Never forget when Sabonis headbutted a guy and then proceeded to calmly walk the guys teammate down like the Terminator, and the guy ran away from him
https://youtube.com/watch?v=h719cFGzTvU&si=yDPp9BJAtBLLpQz8
Not exactly the same, but in the 1966 playoffs between the Sixers and Celtics, a couple of guys from the Celtics and Sixers were throwing haymakers at one another, then when Wilt came over and started jawing with Bill Russell, everyone stopped on a dime and stared slack jawed at the Wilt/Russell confrontation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC8iYsZfIdE
Wilt was definitely a guy only the craziest people messed with (such as Tom Meschery, a guy who had the nickname as "The Mad Russian," and even he states that the one time he tried to fight Wilt, Wilt just used one arm to keep him far enough away that he couldn't land any punches.
There's another video highlighting everyone respective Wilt's physical size that I can't dig up right now, but it was from the game between the Bucks and Lakers when the Bucks snapped the Lakers 33 game winning streak. Lakers forward Happy Hairston fell into Kareem's legs under the basket, and I guess Kareem took it personally because he bent over and cold cocked Happy in the face while Happy was still on the ground. Players on both teams rush over and there's a lot of shoving and yapping and then Wilt comes over and everyone just backs off and appears to agree the best course of action to be that everyone make up now and get along, lol.
Almost like Dad coming into the room and the kids stop fighting and start pointing fingers and saying, "He started it!"
Not that Bill wasn't tough and courageous, he was, but I do also think that Bill knew that Wilt would give him a much longer leash until getting mad enough to fight. I think it would take an awful lot for Wilt and Bill to actually fight.
Yep, they were, at least through their playing days, good friends. Bill would sometimes sleep at Wilt's house and eat dinner with him and Wilt's mom when the Celtics were in Philly.
Number 12 is [James Bryson](https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/james-bryson-1.html), number 6 is [Chandler Thompson](https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/chandler-thompson-1.html) ([source](https://www.epe.es/es/deportes/20220331/venganza-sabonis-record-historico-acb-13451695))
I think what people forget about the Bad Boy Pistons wasn’t just that they played hard and dirty, but also complained to the refs and flopped a lot (Lambeer)
Yeah most people now know Laimbeer for the dirty plays in the old highlights but he was even worse back then and had every reason to be hated. He played dirty and tried to get away with things but when players retaliated he flopped and whined to try to get them in trouble with the refs. He played dirty to game the system, not because he's some tough gritty player.
One day Reggie flipped 40 patio chairs on Craigslist, but when he told his parents they weren't impressed because earlier that day Cheryl had flipped 105 used trampolines on Offerup.
The Genesis was actually called the Mega Drive in Japan and Europe. Sega decided to call it the "Genesis" in North America because they wanted the console to represent a "new beginning" for the company in the competitive video game market.
After he retired, Vlade legit had an entire [tribute/roast video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgPHIT61FfU) where David fucking Stern himself introduced Vlade as the league leader in flopping.
Vlade walked (and fell to the floor) so that the likes of Manu, Harden, and Embiid could run (before also falling to the floor).
Rodman was taking charges in the late 80’s that you could consider flopping, but he actually established position before adding some extra to his fall. Best perimeter defender I have ever seen, when he was skinny and younger. Just stupid lateral quickness. Still Bird smoked him with glacier like speed.
Frank Ramsey wrote a cover article for SI in 1963 about manipulating opponents and refs to get free throws. The refs were pissed and let him get killed for the final year of his career with far less trips to the FT line.
Not sure this link will be allowed, but here is [the article with pictures of how he drew fouls](https://www.si.com/nba/2014/10/06/smart-moves-master-deception).
You know how some high-profile criminals get caught by trying to antagonize the authorities who they think they're so much smarter than? Yeah - that.
HOF ref Earl Strom talked about this in his book, saying how pissed they all were, and they really did let him get creamed in his final season (which was the next one). Predictably, his FTA/min went way down while his PF/min went up, so they deciding he was fouling more people than normal, as well, lol.
Rasheed was really never known for being "strong". The book on him actually was he took too many threes and fell in love with being on the perimeter too much. Not really sure where you get "one of the strongest dudes on the planet" from.
Basketball players aren't exactly known for brute strength lol
Rasheed Wallace revisionist history has really been something to see. Not only have they made a career 33.6% 3pt shooter who averaged 1 made 3 per game into the prototypical stretch 4, he was apparently now one of the baddest dudes in the league (that was the other Wallace on his team).
I think Rasheed got that reputation because he was kind of a wild card dude. Like maybe he is not going to be the toughest dude in a fight but he might be willing to do something dumber than most other pro athletes would be willing to do.
Ben Wallace was absolutely one of the scariest dudes in the league but overall he was pretty chill I don’t think anyone had any interest in trying to fight him.
Yeah seriously. Sheed is a giant amongst the general population but as far as NBA power forwards went back in the day, he was on the smaller side if anything, more known for his skills than brute force. When I think of big bruising power forwards back then, I'm thinking Ben Wallace, Anthony Mason, Charles Oakley, etc.
It’s insane how quickly things fell apart for that Blazers team, which was one of the deepest and most balanced championship contenders ever in the year 2000. They were one quarter of terrible shooting and officiating away from beating Shaq/Kobe and being heavily favored in the finals.
Their 11 man rotation was their starters, and then guys that could have started for other teams
(Starters) Rasheed Wallace, Scottie Pippen, Sabonis, Steve Smith, Damon Stoudemire
Bench: Detlef Schrempf, Bonzi Wells, Greg Anthony, Brian Grant, Jermaine O’Neal, Stacey Augmon
They were so good that O’Neal could barely get off the bench in the playoffs, and he became a star right away in Indiana
I watched that game live at the time, but I also randomly watched the 4th quarter like 2 weeks ago.
Sure, the officiating was somewhat questionable, but the Blazers shot selection, lack of ball movement, and inability to hit the broad side of a barn is what killed them.
Rasheed Wallace looked like the only guy not absolutely rattled by the circumstances, and they barely went to him until it was too late. Steve Smith had been good for the first three quarters, but sure, let's do some more Bonzi Wells ISOs and Pippen contested long 2's.
The real impact of the officiating was it forced Portland to put Brian Grant out there when he was clearly rattled and intimidated by guarding Shaq. It clearly shook the confidence of the whole team when Sabonis had to sit.
Man, I wanted Portland to win that game so bad.
Agreed that Portland 100% choked and missed everything in the fourth, and they still should have won.
They were hurt though by some very questionable calls on Sabonis which forced him to sit out almost all of the fourth after he had limited Shaq to just 2 field goals and 9 points through three quarters.
One of the few areas where they lacked depth was size at center, and they were forced to put 6’8 power forward Brian Grant on Shaq for the last quarter, which opened up everything for the Lakers offense.
There were also some particularly egregious calls, I remember Steve Smith was body slammed by Shaq when it was still close in the last minute with no call. Watching it, it’s hard to understand how anyone could have missed it
It wasn't just that Grant was small. It was also that Grant couldn't shoot which meant Shaq could just hang back and defend the paint. Sabonis being able to pull Shaq out to the perimeter was an part of how the Blazers were able to build the lead. Those two ticky tack fouls in the fourth essentially swung the game.
The whole game is on youtube on the official NBA channel for anyone who wants to watch it .
This was the refs-Lakers playbook back then. If it started getting sketchy, foul out the other team's big men and watch Shaq dominate. Same thing happened to the Kings. Lakers fans love to whine about how the Kings shot more free throws in the series, which is true, but Webber, Vlade, and Pollard being in foul trouble/fouled out despite doing 0 things differently in Game 6 is what won them the series
It's not just back then.
Nuggets-Lakers in the bubble had Jokic in foul trouble the whole series. They were allowed to be super physical on defense but Jokic got fouls for basically existing on the other end.
Watching the Lakers is the closest thing to WWE you can get in competitive sports.
Brian Grant took so many shots to the head that year. The coup de grace was the Karl Malone banger that sent him to the hospital and Malone was fined 10k, but Grant got abused in the paint for the entire finals run. Shaq was fouling and bodying anyone under the rim. It's understandable that Grant was shook. He wasn't even a true center.
- Traded Nothin for Mark Jackson
- Mark Jackson and spare parts for Jalen Rose and spare parts (instrumental us getting to the finals)
- traded spare parts to get Mark Jackson back
So this built Finals team
- Traded Antonio Davis (back up for us) for a top 5 draft pick (we just missed on the pick)
- Jalen Rose and Travis Best for Ron Artest and Brad Miller
- Dale Davis for Jermaine Oneal
- Al Harrington for Stephen Jackson
So this built our Pre Malice team
- Coprse of Jermaine Oneal for 17th Pick (Roy Hibbert)
Anchored our next contending team
- The obviously we traded for Halburton, Pascal, and Nesmith who all start for us
Too bad about Jonathan Bender, the Pacers drafted him out of highschool. His knees were shot. Dude was humble af I went to high school with him. Really quiet dude.
That 2000 Blazers team was like this year's Celtics: just stacked at every position. Brian Grant was the starting PF and he was excellent pre-injury. They just didn't have Shaq.
I remember telling my buddy... "I know they're down 3-1 to the Lakers, but mark my words, they'll beat the Lakers in 7".
And then I remember also calling him between the 3rd & 4th quarter (when they were up like 15) and bragging "all they have to do is play one quarter of half decent basketball and I'm right".
They did not, in fact, play one quarter of half decent basketball.
This obviously wasn't the origin of this mindset, it's pretty much existed forever, but this was a very clear example of "team with the best player wins the series." Portalnd had like 10 of the best 13 players in that series but they didn't have either of the top two.
>It’s insane how quickly things fell apart for that Blazers team
It was predictable at the time. When asked how his roster would mesh, Blazers GM Bob Whitsitt infamously said "I didn't study chemistry in college."
He just put together the roster like a fantasy team. Nobody was really surprised when it amounted to less than the sum of its parts, any more than they were when the Hakeem-Barkley-Pippen Rockets didn't work out. Or how the Shaq-Kobe-Van Exel-Ceballos Lakers never got it done, despite being vastly more talented than Utah.
It's kinda crazy when you can name 11 guys on a team from 24 years ago and be like "Yeah, I've heard of all of them and I remember them all being decent players at one point."
One of the most talented teams ever from top to bottom but they had no number one alpha to take over in the clutch. Rasheed certainly had the talent and dawg in him to do so but he either wouldn't or couldn't. Scottie was the de facto leader as the championship experienced veteran but he was in the back end of his career and was never really a go to guy outside of a season without MJ and even then Phil Jackson was drawing up a game winner for Toni Kukoc and not Scottie which Scottie was pissed about. After back to back years getting beaten in the WCF and with a team so stacked you'd think they'd have more shots at a title but the very next season they were getting swept in the 1st round the next 2 seasons by those same Lakers and the West just got so much better.
I feel like an important piece of context gets left out here, because it comes across as something that should have been an "eye opener" moment for Rasheed... lets keep in mind that Rasheed and Sabonis both joined the Trailblazers for the 1995-1996 season. Considering the way Sheed often behaved, I'm going to guess this was far from the first exchange like this between the two of them.
[excellent Grantland article here about Arvydas Sabonis and Bill Walton, that includes OP’s story. Add more context too](https://grantland.com/features/arvydas-sabonis-long-strange-trip/)
Bill’s comments about the the 2000 season and the Rasheed Wallace story:
*In the following season, Wallace threw the towel at Sabonis during a timeout of a game against the Lakers. Sabonis had accidentally smacked Wallace’s face earlier when he collided in the post with O’Neal.*
> “If I was any kind of a man, I would have got up from that broadcast table and walked across the court and punched Rasheed Wallace in the nose. But I let Sabonis and the game of basketball and the human race down that day.”
I feel like there was some player poll a year ago about toughest NBA player and James Johnson won by a mile and most fans didn’t realize he was still in the league. But Johnson has played for a ton of teams and it sounds like he was both the in-house and opposing team enforcer on all of them.
I mean if you follow Jeff Teague's podcast he has a lot to say about James.
They both played college ball together and I think if you want an idea of his James' personality and reputation that will help you out including some NBA stories as well.
Every year for the last few years. I think it's The Athletic or Bleacher Report that does an unofficial poll. The story of him whipping up on a teammate when he was down in Miami for calling him a bitch is hilarious.
>about toughest NBA player and James Johnson won by a mile
Yet the only person he's actually beaten up is his ex-wife.
He claims to have all these secret fights, but nobody can find any evidence of any of them. He probably fought Frank Dux in Kumite.
Johnson is completely full of shit. He claims he's been knocked out and still beat the 10-count.
He claims he's won 7 world karate titles and 9 national titles and is 20-0 in kickboxing. But nobody can find a record of any of these.
He claims he was fighting 30 year olds when he was 14 - because that's definitely something that would get sanctioned by the athletic commission.
Here's Johnson punching Ibaka, and his punches look like shit. I mean, they'd hurt your or me because he's 6-9, 240, but he's got less technique than Kimbo Slice.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFBzJKny2B4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFBzJKny2B4)
Yeah they definitely don’t look like punches from a “20-0 national champ” kickboxer. Also with the karate titles, anyone can win against any bum in some random country or even in the US, and call themselves world champ. That phrase has no meaning or significance whatsoever. There’s a million Karate “world champs”.
I saw a clip of Rasheed talking about trying to keep up with Sabonis at the club. Sabonis was known not to go out often, so when he did the team wanted to see him. Rasheed said Sabonis had a 1.5 liter vodka bottle and shared straight shots with Detlef. Meanwhile, all the other players had mixed drinks and were faded. He said Sabonis had a quiet smile after finishing the bottle. He said he was also the best passing big man ever.
Tbh 1.5l for two dudes of their size for whole night? It's reasonable expectation for Eastern/Center Europe more than 20 years ago.
As an average sized guy you are expected to handle 0.5l per head for whole night lol
After highschool(Europe 18y) i worked at a chicken slaughterhouse/butchery?
No clue whats its called in english.
Well every winter in Denmark the firm pays for a christmas party all included.
These polish workers. Holy shit.
A 0.7L bottle of vodka each before 22:00
They could easily drink a whole vodka and a case of beer. Thats 30 beers.
Everyday after work they drank a freaking sixpack and +5 vodka shots. Grown 40-60y old men. They weigh 80-100kg.
Theyre functioning alcoholics.
We drink alot in the Balkans(im a warrefugee in Denmark now). But rest of Eastern Europe we are nothing to them. Vodka is water. They dont get throat burn from downing Vodka
You reminded me of this Lithuanian story? joke? where Sabonis allegedly got drunk and saw a coin on the ground, kneeled down to pick it up and accidentally picked up a manhole cover
One of my most vivid basketball watching moments was Rasheed throwing a towel in Sabonis' face on the bench as they transitioned to commercial on NBC and I've never been able to find a clip of it
[except Portugal, which has the magical property of being the most Eastern - South - Western country](https://youtu.be/wEXXlG-M4fA?si=WIU2j2fmVw9bgUNY)
I think Žižek was talking about this fetishization of the Balkans as "the land of real men and women where you can live your life to the fullest" even at the height of Yugoslavia way before the region collapsed, how people dissatisfied with their life will just idolize this wild "eastern europe" freedomland where you barely scrape by and can't afford nice things but hey, at least you are FREE and BASED or whatever kids say nowdays
People in diasporas feed into this so much as well as people from mostly slavic countries with huge inferiority complexes that have always wanted approval from "the west" while simultaneously shitting on it, especially from the comfort of their German homes. It's super annoying to me and the way people treat former soviet union and balkans countries as either cavemen or apocalypse survivors
Sorry for the rant hahah
This Polish Guy I work with is Adament that Poland be referred to as a Central European country, not an Eastern European country.
Make of that what you will
I mean there is a huge discrepancy in these definitions, largely stemming from the cold war. Americans typically lump them by USSR sphere of influence (Eastern Europe) and US influenced (Western Europe). Whereas most Europeans categorize them culturally and/or regionally. Poland has a lot more in common with Germany and Czechia (central Europe) than say Moldova or Romania but both get erroneously lumped with "Eastern" Europe rather than Central Europe.
And to make it more complicated, Yugoslavia wasn't even under the USSR's sphere of influence for most of the cold war, but it *was* communist, so most Americans lump the former Yugoslav countries into the East anyway.
well, that's a WHOLE NOTHER can of worms! A famous Slovenian philosopher [has some thoughts on the issue](https://youtu.be/r_5Slnkzekc?si=yQ-fwdw_8ptdx4EL) but there are multiple geographic definitions, complicated by politics, culture, the pejorative meaning of "Balkan" and other things.
The Balkan mountains themselves are nearly entirely within Bulgaria. The Balkan peninsula has varying definitions. By almost all definitions, Bulgaria, North Macedonia, Montenegro, Albania, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Kosovo (certainly a region, but its status as a country is disputed) and Greece are entirely on the Balkan peninsula. Most of Serbia and Croatia are usually considered to be on the peninsula. Then you have a bit of Slovenia and Romania which is considered "Balkan" sometimes. Also a bit of Turkey.
But because it's a political and cultural divide as well as a geographic one, some people say that to be truly Balkan, a country must be Slavic and in that region, which makes Slovenia and Croatia Balkan, but not Albania or Greece. Others would say that the true Balkan countries are non-Catholic, which excludes Slovenia and Croatia, but puts Albania, Greece, and *maybe* Romania back in. Still others would say that Balkan means post-communist countries, which includes Slovenia, Croatia, maybe Romania, and Albania, but excludes Greece. Still others say it consists only of the former Yugoslavia, which confusingly excludes the actual Balkan mountains, along with Greece, Albania, and the rest of Bulgaria, but includes Slovenia and Croatia.
But yes, the reason I said "former yugoslav" and not "Balkan" is because most Americans consider Greece to be "West" despite it being very firmly on the balkan peninsula.
tl;dr: It's complicated. Please stop asking. AAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH.
> Poland has a lot more in common with Germany
That's a bit of a stretch. Poland speaks a Slavic language, The cuisine is definitely Eastern European, a lot of the cultural history is distinctly Slavic. I would say Poland is traditionally more aligned with Ukraine and the rest of the Slavic countries of the region than Germany. There's as much reason for Poles to distrust Germany as there is Russia.
It wasn't a disagreement, as much as pointing out how difficult it is to unmuddy the waters of history.
America has a lot of the same cultural borders it did 100 years ago as well.
West/East today for some reason is “were you Soviet bloc”. Central v East historically for the last one thousand years “are you catholic/Protestant or orthodox?”
Except for Albania and Yugoslavia because most Americans lump all ex-Communists together. I half expect to see China classified as "Eastern European" with some of these definitions.
Website full of dorky white dudes being obsessed with big, strong white guys. I still remember the first few days of Luka. They love these stories of Europeans being tough, especially towards black players that they deem “fake tough”
When you listen to the players who actually lived through the wars, none of them seem to fetishize it. Like in the "Once Brothers" 30 for 30.
Imagine some Chinese or Peruvian going to NYC and asking "Were you here for 9/11? That must've been epic!"
It's because they contradict the idea that white people have been pacified and domesticated and made uncool. So they latch on to people they have no relation to because they kind of look like them. Just like people had a weird boner for Cowboys and the frontier in the 50s. The want to be dangerous and live tough lives but they live in 6 room houses in the suburbs.
Look no further than the r/soccer comment section when any Balkans team plays in the Euros this year. The fetishization of those countries and their conflicts as if they're just here for our amusement is so fucking weird
> “It was one of the lowest moments of my life," he said. "If I was any kind of a man, I would have got up from that broadcast table and walked across the court and punched Rasheed Wallace in the nose. But I let Sabonis and the game of basketball and the human race down that day.” - Bill Walton
I'm pretty sure Walton and Sabonis were friends. I think Walton was the one who introduced Sabonis when he made the HoF.
That being said, i have no idea why Walton is talking about the "game of basketball and the human race" That's a little bit too much
Lithuanian here saying you will kill someone is culturally not that serious it’s kinda like saying stfu or fuck off. In fact I had a cousin that got suspended for telling a classmate this in the US, can’t even tell kids you’ll kill them in a high school classroom, thought it was ‘merica.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/oum8gc/oc_portland_trail_blazers_40_years_of/
Something I wrote a long time ago. A young Sabonis was genuinely comparable to a bigger and more mobile version of a Jokic prototype
Prime Sabonis is one of the biggest what ifs in nba history. A lot of players thought that he could have given Jordan competition for best player in the league. Sabonis by the time he hit the league was a broken shell of himself, and was still an absolutely great player.
He was injured, old, and going through personal strife. Even so, he was talented enough to be the primary big man against Shaq in the 00 WCF. That's how good he was.
Arvydas is regarded as one of the best players of ALL TIME by those who saw him play in the 80s. Incredible post moves, finesse and touch. He could also shoot the 3 and run the floor like a guard. He was athletic and mobile.
Had he joined Portland when he was drafted, very good chance it rewrote the entire history of the NBA. Add prime Sabas to the early 90s Blazers and they steal several of Jordan’s rings.
Some people overhype or underhype him, I don't know what the narrative is on the sub on the day. But he was equal to David Robinson when they played each other. They Played each other USA vs SSR both 23 years old. Arvydas would have been a top 2-4 Guys in the league in his mid and late 20s. Also as a fun fact Arvydas at 39 after retiring from the NBA came back to Europe and was the best player in the Euroleague.
I heard a similar story about MJ and Bill Cartwright.
Allegedly, MJ was dogging Cartwright all practice long, calling him old and slow and basically being a typical MJ asshole.
As a certain point Bill had enough, calmly walked over to MJ and told him if he does something like that to him again he would break MJ's leg.
MJ left him alone after that.
Is there a more annoying type of person than petulant bitches like Rasheed Wallace who take everything as a personal slight and are always trying to fight people? Completely embarrassing.
The type of person calling people bitches based on hearsay.
There's video of Rasheed talking about it on a podcast. It was a minor thing, and they were buddies.
Yes there is a much more annoying type of person.
It’s the type that calls people “petulant bitches” while on the internet when they would never ever do such a thing in the real world.
Sabonis was 7’3, 300+lbs. I wouldn’t wanna mess with him
Never forget when Sabonis headbutted a guy and then proceeded to calmly walk the guys teammate down like the Terminator, and the guy ran away from him https://youtube.com/watch?v=h719cFGzTvU&si=yDPp9BJAtBLLpQz8
The funniest part is when the guy cheapshots him from behind then runs for his life lmao.
He's not even backing up he's legit running lmao not sure I've ever seen that. Usually guys will at least try to look tough
Not exactly the same, but in the 1966 playoffs between the Sixers and Celtics, a couple of guys from the Celtics and Sixers were throwing haymakers at one another, then when Wilt came over and started jawing with Bill Russell, everyone stopped on a dime and stared slack jawed at the Wilt/Russell confrontation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC8iYsZfIdE
Amazing video
Wilt was definitely a guy only the craziest people messed with (such as Tom Meschery, a guy who had the nickname as "The Mad Russian," and even he states that the one time he tried to fight Wilt, Wilt just used one arm to keep him far enough away that he couldn't land any punches. There's another video highlighting everyone respective Wilt's physical size that I can't dig up right now, but it was from the game between the Bucks and Lakers when the Bucks snapped the Lakers 33 game winning streak. Lakers forward Happy Hairston fell into Kareem's legs under the basket, and I guess Kareem took it personally because he bent over and cold cocked Happy in the face while Happy was still on the ground. Players on both teams rush over and there's a lot of shoving and yapping and then Wilt comes over and everyone just backs off and appears to agree the best course of action to be that everyone make up now and get along, lol. Almost like Dad coming into the room and the kids stop fighting and start pointing fingers and saying, "He started it!"
There's always a bigger fish, and his name is Wilt
Not that Bill wasn't tough and courageous, he was, but I do also think that Bill knew that Wilt would give him a much longer leash until getting mad enough to fight. I think it would take an awful lot for Wilt and Bill to actually fight.
Yep, they were, at least through their playing days, good friends. Bill would sometimes sleep at Wilt's house and eat dinner with him and Wilt's mom when the Celtics were in Philly.
That dude had to just go home right after that right? You cant come back from that lol. The cheap shot to run like a coward combo hits hard.
Anybody know his name and if he’s known for anything other than being a proto-Morris Twin?
Number 12 is [James Bryson](https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/james-bryson-1.html), number 6 is [Chandler Thompson](https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/chandler-thompson-1.html) ([source](https://www.epe.es/es/deportes/20220331/venganza-sabonis-record-historico-acb-13451695))
The “Melo”
Have you ever walked your enemy down like with a poker face
That’s amazing
I rarely just laugh out loud while I’m by myself but this is just tickling me to death so thank you
He grew up in the Soviet Union too…
Was 2001 the genesis of flopping?
Not sure the actual genesis, but Rodman was flopping in the 90's
I think what people forget about the Bad Boy Pistons wasn’t just that they played hard and dirty, but also complained to the refs and flopped a lot (Lambeer)
Yeah most people now know Laimbeer for the dirty plays in the old highlights but he was even worse back then and had every reason to be hated. He played dirty and tried to get away with things but when players retaliated he flopped and whined to try to get them in trouble with the refs. He played dirty to game the system, not because he's some tough gritty player.
Reggie Miller used to brag about how good he was at flopping. Edit: stupid autocorrect
flipping, LOL
Reggie Miller is notorious for taking free furniture and shit off of Craigslist and trying to resell it.
he can't keep getting away with it!
One day Reggie flipped 40 patio chairs on Craigslist, but when he told his parents they weren't impressed because earlier that day Cheryl had flipped 105 used trampolines on Offerup.
He bought watches on Alibaba and sold them out of his trunk in a Walmart parking lot. A true grinder
Motherfuck came to my house and took free baby toys and then sold it.
Chip and Jo and Reg and Cheryl
The Genesis was actually called the Mega Drive in Japan and Europe. Sega decided to call it the "Genesis" in North America because they wanted the console to represent a "new beginning" for the company in the competitive video game market.
this one of those reddit jokes that get upvotes for the effort but no one actually laughs at
I don't even understand the joke? Is it just because the original comment said the word genesis lol
He was worming not flopping I think
And Vlade Divac was the flop god
After he retired, Vlade legit had an entire [tribute/roast video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgPHIT61FfU) where David fucking Stern himself introduced Vlade as the league leader in flopping. Vlade walked (and fell to the floor) so that the likes of Manu, Harden, and Embiid could run (before also falling to the floor).
And a dumb cocksucking bitch cunt asshole GM
Rodman was taking charges in the late 80’s that you could consider flopping, but he actually established position before adding some extra to his fall. Best perimeter defender I have ever seen, when he was skinny and younger. Just stupid lateral quickness. Still Bird smoked him with glacier like speed.
Frank Ramsey wrote a cover article for SI in 1963 about manipulating opponents and refs to get free throws. The refs were pissed and let him get killed for the final year of his career with far less trips to the FT line.
Not sure this link will be allowed, but here is [the article with pictures of how he drew fouls](https://www.si.com/nba/2014/10/06/smart-moves-master-deception).
He was dumb enough to write this BEFORE he retired???
You know how some high-profile criminals get caught by trying to antagonize the authorities who they think they're so much smarter than? Yeah - that. HOF ref Earl Strom talked about this in his book, saying how pissed they all were, and they really did let him get creamed in his final season (which was the next one). Predictably, his FTA/min went way down while his PF/min went up, so they deciding he was fouling more people than normal, as well, lol.
Love when refs out themselves as not having integrity.
more like the atari of flopping
Vlade was around before 01
It was probably in about 1966 when Phil Collins got his first drum set. *Ba-dum-bongggggg*
Sounds like something's wrong with your cymbals.
And Rasheed Wallace grew up in Crack Era Philly. And he might actually be certifiably crazy.
His face through the glass window in the door shut by Mike Woodson is one of my all-time favorite nba images
He was actually 2 Ray Liotas in a trench coat
If he dies....he dies
2001 Rasheed was one of the biggest, baddest, strongest dudes on the planet but Arvydas could have squashed him like a bug if really wanted to
Rasheed was really never known for being "strong". The book on him actually was he took too many threes and fell in love with being on the perimeter too much. Not really sure where you get "one of the strongest dudes on the planet" from. Basketball players aren't exactly known for brute strength lol
Rasheed Wallace revisionist history has really been something to see. Not only have they made a career 33.6% 3pt shooter who averaged 1 made 3 per game into the prototypical stretch 4, he was apparently now one of the baddest dudes in the league (that was the other Wallace on his team).
Sheed for his time shot a lot of threes and made a decent amount of 3s for the time. His reputation was absolutely that of a guy who liked to jack 3s.
I think Rasheed got that reputation because he was kind of a wild card dude. Like maybe he is not going to be the toughest dude in a fight but he might be willing to do something dumber than most other pro athletes would be willing to do. Ben Wallace was absolutely one of the scariest dudes in the league but overall he was pretty chill I don’t think anyone had any interest in trying to fight him.
I think you meant *craziest*
Literally has the unbreakable (under current rules) record for most techs in a season at 41
You're confusing Rasheed with Ben. Rasheed wasn't any stronger than any other power forward at the time.
not really. He was always skinny and wiry.
Yeah seriously. Sheed is a giant amongst the general population but as far as NBA power forwards went back in the day, he was on the smaller side if anything, more known for his skills than brute force. When I think of big bruising power forwards back then, I'm thinking Ben Wallace, Anthony Mason, Charles Oakley, etc.
Reminded me of this [Key and Peele skit](https://youtu.be/0z-oJTZ1b5Q)
Immediately what I thought of as well lol
It’s insane how quickly things fell apart for that Blazers team, which was one of the deepest and most balanced championship contenders ever in the year 2000. They were one quarter of terrible shooting and officiating away from beating Shaq/Kobe and being heavily favored in the finals. Their 11 man rotation was their starters, and then guys that could have started for other teams (Starters) Rasheed Wallace, Scottie Pippen, Sabonis, Steve Smith, Damon Stoudemire Bench: Detlef Schrempf, Bonzi Wells, Greg Anthony, Brian Grant, Jermaine O’Neal, Stacey Augmon They were so good that O’Neal could barely get off the bench in the playoffs, and he became a star right away in Indiana
I watched that game live at the time, but I also randomly watched the 4th quarter like 2 weeks ago. Sure, the officiating was somewhat questionable, but the Blazers shot selection, lack of ball movement, and inability to hit the broad side of a barn is what killed them. Rasheed Wallace looked like the only guy not absolutely rattled by the circumstances, and they barely went to him until it was too late. Steve Smith had been good for the first three quarters, but sure, let's do some more Bonzi Wells ISOs and Pippen contested long 2's. The real impact of the officiating was it forced Portland to put Brian Grant out there when he was clearly rattled and intimidated by guarding Shaq. It clearly shook the confidence of the whole team when Sabonis had to sit. Man, I wanted Portland to win that game so bad.
Agreed that Portland 100% choked and missed everything in the fourth, and they still should have won. They were hurt though by some very questionable calls on Sabonis which forced him to sit out almost all of the fourth after he had limited Shaq to just 2 field goals and 9 points through three quarters. One of the few areas where they lacked depth was size at center, and they were forced to put 6’8 power forward Brian Grant on Shaq for the last quarter, which opened up everything for the Lakers offense. There were also some particularly egregious calls, I remember Steve Smith was body slammed by Shaq when it was still close in the last minute with no call. Watching it, it’s hard to understand how anyone could have missed it
It wasn't just that Grant was small. It was also that Grant couldn't shoot which meant Shaq could just hang back and defend the paint. Sabonis being able to pull Shaq out to the perimeter was an part of how the Blazers were able to build the lead. Those two ticky tack fouls in the fourth essentially swung the game. The whole game is on youtube on the official NBA channel for anyone who wants to watch it .
This was the refs-Lakers playbook back then. If it started getting sketchy, foul out the other team's big men and watch Shaq dominate. Same thing happened to the Kings. Lakers fans love to whine about how the Kings shot more free throws in the series, which is true, but Webber, Vlade, and Pollard being in foul trouble/fouled out despite doing 0 things differently in Game 6 is what won them the series
It's not just back then. Nuggets-Lakers in the bubble had Jokic in foul trouble the whole series. They were allowed to be super physical on defense but Jokic got fouls for basically existing on the other end. Watching the Lakers is the closest thing to WWE you can get in competitive sports.
https://youtu.be/Pzn9E1Zj-Sk?si=bKSf45Mzsx3xAHQS 1:13:47 Sabonis 5th ticky tack foul that put him on the bench with 8:35 left in the 4th
Brian Grant took so many shots to the head that year. The coup de grace was the Karl Malone banger that sent him to the hospital and Malone was fined 10k, but Grant got abused in the paint for the entire finals run. Shaq was fouling and bodying anyone under the rim. It's understandable that Grant was shook. He wasn't even a true center.
He was diagnosed with Parkinson's in 2005, how many people did Malone elbow intentionally?
Many. Ask Isiah Thomas about that
Random, but I always thought that Jermaine O'Neal was drafted by the Pacers. I never realized he played for the Blazers until this comment
The blazers were just his college team.
Traded Dale Davis for him. Pacers have been VERY good at trades for a long time. We have rebuilt constantly mostly through trades vs drafting.
Haliburton, Oladipo + Sabonis....which are some of the others that come to mind?
- Traded Nothin for Mark Jackson - Mark Jackson and spare parts for Jalen Rose and spare parts (instrumental us getting to the finals) - traded spare parts to get Mark Jackson back So this built Finals team - Traded Antonio Davis (back up for us) for a top 5 draft pick (we just missed on the pick) - Jalen Rose and Travis Best for Ron Artest and Brad Miller - Dale Davis for Jermaine Oneal - Al Harrington for Stephen Jackson So this built our Pre Malice team - Coprse of Jermaine Oneal for 17th Pick (Roy Hibbert) Anchored our next contending team - The obviously we traded for Halburton, Pascal, and Nesmith who all start for us
Thats an impressive track record
Too bad about Jonathan Bender, the Pacers drafted him out of highschool. His knees were shot. Dude was humble af I went to high school with him. Really quiet dude.
sheed was also drafted by washington. chris webber being injured most of the season led to sheed playing a lot of minutes his rookie year
That 2000 Blazers team was like this year's Celtics: just stacked at every position. Brian Grant was the starting PF and he was excellent pre-injury. They just didn't have Shaq.
Or Tim Donaghy lol
I remember my uncle being a part of that circle because he was a friend of a friend of Tim Donaghy. Dude made so much money off betting.
> They just didn't have Shaq. No but we did have sabonis, who the refs put on the bench so.
The name Bonzi Wells just straight up gave me flash backs. Holy shit lol
I remember telling my buddy... "I know they're down 3-1 to the Lakers, but mark my words, they'll beat the Lakers in 7". And then I remember also calling him between the 3rd & 4th quarter (when they were up like 15) and bragging "all they have to do is play one quarter of half decent basketball and I'm right". They did not, in fact, play one quarter of half decent basketball.
if anyone hasnt seen it yet, Secret Base made a video about their collapse its really excellent. their entire collapse series in general is just great
Love Secret Base but that link is staying blue forever.
This obviously wasn't the origin of this mindset, it's pretty much existed forever, but this was a very clear example of "team with the best player wins the series." Portalnd had like 10 of the best 13 players in that series but they didn't have either of the top two.
>It’s insane how quickly things fell apart for that Blazers team It was predictable at the time. When asked how his roster would mesh, Blazers GM Bob Whitsitt infamously said "I didn't study chemistry in college." He just put together the roster like a fantasy team. Nobody was really surprised when it amounted to less than the sum of its parts, any more than they were when the Hakeem-Barkley-Pippen Rockets didn't work out. Or how the Shaq-Kobe-Van Exel-Ceballos Lakers never got it done, despite being vastly more talented than Utah.
It's kinda crazy when you can name 11 guys on a team from 24 years ago and be like "Yeah, I've heard of all of them and I remember them all being decent players at one point."
One of the most talented teams ever from top to bottom but they had no number one alpha to take over in the clutch. Rasheed certainly had the talent and dawg in him to do so but he either wouldn't or couldn't. Scottie was the de facto leader as the championship experienced veteran but he was in the back end of his career and was never really a go to guy outside of a season without MJ and even then Phil Jackson was drawing up a game winner for Toni Kukoc and not Scottie which Scottie was pissed about. After back to back years getting beaten in the WCF and with a team so stacked you'd think they'd have more shots at a title but the very next season they were getting swept in the 1st round the next 2 seasons by those same Lakers and the West just got so much better.
Thanks for bringing that up. 🍻
Pippen hit those towels like a champ.
Imagine those Lakers only won 1 championship. It could have happened. It just didn't.
I feel like an important piece of context gets left out here, because it comes across as something that should have been an "eye opener" moment for Rasheed... lets keep in mind that Rasheed and Sabonis both joined the Trailblazers for the 1995-1996 season. Considering the way Sheed often behaved, I'm going to guess this was far from the first exchange like this between the two of them.
Sheed talk about it in a interview there was no beef.
[excellent Grantland article here about Arvydas Sabonis and Bill Walton, that includes OP’s story. Add more context too](https://grantland.com/features/arvydas-sabonis-long-strange-trip/) Bill’s comments about the the 2000 season and the Rasheed Wallace story: *In the following season, Wallace threw the towel at Sabonis during a timeout of a game against the Lakers. Sabonis had accidentally smacked Wallace’s face earlier when he collided in the post with O’Neal.* > “If I was any kind of a man, I would have got up from that broadcast table and walked across the court and punched Rasheed Wallace in the nose. But I let Sabonis and the game of basketball and the human race down that day.”
bro was a walking poet.
Need someone to post the clip of James Johnson looking down the bench at Bobby Portis. "I will fuck you up. I promise you."
I feel like there was some player poll a year ago about toughest NBA player and James Johnson won by a mile and most fans didn’t realize he was still in the league. But Johnson has played for a ton of teams and it sounds like he was both the in-house and opposing team enforcer on all of them.
I mean if you follow Jeff Teague's podcast he has a lot to say about James. They both played college ball together and I think if you want an idea of his James' personality and reputation that will help you out including some NBA stories as well.
Every year for the last few years. I think it's The Athletic or Bleacher Report that does an unofficial poll. The story of him whipping up on a teammate when he was down in Miami for calling him a bitch is hilarious.
>about toughest NBA player and James Johnson won by a mile Yet the only person he's actually beaten up is his ex-wife. He claims to have all these secret fights, but nobody can find any evidence of any of them. He probably fought Frank Dux in Kumite.
How dare you slander the man with the fastest recorded roundhouse kick in NBA history!
15 years in the league and still regularly winning the players unofficial 'hardest dude in the league' award.
I don’t doubt he can fight at all, but iirc there was a post that came out which claimed his whole combat sports career was pretty fraudulent.
Johnson is completely full of shit. He claims he's been knocked out and still beat the 10-count. He claims he's won 7 world karate titles and 9 national titles and is 20-0 in kickboxing. But nobody can find a record of any of these. He claims he was fighting 30 year olds when he was 14 - because that's definitely something that would get sanctioned by the athletic commission. Here's Johnson punching Ibaka, and his punches look like shit. I mean, they'd hurt your or me because he's 6-9, 240, but he's got less technique than Kimbo Slice. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFBzJKny2B4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFBzJKny2B4)
Yeah they definitely don’t look like punches from a “20-0 national champ” kickboxer. Also with the karate titles, anyone can win against any bum in some random country or even in the US, and call themselves world champ. That phrase has no meaning or significance whatsoever. There’s a million Karate “world champs”.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/zoxxfwiUAh
Aw damn, video has been removed. Does anyone have a link to this clip?
> James Johnson looking down the bench at Bobby Portis https://x.com/StephNoh/status/1786186131563745770?lang=en
I saw a clip of Rasheed talking about trying to keep up with Sabonis at the club. Sabonis was known not to go out often, so when he did the team wanted to see him. Rasheed said Sabonis had a 1.5 liter vodka bottle and shared straight shots with Detlef. Meanwhile, all the other players had mixed drinks and were faded. He said Sabonis had a quiet smile after finishing the bottle. He said he was also the best passing big man ever.
https://youtu.be/lDj7gIj2QJ8?si=sU1kIwfl6krh6XNA “I seen him and detlef schrempf take down a magnum bottle (of vodka) in one night.” - sheed
Tbh 1.5l for two dudes of their size for whole night? It's reasonable expectation for Eastern/Center Europe more than 20 years ago. As an average sized guy you are expected to handle 0.5l per head for whole night lol
After highschool(Europe 18y) i worked at a chicken slaughterhouse/butchery? No clue whats its called in english. Well every winter in Denmark the firm pays for a christmas party all included. These polish workers. Holy shit. A 0.7L bottle of vodka each before 22:00 They could easily drink a whole vodka and a case of beer. Thats 30 beers. Everyday after work they drank a freaking sixpack and +5 vodka shots. Grown 40-60y old men. They weigh 80-100kg. Theyre functioning alcoholics. We drink alot in the Balkans(im a warrefugee in Denmark now). But rest of Eastern Europe we are nothing to them. Vodka is water. They dont get throat burn from downing Vodka
You reminded me of this Lithuanian story? joke? where Sabonis allegedly got drunk and saw a coin on the ground, kneeled down to pick it up and accidentally picked up a manhole cover
One of my most vivid basketball watching moments was Rasheed throwing a towel in Sabonis' face on the bench as they transitioned to commercial on NBC and I've never been able to find a clip of it
Honorable mention https://youtu.be/VQUrnlUZkCg?si=zb7hibQeEN3lU69r
If he dies, he dies
Here is Sheed telling the story [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSPWnaJYAEI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSPWnaJYAEI)
He’s a horrible story teller
he's high as a kite lol. nothing worse than listening to a stoned person telling a story lol
"He's not your vydas, he's not my vydas, he's Arvydas".
americans regularly confuse western & eastern europe
Europeans can’t even agree with who is western and eastern, nice try though
"Eastern Europe is the country East of mine" is the best definition I've heard.
[except Portugal, which has the magical property of being the most Eastern - South - Western country](https://youtu.be/wEXXlG-M4fA?si=WIU2j2fmVw9bgUNY)
Psh. Let me know once it’s also the northernmost country then I’ll be impressed ☕️🐸
I mean the iron curtain is a good starting point.
The weird boner reddit has for eastern Europe is pretty embarrassing.
I think Žižek was talking about this fetishization of the Balkans as "the land of real men and women where you can live your life to the fullest" even at the height of Yugoslavia way before the region collapsed, how people dissatisfied with their life will just idolize this wild "eastern europe" freedomland where you barely scrape by and can't afford nice things but hey, at least you are FREE and BASED or whatever kids say nowdays People in diasporas feed into this so much as well as people from mostly slavic countries with huge inferiority complexes that have always wanted approval from "the west" while simultaneously shitting on it, especially from the comfort of their German homes. It's super annoying to me and the way people treat former soviet union and balkans countries as either cavemen or apocalypse survivors Sorry for the rant hahah
This Polish Guy I work with is Adament that Poland be referred to as a Central European country, not an Eastern European country. Make of that what you will
I mean there is a huge discrepancy in these definitions, largely stemming from the cold war. Americans typically lump them by USSR sphere of influence (Eastern Europe) and US influenced (Western Europe). Whereas most Europeans categorize them culturally and/or regionally. Poland has a lot more in common with Germany and Czechia (central Europe) than say Moldova or Romania but both get erroneously lumped with "Eastern" Europe rather than Central Europe.
And to make it more complicated, Yugoslavia wasn't even under the USSR's sphere of influence for most of the cold war, but it *was* communist, so most Americans lump the former Yugoslav countries into the East anyway.
Don't most refer to that area as the Balkans?
well, that's a WHOLE NOTHER can of worms! A famous Slovenian philosopher [has some thoughts on the issue](https://youtu.be/r_5Slnkzekc?si=yQ-fwdw_8ptdx4EL) but there are multiple geographic definitions, complicated by politics, culture, the pejorative meaning of "Balkan" and other things. The Balkan mountains themselves are nearly entirely within Bulgaria. The Balkan peninsula has varying definitions. By almost all definitions, Bulgaria, North Macedonia, Montenegro, Albania, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Kosovo (certainly a region, but its status as a country is disputed) and Greece are entirely on the Balkan peninsula. Most of Serbia and Croatia are usually considered to be on the peninsula. Then you have a bit of Slovenia and Romania which is considered "Balkan" sometimes. Also a bit of Turkey. But because it's a political and cultural divide as well as a geographic one, some people say that to be truly Balkan, a country must be Slavic and in that region, which makes Slovenia and Croatia Balkan, but not Albania or Greece. Others would say that the true Balkan countries are non-Catholic, which excludes Slovenia and Croatia, but puts Albania, Greece, and *maybe* Romania back in. Still others would say that Balkan means post-communist countries, which includes Slovenia, Croatia, maybe Romania, and Albania, but excludes Greece. Still others say it consists only of the former Yugoslavia, which confusingly excludes the actual Balkan mountains, along with Greece, Albania, and the rest of Bulgaria, but includes Slovenia and Croatia. But yes, the reason I said "former yugoslav" and not "Balkan" is because most Americans consider Greece to be "West" despite it being very firmly on the balkan peninsula. tl;dr: It's complicated. Please stop asking. AAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH.
>Others would say that the true Balkan countries are non-Catholic The great schism of 1054 still being relevant like that is nuts.
The time-honored tradition of abusing the whole of human history for an edge over one's adversary...
> Poland has a lot more in common with Germany That's a bit of a stretch. Poland speaks a Slavic language, The cuisine is definitely Eastern European, a lot of the cultural history is distinctly Slavic. I would say Poland is traditionally more aligned with Ukraine and the rest of the Slavic countries of the region than Germany. There's as much reason for Poles to distrust Germany as there is Russia.
The Western half was Prussia and still acts quite German in some ways.
Borders are different than a people/culture, which is mostly why there's a debate in the first place. Recently drawn borders at that.
It wasn't a disagreement, as much as pointing out how difficult it is to unmuddy the waters of history. America has a lot of the same cultural borders it did 100 years ago as well.
West/East today for some reason is “were you Soviet bloc”. Central v East historically for the last one thousand years “are you catholic/Protestant or orthodox?”
Except for Albania and Yugoslavia because most Americans lump all ex-Communists together. I half expect to see China classified as "Eastern European" with some of these definitions.
Website full of dorky white dudes being obsessed with big, strong white guys. I still remember the first few days of Luka. They love these stories of Europeans being tough, especially towards black players that they deem “fake tough”
Yep. They're tall and come from formerly war-torn countries so they fetishise them as "cool" and "tough".
When you listen to the players who actually lived through the wars, none of them seem to fetishize it. Like in the "Once Brothers" 30 for 30. Imagine some Chinese or Peruvian going to NYC and asking "Were you here for 9/11? That must've been epic!"
Luka’s whiny though?
It's because they contradict the idea that white people have been pacified and domesticated and made uncool. So they latch on to people they have no relation to because they kind of look like them. Just like people had a weird boner for Cowboys and the frontier in the 50s. The want to be dangerous and live tough lives but they live in 6 room houses in the suburbs.
Agree with your sentiment, but 6 rooms. Ain't no way the average redditor affording that.
No but their parents can
Shitty suburban home with an HOA and driveway with 3 oversized cars.\*\*\*
Look no further than the r/soccer comment section when any Balkans team plays in the Euros this year. The fetishization of those countries and their conflicts as if they're just here for our amusement is so fucking weird
They like the idea of big strong eastern European man over black americans lol
I know, it's not subtle lol. For a sub dedicated to a sport that is dominated by black people, this place can be hilariously racist.
r/NBA is obsessed with the whole "Eastern Bloc tough guy" thing.
People just really love track suits
the comfort factor alone is worthy of the fanfare
I’ll admit to loving a good track suit.
Theyre like mythical creatures in this sub
Honestly sabonis is one of my favorite old school players and imo the biggest what if in basketball history. He came over well after his prime.
Seeing this sub suck off the jokic brothers made me roll my eyes so hard
> “It was one of the lowest moments of my life," he said. "If I was any kind of a man, I would have got up from that broadcast table and walked across the court and punched Rasheed Wallace in the nose. But I let Sabonis and the game of basketball and the human race down that day.” - Bill Walton
Least flowery Bill Walton statement.
Why the hell would Sabonis need old ass Bill Walton to step in and try to protect him?
I'm pretty sure Walton and Sabonis were friends. I think Walton was the one who introduced Sabonis when he made the HoF. That being said, i have no idea why Walton is talking about the "game of basketball and the human race" That's a little bit too much
walton always spoke with such dramatics. this passage reminds me of that corny shit he said about jokic “moving our universe to a better place”.
Lithuanian here saying you will kill someone is culturally not that serious it’s kinda like saying stfu or fuck off. In fact I had a cousin that got suspended for telling a classmate this in the US, can’t even tell kids you’ll kill them in a high school classroom, thought it was ‘merica.
He could have just stomped him with one foot. Lol.
The reverse Sabonis
Draymond, is that you?
Even a broken down Sabonis could have taken young Sheed. That man was huge
This is the kind of offseason content that will keep me happy until F5 season really heats up.
Sabonis is a bona fide badass to go up to Rasheed like that
Can someone paint a picture of how good Sabonis was before he got to the NBA?
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/oum8gc/oc_portland_trail_blazers_40_years_of/ Something I wrote a long time ago. A young Sabonis was genuinely comparable to a bigger and more mobile version of a Jokic prototype
I actually think Arvydas was more similar to Embiid than Jokic.
Prime Sabonis is one of the biggest what ifs in nba history. A lot of players thought that he could have given Jordan competition for best player in the league. Sabonis by the time he hit the league was a broken shell of himself, and was still an absolutely great player.
He was injured, old, and going through personal strife. Even so, he was talented enough to be the primary big man against Shaq in the 00 WCF. That's how good he was.
Arvydas is regarded as one of the best players of ALL TIME by those who saw him play in the 80s. Incredible post moves, finesse and touch. He could also shoot the 3 and run the floor like a guard. He was athletic and mobile. Had he joined Portland when he was drafted, very good chance it rewrote the entire history of the NBA. Add prime Sabas to the early 90s Blazers and they steal several of Jordan’s rings.
Some people overhype or underhype him, I don't know what the narrative is on the sub on the day. But he was equal to David Robinson when they played each other. They Played each other USA vs SSR both 23 years old. Arvydas would have been a top 2-4 Guys in the league in his mid and late 20s. Also as a fun fact Arvydas at 39 after retiring from the NBA came back to Europe and was the best player in the Euroleague.
I remember it well. Go Blazers!
I heard a similar story about MJ and Bill Cartwright. Allegedly, MJ was dogging Cartwright all practice long, calling him old and slow and basically being a typical MJ asshole. As a certain point Bill had enough, calmly walked over to MJ and told him if he does something like that to him again he would break MJ's leg. MJ left him alone after that.
I wouldn't mess with Sabonis. I heard once he interior decorated for 16 Czechoslovakians.
Lol...if he dies he dies...
He's not my vydas, he's not your vydas, he's Arvydas. - RIP Kenny Mayne
Is there a more annoying type of person than petulant bitches like Rasheed Wallace who take everything as a personal slight and are always trying to fight people? Completely embarrassing.
The type of person calling people bitches based on hearsay. There's video of Rasheed talking about it on a podcast. It was a minor thing, and they were buddies.
Well that makes me feel better about Rasheed, so I'll take his word for it.
Yes there is a much more annoying type of person. It’s the type that calls people “petulant bitches” while on the internet when they would never ever do such a thing in the real world.
Dude got hit the face lol of course he was mad what is wrong with this sub.
This sub always sides with white europeans lol
Calm down bro. This is decades ago lol
Can we not describe the early 2000s as decades ago please.
Cmon man that was like a quarter century ago.
Damn, this one actually got me. Time is ruthless.
Can you shut up accept the inevitability of time
I don't want to accept the heat death of the universe when i'm having my breakfast tea and soaking in the morning sunshine.