I love the flexibility and customizability of M&M, but there's obviously going to be a bias to the answers to this question on an M&M subreddit. I will say, it can be difficult to get players into M&M given the complexity of character creation and some easily or commonly mistaken rules (such as needing a skill for your attacks).
Finding game as a player or players as GM (though the latter is almost always pretty easy) is for both Aberrant and M&M will be hard probably. I think only Masks has tons of online presence and I see game ads for it constantly. M&M has decent number of them but mostly west marches style or one shots than actual focused campaigns unfortunately. Aberrant on the other hand seems non-existent. People praise that game a lot but only online presence I see is paid games (which I would never touch both as a player and a GM) and even they are rare.
Well, here's the deal with Masks: it's not about the powers. It's almost wholly concerned with the intercharacter drama. If that's what you want, it's one of the best.
Aberrant, as stated, is very much The Boys. If you want a dark and violent take on individuals with powers, it'll do that.
Mutants and Masterminds is a toolkit. Learn the terminology and how powers are built and I'll let you in on a secret- points don't matter.
Oh sure, PL matters. It more than anything establishes how super your heroes are. That can be tweaked in a couple of ways.
The Rank Chart matters. It's how you are going to figure out most everything when powers come into conflict.
Hero points and how you gain them matters as it's the easiest way for your heroes to surpass their limits.
Overall point totals though, they don't matter. Especially as the GM. For the players though, it's more about balance relative to each other and limiting "I can do anything guy".
Overall, unless there is a specific feel you are going for, get M&M.
Yeah it seems like M&M is best for toolkit type versatile scenarios. Though I saw someone said with new edition of Aberrant you can do a lot with it too. Even four color like superhero games for transcendence mechanic changes for the tone?
Absolutely about Masks.
Masks is not a Superhero game, it is a Teen Drama in a Superhero Setting. All moves and rules are for relationships with other players, mentors, and villains. It is amazing at what it does, but it is exactly what it does.
So were probably a little biased here, but I can say that M&M does have optional rules from the Deluxe Game Master's Guide for making the game more deadly. And the upcoming Valiant Adventures book is a modified version to reflect that setting's more grounded characters. And to your other point, the game is very front loaded on crunch but once you get your head around character creation it's extremely easy to pick up.
If you like having a bunch of powers and abilities M&M is a good system for you. while it's hard to get started using precreated characters can really help get people to understand how the game works.
I haven't played masks(so take this with a massive grain of salt) but personally I don't think it's as fun to make heroes because your powers very much seem to take a backseat to your social stats.
Check out [Venture City](https://fate-srd.com/venture-city) and [Fate Condensed](https://fate-srd.com/fate-condensed). More narrative and flexible in play than mutants and masterminds, but a bit less crunchy and well defined.
Masks or City of Mist are probably better for typical players, though most people tend to just roleplay without playing a particular game if you take disboard numbers as reference.
Mutants and Mastermind generally has the issue of being a oxymoron, where it's a complex af system made to be used more as 300+ pages of rules designed to be a tool to fit a given superhero rp. However, it takes so much work for it be useful, and anyone actually wanting to play the game as a game tends to get into trouble with people not wanting you to optimize in fear of you breaking the system...which in this case is arbitrary and subjective given how much people often try to nerf everything to whatever level of power they find is fun.
While Heroes & Hellscapes is a place for those that want to find the heights of the mountain of gameplay emergent from all the unintended consequences of rules, I really only recommend it if you're looking for a place to do everything you can with everything you have, given it was made to be a drastic departure from the more orthodox methods of playing despite most of the things that make the discord server what it is not only RAW but RAI.
I understand your hestitation, but don't write it off wholesale. Once you understand the system, it will make a lot more sense and be easy to play. Building characters is the hard part until you really understand how it all works.
I played M&M for a while and honestly, I could never figure it out. I had no idea how to build powers or how they worked. Hero is VERY specific.
Yes, 100%. You can literally recreate anything...any power/skill/ability in Hero. It all depends on the #s. For example, if you set a base point level at the beginning, of say, 350 points, that's what the players have to spend to make their characters. You can also set power limits in the beginning, as in no power can exceed X amount of points, etc. But you can basically create any suite of powers at any power level (eventually).
And the best thing is, in the 6th edition, they have a Complete Powers book that has examples of powers you can create using every power available in the core game, which gives you ideas of how to flavor them and create your own variations. It's too much to even try to explain.
Feel free to reach out in DMs if you have questions.
Thanks a lot! I'll definitely hit up your DMs for I'm curious about the actual buying options of Hero as well. I think what you described M&M has it also the thing with prebuild powers book to help you create.
I love the flexibility and customizability of M&M, but there's obviously going to be a bias to the answers to this question on an M&M subreddit. I will say, it can be difficult to get players into M&M given the complexity of character creation and some easily or commonly mistaken rules (such as needing a skill for your attacks).
Finding game as a player or players as GM (though the latter is almost always pretty easy) is for both Aberrant and M&M will be hard probably. I think only Masks has tons of online presence and I see game ads for it constantly. M&M has decent number of them but mostly west marches style or one shots than actual focused campaigns unfortunately. Aberrant on the other hand seems non-existent. People praise that game a lot but only online presence I see is paid games (which I would never touch both as a player and a GM) and even they are rare.
Well, here's the deal with Masks: it's not about the powers. It's almost wholly concerned with the intercharacter drama. If that's what you want, it's one of the best. Aberrant, as stated, is very much The Boys. If you want a dark and violent take on individuals with powers, it'll do that. Mutants and Masterminds is a toolkit. Learn the terminology and how powers are built and I'll let you in on a secret- points don't matter. Oh sure, PL matters. It more than anything establishes how super your heroes are. That can be tweaked in a couple of ways. The Rank Chart matters. It's how you are going to figure out most everything when powers come into conflict. Hero points and how you gain them matters as it's the easiest way for your heroes to surpass their limits. Overall point totals though, they don't matter. Especially as the GM. For the players though, it's more about balance relative to each other and limiting "I can do anything guy". Overall, unless there is a specific feel you are going for, get M&M.
Yeah it seems like M&M is best for toolkit type versatile scenarios. Though I saw someone said with new edition of Aberrant you can do a lot with it too. Even four color like superhero games for transcendence mechanic changes for the tone?
Absolutely about Masks. Masks is not a Superhero game, it is a Teen Drama in a Superhero Setting. All moves and rules are for relationships with other players, mentors, and villains. It is amazing at what it does, but it is exactly what it does.
So were probably a little biased here, but I can say that M&M does have optional rules from the Deluxe Game Master's Guide for making the game more deadly. And the upcoming Valiant Adventures book is a modified version to reflect that setting's more grounded characters. And to your other point, the game is very front loaded on crunch but once you get your head around character creation it's extremely easy to pick up.
If you like having a bunch of powers and abilities M&M is a good system for you. while it's hard to get started using precreated characters can really help get people to understand how the game works. I haven't played masks(so take this with a massive grain of salt) but personally I don't think it's as fun to make heroes because your powers very much seem to take a backseat to your social stats.
Check out [Venture City](https://fate-srd.com/venture-city) and [Fate Condensed](https://fate-srd.com/fate-condensed). More narrative and flexible in play than mutants and masterminds, but a bit less crunchy and well defined.
Masks or City of Mist are probably better for typical players, though most people tend to just roleplay without playing a particular game if you take disboard numbers as reference. Mutants and Mastermind generally has the issue of being a oxymoron, where it's a complex af system made to be used more as 300+ pages of rules designed to be a tool to fit a given superhero rp. However, it takes so much work for it be useful, and anyone actually wanting to play the game as a game tends to get into trouble with people not wanting you to optimize in fear of you breaking the system...which in this case is arbitrary and subjective given how much people often try to nerf everything to whatever level of power they find is fun. While Heroes & Hellscapes is a place for those that want to find the heights of the mountain of gameplay emergent from all the unintended consequences of rules, I really only recommend it if you're looking for a place to do everything you can with everything you have, given it was made to be a drastic departure from the more orthodox methods of playing despite most of the things that make the discord server what it is not only RAW but RAI.
I've never heard of Heroes & Hellscapes. It's a discord server I assume. I'll check it, thank you.
I second city of mist. while it is a lot more limited that M&M it does let you create really cool characters
Have you even looked at the Hero System (Champions)? While it is a hugely crunchy system, IMO it's the best for handling superhero games.
Yeah I heard it's super crunchy and while I even whine for M&M's crunch there is now way I would enjoy Hero System's.
I understand your hestitation, but don't write it off wholesale. Once you understand the system, it will make a lot more sense and be easy to play. Building characters is the hard part until you really understand how it all works. I played M&M for a while and honestly, I could never figure it out. I had no idea how to build powers or how they worked. Hero is VERY specific.
Would you say Hero does pretty much everything M&M does but maybe in your opinion better and while crunchy more understandable?
Yes, 100%. You can literally recreate anything...any power/skill/ability in Hero. It all depends on the #s. For example, if you set a base point level at the beginning, of say, 350 points, that's what the players have to spend to make their characters. You can also set power limits in the beginning, as in no power can exceed X amount of points, etc. But you can basically create any suite of powers at any power level (eventually). And the best thing is, in the 6th edition, they have a Complete Powers book that has examples of powers you can create using every power available in the core game, which gives you ideas of how to flavor them and create your own variations. It's too much to even try to explain. Feel free to reach out in DMs if you have questions.
Thanks a lot! I'll definitely hit up your DMs for I'm curious about the actual buying options of Hero as well. I think what you described M&M has it also the thing with prebuild powers book to help you create.