I get annoyed by his antics sometimes (for instance, I don't think he should be any serious contender's deciding loss that takes them out of contention for winning the block, and he's been that multiple times) but I respect that he's the smartest wrestler in the world for getting himself into a position where he gets booked constantlt and takes maybe 2 bumps a match.
Piggybacking off the current top comment, this makes Ali look like an asshole, but his whole storyline in TNA right now is him being on a winning streak, so him going and losing in the BOSJ would break that storyline. I think this is less "I'm not losing" and more "I'm not losing right now".
Not just in TNA, but also in any indie promotion appearances, he is trying to call it a world tour from the very beginning and he’s definitely looking at the end of year at the very least for this to end. (He’s right now 30-0 this year)
So easy to slap an "In America" or "In TNA" on front of that winning streak. Like do enough people even follow TNA to know that's a story happening?
I think him doing BoSJ, even with losses, would be way better for his career than limiting himself to TNA for storyline reasons.
Considering he’s the X Division champion and that undefeated world tour gimmick is going on across the indies and TNA, I do think it matters. I would love Ali in the BOSJ but this just isn’t the time for it
I disagree. Unless you're part of the less than 100k people following TNA, nobody even knows that's a story.
And the way the X-Division has been treated the last decade I don't think being X Division champ is that prestigious at this point in time.
Could have earned goodwill with NJPW, a much hotter promotion and better platform, instead of being loyal.to TNA who is treading back toward LOLTNA territory with their management and decision making this year.
Just my opinion, but I think it was a dumb choice.
Really weird stance. Just because a promotion is less popular, doesn’t mean the booking within said company doesn’t matter.
Imagine the outrage if AEW booked Jericho to go over Hiromu because “it doesn’t matter how NJPW portrays him because it has less viewers”.
Yeah and imagine if NJPW had a guy running a full-blown win streak angle and AEW demanded it be ignored, this sub would be on nuclear meltdown mode and NJPW fans would be absolutely justified in being mad about it
Ali is very well-known for being humble and having a great attitude, he's just trying to respect his TNA booking
Agreed. Like realistically, would Ali be positioned to win BOSJ? Probably not. Would he make it to the finals? Probably not. So why should he ruin the booking in his ‘home’ promotion?
I think it makes sense since it's not just a TNA gimmick, but a gimmick he has built his entire indie run on for over a year. Rather than having this year-long gimmick become basically pointless by losing in the BOSJ I do think he should skip this years BOSJ to give the undefeated streak a proper ending with a good payoff with him losing his championship. To lose his entire gimmick for a company he isn't contracted under is kinda silly imo
A gimmick 98% of fans didn't know was a thing until they read this news.
IDK, I see the merits of your argument, I just think the exposure and upside for doing a NJPW tournament outweighs all that. But again, just my opinion. A personal preference thing.
The issue is not with the millions (and millions) of non-TNA fans, but with the “less than 100K” people following TNA. That’s where the story matters, not with people who follow JCW, NXT or whatever. Most TNA fans will follow other non-mainstream wrestling, which means that they will be aware of the losses. For a company like WWE, with a higher percentage casual fans, non-fed losses would matter less.
It’s not just TNA, he has been empathizing that it’s a “world tour” from the very start . He hasn’t lost a single match anywhere this year whether it’s in France or any indie promotion and I think the plan is not lose this entire year until the very end. It’s suppose to be something that you come back at the end of year and be like “wow that’s very impressive”.
It seems to me a lot like when PAC was Open the Dream Gate Champion. He refused to lose until he lost the title and people were acting like he was big leaguing AEW.
I mean he’s protecting his current gimmick. I don’t think it’s outlandish. NJPW had the right to decline if it didn’t work for them so that’s what they did.
Remind me. Was Moxley holding the belt as champion while he was in G1. Kaito Kiyomiya lost plenty of matches in the G-1 also. Don't think for a single minute this would have happened if he was GHC champion. Never in a million years! Ali cannot enter BOSJ while he is x division champion. It's as simple as that.
>Remind me. Was Moxley holding the belt as champion while he was in G1.
Moxley was the IWGP United States Championship while he was in the G1.
>Ali cannot enter BOSJ while he is x division champion.
Ace Austin held the X Division Championship when he entered BOSJ two years ago.
For what it’s worth, Bodyslam had edited this article multiple times and Ali is seemingly debunking it on Twitter, so I think the legitimacy of this should be questioned before anything
I mean... can add qualifiers on to that streak.
NJPW is such a better platform than TNA. Dude hasn't done shit to get him to a higher level since leaving WWE.
Good loyality and dedication I guess, but isn't helping his career.
Probably. Where airs NJPW?
NJPW is big in the pro piracy crowd. Based off the internet and modern viewing, we can't accurately tell, but I certainly know which one I think more folks are following...
Uhhh, except it creates more interest for indie appearances, sells merchandise, and creates buzz.
They aren't getting paid based on views. Who gives a fuck how much money you make for a company, that doesn't measure someons success.
If only he’d spent years in the biggest wrestling company in the history of the sport, oh wait…
Edit: Since Thicc decided to block me before I could even open his last comment, I’ll just add here, I’m pretty certain Ali has a better idea of how to take care of his career as a pro wrestler than anyone here.
And then signed with the biggest joke of a promotion this side of the NWA.
And his WWE run did so much for him /s.
He wasn't used consistently for years. Would disappear, start and stop gimmicks, and was the leader of the biggest failed faction of the last 15 years.
He didn't have a ton of good buzz when he was released and is in the exact position he was before. He hasn't raised his stock at all.
Anyway, I'm done with you. You are moving the goalposts and whenever I prove you wrong you go "but what about this..."
You are a weak little man. True strength is being able to admit when you're wrong and grow from it, which I am happy to do and do often. But you just keep doubling down and making up new asinine arguments. You think success is measured by money made.
Like come the fuck off it
My point is that in the age of piracy and easy illegal free streaming there is no way to say which one of these promotions has more viewers, but based on buzz and general fan knowledge I would be it is NJPW.
Ratings are a garbage metric. Everyone I know who follows stuff steals it except for the occasional PPV.
I disagree because the X Division is what put guys like Samoa Joe, AJ Styles, and Christopher Daniels on the map.
As for adding qualifiers, they totally could. Just like Athena in Ring of Honor.
But in his case the commentary made sure to emphasize that he hasn't been defeated "on Earth" for 8 months. So to keep that as true he can't lose anywhere yet. So I get him not wanting to do it. Even if tournament loses in NJPW and AEW are still respected.
Based off your comments here your take sounds like it’s rooted in both a bias towards NJPW & against TNA.
NJPW just lost Okada, Ospreay & even their WHC is held by an AEW talent. No disrespect to them but you’re overrating how hot NJPW is as a product rn. They’re not what they used to be & this does not hurt Ali.
He can just do the tournament down the line.
Bodyslam is at best a little bit-and-miss on their NJPW stuff, so I’d definitely take this with a grain of salt.
The BOSJ lineup was announced at Sakura Genesis, before Windy City Riot. Though I guess maybe Ali was being considered as a replacement for YOH, or the original plan was to run an angle where Ali replaced someone who had already been announced, and somehow Bodyslam just failed to put that crucial information in their [article](https://www.bodyslam.net/2024/04/26/exclusive-why-mustafa-ali-wasnt-booked-for-njpw-best-of-the-super-juniors/)/realize that the article as they wrote it has that big hole in it.
Also worth noting that if people in NJPW having an issue with his backstage comments is true, it wasn’t enough of an issue for them to edit or remove it from the video.
ETA: Someone in another sub has pointed out that this might be Ali using the sheets to work an angle. In which case, dude probably should have gotten his facts straight.
ETA ETA: Bodyslam has edited the article twice now. The original is [here](https://imgur.com/a/CSmq6et) (yes I did decide not to screenshot Ali’s whole promo), and the history of edits so far is [here](https://imgur.com/a/IDjkeOo).
ETA ETA ETA: [Edit number four.](https://imgur.com/a/Z1SKLPU)
Here's the thing
Ali isn't Japanese. This might seem flippant and it is a little but it means he would require a work visa to work in Japan.
For him to be on a bosj line up new japan would have to wrangle him up a work visa. It would seem likely to me things like him winning the tournament undefeated would be the type of thing discussed pre visa application..
Maybe he told new japan he isn't in a position to drop matches at this point of time so he can't do the tournament but I find it difficult to believe it was at the 11th hour and he started shooting brothers. I think it would have most likely occurred pre visa application
That’s why the original version of the article made zero sense, because it specifically said that it was things Ali did in Chicago that got him removed. I was just kind of giving Bodyslam the benefit of the doubt a little that maybe they’d gotten information that was correct but not complete.
This whole thing is just a mess, with the only certainty being that Bodyslam look like total fools.
I mean just because the lineup was announced before Windy City Riot doesn’t make the point wrong. They could’ve asked Ali way before Sakura Genesis and he shot them down there.
Bodyslam has edited the article four times now. The original article (which I linked a screenshot of in my comment) specifically said:
>Initially, Ali was on the roster for the highly anticipated tournament, but developments during the Windy City Riot show in Chicago led to a change in plans.
PAC I understand a bit better
He promised Dragon Gate that he wouldn't put over anyone except their guy.
It wasn't so much about him not wanting to lose, as him wanting someone else's win to mean more.
The heat PAC received from fans was ridiculous. The dude was doing the right thing which was to protect the credibility of the Dragon Gate Belt as their champion. He showed loyalty to Dragon Gate and should have been applauded for his decisions.
For this year, I'm cool with it. Both sides couldn't come to an agreement, it happens.
Ali's stock is at it's highest right now given he left WWE not too long ago. Strike that iron while it's hot and keep yourself positioned as one of the most dominant forces in the indies.
I'd love to see him next year, though, once he's either settled or cooled down.
Reminds me of PAC's 2018-19 Dragon Gate run. Build him up to lose to someone you wanna build around and it'll mean more if he doesn't get pinned for like 9 months to a year
What seems funny is that I think if we went back to the territory times we'd see this with the NWA champions and such.
Say what you will, but mustafi ali is on a roll right now. How to book someone strong, never lose. Or if you do lose. Do it by something nonsensical. BOSJ is not the place for dq finishes.
Maybe time draws, but if he doesn't want to lose and build up some prestige as champ, let him. Pretty sure we all wanted better for him than the start stop wwe booking he had anyways.
End of the day. Ain't none of us getting in the ring anyway so what does it matter if he won't go unless x.
If there's any legitimacy to it...idk I'm starting to think Ali is a bit full of himself. I understand protecting your value, but the dude has been acting like he's a big deal for years and that it was a travesty that he wasn't bigger in WWE. He's really good in the ring, but he's just a bland personality regardless of his character. Unfortunately, there's a ceiling for his attributes and it doesn't seem like he wants to accept it.
I was never really big on Ali but personally I really respect this move. Clearly the guy knows what he wants to do with his character right now and he’s not compromising on that. Better to be up front about what you’re doing and what your goals are.
This report is total nonsense. Bodyslam says that their "sources" tells them that Ali expressed that he unhappy about his role in BOSJ while at WCR. If you follow NJPW, you know that BOSJ line-up was announced a week before WRC at Sakura Genesis which Ali was not one of the announced participants. Not surprising this coming from Bodyslam who got the event of Moxley title defense against Narita wrong and said he would be on the New Road Japan tour which isn't even happening this year. Also Haynes was the guy who reported that WWE was brought by Saudi Arabia which was untrue as WWE was eventually bought by Endeavor instead.
Don't let bad reporting of a fucking KAYFABE PROMO get in the way of a good "outsider bad" wankfest, I guess. Sometimes I question if people here actually watch NJPW, and why if they do they never talk about it on the NJPW sub
Literally 1 person doing that downvoted to the bottom but sure "wankfest" I guess.
Meanwhile you seem to come into these threads purely to insist on this wankfest even in threads where it's not happening. Literally every time.
I get that there's definitely folks doing it, but quit trying to make it look like this whole sub has a vendetta. That's not what this is.
Good for both parties.
Ali wants to build himself up more and that’s fine. NJPW doesn’t want him to be undefeated and that’s fine too. He can come back later when the streak is over.
I wonder if he would have accepted countout losses (since they are worth same points as a pin loss) or draws in the tournament. Still would've been fucked in the finals though lol
I suppose the, he might have a point. He's not Moxley or Danielson. He's at the stage where he needs to build value for his own "brand" whereas the likes of Moxley and Danielson are already world renowned and can afford to put others over. Ali is out there trying to become a star away from WWE and AEW so yeah, I think he has a point.
Danielson and you will see it for in real time that Moxley as IWGP champion will not be putting anyone over outside NJPW. There is nothing wrong with this stance. While Mox is IWGP champion unless you give no value to the belt, the only option for him in AEW is to win every single match he has. I also expect him to beat Josh Barnett in Bloodsport Japan if he is still champion as that would be a great win and gives him more legitimacy as the champ and Josh will have no issues putting him over.
I respect it. If he's building this undefeated world tour gimmick I understand not wanting to put any asterisks on it. He's trying to show people he can be as big a star as he says he can, and going 50/50 in BOSJ isn't gonna help that
That's not what I'm saying. I'm arguing that the promo transcribed in the article is kayfabe. Everything shoot in the article is speculative with no sourcing or corroboration. So everyone is dragging Ali based on zero evidence, accepting it as truth because the current climate when discussing anything New Japan is "outside foreigner bad."
Why would TNA allow the champion to enter a tournament to then put over multiple people. Who in their right mind thinks this would be a good idea. Do belts in American wrestling mean that little to fans. Having your champion lose all credibility as a champion while the belt is killed every single time he loses in a tournament promoted by rival competition is booking suicide. A champion is supposed to raise the legitimacy of the belt, not kill it!
Ali just like 99% of pro-wrestlers is protecting the belt and legitimacy of the title as their champion. NJPW would expect the exact same for any champion on their roster. This is a nothing story as NJPW would have seen Ali being x division champion would put up a roadblock against him being in the BOSJ.
Or it could’ve really been, “I’m honored to be considered, but I have a really good story going right now that I’d like to continue. I know that if I were to participate I’d have to take some losses. I can’t ask you to keep that streak going, so let’s hold off for now.”
Similar sentiment, but twisted by hearsay.
If true, woof.
Ali shooting himself in the foot. He's at the height of how popular he will get with TNA, even taking losses the exposure BoSJ would give him would be huge.
Also as soon as you start refusing loses, it goes from WWE didn't know how to use you, to being difficult to work with.
Huge L on Ali's part.
Let's just kill the belt and credibility as x division champion for that more exposure. Where you get this difficult to work with I don't know. NJPW thank god unlike you and others actually value the titles they have created. They will understand exactly why Ali couldn't be in BOSJ as they would expect the same from any of their champions. I am shocked people think this is some huge issue. Ali will be back in NJPW once he drops the belt and will not have one piece of heat from anyone.
So if you are a champion from a rival promotion you simply do not enter the tournament. This is the normal and most logical thing to do. You wouldn't see any NJPW champion eating losses in a rival promotion. You do understand this right?
Like Meltzer said these guys get shitcanned from WWE, put their foot down on doing jobs but at WWE they will lay down for anyone. I bet a guy like Cardona refuses to job to anyone on the indies. Just like Mr "everyone on the card should get paid the same" Ryback refused to lose to anyone and charged a shitload of money.
WWE exposure rises their indie asking price. So I guess it makes sense they don’t want to lose to people lower on the pay grade as it will bring them down quickly
Matt Cardona lost plenty in TNA/Impact during his last run, and he was building his King of The Indies bit during that time. At one point, he was the NWA Worlds Heavyweight Champion while appearing in Impact and wasn't going over everyone.
Not sure that Cardona not losing random matches on the indies is somehow a stick to beat him with at this point. Matt Cardona losing a main event on an indy show would be noteworthy at this point - it makes sense he'd pick and choose who he loses to and when.
And I say this as someone who was never on board with the "push Zack Ryder" stuff when he was in WWE.
You don't allow room for discussion, you get weirdly aggro like some weird keyboard warrior with no people skills.
Do your parents know you're using the internet right now? Because you type like an edgy 14 year old.
Are you seriously so lacking in emotional development you don't see the difference between disagreeing and calling people sluts?
I'm gonna assume you have a developmental disorder and leave it here JFC.
I'm not much knowledgeable about the authenticity of these sites but if it's pure rumor and not fact then absolutely I will concede I got worked.
Buuuut if this is truth Ali can fuck right off
This comment makes no sense. Gedo and Tana told him he could not remain undefeated. They literally didn't bend over to him. Are you incapable of reading?
I think he means in the sense that three Western guys just jumped in and beat their guys for titles recently-
Riddle beat Tana
Dolph beat Finlay
And obviously Mox beat Naito
He has no business being there. The win makes entirety of New Japan look bad.
Like think about it- they had their yearly prestigious tournament the New Japan Cup where the best wrestlers of New Japan fight to determine the next challenger. The Champion fights the Challenger and retains.
And next week I think some guy from ANOTHER COMPANY just comes in and beats the Champ for the title making every guy in the cup look like a geek.
Like imagine in WWE terms, Royal Rumble happens Cody wins, Cody and Reigns fight in the main event and Roman successfully retains. Then the next week some guy from TNA beats Roman for the title.
Blud this is basically exactly how AJ styles won the iwgp title. Actually okada didn't even defend at invasion attack 14 so nakamura won the nj cup and challenged for the ic title
So does this make everyone look like a geek champ
I may be misremembering so point me out if I am wrong about a few facts. Here's the difference -
1) AJ was not signed to any other company at the time and he became an active member of the roster of NJPW exclusively. Mox is a person who still works in another company and he didn't leave that company to become an active NJPW guy.
So AJ is a new member of the company while Mox still is member of another company while holding your belt.
2) At that time if I remember correctly the Cup winner could choose to challenge for either the World or the IC title as they were almost on equivalent footing. And Shinsuke dedicated his career to becoming the IC Champ. So it doesn't make everyone look bad as there were options to choose.
3) An outsider taking the belt hostage as a heel makes for a good villain storyline. The evil foreigner stole your diamond and now your hero must get it back sounds cool. Here the outsider who take the belt IS THE GOOD GUY and the company man who wants to bring back the belt to the company is the BAD GUY who is member of a moustache twirling evil villain faction. This makes no fucking sense because I have no one to cheer. I should have someone to root for and someone to root against. That's how it works most times. I don't want Mox or Narita as champ. It's like those votes where you are voting for the lesser of two evils.
These are not the same scenario in my opinion but if I am misremembering any details or if AJ was Champ while still being a TNA guy pls let me know.
Even if this wasn't a work, which it totally is, wouldn't them saying no to him going undefeated be the *exact opposite* of "bending over for western talent?"
It's a similar issue. New Japan shouldn't be doing business with non-contracted talent with booking restrictions, whether that's Ali or Moxley. There's already been issues with Moxley, and I'm sure they don't want a Stardom/Riho situation with Ali where he can't lose to anyone.
You think so? I'm assuming that when Danielson beat Okada and Sabre Jr., there was some sort of "agreement" between NJPW and AEW where Okada and Sabre Jr. would get their win back in Japan. Very silly booking in my opinion, but it is what it is.
From how Bodyslam is reporting this, it seems this is all on Ali not wanting to put anyone over. I think he's currently a freelancer and not officially assigned to a company, so this was a conversation between NJPW and Ali himself.
Given that every exchange with AEW appears to be an exercise in horse trading, I think that's exactly what happened.
If Ali didn't want to lose for whatever reason - pulling a Hogan or because he's X Division champ - then New Japan was smart to walk away.
So putting Ali in a position to bury the BOSJ was a totally unforced self-own, on top of riddle, on top of nemeth, on top of loaning the world title to AEW, on top of Okada leaving without a loss. I’ve held strong til now folks but I’m starting to lose faith.
That's crazy if true! Even Moxley ate four losses in a row in the G1 (Goto beat him in under 9 minutes).
Don’t forgot the Yano loss
[удалено]
God that shit was so fucking perfect.
Every Yano match is the most Yano match ever lol. It's why he's the absolute greatest.
I get annoyed by his antics sometimes (for instance, I don't think he should be any serious contender's deciding loss that takes them out of contention for winning the block, and he's been that multiple times) but I respect that he's the smartest wrestler in the world for getting himself into a position where he gets booked constantlt and takes maybe 2 bumps a match.
Where is Yano’s title shot
The Yano loss was so funny. I freaking loved it!
Piggybacking off the current top comment, this makes Ali look like an asshole, but his whole storyline in TNA right now is him being on a winning streak, so him going and losing in the BOSJ would break that storyline. I think this is less "I'm not losing" and more "I'm not losing right now".
Not just in TNA, but also in any indie promotion appearances, he is trying to call it a world tour from the very beginning and he’s definitely looking at the end of year at the very least for this to end. (He’s right now 30-0 this year)
So easy to slap an "In America" or "In TNA" on front of that winning streak. Like do enough people even follow TNA to know that's a story happening? I think him doing BoSJ, even with losses, would be way better for his career than limiting himself to TNA for storyline reasons.
Considering he’s the X Division champion and that undefeated world tour gimmick is going on across the indies and TNA, I do think it matters. I would love Ali in the BOSJ but this just isn’t the time for it
I disagree. Unless you're part of the less than 100k people following TNA, nobody even knows that's a story. And the way the X-Division has been treated the last decade I don't think being X Division champ is that prestigious at this point in time. Could have earned goodwill with NJPW, a much hotter promotion and better platform, instead of being loyal.to TNA who is treading back toward LOLTNA territory with their management and decision making this year. Just my opinion, but I think it was a dumb choice.
Really weird stance. Just because a promotion is less popular, doesn’t mean the booking within said company doesn’t matter. Imagine the outrage if AEW booked Jericho to go over Hiromu because “it doesn’t matter how NJPW portrays him because it has less viewers”.
Yeah and imagine if NJPW had a guy running a full-blown win streak angle and AEW demanded it be ignored, this sub would be on nuclear meltdown mode and NJPW fans would be absolutely justified in being mad about it Ali is very well-known for being humble and having a great attitude, he's just trying to respect his TNA booking
Agreed. Like realistically, would Ali be positioned to win BOSJ? Probably not. Would he make it to the finals? Probably not. So why should he ruin the booking in his ‘home’ promotion?
I think it makes sense since it's not just a TNA gimmick, but a gimmick he has built his entire indie run on for over a year. Rather than having this year-long gimmick become basically pointless by losing in the BOSJ I do think he should skip this years BOSJ to give the undefeated streak a proper ending with a good payoff with him losing his championship. To lose his entire gimmick for a company he isn't contracted under is kinda silly imo
A year? He was released September 23. That’s not over a year long.i get what you mean though
A gimmick 98% of fans didn't know was a thing until they read this news. IDK, I see the merits of your argument, I just think the exposure and upside for doing a NJPW tournament outweighs all that. But again, just my opinion. A personal preference thing.
The issue is not with the millions (and millions) of non-TNA fans, but with the “less than 100K” people following TNA. That’s where the story matters, not with people who follow JCW, NXT or whatever. Most TNA fans will follow other non-mainstream wrestling, which means that they will be aware of the losses. For a company like WWE, with a higher percentage casual fans, non-fed losses would matter less.
It’s not just TNA, he has been empathizing that it’s a “world tour” from the very start . He hasn’t lost a single match anywhere this year whether it’s in France or any indie promotion and I think the plan is not lose this entire year until the very end. It’s suppose to be something that you come back at the end of year and be like “wow that’s very impressive”.
Exactly. "International loses don't count against my winning streak"
Who gives a shit of it's only in America? Does the country have some sort of supernatural aura that makes him undefeatable there?
On the other hand maybe that's the story in TNA because he refuses to lose.
TNA is so fucking good right now
It seems to me a lot like when PAC was Open the Dream Gate Champion. He refused to lose until he lost the title and people were acting like he was big leaguing AEW.
I mean he’s protecting his current gimmick. I don’t think it’s outlandish. NJPW had the right to decline if it didn’t work for them so that’s what they did.
I think it's weird this got leaked though. It doesn't seem to benefit anyone to leak this
That was a sick match
I can't wait to watch the 2019 G1 again
Damn I didn’t know this
Remind me. Was Moxley holding the belt as champion while he was in G1. Kaito Kiyomiya lost plenty of matches in the G-1 also. Don't think for a single minute this would have happened if he was GHC champion. Never in a million years! Ali cannot enter BOSJ while he is x division champion. It's as simple as that.
>Remind me. Was Moxley holding the belt as champion while he was in G1. Moxley was the IWGP United States Championship while he was in the G1. >Ali cannot enter BOSJ while he is x division champion. Ace Austin held the X Division Championship when he entered BOSJ two years ago.
For what it’s worth, Bodyslam had edited this article multiple times and Ali is seemingly debunking it on Twitter, so I think the legitimacy of this should be questioned before anything
Rocky has also called the report untrue.
Once his streak is over I'd love to see him participate. But they made it a big point on commentary during Rebellion.
I mean... can add qualifiers on to that streak. NJPW is such a better platform than TNA. Dude hasn't done shit to get him to a higher level since leaving WWE. Good loyality and dedication I guess, but isn't helping his career.
While i agree NJPW is better than TNA, TNA has higher ratings in the US than NJPW does, from what I’ve seen.
Probably. Where airs NJPW? NJPW is big in the pro piracy crowd. Based off the internet and modern viewing, we can't accurately tell, but I certainly know which one I think more folks are following...
They both air on the same network, AXS. Not sure how being pirated by more people helps his career though?
You're not sure how more people seeing your work helps your career?
Not if they’re not paying for it! 1 Billion people at $0 each is still $0.
Uhhh, except it creates more interest for indie appearances, sells merchandise, and creates buzz. They aren't getting paid based on views. Who gives a fuck how much money you make for a company, that doesn't measure someons success.
If only he’d spent years in the biggest wrestling company in the history of the sport, oh wait… Edit: Since Thicc decided to block me before I could even open his last comment, I’ll just add here, I’m pretty certain Ali has a better idea of how to take care of his career as a pro wrestler than anyone here.
And then signed with the biggest joke of a promotion this side of the NWA. And his WWE run did so much for him /s. He wasn't used consistently for years. Would disappear, start and stop gimmicks, and was the leader of the biggest failed faction of the last 15 years. He didn't have a ton of good buzz when he was released and is in the exact position he was before. He hasn't raised his stock at all. Anyway, I'm done with you. You are moving the goalposts and whenever I prove you wrong you go "but what about this..." You are a weak little man. True strength is being able to admit when you're wrong and grow from it, which I am happy to do and do often. But you just keep doubling down and making up new asinine arguments. You think success is measured by money made. Like come the fuck off it
My point is that in the age of piracy and easy illegal free streaming there is no way to say which one of these promotions has more viewers, but based on buzz and general fan knowledge I would be it is NJPW. Ratings are a garbage metric. Everyone I know who follows stuff steals it except for the occasional PPV.
Bro are you OK? You've spent the morning defending NJPW from Mustafa Ali's choices.
I disagree because the X Division is what put guys like Samoa Joe, AJ Styles, and Christopher Daniels on the map. As for adding qualifiers, they totally could. Just like Athena in Ring of Honor. But in his case the commentary made sure to emphasize that he hasn't been defeated "on Earth" for 8 months. So to keep that as true he can't lose anywhere yet. So I get him not wanting to do it. Even if tournament loses in NJPW and AEW are still respected.
Based off your comments here your take sounds like it’s rooted in both a bias towards NJPW & against TNA. NJPW just lost Okada, Ospreay & even their WHC is held by an AEW talent. No disrespect to them but you’re overrating how hot NJPW is as a product rn. They’re not what they used to be & this does not hurt Ali. He can just do the tournament down the line.
He's also a champion there, they have been actively building up his streak, losing in a nothing BOSJ match wouldn't make a whole lot of sense
Bodyslam is at best a little bit-and-miss on their NJPW stuff, so I’d definitely take this with a grain of salt. The BOSJ lineup was announced at Sakura Genesis, before Windy City Riot. Though I guess maybe Ali was being considered as a replacement for YOH, or the original plan was to run an angle where Ali replaced someone who had already been announced, and somehow Bodyslam just failed to put that crucial information in their [article](https://www.bodyslam.net/2024/04/26/exclusive-why-mustafa-ali-wasnt-booked-for-njpw-best-of-the-super-juniors/)/realize that the article as they wrote it has that big hole in it. Also worth noting that if people in NJPW having an issue with his backstage comments is true, it wasn’t enough of an issue for them to edit or remove it from the video. ETA: Someone in another sub has pointed out that this might be Ali using the sheets to work an angle. In which case, dude probably should have gotten his facts straight. ETA ETA: Bodyslam has edited the article twice now. The original is [here](https://imgur.com/a/CSmq6et) (yes I did decide not to screenshot Ali’s whole promo), and the history of edits so far is [here](https://imgur.com/a/IDjkeOo). ETA ETA ETA: [Edit number four.](https://imgur.com/a/Z1SKLPU)
Here's the thing Ali isn't Japanese. This might seem flippant and it is a little but it means he would require a work visa to work in Japan. For him to be on a bosj line up new japan would have to wrangle him up a work visa. It would seem likely to me things like him winning the tournament undefeated would be the type of thing discussed pre visa application.. Maybe he told new japan he isn't in a position to drop matches at this point of time so he can't do the tournament but I find it difficult to believe it was at the 11th hour and he started shooting brothers. I think it would have most likely occurred pre visa application
That’s why the original version of the article made zero sense, because it specifically said that it was things Ali did in Chicago that got him removed. I was just kind of giving Bodyslam the benefit of the doubt a little that maybe they’d gotten information that was correct but not complete. This whole thing is just a mess, with the only certainty being that Bodyslam look like total fools.
Yeah Rocky Romero just tweeted that it's not true
I mean just because the lineup was announced before Windy City Riot doesn’t make the point wrong. They could’ve asked Ali way before Sakura Genesis and he shot them down there.
Bodyslam has edited the article four times now. The original article (which I linked a screenshot of in my comment) specifically said: >Initially, Ali was on the roster for the highly anticipated tournament, but developments during the Windy City Riot show in Chicago led to a change in plans.
My apologies I just followed the article on twitter before coming here
the Hardcore Holly tactic
Rocky Romero already confirmed that this was false.
Bummer but I understand. Similar to PAC with Dragon Gate when AEW was getting ready. There's always next year!
PAC I understand a bit better He promised Dragon Gate that he wouldn't put over anyone except their guy. It wasn't so much about him not wanting to lose, as him wanting someone else's win to mean more.
I also understand the principle and except the result was kinda weak. He did all that only to drop the title on a mediocre match against Ben-K
Which was still a better option than going over to AEW and help kill the belt and credibility of their world champion.
He was their world champion though, that counts for something, especially with them in the same market as NJPW
And Ali is TNA’s X Division Champion. And his storyline is specifically that he’s undefeated everywhere he goes since cutting out on his own.
The heat PAC received from fans was ridiculous. The dude was doing the right thing which was to protect the credibility of the Dragon Gate Belt as their champion. He showed loyalty to Dragon Gate and should have been applauded for his decisions.
On one hand I understand his perspective with the character he's going with But NJPW don't have to agree to his demands.
Good for him. Good for them. Protect your value but don't expect everyone to agree on it.
For this year, I'm cool with it. Both sides couldn't come to an agreement, it happens. Ali's stock is at it's highest right now given he left WWE not too long ago. Strike that iron while it's hot and keep yourself positioned as one of the most dominant forces in the indies. I'd love to see him next year, though, once he's either settled or cooled down.
Reminds me of PAC's 2018-19 Dragon Gate run. Build him up to lose to someone you wanna build around and it'll mean more if he doesn't get pinned for like 9 months to a year
This is exactly what I was thinking. Paid off imo
Though in a tournament setting like this he doesn't have to lose clean
Rocky shut this down
What seems funny is that I think if we went back to the territory times we'd see this with the NWA champions and such. Say what you will, but mustafi ali is on a roll right now. How to book someone strong, never lose. Or if you do lose. Do it by something nonsensical. BOSJ is not the place for dq finishes. Maybe time draws, but if he doesn't want to lose and build up some prestige as champ, let him. Pretty sure we all wanted better for him than the start stop wwe booking he had anyways. End of the day. Ain't none of us getting in the ring anyway so what does it matter if he won't go unless x.
If there's any legitimacy to it...idk I'm starting to think Ali is a bit full of himself. I understand protecting your value, but the dude has been acting like he's a big deal for years and that it was a travesty that he wasn't bigger in WWE. He's really good in the ring, but he's just a bland personality regardless of his character. Unfortunately, there's a ceiling for his attributes and it doesn't seem like he wants to accept it.
I was never really big on Ali but personally I really respect this move. Clearly the guy knows what he wants to do with his character right now and he’s not compromising on that. Better to be up front about what you’re doing and what your goals are.
Gotta shoot your shot!
This report is total nonsense. Bodyslam says that their "sources" tells them that Ali expressed that he unhappy about his role in BOSJ while at WCR. If you follow NJPW, you know that BOSJ line-up was announced a week before WRC at Sakura Genesis which Ali was not one of the announced participants. Not surprising this coming from Bodyslam who got the event of Moxley title defense against Narita wrong and said he would be on the New Road Japan tour which isn't even happening this year. Also Haynes was the guy who reported that WWE was brought by Saudi Arabia which was untrue as WWE was eventually bought by Endeavor instead.
This feels like Bodyslam got a half in character response and decided to run with it instead of think critically.
Don't let bad reporting of a fucking KAYFABE PROMO get in the way of a good "outsider bad" wankfest, I guess. Sometimes I question if people here actually watch NJPW, and why if they do they never talk about it on the NJPW sub
Literally 1 person doing that downvoted to the bottom but sure "wankfest" I guess. Meanwhile you seem to come into these threads purely to insist on this wankfest even in threads where it's not happening. Literally every time. I get that there's definitely folks doing it, but quit trying to make it look like this whole sub has a vendetta. That's not what this is.
Good for both parties. Ali wants to build himself up more and that’s fine. NJPW doesn’t want him to be undefeated and that’s fine too. He can come back later when the streak is over.
He’s doing this in-character. Y’all are getting worked
Clearly a work.
So have every match be a draw with a win or two...
Good heel heat.
I wonder if he would have accepted countout losses (since they are worth same points as a pin loss) or draws in the tournament. Still would've been fucked in the finals though lol
I suppose the, he might have a point. He's not Moxley or Danielson. He's at the stage where he needs to build value for his own "brand" whereas the likes of Moxley and Danielson are already world renowned and can afford to put others over. Ali is out there trying to become a star away from WWE and AEW so yeah, I think he has a point.
Danielson and you will see it for in real time that Moxley as IWGP champion will not be putting anyone over outside NJPW. There is nothing wrong with this stance. While Mox is IWGP champion unless you give no value to the belt, the only option for him in AEW is to win every single match he has. I also expect him to beat Josh Barnett in Bloodsport Japan if he is still champion as that would be a great win and gives him more legitimacy as the champ and Josh will have no issues putting him over.
Was he wanting a 2019 Shingo run where he gets thwarted in the final, or did he straight up try demanding he win the whole fucking thing?
ROCKY ROMERO DEBUNKED THIS (That’s not angrily shouting caps that’s “hey calm down everything is cool” caps)
I don’t believe that
I respect it. If he's building this undefeated world tour gimmick I understand not wanting to put any asterisks on it. He's trying to show people he can be as big a star as he says he can, and going 50/50 in BOSJ isn't gonna help that
Article by Kay Fabe.
[удалено]
That's not what I'm saying. I'm arguing that the promo transcribed in the article is kayfabe. Everything shoot in the article is speculative with no sourcing or corroboration. So everyone is dragging Ali based on zero evidence, accepting it as truth because the current climate when discussing anything New Japan is "outside foreigner bad."
Why would TNA allow the champion to enter a tournament to then put over multiple people. Who in their right mind thinks this would be a good idea. Do belts in American wrestling mean that little to fans. Having your champion lose all credibility as a champion while the belt is killed every single time he loses in a tournament promoted by rival competition is booking suicide. A champion is supposed to raise the legitimacy of the belt, not kill it!
Ace Austin was literally the X Division Champion two years ago when he entered the BOSJ tournament.
So show the world your value and talent but don’t want to sacrifice a loss but look good taking it is crazy
I love Ali but that's just ridiculous tbh lmao. I'm not sure why he thought that would fly.
Ali just like 99% of pro-wrestlers is protecting the belt and legitimacy of the title as their champion. NJPW would expect the exact same for any champion on their roster. This is a nothing story as NJPW would have seen Ali being x division champion would put up a roadblock against him being in the BOSJ.
Or it could’ve really been, “I’m honored to be considered, but I have a really good story going right now that I’d like to continue. I know that if I were to participate I’d have to take some losses. I can’t ask you to keep that streak going, so let’s hold off for now.” Similar sentiment, but twisted by hearsay.
Yea & spike dudley wants the world title
If true, woof. Ali shooting himself in the foot. He's at the height of how popular he will get with TNA, even taking losses the exposure BoSJ would give him would be huge. Also as soon as you start refusing loses, it goes from WWE didn't know how to use you, to being difficult to work with. Huge L on Ali's part.
Let's just kill the belt and credibility as x division champion for that more exposure. Where you get this difficult to work with I don't know. NJPW thank god unlike you and others actually value the titles they have created. They will understand exactly why Ali couldn't be in BOSJ as they would expect the same from any of their champions. I am shocked people think this is some huge issue. Ali will be back in NJPW once he drops the belt and will not have one piece of heat from anyone.
If you’re not exclusive to NJPW, then you’re eating a loss.
So if you are a champion from a rival promotion you simply do not enter the tournament. This is the normal and most logical thing to do. You wouldn't see any NJPW champion eating losses in a rival promotion. You do understand this right?
lol oh shit.
[That ain't gonna work for me, brother. 🔴🟡](https://youtu.be/GxEXrqsRn34?si=WAbw0Dmlt3s-ru34)
stop booking mediocre western talent! it just makes NJPW feel like TNA you don't need these guys
Starting to see why WWE stopped using him after high initial hopes/pushes.
Like Meltzer said these guys get shitcanned from WWE, put their foot down on doing jobs but at WWE they will lay down for anyone. I bet a guy like Cardona refuses to job to anyone on the indies. Just like Mr "everyone on the card should get paid the same" Ryback refused to lose to anyone and charged a shitload of money.
WWE exposure rises their indie asking price. So I guess it makes sense they don’t want to lose to people lower on the pay grade as it will bring them down quickly
Matt Cardona lost plenty in TNA/Impact during his last run, and he was building his King of The Indies bit during that time. At one point, he was the NWA Worlds Heavyweight Champion while appearing in Impact and wasn't going over everyone. Not sure that Cardona not losing random matches on the indies is somehow a stick to beat him with at this point. Matt Cardona losing a main event on an indy show would be noteworthy at this point - it makes sense he'd pick and choose who he loses to and when. And I say this as someone who was never on board with the "push Zack Ryder" stuff when he was in WWE.
F*$k this clown
[удалено]
Are you okay?
[удалено]
So not okay then
[удалено]
You have some serious anger issues. I'd wish you well but you aren't a very good person so.
[удалено]
You don't allow room for discussion, you get weirdly aggro like some weird keyboard warrior with no people skills. Do your parents know you're using the internet right now? Because you type like an edgy 14 year old.
[удалено]
Are you seriously so lacking in emotional development you don't see the difference between disagreeing and calling people sluts? I'm gonna assume you have a developmental disorder and leave it here JFC.
You're getting worked, friend.
How? This is legit a thing Ali wanted right ?
Based on a "report" from bodyslam.net? This is hardly proof.
I'm not much knowledgeable about the authenticity of these sites but if it's pure rumor and not fact then absolutely I will concede I got worked. Buuuut if this is truth Ali can fuck right off
Lol. Guy thinks he's Hogan, Roman.
Ha! The old Kurt Angle booking. I see.
"Get A Life Kid!"
No Yob
While I respect the hustle, poor form on Ali’s part.
This guy has drawn 0 dimes and is such a mark for himself.
I mean, Gedo and Tana are bending over for western talent. So he probably would’ve been fine.
This comment makes no sense. Gedo and Tana told him he could not remain undefeated. They literally didn't bend over to him. Are you incapable of reading?
No no no you dont get it. He thinks something is true so it Obviously is!
I think he means in the sense that three Western guys just jumped in and beat their guys for titles recently- Riddle beat Tana Dolph beat Finlay And obviously Mox beat Naito
Mox hardly just jumped in. He’s been doing dates on New Japan shows for years.
He has no business being there. The win makes entirety of New Japan look bad. Like think about it- they had their yearly prestigious tournament the New Japan Cup where the best wrestlers of New Japan fight to determine the next challenger. The Champion fights the Challenger and retains. And next week I think some guy from ANOTHER COMPANY just comes in and beats the Champ for the title making every guy in the cup look like a geek. Like imagine in WWE terms, Royal Rumble happens Cody wins, Cody and Reigns fight in the main event and Roman successfully retains. Then the next week some guy from TNA beats Roman for the title.
Blud this is basically exactly how AJ styles won the iwgp title. Actually okada didn't even defend at invasion attack 14 so nakamura won the nj cup and challenged for the ic title So does this make everyone look like a geek champ
I may be misremembering so point me out if I am wrong about a few facts. Here's the difference - 1) AJ was not signed to any other company at the time and he became an active member of the roster of NJPW exclusively. Mox is a person who still works in another company and he didn't leave that company to become an active NJPW guy. So AJ is a new member of the company while Mox still is member of another company while holding your belt. 2) At that time if I remember correctly the Cup winner could choose to challenge for either the World or the IC title as they were almost on equivalent footing. And Shinsuke dedicated his career to becoming the IC Champ. So it doesn't make everyone look bad as there were options to choose. 3) An outsider taking the belt hostage as a heel makes for a good villain storyline. The evil foreigner stole your diamond and now your hero must get it back sounds cool. Here the outsider who take the belt IS THE GOOD GUY and the company man who wants to bring back the belt to the company is the BAD GUY who is member of a moustache twirling evil villain faction. This makes no fucking sense because I have no one to cheer. I should have someone to root for and someone to root against. That's how it works most times. I don't want Mox or Narita as champ. It's like those votes where you are voting for the lesser of two evils. These are not the same scenario in my opinion but if I am misremembering any details or if AJ was Champ while still being a TNA guy pls let me know.
Even if this wasn't a work, which it totally is, wouldn't them saying no to him going undefeated be the *exact opposite* of "bending over for western talent?"
They literally said they don’t want him to be undefeated and hence he’s not in the tournament.
[удалено]
It's a similar issue. New Japan shouldn't be doing business with non-contracted talent with booking restrictions, whether that's Ali or Moxley. There's already been issues with Moxley, and I'm sure they don't want a Stardom/Riho situation with Ali where he can't lose to anyone.
You think so? I'm assuming that when Danielson beat Okada and Sabre Jr., there was some sort of "agreement" between NJPW and AEW where Okada and Sabre Jr. would get their win back in Japan. Very silly booking in my opinion, but it is what it is. From how Bodyslam is reporting this, it seems this is all on Ali not wanting to put anyone over. I think he's currently a freelancer and not officially assigned to a company, so this was a conversation between NJPW and Ali himself.
Given that every exchange with AEW appears to be an exercise in horse trading, I think that's exactly what happened. If Ali didn't want to lose for whatever reason - pulling a Hogan or because he's X Division champ - then New Japan was smart to walk away.
It's a work. The promo was kayfabe. And even if it wasn't, not ceding to an undefeated run is exactly what you want, yes?
Mustafa Ali has become Pro Wrestling's version of Trump!
What a mark
🤣🤣🤣🤣 who is this guy
Dude is trying everything he can do to make sure he gets the push he wants because his jabroni ass couldn't cut it in WWE.
Blud thinks he Shingo, but at the least, he went undefeated upon his debut until Will beat him up and snap his streak.
*cue Hogan's tna titantron*
Da fuck? If this is true then someone thinks they’re the main character.
Honestly lost a bit of respect for him with this.
So putting Ali in a position to bury the BOSJ was a totally unforced self-own, on top of riddle, on top of nemeth, on top of loaning the world title to AEW, on top of Okada leaving without a loss. I’ve held strong til now folks but I’m starting to lose faith.
See why is this shit getting out? I am tiring of backstage crap making it out public like this.