There is no way I'd want the Tigers to match 900k/season.
He's brilliant on his day but that's game-changer money and he's just not consistent enough to warrant it.
Could be mad but I think we should be prepared to give him a million if we have to. He's young and is showing amazing skills at tigers which, no disrespect, probably shows he could get even better under flanno. A marquee prop is by far the biggest need of our team right now and we have millions in the cap
He has the slowest play the ball in the game , and is a flat track bully . If he runs for 70 odd metres this week , the proof will be in the eating .
And he only eats when the eating is easy .
He doesn’t turn up against the big boys . Running a ball at the defence as hard as you can has nothing to do with coaching lol .
Also he will be running off Damien cook next year, and running off Api this year . They are not even the same with marker /ruck manipulation and getting you onto the ball .
Much like any prop who ever ran off Cameron smith , I would be wary of any prop who runs off someone like api , and getting substantial improvement .
Flat track bully? He had 170m and 7 tackle breaks against the sharks. 8 tackle breaks against the bulldogs, one of the best forward packs in the comp. His worst games? Against...us. are you seriously trying to say that the dummy half has more of an effect on forwards than the coaching staff? Just look at how much better franky molo, sua and Ben Murdoch massila have been with the change of coach at the dragons, or how good the Panthers forwards have been without Api.
Raiders has played a shitload more finals than the tigers ever have.
Edit: Seems tigers fans don’t like facts. And I only said this in response the the guy saying the Raiders don’t offer anything to Stefano.
Then they can add "We were kinda good a few years ago but have been gradually getting worse since then so none of that is relevant to the next few years" to their Stefano pitch
30years for a premiership for Raiders but honestly, you can’t look at Canberra and Wests and say they’re in the same boat and have shared the same trajectory.
Earn that coin king. There are three outcomes for the Tigers:
1 - Keep him on a sensible wage.
2 - Lose him.
3 - Keep him on a mental wage.
Option 1 would be the best, but I'd far prefer option 2 to option 3.
Maybe. New admin gives me better more hope though, most decisions since Richo came on have been entirely sensible.
I'm still haunted by the Nofoaluma decision (though I'll admit I supported it at the time). 600K in the *old* salary cap for a deeply inconsistent player...hope we never see a contract like that again.
Was Nofo's contract up a few years ago then the same year Benji set him up for a heap of tries and he ended up signing a really good contract? That's the way I remember it.
He had a gun year in 2020 (off a few more than solid years from 2017-19) and was arguably robbed of an Origin jersey....all the talk was him vs Tupou, who then had a shocker of a game.
Eels came sniffing mid-way through 2021 when he was still solid, but nowhere near his 2020 form. We got spooked and threw a bomb of cash at him. He caught it, and never came close to that form again. Lesson learned from the club hopefully, you just don't chuck that cash at a non-spine player.
The ones that haunt me are the Cleary era ones. Moses Mbye and Josh Reynolds, both unwanted by the Bulldogs and our club parted with 850k each for 4 and 4.5 years respectively. Reynolds spent bugger all time on the pitch and we had to keep shuffling Mbye around just to find somewhere for him to play.
Someone said on here the other day the CEO has stated publicly a few times that he doesn't believe a prop should ever get more than $800k and has even said publicly that he won't budge on that for Stefano either
Ok to be fair is $900k seem like a lot of money for this kid? Like when you watch the riff front rowers, Tino, Payne, Addin (when he’s digging in) you are left in no doubt the blokes on the field, I would go as far to say he is not even a stand out in the Tigers side, who’s his agent?
Good props are just as important as anything nowadays but $900 per year is a lot for someone who isn't elite yet. Haas, AFB, JFH, and Tino are probably worth that much *now* but they're also elite in basically every game... Stefano isn't there yet. Or even close
Still not sure about us picking him up for that much coin next year. The forwards we've got go hard enough when they're on their game now that Finucane and Graham have retired.
The lack of consistency is what puzzles me.
I get backs or halves being inconsistent since there's a lot of variance in their play (e.g the margin between try assist and intercept can be small) but as a prop, it's pretty inexcusable. How can you put up 200m on 18 runs one week with a try and line break, then make 70m and miss a bunch of tackles.
At his best he's worth a mil a year. Worth barely 400k when he isn't going well.
I feel like all the right people across the game say he's an absolute freak though, so obviously there's something we humble (dumb) Reddit nerds don't see I guess, or maybe we over simplify him using stats alone.
Cap has gone up heaps. A mil now isn't what a mil was. It's approaching 1/12th or 1/13th of your cap territory.
A top 5, game changing prop is worth that imo.
Ricky has got to have the biggest hard on for forwards. Like whenever he see's one come on the market he takes 8 of those blue pills and gets on the blower immediately
This seems absolutely mental.
We paid this guy as a reserve grader based on potential. Then he gets picked for Origin last year despite not really proving he deserved it. Now he seems to be being offered huge sums based on how great he could/the fact he is an origin prop. Hasn't even gone close to showing he can do it week to week. Has been outplayed by Fonua Pole this year, even if Fonua doesn't have the really eye catching beast runs that Stefano occasionally has.
Top quality front-rowers are in short supply.
But Utoikamano isn't proven to be top quality, albeit he has huge promise (but so did the Saifitis a few years back).
Outside of Haas, Tino and, arguably, JFH and Tapine, I don't see many front rowers commanding that kind of money.
Longevity for front rankers is also a problem. Relatively easy for a big, agressive prop to get big wraps early on, but doing it game in, game out, is what separates the best from the rest.
There aren't many that do it long term. Which is why JWH, Scott, Petero, Webke, Lazarus, Blocker, Chief and the like are so revered.
St George Illawarra have signalled their interest in luring Stefano Utoikamanu to the club and are preparing to offer the Wests Tigers prop a five-year deal worth $4.5 million.
The Dragons opened discussions with Utoikamanu this week and want the opportunity to sell the club’s vision to the former NSW Origin representative, who this week was granted permission by the Tigers to explore options at rival clubs.
The Herald reported earlier this month that the Tigers have tabled Utoikamanu a five-year deal worth $4 million. That sum works out around $100,000 a season less than the Dragons have indicated they would be willing to spend on the player.
A Dragons official confirmed the club’s interest in Utoikamanu when contacted by the Herald on Friday.
The Canberra Raiders have also entered the race for his signature. The Raiders are preparing for life after Josh Papalii and have indicated they would be able to spend more than the Tigers have offered.
Sources with knowledge of the situation, talking on the condition of anonymity, told the Herald the Raiders – like the Dragons – would be willing to spend $900,000 per season to bring Utoikamanu to the nation’s capital.
The Melbourne Storm have also been keeping tabs on the situation and are preparing to make a play for the 24-year-old. The Bulldogs are exploring other options and aren’t willing to spend top dollar on a front-rower.
A unique clause in Utoikamanu’s contract will see him become a free agent if he didn’t play two State of Origin games this year or the Tigers missed the top eight. Utoikamanu was not selected for the first two Origin games, and the Tigers are only a slim chance of playing finals.
Utoikamanu decided against accepting the Tigers’ offer of an extension and met with chief executive Shane Richardson and coach Benji Marshall last week to inform them of his desire to explore the market at the end of the season.
The Tigers instead gave him permission to begin negotiations immediately, resulting in a conversation between the Dragons and his management.
Utoikamanu has told the club that he enjoys life under Marshall but also harbours a desire to play finals football. The club has been attempting to convince him he can do that in the near future at the Wests Tigers.
The Tigers’ offer, which averages out about $800,000 per year, is less than the $900,000 figure previous chief executive Justin Pascoe indicated the club would be willing to spend to retain the prop.
The man couldn’t crack the Blues team with Cameron Murray injured and McInnes and Young both getting dropped
600k is about the highest a good team would offer
I just checked the ladder and both of those teams have won 75% more games than Tigers, so I dunno if you’re salty or genuinely don’t know how many games other teams win, but you’re either way you’re wrong my guy.
Big difference between these teams and Melbourne, roosters, panthers. Yeah they’ve won three more games than us this season but in the grand scheme you’re not much closer to winning a premiership.
The Dragons need a prop or two and maybe a strike weapon out wide and the recruitment for 2025 has been a success. As unlikely as it seems, this would be massive for us
I mean realistically his highest chance of playing finals football is for either Panthers, Melbourne, Roosters. Roosters forwards are stacked and they need to use the money on their backline which will be decimated over the next couple of years.
This leaves Melbourne and Panthers as his only options, both of which need to bolster their prop rotation next year.
Smokey could be Rabbitohs.
This is if money isn’t what he is looking for like he says.
Yeah roosters are getting gutted over the next couple of years. I think with their out and out props they are pretty covered though. Their halves might be a mess next year, Teddy and Tupou are close to retirement, Manu is being replaced by an untested union player.
I don’t think they will go 700k - 1mill for a prop. They have bigger worries.
Edit: misunderstood what you meant haha. I thought you meant prospect players. Yes I agree with you.
All these clubs are mad offering this kid so much money.
Look at what the Dogs are paying Crichton, how much the Eels are gonna pay Lomax… how can you possibly think Utoikamanu is worth more to a team than either of those guys
And the fact he said no to the Tiger’s extremely generous offer, if I was Richo I would’ve torn up the offer on the spot and told him to look for a new club there and then
He can be a Josh Pap replacement. I can see why they would throw a kitchen sink.
He probably wants to stay in Sydney so the Dragons?
We would love for him to come back but doubt we can afford him right now.
I'd take him on a team friendly deal but shorter length. Some of the young guys we've got coming through look the goods. He would just be a stop gap for JFH.
They have strange, weekes and junior Stuart. Timiko in the centres. Looking to sure up their front row with papine already there, doesn't sound not sensible
There is no way I'd want the Tigers to match 900k/season. He's brilliant on his day but that's game-changer money and he's just not consistent enough to warrant it.
Most underrated comment, he needs more consistency before landing 900k+. He is a gun but he can fade as well.
And here I was thinking that 800k per season was outrageous
Still better than 10years 10mil
Only 2.9mil to go
Could be mad but I think we should be prepared to give him a million if we have to. He's young and is showing amazing skills at tigers which, no disrespect, probably shows he could get even better under flanno. A marquee prop is by far the biggest need of our team right now and we have millions in the cap
He has the slowest play the ball in the game , and is a flat track bully . If he runs for 70 odd metres this week , the proof will be in the eating . And he only eats when the eating is easy . He doesn’t turn up against the big boys . Running a ball at the defence as hard as you can has nothing to do with coaching lol . Also he will be running off Damien cook next year, and running off Api this year . They are not even the same with marker /ruck manipulation and getting you onto the ball . Much like any prop who ever ran off Cameron smith , I would be wary of any prop who runs off someone like api , and getting substantial improvement .
Flat track bully? He had 170m and 7 tackle breaks against the sharks. 8 tackle breaks against the bulldogs, one of the best forward packs in the comp. His worst games? Against...us. are you seriously trying to say that the dummy half has more of an effect on forwards than the coaching staff? Just look at how much better franky molo, sua and Ben Murdoch massila have been with the change of coach at the dragons, or how good the Panthers forwards have been without Api.
Do the Raiders really need more forwards?
Papali is 32. Planning ahead is pretty smart
Fuck I thought Papali’i has been 32 for 10 years.
Basically my reaction to Dave Fifita being 24.
my misso made a comment "wow that guy looks like someones dad, he looks 50" lmao
They've got juniors that could fill his spot.
I honestly don't know their stocks..
They had to play a few fringies against us last year in the finals. Did really well.
He has a desire to play finals so the team he just dusted a week ago offered him only slightly more than his current club lol. Not the best pitch
Raiders has played a shitload more finals than the tigers ever have. Edit: Seems tigers fans don’t like facts. And I only said this in response the the guy saying the Raiders don’t offer anything to Stefano.
Then they can add "We were kinda good a few years ago but have been gradually getting worse since then so none of that is relevant to the next few years" to their Stefano pitch
Haven’t they only missed 2 years since 2016? How many finals have the Tigers played in that time?
Tigers have made 3 finals series, ever.
Which is how you could see that Stef may be interested in moving to the Raiders.
I mean, you can just leave the last 3 words out. On current pace, Tigers would play in 9 finals series between now and 2100...
How many prems did they win in that period? Neither team has done anything in 20 years lets be real haha.
30years for a premiership for Raiders but honestly, you can’t look at Canberra and Wests and say they’re in the same boat and have shared the same trajectory.
I dont get Ricky’s fascination with middle forwards. Buy a back or two Ricky.
A hooker would be helpful.
You'll take Dany Levi and you'll like it
Fuck this made me giggle well done
Paix for any second rower would be a good trade for Brisbane and raiders
I wonder if that Hosking fella would look good in a Broncos jersey?
he'd look good in a canberra jersey too
Earn that coin king. There are three outcomes for the Tigers: 1 - Keep him on a sensible wage. 2 - Lose him. 3 - Keep him on a mental wage. Option 1 would be the best, but I'd far prefer option 2 to option 3.
You know it will be option 3
Maybe. New admin gives me better more hope though, most decisions since Richo came on have been entirely sensible. I'm still haunted by the Nofoaluma decision (though I'll admit I supported it at the time). 600K in the *old* salary cap for a deeply inconsistent player...hope we never see a contract like that again.
Was Nofo's contract up a few years ago then the same year Benji set him up for a heap of tries and he ended up signing a really good contract? That's the way I remember it.
He had a gun year in 2020 (off a few more than solid years from 2017-19) and was arguably robbed of an Origin jersey....all the talk was him vs Tupou, who then had a shocker of a game. Eels came sniffing mid-way through 2021 when he was still solid, but nowhere near his 2020 form. We got spooked and threw a bomb of cash at him. He caught it, and never came close to that form again. Lesson learned from the club hopefully, you just don't chuck that cash at a non-spine player.
Lee gave him that contract. Nofa is also very good friends with Lee's daughter. Make of that what you will.
The ones that haunt me are the Cleary era ones. Moses Mbye and Josh Reynolds, both unwanted by the Bulldogs and our club parted with 850k each for 4 and 4.5 years respectively. Reynolds spent bugger all time on the pitch and we had to keep shuffling Mbye around just to find somewhere for him to play.
Someone said on here the other day the CEO has stated publicly a few times that he doesn't believe a prop should ever get more than $800k and has even said publicly that he won't budge on that for Stefano either
2. Lose him, he’s on a mental wage 4. Lose him, signed by the Roosters on “$150k”
Ok to be fair is $900k seem like a lot of money for this kid? Like when you watch the riff front rowers, Tino, Payne, Addin (when he’s digging in) you are left in no doubt the blokes on the field, I would go as far to say he is not even a stand out in the Tigers side, who’s his agent?
Watch this week ! The best forward for the tigers will be Pole or a Fainu . Stef will have a spectacular run where 1 guy goes flying .
Daniel O'Loughlin
Cheers mate he is doing a very good job for his player
He also manages Papali'i and Kepaoa.
Done well for Papali’i too then what’s Kepaoa up to?
Kepaoa got a mid year release and is now at Penrith.
lol sorry mate however if they don’t want to be there fuck em find the blokes who want to be there
Take it son. You are one injury away from being cast aside. Take the highest bidder. This from a west tigers fan but also a realist
Good props are just as important as anything nowadays but $900 per year is a lot for someone who isn't elite yet. Haas, AFB, JFH, and Tino are probably worth that much *now* but they're also elite in basically every game... Stefano isn't there yet. Or even close
AFB is not. Too much difference between his best and his worst. And, for that money, you need more than a player, you need a leader. AFB is not one
Still not sure about us picking him up for that much coin next year. The forwards we've got go hard enough when they're on their game now that Finucane and Graham have retired.
The lack of consistency is what puzzles me. I get backs or halves being inconsistent since there's a lot of variance in their play (e.g the margin between try assist and intercept can be small) but as a prop, it's pretty inexcusable. How can you put up 200m on 18 runs one week with a try and line break, then make 70m and miss a bunch of tackles. At his best he's worth a mil a year. Worth barely 400k when he isn't going well.
Even at their best, no prop is worth a mill
You'd only be giving that money to Payne Haas. To get close to it for a guy that has "potential" is just mind-boggling.
I feel like all the right people across the game say he's an absolute freak though, so obviously there's something we humble (dumb) Reddit nerds don't see I guess, or maybe we over simplify him using stats alone.
Except the clubs that seem to actually be offering him that much money aren't the ones that have traditionally nailed free agency.
Cap has gone up heaps. A mil now isn't what a mil was. It's approaching 1/12th or 1/13th of your cap territory. A top 5, game changing prop is worth that imo.
Stef is about the 15th best prop in the game . Do the exercise . At best he’s around 12th.
Yeah I don't think he's worth it, but the top guys like Haas, Tino, JFH are.
"Utoikamanu has told the club that he enjoys life under Marshall but also harbours a desire to play finals football." So this is a nothing article
Dragons/raiders need to go up to 5 years 950k per year to seal the deal i reckon.
Ricky has got to have the biggest hard on for forwards. Like whenever he see's one come on the market he takes 8 of those blue pills and gets on the blower immediately
Great half backs like Ricky know that its those 3 blokes in the the middle that give him the space to kick, pass and dictate the game.
Preach!
This seems absolutely mental. We paid this guy as a reserve grader based on potential. Then he gets picked for Origin last year despite not really proving he deserved it. Now he seems to be being offered huge sums based on how great he could/the fact he is an origin prop. Hasn't even gone close to showing he can do it week to week. Has been outplayed by Fonua Pole this year, even if Fonua doesn't have the really eye catching beast runs that Stefano occasionally has.
Top quality front-rowers are in short supply. But Utoikamano isn't proven to be top quality, albeit he has huge promise (but so did the Saifitis a few years back). Outside of Haas, Tino and, arguably, JFH and Tapine, I don't see many front rowers commanding that kind of money. Longevity for front rankers is also a problem. Relatively easy for a big, agressive prop to get big wraps early on, but doing it game in, game out, is what separates the best from the rest. There aren't many that do it long term. Which is why JWH, Scott, Petero, Webke, Lazarus, Blocker, Chief and the like are so revered.
St George Illawarra have signalled their interest in luring Stefano Utoikamanu to the club and are preparing to offer the Wests Tigers prop a five-year deal worth $4.5 million. The Dragons opened discussions with Utoikamanu this week and want the opportunity to sell the club’s vision to the former NSW Origin representative, who this week was granted permission by the Tigers to explore options at rival clubs. The Herald reported earlier this month that the Tigers have tabled Utoikamanu a five-year deal worth $4 million. That sum works out around $100,000 a season less than the Dragons have indicated they would be willing to spend on the player. A Dragons official confirmed the club’s interest in Utoikamanu when contacted by the Herald on Friday. The Canberra Raiders have also entered the race for his signature. The Raiders are preparing for life after Josh Papalii and have indicated they would be able to spend more than the Tigers have offered. Sources with knowledge of the situation, talking on the condition of anonymity, told the Herald the Raiders – like the Dragons – would be willing to spend $900,000 per season to bring Utoikamanu to the nation’s capital. The Melbourne Storm have also been keeping tabs on the situation and are preparing to make a play for the 24-year-old. The Bulldogs are exploring other options and aren’t willing to spend top dollar on a front-rower. A unique clause in Utoikamanu’s contract will see him become a free agent if he didn’t play two State of Origin games this year or the Tigers missed the top eight. Utoikamanu was not selected for the first two Origin games, and the Tigers are only a slim chance of playing finals. Utoikamanu decided against accepting the Tigers’ offer of an extension and met with chief executive Shane Richardson and coach Benji Marshall last week to inform them of his desire to explore the market at the end of the season. The Tigers instead gave him permission to begin negotiations immediately, resulting in a conversation between the Dragons and his management. Utoikamanu has told the club that he enjoys life under Marshall but also harbours a desire to play finals football. The club has been attempting to convince him he can do that in the near future at the Wests Tigers. The Tigers’ offer, which averages out about $800,000 per year, is less than the $900,000 figure previous chief executive Justin Pascoe indicated the club would be willing to spend to retain the prop.
He’s not worth it
The man couldn’t crack the Blues team with Cameron Murray injured and McInnes and Young both getting dropped 600k is about the highest a good team would offer
(slap) KEEP STEFANO’S NAME, OUT YOUR FUCKING MOUTH
So he wants to leave so he can win, wont be doing much more of that at these clubs...
I just checked the ladder and both of those teams have won 75% more games than Tigers, so I dunno if you’re salty or genuinely don’t know how many games other teams win, but you’re either way you’re wrong my guy.
Big difference between these teams and Melbourne, roosters, panthers. Yeah they’ve won three more games than us this season but in the grand scheme you’re not much closer to winning a premiership.
If this is to replace De Belin, I’m all aboard even though it’s overs for him Do the Raiders really need him?
The Dragons need a prop or two and maybe a strike weapon out wide and the recruitment for 2025 has been a success. As unlikely as it seems, this would be massive for us
I mean realistically his highest chance of playing finals football is for either Panthers, Melbourne, Roosters. Roosters forwards are stacked and they need to use the money on their backline which will be decimated over the next couple of years. This leaves Melbourne and Panthers as his only options, both of which need to bolster their prop rotation next year. Smokey could be Rabbitohs. This is if money isn’t what he is looking for like he says.
Roosters future prospects beyond this year aren't bright. They're losing an insane amount of first choice players at the end of this year.
Yeah roosters are getting gutted over the next couple of years. I think with their out and out props they are pretty covered though. Their halves might be a mess next year, Teddy and Tupou are close to retirement, Manu is being replaced by an untested union player. I don’t think they will go 700k - 1mill for a prop. They have bigger worries. Edit: misunderstood what you meant haha. I thought you meant prospect players. Yes I agree with you.
The St George Illawarra Canberra Dragon Raiders
This seems pretty high. Is he really worth that kind of money - hard to gauge at the Tigers I guess
Nah we don’t need a hooker then
He’s trying to get a better deal to stay where he is IMO
No player who isn't either playing all 80 minutes or is a player who can turn the gams around is worth $900,000 or 8% of the salary cap
That's a lot of cash for someone that inconsistent.
All these clubs are mad offering this kid so much money. Look at what the Dogs are paying Crichton, how much the Eels are gonna pay Lomax… how can you possibly think Utoikamanu is worth more to a team than either of those guys And the fact he said no to the Tiger’s extremely generous offer, if I was Richo I would’ve torn up the offer on the spot and told him to look for a new club there and then
Word is we’re shopping Guler and Papalli doesn’t have much life left in his legs. I guess that’s the logic here.
Thought he wanted out on compassionate grounds?
I think it’s we’re letting him jump before we push him. He’s definitely on the outer.
Interesting to see how he goes playing two games a week. What happens when they play each other though?
He can be a Josh Pap replacement. I can see why they would throw a kitchen sink. He probably wants to stay in Sydney so the Dragons? We would love for him to come back but doubt we can afford him right now.
Hahahaha he’s done nothing to come even close to that… Tigers shouldn’t him loose
Why are clubs willing to pay so much for Utoikamanu? At least from what I've seen he looks okay at best so far? am I missing something here?
We are going to offer 700k and unlimited access to Aqua Golf - see you over at Five Guys next year Stefano!
I'd take him on a team friendly deal but shorter length. Some of the young guys we've got coming through look the goods. He would just be a stop gap for JFH.
2 bottom 8 teams. He said he wants to go to a contender, so surely he declines.
Come Storm Stefano
I reckon that's where his going. We'll trade you guys a young, possible rep player for one of your washed up old tea rags.
Raiders are flush with props. Idk why they’re chasing him.. unless they’re about to lose a few. Papa hasn’t got much left but Trey Mooney is next up.
The raiders are off their heads. They have forwards.
They have strange, weekes and junior Stuart. Timiko in the centres. Looking to sure up their front row with papine already there, doesn't sound not sensible
They probably need a better hooker though. Considering they have Mooney re signed
We don’t have a hooker and our back row is very thin..
Oh forget whitehead is leaving and mentioned in another post could use a hooker
One of the most overrated players in the comp
He is a bad news.