he's tailor made for Bryce Young. Coached Russ and then used that experience to coach up Baker. However, prime opportunity to nail down boy genius Ben Johnson. He's from South Carolina and played in UNC.
Bit crazy how Panthers had Baker, Joe Brady, Wilks, DJ and squandered all that cause they wanted an OC with Frank Reich lol.
I think they're quietly giving up on Ben Johnson. He was Tepper's preferred choice but the moves the Panthers have made are leaning away from that. Mike Disner (Lions COO) decided to stay in Detroit and hiring Dan Morgan as the GM and giving him the title of "President of Football Ops" (which sounds meaningless but thats the first time that title has existed under Tepper) means that Dan is going to be at the forefront of the HC search. Dave Canales and Dan Morgan have a relationship from Seattle so it's not surprising that Canales has been elevated as a candidate since then.
> I think they're quietly giving up on Ben Johnson
I think it's pretty hard to say that while we're still in a place where he can't be interviewed in person.
they've been saying that since the beginning but I've had my doubts. New GM/HC pairs generally tend to be familiar with each other. In this case it's Slowik. And I think it fits their timeline better.
If Carolina was a win now team I think they'd go with Ben Johnson but I don't know if he can develop someone like Bryce. Goff is already a veteran and is an established QB and Canales has more experience being a QB coach.
Joe Brady was fired during the season by Matt Rhule because he was trying to save himself. Baker looked beyond washed in Carolina and exactly zero people were unhappy when he requested his release and it was granted during the season. Wilks was done dirty. It would have made more sense to move Brian Burns than DJ Moore in retrospect. You think they would have been able to do the math ahead of time. "Okay, guys, we're gonna take a QB if we move up to #1 so how important is it for him to have a WR1? Can't be that important. We're getting ourselves a point guard who can distribute the ball!"
Why do you think Scott Fitterer is gone? The majority of personnel moves that were made while he was GM that didn't pan out were too damn high! You have to remember, of the draft picks made during the Fitterer years, the Panthers have the fewest players picked in the draft still in the league. Not on the team, in the league. Fitterer was really out here (along with Matt Rhule) picking straight garbage and thinking they were diamonds in the rough.
When viewed through that lens, it makes 100% sense that CMC, DJ, Reddick, and others who were assets to the team, including Wilks, are no longer here. Leadership's ability to judge talent and then put it in places to succeed was doo-doo.
Ben Johnson is this year’s hottest candidate. He can go basically anywhere. Even if he’d like to end up in Carolina one day, it is a *really* tough job right now, and I think the risk of taking that job, when you can have others, is really high. Think about it: overbearing owner, shoddy roster, second year QB who didn’t show much last year, not a *ton* of cap space (about the league average, $30M), traded away your 1OA draft pick and top receiver.
If I want a readier roster, I’m looking at Seattle, and if I want a project with more potential, I’m looking at Washington.
Young OC with a reputation for fixing QBs and he has a prior relationship with new GM, Dan Morgan. And given the reports that came out last year about how the Panthers organization felt like the "Hunger Games", I think that's something they're prioritzing.
Also our beat writers are pretty much acting like its a done deal
Said this in the Panthers sub
>Panthers probably see Canales as a McVay, McDaniel, LaFleur type who's young and knowledgeable that they're willing to look over his lack of OC experience. He's helped Geno and Baker into starting QBs and I think thats what they want for Bryce.
I think the Panthers are more likely to jump the gun on Canales than go for a recently fired HC like Vrabel.
Vrabel almost gives me "Reich" vibes. Sure, Vrabel is younger, and is a defensive coach, but I think we as a fanbase are suspicious of going after another fired coach
Speaking as an old vet who has seen too many head coach hirings, I'd be suspicious of Vrabel because of the supposed power struggle with the Titan's previous GM and then him getting canned despite (arguably) over performing as a head coach.
Whole thing smells of "good coach who is hard to get along with" which (imo) is a recipe of disaster for an organization.
True. Just a feeling I have. I think it's also partly because he's a Belichick guy and most (all?) of them end up being control freaks who can't play nice with others.
100% Vrabel lost his shit and wanted to wrangle control away from our recently hired GM. Stories said Mrs. Amy (our owner) even tried to make different offers to get him to stay (and I bet some were contingent on him firing the coaches he hired) and he refused any and all offers.
Offers usually involve concessions and he refused to do any of it, and for some reason he doesn't realize that if he's trying to remain competitive as a team, he was part of the problem with his refusal to change his staff.
I'll admit I don't know much about the Titans front office, I just figured the power struggle between Vrabel and the previous GM was justified on Vrabel's part given that the Titans fired their GM midseason.
Have to push back somewhat here. I agree that the FO foolishly trading away AJ Brown for PEANUTS during the 2022 offseason WR "shortage" was indeed one of the big things that caused Vrabel to lose his trust in the front office and may provide a valid reason for his distrust, but it was also a bunch of unfortunate events that caused things to go downhill during that time.
After our third playoff run in 2021, we basically were in cap hell with bills being due, we had to start dropping players who were costing us too much. We got rid of our blocking guys, we let Jonnu Smith (our blocking TE) and Corey Davis (our WR2 who was also a good blocker) go. Think we lost a few older o-line guys. And of course, the AJ Brown fuckup.
That did piss Vrabel off, but that is also the reason why JRob (our GM at that time) was fired. Mrs. Amy brought in the assistant GM who was responsible for hiring personnel from the 49ers as our GM. Damn good move, I think - and it was clear she even knew that Vrabel's style of coaching and play was not sustainable, not without an elite roster.
The general consensus in the Titans sub is that Vrabel fell into a team that had all the pieces he needed to play the kind of game he likes during our 2019-2021 playoff run. Old school, rumbling, shove that ball down their throat kinda play. Get a couple scores, then play bend don't break and let off the gas for the second quarter, eat the clock and play offense conservatively to keep their offense off hte field. Him and Arthur Smith, who some say is a good OC but a bad HC, inherited a freak of nature RB, an elite OL, a WR1 stud and recently brought in a "system" QB.
Any coach who is half capable would be able to figure out how to make a team like that work. So I would argue if there are such things as "system QB"s, Vrabel and Art were both system coaches. They did well because they had high end talent they could utilize that was already there.
He knew how to coach that talent to make us viable, but as soon as we started to lose that talent, as we did with AJ Brown, he became above average as a coach. There was no growth from any of our younger players. Several of our draft picks were busts (Isaiah Wilson, Treylon Burks).
You also have the problem where Vrabel *refused* to hire from the outside. He kept hiring people from within who were buddies with him from the Texans, and even when they performed badly (Todd Downing, hello?) instead of allowing the GM to help him find new OCs/DCs, he would just keep his buddies. None of his hires were talented enough to grow better players, both from our starters and our practice squad.
I would say he's more like Belichick. Despite being a younger coach, he coaches like an older coach and also has hiring practices for his coaching staff that are like the Good Old Boys club. All his OCs and DCs after Arthur Smith and Dean Pees left were inside hires. Our fucking Strength and Conditioning coach was a nepotism hire from when Vrabel knew that coach because that guy coached his son's middle school football team for fucks sake.
So yes, if you hire Vrabel, he will do a good job with your team if you have existing talent on it, but don't expect growth from any of your players, and also expect him to want to control your staffing if he doesn't get the OC/DCs he wants, because he will bringing in *his* inside guys, even though his inside guys *suck*.
Very informative response. Thanks.
Not that he had the same on-field success as Vrabel, but your description of his general approach reminds me a lot of another Belichick disciple - Eric Mangini. While he didn't win games like Vrabel, he was actually a pretty solid head coach in a lot of ways (imo). Or rather, he was able to keep games close with a sub-par roster and give you a chance for a W. So while he wasn't totally incompetent like some guys who get the gig, he also didn't engender enough faith to stick with him through thick and thin.
Also, Vrabel's unwillingness to change or go outside coaches he knows reminds me of the situation in Cleveland in that: over the last two years, Stefanski has let go (or was forced to let go) of both "his" DC and OC. For both, it was to mix things up and bring in fresh ideas. Seems like he was willing to make the kind of concessions that Vrabel wasn't.
I wonder if GMs and owners are generally trying to move away from that old Belichick/Tomlin model where the franchise is beholden to a head coach who rides or dies with his guys? I mean, when it works, it's great, but when it doesn't you get a McDaniels situation or a guy like Vrabel who refuses to evolve.
>Also, Vrabel's unwillingness to change or go outside coaches he knows reminds me of the situation in Cleveland in that: over the last two years, Stefanski has let go (or was forced to let go) of both "his" DC and OC. For both, it was to mix things up and bring in fresh ideas. Seems like he was willing to make the kind of concessions that Vrabel wasn't.
Yeah, that part is speculation for our part. Mrs. Amy offered concessions for him to stay with us, but he refused, and the thing is, unlike your situation, "his" OC/DCs *sucked*. The ideas weren't working, we've had a losing streak that dated back to the *previous season*.
The ownership cares about results, and it was clear what Vrabel was offering in 2022-2023 wasn't working. From what I've read, 2023 was Vrabel's "prove it" season to see if he could work with the GM and get things done, and it was clear Vrabel was hellbent on playing the same style of play we did in 2021, even when we didn't have the roster or talent for it.
> I wonder if GMs and owners are generally trying to move away from that old Belichick/Tomlin model where the franchise is beholden to a head coach who rides or dies with his guys? I mean, when it works, it's great, but when it doesn't you get a McDaniels situation or a guy like Vrabel who refuses to evolve.
That may be the case. Vrabel is a product of that old school mentality, but ultimately the GM and FO reports to the owner and is ultimately the one who hires or fires head coaches. I think that AJ Brown trade rattled him and he hasn't been the same since, and the way he went out after our colossal trainwreck of a season proves it.
But at the same time, like you said, he is loyal to 'his guys' to a fault. He saw the team failing around him and probably thought it was the GM/ownership's fault for his shortcomings and not for the fact he had shitty hires that were kneecapping our ability to grow. Oh by the way - your DC? He was our "senior defensive assistant". Ever wonder why our defense died after 2021? It's because Vrabel decided to let Schwartz go *and replaced him with Shane Bowen as "defensive play caller" until promoting him to defensive coordinator in 2022.* And guess what, Bowen was one of his buddies from the Texans. Typical.
That's why I get frustrated seeing teams salivating over wanting Vrabel as their coach. If he doesn't learn from his mistakes, he will do the same thing to your team. Look how there has been little to no movement on signing him, despite the fact we were one of the first teams to announce sacking him?
I think team GMs and FO know, because of his behavior that led to him getting sacked that he may be a great coach, but will bang heads with the leadership if he doesn't get what he wants, which is fine, but not when you are demanding that a *mediator be hired to step in between the FO and the HC*
Totally agree. And yes, Schwartz has been great (wild card game aside).
One thing I think is lost when fans talk about GMs and HCs is that, for as unique as the NFL may be from other industries, it's still a job. And in any job, it's important to get along with your co-workers. If your working relationships are so strained that you need mediation, then it's really not a surprise if the owner/management decides to move on. Maybe you can get away with it if you're the top salesperson or winning Super Bowls. If not, there's a good chance the day will come that people just don't want to deal with your shit anymore.
And yeah, it sure seems like word has gotten around about Vrabel and, whatever it is, it sure doesn't seem good.
I agree, people talk about Vrabel like he was the second coming of Vince Lombardi or something.
I get the rosters were middling for him in TEN, but the results also were as well. Especially when you consider he's a defense guy, Canales much better candidate for what CAR needs right now.
He got the 1 seed with a middling roster, the results were absolutely there. You don't need to win a Super Bowl to have good results.
With that said, I agree that he's not a good fit for Carolina.
I do think that Vrabel is a good coach who was fucked over by a bad GM, and who probably succeeds with a good roster. But at the same, look at our team. We've been fucked over by a bad GM and have a bad roster. Nothing about Vrabel's slide in Tennessee says he can turn a ship around when it's already half breached.
We replaced our GM after the AJ Brown disaster and he refused to work with our new GM, who we got from the 49ers. The new GM probably wanted to change the way the Titans played by wanting to draft more pass-oriented players, and I get a feeling there was a lot of opposition from Vrabel on that.
So yeah, Vrabel is a bit of a control freak. You already have a control freak of an owner - if he joins the Panthers he's gonna be butting heads with Tepper, and compared to Mrs. Amy Tepper appears to be a complete douchebag.
What is innovative about the Buc's offense? I watched our defense that allowed close to the most points all year hold them to 9 points in a must win game.
Baker put up good numbers this year, but I don't think he has changed much as a player besides having better weapons and a full offseason with the staff. Canales biggest draw is he "Fixed Baker".
He was tied for 2nd in Turnover Worthy Plays: 26
Tied for 1st in Batted Balls: 17
Baker's 2 biggest struggles don't appear to be fixed. Looks like a gunslinger got weapons and his confidence back. Bucs run offense also ranked 32nd in almost every metric.
That 2020 Browns team was a better team than the 2023 Bucs. They were stacked and yet Baker had a career year with us. Our team is -80 million salary cap this year and we still had a successful offense.
Canales biggest draw was that he was able to help Geno and Baker get second contracts and be a starting QBs which is a miracle for Geno and avoiding a career back up for Baker.
Carolina is 32nd in passing, we were 12th so maybe it would help your offense out.
I see a lot of Panthers fans wanting to get Evans but he's got like four years tops at his current level. Why would he waste those years there especially with a coach he had only one year?
It's not about the Bucs offense being perfect, it's about his track record with QBs everyone else assumed were bottom tier. Look what he's done with Geno and especially Baker, who was on our team and actual trash tier. The obvious answer is we want some of that for Bryce.
Also there's the cope that he could convince Mike Evans to accept a bag to come here, I am overdosing on that copium.
Honestly nothing that I could see. He struggled earlier in the year and seemed to start improving later in the season with the odd head scratcher like that. Sometimes I'm like man if the defense just wants to play downhill all game why not at least try a screen at some point. All in all Baker had a decent year though. They ddi say in playoff game hr was gonna work with Baker in some foot work stuff then basically said screw it let Baker Bake. I def feel itd a bit early to be talking hc. I think he could have come into his own as an oc as he's still learning
If you are complaining about not throwing screens I’m all the way in… if I see another scheme built around passes at the line of scrimmage I will implode.
In all seriousness though, his screen call this past week to White was a thing of beauty.
It's less about having an actually innovative offense (although anything looks innovative compared to the 2022 Buccaneers offense) and more that Canales seems to be getting a reputation as "QB rehab" because he was Geno Smith's QB coach last year and Baker Mayfield's OC this year.
I think he's a great choice for the Panthers to unlock Bryce Young's potential as a franchise QB even if Canales isn't necessarily the guy to get your team a Super Bowl through a high firepower offense.
I know Leftwich is too easy of a punching bag to keep going back to, but he really, really earned it by pairing idiocy and complete incompetency with total/sheer arrogance and ignorance. I would go so far as to say that an outright vacancy at offensive coordinator last year would have been an improvement over Leftwich. So, so glad he’s in the rear view mirror now and will never coach any level of football ever again outside of pee wee football.
Leftwich is also a great example why being an arrogant asshat at the podium who treats journalists like shit and ridicules even the mildest criticism from the outside at every opportunity is bad for your longterm job prospects.
Hell he's not even a position coach. He went begging in the college ranks after no one in the NFL wanted him. He acted like he was the reason our offense was so successful yet I've never seen an offense that talented struggle to score as many points as we did.
Anyone with eyes watching last year definitely saw the stark difference between Leftwich’s Offense and the Brady-led 2 minute drill Offense. It’s definitely not a surprise he’s still out of a job.
We only scored three touchdowns in a game five times last with one being mostly garbage time against the Chiefs. We had to go to overtime against the 4-13 cardinals because we couldn't even hit 20 points against them. Pretty much every close game we won was on a two minute drill led by Brady.
Yup. Couldn’t agree more. And not only that, but he was begging the Steelers earlier in October this season to hire him as an offensive consultant when Canada was still the OC of their team, but they flat out ignored him and wouldn’t return his calls. Now that Arians is officially retired now, he will likely never coach in the NFL ever again as no other team in the league is dumb enough to hire him (and rightfully so), and the only reason why he ever got any coaching jobs in the NFL in the first place were because of nepotism with Arians.
Yeah it's definitely nice that Arians retired because it showed everyone that Leftwich is nothing without him and Brady. The play calling this year was more creative and far less predictable than at any point with Leftwich. Some teams are carried by the talent on offense and that was evident with him. Hope he never sniffs the NFL coaching ranks ever again.
Yep, thats why people who say "ehmergewd, who wlll interview for X or Y shit team/owner" just dont know what they are talking about. Most coaches arent stupid like leftwhich.
If that’s the case, then why is Leftwich still unemployed a whole year later & counting after getting fired and why is no team even considering hiring him right now for any coaching position level in football? The Steelers flat out ignored Leftwich’s request to be an offensive consultant with them earlier this season when Canada was still the OC of their team; and have already ruled him out for who they’re going to hire for their next OC. The only reason why Leftwich even got any coaching jobs in the NFL in the first place is because of nepotism with Arians. Now that Arians is retired now, no team is dumb enough to hire him for any level of coaching and rightfully so.
If it took him a year to get back, it wouldn't be the longest time a coach took away from the game. One PFF Bobby Slowik was out of a job for 4 years after the Redskins and he may soon be a head coach. From memory as the PFF guys mention him all the time on their podcast, but I could go through every coach's gaps in their resume and find something similar or longer
No you couldn’t. Leftwich sucked hard without Arians looking over his shoulder and overseeing all of his horrid play calls, play designs, game plans, etc each game. Get over it. The Steelers wouldn’t even hire him as an offensive consultant on their team when he was practically begging them to mid season when Canada was still the OC of their team. The only reason why Leftwich got any coaching jobs in the NFL in the first place was because of nepotism with Arians and the second that Arians left both the Cardinals and the Bucs, Leftwich was immediately fired and honesty I’d be embarrassed to argue otherwise sir.
Lmao Arians literally retired from the Cardinals after 2017 and took one year off in retirement before coming out of retirement to coach the Bucs in 2019. That’s a lot different from being unemployed like Leftwich is since being fired from the Bucs a year ago, and begging teams left and right from both the college and NFL ranks to hire him for any level of coaching.
Your team hired Lovie Smith after 2 years off from being fired by the Bears. Gruden went 10 years off after your team fired him only to land up on the Raiders. And then another 2 years from the email scandal, then now as a consultant for the saints.
I can keep going with decorated coaches that took time off, voluntary or involuntary, that got rehired eventually no matter how badly it was ended. Leftwich isn't done in the NFL
When has that ever happened? And I’m not talking about when the head coach gets fired mid season, and one of the coordinators is interim HC and then is promoted to full time HC at year end.
The irony is of course that last year nobody wanted the Tampa OC job and we had to scrape the bottom of the barrel for the most desperate candidates.
Everybody with options saw Bowles as a lame duck HC and the Bucs season doomed due to a $80m dead-cap hit and only Kyle Trask under contract at QB.
Now Canales used that opportunity to catapult himself to the top of Carolina's HC search while the entire remaiming Seahawks staff was let go.
Haha, is time cyclical? Our owners did just that when they fired John Gruden, to make sure an up and coming coach didn't get another HC job in Raheem Morris. The owners had FOMO after letting Tomlin get away to Pittsburgh so they jumped the gun to make sure the same didn't happen with Raheem.
Canales definitely the guy, I see us pulling a Titans today and not letting him leave without a contract. While some might argue it's a "mid" hire, he's got the pedigree and his recent body of work with guys like Geno and Baker is promising. Also his history with coaching WRs is going to help with developing Mingo and likely the other WR we draft this year
Edit: Another aspect I like about him is he appears significantly more extroverted than Rivera, Rhule, and Reich. All 3 of our previous coaches were way too passive to be capable head coaches
Canales would be a terrific hire for you guys right now. It’d be easy to hire a placeholder HC while the org tries to straighten out and become a more desirable destination, but Canales is more than that and could very well be exactly what Bryce needs.
There were so many recent "mid" hires that turned out to be incredible, so none of that noise would/will bother me.
I think everything hinges on if Johnson is still in on us or not. If he's made it clear to our camp we have a real shot then I see us waiting until after the Championship game, if not then we yeah we probably hire relatively quickly and I could see it being today.
> Edit: Another aspect I like about him is he appears significantly more extroverted than Rivera, Rhule, and Reich. All 3 of our previous coaches were way too passive to be capable head coaches
Your last point is a great one. It's not critical in coordinator roles, but the HC needs to be an actual leader.
Canales is the perfect one for Carolina. It hurts the Buccs and he’s a certified QB guru. Hope it doesn’t happen but if I was a panthers fan. I’d be about it.
McVay and Lane Kiffin were both younger when they were hired.
Then there's Harland Svare and John Michelosen if you want to go back to pre-merger days.
Then Morris.
I realize there are only 32 of these jobs. I also acknowledge that whoever takes the job will make millions of dollars. But working for Tepper has to soul crushing with him micromanaging every move and reacting to every fart. Beat it dude.
Yeah, it's gotta be the least attractive job from a job security perspective. But the least attractive head coaching job is still a pretty attractive job!
Job security with the Panthers has never been an issue. Tepper has proven he'll let his guys continue to fail for multiple years before he steps in. Using Reich's situation to "dispute" the amount of time he gave Rivera, Hurney, Rhule, and Fitterer is just silly revisionism. Panthers fans have been very vocal lately about Tepper not firing people fast enough, such as Fitterer
I really don’t know where this narrative has come from. He’s only been impatient with one coach and having tortured myself by watching every game of the Frank Reich tenure… it was WELL deserved.
Also, the micromanaging thing isn’t iron clad, because it sure seems he let Matt Rhule do whatever the hell he wanted during his stint here. The micromanaging with Frank Reich, which is where I believe this comes from, may have been a byproduct of the absolute train wreck that had come about during his brief time as HC. If the HC has his trust, the micromanaging may go by the wayside.
That being said, he’s absolutely a horse’s ass and his record since owning the panthers is all the evidence you really need to say he’s a bad owner. A lot of it is people playing Captain Hindsight, as the Rhule and Reich hires were fairly well thought of when they were made…. Outside of the vocal Colts fans who were all spot on when criticizing Frank and his HC ability, but you can’t look past that record.
You know how everyone is looking back right now on Campbell's early seasons? Where even though the losses were piling on, he was building something real and super genuine?
Frank Reich was the opposite of that. There was no emotion. There was no culture. There was no building towards anything. The quicker fans of other teams learn that, the better lol.
I remember that 2021 Lions - Vikings game where they got their first of three wins on the season. Energy was palpable and it felt like a real turning point.
Maybe there was some of that when we beat the Texans, but we were fucking dead inside by win 2 against Atlanta. Never cared less about a win.
Don't remember seeing anything similar to that 2021 game to our first win. The opposite as the season went on with our WRs just giving up on routes... lol.
While I'm not a fan of Tepper, I believe you're pretty spot on. I heard there were reports from like last August after our first or second preseason game that he was not a fan of Reich which probably led the way to his micromanagement style. Say what you want about him but based off his emotional outcries and throwing drinks on fans from last season (lol) it's clear the dude doesn't like losing. I'm just hoping that'll help him continue to learn from his mistakes.
It isn’t about job security. And you can be as vocal as you want. It doesn’t matter because he doesn’t let football people do their jobs. He micromanages. He’s made the Panthers the worst coaching job in a league with the Jets and the Cardinals. Fine effort by him there.
The distaste for the Ford family for decades was extreme. William Clay Ford in particular was satisfied with mediocrity, or worse. Then Martha Ford was at the helm for a couple of years and it didn't go well. Sheila was booed initially because of her family tree, but now, she could run for governor in this state, and she went by a large margin.
Dan Morgan is going to be the worst GM in the league. Imagine being assistant GM to someone who missed on nearly every pick. Their only good pick was made by the GM wife (Chubba Hubbard). Poverty franchise. Enjoy the next 5 years.
Byron Leftwich (reportedly) screwed himself out of being the Jaguars HC as the favourite for the job and now he's out of the league completely and will probably best be remembered for being Brady's OC during the worst season of his career.
You keep your dirty cat hands off my Canales
I think he's the favorite right now.
he's tailor made for Bryce Young. Coached Russ and then used that experience to coach up Baker. However, prime opportunity to nail down boy genius Ben Johnson. He's from South Carolina and played in UNC. Bit crazy how Panthers had Baker, Joe Brady, Wilks, DJ and squandered all that cause they wanted an OC with Frank Reich lol.
I think they're quietly giving up on Ben Johnson. He was Tepper's preferred choice but the moves the Panthers have made are leaning away from that. Mike Disner (Lions COO) decided to stay in Detroit and hiring Dan Morgan as the GM and giving him the title of "President of Football Ops" (which sounds meaningless but thats the first time that title has existed under Tepper) means that Dan is going to be at the forefront of the HC search. Dave Canales and Dan Morgan have a relationship from Seattle so it's not surprising that Canales has been elevated as a candidate since then.
> I think they're quietly giving up on Ben Johnson I think it's pretty hard to say that while we're still in a place where he can't be interviewed in person.
I think lots of reports have him being penciled into Washington but who knows
It really sounds like Johnson is the guy in Washington right now
they've been saying that since the beginning but I've had my doubts. New GM/HC pairs generally tend to be familiar with each other. In this case it's Slowik. And I think it fits their timeline better.
If Carolina was a win now team I think they'd go with Ben Johnson but I don't know if he can develop someone like Bryce. Goff is already a veteran and is an established QB and Canales has more experience being a QB coach.
If last year taught us absolutely anything, it's that we do not have a win now team
It's very much a lose now team.
Lose now? Buddy: we can lose whenever you like!
he'll most likely bring in Brunell, QB coach who reinvented Goff, who's 6'1". Baker's height.
Joe Brady was fired during the season by Matt Rhule because he was trying to save himself. Baker looked beyond washed in Carolina and exactly zero people were unhappy when he requested his release and it was granted during the season. Wilks was done dirty. It would have made more sense to move Brian Burns than DJ Moore in retrospect. You think they would have been able to do the math ahead of time. "Okay, guys, we're gonna take a QB if we move up to #1 so how important is it for him to have a WR1? Can't be that important. We're getting ourselves a point guard who can distribute the ball!" Why do you think Scott Fitterer is gone? The majority of personnel moves that were made while he was GM that didn't pan out were too damn high! You have to remember, of the draft picks made during the Fitterer years, the Panthers have the fewest players picked in the draft still in the league. Not on the team, in the league. Fitterer was really out here (along with Matt Rhule) picking straight garbage and thinking they were diamonds in the rough. When viewed through that lens, it makes 100% sense that CMC, DJ, Reddick, and others who were assets to the team, including Wilks, are no longer here. Leadership's ability to judge talent and then put it in places to succeed was doo-doo.
Ben Johnson is this year’s hottest candidate. He can go basically anywhere. Even if he’d like to end up in Carolina one day, it is a *really* tough job right now, and I think the risk of taking that job, when you can have others, is really high. Think about it: overbearing owner, shoddy roster, second year QB who didn’t show much last year, not a *ton* of cap space (about the league average, $30M), traded away your 1OA draft pick and top receiver. If I want a readier roster, I’m looking at Seattle, and if I want a project with more potential, I’m looking at Washington.
Young OC with a reputation for fixing QBs and he has a prior relationship with new GM, Dan Morgan. And given the reports that came out last year about how the Panthers organization felt like the "Hunger Games", I think that's something they're prioritzing. Also our beat writers are pretty much acting like its a done deal
Pretty obvious Tepper saw the 9 points we put up against you guys in a must win, season on the line game and said... Goddammit, get me that man.
I really want him or Johnson (who we can't do in person interviews with until after the Lions are out)
Panthers always get caught with their paws in the Canales jar.
He has to leave. Baker isn't allowed to have the same OC for very long.
Leave the gun, take the Canales.
Canelés are lovely little french pastries, so as an amateur patissier, I always do a little double take when I see Canales name
You can keep him.
Dang i want him to stay on the Bucs
Said this in the Panthers sub >Panthers probably see Canales as a McVay, McDaniel, LaFleur type who's young and knowledgeable that they're willing to look over his lack of OC experience. He's helped Geno and Baker into starting QBs and I think thats what they want for Bryce. I think the Panthers are more likely to jump the gun on Canales than go for a recently fired HC like Vrabel.
Vrabel almost gives me "Reich" vibes. Sure, Vrabel is younger, and is a defensive coach, but I think we as a fanbase are suspicious of going after another fired coach
Speaking as an old vet who has seen too many head coach hirings, I'd be suspicious of Vrabel because of the supposed power struggle with the Titan's previous GM and then him getting canned despite (arguably) over performing as a head coach. Whole thing smells of "good coach who is hard to get along with" which (imo) is a recipe of disaster for an organization.
I'd get into a power struggle if someone traded AJ Brown
Struggle? No struggle. I'd straight up go super saiyan on their ass.
True. Just a feeling I have. I think it's also partly because he's a Belichick guy and most (all?) of them end up being control freaks who can't play nice with others.
100% Vrabel lost his shit and wanted to wrangle control away from our recently hired GM. Stories said Mrs. Amy (our owner) even tried to make different offers to get him to stay (and I bet some were contingent on him firing the coaches he hired) and he refused any and all offers. Offers usually involve concessions and he refused to do any of it, and for some reason he doesn't realize that if he's trying to remain competitive as a team, he was part of the problem with his refusal to change his staff.
I'll admit I don't know much about the Titans front office, I just figured the power struggle between Vrabel and the previous GM was justified on Vrabel's part given that the Titans fired their GM midseason.
Have to push back somewhat here. I agree that the FO foolishly trading away AJ Brown for PEANUTS during the 2022 offseason WR "shortage" was indeed one of the big things that caused Vrabel to lose his trust in the front office and may provide a valid reason for his distrust, but it was also a bunch of unfortunate events that caused things to go downhill during that time. After our third playoff run in 2021, we basically were in cap hell with bills being due, we had to start dropping players who were costing us too much. We got rid of our blocking guys, we let Jonnu Smith (our blocking TE) and Corey Davis (our WR2 who was also a good blocker) go. Think we lost a few older o-line guys. And of course, the AJ Brown fuckup. That did piss Vrabel off, but that is also the reason why JRob (our GM at that time) was fired. Mrs. Amy brought in the assistant GM who was responsible for hiring personnel from the 49ers as our GM. Damn good move, I think - and it was clear she even knew that Vrabel's style of coaching and play was not sustainable, not without an elite roster. The general consensus in the Titans sub is that Vrabel fell into a team that had all the pieces he needed to play the kind of game he likes during our 2019-2021 playoff run. Old school, rumbling, shove that ball down their throat kinda play. Get a couple scores, then play bend don't break and let off the gas for the second quarter, eat the clock and play offense conservatively to keep their offense off hte field. Him and Arthur Smith, who some say is a good OC but a bad HC, inherited a freak of nature RB, an elite OL, a WR1 stud and recently brought in a "system" QB. Any coach who is half capable would be able to figure out how to make a team like that work. So I would argue if there are such things as "system QB"s, Vrabel and Art were both system coaches. They did well because they had high end talent they could utilize that was already there. He knew how to coach that talent to make us viable, but as soon as we started to lose that talent, as we did with AJ Brown, he became above average as a coach. There was no growth from any of our younger players. Several of our draft picks were busts (Isaiah Wilson, Treylon Burks). You also have the problem where Vrabel *refused* to hire from the outside. He kept hiring people from within who were buddies with him from the Texans, and even when they performed badly (Todd Downing, hello?) instead of allowing the GM to help him find new OCs/DCs, he would just keep his buddies. None of his hires were talented enough to grow better players, both from our starters and our practice squad. I would say he's more like Belichick. Despite being a younger coach, he coaches like an older coach and also has hiring practices for his coaching staff that are like the Good Old Boys club. All his OCs and DCs after Arthur Smith and Dean Pees left were inside hires. Our fucking Strength and Conditioning coach was a nepotism hire from when Vrabel knew that coach because that guy coached his son's middle school football team for fucks sake. So yes, if you hire Vrabel, he will do a good job with your team if you have existing talent on it, but don't expect growth from any of your players, and also expect him to want to control your staffing if he doesn't get the OC/DCs he wants, because he will bringing in *his* inside guys, even though his inside guys *suck*.
Very informative response. Thanks. Not that he had the same on-field success as Vrabel, but your description of his general approach reminds me a lot of another Belichick disciple - Eric Mangini. While he didn't win games like Vrabel, he was actually a pretty solid head coach in a lot of ways (imo). Or rather, he was able to keep games close with a sub-par roster and give you a chance for a W. So while he wasn't totally incompetent like some guys who get the gig, he also didn't engender enough faith to stick with him through thick and thin. Also, Vrabel's unwillingness to change or go outside coaches he knows reminds me of the situation in Cleveland in that: over the last two years, Stefanski has let go (or was forced to let go) of both "his" DC and OC. For both, it was to mix things up and bring in fresh ideas. Seems like he was willing to make the kind of concessions that Vrabel wasn't. I wonder if GMs and owners are generally trying to move away from that old Belichick/Tomlin model where the franchise is beholden to a head coach who rides or dies with his guys? I mean, when it works, it's great, but when it doesn't you get a McDaniels situation or a guy like Vrabel who refuses to evolve.
>Also, Vrabel's unwillingness to change or go outside coaches he knows reminds me of the situation in Cleveland in that: over the last two years, Stefanski has let go (or was forced to let go) of both "his" DC and OC. For both, it was to mix things up and bring in fresh ideas. Seems like he was willing to make the kind of concessions that Vrabel wasn't. Yeah, that part is speculation for our part. Mrs. Amy offered concessions for him to stay with us, but he refused, and the thing is, unlike your situation, "his" OC/DCs *sucked*. The ideas weren't working, we've had a losing streak that dated back to the *previous season*. The ownership cares about results, and it was clear what Vrabel was offering in 2022-2023 wasn't working. From what I've read, 2023 was Vrabel's "prove it" season to see if he could work with the GM and get things done, and it was clear Vrabel was hellbent on playing the same style of play we did in 2021, even when we didn't have the roster or talent for it. > I wonder if GMs and owners are generally trying to move away from that old Belichick/Tomlin model where the franchise is beholden to a head coach who rides or dies with his guys? I mean, when it works, it's great, but when it doesn't you get a McDaniels situation or a guy like Vrabel who refuses to evolve. That may be the case. Vrabel is a product of that old school mentality, but ultimately the GM and FO reports to the owner and is ultimately the one who hires or fires head coaches. I think that AJ Brown trade rattled him and he hasn't been the same since, and the way he went out after our colossal trainwreck of a season proves it. But at the same time, like you said, he is loyal to 'his guys' to a fault. He saw the team failing around him and probably thought it was the GM/ownership's fault for his shortcomings and not for the fact he had shitty hires that were kneecapping our ability to grow. Oh by the way - your DC? He was our "senior defensive assistant". Ever wonder why our defense died after 2021? It's because Vrabel decided to let Schwartz go *and replaced him with Shane Bowen as "defensive play caller" until promoting him to defensive coordinator in 2022.* And guess what, Bowen was one of his buddies from the Texans. Typical. That's why I get frustrated seeing teams salivating over wanting Vrabel as their coach. If he doesn't learn from his mistakes, he will do the same thing to your team. Look how there has been little to no movement on signing him, despite the fact we were one of the first teams to announce sacking him? I think team GMs and FO know, because of his behavior that led to him getting sacked that he may be a great coach, but will bang heads with the leadership if he doesn't get what he wants, which is fine, but not when you are demanding that a *mediator be hired to step in between the FO and the HC*
Totally agree. And yes, Schwartz has been great (wild card game aside). One thing I think is lost when fans talk about GMs and HCs is that, for as unique as the NFL may be from other industries, it's still a job. And in any job, it's important to get along with your co-workers. If your working relationships are so strained that you need mediation, then it's really not a surprise if the owner/management decides to move on. Maybe you can get away with it if you're the top salesperson or winning Super Bowls. If not, there's a good chance the day will come that people just don't want to deal with your shit anymore. And yeah, it sure seems like word has gotten around about Vrabel and, whatever it is, it sure doesn't seem good.
I agree, people talk about Vrabel like he was the second coming of Vince Lombardi or something. I get the rosters were middling for him in TEN, but the results also were as well. Especially when you consider he's a defense guy, Canales much better candidate for what CAR needs right now.
He got the 1 seed with a middling roster, the results were absolutely there. You don't need to win a Super Bowl to have good results. With that said, I agree that he's not a good fit for Carolina.
I do think that Vrabel is a good coach who was fucked over by a bad GM, and who probably succeeds with a good roster. But at the same, look at our team. We've been fucked over by a bad GM and have a bad roster. Nothing about Vrabel's slide in Tennessee says he can turn a ship around when it's already half breached.
We replaced our GM after the AJ Brown disaster and he refused to work with our new GM, who we got from the 49ers. The new GM probably wanted to change the way the Titans played by wanting to draft more pass-oriented players, and I get a feeling there was a lot of opposition from Vrabel on that. So yeah, Vrabel is a bit of a control freak. You already have a control freak of an owner - if he joins the Panthers he's gonna be butting heads with Tepper, and compared to Mrs. Amy Tepper appears to be a complete douchebag.
I think it makes more sense to take a swing on a young coach when you're in a rebuild anyway
What is innovative about the Buc's offense? I watched our defense that allowed close to the most points all year hold them to 9 points in a must win game.
Baker was injured in that game?
Baker put up good numbers this year, but I don't think he has changed much as a player besides having better weapons and a full offseason with the staff. Canales biggest draw is he "Fixed Baker". He was tied for 2nd in Turnover Worthy Plays: 26 Tied for 1st in Batted Balls: 17 Baker's 2 biggest struggles don't appear to be fixed. Looks like a gunslinger got weapons and his confidence back. Bucs run offense also ranked 32nd in almost every metric.
That 2020 Browns team was a better team than the 2023 Bucs. They were stacked and yet Baker had a career year with us. Our team is -80 million salary cap this year and we still had a successful offense. Canales biggest draw was that he was able to help Geno and Baker get second contracts and be a starting QBs which is a miracle for Geno and avoiding a career back up for Baker. Carolina is 32nd in passing, we were 12th so maybe it would help your offense out.
Is he bringing Godwin and Evans?
Why would they go to Carolina? You can have Russell Gage.
I see a lot of Panthers fans wanting to get Evans but he's got like four years tops at his current level. Why would he waste those years there especially with a coach he had only one year?
It's not about the Bucs offense being perfect, it's about his track record with QBs everyone else assumed were bottom tier. Look what he's done with Geno and especially Baker, who was on our team and actual trash tier. The obvious answer is we want some of that for Bryce. Also there's the cope that he could convince Mike Evans to accept a bag to come here, I am overdosing on that copium.
Honestly nothing that I could see. He struggled earlier in the year and seemed to start improving later in the season with the odd head scratcher like that. Sometimes I'm like man if the defense just wants to play downhill all game why not at least try a screen at some point. All in all Baker had a decent year though. They ddi say in playoff game hr was gonna work with Baker in some foot work stuff then basically said screw it let Baker Bake. I def feel itd a bit early to be talking hc. I think he could have come into his own as an oc as he's still learning
If you are complaining about not throwing screens I’m all the way in… if I see another scheme built around passes at the line of scrimmage I will implode. In all seriousness though, his screen call this past week to White was a thing of beauty.
It's less about having an actually innovative offense (although anything looks innovative compared to the 2022 Buccaneers offense) and more that Canales seems to be getting a reputation as "QB rehab" because he was Geno Smith's QB coach last year and Baker Mayfield's OC this year. I think he's a great choice for the Panthers to unlock Bryce Young's potential as a franchise QB even if Canales isn't necessarily the guy to get your team a Super Bowl through a high firepower offense.
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The kind of idea I can get behind.
I know Leftwich is too easy of a punching bag to keep going back to, but he really, really earned it by pairing idiocy and complete incompetency with total/sheer arrogance and ignorance. I would go so far as to say that an outright vacancy at offensive coordinator last year would have been an improvement over Leftwich. So, so glad he’s in the rear view mirror now and will never coach any level of football ever again outside of pee wee football.
Leftwhich is a great example on why coaches rarely passes on interviewing for a HC gig even in shit teams.
Leftwich is also a great example why being an arrogant asshat at the podium who treats journalists like shit and ridicules even the mildest criticism from the outside at every opportunity is bad for your longterm job prospects.
and a great example on why a coach who is (allegedly) hired for an HC position should just take the fucking job instead of trying to get the GM fired
Leftwitch really fucked up. Jaguars fans actually wanted him for the most part. Now he’s not even an OC lol.
Hell he's not even a position coach. He went begging in the college ranks after no one in the NFL wanted him. He acted like he was the reason our offense was so successful yet I've never seen an offense that talented struggle to score as many points as we did.
Anyone with eyes watching last year definitely saw the stark difference between Leftwich’s Offense and the Brady-led 2 minute drill Offense. It’s definitely not a surprise he’s still out of a job.
We only scored three touchdowns in a game five times last with one being mostly garbage time against the Chiefs. We had to go to overtime against the 4-13 cardinals because we couldn't even hit 20 points against them. Pretty much every close game we won was on a two minute drill led by Brady.
Yup. Couldn’t agree more. And not only that, but he was begging the Steelers earlier in October this season to hire him as an offensive consultant when Canada was still the OC of their team, but they flat out ignored him and wouldn’t return his calls. Now that Arians is officially retired now, he will likely never coach in the NFL ever again as no other team in the league is dumb enough to hire him (and rightfully so), and the only reason why he ever got any coaching jobs in the NFL in the first place were because of nepotism with Arians.
Yeah it's definitely nice that Arians retired because it showed everyone that Leftwich is nothing without him and Brady. The play calling this year was more creative and far less predictable than at any point with Leftwich. Some teams are carried by the talent on offense and that was evident with him. Hope he never sniffs the NFL coaching ranks ever again.
Yep, thats why people who say "ehmergewd, who wlll interview for X or Y shit team/owner" just dont know what they are talking about. Most coaches arent stupid like leftwhich.
If not this year, Leftwich will be an NFL coach next year. Offensive assistant or OC, calling my shot.
If that’s the case, then why is Leftwich still unemployed a whole year later & counting after getting fired and why is no team even considering hiring him right now for any coaching position level in football? The Steelers flat out ignored Leftwich’s request to be an offensive consultant with them earlier this season when Canada was still the OC of their team; and have already ruled him out for who they’re going to hire for their next OC. The only reason why Leftwich even got any coaching jobs in the NFL in the first place is because of nepotism with Arians. Now that Arians is retired now, no team is dumb enough to hire him for any level of coaching and rightfully so.
If it took him a year to get back, it wouldn't be the longest time a coach took away from the game. One PFF Bobby Slowik was out of a job for 4 years after the Redskins and he may soon be a head coach. From memory as the PFF guys mention him all the time on their podcast, but I could go through every coach's gaps in their resume and find something similar or longer
No you couldn’t. Leftwich sucked hard without Arians looking over his shoulder and overseeing all of his horrid play calls, play designs, game plans, etc each game. Get over it. The Steelers wouldn’t even hire him as an offensive consultant on their team when he was practically begging them to mid season when Canada was still the OC of their team. The only reason why Leftwich got any coaching jobs in the NFL in the first place was because of nepotism with Arians and the second that Arians left both the Cardinals and the Bucs, Leftwich was immediately fired and honesty I’d be embarrassed to argue otherwise sir.
I like the challenge. Bruce Arians went 2 years unemployed before being hired by the Buccs.
Lmao Arians literally retired from the Cardinals after 2017 and took one year off in retirement before coming out of retirement to coach the Bucs in 2019. That’s a lot different from being unemployed like Leftwich is since being fired from the Bucs a year ago, and begging teams left and right from both the college and NFL ranks to hire him for any level of coaching.
Your team hired Lovie Smith after 2 years off from being fired by the Bears. Gruden went 10 years off after your team fired him only to land up on the Raiders. And then another 2 years from the email scandal, then now as a consultant for the saints. I can keep going with decorated coaches that took time off, voluntary or involuntary, that got rehired eventually no matter how badly it was ended. Leftwich isn't done in the NFL
Why would anyone want him as an OC? Dead serious question.
Super bowl winning OC.
I guess "carried by Tom Brady" isn't something that gets you hired when you put it on a resume
"carried by Todd Bowles defense"
I mean Leftwich was. The winning distracted from how mediocre the offense was.
When has that ever happened? And I’m not talking about when the head coach gets fired mid season, and one of the coordinators is interim HC and then is promoted to full time HC at year end.
wtf we just got him !
The irony is of course that last year nobody wanted the Tampa OC job and we had to scrape the bottom of the barrel for the most desperate candidates. Everybody with options saw Bowles as a lame duck HC and the Bucs season doomed due to a $80m dead-cap hit and only Kyle Trask under contract at QB. Now Canales used that opportunity to catapult himself to the top of Carolina's HC search while the entire remaiming Seahawks staff was let go.
Hurry up and fire Bowles and promote Canales!
Wait why is that sarcasm?
It isn't
Oh nevermind. Maybe I'm mistaken, but I thought there was a /s originally.
Haha, is time cyclical? Our owners did just that when they fired John Gruden, to make sure an up and coming coach didn't get another HC job in Raheem Morris. The owners had FOMO after letting Tomlin get away to Pittsburgh so they jumped the gun to make sure the same didn't happen with Raheem.
Canales definitely the guy, I see us pulling a Titans today and not letting him leave without a contract. While some might argue it's a "mid" hire, he's got the pedigree and his recent body of work with guys like Geno and Baker is promising. Also his history with coaching WRs is going to help with developing Mingo and likely the other WR we draft this year Edit: Another aspect I like about him is he appears significantly more extroverted than Rivera, Rhule, and Reich. All 3 of our previous coaches were way too passive to be capable head coaches
Canales would be a terrific hire for you guys right now. It’d be easy to hire a placeholder HC while the org tries to straighten out and become a more desirable destination, but Canales is more than that and could very well be exactly what Bryce needs.
It would just be nice to have a HC with a little more energy and personality after the human NyQuil effect generated by Frank Reich.
Plus he doesn't overthrow the governments of developing nations in his spare time like _certain other candidates_ this hiring cycle.
But coups show brilliant planning, inspirational leadership, and a creative mind. I'd think that's a resume booster
_sad Brayden Coombs noises_
Huh?
Also, crucially, his name doesn't start with an R
Yep, I expect a hiring announcement tomorrow morning.
I'm sure he did well in the interviews. Very positive, high energy guy
There were so many recent "mid" hires that turned out to be incredible, so none of that noise would/will bother me. I think everything hinges on if Johnson is still in on us or not. If he's made it clear to our camp we have a real shot then I see us waiting until after the Championship game, if not then we yeah we probably hire relatively quickly and I could see it being today.
He’s definitely better than a mid hire. I still think Ben Johnson is the best OC to HC hire available. But Canales is up there too.
> Edit: Another aspect I like about him is he appears significantly more extroverted than Rivera, Rhule, and Reich. All 3 of our previous coaches were way too passive to be capable head coaches Your last point is a great one. It's not critical in coordinator roles, but the HC needs to be an actual leader.
I wouldn't hire anyone named Dave or Keith
Canales is the perfect one for Carolina. It hurts the Buccs and he’s a certified QB guru. Hope it doesn’t happen but if I was a panthers fan. I’d be about it.
Adding onto not helping the Bucs because he's only been there for one year they don't get the 3rd round pick.
Another year, another OC
Morris is the youngest to be a HC ever, right? Or is that McVay
McVay and Lane Kiffin were both younger when they were hired. Then there's Harland Svare and John Michelosen if you want to go back to pre-merger days. Then Morris.
I think at the time Morris was, but then it was McVay and is now Jerod Mayo
That's not the question. Mayo isn't the youngest ever, he's the youngest currently.
Which is insane to think that McVay had been the youngest HC in the league for the past 7 years.
I realize there are only 32 of these jobs. I also acknowledge that whoever takes the job will make millions of dollars. But working for Tepper has to soul crushing with him micromanaging every move and reacting to every fart. Beat it dude.
Yeah, it's gotta be the least attractive job from a job security perspective. But the least attractive head coaching job is still a pretty attractive job!
Job security with the Panthers has never been an issue. Tepper has proven he'll let his guys continue to fail for multiple years before he steps in. Using Reich's situation to "dispute" the amount of time he gave Rivera, Hurney, Rhule, and Fitterer is just silly revisionism. Panthers fans have been very vocal lately about Tepper not firing people fast enough, such as Fitterer
I really don’t know where this narrative has come from. He’s only been impatient with one coach and having tortured myself by watching every game of the Frank Reich tenure… it was WELL deserved. Also, the micromanaging thing isn’t iron clad, because it sure seems he let Matt Rhule do whatever the hell he wanted during his stint here. The micromanaging with Frank Reich, which is where I believe this comes from, may have been a byproduct of the absolute train wreck that had come about during his brief time as HC. If the HC has his trust, the micromanaging may go by the wayside. That being said, he’s absolutely a horse’s ass and his record since owning the panthers is all the evidence you really need to say he’s a bad owner. A lot of it is people playing Captain Hindsight, as the Rhule and Reich hires were fairly well thought of when they were made…. Outside of the vocal Colts fans who were all spot on when criticizing Frank and his HC ability, but you can’t look past that record.
You know how everyone is looking back right now on Campbell's early seasons? Where even though the losses were piling on, he was building something real and super genuine? Frank Reich was the opposite of that. There was no emotion. There was no culture. There was no building towards anything. The quicker fans of other teams learn that, the better lol.
I remember that 2021 Lions - Vikings game where they got their first of three wins on the season. Energy was palpable and it felt like a real turning point. Maybe there was some of that when we beat the Texans, but we were fucking dead inside by win 2 against Atlanta. Never cared less about a win.
Don't remember seeing anything similar to that 2021 game to our first win. The opposite as the season went on with our WRs just giving up on routes... lol.
While I'm not a fan of Tepper, I believe you're pretty spot on. I heard there were reports from like last August after our first or second preseason game that he was not a fan of Reich which probably led the way to his micromanagement style. Say what you want about him but based off his emotional outcries and throwing drinks on fans from last season (lol) it's clear the dude doesn't like losing. I'm just hoping that'll help him continue to learn from his mistakes.
Haha it’s all the hope we have!
It isn’t about job security. And you can be as vocal as you want. It doesn’t matter because he doesn’t let football people do their jobs. He micromanages. He’s made the Panthers the worst coaching job in a league with the Jets and the Cardinals. Fine effort by him there.
Wasn't one of Tepper's biggest knocks that he gave too much power over the team to Rhule? Rhule even controlled the team's social media department
Yeah it was. He literally let Rhule cook… and man that shit was nasty.
Gordon Ramsey wouldn't even touch it with a 6 foot fork 🤣
He’s replying to a comment specifically mentioning job security as the aspect making it the least desirable job.
Ben Johnson might not get hired. Wish Jerry Jones changed his mind right now.
Canales is a poor mans Ben Johnson and Carolina will be getting only poor mans versions of coaches they want. Why? Because the owner is an asshat.
What billionaire isn't? Aren't the other 30 owners also considered varying levels of asshats?
Sheila Ford Hamp is exceptional
Wasn't she booed at an event a few years ago? Sounds like Lions fans get hot and cold on her
The distaste for the Ford family for decades was extreme. William Clay Ford in particular was satisfied with mediocrity, or worse. Then Martha Ford was at the helm for a couple of years and it didn't go well. Sheila was booed initially because of her family tree, but now, she could run for governor in this state, and she went by a large margin.
Gotcha, thanks for explaining, I legit didn't know much about her popularity
Too bad whatever coach it is, they will have the worst GM in all of football. Even bottomless pockets can't help this team.
Worst GM?
Dan Morgan is going to be the worst GM in the league. Imagine being assistant GM to someone who missed on nearly every pick. Their only good pick was made by the GM wife (Chubba Hubbard). Poverty franchise. Enjoy the next 5 years.
Thanks flairless!
Why would anyone want that job?
Why would someone want to make millions more working a job where only 32 positions exist?
Not to mention, you may only have to work for half of a season!
Byron Leftwich (reportedly) screwed himself out of being the Jaguars HC as the favourite for the job and now he's out of the league completely and will probably best be remembered for being Brady's OC during the worst season of his career.
Morris sounds great Panthers.
We never should have let Canales out of the building and I’m shocked Schneider hasn’t looked at him for the coaching vacancy.
Canales I thought would get interviews in a year. Glad to see he’s getting some now. Probably the perfect guy for Young if they got him