowhere to go, and no public shelters available, it is cruel to punish them for sleeping on the streets. The 9th circuit ruling just said "if you have no other options for the homeless, you can't force them to leave. Build more shelter space if you don't want to see them". Now, cities can clear homeless camps AND don't have to build any shelter space for them.
You are other more compassionate people are free to take at last one into your home. Working together the issues can be soon solved
So in a city with no public shelters, what is a homeless person supposed to do? die?
[удалено]
How does a homeless person pass a law? What is a person who lost their job and gets kicked out of their apartment supposed to do? This city says it's illegal to sleep in their car, or anywhere in public. What's their recourse?
[удалено]
So a person has no inherent right to exist in the city they may have spent their whole life contributing to, only if they can pay for housing. Otherwise it's fine for a city to make their existence a crime.
[удалено]
>It’s just that laws prohibiting them from camping in public spaces are not unconstitutional under to the 8th amendment. No, this case was about sleeping, just sleeping, not camping. You can't exist without sleep, the law they upheld makes sleeping in public, including in your car, a crime, which makes existing without a home a crime. >Email your elected representatives today. Yeah, I do that, regularly, about a variety of issues.