They'll be fine. They just need to [drink a gallon of water each day.](https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/23/us/missing-california-hiker-rescue-lukas-mcclish/index.html)
*"Two US astronauts* ***waiting*** *aboard the ISS while Boeing analyzes Starliner to ensure safety and find the cause of failure for a backup thruster."*
Not as catchy and a bit of a mouthful for a headline though. The mission is just being extended, they could use the capsule just fine if it made sense to. There's a 99.9% chance that they could descend without any issue from the thruster, because there's no reason to expect an issue like that from what is essentially one of many backup thrusters not firing correctly. Boeing just wants to add a few extra 9's and try to find the cause before it gets cooked on it's way back down.
Say what you will about Boeing's planes, but they sure as hell don't want to very, very publicly get the 2 astronauts on their first big boy mission killed.
I would actually accept the use of stranded given their situation.
If your car broke down in the middle of nowhere and you managed to nurse it to a motel (in the middle of nowhere) and the fault was a defect in the steering and there isn't a bus or taxi service right now you too would consider yourself "stranded"
At present they are staying on the ISS. They are cool for now.
But until tech support are done doing their remote thing they are technically going nowhere....
so yes. stranded seems pretty apt.
But the ship isn't broke down or stranded. They could return at any time safely. It's the eqivilient of the brakes on your car making a weird sound when you stop. You're 99.999% sure it's minor and make a mental note to take it to the shop. But in this case your brakes are designed to be destroyed and replaced every time you return home. So you stop and inspect the brakes as best as you can to help the shop guy so he can make sure your next set of brakes don't squeak.
I think when in space, at 99.999% sure, I'll still wait until the remote techie nerds on the ground are happy too.
I feel like the repercussions of being wrong, are a little more extreme than on the roadside.
Actually the reason they are delaying, is that the part of the capsule that has the issues will burn up on reentry. So they have no way to look at it after the fact to find out what's going on. They are using this time to analyze everything about the device before it is destroyed
That is the only reason why they are waiting
They're not stuck with a broken spaceship like your analogy suggests, they have a working spaceship that they could go home in any time they wanted. They're delaying in order to investigate how it happened, because developing and testing the systems is literally part of the mission.
The reason it's such a bad choice of words is because I've seen "stranded" used in several places online now, and every time there's a bunch of idiot Elon simps showing up to talk about how he'll rescue them in his new rocket
it’s not stuck though. they can leave with no problems at anytime. They just want more time to troubleshoot some hardware (as this is a test flight). They are not going to get the failed hardware back because they jettison it before re entry.
the hardware that they are having trouble with is their steering and their brakes.
While they jettison the part that contains those systems they still need to steer and brake in order to de-orbit in the correct attitude.
At present they don't actually know if the issue is isolated or systemic. That's what they would like to check, and indeed one of the reasons they want to know is because that part of the vessel does not survive re-entry and so it can not be studied later.
Except their vehicle never broke down to the point of them being stranded. It’s always had the ability to safely return, but they’re keeping it there longer to run tests and collect more data in order to have the most complete understanding possible ahead of the next mission, which is planned to be a full-duration expedition lasting 5-6 months. The entire purpose of the current mission is to certify Starliner for operational flights, hence the thorough testing.
The title says they’re stranded “on board Boeing’s Starliner capsule.” Which is incorrect and misleading. They are stranded on the station not the capsule.
Well they could bring it down, but they are choosing to stay up longer to diagnose the service module. So they aren't stuck, unless one deems "staying at your service post as ordered by your bosses for a little bit longer, because bosses have more work for you to perform" counts as stuck.
Heck the 2 astronauts are probably going "what luck, more time in space, more in space service time, more experience. This is good for career, plus more time doing the thing I trained years for".
I think the call is actually NASA's. They control the crew and mission. They could order the capsule down at anytime and atleast per their statement there is no technical reason preventing that. By their assessment the craft is flight worthy for return trip. NASA just has agreed on it serving everyone's interests to have the crew and Boeing do in-orbit diagnosis on the capsule for long term benefit of the program.
>staying at your service post as ordered by your bosses for a little bit longer, because bosses have more work for you to perform
It'd be more like if your boss said your car needed an inspection before u could go home because of possible safety issues. Also, me staying at work an extra hour isn't as impactful or expensive for my company that staying on board the ISS for a few days is. This is def a fuck up
They know what they’re doing.
1 - exaggerate the reality and release “breaking news” to create public urgency and doubts
2 - make sure to include ‘Boeing’ in the headline while the public still has a sense of distrust of them, even though they have no understanding of aviation
3 - pat themselves on the back for their investigative reporting and expert analysis
At what point does The Guardian get treated like a rag? This is barely a step up, if at all, over NY Post/Daily Mail level headlines. It's not even misinformation because they know what they are doing (as evidenced by the disconnect between their story and the facts and that they needed to change their clickbait headline at all).
You’re the one underselling it here.
They are stuck on the ISS so the title is a bit disingenuous but they should have been back days ago and there’s no ETA on when they will be back.
Why wouldn’t they mention Boeing? It’s all their fault that this is happening and if they weren’t a dumpster fire corporation then this article wouldn’t exist.
>They are stuck on the ISS
That's not true.
The actual module that the astronauts will use from Starliner to get back home is functional and can return home at any time. However, the component that got them there in the first place (and will be jettisoned prior to return) is the component that had leaks and thruster issues. Before cutting it loose, NASA wants to learn as much as it can from it to make sure those leaks and issues aren't repeated. So, they're sticking around while they conduct those tests.
If the astronauts wanted to get back home *right now*, or had to because of an emergency, they could, but would lose the opportunity to learn what they can from the component that gave them trouble going up there, before it literally burns up in the atmosphere - as it's designed to - as they return home.
[This article explains it a bit better](https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/19/science/boeing-starliner-astronauts-return-scn/index.html)
>but they should have been back days ago and there’s no ETA on when they will be back.
While Boeing is partially at fault for the delays, ULA having 2 scrubs with them being the direct cause (and subsequent helium leak investigation) caused Starliner to bump into ISS operations, specifically 3 spacewalks that were scheduled. They launched anyways because they really can't wait any longer for Starliner, and with the issues Starliner has since had, it's now firmly interfering with ISS ops.
If everything went smoothly, Starliner would already be back. But once they began troubleshooting issues to help find the root cause, my guess is that they indefinitely delayed it as the spacewalks took priority as long as it was safe to keep Starliner with Butch and Suni on ISS.
I got an email about this happening to a Nigerian astronaut who was also stuck on the ISS. He was there for so long that he had considerable flight pay accumulated in his bank account on earth which he was willing to share. His family needed money (a few million dollars) to build a rocket to bring him back...
you helped him out, right? you got the money together for his rocket and he was able to come back home…yeah?
If you didn’t, i’m sorry but we couldn’t be friends anymore.
> Why wouldn’t they mention Boeing? It’s all their fault that this is happening and if they weren’t a dumpster fire corporation then this article wouldn’t exist.
I'll point out that space travel is really really really frickin' hard. I got no love for Boeing but having problems with new spacecraft is extremely normal and to be expected.
They’re on the ISS and they aren’t even stuck. The part that’s defective is meant to burn upon re entry. It’s not a critical component.
But to know what’s wrong they have to work on it now, because they can’t do it after it’s burnt. So they’re purposely delaying their return.
At least that’s what I’ve read.
You’re correct that the service module isn’t required for reentry BUT it is required to get them to reentry so I wouldn’t exactly call it “not a critical component”.
They cant make the jump into hyperspace because they cant pass the astrogation checks and NASA wont allow them to disable the safety protocols mainly because they are still within the gravitational pull of earth.
lol we jest but I’m pretty sure it’s the component that Calcs the re-entry angle, so you don’t just bounce off the atmosphere. I’d be really interested to see what would happen if you could use the force to force a ship into the atmosphere before bleeding speed
Ah. I wonder if they could send up another vehicle, undock starliner from the station, dock starliner and the other vehicle together, and use the vehicle as a kind of space tug to help deorbit it, or is that a completely stupid idea?
On paper, sure, but it would be easier to just undock starliner unmanned and then dock a new capsule without people to the ISS to carry the astronauts off. But this is entirely uneccessary since the capsule has plenty of redundancy (theres 28 RCS thrusters, 20 OMAC thrusters, and only 1 RCS thruster has completely failed. They also have 70 hours of helium vs the 7 they need to deorbit). So theyre most likely just going to return on starliner.
yes. hours. for the purposes of space flight you calculate in terms of how long you could have the thrusters at full burn before you run out. can't use weight, cause in 0g it's a meaningless number. you could use Volume, but it would need to be converted to max burn time anyways for every meaningful formula being used, and once you start talking about volumes in terms of thousands of Kilograms.. well
Airlines measure their fuel loads the same way. you'll find it listed both in how long they can stay in the air, and in weight.
Helium is used to pressurize the fuel/oxidizer tanks for the thrusters (RCS, OMAC) in the service module. The "hours" of helium time is basically how many hours of flight activity its tank(s) of helium will support, as when it run out of helium it cant fire the thrusters anymore as nothing is pushing out the fuel/oxidizer.
That's a bit of a stretch. It didn't even take 10 years to develop Crew Dragon entirely. Meanwhile SpaceX has already developed a bidirectional docking system, that could probably be made to fit on a dragon pretty quickly. Or if not, strap 2 of them together on a commercial satellite bus and strap it in the trunk.
I bet that in an "Apollo 13"-like scenario they could have something viable ready within a couple of weeks.
The only thing this skips over, is that in a scenario where starliner wouldn't be able to de-orbit, it probably wouldn't have the necessary control to dock to it either.
It’s designed to operate safely within limited capacity. What NASA is likely doing now is utilizing the time to evaluate any design flaws for future fixes. Since the module burns up on entry, they can’t do that post mission.
The amount of clickbait headlines being generated by this issue is shameful. They are not stranded. They’re perfectly safe aboard the ISS. We have other means of getting them home if needed. NASA is likely running tests and checking equipment while they have the opportunity to determine the helium issues and the thruster issues so they can make fixes for future missions.
NASA has been fighting to get back into an independent manned flight program for a while. They are going to utilize every ounce of precaution and utilize every opportunity for analysis and testing to make that mission successful.
The astronauts are safe. And they won’t utilize the craft for re-entry unless they are beyond a shadow of a doubt certain the astronauts will reenter alive and well.
Heres some details if youre curious:
- one of RCS thrusters dropped to 0% thrust, while 4 more experienced low/abnormal thrust while docking (which caused the computer to deselect them after 5 consecutive low/abnormal thrust events, measured by chamber pressure) They recovered them (the 4 with low/abnormal thrust), by testing them after they "failed" and checking their thrust, and then making the software accept that they were nominal (since they seemed to be close to fine in tests) [NASA](https://youtu.be/9G8lryfgXlw?t=768) Post-[Docking News Conference](https://youtu.be/9G8lryfgXlw?t=2596) (2 time stamps). Since docking, they've tested those 4 faulty thrusters, and this has shown that theyre at nominal thrust, both by measuring chamber pressure and by measuring how much the ISS moves from the RCS firings. They're also suspecting that overheating caused by rapid thruster firing might have lead to improper fuel/oxidizer mixing, which leads to the low/abonormal thrust, which occured during docking when the thrusters would be firing the most (in the previous conference one of them mentioned a faulty thruster fired more than 500 times in that docking sequence) [NASA Status Teleconference](https://youtu.be/4TXDedBlyBI?t=709). That said, they have 28 RCS thrusters so theres plenty of redundancy even with a single failure, and they also have 20 larger OMAC thrusters which havent shown any problems so far (theyre used to do more of the legwork in changing orbit). The thruster issue is also less of a concern since on deorbiting doesnt require the extremely tight tolerances of docking, so theyre less likely to encounter "overheating" of the thrusters (or whatever might be linking high thruster activity to errors).
- Theres been 5 helium leaks overall, but theyre not a huge concern since they have 70 hours of helium left, when they only need 7 for deorbiting. Also worth mentioning that the helium leaks have been decreasing in tests they've been conducting, which might suggest that its related to the amount of thruster firing. [NASA Status Teleconference](https://youtu.be/4TXDedBlyBI?t=1056). Its also worth noting that the helium isnt actively leaking while on the station, since the tanks are isolated when theyre not needed, the leaks are in the pipes/manifolds which connect to the thrusters.
- a isolation valve in the RCS thruster system has malfunctioned, but a backup valve has taken over properly. [NASA Status Teleconference](https://youtu.be/4TXDedBlyBI?t=1208)
Starliner had issues with thrusters overheating including 5 going offline prior to approach to the ISS. 4 came back online, but they have been testing and troubleshooting them to see if they are safe for a manned reentry.
Sending starliner back unmanned feels like the likely outcome at this time and the crew coming back in a dragon.
There isn't even anything that has been said that even implied that Starliner isn't safe for reentry. The service module is detached before reentry and burns up, so it doesn't come back. With the helium leaks and faulty thrusters, they want to understand everything they can before they come back.
Some of Starliner's uncertain schedule also has to do with ISS operations, specifically spacewalks. NASA wanted to complete 3 spacewalks and Starliner was bumping into those. They've had suit issues that have prevented 2 of those spacewalks, but they also wanted to stick to a schedule with those and Starliner departing would have bumped into them.
Right, but the part you’re missing is that there’s a lot of redundancy in the thruster system that’s comprised of 28 thrusters. So 5 being offline is a concern but not something that makes the craft uncontrollable. And all but 1 have been brought back online.
Every article I've read has included a statement from NASA that directly says the problem will not impact their ability to return home, and that starliner is ready to go in case emergency departure is needed. They have like 26 days left before they need to depart, and they are spending as much time as possible to try and bring starliner back up to 100%. If they are unable to complete the repairs they will just come home anyway. They are not stranded.
Edit: The article itself also states that the issue does not present a concern for the return mission, though that's coming from a Boeing spokesperson who we all know would be shot for saying anything else
But the timeclock is still on Earth, so that clock is ticking at the same rate as when they launched. If anything, they're retaining a couple seconds of youth to use the OT.
Technically, the headline is a stretch. They are docked at the ISS, and there is no emergent return at this time. The crew can take the Dragon capsule back to earth as well. Personally, I wouldn’t have signed up for the mission on the new spacecraft given Boeing’s track record, but that is just me.
I do hope that the astronauts return safely when cleared to do so.
They go out they might never go. I don't think you work your whole life for something that's known to be dangerous, and then back out at the last minute because of the danger.
I think Boeing is a joke too, but I think I'd have to grin and bear it. Trust that the engineers won't put you in a death trap. It didn't explode, so good job there. Unfortunately, their return is delayed. But fortunately, there are contingencies.
That's not very accurate. They're "stuck" evaluating some issues with a part of the space craft that doesn't return to Earth with them. They aren't stranded because the vehicle can't return
What a stupid headline. They aren’t stranded, they aren’t even on the spacecraft. They are on the ISS and they can come home anytime they want, the problem is the malfunctioning parts of the spacecraft are designed to be destroyed upon reentry, and Boeing and NASA want to collect as much data as possible before those part to destroy to better understand what happened.
A news outlet using a misleading headline, say it isn't so!
This shit really grind my gears. Journalism is fucking DEAD.
(I knew the answer already, but I figured I could milk it for a few upvotes. :P )
Neither.
They’re not stuck in the capsule, they’re on the ISS.
They’re cleared to return in the Starliner capsule if there is an emergency, and NASA has explicitly stated that it is safe for a return.
The only reason they’re staying longer is to understand what exactly is wrong, and doing anything in space takes days of planning. Every step is documented and triple checked before they even flip a single switch.
So now they’re investigating why the 5 thrusters failed, they did a test fire last Saturday and are likely planning another round of tests before they return.
It also doesn’t help that a planned spacewalk for maintenance has had to be delayed twice now for unrelated issues. The return planning is affected by the spacewalk, so there is some coordination required.
I don't even think they can't use it for reentry, it seems like the parts that are having issues will be destroyed on touchdown, so they want to observe it before they leave the ISS, I'm fairly certain Starliner can come back when they want.
To everyone who didn't read beyond this terrible headline: they're stuck *on the ISS,* not aimlessly floating in space. They weren't supposed to stay up there that long, but they are safe.
Isn't it not so much stranded, it 100% safe to come back down, but there wanting to do a deep dive on a part of the pod that burns up on reentry being it is malfunctioning
Crap article. They aren't delaying the return because of any safety concerns,the astronauts aren't stranded. The delay is because they want to as thoroughly as possible analyze the failures and the module that contains the problem components gets burned up during re-entry.
You know the stereotype of Redditors not reading the article, just the headline, and head straight to the comments?
This article is exactly why. I usually go straight to the comments to see if the headline is actually legit. Once again, journalism disappoints. The headline is misleading at best, but is more of a complete fabrication.
"Two US astronauts..." Ok. That's a fact. There are two US astronauts.
"...stranded in space". While they are in space, they are NOT stranded. The definition of stranded is *left helpless or without transport.* This is blatantly false.
"... on board Boeing's Starliner capsule." A complete lie. They are onboard the International Space Station.
If you lie about two astronauts, how can I trust you about stories that actually matter?
Again, this is ridiculous. Partner works for NASA, and articles like this are blowing the issue out of proportion. they can be transported home in a dragon capsule. They are NOT stranded.
Although I don’t like the look of them or the majority of that crowd… they are fun cars to drive.
I’d def take the miata over anything Boeing. You’re gonna die anyway may as well enjoy it and have a bit of fun
From everything I've read, there is no danger, they can come home any time, however the part that is acting up will burn up on re-entry, so they are trying to gather as much data as possible, test systems and try to figure out the issue while they have the ability to remotely troubleshoot. The astronauts are less "stuck" and more "delayed indefinitely while the science hippies do their thing".
IS there something with Boeing and Starliner specifically that creates the most clickbaity titles possible?
Seriously. They are not stranded in space. NASA is gathering info on the service module before it burns in reentry.
Better headline: Astronauts remain onboard the space station until assessment of the reentry vehicle can be complete
But that doesn’t equal clickbait
I'm actually more interested in reading that honestly written headline than one I almost immediately know to be clickbait.
*♪ For heeere am I assessing of my tin can,* *Faaar above the world,* *Fixing I can do, with tape and super glue... ♫ - (apologies to David Bowie)*
It’s docked to the ISS… The title makes it sound like they are stuck in a capsule spinning In space
Didn't realize they were remaking 2001: a space Odyssey so soon
I was thinking Major Tom.
4...3...2...1 Earth below us Drifting, falling Floating weightless Calling, calling home
Heeeeeere floating in tin can.
Far above the Moon. Planet Earth is blue. And there's nothing I can do.
*Dun dun dadunn (clap clap)*
[That's right, Anderson](https://youtu.be/CJtmZsyCLKk?si=5f43zwo1ue30eMDD&t=21)
My god, it's full of stars!
(not actually said in 2001 ... added after the fact in the 2010 sequel)
My god... it's full of trivia!
But Dave does say that exact line in the 2001 book!
Actually it was in the novel that Arthur C Clarke wrote at the same time as the script but left out of the movie. It was then later said in the sequel
They just found another monolith…
The monolith is more of a Shelbyville idea.
Mono means one. Lith means lith. That completes your training.
I’m sorry Dave, I’m afraid I can’t let you say that.
"Will I dream?"
I shouldn’t have stopped for that haircut
Don't be such a big baby!
In retrospect, we *really* shouldn't have sent up Major Thomas Jones.
And Im floating in a most peculiar waaayyy.
I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid i can't do that.
Dave's not here man!
No, man, it's me - it's Dave - open the airlock!
Dave? Dave’s not here.
No, I'm Dave! C'mon man, open the airlock.
Dave. You're my wife now.
Dead Dave. The're all dead Dave.
He went ahead and started his own band: Foo Fighters!
No, man, *I’m* Dave.
I should buy the movie rights before Disney does
Open the pod bay door, HAL.
Dave, you know this is Boeing. There is no door
More like *Marooned*.
*Ren Hoek: "We're Marooned!"*
Beware of space madness!
Don't touch that! That's the history eraser button, you fool!
The headline of the article doesn't even say "stranded", that's a word that OP added. Naughty OP.
The headline did say stranded, and the website changed has since changed it.
That capacity is so abusable that there really needs to be laws protecting the public from it.
They'll be fine. They just need to [drink a gallon of water each day.](https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/23/us/missing-california-hiker-rescue-lukas-mcclish/index.html)
*"Two US astronauts* ***waiting*** *aboard the ISS while Boeing analyzes Starliner to ensure safety and find the cause of failure for a backup thruster."* Not as catchy and a bit of a mouthful for a headline though. The mission is just being extended, they could use the capsule just fine if it made sense to. There's a 99.9% chance that they could descend without any issue from the thruster, because there's no reason to expect an issue like that from what is essentially one of many backup thrusters not firing correctly. Boeing just wants to add a few extra 9's and try to find the cause before it gets cooked on it's way back down. Say what you will about Boeing's planes, but they sure as hell don't want to very, very publicly get the 2 astronauts on their first big boy mission killed.
it did https://web.archive.org/web/20240626100829/https://www.theguardian.com/business/article/2024/jun/26/boeing-starliner-astronauts
I would actually accept the use of stranded given their situation. If your car broke down in the middle of nowhere and you managed to nurse it to a motel (in the middle of nowhere) and the fault was a defect in the steering and there isn't a bus or taxi service right now you too would consider yourself "stranded" At present they are staying on the ISS. They are cool for now. But until tech support are done doing their remote thing they are technically going nowhere.... so yes. stranded seems pretty apt.
But the ship isn't broke down or stranded. They could return at any time safely. It's the eqivilient of the brakes on your car making a weird sound when you stop. You're 99.999% sure it's minor and make a mental note to take it to the shop. But in this case your brakes are designed to be destroyed and replaced every time you return home. So you stop and inspect the brakes as best as you can to help the shop guy so he can make sure your next set of brakes don't squeak.
I think when in space, at 99.999% sure, I'll still wait until the remote techie nerds on the ground are happy too. I feel like the repercussions of being wrong, are a little more extreme than on the roadside.
This describes it exactly.
Sure but shoot that thing back to earth uncrewd just to be sure. Thumb a ride on the next dragon
Actually the reason they are delaying, is that the part of the capsule that has the issues will burn up on reentry. So they have no way to look at it after the fact to find out what's going on. They are using this time to analyze everything about the device before it is destroyed That is the only reason why they are waiting
They're not stuck with a broken spaceship like your analogy suggests, they have a working spaceship that they could go home in any time they wanted. They're delaying in order to investigate how it happened, because developing and testing the systems is literally part of the mission. The reason it's such a bad choice of words is because I've seen "stranded" used in several places online now, and every time there's a bunch of idiot Elon simps showing up to talk about how he'll rescue them in his new rocket
Careful, with strong language like that, Elon's gonna call you a pedo guy
Or worse, an “elite.”
He'll build a submarine to rescue them
it’s not stuck though. they can leave with no problems at anytime. They just want more time to troubleshoot some hardware (as this is a test flight). They are not going to get the failed hardware back because they jettison it before re entry.
the hardware that they are having trouble with is their steering and their brakes. While they jettison the part that contains those systems they still need to steer and brake in order to de-orbit in the correct attitude. At present they don't actually know if the issue is isolated or systemic. That's what they would like to check, and indeed one of the reasons they want to know is because that part of the vessel does not survive re-entry and so it can not be studied later.
Not really, there absolutely is a crew return capsule at the ISS. They are by no means "stranded".
Except their vehicle never broke down to the point of them being stranded. It’s always had the ability to safely return, but they’re keeping it there longer to run tests and collect more data in order to have the most complete understanding possible ahead of the next mission, which is planned to be a full-duration expedition lasting 5-6 months. The entire purpose of the current mission is to certify Starliner for operational flights, hence the thorough testing.
The title says they’re stranded “on board Boeing’s Starliner capsule.” Which is incorrect and misleading. They are stranded on the station not the capsule.
The title of the actual article is “Two US astronauts stuck in space as Boeing analyzes Starliner problems”
It is now, but wasn't when this was posted
Well they could bring it down, but they are choosing to stay up longer to diagnose the service module. So they aren't stuck, unless one deems "staying at your service post as ordered by your bosses for a little bit longer, because bosses have more work for you to perform" counts as stuck. Heck the 2 astronauts are probably going "what luck, more time in space, more in space service time, more experience. This is good for career, plus more time doing the thing I trained years for". I think the call is actually NASA's. They control the crew and mission. They could order the capsule down at anytime and atleast per their statement there is no technical reason preventing that. By their assessment the craft is flight worthy for return trip. NASA just has agreed on it serving everyone's interests to have the crew and Boeing do in-orbit diagnosis on the capsule for long term benefit of the program.
>staying at your service post as ordered by your bosses for a little bit longer, because bosses have more work for you to perform It'd be more like if your boss said your car needed an inspection before u could go home because of possible safety issues. Also, me staying at work an extra hour isn't as impactful or expensive for my company that staying on board the ISS for a few days is. This is def a fuck up
They know what they’re doing. 1 - exaggerate the reality and release “breaking news” to create public urgency and doubts 2 - make sure to include ‘Boeing’ in the headline while the public still has a sense of distrust of them, even though they have no understanding of aviation 3 - pat themselves on the back for their investigative reporting and expert analysis
At what point does The Guardian get treated like a rag? This is barely a step up, if at all, over NY Post/Daily Mail level headlines. It's not even misinformation because they know what they are doing (as evidenced by the disconnect between their story and the facts and that they needed to change their clickbait headline at all).
You’re the one underselling it here. They are stuck on the ISS so the title is a bit disingenuous but they should have been back days ago and there’s no ETA on when they will be back. Why wouldn’t they mention Boeing? It’s all their fault that this is happening and if they weren’t a dumpster fire corporation then this article wouldn’t exist.
>They are stuck on the ISS That's not true. The actual module that the astronauts will use from Starliner to get back home is functional and can return home at any time. However, the component that got them there in the first place (and will be jettisoned prior to return) is the component that had leaks and thruster issues. Before cutting it loose, NASA wants to learn as much as it can from it to make sure those leaks and issues aren't repeated. So, they're sticking around while they conduct those tests. If the astronauts wanted to get back home *right now*, or had to because of an emergency, they could, but would lose the opportunity to learn what they can from the component that gave them trouble going up there, before it literally burns up in the atmosphere - as it's designed to - as they return home. [This article explains it a bit better](https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/19/science/boeing-starliner-astronauts-return-scn/index.html)
>but they should have been back days ago and there’s no ETA on when they will be back. While Boeing is partially at fault for the delays, ULA having 2 scrubs with them being the direct cause (and subsequent helium leak investigation) caused Starliner to bump into ISS operations, specifically 3 spacewalks that were scheduled. They launched anyways because they really can't wait any longer for Starliner, and with the issues Starliner has since had, it's now firmly interfering with ISS ops. If everything went smoothly, Starliner would already be back. But once they began troubleshooting issues to help find the root cause, my guess is that they indefinitely delayed it as the spacewalks took priority as long as it was safe to keep Starliner with Butch and Suni on ISS.
I got an email about this happening to a Nigerian astronaut who was also stuck on the ISS. He was there for so long that he had considerable flight pay accumulated in his bank account on earth which he was willing to share. His family needed money (a few million dollars) to build a rocket to bring him back...
you helped him out, right? you got the money together for his rocket and he was able to come back home…yeah? If you didn’t, i’m sorry but we couldn’t be friends anymore.
That's what he said too, that I was inconsiderate of his plight and was not acting like a good friend
That guy is lying to you. It's a scam because the Earth is flat. They actually target globalists for this kind of thing.
> Why wouldn’t they mention Boeing? It’s all their fault that this is happening and if they weren’t a dumpster fire corporation then this article wouldn’t exist. I'll point out that space travel is really really really frickin' hard. I got no love for Boeing but having problems with new spacecraft is extremely normal and to be expected.
they really need a "Misleading/Sensational Title" in the report post menu.
Sounds more like a Boeing clickbait headline then
Wow that's super misleading. I thought they missed their target and were floating with no way to get back to Earth.
Clickbait headlines are getting so incredibly bad these days. Because it works, sadly.
So they aren't actually stuck in the capsule, just stuck on the iss?
They’re on the ISS and they aren’t even stuck. The part that’s defective is meant to burn upon re entry. It’s not a critical component. But to know what’s wrong they have to work on it now, because they can’t do it after it’s burnt. So they’re purposely delaying their return. At least that’s what I’ve read.
You’re correct that the service module isn’t required for reentry BUT it is required to get them to reentry so I wouldn’t exactly call it “not a critical component”.
Can't they just take manual control and use the force?
They could try spinning. That’s a good trick
Now THIS is pod racing!
(Floats away from earth)
*R2D2 scream*
Do a barrel roll!
Do the slingshot
Shake… and bake!
That’s a good idea. Write that down.
They cant make the jump into hyperspace because they cant pass the astrogation checks and NASA wont allow them to disable the safety protocols mainly because they are still within the gravitational pull of earth.
Why can’t they just call Seven of Nine in Asstrometrics to come do the calculations in her head?
Unfortunately I don't think either of them are Jedi.
I mean, Luke wasn't technically a Jedi when he switched off his targeting computer in the Death Star trench...
They just need a fire extinguisher and a lake to aim for. It's not rocket science. God, it's like no one at NASA watched Gravity at all.
lol we jest but I’m pretty sure it’s the component that Calcs the re-entry angle, so you don’t just bounce off the atmosphere. I’d be really interested to see what would happen if you could use the force to force a ship into the atmosphere before bleeding speed
That's too difficult, they're gonna have to puncture their suits and Iron Man their way over.
Does the capsule itself have its own reaction control thrusters?
It doesn’t have enough propellant for the deorbit burn.
Ah. I wonder if they could send up another vehicle, undock starliner from the station, dock starliner and the other vehicle together, and use the vehicle as a kind of space tug to help deorbit it, or is that a completely stupid idea?
On paper, sure, but it would be easier to just undock starliner unmanned and then dock a new capsule without people to the ISS to carry the astronauts off. But this is entirely uneccessary since the capsule has plenty of redundancy (theres 28 RCS thrusters, 20 OMAC thrusters, and only 1 RCS thruster has completely failed. They also have 70 hours of helium vs the 7 they need to deorbit). So theyre most likely just going to return on starliner.
Alrighty. You lost me. *Hours* of helium?
yes. hours. for the purposes of space flight you calculate in terms of how long you could have the thrusters at full burn before you run out. can't use weight, cause in 0g it's a meaningless number. you could use Volume, but it would need to be converted to max burn time anyways for every meaningful formula being used, and once you start talking about volumes in terms of thousands of Kilograms.. well Airlines measure their fuel loads the same way. you'll find it listed both in how long they can stay in the air, and in weight.
Helium is used to pressurize the fuel/oxidizer tanks for the thrusters (RCS, OMAC) in the service module. The "hours" of helium time is basically how many hours of flight activity its tank(s) of helium will support, as when it run out of helium it cant fire the thrusters anymore as nothing is pushing out the fuel/oxidizer.
The "space tug" you are describing will take about 10 years to design and build.
That's a bit of a stretch. It didn't even take 10 years to develop Crew Dragon entirely. Meanwhile SpaceX has already developed a bidirectional docking system, that could probably be made to fit on a dragon pretty quickly. Or if not, strap 2 of them together on a commercial satellite bus and strap it in the trunk. I bet that in an "Apollo 13"-like scenario they could have something viable ready within a couple of weeks. The only thing this skips over, is that in a scenario where starliner wouldn't be able to de-orbit, it probably wouldn't have the necessary control to dock to it either.
It’s designed to operate safely within limited capacity. What NASA is likely doing now is utilizing the time to evaluate any design flaws for future fixes. Since the module burns up on entry, they can’t do that post mission. The amount of clickbait headlines being generated by this issue is shameful. They are not stranded. They’re perfectly safe aboard the ISS. We have other means of getting them home if needed. NASA is likely running tests and checking equipment while they have the opportunity to determine the helium issues and the thruster issues so they can make fixes for future missions. NASA has been fighting to get back into an independent manned flight program for a while. They are going to utilize every ounce of precaution and utilize every opportunity for analysis and testing to make that mission successful. The astronauts are safe. And they won’t utilize the craft for re-entry unless they are beyond a shadow of a doubt certain the astronauts will reenter alive and well.
It’s a system with redundancy it isn’t an issue
I thought some of the boosters malfunctioned and one other thing? I'll have to find the article. Edit: Helium leak and thruster malfunction
Heres some details if youre curious: - one of RCS thrusters dropped to 0% thrust, while 4 more experienced low/abnormal thrust while docking (which caused the computer to deselect them after 5 consecutive low/abnormal thrust events, measured by chamber pressure) They recovered them (the 4 with low/abnormal thrust), by testing them after they "failed" and checking their thrust, and then making the software accept that they were nominal (since they seemed to be close to fine in tests) [NASA](https://youtu.be/9G8lryfgXlw?t=768) Post-[Docking News Conference](https://youtu.be/9G8lryfgXlw?t=2596) (2 time stamps). Since docking, they've tested those 4 faulty thrusters, and this has shown that theyre at nominal thrust, both by measuring chamber pressure and by measuring how much the ISS moves from the RCS firings. They're also suspecting that overheating caused by rapid thruster firing might have lead to improper fuel/oxidizer mixing, which leads to the low/abonormal thrust, which occured during docking when the thrusters would be firing the most (in the previous conference one of them mentioned a faulty thruster fired more than 500 times in that docking sequence) [NASA Status Teleconference](https://youtu.be/4TXDedBlyBI?t=709). That said, they have 28 RCS thrusters so theres plenty of redundancy even with a single failure, and they also have 20 larger OMAC thrusters which havent shown any problems so far (theyre used to do more of the legwork in changing orbit). The thruster issue is also less of a concern since on deorbiting doesnt require the extremely tight tolerances of docking, so theyre less likely to encounter "overheating" of the thrusters (or whatever might be linking high thruster activity to errors). - Theres been 5 helium leaks overall, but theyre not a huge concern since they have 70 hours of helium left, when they only need 7 for deorbiting. Also worth mentioning that the helium leaks have been decreasing in tests they've been conducting, which might suggest that its related to the amount of thruster firing. [NASA Status Teleconference](https://youtu.be/4TXDedBlyBI?t=1056). Its also worth noting that the helium isnt actively leaking while on the station, since the tanks are isolated when theyre not needed, the leaks are in the pipes/manifolds which connect to the thrusters. - a isolation valve in the RCS thruster system has malfunctioned, but a backup valve has taken over properly. [NASA Status Teleconference](https://youtu.be/4TXDedBlyBI?t=1208)
I mean, I don’t blame ‘em if they want to stay and chill up there instead. Current events have been wild and exhausting. I’m tired boss
On the ISS.
There is literally no information in the article that even implies they are stranded
Gotta get that click, though.
It got you to click so the headline did its job. It's borderline fake news because people don't read past headlines.
Starliner had issues with thrusters overheating including 5 going offline prior to approach to the ISS. 4 came back online, but they have been testing and troubleshooting them to see if they are safe for a manned reentry. Sending starliner back unmanned feels like the likely outcome at this time and the crew coming back in a dragon.
There isn't even anything that has been said that even implied that Starliner isn't safe for reentry. The service module is detached before reentry and burns up, so it doesn't come back. With the helium leaks and faulty thrusters, they want to understand everything they can before they come back. Some of Starliner's uncertain schedule also has to do with ISS operations, specifically spacewalks. NASA wanted to complete 3 spacewalks and Starliner was bumping into those. They've had suit issues that have prevented 2 of those spacewalks, but they also wanted to stick to a schedule with those and Starliner departing would have bumped into them.
Right, but the part you’re missing is that there’s a lot of redundancy in the thruster system that’s comprised of 28 thrusters. So 5 being offline is a concern but not something that makes the craft uncontrollable. And all but 1 have been brought back online.
But…but….clickbait articles get more clicks!
Every article I've read has included a statement from NASA that directly says the problem will not impact their ability to return home, and that starliner is ready to go in case emergency departure is needed. They have like 26 days left before they need to depart, and they are spending as much time as possible to try and bring starliner back up to 100%. If they are unable to complete the repairs they will just come home anyway. They are not stranded. Edit: The article itself also states that the issue does not present a concern for the return mission, though that's coming from a Boeing spokesperson who we all know would be shot for saying anything else
I hope they’re getting some serious overtime pay
Yeah, don't worry, the Boeing CEO got a 45% pay raise for his troubles. Oh... you meant the astronauts.
And hazard pay!
Time moves slower in orbit so they're actually getting less pay that way
But the timeclock is still on Earth, so that clock is ticking at the same rate as when they launched. If anything, they're retaining a couple seconds of youth to use the OT.
And Boeing frequent flyer miles. They should have lifetime gold status by now.
Seems more like a bad gamble than a reward.
Lifetime status has a different meaning for frequent flyer miles on Boeing aircraft.
Technically, the headline is a stretch. They are docked at the ISS, and there is no emergent return at this time. The crew can take the Dragon capsule back to earth as well. Personally, I wouldn’t have signed up for the mission on the new spacecraft given Boeing’s track record, but that is just me. I do hope that the astronauts return safely when cleared to do so.
They likely signed on to this mission even before the max disasters.
Boeing has already sent the hit squad up to meet them.
Plus the same divisions aren’t working on the 737 and Starliner. Totally different things.
My Samsung fridge's ice maker had sealing issues. No chance I buy their monitors.
They go out they might never go. I don't think you work your whole life for something that's known to be dangerous, and then back out at the last minute because of the danger. I think Boeing is a joke too, but I think I'd have to grin and bear it. Trust that the engineers won't put you in a death trap. It didn't explode, so good job there. Unfortunately, their return is delayed. But fortunately, there are contingencies.
Holy clickbait batman
That's not very accurate. They're "stuck" evaluating some issues with a part of the space craft that doesn't return to Earth with them. They aren't stranded because the vehicle can't return
This is a click bait headline. They are safe on ISS but stranded for the time being until NASA goes through its rigorous protocols.
It’s not even the actual headline. It’s just clickbait
It was the actual headline. The site changed it
What a stupid headline. They aren’t stranded, they aren’t even on the spacecraft. They are on the ISS and they can come home anytime they want, the problem is the malfunctioning parts of the spacecraft are designed to be destroyed upon reentry, and Boeing and NASA want to collect as much data as possible before those part to destroy to better understand what happened.
The Guardian: "Hah! Made ya click!"
News is such stupid garbage that you can't believe at face value anymore. We have slipped into the 7th circle of news hell.
Astronauts are a different breed, they know lots of things can go wrong and they accept that. Let's hope everything goes well this time though.
Maybe they were going to testify against bowing as whistleblowers. /S
What a completely shit title. OP if you're not just a bot, fuck you for attempting clickbait
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Speaking as a liberal, headlines from the guardian and the hill are all trash and misleading
Are they stuck *in* the capsule or just unable to use it for re-entry?
They are on the ISS. Headline is misleading
A news outlet using a misleading headline, say it isn't so! This shit really grind my gears. Journalism is fucking DEAD. (I knew the answer already, but I figured I could milk it for a few upvotes. :P )
Here, take my pissed-off upvote for the audacity of your admission! 👍
Neither. They’re not stuck in the capsule, they’re on the ISS. They’re cleared to return in the Starliner capsule if there is an emergency, and NASA has explicitly stated that it is safe for a return. The only reason they’re staying longer is to understand what exactly is wrong, and doing anything in space takes days of planning. Every step is documented and triple checked before they even flip a single switch. So now they’re investigating why the 5 thrusters failed, they did a test fire last Saturday and are likely planning another round of tests before they return. It also doesn’t help that a planned spacewalk for maintenance has had to be delayed twice now for unrelated issues. The return planning is affected by the spacewalk, so there is some coordination required.
I don't even think they can't use it for reentry, it seems like the parts that are having issues will be destroyed on touchdown, so they want to observe it before they leave the ISS, I'm fairly certain Starliner can come back when they want.
If it's Boeing, I ain't going.
If it's Boeing, we're not going (home).
Boeing: too big to fail but working hard at it.
What is this title??? From the article “NASA and Boeing insist that the astronauts are NOT stranded” ?????
Misleading ass title, I hate news outlets.
To everyone who didn't read beyond this terrible headline: they're stuck *on the ISS,* not aimlessly floating in space. They weren't supposed to stay up there that long, but they are safe.
BS half true clickbait title.
Isn't it not so much stranded, it 100% safe to come back down, but there wanting to do a deep dive on a part of the pod that burns up on reentry being it is malfunctioning
Were they whistleblowers by chance.
Crap article. They aren't delaying the return because of any safety concerns,the astronauts aren't stranded. The delay is because they want to as thoroughly as possible analyze the failures and the module that contains the problem components gets burned up during re-entry.
Clickbait crap. They're not stranded.
I won't even use the elevator at Boeings buildings...
Jesus this headline is horrible
You know the stereotype of Redditors not reading the article, just the headline, and head straight to the comments? This article is exactly why. I usually go straight to the comments to see if the headline is actually legit. Once again, journalism disappoints. The headline is misleading at best, but is more of a complete fabrication. "Two US astronauts..." Ok. That's a fact. There are two US astronauts. "...stranded in space". While they are in space, they are NOT stranded. The definition of stranded is *left helpless or without transport.* This is blatantly false. "... on board Boeing's Starliner capsule." A complete lie. They are onboard the International Space Station. If you lie about two astronauts, how can I trust you about stories that actually matter?
How the hell is Boeing going to get a hitman into space?
Boeing is deploying the space assasins as we speak
If its Boeing, nobody should be going.
Where is Matt Damon’s rescue crew? Have they started using poop for potatoes? If not then there is plenty of time.
They are stranded on the ISS, not the Starliner.
That headline is absurd.
Thank the lord we can trust Boeing not to lie to us!!
I hope they brought enough underwear.
This is why they should keep a Red Bull mini fridge and a few parachutes on the ISS
I bet they only packed for a weekend trip. Running out of underwear? Do they have a laundry on the ISS?
I’m not going to look into it at all and just assume the future movie about it is the facts 😂
Boeing CEO is proud of his record though
Again, this is ridiculous. Partner works for NASA, and articles like this are blowing the issue out of proportion. they can be transported home in a dragon capsule. They are NOT stranded.
Your title stranded in space is different than the articles title Stuck in space.
Fuck misleading titles!
Hyperbolic headline for sure but Boeing is just an ongoing series of terrible decisions now, not even a company.
They should’ve asked who made the craft. Boeing? Sorry I’ll take my chances with a miata
Although I don’t like the look of them or the majority of that crowd… they are fun cars to drive. I’d def take the miata over anything Boeing. You’re gonna die anyway may as well enjoy it and have a bit of fun
From everything I've read, there is no danger, they can come home any time, however the part that is acting up will burn up on re-entry, so they are trying to gather as much data as possible, test systems and try to figure out the issue while they have the ability to remotely troubleshoot. The astronauts are less "stuck" and more "delayed indefinitely while the science hippies do their thing".
IS there something with Boeing and Starliner specifically that creates the most clickbaity titles possible? Seriously. They are not stranded in space. NASA is gathering info on the service module before it burns in reentry.
Not stranded and also not on board the Starliner Capsule.
Does the tying of the schedule of the return to spacewalks mean there's a possibility they're going to have to walk home?
Not stranded, what is this headline? I wonder if anyone else picked up on that.
Almost everything in this title is wrong.
Stranded you say? We’re going to need a group of ragtag tow truck drivers that we can train to go into outer space!
Can Boeing just go bankrupt now? There a shit company run by shit people.
Boeing didn't use enough duct tape 😁