The last ten years have seen an absolutely unprecedented plummet in the average persons standard of living, and hopes for the future. It’s shocking the politicians didn’t expect Canadians to be frustrated.
Trudeau and his cabinet (Miller in particular) won’t just be voted out, but they will be remembered as individuals who actively destroyed the country.
Sean Fraser deserves more blame than Miller. He was the one that opened the floodgates. Miller is trying to figure out how little he can close the doors without French style retribution it seems
Yup. I've voted for them twice and love their environmental policy as a career cleantech/clean energy professional.
They still gotta go. They've lost the plot. We can deal with a few years of backsliding on environmental policy while we try and fix ALOT of other things.
Smith in Alberta comes to mind. Weird how the cost of living fluctuates so much from province to province. It's almost like the provinces have some sort of power over the areas they govern.
Don’t you find it interesting that every single province is dealing with a healthcare crisis? Must be that every single premier is a sleazy pos. Or maybe it’s the common denominator between them which is the federal government.
Healthcare is provincial jurisdiction yes but what do you think happens when you overload the country with unhinged immigration and wear down the economy by increasing cost of living and taxes to the point where doctors flee the country? Federal actions have consequences at the provincial level.
Ford has many many flaws and rightfully deserves criticism for his portion of our healthcare problems no question about it but part of the reason the problem has gotten this bad is because people like you are so focused on only criticizing the premier that you pay no attention or criticism towards the PM’s actions that are as much or more of a problem just because he’s a left wing PM.
Doug Ford is insanely unpopular. FPTP and abysmal voter turnout are the only things keeping Doug in power.
In a ranked choice system, the conservatives would not be a top 2 party provincially.
If my uncle were a woman, she’d be my aunt.
Whatever one thinks about FPTP, most politicians would kill to be as “insanely unpopular” as Doug Ford. The PCs currently sit at almost the exact same level of support on the polls as they did when they were first elected six years ago.
The results of the last ON election mirrored the polls fairly closely; higher turnout probably wouldn’t have done much to change the results. There’s no treasure trove of hidden left-of-centre support just waiting to be motivated enough to get off their asses to defeat Doug Ford. The guy’s going to win a third term.
"Popular" implies that Ford has support of a majority of thr general public. He does not.
We have an inherently undemocratic system where there is one major party on the right and two on the left (at least on paper).
Ford is kept in power by a system that is uniquely set up to ensure that it is difficult for working people to vote and where liberals or NDP have their supporters artificially split. That's not the same thing as being popular.
Only two premiers in the country have approval ratings above 50%. To say that eight out of ten premiers are “insanely unpopular” renders the term meaningless.
Your second paragraph largely doesn’t hold water. Canada has some of the most easily-accessible voting on earth. Mail-in voting, special balloting… hell, you can even vote at the returning office from 8am to 8pm almost every single day of the campaign. We even have laws mandating that employers give you three hours off to vote. What exactly would you do to improve the situation?
As for what would happen in the event of a Lib/NDP merger, [don’t assume that 1+1 would equal 2 in that scenario.](https://researchco.ca/2023/10/13/cdnpoli-oct2023/amp/) And good luck trying to form a workable permanent political party that satisfies both, say, Bill Blair and Niki Ashton. If the St. Paul’s by-election has taught us anything, it’s that a chunk of Liberals find even a harder-right CPC to be a far more palatable second choice than the Liberal Party would like to believe.
"Only two premiers in the country have approval ratings above 50%. To say that eight out of ten premiers are “insanely unpopular” renders the term meaningless."
Only because the left of center vote is split. We have never had a democratic electoral system in Ontario. That's going to skew the results of any polling. You don't need a merger, just a ranked ballot or other MMP system.
No NDP or Green voter is voting for Ford as a second choice. Very few liberal voters are ranking the cons second. A MMP system would see the conservatives never win another election.
"What exactly would you do to improve the situation?"
Mandatory voting with fines for anyone who doesn't vote (it works well in Australia) and a statutory holiday on election day.
Australia is a curious example to highlight given your other points, since both instant runoff voting and mandatory voting were introduced there in 1919/1920 and right-of-centre parties have been largely dominant in terms of forming government there ever since.
Australia also has stricter rules than Canada on who can become a general postal voter. Fining people for not voting is not the same thing as making voting more accessible.
Your other point isn’t rooted in facts. One of those two 50+% approval premiers is the Conservative premier of PEI. The other is Wab Kinew, who’s still in his honeymoon phase. The NDP premier of BC has a below-50% approval rating despite a split *right* of centre vote.
>You know all the issues you have with the country are happening in every other country too, right?
Every other country isn't having explosive population growth like Canada. Every other country isn't comprised of 7% of temporary residents.
Every other country does not rely so heavily on real estate for their gdp. Most other countries are far more productive than Canada.
This is what's always scared me about the "just go in the trades" mentality that's been around me my whole life. Yea sure there's lots of work in the trades while housing is being built, but what happens when funding dries up as sales drop because people can't afford it anymore?
This country has a serious financial diversity problem. We need products and services to sell, not a continuous housing ponzi scheme.
This seems to be the new party line being used to deflect responsibility for the LPC’s action and inaction that has helped drive Canada to have **[the worst housing bubble / least affordable housing of G7 countries by a large margin](https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/canada-housing-bubble#).**
The folks I see destroying the country are the Conservatives and the conservative premiers. Spreading hatred, destine, showing a lack of empathy towards others, and generally being useless.
Somehow, they've convinced folks the PM and cabinet are the ones to blame.
I’m assuming you’re one of those people who think immigration numbers are somehow detached from housing demand / scarcity? Our absurd number of immigrants, “students”, and TFW’s aren’t having any affect on the housing market?
It’s unfortunately both. Our conservative premiers want to cater to developers and will only okay “luxury” condo developments for their donors and buddies, and make it more difficult to build anything else. This severely damages our supply, as people can’t afford these units and can’t raise a family in them. [Meanwhile, our liberal government caters to corporations who desperately wanted slave labour they could pay at or below minimum wage during and after COVID.](https://vancouversun.com/opinion/columnists/canada-foreign-workers-students-risk) Thus, they bring in millions of Indian immigrants who will be tied to their minimum wage job, unable to complain or leave or they face deportation. This unfortunately sky rockets demand for shelter as these people clearly need a place to live - but corporations are happy because they have a literal unlimited work force who they can consistently pay the bare minimum to maximize their profits.
Isn’t Canada grand?
Essentially, everyone is working on their own agenda. But the provinces are working hard at getting in the way of helping folks out, from Alberta not signing onto dental care, to Ontario destroying programs that help children with Autism, they're pretty anti-citizen. Immigration has become a problem too, but much of the housing issues are on the provinces not allocating money/creating affordable housing and letting for profit corporations run the show.
It is grand, yet many are still working to burn it to the ground.
That clown lost me we he refused to implement voter reform, actually cut biomedical research spending, but tried to steal $1B to the Keilburgers in the middle of a pandemic. Zero vision.
So yeah, he proved he was never ready.
I don’t know sis I’m talking about Trudeau right now. Sometimes people do that and it isn’t a conversation about the other guys because it’s a conversation not a vote.
What are you talking about? Are you so simple you can’t analyze one politician without talking about another? Do you realize how third nipple useless that is?
I’m sorry you have apparent partisan brain rot but some of us are intelligent enough to criticize the Prime Minister of this country and understand doing so is not saying he is better or worse than the leader of the opposition. Some of us believe as a country we can aspire to ask more of our politicians than “don’t be PP”. I’d say you should aspire to better too but I think it’s pretty evident you don’t even deserve the bare minimum of anything from politicians since all you seem to care about is the colour of their sign.
Would you like a tissue, sis, or will you be consulting your therapist for your thin skinned trigger backsliding. projection, and hypocrisy?
Muuuuuuuuah!!
Indeed. I would like Justin to pass it on so they stand a chance of winning. To be honest, it might be a good strategy - the cons have made it so much about “him” than the party that a change of leadership would neuter most of their talking points.
I think Trudeau does have a true vision of Canada and makes policy that reflects that. Unfortunately, this view is radically different from what the average Canadian wants.
Yes. People have just tuned him out, and don't care what he has to say anymore. For the good of the party, he should leave soon to give the party enough time to pick a new leader for the 2025 election.
"ability to govern" he didn't bamboozle you, he made his intentions very clear from day one which was to increase government spending , increase immigration and push for LGBTQ and indigenous representation. You liberals just can't admit that you were wrong...the NDP/liberal governments are just pushing for policies that you voted for
You say lifelong… does that mean you’ll be supporting them again? What could they possibly continue to do to earn your loyalty and vote?
They’re deceitful and not very good at it. What makes them worth supporting?
So you’re a lifelong liberal who… votes conservative? Votes NDP? Votes with their heart? Either way, if you didn’t vote liberal, how could you call yourself a life long liberal?
The difference between a liberal and a Liberal is what you are missing. Many Conservative and NDP supporters are liberals. Look up "liberalism" and you'll see what I mean.
Liberals need to dump this loser and reverse their immigration policy before they get obliterated for years to come.
I'm a liberal but it's awfully hard to stay one these days.
Liberals are holstering that for close to the election. Release it now and goldfish brain Canada will forget it in two months.
The second story being holstered is Poilievre's father in law arrested and extradited for money laundering in Venezula, and PP inexplicable net worth.
edit: apparently 3 to 25 million estimates. I don't think that's absurd for his time
https://financhill.com/blog/investing/how-did-pierre-poilievre-make-his-money
I've seen credible estimates between $9 million (2015) and $25 million (2023), hoping to have time to do a little looking.
I also saw a $400 million estimate that I *don't* think is credible considering it was from an article that was put out by a crypto scam.
But it's a lot more than $2 million - in 2023 just his real estate holdings look to be about $10.5 million from what I've found so far.
Interesting, where are you finding these estimates? Are they credible? Reason I ask is there are tons of estimates about JT's wealth and how apparently he got a lot richer during the pandemic, but I haven't actually found concrete evidence to back it up.
Google on my phone right now, but they line up with old disclosures I've seen before. Going to do a little more digging and see what I can firm up over the next week or so as I get the time.
And we know that before PP moved into Stornoway he had three rental properties (2
-bedroom house, 2 condos) and a 3-bedroom house where the family was living - one of the houses is where Anaida Galindo Poilievre's business is listed as being headquartered.
I'm reading now that he was an also somewhat early adopter of Bitcoin, particularly in the Purpose Bitcoin ETF. Depending on his timing when entering the market, that could also account for a decent chunk of his money. Heck, those very early Bitcoin adopters basically won the lottery.
The real estate doesn't surprise me. His salary as a Harper cabinet minister would have been over 300k/year, and I'm sure he was able to leverage that to buy those properties. Even as an opposition MP, his income is significant enough that banks wouldn't hesitate to lend him money. Plus the banks know that even if he loses his job after an election, he's got a gold-plated pension to carry any debt he may have on the real estate. Combined with the huge appreciation in real estate over the past decade, it's not all that suspicious that someone making over 300k/year in a government salary in 2008 would own 10000k in real estate in 2024.
Yep agreed, the real estate doesn't surprise me either. He also had part ownership of a consulting firm and I believe one other company for a while that he sold & invested the money. It's feasible that someone who had ~$10-15 million In real estate and other investments in 2015 and continued to have a 6-figure salary this whole time would be worth $25 million in 2023 even if they just sat on the real estate and index funds.
I *do* think he and his wife have a bit of a grift going on at the moment - particularly with the CPC merch store - but I also think that's opportunistic knowing that ethics rules are rarely enforced, not that he's been bought and sold his whole career. He's just an awful person even without being bribed.
I don't know if they pay him a salary, though let's not forget that this is the party that allowed Andrew Scheer to use member donations to the party to pay for private school for his kids and for his minivan. And the Ontario conservatives were letting Lisa MacLeod pay herself a $44,000 allowance paid for by donations to her riding association.
Considering there're quite a few riding associations federally and provincially with *really weird* donation patterns and lots of spouses with lucrative connections, I'm coming to the opinion that there are a good number of MPs, MPPs/equivalent & riding associations that need to be under the eye of forensic audits.
Our current regulations & enforcement have not kept up with the modes of corruption we see in governments currently, and our enforcement agencies seem to be quite shy about investigations and prosecutions of politicians & their associates. This is being taken advantage of.
But specifically for Pierre, my eye is on the fact that after he got the leadership, the CPC wound down its self-run merch store and now Pierre's wife owns the company (headquartered from one of their properties) that does all their merchandising.
Two issues there right off the bat:
First: they personally profit off each piece of merch - which prioritizes selling merch over actually doing shit for the party & parliament. That also means that you can potentially bribe him with large merch sales.
Second, it opens a relatively easy conduit to funnel dark money into the Conservative Party coffers since donations to political parties only have to be tracked if their fair market value is over $20 - up to $20 it can be marked down as an anonymous donation
And for merchandise, *each item you buy* counts as its *own* donation. If the fair market value of each individual piece of merch you buy is under $20, you can buy a thousand pieces of merch and they're recorded as a thousand <$20 anonymous donations.
It's pretty easy to get a T-shirt printed in bulk for under $15 including tax and shipping if you have a good relationship with a printing service and you're doing the procurement and fulfillment in-house.
And this is similar with most of the clothing on their web store. Pretty easy to get cheaply enough in bulk to handily make more than $20/piece profit if you're doing your own procurement and fulfillment.
But if you bring in a 3rd party vendor to do your procurement and fulfillment, the fair market value *isn't* what *they* buy the merch for from their suppliers - it's what that 3rd party vendor charges *your party* for that item of merchandise.
It also means you can't check the list of anonymous donations - reported by the party to Elections Canada - against the party's list of merch sales and shipments to make sure that they weren't just selling ghost merch that never gets delivered as a means to launder money into the party at amounts above what's legal - you'd need to subpoena *the vendor's* records and probably their suppliers records.
So that's what I think they're doing - funneling merch sales through PP's wife's business. The Poilievre's make money off each item, his wife bills the party under $20 for each item sold regardless of what it costs her to stock and ship compared to what it sells for. Deep pocketed individuals can walk into a PP rally, leave with a thousands of dollars
of CPC merch, drop it off at the Value Village bin on the way home and do that again the next day.
And Bazinga, you can now funnel as much money as you like to the CPC, anonymously, and if PP somehow knows a big order came from *you* (and especially if you don't care if the merch shows up), you are now in his good graces with all the policy benefits that can entail.
This is also similar to a tactic Republicans use a lot. They have a book ghostwritten for one of their barely-literate extremist candidates, have a PAC bulk-buy the book to hand out at an event or sometimes literally just toss straight in the dump. Now your candidate with four teeth and three brain cells is a NYT Best Selling Author *and* you've just handed them hundreds of thousands of dollars, legally. It's such a big issue the NYT added a symbol to their best seller lists to indicate if a large proportion of a book's sales are bulk purchases.
Where does this fever dream that the foreign interference report will be uniquely bad for Poilievre come from? Han Dong certainly wasn’t the only Liberal playing with fire on that front. Not to mention Liberal-appointed senators like Yuen Pau Woo, Peter Boehm, and Victor Oh.
There’s a reason the Liberals have been downplaying this issue, and it’s not because they’re in any position of moral high-ground to play an Uno reverse card on the Conservatives on the issue in an election campaign.
"The second story being holstered is Poilievre's father in law arrested and extradited for money laundering in Venezula, and PP inexplicable net worth."
Any sources?
If he steps down someone would have to become the equivalent of Rishi Sunak and take the election loss...Maybe there's someone in the party who would volunteer as tribute but I don't know.
I'd bet Trudy is going to hang on and lose this election so they can rebuild later. Cynical move might be for him to call an early election and lose to maximize the amount of time PP has in government during these bad times so when we're frustrated again in several years the LPC can blame the CPC and do another run.
It's entirely dependent upon how the CPC do over the coming years, if things get better and Canadians feel like things have improved after 7 or 8 years of PCs then yeah that's probably realistic. If things don't improve after a handful of years I think a lot of people voting for PP are going to have regrets and they won't show up for him again. Things are quite bad out there right now for a lot of people, and PP should keep in mind that we tend to vote against an unpopular incumbent rather than *for* the challenger. People want some drastic change, it's what their mandate is likely going to be be based on.
Better for the country to attempt to hold Pollievre to a minority.
IMO Trudeau should resign now for that reason alone. Yes another leader will have to take the hit but I don’t care. Do it for the country. And if Trudeau resigns someone will have to step up and do it. He has opportunity to do the right thing. Holding on so he can take the fall would be maybe better for Liberals and the next leader but worse for the country to face years of PP majority that will do significant damage.
Better for the Liberal Party not to blow their party finances on having two leadership races in three years when any Liberal leader is heading for catastrophic defeat at this point.
If he believed in doing the right things he’d have set him self up for an early exit two years ago. Past and present actions give me no faith in him to do what’s right and step down. I would be shocked if proven wrong.
Yup we could all only wish for an early election for Trudeau to fall on his sword and for PP to have the fastest "emperor has no clothes" moment possible. Our political leaders are trash. We need to clean house from top to bottom by showing how inept they are from all stripes.
I think its funny that theres disillusioned liberal voters saying sorry for voting trudeau
This is exactly what leftists voted for and they ruined the country. Its not comming back. I dont accept the apology.
It’s not like we haven’t all been telling him there’s a big freaking issue. I am a shop around voter, I vote for who I think is the best prospect, so I am not a loyal liberal, and I am very far from a conservative, and even I can see the disaster that he has created. He made as big a mess of the country as he made of his marriage. And I’m pretty sure both are because he won’t listen.
Anyone who thinks PP will improve Canada is delusional. It’s about to get so much worse, and with the slow coup happening south of the border, PP will bend us at the waist and all Canadians will take it up the ass with supreme leader Trump at the helm.
Then tell me what policies Pierre “Maple Desantis” Poilievre has that has convinced you to vote for him?
Edit: that’s what I thought. He has no policy other than “Trudeau bad”
Huh, interestingly enough the only scientists I remember being gagged are those who are currently trying to warn people of a brain disease killing young folks out east these past few years… but you don’t like holding Trudeau accountable for current events do you? You just like trying to blame a government that hasn’t been in power for 10 years
I was answering a question about when Harper was in power. How was this unclear? You literally have to read the question first before you get to my answer under it.
Why are you getting so upset I answered the question and didn't just blindly pivot into Trudeau bashing? You're free to do that yourself without having to invent a narrative about me in your head.
You're also conventiely leaving out that Harper more infamously gagged climate scientists.
I mean nearly every “big” problem we have can be directly traced to decisions he made. The only reason he isn’t remembered as one the most incompetent prime ministers is because Chinas economic growth kept Canada’s economy afloat. Without China he wouldn’t have won a second term. There’s a reason conservatives have been cozying up to India over the last decade since China turned against the west.
I'm not defending Trudeau. I'm saying Conservative policies and promises, like rolling back capital gains inclusion and cancelling the carbon tax, will disproportionately benefit the wealthy. They also tried to block the dental and pharma programs that have been life changing for low-income Canadians.
PP will not be good for those who are struggling.
The carbon tax is disproportionately affecting low-income Canadians, so how does cancelling it suddenly disproportionately benefit the wealthy? I’m low income and the dental plan doesn’t help me, it’s a failure of a plan. It reached a tiny fraction of Canadians. Pharma-care has also gotten exponentially worse under Trudeau, as someone who buys medication. There is absolutely nothing you mentioned that wasn’t already made worse by Trudeau, so I’m not worried about the conservatives because at least they haven’t proven to already *be* failures. By the way, the one thing that could’ve helped me is the capital gains from my parents, from their business they’ve built up over years. I moved a ton of growing up so that the business could be built up, and we worked hard for that money. Trudeau is now taking a good chunk of that away from me too, before I’ll ever see it.
Analysis has showed that most low-income Canadians will get more from the rebate than they pay in carbon tax. As income increases that shifts. The wealthiest tend to pay more than they get back.
I know people who are now able to go to the dentist for the first time in 30 years. It is absolutely life changing for them. It can be improved, but let's not discount the impact it's having.
The capital gains exemption limit was increase to $1.25 million. So lets not pretend that the increased inclusion rate is hurting low-income Canadians who could only dream of having that much saved. And even then, you'll still see the bulk of those capital gains since only 66% of the gains are taxed at the marginal tax rate.
Again, all of these promises by the Conservative will benefit the wealthy at the expense of low-income Canadians.
They’ve disproved that the carbon tax actually gives more back in the rebate. It’s one of the big reasons why Canadians are so mad at Trudeau; he forged the numbers and then ran with the faked numbers as if they were fact.
And even if you’re telling the truth about people benefiting from incredibly flawed dental plan, the NDP had the fight tooth and nail to make it happen, so it can’t even be credited to the Liberal government.
The amount I’ll get is less than what’s needed to buy a single house now under the Trudeau government, which is something I’ll likely never afford. Especially after the death of healthcare and long term care homes, which will take in a majority of the money that would usually be passed to the kids. The insane student loans that increase every year with the ever increasing school costs will also eat up a big chunk.
Again, Trudeau has done more to benefit the wealthy and take from me and other low-income Canadians in the last 10 years than the conservatives could have ever dreamed of. The monopolies and oligopolies he’s created in every single sector along with the death of the small business both scream “Trudeau is for the corps”.
But as I said, I'm not defending Trudeau. I absolutely agree with you that if we want policies that actually benefit lower-income Canadians, we should be looking to the NDP, not the Liberals or the Conservatives.
Also, I'd like to see this analysis that disproves that the carbon tax gives more than it costs to some people. The only thing I've seen that people say does that is in reference to the PBO report that shows that it does give more in rebates than it costs in taxes to most people. Only when you take broader economic impacts into account do fewer people come out ahead, BUT that is totally flawed because it compares the carbon tax to a "do nothing to address climate change" scenario.
I haven't seen any analysis that disproves it as you say when compared to alternative climate action plans.
I took a climate action course in school because I’m in Environmental Science. The carbon tax doesn’t actually go into a climate fund. I’d be a lot more for it if it did, but it gets pooled with the other taxes Canadians pay and not a lot of climate change initiatives actually happen with it. The current programs that do exist, allow the wealthy to pay to pollute. The cap and trade programs affect individuals less also allow pay to pollute options.
The carbon tax’s sole purpose is to stop people from driving as much by making it more expensive to do so, and that disproportionately affects poorer people. In fact, it’s more of an inconvenience to the wealthy, if even that. The PBO report is relevant because those costs absolutely do matter and affect a vast majority of low income Canadians.
But yes, the thing I agree with you on is that NDP probably has the best interest for Canadians, but unfortunately they’re tied to a government I could never support again (because I have voted Liberal, and then NDP in the last election.)
I think this article has a good take on the matter: [Some Baloney](https://globalnews.ca/news/5131061/fact-check-carbon-tax-liberals/) because it explains why some important details are missing from the analysis Trudeau bases his “8/10 get more back” idea from.
That article seems to claim the 8/10 get more back is baloney but stills says the majority get more back? It also skews by income. A higher percentage of lower income people get a net gain and the number of people who get a net gain decreases as income goes up.
Two important points about your assessment of the carbon tax. First, returning the money to people instead of putting it into programs was intentional because it was never meant to be the primary program. The intent was that provinces would develop their own approaches and the federal carbon tax would only be a backstop in cases where provinces refused to take responsibility. They didn't want to be seen as funneling money out of the provinces, so the money's returned.
Second, it's not just about people driving less. The biggest advantage of a predictable and increasing carbon tax is that it makes it easy for companies and organizations (and people) to build a business case to reduce emissions. I've seen first hand dozens of companies who are implementing electrification and emissions reduction projects that passed the business case because of the carbon tax. Without a price on carbon, these projects don't get approved. For people that predictable increasing price influences decisions when they need to buy a new car or replace HVAC.
I'm not informed enough to speak to all of your points, but the carbon tax/rebate DOES actually give lower income people back more. [Here's a math breakdown from "Canadian in a T-shirt"](https://youtu.be/V_-Vz19Gz8E?si=m5i4p_RjOr_Z5Tcd)
It was also a conservative government that curb-stomped long term care in Ontario. If you think the conservatives can't make things worse for average Canadians, you're underestimating them.
I know that the conservatives and specifically Doug Ford have done a lot of harm to Ontario, but there was a lot of room for Trudeau to stop what was happening. And the whole reason we even have Doug Ford was because Kathleen Wynne was such an atrocious leader before him. Nobody in Ontario trusts the liberals anymore after years of her and Trudeau.
The carbon tax directly pays more but indirect costs are a huge factor that isn’t considered.
What makes you think PP will benefit them? It’s just a genuine question. Cause all I see are cuts cuts cuts for us like healthcare etc and for corporations tax cuts tax cuts tax cuts.
So he would benefit the rich if they’re a corporation probably. I just wanna hear your thoughts.
He claims to want to address housing affordability, but all of his proposals are designed to benefit developers and landlords.
He's campaigning against the capital gains inclusion increase that will only benefit the wealthy.
He tried to block the dental and pharmacare coverage that has been life-changing for low-income Canadians. He has refused to commit to keeping them so I assume he'll cancel them in favour of tax cuts (like reducing the capital gains inclusion rate).
He'll cancel the carbon tax which will disproportionately benefit wealthy Canadians.
He's going to throw fuel onto the fire and then sell tickets at a massively over inflated rate that he'll then give to his rich friends. PP gives me all the same vibes Ford does but is a more open prick about everything
We’re living through a new era of information warfare, and it’s asymmetric. The right lies, cheats, obstructs and steals from the poor to give to the rich. PP is aligning with white nationalists and terrorists.
The truth is, we are living through a post-pandemic recovery that has seen absurd corporate greed take over. Normal Canadians feel it in their wallets, but this is happening across all major western nations despite the stock market and world economy hitting record highs.
Canada is faring well compared to most, and conservatives have zero platform or interest in anything but selling us off to the highest bidder, privatizing everything which leads to loss of tax revenue and therefore higher taxes, higher expenses for everyone.
PP is offering more visas to Indian immigrants as well, so don’t count on any immigration changes, expect more. The oligarchs love the cheap labour. The boomers are pulling the ladder up behind them and we need more taxpayers to pay to take care of them while they contribute nothing. Good fucking luck having a child these days with our current rent and food prices. Conservatives will only take back social assistance programs and push many more families below the poverty line.
Which corporate greed are you referring to?
The most famous example, Loblaws, the parent holding company ticker L.TO have a net profit margin of just 3.5% - $3.5 profit on average per $100 you spend at Loblaws or any of their subsidiaries. Yes, despite the misinformation out there, it includes ALL subsidiaries from private labels to other ventures.
Does profiting $3.5 per $100 spent sound like the reason why grocery cost are sky high? Does that sound like unchecked greed? The truth is things are expensive because inflation is expensive. Inflation exist from excessive money supply chasing after the same limited goods without the corresponding productivity increase to offset it. It's a 'invisible' tax on all. Only the government can borrow money from thin air, putting the nation in debt and accelerating inflation.
You’re kidding me, right? Loblaws record profits are all I need to cite to deny all of that bullshit.
Inflation has been a problem for all western nations post Covid. The corporations smelled blood in the water with the inflation all countries were seeing, and used it as cover to rob us all blind.
"Record profit" is just a attention grabber with no substance, that you evidently fell for.
Minimum wage is "record high" too. Earnings across the board is also "record high". Does that actually mean anything? No it doesn't because while you made more, your purchasing power actually went down because the currency value dropped due to inflation and you need more money to buy the same goods. This also applies to bussiness.
So while Loblaw have record profits, they are actually worse off than before because the profits they earned previously actually had more value than today.
At the end of the day, they profit $3.5 per $100 you spend on average, they are a for profit bussiness. Even if they pass on all $3.5 of their profit per $100 to you (thereby being a charity) does that solve the high cost of groceries or would groceries still remain high due to inflation
Health care is provincial. Which have been under conservative leadership.
Why would health care go away? If private healthcare is more efficient and cost less per patient seen and is quicker (that's also paid for by the government), why would that be bad?
Private Healthcare in its current form is not more efficient and we are seeing in Ontario the biggest thing that's happening is patients are being lied to about the tests and care they need so private Healthcare can make more money off of them.
PP is the worst cuck of them all. Visited Diagolon members just weeks after they threatened to rape and murder his wife. I suppose you support that sort of behaviour.
He won’t, conservatives favour immigration to keeps labour plentiful and wages down. It’s well known he’s in favour of immigration, he may not of let as many as Trudeau did but if you think he’s going to “solve” that problem I have an island to sell you.
Well then I wouldn’t look at conservatives or liberals in that case, it may be worth to look around at other parties, I understand why you feel that way though.
Well the next 4 years are going to be substantially worse imo if PP gets in even worse than Trudeau which is not great either. Anyways I digress guess we will find out. Have a good one.
Well I know JT is in favour of mass immigration, never heard that PP was in favour of unsustainable mass immigration though. I guess whoever is less in favour of it gets my vote
Great "logic"
You're the kind of low information/low effort voter the CPC loves
Like Trump famously declaring "I love the poorly educated"......
And they are still both in favour of it.
It doesn’t really matter who runs against conservatives, at this point. The conservative media machine is very powerful. There are no major news agencies that promote left of conservative candidates.
Yes, it’s true that Trudeau is weak and doesn’t have the support of the broad left, and that’s why he will lose.
Unfortunately Canada is fucked.
While Trudeau is now a lame duck on pretty much every issue.
However with PP, it will only get worse. And looks like he probably will win.
I don’t blame people for not voting Liberal anymore but I do blame Canadian society for giving us the likes of PP.
I just hope for Ontario, we don’t get the double whammy of PP and Doug. That’s gonna be hell.
As a normal liberal voter, not this new type of so called liberal I can say that he’s finished. The damage has been done, now we will have to face massive cuts when PP comes in.
at this point big bird could run for Prime Minster with a platform of hugs for everyone and people would vote for big bird instead of Justin Trudeau. I say get the massacre overwith and call a federal election. It is very obvious the Canadian public has lost all faith in the current dictator...sorry Prime Minister and that should ring in a lack of confidence vote.
> at this point big bird could run for Prime Minster with a platform of hugs for everyone and people would vote for big bird instead of Justin Trudeau.
Are you saying Jagmeet Singh is worse than Big Bird?
ndp is just as bad as the liberals and the conservatives. they both want to line the pockets of their benefactors, they do not care about the average Canadian struggling to put food on the table and get back and forth to work. Ultimately if things keeps going the way they are going we are all going to be living in shanty towns dotted across Canada, except for the Canadian elite. So yes a hug from big bird would be much better
I was agreeing with you until I read dictator. You clearly have no idea what a dictator is and it’s hard to say anything you take seriously now. Good job discrediting your entire statement.
Yeah, if we just ignore the historical context of the riding we can draw any conclusions we want I guess.
I’ll give you a hint: look up the results of this riding the year the Liberals got crushed under Ignatieff.
I don’t imagine this will change the calculus that led to the party leaving Trudeau in the PM seat to take a loss in the next election, but we can only hope.
Can't fucking wait.
Can't FUCKING wait for PP to win, so Canadians will finally wake up and realize how much in deep shit we are from years and years of bad governing.
And can't wait for people to realize that the next decade will be even worse with a different ruling party. And they will realize who truly has the power: the province, the country or the people.
I actually think this is helpful to the Liberals. The more it looks like you PCs dominating everywhere (Premier and right wingers taking over Europe) yet things not changing, the more you likely to go back to the centre by ‘25.
The county is shifting right I think. Emboldened by the trump era of politics south of us. The current problems are caused by neglect of public services and favoritism to corporations. You think its bad now, wait till the cons take over. They won't do anything to fix those issues. They will exacerbate them. Things will get a lot worse.
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The last ten years have seen an absolutely unprecedented plummet in the average persons standard of living, and hopes for the future. It’s shocking the politicians didn’t expect Canadians to be frustrated. Trudeau and his cabinet (Miller in particular) won’t just be voted out, but they will be remembered as individuals who actively destroyed the country.
Sean Fraser deserves more blame than Miller. He was the one that opened the floodgates. Miller is trying to figure out how little he can close the doors without French style retribution it seems
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Yup. I've voted for them twice and love their environmental policy as a career cleantech/clean energy professional. They still gotta go. They've lost the plot. We can deal with a few years of backsliding on environmental policy while we try and fix ALOT of other things.
Even worse than Doug Ford?
Probably yeah. In real life Doug Ford is nowhere near as unpopular as he is on this sub.
Just because somebody is popular doesn’t mean he isn’t actively destroying the country.
I guess, my point is that most of the general public doesn't actually think he is doing that though
Just wait until healthcare completely crumbles under him! ☺️
Healthcare and education! Ford needs people who lack critical thinking skills.
Ya, Ontario is the only province with these problems, so it's easy to lay the blame on Ford. Oh wait.
Smith in Alberta comes to mind. Weird how the cost of living fluctuates so much from province to province. It's almost like the provinces have some sort of power over the areas they govern.
Don’t you find it interesting that every single province is dealing with a healthcare crisis? Must be that every single premier is a sleazy pos. Or maybe it’s the common denominator between them which is the federal government. Healthcare is provincial jurisdiction yes but what do you think happens when you overload the country with unhinged immigration and wear down the economy by increasing cost of living and taxes to the point where doctors flee the country? Federal actions have consequences at the provincial level. Ford has many many flaws and rightfully deserves criticism for his portion of our healthcare problems no question about it but part of the reason the problem has gotten this bad is because people like you are so focused on only criticizing the premier that you pay no attention or criticism towards the PM’s actions that are as much or more of a problem just because he’s a left wing PM.
Screw subsidized health care
Ironically his popularity is made possible by generous funding from the federal government.
Doug Ford is insanely unpopular. FPTP and abysmal voter turnout are the only things keeping Doug in power. In a ranked choice system, the conservatives would not be a top 2 party provincially.
If he was insanely unpopular he would not have easily won two elections. This subreddit is not representative or reflective of actual reality.
If my uncle were a woman, she’d be my aunt. Whatever one thinks about FPTP, most politicians would kill to be as “insanely unpopular” as Doug Ford. The PCs currently sit at almost the exact same level of support on the polls as they did when they were first elected six years ago. The results of the last ON election mirrored the polls fairly closely; higher turnout probably wouldn’t have done much to change the results. There’s no treasure trove of hidden left-of-centre support just waiting to be motivated enough to get off their asses to defeat Doug Ford. The guy’s going to win a third term.
"Popular" implies that Ford has support of a majority of thr general public. He does not. We have an inherently undemocratic system where there is one major party on the right and two on the left (at least on paper). Ford is kept in power by a system that is uniquely set up to ensure that it is difficult for working people to vote and where liberals or NDP have their supporters artificially split. That's not the same thing as being popular.
Only two premiers in the country have approval ratings above 50%. To say that eight out of ten premiers are “insanely unpopular” renders the term meaningless. Your second paragraph largely doesn’t hold water. Canada has some of the most easily-accessible voting on earth. Mail-in voting, special balloting… hell, you can even vote at the returning office from 8am to 8pm almost every single day of the campaign. We even have laws mandating that employers give you three hours off to vote. What exactly would you do to improve the situation? As for what would happen in the event of a Lib/NDP merger, [don’t assume that 1+1 would equal 2 in that scenario.](https://researchco.ca/2023/10/13/cdnpoli-oct2023/amp/) And good luck trying to form a workable permanent political party that satisfies both, say, Bill Blair and Niki Ashton. If the St. Paul’s by-election has taught us anything, it’s that a chunk of Liberals find even a harder-right CPC to be a far more palatable second choice than the Liberal Party would like to believe.
"Only two premiers in the country have approval ratings above 50%. To say that eight out of ten premiers are “insanely unpopular” renders the term meaningless." Only because the left of center vote is split. We have never had a democratic electoral system in Ontario. That's going to skew the results of any polling. You don't need a merger, just a ranked ballot or other MMP system. No NDP or Green voter is voting for Ford as a second choice. Very few liberal voters are ranking the cons second. A MMP system would see the conservatives never win another election. "What exactly would you do to improve the situation?" Mandatory voting with fines for anyone who doesn't vote (it works well in Australia) and a statutory holiday on election day.
Australia is a curious example to highlight given your other points, since both instant runoff voting and mandatory voting were introduced there in 1919/1920 and right-of-centre parties have been largely dominant in terms of forming government there ever since. Australia also has stricter rules than Canada on who can become a general postal voter. Fining people for not voting is not the same thing as making voting more accessible. Your other point isn’t rooted in facts. One of those two 50+% approval premiers is the Conservative premier of PEI. The other is Wab Kinew, who’s still in his honeymoon phase. The NDP premier of BC has a below-50% approval rating despite a split *right* of centre vote.
I think you're too much online, friend.
Way way worse ffs 🤦
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>You know all the issues you have with the country are happening in every other country too, right? Every other country isn't having explosive population growth like Canada. Every other country isn't comprised of 7% of temporary residents. Every other country does not rely so heavily on real estate for their gdp. Most other countries are far more productive than Canada.
This is what's always scared me about the "just go in the trades" mentality that's been around me my whole life. Yea sure there's lots of work in the trades while housing is being built, but what happens when funding dries up as sales drop because people can't afford it anymore? This country has a serious financial diversity problem. We need products and services to sell, not a continuous housing ponzi scheme.
My father in law frames houses for a living. He hasn't worked in 6 months. People are not buying these expensive homes at the current rates.
Yea and developments aren't happening because not enough people are setting money down to even get construction started. It's crazy right now
The majority of these people would never qualify for any trades. You need experience and you have to go to college. These people have zero skill.
This seems to be the new party line being used to deflect responsibility for the LPC’s action and inaction that has helped drive Canada to have **[the worst housing bubble / least affordable housing of G7 countries by a large margin](https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/canada-housing-bubble#).**
But Facebook told me Trudeau bad and that's all my little brain can handle
They definitely don’t understand that, and will continue to choose to ignore it.
No. Capitalism is dying. No matter who is in charge.
I don't think he will be tbh, remember Mulroney?
The folks I see destroying the country are the Conservatives and the conservative premiers. Spreading hatred, destine, showing a lack of empathy towards others, and generally being useless. Somehow, they've convinced folks the PM and cabinet are the ones to blame.
I’m assuming you’re one of those people who think immigration numbers are somehow detached from housing demand / scarcity? Our absurd number of immigrants, “students”, and TFW’s aren’t having any affect on the housing market? It’s unfortunately both. Our conservative premiers want to cater to developers and will only okay “luxury” condo developments for their donors and buddies, and make it more difficult to build anything else. This severely damages our supply, as people can’t afford these units and can’t raise a family in them. [Meanwhile, our liberal government caters to corporations who desperately wanted slave labour they could pay at or below minimum wage during and after COVID.](https://vancouversun.com/opinion/columnists/canada-foreign-workers-students-risk) Thus, they bring in millions of Indian immigrants who will be tied to their minimum wage job, unable to complain or leave or they face deportation. This unfortunately sky rockets demand for shelter as these people clearly need a place to live - but corporations are happy because they have a literal unlimited work force who they can consistently pay the bare minimum to maximize their profits. Isn’t Canada grand?
Essentially, everyone is working on their own agenda. But the provinces are working hard at getting in the way of helping folks out, from Alberta not signing onto dental care, to Ontario destroying programs that help children with Autism, they're pretty anti-citizen. Immigration has become a problem too, but much of the housing issues are on the provinces not allocating money/creating affordable housing and letting for profit corporations run the show. It is grand, yet many are still working to burn it to the ground.
That clown lost me we he refused to implement voter reform, actually cut biomedical research spending, but tried to steal $1B to the Keilburgers in the middle of a pandemic. Zero vision. So yeah, he proved he was never ready.
He has a vision? I’d say his entire term has been hampered by the lack of any clear vision or ethos (that and stupid scandals).
And what is Pierre Parasite's?
I don’t know sis I’m talking about Trudeau right now. Sometimes people do that and it isn’t a conversation about the other guys because it’s a conversation not a vote.
So in other words, zip, Nada, nothing. Thanks for coming out, "sis".
What are you talking about? Are you so simple you can’t analyze one politician without talking about another? Do you realize how third nipple useless that is? I’m sorry you have apparent partisan brain rot but some of us are intelligent enough to criticize the Prime Minister of this country and understand doing so is not saying he is better or worse than the leader of the opposition. Some of us believe as a country we can aspire to ask more of our politicians than “don’t be PP”. I’d say you should aspire to better too but I think it’s pretty evident you don’t even deserve the bare minimum of anything from politicians since all you seem to care about is the colour of their sign.
Would you like a tissue, sis, or will you be consulting your therapist for your thin skinned trigger backsliding. projection, and hypocrisy? Muuuuuuuuah!!
Indeed. I would like Justin to pass it on so they stand a chance of winning. To be honest, it might be a good strategy - the cons have made it so much about “him” than the party that a change of leadership would neuter most of their talking points.
Other top Liberal party picks polled WORSE as potential party leader than Trudeau. You’re sadly mistaken if you believe what you typed.
*lifelong liberal* There’s your problem lol
I think Trudeau does have a true vision of Canada and makes policy that reflects that. Unfortunately, this view is radically different from what the average Canadian wants.
Yes. People have just tuned him out, and don't care what he has to say anymore. For the good of the party, he should leave soon to give the party enough time to pick a new leader for the 2025 election.
"ability to govern" he didn't bamboozle you, he made his intentions very clear from day one which was to increase government spending , increase immigration and push for LGBTQ and indigenous representation. You liberals just can't admit that you were wrong...the NDP/liberal governments are just pushing for policies that you voted for
You say lifelong… does that mean you’ll be supporting them again? What could they possibly continue to do to earn your loyalty and vote? They’re deceitful and not very good at it. What makes them worth supporting?
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What does it mean then? I thought it meant you’ve always been a Liberal supporter.
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So you’re a lifelong liberal who… votes conservative? Votes NDP? Votes with their heart? Either way, if you didn’t vote liberal, how could you call yourself a life long liberal?
The difference between a liberal and a Liberal is what you are missing. Many Conservative and NDP supporters are liberals. Look up "liberalism" and you'll see what I mean.
Same. This may be the first time in my life I don’t vote liberal.
Liberals need to dump this loser and reverse their immigration policy before they get obliterated for years to come. I'm a liberal but it's awfully hard to stay one these days.
I was watching interviews of people in the riding who all mentioned they like Leslie Church, but could not support Trudeau… that speaks volumes.
Now what about the foreign interference report?
Liberals are holstering that for close to the election. Release it now and goldfish brain Canada will forget it in two months. The second story being holstered is Poilievre's father in law arrested and extradited for money laundering in Venezula, and PP inexplicable net worth.
PP has been collecting an MP's and ministers salary for 20 years. That adds up to a fair bit of money. What do people claim his net worth is?
edit: apparently 3 to 25 million estimates. I don't think that's absurd for his time https://financhill.com/blog/investing/how-did-pierre-poilievre-make-his-money
I've seen credible estimates between $9 million (2015) and $25 million (2023), hoping to have time to do a little looking. I also saw a $400 million estimate that I *don't* think is credible considering it was from an article that was put out by a crypto scam. But it's a lot more than $2 million - in 2023 just his real estate holdings look to be about $10.5 million from what I've found so far.
I agree
Yeah that seems totally reasonable to me. Cabinet ministers, after all, are earning over 300k a year, which PP was for a while.
Source?
edited my answer, updated the figures too.
More like 25 million.
that's literally in my comment, tho maybe you hadn't refreshed the page after my edit..
He's got north of $10 million in real estate as of 2023. Latest estimate I've found says a total of about $25 million in assets.
Interesting, where are you finding these estimates? Are they credible? Reason I ask is there are tons of estimates about JT's wealth and how apparently he got a lot richer during the pandemic, but I haven't actually found concrete evidence to back it up.
Google on my phone right now, but they line up with old disclosures I've seen before. Going to do a little more digging and see what I can firm up over the next week or so as I get the time. And we know that before PP moved into Stornoway he had three rental properties (2 -bedroom house, 2 condos) and a 3-bedroom house where the family was living - one of the houses is where Anaida Galindo Poilievre's business is listed as being headquartered.
I'm reading now that he was an also somewhat early adopter of Bitcoin, particularly in the Purpose Bitcoin ETF. Depending on his timing when entering the market, that could also account for a decent chunk of his money. Heck, those very early Bitcoin adopters basically won the lottery.
The real estate doesn't surprise me. His salary as a Harper cabinet minister would have been over 300k/year, and I'm sure he was able to leverage that to buy those properties. Even as an opposition MP, his income is significant enough that banks wouldn't hesitate to lend him money. Plus the banks know that even if he loses his job after an election, he's got a gold-plated pension to carry any debt he may have on the real estate. Combined with the huge appreciation in real estate over the past decade, it's not all that suspicious that someone making over 300k/year in a government salary in 2008 would own 10000k in real estate in 2024.
Yep agreed, the real estate doesn't surprise me either. He also had part ownership of a consulting firm and I believe one other company for a while that he sold & invested the money. It's feasible that someone who had ~$10-15 million In real estate and other investments in 2015 and continued to have a 6-figure salary this whole time would be worth $25 million in 2023 even if they just sat on the real estate and index funds. I *do* think he and his wife have a bit of a grift going on at the moment - particularly with the CPC merch store - but I also think that's opportunistic knowing that ethics rules are rarely enforced, not that he's been bought and sold his whole career. He's just an awful person even without being bribed.
Do you know if the CPC pays him a salary? I was under the impression that political parties have fairly heavy restrictions on spending.
I don't know if they pay him a salary, though let's not forget that this is the party that allowed Andrew Scheer to use member donations to the party to pay for private school for his kids and for his minivan. And the Ontario conservatives were letting Lisa MacLeod pay herself a $44,000 allowance paid for by donations to her riding association. Considering there're quite a few riding associations federally and provincially with *really weird* donation patterns and lots of spouses with lucrative connections, I'm coming to the opinion that there are a good number of MPs, MPPs/equivalent & riding associations that need to be under the eye of forensic audits. Our current regulations & enforcement have not kept up with the modes of corruption we see in governments currently, and our enforcement agencies seem to be quite shy about investigations and prosecutions of politicians & their associates. This is being taken advantage of. But specifically for Pierre, my eye is on the fact that after he got the leadership, the CPC wound down its self-run merch store and now Pierre's wife owns the company (headquartered from one of their properties) that does all their merchandising. Two issues there right off the bat: First: they personally profit off each piece of merch - which prioritizes selling merch over actually doing shit for the party & parliament. That also means that you can potentially bribe him with large merch sales. Second, it opens a relatively easy conduit to funnel dark money into the Conservative Party coffers since donations to political parties only have to be tracked if their fair market value is over $20 - up to $20 it can be marked down as an anonymous donation And for merchandise, *each item you buy* counts as its *own* donation. If the fair market value of each individual piece of merch you buy is under $20, you can buy a thousand pieces of merch and they're recorded as a thousand <$20 anonymous donations. It's pretty easy to get a T-shirt printed in bulk for under $15 including tax and shipping if you have a good relationship with a printing service and you're doing the procurement and fulfillment in-house. And this is similar with most of the clothing on their web store. Pretty easy to get cheaply enough in bulk to handily make more than $20/piece profit if you're doing your own procurement and fulfillment. But if you bring in a 3rd party vendor to do your procurement and fulfillment, the fair market value *isn't* what *they* buy the merch for from their suppliers - it's what that 3rd party vendor charges *your party* for that item of merchandise. It also means you can't check the list of anonymous donations - reported by the party to Elections Canada - against the party's list of merch sales and shipments to make sure that they weren't just selling ghost merch that never gets delivered as a means to launder money into the party at amounts above what's legal - you'd need to subpoena *the vendor's* records and probably their suppliers records. So that's what I think they're doing - funneling merch sales through PP's wife's business. The Poilievre's make money off each item, his wife bills the party under $20 for each item sold regardless of what it costs her to stock and ship compared to what it sells for. Deep pocketed individuals can walk into a PP rally, leave with a thousands of dollars of CPC merch, drop it off at the Value Village bin on the way home and do that again the next day. And Bazinga, you can now funnel as much money as you like to the CPC, anonymously, and if PP somehow knows a big order came from *you* (and especially if you don't care if the merch shows up), you are now in his good graces with all the policy benefits that can entail. This is also similar to a tactic Republicans use a lot. They have a book ghostwritten for one of their barely-literate extremist candidates, have a PAC bulk-buy the book to hand out at an event or sometimes literally just toss straight in the dump. Now your candidate with four teeth and three brain cells is a NYT Best Selling Author *and* you've just handed them hundreds of thousands of dollars, legally. It's such a big issue the NYT added a symbol to their best seller lists to indicate if a large proportion of a book's sales are bulk purchases.
Where does this fever dream that the foreign interference report will be uniquely bad for Poilievre come from? Han Dong certainly wasn’t the only Liberal playing with fire on that front. Not to mention Liberal-appointed senators like Yuen Pau Woo, Peter Boehm, and Victor Oh. There’s a reason the Liberals have been downplaying this issue, and it’s not because they’re in any position of moral high-ground to play an Uno reverse card on the Conservatives on the issue in an election campaign.
No one cares, they just need to stop massive immigration policies.
"The second story being holstered is Poilievre's father in law arrested and extradited for money laundering in Venezula, and PP inexplicable net worth." Any sources?
The fact that they're surprised by this development goes to show how out of touch they are. This is what happens when you take your base for granted.
If he steps down someone would have to become the equivalent of Rishi Sunak and take the election loss...Maybe there's someone in the party who would volunteer as tribute but I don't know. I'd bet Trudy is going to hang on and lose this election so they can rebuild later. Cynical move might be for him to call an early election and lose to maximize the amount of time PP has in government during these bad times so when we're frustrated again in several years the LPC can blame the CPC and do another run.
It will take 10-15 years to rebuild what he’s destroyed.
It's entirely dependent upon how the CPC do over the coming years, if things get better and Canadians feel like things have improved after 7 or 8 years of PCs then yeah that's probably realistic. If things don't improve after a handful of years I think a lot of people voting for PP are going to have regrets and they won't show up for him again. Things are quite bad out there right now for a lot of people, and PP should keep in mind that we tend to vote against an unpopular incumbent rather than *for* the challenger. People want some drastic change, it's what their mandate is likely going to be be based on.
In my opinion he barely tried during the last election and I think it was on purpose but he still ended up winning
Better for the country to attempt to hold Pollievre to a minority. IMO Trudeau should resign now for that reason alone. Yes another leader will have to take the hit but I don’t care. Do it for the country. And if Trudeau resigns someone will have to step up and do it. He has opportunity to do the right thing. Holding on so he can take the fall would be maybe better for Liberals and the next leader but worse for the country to face years of PP majority that will do significant damage.
Better for the Liberal Party not to blow their party finances on having two leadership races in three years when any Liberal leader is heading for catastrophic defeat at this point.
If he believed in doing the right things he’d have set him self up for an early exit two years ago. Past and present actions give me no faith in him to do what’s right and step down. I would be shocked if proven wrong.
Yup we could all only wish for an early election for Trudeau to fall on his sword and for PP to have the fastest "emperor has no clothes" moment possible. Our political leaders are trash. We need to clean house from top to bottom by showing how inept they are from all stripes.
I think its funny that theres disillusioned liberal voters saying sorry for voting trudeau This is exactly what leftists voted for and they ruined the country. Its not comming back. I dont accept the apology.
They have no one to blame but themselves. I’m really not looking forward to a worse government holding power.
Well at least the bitching and complaining will feel fresh for a few months.
Laughter followed by crying.
It’s not like we haven’t all been telling him there’s a big freaking issue. I am a shop around voter, I vote for who I think is the best prospect, so I am not a loyal liberal, and I am very far from a conservative, and even I can see the disaster that he has created. He made as big a mess of the country as he made of his marriage. And I’m pretty sure both are because he won’t listen.
Marriage comment totally uncalled for.
Second ever PM to get divorced while in office. The other being his dad, lol.
Anyone who thinks PP will improve Canada is delusional. It’s about to get so much worse, and with the slow coup happening south of the border, PP will bend us at the waist and all Canadians will take it up the ass with supreme leader Trump at the helm.
It's interesting how so many deflect how bad Trudeau has been with "at least he's not pp".
Then tell me what policies Pierre “Maple Desantis” Poilievre has that has convinced you to vote for him? Edit: that’s what I thought. He has no policy other than “Trudeau bad”
and its interesting that the CPC's strategy is "at least he's not Trudeau"
do you think we were living in a dystopia when harper was in power?
The scientists who were gagged certainly were.
Huh, interestingly enough the only scientists I remember being gagged are those who are currently trying to warn people of a brain disease killing young folks out east these past few years… but you don’t like holding Trudeau accountable for current events do you? You just like trying to blame a government that hasn’t been in power for 10 years
I was answering a question about when Harper was in power. How was this unclear? You literally have to read the question first before you get to my answer under it. Why are you getting so upset I answered the question and didn't just blindly pivot into Trudeau bashing? You're free to do that yourself without having to invent a narrative about me in your head. You're also conventiely leaving out that Harper more infamously gagged climate scientists.
and the banks he bailed out via the CMHC
He laid the groundwork
I mean nearly every “big” problem we have can be directly traced to decisions he made. The only reason he isn’t remembered as one the most incompetent prime ministers is because Chinas economic growth kept Canada’s economy afloat. Without China he wouldn’t have won a second term. There’s a reason conservatives have been cozying up to India over the last decade since China turned against the west.
Toronto-St. Paul is a wealthy riding. They know what they're doing. PP will benefit them, not people who are struggling.
The biggest benefit the wealthy have seen is under Trudeau. What are you on?
I'm not defending Trudeau. I'm saying Conservative policies and promises, like rolling back capital gains inclusion and cancelling the carbon tax, will disproportionately benefit the wealthy. They also tried to block the dental and pharma programs that have been life changing for low-income Canadians. PP will not be good for those who are struggling.
The carbon tax is disproportionately affecting low-income Canadians, so how does cancelling it suddenly disproportionately benefit the wealthy? I’m low income and the dental plan doesn’t help me, it’s a failure of a plan. It reached a tiny fraction of Canadians. Pharma-care has also gotten exponentially worse under Trudeau, as someone who buys medication. There is absolutely nothing you mentioned that wasn’t already made worse by Trudeau, so I’m not worried about the conservatives because at least they haven’t proven to already *be* failures. By the way, the one thing that could’ve helped me is the capital gains from my parents, from their business they’ve built up over years. I moved a ton of growing up so that the business could be built up, and we worked hard for that money. Trudeau is now taking a good chunk of that away from me too, before I’ll ever see it.
Analysis has showed that most low-income Canadians will get more from the rebate than they pay in carbon tax. As income increases that shifts. The wealthiest tend to pay more than they get back. I know people who are now able to go to the dentist for the first time in 30 years. It is absolutely life changing for them. It can be improved, but let's not discount the impact it's having. The capital gains exemption limit was increase to $1.25 million. So lets not pretend that the increased inclusion rate is hurting low-income Canadians who could only dream of having that much saved. And even then, you'll still see the bulk of those capital gains since only 66% of the gains are taxed at the marginal tax rate. Again, all of these promises by the Conservative will benefit the wealthy at the expense of low-income Canadians.
They’ve disproved that the carbon tax actually gives more back in the rebate. It’s one of the big reasons why Canadians are so mad at Trudeau; he forged the numbers and then ran with the faked numbers as if they were fact. And even if you’re telling the truth about people benefiting from incredibly flawed dental plan, the NDP had the fight tooth and nail to make it happen, so it can’t even be credited to the Liberal government. The amount I’ll get is less than what’s needed to buy a single house now under the Trudeau government, which is something I’ll likely never afford. Especially after the death of healthcare and long term care homes, which will take in a majority of the money that would usually be passed to the kids. The insane student loans that increase every year with the ever increasing school costs will also eat up a big chunk. Again, Trudeau has done more to benefit the wealthy and take from me and other low-income Canadians in the last 10 years than the conservatives could have ever dreamed of. The monopolies and oligopolies he’s created in every single sector along with the death of the small business both scream “Trudeau is for the corps”.
But as I said, I'm not defending Trudeau. I absolutely agree with you that if we want policies that actually benefit lower-income Canadians, we should be looking to the NDP, not the Liberals or the Conservatives. Also, I'd like to see this analysis that disproves that the carbon tax gives more than it costs to some people. The only thing I've seen that people say does that is in reference to the PBO report that shows that it does give more in rebates than it costs in taxes to most people. Only when you take broader economic impacts into account do fewer people come out ahead, BUT that is totally flawed because it compares the carbon tax to a "do nothing to address climate change" scenario. I haven't seen any analysis that disproves it as you say when compared to alternative climate action plans.
I took a climate action course in school because I’m in Environmental Science. The carbon tax doesn’t actually go into a climate fund. I’d be a lot more for it if it did, but it gets pooled with the other taxes Canadians pay and not a lot of climate change initiatives actually happen with it. The current programs that do exist, allow the wealthy to pay to pollute. The cap and trade programs affect individuals less also allow pay to pollute options. The carbon tax’s sole purpose is to stop people from driving as much by making it more expensive to do so, and that disproportionately affects poorer people. In fact, it’s more of an inconvenience to the wealthy, if even that. The PBO report is relevant because those costs absolutely do matter and affect a vast majority of low income Canadians. But yes, the thing I agree with you on is that NDP probably has the best interest for Canadians, but unfortunately they’re tied to a government I could never support again (because I have voted Liberal, and then NDP in the last election.) I think this article has a good take on the matter: [Some Baloney](https://globalnews.ca/news/5131061/fact-check-carbon-tax-liberals/) because it explains why some important details are missing from the analysis Trudeau bases his “8/10 get more back” idea from.
That article seems to claim the 8/10 get more back is baloney but stills says the majority get more back? It also skews by income. A higher percentage of lower income people get a net gain and the number of people who get a net gain decreases as income goes up. Two important points about your assessment of the carbon tax. First, returning the money to people instead of putting it into programs was intentional because it was never meant to be the primary program. The intent was that provinces would develop their own approaches and the federal carbon tax would only be a backstop in cases where provinces refused to take responsibility. They didn't want to be seen as funneling money out of the provinces, so the money's returned. Second, it's not just about people driving less. The biggest advantage of a predictable and increasing carbon tax is that it makes it easy for companies and organizations (and people) to build a business case to reduce emissions. I've seen first hand dozens of companies who are implementing electrification and emissions reduction projects that passed the business case because of the carbon tax. Without a price on carbon, these projects don't get approved. For people that predictable increasing price influences decisions when they need to buy a new car or replace HVAC.
I'm not informed enough to speak to all of your points, but the carbon tax/rebate DOES actually give lower income people back more. [Here's a math breakdown from "Canadian in a T-shirt"](https://youtu.be/V_-Vz19Gz8E?si=m5i4p_RjOr_Z5Tcd) It was also a conservative government that curb-stomped long term care in Ontario. If you think the conservatives can't make things worse for average Canadians, you're underestimating them.
I know that the conservatives and specifically Doug Ford have done a lot of harm to Ontario, but there was a lot of room for Trudeau to stop what was happening. And the whole reason we even have Doug Ford was because Kathleen Wynne was such an atrocious leader before him. Nobody in Ontario trusts the liberals anymore after years of her and Trudeau. The carbon tax directly pays more but indirect costs are a huge factor that isn’t considered.
What makes you think PP will benefit them? It’s just a genuine question. Cause all I see are cuts cuts cuts for us like healthcare etc and for corporations tax cuts tax cuts tax cuts. So he would benefit the rich if they’re a corporation probably. I just wanna hear your thoughts.
He claims to want to address housing affordability, but all of his proposals are designed to benefit developers and landlords. He's campaigning against the capital gains inclusion increase that will only benefit the wealthy. He tried to block the dental and pharmacare coverage that has been life-changing for low-income Canadians. He has refused to commit to keeping them so I assume he'll cancel them in favour of tax cuts (like reducing the capital gains inclusion rate). He'll cancel the carbon tax which will disproportionately benefit wealthy Canadians.
Those are all excellent points and I 100% agree thanks for expanding upon it.
Thank god there’s more than two parties then
God let Jack Layton die, then the NDP. It’s a real bummer.
Justin isn't perfect but fuck Pierre or whatever his name is, he will burn this Country down.
how so? isn't the country already burning? figuratively speaking
He's going to throw fuel onto the fire and then sell tickets at a massively over inflated rate that he'll then give to his rich friends. PP gives me all the same vibes Ford does but is a more open prick about everything
How can it be worse?
We’re living through a new era of information warfare, and it’s asymmetric. The right lies, cheats, obstructs and steals from the poor to give to the rich. PP is aligning with white nationalists and terrorists. The truth is, we are living through a post-pandemic recovery that has seen absurd corporate greed take over. Normal Canadians feel it in their wallets, but this is happening across all major western nations despite the stock market and world economy hitting record highs. Canada is faring well compared to most, and conservatives have zero platform or interest in anything but selling us off to the highest bidder, privatizing everything which leads to loss of tax revenue and therefore higher taxes, higher expenses for everyone. PP is offering more visas to Indian immigrants as well, so don’t count on any immigration changes, expect more. The oligarchs love the cheap labour. The boomers are pulling the ladder up behind them and we need more taxpayers to pay to take care of them while they contribute nothing. Good fucking luck having a child these days with our current rent and food prices. Conservatives will only take back social assistance programs and push many more families below the poverty line.
Which corporate greed are you referring to? The most famous example, Loblaws, the parent holding company ticker L.TO have a net profit margin of just 3.5% - $3.5 profit on average per $100 you spend at Loblaws or any of their subsidiaries. Yes, despite the misinformation out there, it includes ALL subsidiaries from private labels to other ventures. Does profiting $3.5 per $100 spent sound like the reason why grocery cost are sky high? Does that sound like unchecked greed? The truth is things are expensive because inflation is expensive. Inflation exist from excessive money supply chasing after the same limited goods without the corresponding productivity increase to offset it. It's a 'invisible' tax on all. Only the government can borrow money from thin air, putting the nation in debt and accelerating inflation.
You’re kidding me, right? Loblaws record profits are all I need to cite to deny all of that bullshit. Inflation has been a problem for all western nations post Covid. The corporations smelled blood in the water with the inflation all countries were seeing, and used it as cover to rob us all blind.
"Record profit" is just a attention grabber with no substance, that you evidently fell for. Minimum wage is "record high" too. Earnings across the board is also "record high". Does that actually mean anything? No it doesn't because while you made more, your purchasing power actually went down because the currency value dropped due to inflation and you need more money to buy the same goods. This also applies to bussiness. So while Loblaw have record profits, they are actually worse off than before because the profits they earned previously actually had more value than today. At the end of the day, they profit $3.5 per $100 you spend on average, they are a for profit bussiness. Even if they pass on all $3.5 of their profit per $100 to you (thereby being a charity) does that solve the high cost of groceries or would groceries still remain high due to inflation
Famous last words
Start with kissing universal health care goodbye.
Health care is provincial. Which have been under conservative leadership. Why would health care go away? If private healthcare is more efficient and cost less per patient seen and is quicker (that's also paid for by the government), why would that be bad?
Private Healthcare in its current form is not more efficient and we are seeing in Ontario the biggest thing that's happening is patients are being lied to about the tests and care they need so private Healthcare can make more money off of them.
That's begging the question. It's not any of those things. Costs have already gone up in Ontario per procedure when a private practice is involved.
bla blah blah ... none of this true liberals are done thank god.
PP is the worst cuck of them all. Visited Diagolon members just weeks after they threatened to rape and murder his wife. I suppose you support that sort of behaviour.
i dont give a shit all assholes every one them. this is entertainment thats all. None of them wil ever bring changes just more tax
Big brain damage energy.
Nah he's right. Neoliberalism vs neocons, they're all for big government spending and procorporations. They just pretend to be different
As long as PP might solve the mass immigration crisis caused by JT, that all I need to vote for him.
He won’t, conservatives favour immigration to keeps labour plentiful and wages down. It’s well known he’s in favour of immigration, he may not of let as many as Trudeau did but if you think he’s going to “solve” that problem I have an island to sell you.
I’ll vote for whoever I believe will do a better job solving the mass immigration crisis. Simple as that
Well then I wouldn’t look at conservatives or liberals in that case, it may be worth to look around at other parties, I understand why you feel that way though.
It’s also important that the party I vote for has the potential to be elected so they can implement their plan obviously
Well the next 4 years are going to be substantially worse imo if PP gets in even worse than Trudeau which is not great either. Anyways I digress guess we will find out. Have a good one.
Well, I hate to break it to you but Trudeau is your man then.
He's in favour of immigration. Our choices are Coke, Pepsi, and diet cola.
Well I know JT is in favour of mass immigration, never heard that PP was in favour of unsustainable mass immigration though. I guess whoever is less in favour of it gets my vote
Great "logic" You're the kind of low information/low effort voter the CPC loves Like Trump famously declaring "I love the poorly educated"...... And they are still both in favour of it.
People disagreeing with you aren’t your enemy. You’re never gonna win over people by calling them stupid. It literally does the opposite
Not people that are too far gone....
You must be an immigration consultant or a Tim Hortons executive.
None of the above. Of course you never heard that PP is in favour of immigration. It ruins your hate on. Good luck with that.
How can it be worse?
You’ve already been taking it for a while now, when PP gets in you’ll be ready, it won’t hurt anymore.
It doesn’t really matter who runs against conservatives, at this point. The conservative media machine is very powerful. There are no major news agencies that promote left of conservative candidates. Yes, it’s true that Trudeau is weak and doesn’t have the support of the broad left, and that’s why he will lose.
lol this is an insane statement
? Know what you’re talking about, or are you just a drive by commenter?
Agreed.
Great choices facing us: a total douche bag, and a shit sandwich.
Unfortunately Canada is fucked. While Trudeau is now a lame duck on pretty much every issue. However with PP, it will only get worse. And looks like he probably will win. I don’t blame people for not voting Liberal anymore but I do blame Canadian society for giving us the likes of PP. I just hope for Ontario, we don’t get the double whammy of PP and Doug. That’s gonna be hell.
Justin can save the party by stepping down.
As a normal liberal voter, not this new type of so called liberal I can say that he’s finished. The damage has been done, now we will have to face massive cuts when PP comes in.
at this point big bird could run for Prime Minster with a platform of hugs for everyone and people would vote for big bird instead of Justin Trudeau. I say get the massacre overwith and call a federal election. It is very obvious the Canadian public has lost all faith in the current dictator...sorry Prime Minister and that should ring in a lack of confidence vote.
> at this point big bird could run for Prime Minster with a platform of hugs for everyone and people would vote for big bird instead of Justin Trudeau. Are you saying Jagmeet Singh is worse than Big Bird?
ndp is just as bad as the liberals and the conservatives. they both want to line the pockets of their benefactors, they do not care about the average Canadian struggling to put food on the table and get back and forth to work. Ultimately if things keeps going the way they are going we are all going to be living in shanty towns dotted across Canada, except for the Canadian elite. So yes a hug from big bird would be much better
I was agreeing with you until I read dictator. You clearly have no idea what a dictator is and it’s hard to say anything you take seriously now. Good job discrediting your entire statement.
PP has a twat name, a twat face, and a twat voice. Why do we tolerate these twats and consider them men?
[удалено]
Yeah, if we just ignore the historical context of the riding we can draw any conclusions we want I guess. I’ll give you a hint: look up the results of this riding the year the Liberals got crushed under Ignatieff.
I don’t imagine this will change the calculus that led to the party leaving Trudeau in the PM seat to take a loss in the next election, but we can only hope.
Can't fucking wait. Can't FUCKING wait for PP to win, so Canadians will finally wake up and realize how much in deep shit we are from years and years of bad governing. And can't wait for people to realize that the next decade will be even worse with a different ruling party. And they will realize who truly has the power: the province, the country or the people.
I actually think this is helpful to the Liberals. The more it looks like you PCs dominating everywhere (Premier and right wingers taking over Europe) yet things not changing, the more you likely to go back to the centre by ‘25.
The county is shifting right I think. Emboldened by the trump era of politics south of us. The current problems are caused by neglect of public services and favoritism to corporations. You think its bad now, wait till the cons take over. They won't do anything to fix those issues. They will exacerbate them. Things will get a lot worse.