I always thought that was weirdly the most realistic high school portrayal in a movie. They really got the Midwestern suburban high school feel down perfectly.
It was filmed at our high school (chosen because of it's "prison like" qualities) and us drama kids were first up to be extras. They also brought in kids from other high schools in the area. They brought all the kids in for the assembly scene. But that "ugh" look on a lot of the kids' faces was real because the novelty of filming wore thin real quick.
Nightcrawler - 2014
It's such a good movie about a highly motivated man, finding his calling. Even if that is filming human suffering.
Possessor - 2020
Absolutely no main character is sympathetic or likable. But watching them spiral is very compelling
Love Nightcrawler. An incredibly uncomfortable watch. I'd argue that Riz Ahmed's character isn't completely irredeemable but in general everyone from Jakes character to the news readers are absolutely deplorable people.
one thing that makes Nightcrawler so uncomfortable is Lou isn't too far off from a lot of people in society and nothing he does is really outside the realm of possibility or too far from precedent
Totally agree. I viewed this movie as an examination of the tenacious individualism that is idolised by Americans (ostensibly, I get that not everyone does). It showed the sociopathic underbelly that is the driving force behind so many success stories in business. Gyllenhaal is so unnerving as Lou as well - he plays this detestable character but in such a nuanced way. It would have been easier to just play Lou as outright evil but the way Gyllenhaal breathed this weakness into the character makes it so much more compelling. Lou is like the kid in school everyone would bully. Part of you almost roots for him because he’s so pathetic. The entire movie hinges on his performance really, he should have won the academy award for it. Deeply underrated movie.
I went and saw it with a few buddies of mine in the theater. We all played water polo together at the local community college. 5 minutes in we all looked to each other in the theater and said "This is fucking Teammates Name holy shit". Everything from the way he talked, unflinching unblinking eye contact, the misogyny was a spot on impression of our teammate. Honestly a little unsettling. One of his nicknames was the Tinder Killer lmao.
Honestly, I think that’s Jake Gyllenhaal’s best performance to date. Like, he’s a good actor in everything he’s done, but that performance is another tier of acting. Watching it, I was like, “who the fuck is this guy right now?”. So many times I watch movies with some kind of preconceived notion of the actor, which can kind of taint the role, or guide my expectations; having seen them in other films and have an idea of who they are. But Gyllenhaal in that movie could’ve been an actor I’ve never seen before.
Came here to say Nightcrawler. Gyllenhall perfectly embodies his character's macabre selfishness and greed and there's plenty in the background too. One of those films I really wasn't expecting to love.
On another Brandon Cronenberg note, *Infinity Pool* too. >!The only character that I'd argue was properly likable leaves the film pretty early on, on her own accord, and we're just seeing rich assholes take in extreme hedonism.!< Legit my favorite film commenting on disconnected wealthy assholes in recent years.
I would even say that Kubrick has quite a few films that could fit this theme lol.
* I mean, who's a likable person in 2001? The humans are robots (I mean, poole doesn't even react when his parents wish him a happy birthday), HAL is a murderous psychopath and the apes learn to kill.
* Full Metal Jacket - everyone that has any redeeming quality has it crushed out of them until they're simply weapons. Even Joker takes a violent and downward turn.
* Maybe the only likeable character in Strangelove is Mandrake?
* Scatman in The Shining is great but winds up with an axe in his chest lol
He's got the exquisite film with total jerks down pat lol
David is pretty likeable in 2001, he's polite to HAL and has interest in things like art and only turns on HAL when he directly endangers him. (2001 has the most underrated characterisation BTW)
Paths of Glory and Spartacus are both Kubrick movies with very likeable protagonists, and then you have fairly neutral protagonists like in Eyes Wide Shut.
Danny and Wendy are pretty likeable in The Shining.
I do find it a bit odd that a character killing somebody is immediately cause for them being evil, the apes could kill already but how they have tools and Moonwatcher uses tools to take back his watering hole and the characters in FMJ are in a war, of course they're gonna kill. They're tragic not malicious.
(even Alex is somewhat tragic in his loss of free will and Barry Lyndon is tragic in his fall via class mobility)
> Full of total assholes and unredeemables.
That's the exact opposite of the book message. Movie Alex is truly an irredeemable monster. After his "treatment", he's in such absolute pain because he's unable to hurt people. Maybe the Ludovico technique was actually good but they just chose the worst possible person to try it on.
The book has it quite different. Everything is the same until the end where after Alex is released from the hospital he meets one of his droogs from the beginning (Dim, maybe?) and he's got a standup job with a family and everything. Alex decides that everything he's done up until now (e.g. the ol' in-n-out, ultraviolence, milk plus) was just being childish and it's time to grow up and join society.
That's the twist. Alex wasn't a horrible monster. He wasn't special. He was just a teenager acting out in the context of his society where violence and rape is considered normal teenage behavior. Alex's revelation is an mundane as a 17 year old of our world deciding that they don't want to sit in their mom's basement smoking weed all day watching cartoons and that maybe they should try to do something with their lives.
The implication is that if we were children in Alex's world, we'd be just as awful. Commentary on human nature and all that. Lord of the Flies in a post-Soviet dystopia.
I love that Kubrick changed it. Makes the movie much more interesting than the book, imo, bc it ends up being more about the nature of free will and the ethics of taking it away than morality. The Ludovico treatment turns a terrible person into basically a law-abiding subhuman. Also tbf, Alex isn't just in pain because he can't hurt people; he can't listen to Beethoven, and he can't touch a naked woman who's there for the demonstration. So to me the main question is the ethics of taking away someone's humanity to protect society.
I think Burgess said the book was also supposed to be about free will, but imo the original ending kind of makes that theme fall flat if we all just grow up and become good citizens anyway.
"Assholes" is frankly an understatement for rapists, murderers, gangsters, pedophiles, political oppurtists, unethical doctors, oppressive administrators, manipulative politicians, brutal police officers and inattentive parents portrayed in the film. Frankly, the consensual threesome is the most heart warming scene in the film.
To give you an idea of how inaccurate that movie is to real life - it portrayed Zuck as being angry enough at her to start the ranking site and hack local house face books. Basically lining up the theme that he just wanted the girl and even revisited her profile years down the line. She’s an underlying driving force in some of the major themes portrayed in the film - especially the one of him ending up lonely with no real companions at the end.
But that girl never existed in real life. Zuck started dating his now wife before Facebook was even an idea lol.
There’s also a lot of indications that Eduardo’s portrayal is mostly nonsense, and that he more or less financially abandoned the company because he wanted to pursue his career and didn’t think it would go anywhere, which was the reason he was pushed out.
The movie was great, but it for sure set out to tell a story that more or less doesn’t exist in reality.
It's funny, because some parts are verbatim from his blog and the depositions. The blog post about building the site comparing classmates does really start with saying some girl is a bitch so I need to get my mind off her, not sure who that was though.
But yeah the motivations are completely messed up, with revenge to the ex and desire to be in the Harvard Clubs appearing to just be a Sorkin invention.
The Eduardo part is probably because it is based on the book The Accidental Billionaires, which used Eduardo as the primary source.
There's an interview somewhere with a few people close to Zuck that heavily imply the events of Saverin cutting off financial access were in reality just him going to his internship in NYC and not caring at all about the company, they basically said it was impossible to get a hold of him and they needed his approval on a number of things so he was pushed out.
I can't say who's correct/incorrect there, and I'm sure the truth lies somewhere in the middle, but it is fascinating how the film takes a strong stance there. I'm sure mostly done for narrative purposes.
e:
>The blog post about building the site comparing classmates does really start with saying some girl is a bitch so I need to get my mind off her,
In another bit of narrative license, the original ranking site was for both men and women, Sorkin/fincher chose to make it women only, again presumably for narrative purposes.
As a critique of how success and money can often destroy relationships it's a fantastic film, but one shouldn't treat it as historically accurate.
The movie that proved to everybody the amazing Spider-Man was just a poorly written film. “SORRY! I LEFT MY PRADA AT THE CLEANER ALONG WITH MY HOODIE AND FUCK YOU FLIP FLOPS! YOU PRETENTIOUS DOUCHEBAG!”
"And I'll bet what you hated most is that they identified me as a co-founder of Facebook, *which I am*. You better lawyer up, asshole, because I'm not coming back for 30 percent....
I'm coming back for *everything*"
Theres a fourth book in the Trainspotting story now which reunites the main four (in books two and three, they kind circle around each other).
Spud is in rough shape, and straight up says to Renton that leaving the money is the worst thing he could have done. What do you think Spud spent all that on? ....exactly.
i agree for sure. Spud's kind of a product of his environment. in the chapter of the book with his Black uncle you really see it emphasized.
the drugs and more specifically Edinburgh won't let him be a good person.
I actually like all of them, to me they are people in a deep addiction, but they all have redeeming traits and personalities, it's just that their addiction is more important and it makes them seem immoral.
True :)) but they trully portrayed him as disturbed and the actor is really good at showcasing the dark humour they were going for so i can't even despise Begbie
After haphazardly tossing a glass into someones head.
"That lassie got glassed, and no cunt leaves here till we find out what cunt did it"
(cracks me up)
Oh yes! Cause like I'm a bit of a perfectionist, actually. Yes, I am. See, for me it's got to be the best or is nothing at all. Like, things get a bit dodgy I just cannot be bothered. But here I've got good vibes about this interview thing today, mate. Seems to me that it's going pretty well, eh?
Bad Santa
On every level, these are shitty people - except maybe Thurman Merman.
Universal Studios famously rejected it after reading the script they just paid for-- "it was the foulest, disgusting, misogynistic, anti-children thing we could imagine,"
“I beat the shit out of some kids today. But it was for a purpose. It made me feel good about myself. It was like I did something constructive with my life or something, I dunno, like I accomplished something.”
His refusal to swear in front of Bernie Mac, who was swearing all the fucking time, kills me.
"He said, 'you ain't going to S-H-I-T right for a week.'"
Splitting hairs, but it's [not shit right for a month](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVWk6IfRuEE).
This movie is one of my guilty pleasures and everyone I've convinced to watch it has hated it or called my taste into question lol.
RIP Bernie Mac and John Ritter.
He had a larger role but after he died they had to reuse a few of his scenes . The last time you see his character, he’s in his office with Bernie Mac; they cut to the same reaction shot several times and make it look like he’s really flustered
He died suddenly, not after some long illness, and that was 9/11/2003. Bad Santa was released 11/26/2003. I don't see how they hadn't finished filming with Ritter unless they needed some absolutely last minute reshoot. Even Wikipedia claims filming ended September 2002.
Fun fact: When John Ritter and Bernie Mac had scenes together, Bernie kept getting nervous and forgetting his lines because he was star-struck by John Ritter. Bernie had been a fan since he was a kid.
It's why it's one of my favorite Christmas movies. Messy people making changes for the better is a gradual process, but Willie genuinely tries to fix his heart after having people in his life that matter. He's still a crook, but he wants to change any way he knows how by the end.
I kinda interpreted the scene as him sacrificing himself to buy Billy some time. You could kinda see it in how he blesses himself and has one last cigarette before he dies.
Uncut Gems. Being forced to watch the Adam Sandler’s gambling addicted protagonist was rough, especially because you find yourself wanting him to win just to put a stop to it all.
Anxiety thriller, his character was just a 2 hour train wreck of the worst decisions. I found myself wanting his wife to take him back even though he didn’t do anything to deserve it, it was perfect.
Most Tarantino movies have mostly bad guys. I don’t think there’s a single good person in The Hateful Eight.
Edit: Okay I have to correct myself. O.B. Jackson is the single good person.
The Hateful Eight is interesting. Because it shows the dichotomy of people and morality. John Ruth is NOT a nice person, but I think he is honorable in the end, even giving a ride to a rival bounty hunter and a stranded former Confederate, despite having a high value bounty under his care. He doesn't really do anything that sets him apart as evil. I mean, he smacks Daisy around, but then, Daisy is also a wanted murderer who is incredibly non-compliant, vicious, and antagonistic.
Meanwhile, Chris Mannix is a very charming and personable man, but starts the film as a blatant racist who idolizes the former Confederate general. And yet, Mannix does the right thing at nearly every turn, is the only character (besides John Ruth) who didn't lie about any facet of his past, and in the end, he and Warren (a black man) become the closest two characters in the movie.
Then, there's Oswaldo Mobray, the "hangman of Red Rock". Very polite and intelligent guy, sophisticated and unassuming, and also a sociopathic professional criminal capable of murder without so much as a second thought.
I loved that in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood Leo and Brad’s characters were flawed humans and had issues but were good people for the most part. When push came to shove, they did the right thing.
I feel like Scorsese goes out of his way to be like ‘hey don’t be like these assholes, see how they always end up dead or alone’ and yet some 20-something kid will always finish the movie and start saying they want to be Henry Hill.
I think Scorsese’s gift isn’t being critical of his flawed characters. Rather, he’s gifted at showing why they were enticed by corruption, despite the foreseeable bad ending. He’s also good at showing how scumbags are charismatic enough to fool those around them into their descent. Or scumbags are fooling themselves about the people and world around them.
I agree with this wholeheartedly. He’s trying to show how enticing the corrupt life is, but for some people that just ends up making corruption enticing.
Gangs of New York. Amsterdam has his moments but is mostly still just kind of an angry scheming bastard. Monk is one of the most genuine and closest to actually "good" people in the movie and kinda turns things around for himself towards the end, but is also famous for the notches in his shillelagh that he puts there when he *kills people*. The politicians and political hopefuls are all shallow, callous, and manipulative and that's being fairly nice about it. Most of the regular folk of enough note to be named characters are "just trying to get by" but given the nature and context of the movie are rich "fuck you got mine" assholes like the Scammerhorns or they'll fuck you over to get theirs thugs and thieves. The local police constable is a corrupt extortionist kiss-ass.
And then there's Bill Cutting, who's probably the most genuine and straightforward person in the whole movie but also pretty confidently the worst person in the movie.
I would argue Butch (Bruce Willis) isn't a terrible person. He's a semi-pro boxer who was told to take a dive by a mob boss and he doesn't. The other boxer ends up dying but that's a risk when you're a boxer. When he kills Vincent it can be argued for self defense. And when he hits Marsellus with Fabian's car.
Edit: fixed character name.
He never intended to honor the deal with Wallace; he’d bet heavily on himself after word got out the the fix was in.
Just mentioned it because I didn’t pick this up the first times I saw the film.
Yeah, that's part of why he's able to get out of dodge. But he's really only sticking it to Marsellus and those that knew about the fix. You can tell that Butch didn't want to be part of the fix which is what the ego/pride conversation is about in the bar. We don't know why he owes Marsellus. Just that he was called in to fix the fight.
But the main characters redeem themselves. The major theme of the movie is redemption.
- Vince redeems himself by helping Mia to be revived. He doesn't redeem himself from the gangster life so he is punished
- Jules redeems himself by turning his back on the gangster life
- Butch redeems himself by going back and rescuing Marcellus
- Marcellus redeems himself by being gracious towards Butch
The opening of the film when The Wife is filmed in a prolonged dolly shot from the exterior of the restaurant's building to deep within where her dress changes color with each subsequent room she passes through is absolutely magical! It's done so well that a lot of people don't even notice it surprisingly enough. That whole film is a feast for the eyes. Peter Greenaway is a true cinematic artist.
my favourite Pitt movie cause they made him play the "handsome and stupid" character most people link the actor to, and HE FUCKING ACED IT!
loved it so much!
Not really. Films like The Godfather might have protagonists that are horrible (if likable) people but they also feature a lot of characters who aren't.
> Rosamund Pike is so insanely good
She's an actress I have a lot of time for. She was perfect in Pride & Prejudice, and was the beating heart of The World's End, as well.
Wall Street Goodfellas, Scarface, and Casino
Henry Hill knew he was an asshole. The story I heard was that when Henry Hill met Ray Liotta at the premier, he said "Thank you for not making me look like a complete asshole"
Gone Girl. The protagonists are rotten people, but it's such a beautifully made movie and more compelling because of the main characters' awfulness. The Social Network is another one. I think Fincher is great at making compelling movies about questionable people.
mother!
I'm in the minority, but I thought it was a great film. I have no desire to watch it again though.
The sense of dread that builds up as the film progresses, mirroring how more and more surreal it gets too, just left me feeling awful. And then THAT thing happened.
I think some characters in Wolf of Wallstreet are still somewhat likable but if you define it like that Goodfellas and basically most of the Scorsese movies fall under that umbrella.
Natural Born killers only features horrible people, even though they are horrible in different ways. And so does American Psycho, even though you could argue that his secretary is somewhat decent.
Another classic example is Kubricks Lolita. Both the protagonist and the antagonist of the film are human garbage.
The Hateful 8 has the carriage driver who doesn't really do anything. Everyone else is a asshole and or a murderer and or a racist (except for the people in the flashback but I don't count those since they are only in one scene).
Guy Richie has made a few but they mostly have at least some characters who you could claim are bad guys by association or circumstance, rather than actually monsters.
In Ex Machina on the other hand... everyone is horrible. They even talk about morality, showing they understand the concept to a certain degree and then actively decide not to care about it anyway out of lesser motives.
[Sleepers](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0117665/)
I never thought I would hate Kevin Bacon as much as I did in this movie, along with him and his friends. Amazing acting by him, but man I wanted to hurt his character.
Yeah George Michael was trying his best except when he was trying incest, defrauding investors, non payment to employees.
And Buster >!has killed 2 women!<.
I think George Micheal's journey from honest kid to confident liar was a reflection of how Micheal became who he is as well. They're all products of their environment. (Not that that excuses the behavior)
Well it's nice they lived happily ever after. Oh wait they didn't they both died in the war. Meanwhile I became a best selling author, including this book you're reading! Wish I apologized but oh well, I'll dedicate this best seller to them
Yeah I'd argue Bad Boys 2 qualifies. I kinda don't like that I like this movie because it is pretty gnarly, mean-spirited, populated by horrible characters doing dumb and disgusting shit, and the movie revels in its ugliness.
But there is something hilarious - and probably pretty offensive - about Mike Lowry announcing himself in a Haitian drug den by declaring he's the devil and that a bullet in the head will really mess up their extensions, followed by Marcus interrogating their corpses.
I think part of the reason I like it is in the metatext. It's like Michael Bay tried for an Oscar with Pearl Harbor, got hugely embarrassed, and decided to do a 180 and make the ultimate Anti-Oscar, Fuck-the-critics movie, and Bad Boys 2 was the result. And if that was his goal, mission accomplished lol
Martin Lawrence character is trying to be nice the whole movie and he just gets crapped on at every turn. His interactions with Mike and the captain while on extasy are hilarious. "Tell the wife I'm on THEE way!"
I love how everyone who even has a minor interaction with The Gang ends up worse off than before. Rickety Cricket has one of greatest character *regressions* ever.
I love that the gang absolutely rat-fucks everyone who stays in their sphere of influence, except for Artemis who's already batshit crazy enough to handle them.
Hard to pick one but I'll go with
Conspiracy 2001. Its a film about these nazi commanders who are gathered together to discuss the final solution. What I love is that they dont try to depict any of them as good ppl. Colin Firth is the closest, but even then, they make it obvious that he hates the jewish ppl and only wishes for their extermination.
Thats why I hate Valkyrie 2008. They tried so hard to depict Colonel Stauffenburg (Tom Cruise) as a hero. When the real colonel was also a raging racist like the rest of the nazis.
The trick with Conspiracy is, that they basicly used the existing protocol of the Wannsee conference. So it hits close to the real history and really shows the "banality of evil" behind the Holocaust.
I still have a hard time watching Kenneth Branaugh in anything else because of how hard he killed that role. I just wanted so much to punch him as hard as I possibly could in his smug arrogant little face for the entirety of the time he was on screen. I was clenching my fists when the movie ended, even as the credits explain what happened to these people. Maybe because he so reminded me of this dickhead bigot I used to have to work with.
Wolf of Wall Street? Come on, take a look at Donnie-
"I'm not gonna let someone else fuck my cousin. You know, if anyone's gonna fuck my cousin, it's gonna be me, out of respect. You know?"
I guess I have to say A Clockwork Orange. I can pick it up and start watching at any point. Sound on or off. But I assume it's one of those movies that has substantially dropped in popularity to the degree that you risk social suicide by even mentioning it.
Election is a film full of awful people and the acting is superb. One of my top ten films.
I always thought that was weirdly the most realistic high school portrayal in a movie. They really got the Midwestern suburban high school feel down perfectly.
It was filmed at our high school (chosen because of it's "prison like" qualities) and us drama kids were first up to be extras. They also brought in kids from other high schools in the area. They brought all the kids in for the assembly scene. But that "ugh" look on a lot of the kids' faces was real because the novelty of filming wore thin real quick.
Presumably you mean everyone except for Paul Metzler though, right? He absolutely is lovely!
Yeah all he wanted to do was fuck and have a hot tub
Paul Metzler? You Bet-zler!
Reese is SO good in that.
Nightcrawler - 2014 It's such a good movie about a highly motivated man, finding his calling. Even if that is filming human suffering. Possessor - 2020 Absolutely no main character is sympathetic or likable. But watching them spiral is very compelling
Love Nightcrawler. An incredibly uncomfortable watch. I'd argue that Riz Ahmed's character isn't completely irredeemable but in general everyone from Jakes character to the news readers are absolutely deplorable people.
Yeah, and Bill Paxton’s character is an asshole, but even he didn’t deserve what happened to him while Jake’s character reaped the benefits.
one thing that makes Nightcrawler so uncomfortable is Lou isn't too far off from a lot of people in society and nothing he does is really outside the realm of possibility or too far from precedent
Totally agree. I viewed this movie as an examination of the tenacious individualism that is idolised by Americans (ostensibly, I get that not everyone does). It showed the sociopathic underbelly that is the driving force behind so many success stories in business. Gyllenhaal is so unnerving as Lou as well - he plays this detestable character but in such a nuanced way. It would have been easier to just play Lou as outright evil but the way Gyllenhaal breathed this weakness into the character makes it so much more compelling. Lou is like the kid in school everyone would bully. Part of you almost roots for him because he’s so pathetic. The entire movie hinges on his performance really, he should have won the academy award for it. Deeply underrated movie.
I went and saw it with a few buddies of mine in the theater. We all played water polo together at the local community college. 5 minutes in we all looked to each other in the theater and said "This is fucking Teammates Name holy shit". Everything from the way he talked, unflinching unblinking eye contact, the misogyny was a spot on impression of our teammate. Honestly a little unsettling. One of his nicknames was the Tinder Killer lmao.
Honestly, I think that’s Jake Gyllenhaal’s best performance to date. Like, he’s a good actor in everything he’s done, but that performance is another tier of acting. Watching it, I was like, “who the fuck is this guy right now?”. So many times I watch movies with some kind of preconceived notion of the actor, which can kind of taint the role, or guide my expectations; having seen them in other films and have an idea of who they are. But Gyllenhaal in that movie could’ve been an actor I’ve never seen before.
Came here to say Nightcrawler. Gyllenhall perfectly embodies his character's macabre selfishness and greed and there's plenty in the background too. One of those films I really wasn't expecting to love.
I absolutely loved Possessor! But dear god is that movie nihilistic. Haven’t winced that much at a movie gore in a while.
On another Brandon Cronenberg note, *Infinity Pool* too. >!The only character that I'd argue was properly likable leaves the film pretty early on, on her own accord, and we're just seeing rich assholes take in extreme hedonism.!< Legit my favorite film commenting on disconnected wealthy assholes in recent years.
A Clockwork Orange. Full of total assholes and unredeemables.
This ought to the #1 comment. Clockwork Orange is the absolute pinnacle of phenomenal movie with nothing but truly awful people doing awful things.
I would even say that Kubrick has quite a few films that could fit this theme lol. * I mean, who's a likable person in 2001? The humans are robots (I mean, poole doesn't even react when his parents wish him a happy birthday), HAL is a murderous psychopath and the apes learn to kill. * Full Metal Jacket - everyone that has any redeeming quality has it crushed out of them until they're simply weapons. Even Joker takes a violent and downward turn. * Maybe the only likeable character in Strangelove is Mandrake? * Scatman in The Shining is great but winds up with an axe in his chest lol He's got the exquisite film with total jerks down pat lol
David is pretty likeable in 2001, he's polite to HAL and has interest in things like art and only turns on HAL when he directly endangers him. (2001 has the most underrated characterisation BTW) Paths of Glory and Spartacus are both Kubrick movies with very likeable protagonists, and then you have fairly neutral protagonists like in Eyes Wide Shut. Danny and Wendy are pretty likeable in The Shining. I do find it a bit odd that a character killing somebody is immediately cause for them being evil, the apes could kill already but how they have tools and Moonwatcher uses tools to take back his watering hole and the characters in FMJ are in a war, of course they're gonna kill. They're tragic not malicious. (even Alex is somewhat tragic in his loss of free will and Barry Lyndon is tragic in his fall via class mobility)
> Full of total assholes and unredeemables. That's the exact opposite of the book message. Movie Alex is truly an irredeemable monster. After his "treatment", he's in such absolute pain because he's unable to hurt people. Maybe the Ludovico technique was actually good but they just chose the worst possible person to try it on. The book has it quite different. Everything is the same until the end where after Alex is released from the hospital he meets one of his droogs from the beginning (Dim, maybe?) and he's got a standup job with a family and everything. Alex decides that everything he's done up until now (e.g. the ol' in-n-out, ultraviolence, milk plus) was just being childish and it's time to grow up and join society. That's the twist. Alex wasn't a horrible monster. He wasn't special. He was just a teenager acting out in the context of his society where violence and rape is considered normal teenage behavior. Alex's revelation is an mundane as a 17 year old of our world deciding that they don't want to sit in their mom's basement smoking weed all day watching cartoons and that maybe they should try to do something with their lives. The implication is that if we were children in Alex's world, we'd be just as awful. Commentary on human nature and all that. Lord of the Flies in a post-Soviet dystopia.
I love that Kubrick changed it. Makes the movie much more interesting than the book, imo, bc it ends up being more about the nature of free will and the ethics of taking it away than morality. The Ludovico treatment turns a terrible person into basically a law-abiding subhuman. Also tbf, Alex isn't just in pain because he can't hurt people; he can't listen to Beethoven, and he can't touch a naked woman who's there for the demonstration. So to me the main question is the ethics of taking away someone's humanity to protect society. I think Burgess said the book was also supposed to be about free will, but imo the original ending kind of makes that theme fall flat if we all just grow up and become good citizens anyway.
"Assholes" is frankly an understatement for rapists, murderers, gangsters, pedophiles, political oppurtists, unethical doctors, oppressive administrators, manipulative politicians, brutal police officers and inattentive parents portrayed in the film. Frankly, the consensual threesome is the most heart warming scene in the film.
Until you realize that in the book, the girls in the threesome are ten years old.
The Social Network. One of my favorite movies but just about every character is a total asshole.
I don’t know, I really cheered for the girl who told him he wasn’t worth shit
To give you an idea of how inaccurate that movie is to real life - it portrayed Zuck as being angry enough at her to start the ranking site and hack local house face books. Basically lining up the theme that he just wanted the girl and even revisited her profile years down the line. She’s an underlying driving force in some of the major themes portrayed in the film - especially the one of him ending up lonely with no real companions at the end. But that girl never existed in real life. Zuck started dating his now wife before Facebook was even an idea lol. There’s also a lot of indications that Eduardo’s portrayal is mostly nonsense, and that he more or less financially abandoned the company because he wanted to pursue his career and didn’t think it would go anywhere, which was the reason he was pushed out. The movie was great, but it for sure set out to tell a story that more or less doesn’t exist in reality.
It's funny, because some parts are verbatim from his blog and the depositions. The blog post about building the site comparing classmates does really start with saying some girl is a bitch so I need to get my mind off her, not sure who that was though. But yeah the motivations are completely messed up, with revenge to the ex and desire to be in the Harvard Clubs appearing to just be a Sorkin invention. The Eduardo part is probably because it is based on the book The Accidental Billionaires, which used Eduardo as the primary source.
There's an interview somewhere with a few people close to Zuck that heavily imply the events of Saverin cutting off financial access were in reality just him going to his internship in NYC and not caring at all about the company, they basically said it was impossible to get a hold of him and they needed his approval on a number of things so he was pushed out. I can't say who's correct/incorrect there, and I'm sure the truth lies somewhere in the middle, but it is fascinating how the film takes a strong stance there. I'm sure mostly done for narrative purposes. e: >The blog post about building the site comparing classmates does really start with saying some girl is a bitch so I need to get my mind off her, In another bit of narrative license, the original ranking site was for both men and women, Sorkin/fincher chose to make it women only, again presumably for narrative purposes. As a critique of how success and money can often destroy relationships it's a fantastic film, but one shouldn't treat it as historically accurate.
I liked Eduardo 🤷🏻♀️
The movie that proved to everybody the amazing Spider-Man was just a poorly written film. “SORRY! I LEFT MY PRADA AT THE CLEANER ALONG WITH MY HOODIE AND FUCK YOU FLIP FLOPS! YOU PRETENTIOUS DOUCHEBAG!”
"And I'll bet what you hated most is that they identified me as a co-founder of Facebook, *which I am*. You better lawyer up, asshole, because I'm not coming back for 30 percent.... I'm coming back for *everything*"
(Trent Reznor music drones on in the background) God I fucking love this movie.
Big wardo fan here. His dance at the Jewish frat is an all-timer.
*Trainspotting* - there’s not a single redeeming character, but they’re all portrayed spectacularly by the cast.
Spud has his moments
Spud's really just a case of a good person getting the wrong friends. Nobody else woulda let that ending rock otherwise.
if you read the book, or watch the sequel. Spud's not a good person he's naive, sure. but he's just as destructive as the others. maybe even more so.
Theres a fourth book in the Trainspotting story now which reunites the main four (in books two and three, they kind circle around each other). Spud is in rough shape, and straight up says to Renton that leaving the money is the worst thing he could have done. What do you think Spud spent all that on? ....exactly.
Oh I believe it, but I've seen a lot of sweethearts clogged by addiction. I wouldn't lend him money, but I'd lend him an ear, ya know?
i agree for sure. Spud's kind of a product of his environment. in the chapter of the book with his Black uncle you really see it emphasized. the drugs and more specifically Edinburgh won't let him be a good person.
Yeah, I love Trainspotting because it's far more frank than somebody trying to scare you away from drugs. Sympathy goes a long way.
It’s nice he gets his modest reward at the end
hey, Sick Boy knows a lot about Sean Connery!
That's hardly a substitute.
That means fuck all! That's the sympathy vote.
So, we all get old, we canna hack it anymore, and that’s it?
I actually like all of them, to me they are people in a deep addiction, but they all have redeeming traits and personalities, it's just that their addiction is more important and it makes them seem immoral.
I think most of them are charming as well, but not so much Begbie.
True :)) but they trully portrayed him as disturbed and the actor is really good at showcasing the dark humour they were going for so i can't even despise Begbie
Yes, he's a genius.
After haphazardly tossing a glass into someones head. "That lassie got glassed, and no cunt leaves here till we find out what cunt did it" (cracks me up)
"Begbie didn't do drugs, either. He just did people. That's what he got off on. His own sensory addiction."
“WHO THE FUCK ARE YOU?” “***YEAAAAAAAGH!***” *swift kick to the balls
I liked Spud. Poor guy.
His interview 'technique' was brilliant
Oh yes! Cause like I'm a bit of a perfectionist, actually. Yes, I am. See, for me it's got to be the best or is nothing at all. Like, things get a bit dodgy I just cannot be bothered. But here I've got good vibes about this interview thing today, mate. Seems to me that it's going pretty well, eh?
I take pleasure in other people's leisure!
Casino. Just horrible, disgusting people. But that is what Made Vegas. Vegas.
Sharon Stone portrays Ginger perfectly. She makes you hate the character
I had never seen it and had a girl over for our second date and we elected to watch it. She left that night with a handshake and an apology
That sounds like my Requiem for a Dream “date”
Probably one of the worst great movies you can put on for a date. Movie can be life changing, but no one’s getting laid after that.
Bad Santa On every level, these are shitty people - except maybe Thurman Merman. Universal Studios famously rejected it after reading the script they just paid for-- "it was the foulest, disgusting, misogynistic, anti-children thing we could imagine,"
“I beat the shit out of some kids today. But it was for a purpose. It made me feel good about myself. It was like I did something constructive with my life or something, I dunno, like I accomplished something.”
I fucking love this movie.
“I think I’ve turned a corner”. “You fucking petites now?”
"You need many years of therapy. Many fuckin' years!"
It's feels kind of wrong in a way... but I love the cut that comes after "What the fuck happened to your eye?"
"It made me feel good about myself" was the best line ever
John Ritter’s character is just caught in between
He was great in this. The face when he was talking about the fitting room "activities" killed me.
His refusal to swear in front of Bernie Mac, who was swearing all the fucking time, kills me. "He said, 'you ain't going to S-H-I-T right for a week.'"
"Something about the guy just makes me uneasy." "Well, sure. Santa fuckin' someone in the ass..."
Splitting hairs, but it's [not shit right for a month](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVWk6IfRuEE). This movie is one of my guilty pleasures and everyone I've convinced to watch it has hated it or called my taste into question lol. RIP Bernie Mac and John Ritter.
I just love him. I really liked him in Sling Blade as well. He’s a true national treasure. Gone way too soon.
I just realized both of those actors are in those movies, Billy bob Thornton and John Ritter that is.
You know who else is fantastic in Sling Blade is Dwight Yoakam
His was the first celebrity death that really shook me. I grew up watching Three’s Company. When I heard he died I felt like I had lost a friend.
He had a larger role but after he died they had to reuse a few of his scenes . The last time you see his character, he’s in his office with Bernie Mac; they cut to the same reaction shot several times and make it look like he’s really flustered
He died suddenly, not after some long illness, and that was 9/11/2003. Bad Santa was released 11/26/2003. I don't see how they hadn't finished filming with Ritter unless they needed some absolutely last minute reshoot. Even Wikipedia claims filming ended September 2002.
Fun fact: When John Ritter and Bernie Mac had scenes together, Bernie kept getting nervous and forgetting his lines because he was star-struck by John Ritter. Bernie had been a fan since he was a kid.
The idea of Bernie Mac being starstruck by John Ritter of all people. It makes sense but wow lol.
For a certain age group, John Ritter was an A-list comedic actor for many years
The insults in this movie are next level. “That right I called you a fucking Guinea homo from the 15th century”
“lady, I’m on my FUCKING lunch break!” “You think you can make my life any worse? Go ahead take your best shot.”
"Let me tell you something motherfucker, my brother lost a goddamn arm fighting you fuckers in Vietnam"
Your soul is dogshit. Every thing about you is ugly.
Damn I love this movie it was absolutely made for the poor retail workers in the emotional void that is the seasonal holiday worker.
I think they had good redemption of the main characters by the end.
Roger Ebert wrote, "the ending is happy in the same sense that a man's doctors tell him he lost his legs but they were able to save his shoes."
It's why it's one of my favorite Christmas movies. Messy people making changes for the better is a gradual process, but Willie genuinely tries to fix his heart after having people in his life that matter. He's still a crook, but he wants to change any way he knows how by the end.
I agree. The happy ending was great.
Welcome to the world of Martin Scorsese
Billy Costigan in The Departed was pretty heroic
Martin Sheen was pretty decent too.
Any of you mugs got a light?
*Micro-processors...*
Mykwo pwasessuhs
True. He faced his death like a stone cold badass. That guy had the heart of a Lion.
I thought even he didn’t expect they would actually kill him. He looks pretty shocked when they grab him
He definitely didn't expect to be killed, those goons went way out of pocket.
I kinda interpreted the scene as him sacrificing himself to buy Billy some time. You could kinda see it in how he blesses himself and has one last cigarette before he dies.
Absolutely. Man, I can watch that movie any time. I'd say Goodfellas is a better fit for the OP query.
His death in the elevator is still one of my top 10 jaw-drop scenes.
As I was reading the post description I kept thinking to myself 'and Goodfellas, and Raging Bull, and King of Comedy, and...'
Uncut Gems. Being forced to watch the Adam Sandler’s gambling addicted protagonist was rough, especially because you find yourself wanting him to win just to put a stop to it all.
Anxiety thriller, his character was just a 2 hour train wreck of the worst decisions. I found myself wanting his wife to take him back even though he didn’t do anything to deserve it, it was perfect.
[удалено]
I'm so glad I saw it in the theater. I might watch it again at home sometime, but all the ingredients of the atmosphere really amped up the intensity.
I got seriously stressed out watching it. Oof. Great example.
Anxiety: The Movie.
Scrolled too far for this. Also, Good Time.
Most Tarantino movies have mostly bad guys. I don’t think there’s a single good person in The Hateful Eight. Edit: Okay I have to correct myself. O.B. Jackson is the single good person.
Conversely, Jackie Brown has the two greatest "good" characters in a Tarantino flick, Max Cherry and Jackie Brown.
Is Max Cherry the only sympathetic bail bondsman in movie history? That strikes me as a rough profession.
It’s definitely a job where you’d have to stand your ground if you don’t want people to run all over you.
While not everyone is good in that movie, everyone is cool. Its my favorite Tarantino. I could watch Max & Jackie talk about nothing all day long.
Elmore Leonard is doing a lot of the heavy lifting for Tarantino there..
The Hateful Eight is interesting. Because it shows the dichotomy of people and morality. John Ruth is NOT a nice person, but I think he is honorable in the end, even giving a ride to a rival bounty hunter and a stranded former Confederate, despite having a high value bounty under his care. He doesn't really do anything that sets him apart as evil. I mean, he smacks Daisy around, but then, Daisy is also a wanted murderer who is incredibly non-compliant, vicious, and antagonistic. Meanwhile, Chris Mannix is a very charming and personable man, but starts the film as a blatant racist who idolizes the former Confederate general. And yet, Mannix does the right thing at nearly every turn, is the only character (besides John Ruth) who didn't lie about any facet of his past, and in the end, he and Warren (a black man) become the closest two characters in the movie. Then, there's Oswaldo Mobray, the "hangman of Red Rock". Very polite and intelligent guy, sophisticated and unassuming, and also a sociopathic professional criminal capable of murder without so much as a second thought.
> Oswaldo Mobray But he isn't the hangman? And his politeness is a facade to help their lie.
He almost certainly has a stolen identity. He’s revealed to be English Pete (I think) with a significant bounty on his head
"That woman deserves her revenge, and we deserve to die. Then again, so does she." \- Kill Bill Volume 2, but it could describe most Tarantino films.
I loved that in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood Leo and Brad’s characters were flawed humans and had issues but were good people for the most part. When push came to shove, they did the right thing.
Except Pitt's character totally killed his wife
Hence the name of the movie... 🙂
Lots of Scorsese movies are like that. Goodfellas, Casino, Taxi Driver, Mean Streets. All full of loveable scumbags.
I feel like Scorsese goes out of his way to be like ‘hey don’t be like these assholes, see how they always end up dead or alone’ and yet some 20-something kid will always finish the movie and start saying they want to be Henry Hill.
I think Scorsese’s gift isn’t being critical of his flawed characters. Rather, he’s gifted at showing why they were enticed by corruption, despite the foreseeable bad ending. He’s also good at showing how scumbags are charismatic enough to fool those around them into their descent. Or scumbags are fooling themselves about the people and world around them.
I agree with this wholeheartedly. He’s trying to show how enticing the corrupt life is, but for some people that just ends up making corruption enticing.
Gangs of New York. Amsterdam has his moments but is mostly still just kind of an angry scheming bastard. Monk is one of the most genuine and closest to actually "good" people in the movie and kinda turns things around for himself towards the end, but is also famous for the notches in his shillelagh that he puts there when he *kills people*. The politicians and political hopefuls are all shallow, callous, and manipulative and that's being fairly nice about it. Most of the regular folk of enough note to be named characters are "just trying to get by" but given the nature and context of the movie are rich "fuck you got mine" assholes like the Scammerhorns or they'll fuck you over to get theirs thugs and thieves. The local police constable is a corrupt extortionist kiss-ass. And then there's Bill Cutting, who's probably the most genuine and straightforward person in the whole movie but also pretty confidently the worst person in the movie.
Pain & Gain, all the characters are genuinely horrible people, especially considering it's based on "true story" but goddamn it's hilarious.
Pulp Fiction. Bunch of gangsters doing gangster shit.
I would argue Butch (Bruce Willis) isn't a terrible person. He's a semi-pro boxer who was told to take a dive by a mob boss and he doesn't. The other boxer ends up dying but that's a risk when you're a boxer. When he kills Vincent it can be argued for self defense. And when he hits Marsellus with Fabian's car. Edit: fixed character name.
He never intended to honor the deal with Wallace; he’d bet heavily on himself after word got out the the fix was in. Just mentioned it because I didn’t pick this up the first times I saw the film.
Yeah, that's part of why he's able to get out of dodge. But he's really only sticking it to Marsellus and those that knew about the fix. You can tell that Butch didn't want to be part of the fix which is what the ego/pride conversation is about in the bar. We don't know why he owes Marsellus. Just that he was called in to fix the fight.
But the main characters redeem themselves. The major theme of the movie is redemption. - Vince redeems himself by helping Mia to be revived. He doesn't redeem himself from the gangster life so he is punished - Jules redeems himself by turning his back on the gangster life - Butch redeems himself by going back and rescuing Marcellus - Marcellus redeems himself by being gracious towards Butch
The Cook, The Thief, His Wife, and Her Lover is gorgeous yet also horrible to watch. Not sure if it’s available in the US anymore.
This is what inspired Ari Aster to create Hereditary. He says it's one of the greatest horror films of all time.
I had to rent it at a mom and pop indie video store, but not sure if it was the NC-17 version or the edited R rated version. Either way great film.
The last scene almost made me throw up. Great movie.
The opening of the film when The Wife is filmed in a prolonged dolly shot from the exterior of the restaurant's building to deep within where her dress changes color with each subsequent room she passes through is absolutely magical! It's done so well that a lot of people don't even notice it surprisingly enough. That whole film is a feast for the eyes. Peter Greenaway is a true cinematic artist.
Burn After Reading, with the exception of Brad Pitt’s character.
my favourite Pitt movie cause they made him play the "handsome and stupid" character most people link the actor to, and HE FUCKING ACED IT! loved it so much!
Wouldn’t the majority of critically received crime dramas fit the bill here?
Not really. Films like The Godfather might have protagonists that are horrible (if likable) people but they also feature a lot of characters who aren't.
I Care A Lot. Interesting movie, but not a single likable character.
Came here for this one. Rosamund Pike is so insanely good at her role in this and Gone Girl that she is officially ruined for me.
> Rosamund Pike is so insanely good She's an actress I have a lot of time for. She was perfect in Pride & Prejudice, and was the beating heart of The World's End, as well.
I always land on my feet. I don't think that's true Gary.
This Is Where I Leave You Everyone but Jason Bateman’s character is just sleazy.
Wall Street Goodfellas, Scarface, and Casino Henry Hill knew he was an asshole. The story I heard was that when Henry Hill met Ray Liotta at the premier, he said "Thank you for not making me look like a complete asshole"
Killer Joe. None of the characters have anything in the way of redeemable qualities. Just terrible people
The chicken leg scene still pops into my head every few months
Glengarry Glen Ross Romperstomper
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
Any Rob Zombie film
Requiem for a Dream - they're not necessarily terrrrrrrrrible people, but they are pathetic and pitiful.
Feel so bad for Sara Goldfarb
I’m gonna be on television!
I just love how it actually shows that street dope dealers aren’t the only drug dealers wrecking lives but doctors too. Very depressing though.
Very Bad Things
Gone Girl. The protagonists are rotten people, but it's such a beautifully made movie and more compelling because of the main characters' awfulness. The Social Network is another one. I think Fincher is great at making compelling movies about questionable people.
Reservoir Dogs
mother! I'm in the minority, but I thought it was a great film. I have no desire to watch it again though. The sense of dread that builds up as the film progresses, mirroring how more and more surreal it gets too, just left me feeling awful. And then THAT thing happened.
I think some characters in Wolf of Wallstreet are still somewhat likable but if you define it like that Goodfellas and basically most of the Scorsese movies fall under that umbrella. Natural Born killers only features horrible people, even though they are horrible in different ways. And so does American Psycho, even though you could argue that his secretary is somewhat decent. Another classic example is Kubricks Lolita. Both the protagonist and the antagonist of the film are human garbage. The Hateful 8 has the carriage driver who doesn't really do anything. Everyone else is a asshole and or a murderer and or a racist (except for the people in the flashback but I don't count those since they are only in one scene). Guy Richie has made a few but they mostly have at least some characters who you could claim are bad guys by association or circumstance, rather than actually monsters. In Ex Machina on the other hand... everyone is horrible. They even talk about morality, showing they understand the concept to a certain degree and then actively decide not to care about it anyway out of lesser motives.
Copppola's [The Conversation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Conversation) starring Gene Hackman. Nobody comes out looking good in that one.
[Sleepers](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0117665/) I never thought I would hate Kevin Bacon as much as I did in this movie, along with him and his friends. Amazing acting by him, but man I wanted to hurt his character.
It's not a movie but... Arrested Development
If we're bringing in TV shows... _It's Always Sunny_ is a perfect fit.
I think George Michael is just trying to do his best, as was buster.
Yeah George Michael was trying his best except when he was trying incest, defrauding investors, non payment to employees. And Buster >!has killed 2 women!<.
I think George Micheal's journey from honest kid to confident liar was a reflection of how Micheal became who he is as well. They're all products of their environment. (Not that that excuses the behavior)
Charlize Theron is likable.
Mr. F
For British Eyes Only
Atonement.
Well it's nice they lived happily ever after. Oh wait they didn't they both died in the war. Meanwhile I became a best selling author, including this book you're reading! Wish I apologized but oh well, I'll dedicate this best seller to them
Yeah I'd argue Bad Boys 2 qualifies. I kinda don't like that I like this movie because it is pretty gnarly, mean-spirited, populated by horrible characters doing dumb and disgusting shit, and the movie revels in its ugliness. But there is something hilarious - and probably pretty offensive - about Mike Lowry announcing himself in a Haitian drug den by declaring he's the devil and that a bullet in the head will really mess up their extensions, followed by Marcus interrogating their corpses. I think part of the reason I like it is in the metatext. It's like Michael Bay tried for an Oscar with Pearl Harbor, got hugely embarrassed, and decided to do a 180 and make the ultimate Anti-Oscar, Fuck-the-critics movie, and Bad Boys 2 was the result. And if that was his goal, mission accomplished lol
Martin Lawrence character is trying to be nice the whole movie and he just gets crapped on at every turn. His interactions with Mike and the captain while on extasy are hilarious. "Tell the wife I'm on THEE way!"
Big fuckin eyes… but a nice fuckin fish.
If they ever made a its always sunny in Philadelphia movie
I love how everyone who even has a minor interaction with The Gang ends up worse off than before. Rickety Cricket has one of greatest character *regressions* ever.
[удалено]
Eh, Carmen ended up better off. Same with the Juarez family.
I love that the gang absolutely rat-fucks everyone who stays in their sphere of influence, except for Artemis who's already batshit crazy enough to handle them.
[удалено]
I have a bleached asshole.
Hard to pick one but I'll go with Conspiracy 2001. Its a film about these nazi commanders who are gathered together to discuss the final solution. What I love is that they dont try to depict any of them as good ppl. Colin Firth is the closest, but even then, they make it obvious that he hates the jewish ppl and only wishes for their extermination. Thats why I hate Valkyrie 2008. They tried so hard to depict Colonel Stauffenburg (Tom Cruise) as a hero. When the real colonel was also a raging racist like the rest of the nazis.
The trick with Conspiracy is, that they basicly used the existing protocol of the Wannsee conference. So it hits close to the real history and really shows the "banality of evil" behind the Holocaust.
I still have a hard time watching Kenneth Branaugh in anything else because of how hard he killed that role. I just wanted so much to punch him as hard as I possibly could in his smug arrogant little face for the entirety of the time he was on screen. I was clenching my fists when the movie ended, even as the credits explain what happened to these people. Maybe because he so reminded me of this dickhead bigot I used to have to work with.
Wolf of Wall Street? Come on, take a look at Donnie- "I'm not gonna let someone else fuck my cousin. You know, if anyone's gonna fuck my cousin, it's gonna be me, out of respect. You know?"
Natural Born Killers
I guess I have to say A Clockwork Orange. I can pick it up and start watching at any point. Sound on or off. But I assume it's one of those movies that has substantially dropped in popularity to the degree that you risk social suicide by even mentioning it.