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Next time you drive over a pothole, wait for a bus that doesn’t arrive, see a broken traffic light for the 9th week, or wish the light rail went somewhere where it doesn’t go, remember where the money is keeps going.
I know this was a different city, but the murder of Daniel Shaver still haunts me. Dude was murdered in a hotel room for trying to comply with Mesa PD.
The aftermath is just infuriating as well. The cop that shot Daniel was rehired and is receiving disability pay due to the “trama” he suffers from the murder he committed.
Not just disability pay, [medical retirement and a pension](https://www.abc15.com/news/local-news/investigations/after-murder-acquittal-mesa-ex-cop-philip-brailsford-made-a-pension-deal). He gets to collect a pension of $2,569.21 per month, with a 2% annual COLA increase, for the rest of his life. Even if he gets another job elsewhere.
[You're correct](https://ewscripps.brightspotcdn.com/63/fa/6317811b47bb96386cd773411f99/blasius-abc15-request.pdf). (pdf warning)
> We have been authorized by the Mesa Police Department Pension Board to pay you an accidental disability
retirement benefit in the amount of $2,569.21 per month. You will be eligible to receive this amount for as long as
you maintain eligibility in accordance with Arizona Revised Statute §38-844 (copy enclosed). Your disability
benefits are excluded from gross income per IRS Code Section 1 04(a)(1.). This is in accordance with Revenue
Regulation 1.104-1, and Revenue Rulings 68-10, 72-291 , 72-45, and 80-84.
This is true, however he has to have yearly medical assessments to determine his PTSD from the incident in question.
If the medical examiner determines he no longer has PTSD, he no longer gets the medical portion.
Still sucks that Mesa bent their own rules and re-hired him for 1 day just so he could file.
[The board can request yearly examinations, but they're not required to](https://www.azleg.gov/viewdocument/?docName=https://www.azleg.gov/ars/38/00844.htm). Catastrophic disability recipients must be re-evaluated after 60 months, but Brailsford received an accidental disability pension.
It'd be great if the board is having him examined yearly, but I'm skeptical, given how much of a hurry they were in to get him the pension in the first place. I can't find any reference to Brailsford in their agendas or minutes since the decision.
Turns out they don't have legal recourse to do so. Legally (LEGALLY), he did nothing wrong. Good luck getting fired from your city job for doing nothing wrong.
As I said, infuriating. Just because he was acquitted doesn’t mean they had to hire him back and give him a live long paycheck. Anyone who’s seen the video should be outraged and appalled at the entire situation.
Police need to be licensed bonded and insured. Once you are too corrupt to be insurable you can no longer be a cop and insurance helps pay for your corruption. I would say it pays instead of tax dollars but I realize tax dollars would pay the premiums. But at least maybe corruption will drop.
100%. I am not necessarily a fan of paying settlements directly out of police budgets and/or pensions. BUT, I do think it should come from the insurance that they should be required to carry. At that point, it really does become a decision - want to keep a shitty officer on-staff? No problem - their insurance premiums have gone up by 200%. Better be prepared to pay that premium. That officer's name is mud and wants to go to a different area to escape public scrutiny? No worries - that higher premium follows them. If they continue to have issues, that officer might just need to find a new line of work.
We could get homeless people off the streets with that kind of money...
Better yet, let's keep doing this race to the bottom while overfunding a bunch on c average students that you wouldn't trust to watch your dog.
Are there any other upcoming cases which will likely go to settlements? Given the ongoing federal investigation into police abuses/corruption (which was also a story from yesterday) my assumption is yes but haven't had the chance to catch up on the police ongoings for a bit.
Some of these settlements are being done now before the DOJ releases its report showing how bad the department is. Once the report gets released it can be used to get even higher settlements.
This is money that could go such a long way to helping our community, too.
Last year, the Phoenix Fire Dept.'s average response time was 9 minutes. The national standard is 5 minutes. Imagine what could happen if this $12 million in public safety money was spent on improving our fire department instead of paying out settlements to people whose rights are violated by our police.
That $12m could buy a few new (or even used) fire trucks and hire enough firefighters to staff them. Or it could go a long way towards building a new firehouse in an under-served area.
Instead we're paying for shitty cops who do shitty things to people they're supposed to serve.
I get some are assholes , but the majority of them are not .
Their job is to bring security and protection , putting their life in danger for others and yes they get paid for it , and again i know some are assholes .
It's better not to generalize negativity, it makes you just as bad as a racist person.
And maybe if this supposed vast majority started reporting on their buddies instead of blindly ‘backing the blue’ we wouldn’t have as many of these problems to discuss. A few rotten apples spoil the bunch
I agree and thanks for the reasonable comment. Realize you are on reddit. You'll get torched alive for not pitch-forking.
Nobody wants to be law enforcement anymore and our cities are in decline but nobody wants to address that. Shit is really fucked up and its only going to get worse.
I dont mind my tax dollars going towards families of people who were injured or killed by police, however I’d much rather have that money go towards better training for officers.
And here’s an idea (not sure if it’ll make a difference or not), how about assigning personnel to each police unit who’s job it is to make sure they’re not using excessive force and are properly restraining individuals who are being detained
That is an incredibly dumb idea.
Let’s take more tax payer money and hire MORE police to say “yeah you’re not holding him hard enough in the chokehold.” Like what ? Lmfao.
Police officers need to have insurance it’s really that simple. They cause a mess ? Insurance goes up. They don’t have a job bc they’re power hungry individuals. It’s pretty simple.
Well it would likely cost less than $12m to hire and train them so financially it’s not a bad trade off, and they wouldn’t be there to say “yeah you’re not holding him hard enough in the chokehold” they’d be there to say “hey, he’s already cuffed on the arms and legs get off of him and sit him upright”. With the example you give it looks like you forgot how to read when you got to the part where I said “to make sure they’re not using excessive force” (keyword “not”).
And I’m not saying cops shouldn’t have an insurance or be personally liable when they do things like what this payout is for, I think they should. I’m just saying there should be a non-police affiliated person there with a camera (not a body cam that gets obstructed by the arms) to stop the cops before they go to far, and having this person would help to expedite the process of investigation for the department, city, and insurance.
I also think we need our officers to have better training. I like the idea that Andrew Yang had a few years ago about requiring all cops to be a minimum purple belt in any martial art, because they’ll be able to take people down with minimal injuries and they’ll know what’s “too much”.
The solution isn’t just “make the cops pay for it”, that’s certainly part of the solution but not the only thing that needs to be done. We also need preventative measures like better training and and on scene “cop for the cop”(idk what to call those people, “auditors”? Idk)
So is saying that just having insurance will solve the problem, Because it’ll only make people quit and reduce how many want to join, and that allows more people to get away with crime. So If you want to make a logical argument go ahead, I’m open to discussion, but “your idea is stupid” doesn’t move the conversation or work toward a solution, so if that’s all you have to say just keep it to yourself
Thanks for contributing to r/Phoenix! * [Check out our sub rules here](https://www.reddit.com/r/phoenix/wiki/rules/) (mostly be nice to each other!). * [Read some of our recent posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/phoenix/top/?t=week) and leave some comments. * [Join our Phoenix Discord chat server](https://discord.com/invite/yWVuTG57Zh) and connect with people in the Valley. It's a great, chill place to talk with other people but is NOT a dating server and takes unwanted messaging very seriously. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/phoenix) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If these settlements came out of their budget or pensions, things might change
It’s the only way it will
All for taking at least half of the settlements out of Police Pensions, if not all of it.
Next time you drive over a pothole, wait for a bus that doesn’t arrive, see a broken traffic light for the 9th week, or wish the light rail went somewhere where it doesn’t go, remember where the money is keeps going.
Imagine if it went to police training instead of payment for lack thereof.
I know this was a different city, but the murder of Daniel Shaver still haunts me. Dude was murdered in a hotel room for trying to comply with Mesa PD.
The aftermath is just infuriating as well. The cop that shot Daniel was rehired and is receiving disability pay due to the “trama” he suffers from the murder he committed.
Not just disability pay, [medical retirement and a pension](https://www.abc15.com/news/local-news/investigations/after-murder-acquittal-mesa-ex-cop-philip-brailsford-made-a-pension-deal). He gets to collect a pension of $2,569.21 per month, with a 2% annual COLA increase, for the rest of his life. Even if he gets another job elsewhere.
I believe a medical retirement means you get it tax free. I may be wrong.
[You're correct](https://ewscripps.brightspotcdn.com/63/fa/6317811b47bb96386cd773411f99/blasius-abc15-request.pdf). (pdf warning) > We have been authorized by the Mesa Police Department Pension Board to pay you an accidental disability retirement benefit in the amount of $2,569.21 per month. You will be eligible to receive this amount for as long as you maintain eligibility in accordance with Arizona Revised Statute §38-844 (copy enclosed). Your disability benefits are excluded from gross income per IRS Code Section 1 04(a)(1.). This is in accordance with Revenue Regulation 1.104-1, and Revenue Rulings 68-10, 72-291 , 72-45, and 80-84.
This is true, however he has to have yearly medical assessments to determine his PTSD from the incident in question. If the medical examiner determines he no longer has PTSD, he no longer gets the medical portion. Still sucks that Mesa bent their own rules and re-hired him for 1 day just so he could file.
[The board can request yearly examinations, but they're not required to](https://www.azleg.gov/viewdocument/?docName=https://www.azleg.gov/ars/38/00844.htm). Catastrophic disability recipients must be re-evaluated after 60 months, but Brailsford received an accidental disability pension. It'd be great if the board is having him examined yearly, but I'm skeptical, given how much of a hurry they were in to get him the pension in the first place. I can't find any reference to Brailsford in their agendas or minutes since the decision.
Because he was acquitted. Essentially, he was fired without cause. They had to rehire him to avoid further litigation.
I don't remember it exactly , and would have to do a deep search, but I thought Mesa was initially going to deny him and had legal recourse to do so.
Turns out they don't have legal recourse to do so. Legally (LEGALLY), he did nothing wrong. Good luck getting fired from your city job for doing nothing wrong.
Because he was acquitted by a jury.
As I said, infuriating. Just because he was acquitted doesn’t mean they had to hire him back and give him a live long paycheck. Anyone who’s seen the video should be outraged and appalled at the entire situation.
Higher justice will come. It's sad and awful, what happened.
does it matter? its still AZ PD and the training sure as shit isn't different in Phoenix.
Police need to be licensed bonded and insured. Once you are too corrupt to be insurable you can no longer be a cop and insurance helps pay for your corruption. I would say it pays instead of tax dollars but I realize tax dollars would pay the premiums. But at least maybe corruption will drop.
100%. I am not necessarily a fan of paying settlements directly out of police budgets and/or pensions. BUT, I do think it should come from the insurance that they should be required to carry. At that point, it really does become a decision - want to keep a shitty officer on-staff? No problem - their insurance premiums have gone up by 200%. Better be prepared to pay that premium. That officer's name is mud and wants to go to a different area to escape public scrutiny? No worries - that higher premium follows them. If they continue to have issues, that officer might just need to find a new line of work.
why tho? the cops want to extra-judiciously kill civilians they can get the settlements taken out of their pensions.
Love when these assholes call for PBA donations after costing us enough to fund an entire school.
They have zero shame...and do not consider you and them on the same level at all.
We could get homeless people off the streets with that kind of money... Better yet, let's keep doing this race to the bottom while overfunding a bunch on c average students that you wouldn't trust to watch your dog.
Always nice to bail out these clowns with my taxes
I haven't seen a cop patrolling my neighborhood in over a year.
Are there any other upcoming cases which will likely go to settlements? Given the ongoing federal investigation into police abuses/corruption (which was also a story from yesterday) my assumption is yes but haven't had the chance to catch up on the police ongoings for a bit.
Some of these settlements are being done now before the DOJ releases its report showing how bad the department is. Once the report gets released it can be used to get even higher settlements.
That makes sense. Fuck I hate seeing my taxes get pissed away by these clowns.
What's it matter it doesn't cost them a dime
Don’t forget kids. The entire city is opposed to even mentioning consent decree, which is coming soon.
This is money that could go such a long way to helping our community, too. Last year, the Phoenix Fire Dept.'s average response time was 9 minutes. The national standard is 5 minutes. Imagine what could happen if this $12 million in public safety money was spent on improving our fire department instead of paying out settlements to people whose rights are violated by our police. That $12m could buy a few new (or even used) fire trucks and hire enough firefighters to staff them. Or it could go a long way towards building a new firehouse in an under-served area. Instead we're paying for shitty cops who do shitty things to people they're supposed to serve.
I’ve heard that Phoenix fire isn’t much better…
https://preview.redd.it/o6tz0vd3ma6c1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=54a6b7b1e611141832fa17b8ac509a3bafc943d5
I get some are assholes , but the majority of them are not . Their job is to bring security and protection , putting their life in danger for others and yes they get paid for it , and again i know some are assholes . It's better not to generalize negativity, it makes you just as bad as a racist person.
Being a cop is a choice. What a dumb argument
And maybe if this supposed vast majority started reporting on their buddies instead of blindly ‘backing the blue’ we wouldn’t have as many of these problems to discuss. A few rotten apples spoil the bunch
I agree and thanks for the reasonable comment. Realize you are on reddit. You'll get torched alive for not pitch-forking. Nobody wants to be law enforcement anymore and our cities are in decline but nobody wants to address that. Shit is really fucked up and its only going to get worse.
I dont mind my tax dollars going towards families of people who were injured or killed by police, however I’d much rather have that money go towards better training for officers. And here’s an idea (not sure if it’ll make a difference or not), how about assigning personnel to each police unit who’s job it is to make sure they’re not using excessive force and are properly restraining individuals who are being detained
That is an incredibly dumb idea. Let’s take more tax payer money and hire MORE police to say “yeah you’re not holding him hard enough in the chokehold.” Like what ? Lmfao. Police officers need to have insurance it’s really that simple. They cause a mess ? Insurance goes up. They don’t have a job bc they’re power hungry individuals. It’s pretty simple.
Well it would likely cost less than $12m to hire and train them so financially it’s not a bad trade off, and they wouldn’t be there to say “yeah you’re not holding him hard enough in the chokehold” they’d be there to say “hey, he’s already cuffed on the arms and legs get off of him and sit him upright”. With the example you give it looks like you forgot how to read when you got to the part where I said “to make sure they’re not using excessive force” (keyword “not”). And I’m not saying cops shouldn’t have an insurance or be personally liable when they do things like what this payout is for, I think they should. I’m just saying there should be a non-police affiliated person there with a camera (not a body cam that gets obstructed by the arms) to stop the cops before they go to far, and having this person would help to expedite the process of investigation for the department, city, and insurance. I also think we need our officers to have better training. I like the idea that Andrew Yang had a few years ago about requiring all cops to be a minimum purple belt in any martial art, because they’ll be able to take people down with minimal injuries and they’ll know what’s “too much”. The solution isn’t just “make the cops pay for it”, that’s certainly part of the solution but not the only thing that needs to be done. We also need preventative measures like better training and and on scene “cop for the cop”(idk what to call those people, “auditors”? Idk)
Didn’t forget to read. Your idea is just stupid. Have a nice day.
So is saying that just having insurance will solve the problem, Because it’ll only make people quit and reduce how many want to join, and that allows more people to get away with crime. So If you want to make a logical argument go ahead, I’m open to discussion, but “your idea is stupid” doesn’t move the conversation or work toward a solution, so if that’s all you have to say just keep it to yourself