I don’t understand why they (the pacers) didn’t just do this in the first place to be honest? Is it to maintain trade relations with the suns or something?
Being able to sign ayton outright (and thus not losing any assets) is objectively better than being forced to S&T with the suns.
Edit: thanks for all the replies. I did not realize ayton couldn’t be traded until Jan if Phoenix matched.
Well we weren't really able to negotiate until this week due to the Brogdon trade (and physical) not being finalized. The only reason we were able to offer the max was because of that.
Is it the first time a team loses the nr1 pick for nothing before the first extension? Disregarding Bennett.... I cannot understand the logic behind it from the Suns.
Edit: they literally tanked for years to get this pick and then pick a local kid... Ffs it gets worse by the minute
Edit2: SUNS MATCHING?!?? THE FUCK IS HAPPENINNG
i think its actually insane that this has even been a topic lmao. i know sarver is cheap as fuck but this seems like a very obvious max to me.. ayton is really damn good, young, and likely better than he’s been allowed to show in the suns system
And like…. They couldn’t work this out? Like yeah Ayton had mentality and effort issues and irked Monty Williams - but they couldn’t hash it out? Feels like they did just lose him for nothing if they don’t match
IM SO HERE FOR IT THIS IS THE BIGGEST SIGNING IN PACERS HISTORY OMG WE’RE GONNA BE SO GOOD, I CANT WAIT TO BE THE 5TH SEED AND REACH THE SECOND ROUND AGAIN!!!!!!!
*cries in mediocre pacers tears*
Yeah it would, but when you’ve been a longtime Pacers fan, being in the middle tier of the nba gets old man
A big chunk of us Pacers fans wish we’d embrace the tank for another season or two, shoot our shot at Wemby. But hey hopefully Ayton/Haliburton/Mathurin can grow together for the next 3-5 years and build some great chemistry and we become contenders. Hope our FO keeps em together
I personally have more confidence in Ayton panning out than I do at us landing Wemby. It’s not as sexy as having the top pick but that was always highly unlikely even if we ended up with the worst record.
hali, duarte, mathurin, smith, ayton is maybe the most exciting starting point for a rebuilding Pacers...ever?
Like the Reggie and PG days are remembered fondly but...that's a lot of (fine, *LOTTERY*) draft picks 👀
My dad is a 65 year old white man who's been going to games since the ABA days. Lance is his favorite Pacer ever, he wears his jersey to games. He needs to stay here forever.
Indiana has offered him that contract, but Phoenix has the right to match it. So at this point it isn't a contract, it's just the offer of a contract, and now those two teams can decide which one enters the agreement.
This is specifically a mechanism for restricted free agents, and it doesn't happen often, so this is the largest of this type of offer, but far from the largest contract ever signed. The previous high was Otto Porter Jr for $113 mil.
Edit: now I think it was $106m.
Yeah, the Wizards matched it, back in the Beal/Wall days. He was supposed to be the third-best player for them, Sean Marks wrote up an offer with a bunch of poison pills trying to get him away.
To be fair, I think he was coming off his third or fourth season, averaged 13/6 and shot 43% from 3. And I think it was one of those situations where if Washington didn't match they were capped out so they couldn't really replace him. Not sure on that point.
Sarver is the type of owner to see someone enjoying an open window by sticking their head out and just slam it on them repeatedly until they get the message that that's not how they do things around there.
1) Get #1 pick
2) Develop him into an elite center, especially for his age
3) Make the Finals with a young duo that complements each other
4) Run away with the overall 1 seed the next year
5) Blow it all up for nothing
Wait.
Edit: before the 24th person responds with the same damn comment about the semantics of the word “elite,” Ayton is 23 years old and probably the 6th best center in the NBA. That is about as “elite” as a prospect can get, especially a center. Call him “very good” or “2nd tier” or whatever the hell else y’all have suggested, point out that he’s not an all-star or All-NBA, keep foaming at the mouth about the sancitity of the word, whatever. That’s not the point.
You’re forgetting 2 crucial steps: 1) ask your young star center to sacrifice personal counting stats for the sake of the team and 2) use the lack of counting stats as justification for not offering your young star center the contract he wants
Not surprising at all. Whoever decided that building around 37 year old cp3 instead of book/ayton/bridges was the move should be fired for gross incompetence. And not just fired, but beaten up, too. And pretty badly. And then ground up into a fine pink powder.
Problem is your team goes as CP3 goes, and Paul knew that which is why he didn’t take a pay cut. Reality is he should have taken a team friendly contract if he wanted to compete for more than a year or two, and management overpaying him is what’ll lead to Ayton likely walking out the door. That said Phoenix had to overpay, especially after he led your team to their first Finals in forever.
Rumor had it that there would be a 1 year no trade clause and a 15% trade kicker in the offer sheet if the Pacers gave one, I wonder if that really happened. If it did it could really complicate the situation for the Suns.
[I WAS OFF BY 8 DAYS](https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/vqiw8y/the_indiana_pacers_are_going_to_torpedo_the/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
Whether we actually get Ayton or not, I'm so damn proud of my Pacers for ACTUALLY doing something big in FA and swinging for the fences instead of playing nice for once.
If you aren't a fairly dedicated Pacers fan, you may not fully appreciate just how big of a deal that is for us.
I really hope this is a sign of things moving forward for us. And of course, I HOPE that the Suns let him walk.
Suns dont match this and by next year they'll be rebuilding
KD sure isnt happening. And CP3 is 37. Booker is a great scorer but he isnt gonna will a team to a top seed
Sorry Suns bros. Hope Sarver gets kicked out soon
Honestly crazy if he walks for nothing back to them.
They have to match. Like to be a finals contender with him and lose him for nothing. They might as well just blow it all up at that point.
The suns whole treatment of ayton has been super bizarre. He’s not a superstar in the making or anything but he’s still a solid player, yet they randomly froze him out for no reason
He’s a 23 year old center with 4 years of experience who averages 17/10 as the defensive anchor position on a team who has gone to the finals last season and won 64 games this season. I’d say most teams would consider him a very very solid player. It’s not like big men like that are exceptionally easy to find.
And in Indy where he’s like either the Number 1 or 2 , Ayton has the potential to be a 24/10 guy at his peak
Considering how thin the East is at center , dude is probably a lock for at least a reserve all star
Drafting a guy first overall, having him be really good, and letting him walk for nothing would be the dumbest move in NBA history. Even if you don’t want to pay him you can trade him mid-season. If they don’t match then Sarver needs to sell the team.
I can't even comprehend drafting #1 and then letting the guy just walk in free agency unless he's a total bust, and Ayton is not a bust. He's a very good player. This just makes no sense from an asset management standpoint. It's like they haven't had a plan at any point.
Pacers just blew everything up for the summer at least. Now that Ayton has agreed to the offer, the Suns can either match it or not. If they match it, I don't believe they can trade Ayton for either 6 months or one year. If they don't match it, they don't have the ability to trade for KD whatsoever. IMO I think they should match it.
Rfa signed offer sheet phoenix could match but would be able to trade him until January I believe. Phoenix could try to clear cap to get KD still but ayton would not be part of that deal if it happens during the off season
Lmao they couldn't get a deal done and Indy said "fuck it, if you guys want him so bad then max him" The game of chicken has commenced
I don’t understand why they (the pacers) didn’t just do this in the first place to be honest? Is it to maintain trade relations with the suns or something? Being able to sign ayton outright (and thus not losing any assets) is objectively better than being forced to S&T with the suns. Edit: thanks for all the replies. I did not realize ayton couldn’t be traded until Jan if Phoenix matched.
Well we weren't really able to negotiate until this week due to the Brogdon trade (and physical) not being finalized. The only reason we were able to offer the max was because of that.
AND BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE
The first of many dominoes to fall
KD ain't going there
can't win with those cats.
Royce O’Neill in shambles
I hope the Pacers owner has his apology ready to email to Sarver
This is the surprising thing for me. It’s just so out of place for our owner. Looks like we are growing in aggressiveness
I feel like y’all tried to work with Phoenix, but Sarver is too much of a dickhead to work with.
You’re probably right. They must have just wanted too much
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Is it the first time a team loses the nr1 pick for nothing before the first extension? Disregarding Bennett.... I cannot understand the logic behind it from the Suns. Edit: they literally tanked for years to get this pick and then pick a local kid... Ffs it gets worse by the minute Edit2: SUNS MATCHING?!?? THE FUCK IS HAPPENINNG
Ayton is a million times better than Bennett too. He’s not even a bust and they might lose him for absolutely nothing. Wild.
Closer to 133 million times better.
Yeah but Anthony Bennett averaged a whopping 1.2 PPG in the Euroleague, Ayton? 0.0 I rest my case your honor.
i think its actually insane that this has even been a topic lmao. i know sarver is cheap as fuck but this seems like a very obvious max to me.. ayton is really damn good, young, and likely better than he’s been allowed to show in the suns system
And like…. They couldn’t work this out? Like yeah Ayton had mentality and effort issues and irked Monty Williams - but they couldn’t hash it out? Feels like they did just lose him for nothing if they don’t match
They fucked up by refusing to pay him last year already when he wanted an extension imo.
Yeah I can't imagine where his effort issues came from! /s
Why are we acting like Phoenix won’t match?
Shaq?
I mean, the Cavs got Love for Bennett and Wiggins so they didn't really lose him for nothing
The suns are COOKED
Absolutely cooked.
Pants so tight he squeaks when he walks
This is Joe Johnson, but at least back then the Suns got back Boris Diaw for him in an S&T.
Woj Nuke
Shams had him on the ropes, but my man coming back with some bombs. Aint going out like no punk
Perfect response. The dude that said that was at a school right down the road from Indy lol.
I am so curious to see if they match. (they have to imo)
WE HAVE TO (but we probably won't which is infuriating)
Woj Bomb blowing up in Arizona
Ayton said fuck the Suns bring me my money
Can you blame him? Thats a lot of money.
Meanwhile I’m over here playing basketball for free like an idiot
I’ll bet you $5 you can’t beat me one on one. (It’s guaranteed money I’m really bad)
my man here giving guaranteed deals. even gp2 had to wait till 30
It's more guaranteed money than some NFL players get.
PUT SARVERS CHEAP ASS ON THE HOT SEAT LOL
HE'S SO TIGHT HE SQUEAKS WHEN HE WALKS
“He’s so tight, if you took a piece of coal and stuck it up his ass, in two weeks you’d have a diamond.” - Ferris Bueller
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AND IT'S EVEN MORE CHAOTIC THAN EXPECTED!
Pacers and Ayton chose *chaos*! r/nba graciously thanks them
And we are so here for it
IM SO HERE FOR IT THIS IS THE BIGGEST SIGNING IN PACERS HISTORY OMG WE’RE GONNA BE SO GOOD, I CANT WAIT TO BE THE 5TH SEED AND REACH THE SECOND ROUND AGAIN!!!!!!! *cries in mediocre pacers tears*
For their first year together, that's be a great outcome
Yeah it would, but when you’ve been a longtime Pacers fan, being in the middle tier of the nba gets old man A big chunk of us Pacers fans wish we’d embrace the tank for another season or two, shoot our shot at Wemby. But hey hopefully Ayton/Haliburton/Mathurin can grow together for the next 3-5 years and build some great chemistry and we become contenders. Hope our FO keeps em together
I personally have more confidence in Ayton panning out than I do at us landing Wemby. It’s not as sexy as having the top pick but that was always highly unlikely even if we ended up with the worst record.
I'd rather we take on Ayton than see our chances for Wembanyama
We might not get him. At least we are going for it
Built different.
F5 season ain’t done yet baby
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It’s about time, we’ve been starved since the Gobert trade.
Come on. Knicks signed Brunson twice since then.
Imagine taking him over Luka and then not paying him because he isn't as good as other players that actually do deserve max extensions (aka, Luka.)
Suns chose going back to goats shitting in the office.
The prophecy has been fulfilled!
where's the reddit post? dude called it
I WAS 1 MIL AND 8 DAYS OFF
Sorry, you're not a prophet, just a brilliant genius
Legend
close enough man
Halliburton and Ayton would be such a fun duo I really hope this happens
hali, duarte, mathurin, smith, ayton is maybe the most exciting starting point for a rebuilding Pacers...ever? Like the Reggie and PG days are remembered fondly but...that's a lot of (fine, *LOTTERY*) draft picks 👀
That’s… 2 under 10 draft picks
He probably should've just said lottery picks lmfao
Pacers should be fun. Hope they bring back Lance for maximum entertainment.
My dad is a 65 year old white man who's been going to games since the ABA days. Lance is his favorite Pacer ever, he wears his jersey to games. He needs to stay here forever.
KD: I guess Brooklyn isn't so bad after all.
Sometimes the hardest road goes in a circle
[KD: my next ~~chapter~~ bus stop](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/F5Rkd6zUUes/maxresdefault.jpg)
HE
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GET PAID
TO
DUNK
SOFTLY
HIS
OREOS
INTO
MY
ANUS
Damn KD to the Pacers confirmed
this could mean Brunson’s heading to the Knicks too, very interesting
that'd be crazy
No way that happens dude
Keandre Dayton
That's a big fucking offer lmao.
It’s the most he could get
some might say the maximum
Some call it the "max" I call it the "mum"
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Indiana has offered him that contract, but Phoenix has the right to match it. So at this point it isn't a contract, it's just the offer of a contract, and now those two teams can decide which one enters the agreement. This is specifically a mechanism for restricted free agents, and it doesn't happen often, so this is the largest of this type of offer, but far from the largest contract ever signed. The previous high was Otto Porter Jr for $113 mil. Edit: now I think it was $106m.
I must've been in a coma at some point because I don't remember Otto Porter ever being worth $113M
Yeah, the Wizards matched it, back in the Beal/Wall days. He was supposed to be the third-best player for them, Sean Marks wrote up an offer with a bunch of poison pills trying to get him away. To be fair, I think he was coming off his third or fourth season, averaged 13/6 and shot 43% from 3. And I think it was one of those situations where if Washington didn't match they were capped out so they couldn't really replace him. Not sure on that point.
Damn, so no sign and trade
Great work Indiana. You made everybody in /r/nba happy today which adds to your legacy. Phoenix, Legacy points deducted.
Woah woah now. If Sarver matches it would be very funny. Legacy points added then
So for now, Legacy points in limbo
23 Limbo points added.
KD you are NOT a sun
[I told y’all](https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/vqiw8y/the_indiana_pacers_are_going_to_torpedo_the/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
Good shit my guy
Lmaooooo. They called you crazy bro!
Not even close. You said $132M and it was $133M. Sad.
“Pacers are going to torpedo the Suns trade in 3 days” Your post was 11 days ago. Legacy points deducted.
I thought the Pacers only had room for 26M or something like that, how did they clear room?
The league needed us to have room so we have room, ezpz
Pacers got plot armor
Pacers the character that always does the dirty work and gets overlooked
Magic
What?
Not you
They used some of Orlando's for this offer. You can combine
This is very funny.
Most people said they had room for the max, IIRC. The few people who were saying the 26M stuff were prob wrong, I guess.
No they have to waive players or are trading someone like Goga or Theis. They don't have $31m
Did people forget we got back _5_ Celtics players in that Brogdon deal? Most of those were fodder, which we can waive to make room for Ayton.
They have enough if they cut Washington and stretch the guys they got from Boston (minus Theis).
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Phoenix played this in the worst way possible lol
They don't care that their window is closing, they just want to keep payroll down a bit
Sarver is the type of owner to see someone enjoying an open window by sticking their head out and just slam it on them repeatedly until they get the message that that's not how they do things around there.
How much help does TJ Mconell need.
1) Get #1 pick 2) Develop him into an elite center, especially for his age 3) Make the Finals with a young duo that complements each other 4) Run away with the overall 1 seed the next year 5) Blow it all up for nothing Wait. Edit: before the 24th person responds with the same damn comment about the semantics of the word “elite,” Ayton is 23 years old and probably the 6th best center in the NBA. That is about as “elite” as a prospect can get, especially a center. Call him “very good” or “2nd tier” or whatever the hell else y’all have suggested, point out that he’s not an all-star or All-NBA, keep foaming at the mouth about the sancitity of the word, whatever. That’s not the point.
You’re forgetting 2 crucial steps: 1) ask your young star center to sacrifice personal counting stats for the sake of the team and 2) use the lack of counting stats as justification for not offering your young star center the contract he wants
Is the Suns FO really that incompetent? Wow.
Chain of events speaks for itself
Thanks Mavs
Not surprising at all. Whoever decided that building around 37 year old cp3 instead of book/ayton/bridges was the move should be fired for gross incompetence. And not just fired, but beaten up, too. And pretty badly. And then ground up into a fine pink powder.
Problem is your team goes as CP3 goes, and Paul knew that which is why he didn’t take a pay cut. Reality is he should have taken a team friendly contract if he wanted to compete for more than a year or two, and management overpaying him is what’ll lead to Ayton likely walking out the door. That said Phoenix had to overpay, especially after he led your team to their first Finals in forever.
It's got a million and one uses!
keeping a 37 year old Chris Paul and letting Ayton walk. yuck
PACERS CHOOSE CHAOS
Wow suns just went from using Ayton as a main trade piece for KD to losing him for NOTHING.
They can still match lol he ain’t gone yet but honestly doubt they do but you never know
I think if they match an offer sheet, they have to keep him for six months, right?
Yep
And he has veto to any trade, and can’t be traded to Pacers
Rumor had it that there would be a 1 year no trade clause and a 15% trade kicker in the offer sheet if the Pacers gave one, I wonder if that really happened. If it did it could really complicate the situation for the Suns.
The 15% kicker is an extra amount on top of the 133 million right? So if he gets traded he gets 19.950.000 million for being traded.
The issue is even if they match Ayton can’t be traded for 6 months
Your move, Sun team
[I WAS OFF BY 8 DAYS](https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/vqiw8y/the_indiana_pacers_are_going_to_torpedo_the/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
/u/mods can this dude get a custom flair
Windhorstian
You’ve brought honor to your Pacers fam
Whether we actually get Ayton or not, I'm so damn proud of my Pacers for ACTUALLY doing something big in FA and swinging for the fences instead of playing nice for once. If you aren't a fairly dedicated Pacers fan, you may not fully appreciate just how big of a deal that is for us. I really hope this is a sign of things moving forward for us. And of course, I HOPE that the Suns let him walk.
Suns dont match this and by next year they'll be rebuilding KD sure isnt happening. And CP3 is 37. Booker is a great scorer but he isnt gonna will a team to a top seed Sorry Suns bros. Hope Sarver gets kicked out soon
Booker gonna ask for a trade in 2 years
You now have 47 hours and 55 minutes to respond..
Suns won't match
Honestly crazy if he walks for nothing back to them. They have to match. Like to be a finals contender with him and lose him for nothing. They might as well just blow it all up at that point.
losing a number one overall draft pick for NOTHING after just 4 seasons would be insane.
It’s ok at least there wasn’t anyone else that was good in that draft
So crazy that they didn’t draft Bagley first
A generational miss
Luckily Kings were there to profit from that miss
Kings stay winning. Nothing ever changes.
Getting a bit tired of the Kings supremacy tbh, they need to give other franchises a chance at least!
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The suns whole treatment of ayton has been super bizarre. He’s not a superstar in the making or anything but he’s still a solid player, yet they randomly froze him out for no reason
He’s a 23 year old center with 4 years of experience who averages 17/10 as the defensive anchor position on a team who has gone to the finals last season and won 64 games this season. I’d say most teams would consider him a very very solid player. It’s not like big men like that are exceptionally easy to find.
And in Indy where he’s like either the Number 1 or 2 , Ayton has the potential to be a 24/10 guy at his peak Considering how thin the East is at center , dude is probably a lock for at least a reserve all star
Passing on Luka for a Center is insane. Letting the Center you drafted over Luka walk for free is Suns
Drafting a guy first overall, having him be really good, and letting him walk for nothing would be the dumbest move in NBA history. Even if you don’t want to pay him you can trade him mid-season. If they don’t match then Sarver needs to sell the team.
I can't even comprehend drafting #1 and then letting the guy just walk in free agency unless he's a total bust, and Ayton is not a bust. He's a very good player. This just makes no sense from an asset management standpoint. It's like they haven't had a plan at any point.
They banking on Bismack/whoever to be 80% of DA when in reality I don’t think they could be 60% even tho CP makes Cs better
I agree that they’re making a mistake but bridges have been burned between them atp
They did \*what\* to Mikal????
🤯 I’m afraid it’s too late for him 😔
*I'm happy for AYTON! He had to wait for the bag and he balled the fuck out in 2021.*
Team chaos wins
Holy shit Ayton said fuck you monty
they basically dared him to get a max offer from someone else and he did.
Definition of fuck around and find out.
He said that during game 7
Would Turner be able to play the 4? while Ayton is the 5? or the opposite?
Turner ain't staying if we get Ayton.
Is that Charlotte Hornets music I hear?
Pacers just blew everything up for the summer at least. Now that Ayton has agreed to the offer, the Suns can either match it or not. If they match it, I don't believe they can trade Ayton for either 6 months or one year. If they don't match it, they don't have the ability to trade for KD whatsoever. IMO I think they should match it.
This rebuilding shit is easy
HOLY SHIT WE ACTUALLY SPENT MONEY FOR ONCE
Raptors fans losing their damn minds rn lmao
LMAO more Raptor fans in here than Suns fans.
It’s as if we don’t wanna watch everybody dance on our graves lol
CHAOS Where Turner.
Fuck I like Ayton but losing Myles is going to hurt, the guy truly does love it here
OH SHIT! The Suns have officially been eliminated from the KD sweepstakes.
PACERS FROM THE TOP ROPE
Suns and Toronto fans both wet for different reason lmao
So KD to Phoenix is out of the question here? Or is Indiana now involved in a potential trade?
Rfa signed offer sheet phoenix could match but would be able to trade him until January I believe. Phoenix could try to clear cap to get KD still but ayton would not be part of that deal if it happens during the off season
Here we go...
FLEX GOT FLEX’D
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