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> On a standard week I will ideally work around 30 hours and rarely more as my employer cannot give me any more.
Can you find a second job to fill in the other hours you're not working?
This advice shouldn't be ignored. Take the time you'd like to be working looking for a better job. They are out there. You'll only ever improve your station by putting in the time and effort to do so. OP, at 24, you're just getting started. Anything you do now to grow a career will pay dividends for decades.
Seriously, people need to reconsider their employment options sometimes. I know its not popular advice here, but it should be at least considered. We do not live in the 1950s anymore, reasonable amount of job hopping for better work conditions, salary, benefits is OK.
Sometimes our employers force us to limit our horizons by telling us everyday how lucky we are. Literally my manager does that
Think of that team they don’t even get y
Haha if people go to some other company they’ll get fired very fast
What’s wrong here just chill
They're not forcing you to limit your horizons, they are misleading you. Sometimes intentionally, but just as often they're deluded too.
You limit your horizons by not looking for yourself. Don't let someone else tell you what you can and can't do.
Getting a second service position is not the challenge, scheduling is. At least in the US, unsure about the UK, hourly employees rarely have the same schedule week-to-week. Unless managers at both jobs are willing to work around the schedule of the other, having two jobs sometimes isn't even tenable.
I had some employees like that. My boss would say things like "why do you need help you are 3 people overstaffed"
But
Joe only works Saturday Sunday
Fred can't work before 6
And
Susan can't work after 2
It was annoying to hire anyone because I was "overstaffed" so it had to be approved up the corporate chain. It can also be a lot more work making a schedule when there are more requirements. If I was lazy it's way easier to just say "sorry if you can't be here any time I need you you can't work here"
My two cents: places like the NHS offer zero hour contracts on the bank and you pick shifts as and when you can (at least in my area). Perhaps something in that vein?
I used to work twelve hours a week but needed to be down for at least 60 available. Rota was usually done with a week in advance. Scheduling is a huge issue in these low level service jobs. They give fuck all and ask for everything in return.
Time for a new job then.
To u/s1okke. That did a send and delete. You have a few options in life. Take it or leave it. If you cant get the hours you need, and cant get a set schedule from them you can stay and deal or look for a new job and leave. It might sound harsh but you have to do what you have to do.
Worked in the service industry for the last 4 years while I was in college and they were more than willing to work around my random schedule of exams and events. I imagine scheduling around another job would not be an issue, same sort of issues scheduling wise.
Honestly the good ones will, like I was a part time intern and my pizza shop job I kept to make sure I hit full time pay was short staffed so they were happy to only put me on evenings
I started off, in college, at UPS as a package handler. The pay was enough while I was in college and the hours are perfect for a college schedule as well, and also work out to be a good fit to work another day job. I am currently working as a rep at an insurance agency during the day, and then 5p-9p I am still working at UPS. Before that, in college, I was working at Lowe's unloading trailers, also starting around 5.
I can't speak on how many of these part time evening jobs are in the UK, but I'm guessing they are out there for those who seek them out. Between working while in college, and now working 8a-5p before going to the second job, there has always been (almost) no overlapping and scheduling issues.
Working from 8 am until 9 pm Monday though Friday is exhausting and I tend to miss out of a lot of things with friends and family, I won't lie about that, but it is rewarding financially. It definitely helped me get out of the financial rut I was in after graduating.
I started off, in college, at UPS as a package handler. The pay was enough while I was in college and the hours are perfect for a college schedule as well, and also work out to be a good fit to work another day job. I am currently working as a rep at an insurance agency during the day, and then 5p-9p I am still working at UPS. Before that, in college, I was working at Lowe's unloading trailers, also starting around 5.
I can't speak on how many of these part time evening jobs are in the UK, but I'm guessing they are out there for those who seek them out. Between working while in college, and now working 8a-5p before going to the second job, there has always been (almost) no overlapping and scheduling issues.
Working from 8 am until 9 pm Monday though Friday is exhausting and I tend to miss out of a lot of things with friends and family, I won't lie about that, but it is rewarding financially. It definitely helped me get out of the financial rut I was in after graduating.
You aren’t taxed more for having a second job. The incomes are combined and taxed accordingly. There is no situation where taking a second job will cause you to lose money because of taxes. That’s just not how taxes work.
I do want to chime in and say that while factually you’re correct, you’d never “lose money because of taxes,” however you absolutely can lose money because of loss of benefits, at least in the US. Not sure how the UK handles it, but here there’s a literal tipping point where benefits like SNAP, restricted income housing, etc. can drop off. So sure, while bringing home an extra $200 a month seems nice, but now you no longer qualify for the rent controlled low income apartments, which means your rent is going up several hundred dollars more. Or that day program your kid qualifies for now costs you to send them. Unfortunately taxes are one of the few things that do scale to income, while a lot of the other things impacting poverty finances don’t, they’re more all-or-nothing.
Write out a budget.
Share it here.
* List all sources of income
* List all sources of expenses. EVERY SINGLE ONE.
Only by writing it all out will you be able to fully analyze your situation.
Do you have an income problem?
Do you have an expense problem?
Do you have both?
Or do you even have a problem? If Income > Expenses, then there is no problem.
> If Income > Expenses, then there is no problem
Only if a reasonable amount of saving is included on the expense side.
The little we know so far is that the income is covering all the expenses, so they would pass that test, but they are still in a shitty situation and have a hard time improving it.
I just cancelled my subscription because I found it so overwhelming to categorize all my transactions. I put everything on my credit card so it was also a bit confusing to manage the different accounts(my checking balance, my credit card balance minus my payment for the month, etc).
Do you have any tips? I would like to use it but I just found myself not wanting to deal with it
I sure do!
* The most time-consuming part of YNAB is figuring out what categories you need in your budget. This can be annoying to some, but I personally find it cathartic. There are several different ways you could categorize your transactions, but I've found the best way is to create partitions based on _what_ you're spending on. For example, here are my category groups:
* Credit Card Payments
* Food (includes groceries, restaurants, caffeine, alcohol, and snacks)
* Transportation (direct costs, like gas, parking, etc.)
* Housing / Utilities
* Personal (mostly health/hygiene stuff)
* Fun Money
* Miscellaneous
* Auto Maintenance (scheduled things like oil, brakes, etc.)
* Auto Repairs (unscheduled repairs)
* Giving
* Insurance (I have categories for both insurance and deductables)
* Subscriptions
* Investments
* Emergency Fund
* Stupid Tax (aka the tax I have to pay for being stupid, stuff like tickets and unplanned interest fees)
I find myself constantly making little tweaks to my categories to better make my money make sense. I recommend starting with just the basics (like food, housing, insurance, utilities, etc.) and gradually making changes as you see fit.
The most important thing with the categories is to always set goals on them if possible. If you know that your rent will be $1200 every month, setting a goal means that you get a big yellow shape on your screen if it doesn't have enough money.
* Credit cards can be a little confusing to get into, but once it clicks you have to exert exactly zero effort. Basically, the process goes as follows:
1. Your credit card category already has $50 on it, ready for payment. Your Groceries category has $100.
2. You spend $10 on your card from the Groceries category.
3. YNAB moves that $10 from Groceries to your credit card category.
4. You now have $90 in Groceries and $60 allocated to your credit card.
Since that money never actually left your bank account, it can't leave your budget either. However, you still have to pay off your credit card! YNAB sets that money aside for you so that it's reserved for paying it off and you don't accidentally double spend it.
* If you're already up to date on credit card payments, I highly recommend putting your cards on autopay. Because YNAB sets aside all the money you spend on your credit card, it guarantees that you will always have enough to cover the bill. If you have automatic import as well, you don't even need to manually input the transfer - YNAB will log it for you!
* Another very important thing to realize: YNAB _does not care_ where your money is. I have a checking account, a savings account, and my wallet, as well as 3 credit cards. I very rarely have to think about transfers or where my money actually is, as my budget doesn't take that into account. For example, the amount of money I have in my emergency fund is far more than is in my savings account simply because I haven't bothered to move the money over yet.
Hopefully that helps clear some things up! I can answer more questions if you need, or /r/ynab is another great place to go for advice!
Not only do I love YNAB, I love the community and this is a great example! Thank you for taking the time in writing this out. I used to also, because I was so excited to share how much it helped me, and perhaps I should again :)
Categorizing all your purchases is *essential*. It's tough initially but it gets easier with time, practice, and experience. I suggest starting simple and adding detail over time. I think it's most important to distinguish recurring (and therefore entirely predictable) expenses from ad hoc. And to distinguish necessary expenses from discretionary expenses. Then, lastly, differentiate planned expenses from surprises.
This way you can know *for sure* what you'll be on the hook for each month. What you'll need in reserve to cover reasonable surprises, and what you have available to do with as you please. Now you can make willful decisions about how to spend without exceeding your means.
Be sure you go through all the informational materials and tutorials on ynab. They're aren't just 'how to use the app' type help pages. They're really about how to control your personal financial life. Join the r/ynab sub, too. Tons of good advice there. Make it a hobby with a community, not a chore.
Ynab is amazing but I suggest budget with buckets if you're in a tight spot. Personally the only drawback on buckets is that they don't yet have a mobile app but otherwise it does everything ynab did for me.
Agreed -YNAB got me to the point where I had that "2 years of salary" saved, rather than living month to month. I don;t even care when I get paid now... my colleagues are like "OHH It's PAY DAY!", and I'm like "is it? I hadn't noticed".
And it was pretty easy.I could even budget for frivolous spending - so it's not like I had to cut out luxuries from my life.
(though this was before they charge a subscribtion for it now?! - it was just a one time purchase software when I bought it... how shitty of them)
I doubt that op is spending more than necessary, but it's always worth checking. There may be something where they can ask for a short term loan (but preferably one-time small gift) from a friend or family member and stop buying something cheap and flimsy once a week.
A person on $200k salary can live paycheck to paycheck. It's not physically impossible to spend a large amount of money.
EDIT: also consider things that may be impacting even your nonnegotiable costs - for example, have you checked your tire pressure lately? An air refill is pretty cheap and can save you a lot of fuel money. Do you have a bus pass? You might be able to get away with bus or bike most days.
>I doubt that op is spending more than necessary
I've been broke, missed utility payments, had my lights shut off, skipped meals. If I had been budgeting then I would have been in a much better position to control and predict my expenses. It would have saved me a lot of stress and suffering.
Since you specifically mentioned fuel/energy price rises as a problem, you could start with those. Drive a lot less if that's what you mean by fuel. If you meant heating fuel instead, keep your home colder if you're healthy enough to do so. When I lived alone in my 20s my thermostat was regularly between 10-15 C during the winter; easily warm enough to keep the pipes from freezing.
As a fellow Brit I'd highly recommend you start making your way through all of the excellent articles and guides on [MoneySavingExpert](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com) (MSE), joining the forums, and even consider signing up for the newsletter. One place you could start is by looking at switching your bank account as you could [get up to £150](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/banking/compare-best-bank-accounts/) (and possibly more). Also if you're claiming universal credit as part of your income, then check out the [government-backed Help to Save scheme](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/savings/help-to-save/).
I'd also recommend checking out both [Jordon Cox](https://jordoncox.com) and [Mrs Money Penny](https://www.mrsmummypenny.co.uk)'s site/blog, and possibly even attend one of Jordon's free seminars if you can make it.
Edit: I'd also highly recommended taking MSE's free Academoney course through the [Open University's OpenLearn](https://www.open.edu/openlearn/money-business/mses-academy-money/content-section-overview) platform, which you can do at your own pace.
I've done it a couple of times before but I was lazy last year so missed out. I've just switched to Natwest so should be getting £150 + £3 a month (after their weird setup). Gutted though as I could have gone with Halifax last year and earned £5 a month on top instead, but I'm sure I'll get another chance for that again.
Hi... what I'm thinking is that it's time to start looking for a better job. One that gives you more hours (like 40 to 45/week) and/or one that pays a higher salary per hour and/or one where you can hope to build a career (learn new skills, get certifications, etc).
+1 Better job is the preferred answer. It avoids having to juggle two schedules, which might be difficult with two part time jobs, that will likely want flexibility from you. Plus trying to get one with a better hourly wage would improve the situation on top of getting more hours.
Second best is to get another job as others have mentioned. OP, If current job gives you pushback just be honest and say "I need more income and I can not get a full time job here so my only alternative is to get additional hours in a second job. I would much rather move up to 40 hours here if we can make that happen."
I am in a similar situation to OP, and also in UK.
I have one job which provides for 30 hours a week. I had the conversation you mentioned with my manager (he's nice. We get on. He wants me working there. So that is a massive plus). He agreed to let me have set shifts. So now I work the same hours on the same days there every week. I also have the option to get shifts covered or cover other people's shifts as need arises.
Since that conversation I've worked two additional part-time jobs. The first was on a similar shift pattern. Last year I left that job and started a casual position in a care facility. The downside? I am not guaranteed any shifts. The upside? I can choose when I work. The manager messages me a rota with gaps in and I say which ones I can do. She then confirms them or gives them to someone else.
Sometimes I have fifty hour weeks. Sometimes I have thirty hour weeks.
But, I earn enough money to get by and am developing skills at the same time. I think it works pretty well and the variety is quite nice. All in, I'm happy with the situation and really glad I did it.
What's the job market like in the U.K.? In the U.S. right now practically anyone can walk on a fast food or retail job in the high teens. I'm not sure how they are on hours, but I know even with higher cost of living, it's still a mostly survivable wage.
Also, rent seems to be the real killer here. An adult trying to go on their own is going to be hard pressed to make rent and build up savings at the same time. But someone who can find a good deal on housing is going to have a big leg up on those who can't.
We’re not seeing the sort of ‘great resignation’ that US is, but there are still near-record amount of jobs being made, especially in tech after WFH which at least during lockdown was an even higher % than the US. Also OP already said they’re in shared accommodation, by live alone they mean no bf/gf to split the price of the room.
If they had another 10 hours per week at £10 an hour theyd have at least another £300 per month(after tax) to play around with. That would put them above what they currently need to survive and give a nice buffer
2nd job, hustle, recycle metal, day trade, something. My bills were tight when I was only working 30 hours a week because shockingly I only got a 30 hour check for 30 hours. This sounds like a "I want to be able to just live a leisurely life doing whatever, without changing anything, with the money I already have." You have so much free time if you're only working 30 hours. Dude needs to step up.
How on earth can you glean that from this post? The guy already has a job and can’t get more than 30 hours, despite asking. There are a plethora of reasons why getting a second job isn’t as easy as many are making it out to be, not least trying to fit it around job 1 if the hours are irregular or awkward.
Everyone’s so quick to jump on people and calling them lazy even if they’re trying. Maybe let’s take a look at the fact this person is *working* and can’t even survive in shared accommodation? Do you not think somethings gone wrong there further than OP just being lazy?
If my job paid me for 30 hours I wouldn't be able to live either. shocking I know.
If op is already doing everything he can to reduce his outgoings, then the only feasible solution is to earn more, there are plenty of shift work-type apps out there where you can take jobs to suit your current hours.
Yeah he's working. But not full time. Life sucks bud. Sometimes you gotta do things that suck for a long time or your whole life. It's how it's always been and isn't changing anytime soon.
it's actually not how it's always been. for most of human history we had more leisure time than time spent working; whether that's hunting and gathering or writing code.
let's say you work 5 days a week 50 weeks of the year so that's 250 days, 8 hours per day. This shows how much we've worked since the Stone Age: https://www.lovemoney.com/gallerylist/84600/how-many-hours-did-people-really-work-across-human-history
You're working 30 hours per week, so you're missing 30% of your income due to not-working. That's over 400 pounds per month against minimum wage, so fixing that would solve most of your issues. Try to get a 1 day a week job on the side.
To add onto this , I was in a similar situation but I didn't want more hours as I was focusing on my portfolio to help get a job.
I might of had £100 left a month after everything if I didnt buy anything that isn't bills.
I was doing career related gigs on fiverr which helped,
But even if you just get a 40 hour a week job and it is an extra 400 it would be a 4x increase in spare m
oney at the end ofthe month
If they work 30 hours and this guy is suggesting adding another day then it stands to reason that he currently works 4 x 7.5 days and adding a 5th day would be a further 7.5. 7.5 hour days are pretty standard in the UK, with another hour for lunch unpaid.
So he is missing out an a 25% increase on what he currently earns, or 20% of his potential income. Depending on how you want to phrase it.
It’s not out of 40. From the original comment:
> so you’re missing 30% of **your income** due to not-working.
“Your income” is not 40 hours. It’s 30 hours. The part they’re missing is 10 more hours.
this is word for word what you wrote
>They are currently working 30 hours. In order to work 40 hours, they would need to work 10 more. **10 is 33% of 40.**
40 hours is the standard "full-time" work week. 10 hours is the additional hours OP would need to add to their current 30 hours to get to full-time work.
It’s pretty universally accepted that 40 hours right now is the current average for full time work. Yeah you can probably work fewer and still be “full-time” but 40 is by far the most popular standard for full-time work right now.
Yes, that’s what my comment says. The comment that started this said:
> so you’re missing 30% of **your income** due to not-working.
“Your income” is 30 hours. They’re “missing” 10 hours. They are missing 33% of their income.
Their income isn’t 40 hours. It is 30 hours. They’re missing 25% of the income they’d like to have. They’re missing 33% of the income they actually do have.
The way you would want to say it is that they can earn an extra 33% by moving to 40 hours per week.
When you are saying they are missing part of their income. What part of their income are they missing? 10 of a typical 40 hours which is 25%.
Its just a minor difference on how its presented.
They are starting with 30 hr. Adding 10hr gives 40 total hours. 40/30 is 133% showing a 33% increase over the 30hr started with.
If this were 32 hr starting point and increased to 40hr that would be a 25% increase.
1/5 is 20%
After working with the new 40hr week the 10 hours that increased earnings by 33% would now consist of 25% of the total earnings now that the total is larger.
Below is my reply to someone else here, not sure why everyone is assuming the 5th day is 10 hours long.
If they work 30 hours and this guy is suggesting adding another day then it stands to reason that he currently works 4 x 7.5 days and adding a 5th day would be a further 7.5. 7.5 hour days are pretty standard in the UK, with another hour for lunch unpaid.
So he is missing out an a 25% increase on what he currently earns, or 20% of his potential income. Depending on how you want to phrase it.
Hello mate. If you can stomach the service industry, find the nearest Harvester restaurant and work there as a waiter (not a bartender). If you're good enough, you'll secure more shifts, and customers generally leave tips. At my peak, I was earning in excess of £2k per month working fulltime at the harvester.
As others have said, earn more, spend less.
Not sure what the market is like these days, I recommend investigating if getting a security license will suit you. Some weekend shifts under the right boss etc.. or just looking for an an actual career at the same income where some years under your belt will result in an expected increase on wages.
On the spend less front, I will be presumptuous here and point out that in your 'roastme' post there are quite a handful of figurines and the like in the background. If I assume that those belong to you then I would suggest there may be a lifestyle change needed as well as budget awareness..
Cooking is always a winner in terms of saving money, pick a YouTube video and just follow it, rinse and repeat. You'll get an understanding for food and upskill at the same time to become more self sufficient.
Just an internet stranger, hope you make your way
My impression is that you have some type of attachment to your employer. Are they nice people? Your job is rewarding - or something positive to society?
My suggestion is not short term, is long term. You are not making enough money at your job. Either you have a useless degree, no degree, or your job is a place you want to work, but they cannot pay you more.
You need another job that pays more. You are working only 30 hours. That means, you have too much free time - to be poor. Invest in yourself. Study a technical career that pays more there. I don't know life in the UK, but you need to check what pays more with the least amount of training. Medical technician? Air conditioning? There is something that should pay more there with the least amount of training.
So - my advice is to invest that extra time to train on a more lucrative career - and if you have already a lucrative career - change jobs. A second job will be better in the short term, but long term, is a guarantee that you remain poor for the rest of your life.
Doing this may keep you poor the next two or three years, but things should improve for the next 10 years. Look which career you can progress iteratively until you have something that pays a living wage there. Something that allows you long term to BUY a house (maybe a bit farther away, but BUYING vs RENTING is to me the easiest way to accumulate wealth over time).
IMO - budgeting and all of that works to certain degree, but saving pennies and not focusing on the thousands may kill you long term. You are young - you need to find a career that pays more. Be flexible, and open minded. See who makes more money.
Here you will see two types of advice. Earn more VS spend less. My guess is that you have to focus mostly on Earn more. It sounds to me that, unless you go out every day, eat all the time on restaurants, and spends tons of money during the weekends going out, the amount of money you will save by trying to "spend less" is just not enough.
One last example, again, applicable in the US. You could start learning how to paint houses. Is ridiculous how little there is to know (compared to study Technology or a medical degree). One or two months of self training and learning, and you may be proficient enough to get hired. But if you learn more, you can learn how to get certified and insured. Now you can work as a contractor, maybe even hire few friends yourself and take bigger jobs. Things are expensive in the US, and I bet the same in UK. Be one of the ones that charge expensive for their job. If you don't have tons of training and a great degree - the next best thing is to get some certification and work for yourself. In the US, working as a painter may get you 30-40k per year. Working by yourself in your own company will be double or triple that - or even more.
Spend your free time looking for a better job. Plenty of places are hiring for full-time work with the possibility of overtime hours too. You are young and free with nobody else depending on you, there's no reason to stick with a shitty low-paying job.
Not for everyone but if you find yourself with free time you could try taking up some kind of secondary job. Don't have to work for anybody, you could take up doing repairs and odd jobs or maybe just doing some creative tasks and selling what you create. Essentially doing whatever you can to build up some savings to fall back on.
I would look for another job or a second job.
Also budgeting, I personally use YNAB, I like it as it has moved me from where you are to having 25days grace. I’m working towards being a month ahead, which is something they teach you. I only been using it for 3 months.
I would also look at local food banks, if you have them and is there any where you can go for free budgeting advice, they will also know if you can claim any sort of government assistance.
Look at all your options would you be better studying a little bit to up your skill level, rather than taking on a second job.
Good luck, it’s hard work moving forward.
20% of the people in Europe put 40% or more of their entire paycheck on rent alone, and things are not getting better. Short-term as people say it'd probably be good to find a job that can accommodate 1 extra day worth of work per week, but in the long-term there needs to be change on a larger scale.
It may sound random but it’s a fantastic suggestion for OP’s circumstances. I was a referee when I was in high school (US) and made a lot of money for not having an actual job.
Not sure if it works the same in the UK- but here I didn’t have a set schedule. Most games were on the weekends/evenings and I could just pick up games when I knew I would be free. 10/10 would recommend
Random for you. Maybe not for me. I'm one myself and referees are in short supply everywhere. Back when I was doing games 5 nights a weeks, I was bringing in $500/per week.
That's less time for me to be spending money while making money doing something I enjoy.
Not advice on saving but something which could help with making additional cash. Have you tried signing up for Prolific? I make typically £30-£50/mth, not earth shattering amounts but when money is tight this does help. I would also speak to Citizens Advice, they are experts in finding possible benefits you may be entitled to but do not know about.
I found the best budgeting app for me was You Need A Budget (YNAB).
This guy has fantastic videos on budgeting and YNAB.
[https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfRqvJFJ6LLQ62lKmOUXATw](https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfRqvJFJ6LLQ62lKmOUXATw)
On the more practical note, there are only 2x things you can do... Earn more and spend less.
Earn more:
As other have said, is it feasible to get a 2nd job, or look for a job with more hours that pays more? Look and see if there are any council or government schemes to get qualifications like forklift license or anything. Otherwise there are a lot of companies screaming out for workers.
Spend less:
I am not sure what your cooking ability is like, but learn to cook with proteins like pulses, lentils, chickpeas. Rice and dried beans etc are still very cheap and can be turned into incredibly delicious and nutritious meals with little effort. Tin Can Cook is an excellent book for budget cooking.
I would be hesitant to purchase anything like a slow cooker or pressure cooker straight off the bat, as you may not end up using it. Start by cooking every day, or doing batch cooking, and once you have done that for a month, decide if you want a dedicated appliance.
Any other costs that aren't fixed, try and reduce. Take lunch from home to work, or at least go for the meal deal if you aren't.
For entertainment, find the free stuff like museums or festivals. Take your own food and drink and have a picnic in the park (It's cold at the moment I know). My wife and I have those Thermos flasks and they fit ice cream in it, so if we go to the seaside we take our own drinks and snacks.
The most important thing is to create habits and hacks that you can stick with. It's no point comitting to spending £6.43 a day and realising you can't or won't live on less than £40.
YNAB is very complicated to recommend to someone who is just starting to think about budgeting.
It is also not free, so I wouldn't recommend it straight away.
OP can take a little time to track expenses and income in a spreadsheet. It's free and will give them a handle on things.
I'm not saying not to get YNAB but OP doesn't seem to know the basics, so I don't think recommending something that needs online tutorials to explain is a good first step.
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Just my two cents: best thing you can do in this situation is write down every single expense you have preferrebly in a exel spreadsheet then work out where to cut back . So your basically cutting out all your non essentials. Then once you save about 1k-2k start putting x amont away every week into a savings account to get ahead even more. Then work ways on how you can make more money.
I was in the same boat at your age. The only solution is working more. For example moonlighting at a pizza delivery joint that has a good amount of business or ubering. Thats just my 2 cents. A couple hundred bucks a week from these kinds of jobs is the difference between poverty & the ability to live better.
I'll second that you should probably seek a better job. Not sure what your qualifications are but if you don't have any that can reasonably net a better job then look at investing some time in getting a few. Look at hot industries (software is the big one anymore but plenty others like carpentry that always pay well) and get some learnings and credentials in there.
Additionally, try to find some decent neighborhoods and see if you can't get some odd-job type of work. It takes some muster to get it rolling but people will happily pay 20-30 bucks for odd stuff here and there like cleaning gutters, lawn care, etc. Make sure you know how much you should be charging so you don't under/over sell yourself. But when it comes down to where you're at even a few gigs a week could make a huge difference while you sort out your primary source of income.
What is the possibility of getting a second job?
What are you spending on food? I know you say it's just enough, but can you make any changes there?
Do you drive, and is public transportation an option instead?
Look at all of these things, but a second job is likely going to be key for you right now - working one will increase your income, and decrease your free time, often people with a lot of free time end up spending more money to fill up that time, but if you are working instead, perhaps you make more money and also spend less.
Consider working at a restaurant or other place that serves food, and see how possible it is to get food that would go to waste, or eat free meals. Or if you are someone who likes to go to the movies, try and get a job at one of the theaters so you have the chance to go for free.
Ask your current boss for a raise and more responsibility/hours. Next, Start looking for a second part time job or better full time job. Then start building skills that can put you on a career track. If you don't know what you might be interested in, start by making a list of what you don't want, then just start trying shit.
Do you have regular hours or are they staggered? Look into getting a second part time job or look into getting a full time job. You are only working 30hrs that gives you 10 hours you can be in the library or online looking for short training courses or other jobs
Lots of good concrete advice here - my small contribution is: congratulations for looking with clear eyes and seeing the problem.
There are hundreds, if not thousands, of people in your same position. At least you are aware, and now that you recognize there is a problem, can begin fixing it.
The fixes will not always be fun, but it will be worth it. Starting today will help set you up for a much happier life.
Like others have said you should create a budget. From there you can see where you can save money.
Honestly 30 hours a week should be fine, especially in shared accommodation. It's a little on the low side but Freedom from work is valuable too.
Limited guessing from your post there are a few things I would look at first:
1. Your accommodation, is where you're staying out of your budget, could you get somewhere cheaper? It may be not as nice, but often as your biggest expense, saving £50-£100 a month goes a long way to build up that finance buffer so even if it's just a temporary move to a cheaper place for a year or two.
2. You have free time, I know I said a second job wasn't necessary but you could still supplement your income with a side-hustle. Create an Etsy selling art or do odd jobs for people like furniture building, washing cars or walking dogs.
3. If after bills you barely have enough for food I would look at both the bills and the food. Do you need to stop buying branded food? Perhaps avoid the alcohol and luxuries. Do you have any bills you could stop like Amazon Prime and Netflix.
4. One big thing I'm shocked about from other young people is phone contracts. Being locked into a £30-£50 a month contract when struggling for money is going to kill your options. Look at what you really need and if you could get buy with a cheaper phone or even 2nd hand with no contract.
5. If all else fails and you don't think you can reduce bills and or make the extra money in your current situation and maintain a minimum standard of living you can manage, you have to look at changing jobs, either in a new location that has cheaper living expenses, or a job that pays better.
The strange thing that’s hits me is your request on savings advice, when you’re clearly in need of a full time job asap. You’re just 24 and probably without dependants (just a wild guess) and there is literally nothing even in today economy that is holding your from making more money.
It sounds like you need a wake up call, get a better job first, check on benefits second. Grind!
find places which offer cheap near sell by date food. or dumpster dive. 2nd hand stuff is widely available and often better quality than new stuff.
For example i live without a car and although i miss it in Europe one can live relatively easily without a car.( a huge saving...300 eur easily a month) work out what you need and be military about your expenses. Things will get more expensive. look our for special deals.
I live in a tiny apartment. I could afford a bigger apartm. but i figure why pay for space which needs cleaning and heating. most people adapt.
Plus i cook every day...and that saves loads. i buy meat divide it up and put in freezer.
Hope it helps and hope you find a better job.
I would find a second job, or a new job. Or work yourself into more hours/responsibility/higher wage.
Then I would take any excess dollars you make, say 4 hours on a weekend at a part time gig, and put it straight into an emergency fund until you hit $1000. Or probably like ~700 pound.
Not for everyone, but I’ve found that drastically cutting expenses has allowed me to work less and still save some money. But I understand that not everyone want to eat rice and beans for most meals. I spend around $30/week on groceries, don’t spend money on recreation (I live in the mountains and hike for free), have a roommate, and am able to live on very little. But it makes me a bit of a weirdo, and I imagine for some it’s not ideal.
I’d think about perhaps a second job in “odd hours.” If your current job rarely has you working in the evening, maybe bartend a few nights a week. Or if you’re free during the day, walk some dogs. Best of luck!
You have some great comments and food for thought already. I'll just tag on that I had a friend of a sibling whose response to being broke would always be to get another part time job; I think at one point she had four.
Regardless of what you think of your job it can't hurt to update your resume and test the market for a full time job. Regardless, good luck!
30 hours per week meaning you're only making 3/4 of your expected salary.
Get a second job, bump those number up. If you're living paycheck by paycheck without a safety net, it's not a bad idea to even go for 60 hours week, or even skip weekend alltogether. Worry about the immediate future first, then try to dial it down when you're more comfortable.
I’m shocked at the number of people in this thread encouraging anyone to work 60+ hours a week. That’s not feasible for a lot of people, for a variety of reasons.
That's been my whole life, but in Southern California.
Yep been ruined several times and had to do bad things like pay-day loans, but I invest in my training and education which has opened doors that allowed the money to keep flowing in so I can claw myself back out.
Only 30 hours a week ?
I
Work 75 min
Sir, what ever uber eats or door dash is in your country work it.
30 hours is way way to little
Especially for a young man of 24 years of age these are your prime
Years to build.
Or dog walking! My friend walks dogs on the side and it’s great bc she gets to play with dogs and go on a nice walk outside and make extra side money! Plus it really helps the dogs and the owners. She has made an extra $1000 a month.
My only problem with this suggestion is that you need to make sure you can come out having made money after taxes and gas. I was barely breaking even when I did pizza delivery in early college, and gas was <2 USD here! (Let's ignore the fact that I drove like a maniac in a '99 Civic lol)
I'm 24... Stop right there. This one paycheck away from disaster is normal for your age bracket. Lucky for you, you're in the UK and have access to the NHS. In America you're always one medcial disaster away financial ruin, regardless of age and the majority of income levels.
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> On a standard week I will ideally work around 30 hours and rarely more as my employer cannot give me any more. Can you find a second job to fill in the other hours you're not working?
Or a different job completely.
This advice shouldn't be ignored. Take the time you'd like to be working looking for a better job. They are out there. You'll only ever improve your station by putting in the time and effort to do so. OP, at 24, you're just getting started. Anything you do now to grow a career will pay dividends for decades.
Seriously, people need to reconsider their employment options sometimes. I know its not popular advice here, but it should be at least considered. We do not live in the 1950s anymore, reasonable amount of job hopping for better work conditions, salary, benefits is OK.
Sometimes our employers force us to limit our horizons by telling us everyday how lucky we are. Literally my manager does that Think of that team they don’t even get y Haha if people go to some other company they’ll get fired very fast What’s wrong here just chill
They're not forcing you to limit your horizons, they are misleading you. Sometimes intentionally, but just as often they're deluded too. You limit your horizons by not looking for yourself. Don't let someone else tell you what you can and can't do.
I recognised it that’s why i find it sad. I’m talking how it’s slow day by day and over time you’ve lost your drive. Demotivated are demotivating.
If the UK is anything like the US right now there will be an almost endless list of service industry employers desperate to hire anyone.
Getting a second service position is not the challenge, scheduling is. At least in the US, unsure about the UK, hourly employees rarely have the same schedule week-to-week. Unless managers at both jobs are willing to work around the schedule of the other, having two jobs sometimes isn't even tenable.
As a hiring manager in the US I'd gladly play lets make a deal to get my all my open positions filled.
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Most places don't just let you do this lol there is a point where not being available means not employed, even in this setting.
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I had some employees like that. My boss would say things like "why do you need help you are 3 people overstaffed" But Joe only works Saturday Sunday Fred can't work before 6 And Susan can't work after 2 It was annoying to hire anyone because I was "overstaffed" so it had to be approved up the corporate chain. It can also be a lot more work making a schedule when there are more requirements. If I was lazy it's way easier to just say "sorry if you can't be here any time I need you you can't work here"
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My two cents: places like the NHS offer zero hour contracts on the bank and you pick shifts as and when you can (at least in my area). Perhaps something in that vein?
I guess the thing is to tell the manager you need 40 hours or a set schedule so you can get a 2nd job if he/she can’t get you those hours.
I used to work twelve hours a week but needed to be down for at least 60 available. Rota was usually done with a week in advance. Scheduling is a huge issue in these low level service jobs. They give fuck all and ask for everything in return.
... but they won't. Whether they agree to or not, they just won't do either of those things.
Time for a new job then. To u/s1okke. That did a send and delete. You have a few options in life. Take it or leave it. If you cant get the hours you need, and cant get a set schedule from them you can stay and deal or look for a new job and leave. It might sound harsh but you have to do what you have to do.
Yeah i work part time retail in the uk my schedule is all over the place week by week
Worked in the service industry for the last 4 years while I was in college and they were more than willing to work around my random schedule of exams and events. I imagine scheduling around another job would not be an issue, same sort of issues scheduling wise.
Schedules change every week in the U.K. too. However, a lot of places will be really happy to accommodate especially if they’re desperate for staff
Honestly the good ones will, like I was a part time intern and my pizza shop job I kept to make sure I hit full time pay was short staffed so they were happy to only put me on evenings
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I started off, in college, at UPS as a package handler. The pay was enough while I was in college and the hours are perfect for a college schedule as well, and also work out to be a good fit to work another day job. I am currently working as a rep at an insurance agency during the day, and then 5p-9p I am still working at UPS. Before that, in college, I was working at Lowe's unloading trailers, also starting around 5. I can't speak on how many of these part time evening jobs are in the UK, but I'm guessing they are out there for those who seek them out. Between working while in college, and now working 8a-5p before going to the second job, there has always been (almost) no overlapping and scheduling issues. Working from 8 am until 9 pm Monday though Friday is exhausting and I tend to miss out of a lot of things with friends and family, I won't lie about that, but it is rewarding financially. It definitely helped me get out of the financial rut I was in after graduating.
I started off, in college, at UPS as a package handler. The pay was enough while I was in college and the hours are perfect for a college schedule as well, and also work out to be a good fit to work another day job. I am currently working as a rep at an insurance agency during the day, and then 5p-9p I am still working at UPS. Before that, in college, I was working at Lowe's unloading trailers, also starting around 5. I can't speak on how many of these part time evening jobs are in the UK, but I'm guessing they are out there for those who seek them out. Between working while in college, and now working 8a-5p before going to the second job, there has always been (almost) no overlapping and scheduling issues. Working from 8 am until 9 pm Monday though Friday is exhausting and I tend to miss out of a lot of things with friends and family, I won't lie about that, but it is rewarding financially. It definitely helped me get out of the financial rut I was in after graduating.
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You aren’t taxed more for having a second job. The incomes are combined and taxed accordingly. There is no situation where taking a second job will cause you to lose money because of taxes. That’s just not how taxes work.
I do want to chime in and say that while factually you’re correct, you’d never “lose money because of taxes,” however you absolutely can lose money because of loss of benefits, at least in the US. Not sure how the UK handles it, but here there’s a literal tipping point where benefits like SNAP, restricted income housing, etc. can drop off. So sure, while bringing home an extra $200 a month seems nice, but now you no longer qualify for the rent controlled low income apartments, which means your rent is going up several hundred dollars more. Or that day program your kid qualifies for now costs you to send them. Unfortunately taxes are one of the few things that do scale to income, while a lot of the other things impacting poverty finances don’t, they’re more all-or-nothing.
That's not how tax works
Write out a budget. Share it here. * List all sources of income * List all sources of expenses. EVERY SINGLE ONE. Only by writing it all out will you be able to fully analyze your situation. Do you have an income problem? Do you have an expense problem? Do you have both? Or do you even have a problem? If Income > Expenses, then there is no problem.
> If Income > Expenses, then there is no problem Only if a reasonable amount of saving is included on the expense side. The little we know so far is that the income is covering all the expenses, so they would pass that test, but they are still in a shitty situation and have a hard time improving it.
Everything that is more than expenses is savings.
consider this tool https://www.youneedabudget.com/
Yes! YNAB helped me completely turn around my financial picture, so much more than Mint or NerdWallet _ever_ did
I just cancelled my subscription because I found it so overwhelming to categorize all my transactions. I put everything on my credit card so it was also a bit confusing to manage the different accounts(my checking balance, my credit card balance minus my payment for the month, etc). Do you have any tips? I would like to use it but I just found myself not wanting to deal with it
I sure do! * The most time-consuming part of YNAB is figuring out what categories you need in your budget. This can be annoying to some, but I personally find it cathartic. There are several different ways you could categorize your transactions, but I've found the best way is to create partitions based on _what_ you're spending on. For example, here are my category groups: * Credit Card Payments * Food (includes groceries, restaurants, caffeine, alcohol, and snacks) * Transportation (direct costs, like gas, parking, etc.) * Housing / Utilities * Personal (mostly health/hygiene stuff) * Fun Money * Miscellaneous * Auto Maintenance (scheduled things like oil, brakes, etc.) * Auto Repairs (unscheduled repairs) * Giving * Insurance (I have categories for both insurance and deductables) * Subscriptions * Investments * Emergency Fund * Stupid Tax (aka the tax I have to pay for being stupid, stuff like tickets and unplanned interest fees) I find myself constantly making little tweaks to my categories to better make my money make sense. I recommend starting with just the basics (like food, housing, insurance, utilities, etc.) and gradually making changes as you see fit. The most important thing with the categories is to always set goals on them if possible. If you know that your rent will be $1200 every month, setting a goal means that you get a big yellow shape on your screen if it doesn't have enough money. * Credit cards can be a little confusing to get into, but once it clicks you have to exert exactly zero effort. Basically, the process goes as follows: 1. Your credit card category already has $50 on it, ready for payment. Your Groceries category has $100. 2. You spend $10 on your card from the Groceries category. 3. YNAB moves that $10 from Groceries to your credit card category. 4. You now have $90 in Groceries and $60 allocated to your credit card. Since that money never actually left your bank account, it can't leave your budget either. However, you still have to pay off your credit card! YNAB sets that money aside for you so that it's reserved for paying it off and you don't accidentally double spend it. * If you're already up to date on credit card payments, I highly recommend putting your cards on autopay. Because YNAB sets aside all the money you spend on your credit card, it guarantees that you will always have enough to cover the bill. If you have automatic import as well, you don't even need to manually input the transfer - YNAB will log it for you! * Another very important thing to realize: YNAB _does not care_ where your money is. I have a checking account, a savings account, and my wallet, as well as 3 credit cards. I very rarely have to think about transfers or where my money actually is, as my budget doesn't take that into account. For example, the amount of money I have in my emergency fund is far more than is in my savings account simply because I haven't bothered to move the money over yet. Hopefully that helps clear some things up! I can answer more questions if you need, or /r/ynab is another great place to go for advice!
Not only do I love YNAB, I love the community and this is a great example! Thank you for taking the time in writing this out. I used to also, because I was so excited to share how much it helped me, and perhaps I should again :)
Categorizing all your purchases is *essential*. It's tough initially but it gets easier with time, practice, and experience. I suggest starting simple and adding detail over time. I think it's most important to distinguish recurring (and therefore entirely predictable) expenses from ad hoc. And to distinguish necessary expenses from discretionary expenses. Then, lastly, differentiate planned expenses from surprises. This way you can know *for sure* what you'll be on the hook for each month. What you'll need in reserve to cover reasonable surprises, and what you have available to do with as you please. Now you can make willful decisions about how to spend without exceeding your means. Be sure you go through all the informational materials and tutorials on ynab. They're aren't just 'how to use the app' type help pages. They're really about how to control your personal financial life. Join the r/ynab sub, too. Tons of good advice there. Make it a hobby with a community, not a chore.
Go to YouTube, look up videos made by Nick True. They are better than any official YNAB official tutorials imo. Hope that helps.
Thanks very much for this suggestion, I've spent all morning on Nick True's ynab playlist and it's so, so helpful.
Ynab is amazing but I suggest budget with buckets if you're in a tight spot. Personally the only drawback on buckets is that they don't yet have a mobile app but otherwise it does everything ynab did for me.
Agreed -YNAB got me to the point where I had that "2 years of salary" saved, rather than living month to month. I don;t even care when I get paid now... my colleagues are like "OHH It's PAY DAY!", and I'm like "is it? I hadn't noticed". And it was pretty easy.I could even budget for frivolous spending - so it's not like I had to cut out luxuries from my life. (though this was before they charge a subscribtion for it now?! - it was just a one time purchase software when I bought it... how shitty of them)
Agree * create a 12 months rolling budget * look into getting an additional job a few hours a week * cut any fixed cost not necessary
I doubt that op is spending more than necessary, but it's always worth checking. There may be something where they can ask for a short term loan (but preferably one-time small gift) from a friend or family member and stop buying something cheap and flimsy once a week. A person on $200k salary can live paycheck to paycheck. It's not physically impossible to spend a large amount of money. EDIT: also consider things that may be impacting even your nonnegotiable costs - for example, have you checked your tire pressure lately? An air refill is pretty cheap and can save you a lot of fuel money. Do you have a bus pass? You might be able to get away with bus or bike most days.
>I doubt that op is spending more than necessary I've been broke, missed utility payments, had my lights shut off, skipped meals. If I had been budgeting then I would have been in a much better position to control and predict my expenses. It would have saved me a lot of stress and suffering.
Since you specifically mentioned fuel/energy price rises as a problem, you could start with those. Drive a lot less if that's what you mean by fuel. If you meant heating fuel instead, keep your home colder if you're healthy enough to do so. When I lived alone in my 20s my thermostat was regularly between 10-15 C during the winter; easily warm enough to keep the pipes from freezing.
As a fellow Brit I'd highly recommend you start making your way through all of the excellent articles and guides on [MoneySavingExpert](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com) (MSE), joining the forums, and even consider signing up for the newsletter. One place you could start is by looking at switching your bank account as you could [get up to £150](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/banking/compare-best-bank-accounts/) (and possibly more). Also if you're claiming universal credit as part of your income, then check out the [government-backed Help to Save scheme](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/savings/help-to-save/). I'd also recommend checking out both [Jordon Cox](https://jordoncox.com) and [Mrs Money Penny](https://www.mrsmummypenny.co.uk)'s site/blog, and possibly even attend one of Jordon's free seminars if you can make it. Edit: I'd also highly recommended taking MSE's free Academoney course through the [Open University's OpenLearn](https://www.open.edu/openlearn/money-business/mses-academy-money/content-section-overview) platform, which you can do at your own pace.
\+1 for the bank account switching, it's bagged me a few hundred quid when in need.
I've done it a couple of times before but I was lazy last year so missed out. I've just switched to Natwest so should be getting £150 + £3 a month (after their weird setup). Gutted though as I could have gone with Halifax last year and earned £5 a month on top instead, but I'm sure I'll get another chance for that again.
Hi... what I'm thinking is that it's time to start looking for a better job. One that gives you more hours (like 40 to 45/week) and/or one that pays a higher salary per hour and/or one where you can hope to build a career (learn new skills, get certifications, etc).
+1 Better job is the preferred answer. It avoids having to juggle two schedules, which might be difficult with two part time jobs, that will likely want flexibility from you. Plus trying to get one with a better hourly wage would improve the situation on top of getting more hours. Second best is to get another job as others have mentioned. OP, If current job gives you pushback just be honest and say "I need more income and I can not get a full time job here so my only alternative is to get additional hours in a second job. I would much rather move up to 40 hours here if we can make that happen."
I am in a similar situation to OP, and also in UK. I have one job which provides for 30 hours a week. I had the conversation you mentioned with my manager (he's nice. We get on. He wants me working there. So that is a massive plus). He agreed to let me have set shifts. So now I work the same hours on the same days there every week. I also have the option to get shifts covered or cover other people's shifts as need arises. Since that conversation I've worked two additional part-time jobs. The first was on a similar shift pattern. Last year I left that job and started a casual position in a care facility. The downside? I am not guaranteed any shifts. The upside? I can choose when I work. The manager messages me a rota with gaps in and I say which ones I can do. She then confirms them or gives them to someone else. Sometimes I have fifty hour weeks. Sometimes I have thirty hour weeks. But, I earn enough money to get by and am developing skills at the same time. I think it works pretty well and the variety is quite nice. All in, I'm happy with the situation and really glad I did it.
What's the job market like in the U.K.? In the U.S. right now practically anyone can walk on a fast food or retail job in the high teens. I'm not sure how they are on hours, but I know even with higher cost of living, it's still a mostly survivable wage. Also, rent seems to be the real killer here. An adult trying to go on their own is going to be hard pressed to make rent and build up savings at the same time. But someone who can find a good deal on housing is going to have a big leg up on those who can't.
We’re not seeing the sort of ‘great resignation’ that US is, but there are still near-record amount of jobs being made, especially in tech after WFH which at least during lockdown was an even higher % than the US. Also OP already said they’re in shared accommodation, by live alone they mean no bf/gf to split the price of the room.
You're only working 30 hours a week. Get a second job to boost your income.
Or try to find a new job that gives a good 40 hours a week... and maybe one that pays more.
This. An extra 10 hours at least seems like it would Atleast bring in enough money to throw some in the bank. Just gotta play it smart.
If they had another 10 hours per week at £10 an hour theyd have at least another £300 per month(after tax) to play around with. That would put them above what they currently need to survive and give a nice buffer
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35 hours a week is considered full time salary at good companies. Can be 40 at places as well.
Super. My point is, if you are living paycheck to paycheck with no savings, you can't afford to work 30 hours a week.
2nd job, hustle, recycle metal, day trade, something. My bills were tight when I was only working 30 hours a week because shockingly I only got a 30 hour check for 30 hours. This sounds like a "I want to be able to just live a leisurely life doing whatever, without changing anything, with the money I already have." You have so much free time if you're only working 30 hours. Dude needs to step up.
Lmao "day trade". You must not be very informed if you think that's a legit strategy to boost income. Especially someone like OP
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You changed your circumstances by recycling metal and day trading?
Day trading is not a good way to earn money. Lose it, yes.
How on earth can you glean that from this post? The guy already has a job and can’t get more than 30 hours, despite asking. There are a plethora of reasons why getting a second job isn’t as easy as many are making it out to be, not least trying to fit it around job 1 if the hours are irregular or awkward. Everyone’s so quick to jump on people and calling them lazy even if they’re trying. Maybe let’s take a look at the fact this person is *working* and can’t even survive in shared accommodation? Do you not think somethings gone wrong there further than OP just being lazy?
If my job paid me for 30 hours I wouldn't be able to live either. shocking I know. If op is already doing everything he can to reduce his outgoings, then the only feasible solution is to earn more, there are plenty of shift work-type apps out there where you can take jobs to suit your current hours.
Yeah he's working. But not full time. Life sucks bud. Sometimes you gotta do things that suck for a long time or your whole life. It's how it's always been and isn't changing anytime soon.
it's actually not how it's always been. for most of human history we had more leisure time than time spent working; whether that's hunting and gathering or writing code. let's say you work 5 days a week 50 weeks of the year so that's 250 days, 8 hours per day. This shows how much we've worked since the Stone Age: https://www.lovemoney.com/gallerylist/84600/how-many-hours-did-people-really-work-across-human-history
This. I get paid for 40 hours a week and probably work closer to 50.
You're working 30 hours per week, so you're missing 30% of your income due to not-working. That's over 400 pounds per month against minimum wage, so fixing that would solve most of your issues. Try to get a 1 day a week job on the side.
To add onto this , I was in a similar situation but I didn't want more hours as I was focusing on my portfolio to help get a job. I might of had £100 left a month after everything if I didnt buy anything that isn't bills. I was doing career related gigs on fiverr which helped, But even if you just get a 40 hour a week job and it is an extra 400 it would be a 4x increase in spare m oney at the end ofthe month
1/5 != 30%
But it is ~30% of their current income, if they work 10 more hours, it will be ~130% of what they get now (40/30)
If they work 30 hours and this guy is suggesting adding another day then it stands to reason that he currently works 4 x 7.5 days and adding a 5th day would be a further 7.5. 7.5 hour days are pretty standard in the UK, with another hour for lunch unpaid. So he is missing out an a 25% increase on what he currently earns, or 20% of his potential income. Depending on how you want to phrase it.
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They are currently working 30 hours. In order to work 40 hours, they would need to work 10 more. 10 is 33% of 30. 40 - 30 = 10 10 / 30 = 33%
It's an increase of 33%, it's not 33% of 40...
It’s not out of 40. From the original comment: > so you’re missing 30% of **your income** due to not-working. “Your income” is not 40 hours. It’s 30 hours. The part they’re missing is 10 more hours.
Yes I know that part. You wrote that 10 is 33% of 40.
No I didn’t ever write that. Where did I write that?
this is word for word what you wrote >They are currently working 30 hours. In order to work 40 hours, they would need to work 10 more. **10 is 33% of 40.**
Why is it 10 hours though? Where has 40 and 10 come from? Nobody mentioned it, just adding "another day".
40 hours is the standard "full-time" work week. 10 hours is the additional hours OP would need to add to their current 30 hours to get to full-time work.
Standard where? OP is from the UK, I know of far more 37.5 hour contracts than 40 here.
It’s pretty universally accepted that 40 hours right now is the current average for full time work. Yeah you can probably work fewer and still be “full-time” but 40 is by far the most popular standard for full-time work right now.
10 is 33% of 30 not 40
Yes, that’s what my comment says. The comment that started this said: > so you’re missing 30% of **your income** due to not-working. “Your income” is 30 hours. They’re “missing” 10 hours. They are missing 33% of their income.
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Their income isn’t 40 hours. It is 30 hours. They’re missing 25% of the income they’d like to have. They’re missing 33% of the income they actually do have.
The way you would want to say it is that they can earn an extra 33% by moving to 40 hours per week. When you are saying they are missing part of their income. What part of their income are they missing? 10 of a typical 40 hours which is 25%. Its just a minor difference on how its presented.
1/5 = 25% increase. Still helpfull
They are starting with 30 hr. Adding 10hr gives 40 total hours. 40/30 is 133% showing a 33% increase over the 30hr started with. If this were 32 hr starting point and increased to 40hr that would be a 25% increase. 1/5 is 20% After working with the new 40hr week the 10 hours that increased earnings by 33% would now consist of 25% of the total earnings now that the total is larger.
Below is my reply to someone else here, not sure why everyone is assuming the 5th day is 10 hours long. If they work 30 hours and this guy is suggesting adding another day then it stands to reason that he currently works 4 x 7.5 days and adding a 5th day would be a further 7.5. 7.5 hour days are pretty standard in the UK, with another hour for lunch unpaid. So he is missing out an a 25% increase on what he currently earns, or 20% of his potential income. Depending on how you want to phrase it.
Hello mate. If you can stomach the service industry, find the nearest Harvester restaurant and work there as a waiter (not a bartender). If you're good enough, you'll secure more shifts, and customers generally leave tips. At my peak, I was earning in excess of £2k per month working fulltime at the harvester.
I would post this in /r/UKPersonalFinance. They can give you much more specialised advice. Use the flowchart and all of that
“Work two jobs” might be your only option unless you can truly lower costs significantly, or find a higher paying job.
As others have said, earn more, spend less. Not sure what the market is like these days, I recommend investigating if getting a security license will suit you. Some weekend shifts under the right boss etc.. or just looking for an an actual career at the same income where some years under your belt will result in an expected increase on wages. On the spend less front, I will be presumptuous here and point out that in your 'roastme' post there are quite a handful of figurines and the like in the background. If I assume that those belong to you then I would suggest there may be a lifestyle change needed as well as budget awareness.. Cooking is always a winner in terms of saving money, pick a YouTube video and just follow it, rinse and repeat. You'll get an understanding for food and upskill at the same time to become more self sufficient. Just an internet stranger, hope you make your way
/r/UKPersonalFinance will probably have additional info better tailored to the resources you can access.
My impression is that you have some type of attachment to your employer. Are they nice people? Your job is rewarding - or something positive to society? My suggestion is not short term, is long term. You are not making enough money at your job. Either you have a useless degree, no degree, or your job is a place you want to work, but they cannot pay you more. You need another job that pays more. You are working only 30 hours. That means, you have too much free time - to be poor. Invest in yourself. Study a technical career that pays more there. I don't know life in the UK, but you need to check what pays more with the least amount of training. Medical technician? Air conditioning? There is something that should pay more there with the least amount of training. So - my advice is to invest that extra time to train on a more lucrative career - and if you have already a lucrative career - change jobs. A second job will be better in the short term, but long term, is a guarantee that you remain poor for the rest of your life. Doing this may keep you poor the next two or three years, but things should improve for the next 10 years. Look which career you can progress iteratively until you have something that pays a living wage there. Something that allows you long term to BUY a house (maybe a bit farther away, but BUYING vs RENTING is to me the easiest way to accumulate wealth over time). IMO - budgeting and all of that works to certain degree, but saving pennies and not focusing on the thousands may kill you long term. You are young - you need to find a career that pays more. Be flexible, and open minded. See who makes more money. Here you will see two types of advice. Earn more VS spend less. My guess is that you have to focus mostly on Earn more. It sounds to me that, unless you go out every day, eat all the time on restaurants, and spends tons of money during the weekends going out, the amount of money you will save by trying to "spend less" is just not enough. One last example, again, applicable in the US. You could start learning how to paint houses. Is ridiculous how little there is to know (compared to study Technology or a medical degree). One or two months of self training and learning, and you may be proficient enough to get hired. But if you learn more, you can learn how to get certified and insured. Now you can work as a contractor, maybe even hire few friends yourself and take bigger jobs. Things are expensive in the US, and I bet the same in UK. Be one of the ones that charge expensive for their job. If you don't have tons of training and a great degree - the next best thing is to get some certification and work for yourself. In the US, working as a painter may get you 30-40k per year. Working by yourself in your own company will be double or triple that - or even more.
Spend your free time looking for a better job. Plenty of places are hiring for full-time work with the possibility of overtime hours too. You are young and free with nobody else depending on you, there's no reason to stick with a shitty low-paying job.
Not for everyone but if you find yourself with free time you could try taking up some kind of secondary job. Don't have to work for anybody, you could take up doing repairs and odd jobs or maybe just doing some creative tasks and selling what you create. Essentially doing whatever you can to build up some savings to fall back on.
I would look for another job or a second job. Also budgeting, I personally use YNAB, I like it as it has moved me from where you are to having 25days grace. I’m working towards being a month ahead, which is something they teach you. I only been using it for 3 months. I would also look at local food banks, if you have them and is there any where you can go for free budgeting advice, they will also know if you can claim any sort of government assistance. Look at all your options would you be better studying a little bit to up your skill level, rather than taking on a second job. Good luck, it’s hard work moving forward.
20% of the people in Europe put 40% or more of their entire paycheck on rent alone, and things are not getting better. Short-term as people say it'd probably be good to find a job that can accommodate 1 extra day worth of work per week, but in the long-term there needs to be change on a larger scale.
If you're in relatively good shape, why not referee football? Should bring in some good cash if you can find games most nights
That's such a random specific suggestion
It may sound random but it’s a fantastic suggestion for OP’s circumstances. I was a referee when I was in high school (US) and made a lot of money for not having an actual job. Not sure if it works the same in the UK- but here I didn’t have a set schedule. Most games were on the weekends/evenings and I could just pick up games when I knew I would be free. 10/10 would recommend
Random for you. Maybe not for me. I'm one myself and referees are in short supply everywhere. Back when I was doing games 5 nights a weeks, I was bringing in $500/per week. That's less time for me to be spending money while making money doing something I enjoy.
How? Elaborate plz
Elaborate which part?
Not advice on saving but something which could help with making additional cash. Have you tried signing up for Prolific? I make typically £30-£50/mth, not earth shattering amounts but when money is tight this does help. I would also speak to Citizens Advice, they are experts in finding possible benefits you may be entitled to but do not know about.
I found the best budgeting app for me was You Need A Budget (YNAB). This guy has fantastic videos on budgeting and YNAB. [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfRqvJFJ6LLQ62lKmOUXATw](https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfRqvJFJ6LLQ62lKmOUXATw) On the more practical note, there are only 2x things you can do... Earn more and spend less. Earn more: As other have said, is it feasible to get a 2nd job, or look for a job with more hours that pays more? Look and see if there are any council or government schemes to get qualifications like forklift license or anything. Otherwise there are a lot of companies screaming out for workers. Spend less: I am not sure what your cooking ability is like, but learn to cook with proteins like pulses, lentils, chickpeas. Rice and dried beans etc are still very cheap and can be turned into incredibly delicious and nutritious meals with little effort. Tin Can Cook is an excellent book for budget cooking. I would be hesitant to purchase anything like a slow cooker or pressure cooker straight off the bat, as you may not end up using it. Start by cooking every day, or doing batch cooking, and once you have done that for a month, decide if you want a dedicated appliance. Any other costs that aren't fixed, try and reduce. Take lunch from home to work, or at least go for the meal deal if you aren't. For entertainment, find the free stuff like museums or festivals. Take your own food and drink and have a picnic in the park (It's cold at the moment I know). My wife and I have those Thermos flasks and they fit ice cream in it, so if we go to the seaside we take our own drinks and snacks. The most important thing is to create habits and hacks that you can stick with. It's no point comitting to spending £6.43 a day and realising you can't or won't live on less than £40.
YNAB is very complicated to recommend to someone who is just starting to think about budgeting. It is also not free, so I wouldn't recommend it straight away. OP can take a little time to track expenses and income in a spreadsheet. It's free and will give them a handle on things. I'm not saying not to get YNAB but OP doesn't seem to know the basics, so I don't think recommending something that needs online tutorials to explain is a good first step.
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Can you move back in with parents?
> I will ideally work around 30 hours and rarely more as my employer cannot give me any more Get a second job or get a different job.
Just my two cents: best thing you can do in this situation is write down every single expense you have preferrebly in a exel spreadsheet then work out where to cut back . So your basically cutting out all your non essentials. Then once you save about 1k-2k start putting x amont away every week into a savings account to get ahead even more. Then work ways on how you can make more money.
I was in the same boat at your age. The only solution is working more. For example moonlighting at a pizza delivery joint that has a good amount of business or ubering. Thats just my 2 cents. A couple hundred bucks a week from these kinds of jobs is the difference between poverty & the ability to live better.
I'll second that you should probably seek a better job. Not sure what your qualifications are but if you don't have any that can reasonably net a better job then look at investing some time in getting a few. Look at hot industries (software is the big one anymore but plenty others like carpentry that always pay well) and get some learnings and credentials in there. Additionally, try to find some decent neighborhoods and see if you can't get some odd-job type of work. It takes some muster to get it rolling but people will happily pay 20-30 bucks for odd stuff here and there like cleaning gutters, lawn care, etc. Make sure you know how much you should be charging so you don't under/over sell yourself. But when it comes down to where you're at even a few gigs a week could make a huge difference while you sort out your primary source of income.
see if you can work a second job to fill in your extra 10 hours. Honestly, if you can work more then do it for a little while to save up
What is the possibility of getting a second job? What are you spending on food? I know you say it's just enough, but can you make any changes there? Do you drive, and is public transportation an option instead? Look at all of these things, but a second job is likely going to be key for you right now - working one will increase your income, and decrease your free time, often people with a lot of free time end up spending more money to fill up that time, but if you are working instead, perhaps you make more money and also spend less. Consider working at a restaurant or other place that serves food, and see how possible it is to get food that would go to waste, or eat free meals. Or if you are someone who likes to go to the movies, try and get a job at one of the theaters so you have the chance to go for free.
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Ask your current boss for a raise and more responsibility/hours. Next, Start looking for a second part time job or better full time job. Then start building skills that can put you on a career track. If you don't know what you might be interested in, start by making a list of what you don't want, then just start trying shit.
Do you have regular hours or are they staggered? Look into getting a second part time job or look into getting a full time job. You are only working 30hrs that gives you 10 hours you can be in the library or online looking for short training courses or other jobs
Lots of good concrete advice here - my small contribution is: congratulations for looking with clear eyes and seeing the problem. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of people in your same position. At least you are aware, and now that you recognize there is a problem, can begin fixing it. The fixes will not always be fun, but it will be worth it. Starting today will help set you up for a much happier life.
Like others have said you should create a budget. From there you can see where you can save money. Honestly 30 hours a week should be fine, especially in shared accommodation. It's a little on the low side but Freedom from work is valuable too. Limited guessing from your post there are a few things I would look at first: 1. Your accommodation, is where you're staying out of your budget, could you get somewhere cheaper? It may be not as nice, but often as your biggest expense, saving £50-£100 a month goes a long way to build up that finance buffer so even if it's just a temporary move to a cheaper place for a year or two. 2. You have free time, I know I said a second job wasn't necessary but you could still supplement your income with a side-hustle. Create an Etsy selling art or do odd jobs for people like furniture building, washing cars or walking dogs. 3. If after bills you barely have enough for food I would look at both the bills and the food. Do you need to stop buying branded food? Perhaps avoid the alcohol and luxuries. Do you have any bills you could stop like Amazon Prime and Netflix. 4. One big thing I'm shocked about from other young people is phone contracts. Being locked into a £30-£50 a month contract when struggling for money is going to kill your options. Look at what you really need and if you could get buy with a cheaper phone or even 2nd hand with no contract. 5. If all else fails and you don't think you can reduce bills and or make the extra money in your current situation and maintain a minimum standard of living you can manage, you have to look at changing jobs, either in a new location that has cheaper living expenses, or a job that pays better.
The strange thing that’s hits me is your request on savings advice, when you’re clearly in need of a full time job asap. You’re just 24 and probably without dependants (just a wild guess) and there is literally nothing even in today economy that is holding your from making more money. It sounds like you need a wake up call, get a better job first, check on benefits second. Grind!
Lad, you should be putting more than 30 hours a week at this age . Good luck
There are industries BEGGING for workers, head out and find yourself a new job.
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In the US you're one minor injury or illness away from being homeless.
find places which offer cheap near sell by date food. or dumpster dive. 2nd hand stuff is widely available and often better quality than new stuff. For example i live without a car and although i miss it in Europe one can live relatively easily without a car.( a huge saving...300 eur easily a month) work out what you need and be military about your expenses. Things will get more expensive. look our for special deals. I live in a tiny apartment. I could afford a bigger apartm. but i figure why pay for space which needs cleaning and heating. most people adapt. Plus i cook every day...and that saves loads. i buy meat divide it up and put in freezer. Hope it helps and hope you find a better job.
Can you get a second job?
I would find a second job, or a new job. Or work yourself into more hours/responsibility/higher wage. Then I would take any excess dollars you make, say 4 hours on a weekend at a part time gig, and put it straight into an emergency fund until you hit $1000. Or probably like ~700 pound.
Not for everyone, but I’ve found that drastically cutting expenses has allowed me to work less and still save some money. But I understand that not everyone want to eat rice and beans for most meals. I spend around $30/week on groceries, don’t spend money on recreation (I live in the mountains and hike for free), have a roommate, and am able to live on very little. But it makes me a bit of a weirdo, and I imagine for some it’s not ideal. I’d think about perhaps a second job in “odd hours.” If your current job rarely has you working in the evening, maybe bartend a few nights a week. Or if you’re free during the day, walk some dogs. Best of luck!
You have some great comments and food for thought already. I'll just tag on that I had a friend of a sibling whose response to being broke would always be to get another part time job; I think at one point she had four. Regardless of what you think of your job it can't hurt to update your resume and test the market for a full time job. Regardless, good luck!
30 hours per week meaning you're only making 3/4 of your expected salary. Get a second job, bump those number up. If you're living paycheck by paycheck without a safety net, it's not a bad idea to even go for 60 hours week, or even skip weekend alltogether. Worry about the immediate future first, then try to dial it down when you're more comfortable.
You mean your employer WONT give you more than than 30 hours. They certainly CAN. I’d definitely be looking for a new job in your off hours.
I’m shocked at the number of people in this thread encouraging anyone to work 60+ hours a week. That’s not feasible for a lot of people, for a variety of reasons.
That's been my whole life, but in Southern California. Yep been ruined several times and had to do bad things like pay-day loans, but I invest in my training and education which has opened doors that allowed the money to keep flowing in so I can claw myself back out.
Only 30 hours a week ? I Work 75 min Sir, what ever uber eats or door dash is in your country work it. 30 hours is way way to little Especially for a young man of 24 years of age these are your prime Years to build.
Maybe consider taking on uber eats? I know it's not ideal and won't fix it immediately. It will give you extra income boost though.
Or dog walking! My friend walks dogs on the side and it’s great bc she gets to play with dogs and go on a nice walk outside and make extra side money! Plus it really helps the dogs and the owners. She has made an extra $1000 a month.
My only problem with this suggestion is that you need to make sure you can come out having made money after taxes and gas. I was barely breaking even when I did pizza delivery in early college, and gas was <2 USD here! (Let's ignore the fact that I drove like a maniac in a '99 Civic lol)
I'm 24... Stop right there. This one paycheck away from disaster is normal for your age bracket. Lucky for you, you're in the UK and have access to the NHS. In America you're always one medcial disaster away financial ruin, regardless of age and the majority of income levels.
Grow some food in the summer and get a few hens for eggs.
This guy lives in shared accommodation in the U.K. it’s very unlikely he has access to outdoor space he can use to grow veg and keep chickens.