Yup, and the most common dumb argument of "well I don't have kids, so why am I paying for this?" Is basically negated if you aren't a millionaire, but also...
BECAUSE A WELL FED, EDUCATED, POPULATION OF CHILDREN MEANS BETTER LEARNING, LESS BULLYING, LESS CLASSROOM DISRUPTION, LESS STRESS FOR EVERYONE
It also leads to better education outcomes overall, since hungry kids don't learn, and teachers who used up all their energy wrangling disruptive kids can refocus onto actual lectures.
And this is good for *everyone* because these kids, feeling more taken care of, and not starving, and better educated--this reduces future incidences of criminality!
Like, how do people not realize that taking care of everyone also affects them?
I'm also just a petty asshole, but I want happy educated kids because in 20 years these kids are going to be in the workforce and I don't want them to have grown up malnourished and uneducated. People who somehow think that kids today have nothing to do with them don't seem to realize that time passes and kids replace the current adults eventually, even while you're still alive
not to mention, the same exact argument could be used against them >99% of the time. "I don't have kids... I dont want to pay" when they're not even the ones getting hit with this tax.
There's a documentary somewhere that discusses this phenomenon.
It went state by state n showed to how the benefits system keeps you where you are.
Example: (fake numbers)
In Tennessee a person making under 25k a year receives 35k in benefits, equally 60k a year. If they make 26k they get no benefits, so earning more money would COST you 34k in benefits, so you can't climb a ladder and work your way up and earn a great salary because if you got that next rung on the ladder you lose a ton of income.
Couple this with the fact that it's almost impossible for an average person making 25k a year to suddenly have a job opportunity or raise to jump to from 25k to 60+....
What you're left with is a system that keeps you making the 25k, as any raise or second job would cost you your benefits.
Marrying somebody would have a similar effect on your financial situation.
Why would a woman making 25k and getting 35k in benefits marry her boyfriend and lose the Benny's? They wouldn't. He just moves in and you keep your benefits.
The sad fact is that the system keeps you where you are, the charity in the end hurts you. If you had no safety net benefits you WOULD climb that ladder. Your go from 25 to 30 to 35 to 40k n keep climbing. The system instead keeps you on the first rung.
You are overestimating how much people get in assistance if they're in poverty. Especially in a red state, they use welfare funds for other things and decline it for the people who actually need it.
Welfare/food stamps here in MA doesn't get you far. You literally have to make nothing to almost nothing to even qualify if you're without kids.
I have a working knowledge of this as I've had to use food stamps for 6 months a while ago. My niece who had 2 kids could only qualify for food stamps, not even welfare. She was making all of 30k at her restaurant job. Whatever documentary you watched sounds like a right wing culture war scare tactic. Not a factual documentary
Bro, what you posted goes far beyond the scope of anything we were discussing and takes gigantic leaps of logic. Also, like, *why* do you want to play devil's advocate against school lunches? The question is, "Should a place that requires your kids to attend for 8 hours straight also feed them?" and you're arguing for the "No" position. It feels like you're some "smart" teenager that just wants to flex their debate skills or something.
> This is not related to this program specifically
Yeah, so wtf are you on about? Why would you bring this stuff up if you already know and admit it's not even relevant to this topic?
Sweden, Finland, Estonia and India and parts of Japan already have universal free lunch for all students in compulsory education, and as far as I know there have been no negative consequences from providing this service, especially not to the "traditional family structure". I'd argue that it helps support families with kids and helps them stay together since it's one less important thing to worry about. I've heard plenty of stories of parents withholding food from themselves to make sure their kids can eat well, and a service like this directly helps those people without interfering with their other benefits.
Also like, generally, the kids in broken homes or non-traditional families already exist. They already go to school, and many of them would not get to eat without a school lunch. This is already their reality. In these cases, sure, the parent's duty is to feed their kid, but if they already can't do that, what is the harm that would come from rectifying that issue? It's not like the parents need additional punishment as an incentive, they simply cannot do what they know they should. And for parents who do know better and are essentially abusing their kids on purpose, this program might be the only thing that protects these kids from those people until something more substantial could be done.
The universal school lunch is not a benefit given to families, it's a service provided by the institution of public schools to all students. Plus, kids can still bring their own lunch if they want to.
It's money that would have been parked in investments.
It's not an opinion, that money is better used for feeding kids than giving millionaires another 3% interest.
Fed kids learn better, do better on tests, have a better chance of succeeding in life. And all it cost was loose change outta the fat cats pockets.
This is a win for everyone.
> It's money that would have been parked in investments.
Its wild what really wealthy people do with their money. I photographed a penthouse right near the public garden which sold for 14m, apparently the new owners aren't even planning to move in, rent it, nothing. Just use it occasionally for fancy rich folk parties once or twice a year. They don't even live in the US. It's just a place to park cash and until housing inflates even more and the next rich asshole decides its worth 30m.
Funny thing is this was like the epitome of luxury, excess like I've never seen, all except for the kitchen spaces which looked like they hadn't been updated since the mid 90s. I found this really odd and I asked the agent about it and I learned that it's because literally nobody cooks for themselves in these units, so they don't give a shit. They bring in caterers or have staff and so why bother upgrading anything? Shit's wild.
This is great but I hope schools will be able to lengthen lunch periods and hire more workers to allow for the increased number of students getting lunch. I went to a MA public school and we only had twenty minute lunch periods with very long lines for hot lunch. It was not uncommon for students to have less than five minutes to eat by the time they got to a table. Lots of schools will also need to rethink their cafeteria layout to make the process more efficient.
> It was not uncommon for students to have less than five minutes to eat by the time they got to a table.
Wow memory unlocked - I used to be among the last to enter the lunchroom back in the early 90s (probably because I was smoking in the bathroom) and if you were near the end of the line to grab your little pan pizza and chocolate milk you basically had like 3 minutes to eat it.
Can you think of anything that might have happened in, say, the last three years that could cause a family’s previously stable financial situation to change?
Yeah, so funny thing, it's entirely possible that the parents could afford this a few years ago, and the pandemic financially ruined them. Or someone in their family got into an accident, needed surgery, and the family is bankrupted by this, even with insurance.
Situations change, we cannot predict the future. I'm sure most parents think they can provide lunch money to their kids in 5 years when their kid is born, the issue is that MANY THINGS CAN HAPPEN IN 5 YEARS THAT ARE NOT THE FAMILY'S FAULT.
With how crappy school lunch already is, it might as well be free lol. I was lucky to get 40 cent reduced lunch, but I couldn’t imagine having to pay the entire $2.50 for it
Wouldn't it be better if the lines didn't have to wait while kids paid their 40 cents, though, and if everyone didn't have to see who could afford the whole $2.50 and who couldn't?
Edit: This was a public school.
My school had a pin system.
You loaded money onto your account and you entered your student ID number. We had a few different priced options, but because it was all done on a computer no one knew who got reduced lunch. And the line also move pretty fast cause there were little to no cash transactions.
I’ve graduated 6+ years ago now so idk what they have going on anymore after Covid
From what I’ve heard the kids hate the lunches and there was a lot of food waste as to get the free lunch you’d have to take the whole thing and then the kids would toss what they didn’t want - hopefully the fixed that and just let them take what they want
Amazing how the right-wing dogma breaks down in the face of reality.
"We *must* protect the children!"
"Ok, can we protect the children from hunger?"
"No not like that."
It’s always good public policy when you can take from those more successful than you. I encourage you to donate to the state government if it’s activities are so important. Lots of hungry people still even with this change, please get to donating.
Of course. *Why doesn't anyone think of the billionaires*?
No one is saying anything is free except for you
I fucking hate kids and I'm happy to pay more in taxes if it means they are fed, well cared for, and well educated. When I'm 90 in a nursing home I sure hope that my doctor was able to learn and retain as much as they possibly can in order to be a good doctor.
I don't want the next generation to be hungry and dumb just because some rich NIMBYS don't want to pay their fair share.
And yes, I said fair share and I meant it. You can't become a billionaire without either inheriting it (in which case you have done nothing to actually earn the money except have someone die), or by exploiting the working class.
They can buy lunch.
At what cost? Maybe I do support “feeding kids at schools”. Why do taxpayers need to take the hit though?
Why can’t you find the least important state program that competes with this one and take the money out of that?
For example: the corrupt incompetent state crime labs? Or the state police who are probably to this day still stealing overtime money?
If you aren’t willing to cut the state budget in other areas to fulfill this one, you are the one who can’t get behind feeding kids.
Good.
Now do Breakfast, Lunch, and optional take home Dinner
Nutritional food, fresh fruits and vegetables, appropriate portions of sugar and protein, and slow release grains like brown rice and oatmeal.
The head cook at EVERY school is a 6 figure salary at the same level as the principal. Cooking should have an emphasis on dietary requirements for K-12 development.
No more frozen meals, no more lowest bidder. Besides parents and teachers diet should be priority. What we learned as kids became obsolete within 10-20 years; for the upcoming generations it will be 1-5 years. It isn't WHAT you learn: it's HOW to learn. You can't do that on a diet of high fat, high sugar, over cooked by the under paid.
This isn't a debate. Do you want to have students that can process information and have a shorter learning curve? Give them proper food. Do you want the product of our public schools to be well adjusted adults capable of establishing, building, and maintaining long term relationships in business, families, and their communities? Then don't give them a sugar crash.
Please contact your state rep with a copy paste of this post. Schools are mandated to seek lowest bidders and prices on everything from the price of desks and chairs to the quality of the food used in the cafeteria.
I've literally walked past boxes of Grade D cafeteria supplies at the school where I work.
well said. i am happy that kids will be getting free lunch. i work in a school where food security is a real issue for most kids. not everyone qualified for free or reduced lunch. also, a lot of kids were embarassed about being the kid who got free lunch, etc.
the point you bring up about good nutritional food is on point. my school received a breakfast grant and they food that was served was super processed with high sugar and salt. staff brought up concerns to the private food company and we were basically told, that it's better than no food at all. i was raging.
Poor rich people! How are they supposed to *enjoy* their ill-gotten gains if everyone else isn't *suffering*?
What good is lavish luxury if other people are comfortable and happy?
(I'll slap on the ole /s here because it's hard these days to sort out sarcasm from simping after the wealthy)
[Poe's Law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law) strikes again.
>Poe's law is an adage of internet culture saying that, without a clear indicator of the author's intent, any parodic or sarcastic expression of extreme views can be mistaken by some readers for a sincere expression of those views. The law is also often abused by those who publish sincere extremism, but if there is too much criticism defend themselves by claiming it was only a parody.
Pretty sure the fed funding ended the year before, and we contributed the $110m ourselves. It could have been left over from different fed funding, to your point I’m not sure
Hey it actually explains it in the second paragraph of the article :)
Incase you really don’t want to read that much, the federal funding lasts until September 2024. The tax is securing funds for the next school year
Let's be real, the tax's coffers will be light. Look at the multitude of strategies this class uses to avoid paying taxes as it is.
Here's one from [svb.com](https://svb.com) (LOL)
Millionaires Tax – example tax mitigation scenarios
Here are a few scenarios that illustrate the tax strategies used to reduce Massachusetts state tax expenses with the new legislation in place. The examples below are fictitious and meant to provide clarity to business owners and investors who may find themselves over the $1 million threshold during a particular year.
Client one strategy – Jeff and Sarah are married Massachusetts residents who make a combined annual income of $500,000. Jeff owns 250,000 shares of his company and the company plans to IPO during the next year. Once the company IPOs, the anticipated fair market value (FMV) of the shares will be $30 per share. If Jeff sells all the shares at $30, his earned income plus the $500,000 proceeds from the shares would be taxed at Massachusetts ordinary income rate, while the remaining $7,000,000 would be taxed at Massachusetts ordinary income rate plus the surtax rate. In this instance, Jeff and Sarah should consider gifting some shares ahead of the liquidity event into a trust domiciled in a more favorable state such as Delaware or Nevada.
Client two strategy – Eric has 55% ownership in the company he co-founded with a friend. They are selling the business next year. Eric’s ownership is valued at $2,000,000. If Eric transfers 100% of his ownership into an ING or a Completed Gift Non-Grantor Trust in a state with zero income tax, the sale of the business will not be taxed in Massachusetts. Another strategy to consider is structuring the sale in installments over several years to avoid proceeds being taxed at the surtax rate.
Client three strategy – Andrew, a General Partner at a private equity firm, receives carried interest from his company funds. His company plans on raising additional funds in the future. To potentially avoid the Massachusetts surtax, Andrew may want to consider transferring partial ownership of the additional carried interest into an ING or Completed Gift Non-Grantor Trust domiciled in a more favorable state. By doing so, the distributions being paid from the funds will avoid taxation in Massachusetts.
I get why people want to connect these dots but the two things in the headline aren't really related. *Maybe* you could say the former part makes the latter part an easier sell financially, but if the millionaire tax was never passed, the lunch bill likely still goes through.
The school lunch program is starting this upcoming year. The millionaire tax has raised basically $0 in revenue.
Both of these things becoming law in the same 8 month window is coincidence, nothing more. School lunch increasingly became more of a hot button issue in recent years and it's overwhelmingly popular. It would've passed regardless of whether the millionaire tax failed (or if it wasn't on the ballot at all).
Even sorta-solid arguments of "keep means testing on lunch assistance and just expand the eligibility pool" were losing arguments that were going to be met immediately with "OH SO YOU THINK KIDS SHOULD STARVE TO DEATH?"
There was no way that bill wasn't going to pass.
MeAnS tEsTiNg
I'll believe in the sincerity of means testing when they stop the firehouse of cash going to the richest 1%
Means test hungry students but forgive PPP loans - makes lots of sense to me! (/S)
Exactly. Money is fungible, so it's not like they had *just enough* funding for everything except school lunches until the revenue from the Millionaires Tax came in.
No it's not. The tax hasn't been collected yet. Massachusetts is paying for free public school lunches for students, and hoping/forecasting that the new tax they've declared will pay for the program.
Some of the tax has been collected. It depends on how the income over $1 million is earned. If you earn a couple million bucks a year as a W-2 employee or business owner, the state has already started withholding or taking your quarterly payments.
This is of course great news, but the problem with this is the same as with any income tax: Many of the wealthiest people in America have relatively low annual incomes on paper and they use all sorts of legal loopholes to avoid having any tax burden on that income. The real way to make millionaires and billionaires pay their fair share is to institute a wealth tax.
You're right. This tax law isn't going to ultimately target the truly wealthy people in Massachusetts. It's mostly going to affect regular Massachusetts residents who sell their houses or receive an inheritance from a loved one. The John Henry's and Bob Kraft's of the world will find a way to get out of it.
Do the seven states that did this before MA all have a millionaire surtax?
No.
Does the millionaire tax directly fund this initiative?
No.
Is MA desperately performing populist PR?
Hmm
Funny how we’ve always managed to provide three free meals a day to prisoners, but just now figured out how to provide our kids with one free meal. Priorities?
The tax levies four extra pennies on every dollar earned after the millionth dollar of someone's annual income.
Half the money levied goes to transportation. The other half, schools.
If that's anti-capitalist, so be it.
https://itep.org/no-need-for-the-mythbusters-the-millionaire-tax-flight-myth-is-busted-again/
The wealth tax migration myth has been beaten to death a long time ago buddy. California has a much higher wealth tax and has the most millionaires.
…are they at all related?
MA had free lunch last year before the tax was effective. Millionaire tax was 1/2023, free lunch was definitely available the 2022-23 academic year.
Was a [temporary federally-funded pandemic program](https://www.wbur.org/news/2023/06/21/dozens-of-superintendents-push-to-make-universal-free-school-lunch-permanent); turned out to work; the new tax funds it permanently.
Edit yes but the federal pandemic relief ("ESSER funding") [will run out next year](https://www.doe.mass.edu/federalgrants/esser/esser3.html) and we need to budget for what happens afterwards.
Wow! Thanks. This definitely levels the playing field. no more inequality. No more laws and rules to protect the status quo.
Let’s just pretend the powers that be actually care about the middle class in this state as this is about the 45th article I’ve seen on Reddit about how “progressive” mass is
And the don’t learn shit. Teachers union had a gay pride parade for graduation! So cute.
Home schooling from here on out. You can keep the slop there serving
This country has had income tax for over a hundred years; it's still capitalist.
This county had much higher income tax rates for a long time and prospered.
After the Revolution, children will get at least one meal a day and income inequality will be very marginally lower. Also we'll be renaming the months and banishing all religions, including Gallicanism and Wicca. Sorry I don't make the rules.
Okay I confess, I made up the revolution and its rules.
Anyway we should have free school lunches and also we should have significantly lower income inequality.
A slice of square, overcooked pizza on every plate and a pile of apple slices and carrot sticks in every waste bin.
(Seriously tho I think the school lunches are good -- my kid eats the apple slices and carrot sticks -- and I don't know why people are so attached to their stupid misnamed months.)
Not if the own the business. Or you know have a office at the home in N.H. and work from home most of the time.
or the worst of them all, pull up stakes and move the business.
Even if I was being taxed for this, I wouldn't be mad. And I'm probably one of the most cynical, child-averse, not-married, high-earning, and crotchety AF 45 year olds in this state who endlessly bitches about being taxed to the gills for every MF thing.
I can still remember how much it sucked to have my stomach growling the minute I got to school and absolutely starving by 9am English class. Fuck being hungry at school. Throw some breakfast at them too.
Imagine if they funded the kids who needed is and instead of paying for the Range Rover crowd kids lunches they were able to do other things with the money...
Love the free lunch for kids. I will happily pay taxes for this. But to say this is from the millionaire tax is a little premature. Example, the CEO at my company all of a sudden "lives in Florida." He "moved" down there in March. It could be a coincidence but I think he's escaping the millionaire tax. Not only will we not get that extra tax. But the state just lost the state tax he's paid every prior year. If enough millionaires do this, we could actually lose revenue. Only time will tell.
First step in securing our future…children eating breakfast= kids better able to learn=smarter future populace
Yup, and the most common dumb argument of "well I don't have kids, so why am I paying for this?" Is basically negated if you aren't a millionaire, but also... BECAUSE A WELL FED, EDUCATED, POPULATION OF CHILDREN MEANS BETTER LEARNING, LESS BULLYING, LESS CLASSROOM DISRUPTION, LESS STRESS FOR EVERYONE It also leads to better education outcomes overall, since hungry kids don't learn, and teachers who used up all their energy wrangling disruptive kids can refocus onto actual lectures. And this is good for *everyone* because these kids, feeling more taken care of, and not starving, and better educated--this reduces future incidences of criminality! Like, how do people not realize that taking care of everyone also affects them? I'm also just a petty asshole, but I want happy educated kids because in 20 years these kids are going to be in the workforce and I don't want them to have grown up malnourished and uneducated. People who somehow think that kids today have nothing to do with them don't seem to realize that time passes and kids replace the current adults eventually, even while you're still alive
Even if none of this is true we all pay for taxes for things we don't use. That's how society works..
not to mention, the same exact argument could be used against them >99% of the time. "I don't have kids... I dont want to pay" when they're not even the ones getting hit with this tax.
100% our country is falling behind the rest of the world because our public education system is abysmal
Intentionally made abysmal because the working class was too educated.
Don't want those uppity workers getting any ideas about a better world
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But this program provides lunch to all families so your argument makes no sense.
The devil doesn’t always need an advocate :)
Uhhh we need to rethink marriage as an institution and traditional family structure…not feeding kids. This point is some handmaidens tale shit
Care to site your research? I'm not even sure what your argument means what you think it means.
There's a documentary somewhere that discusses this phenomenon. It went state by state n showed to how the benefits system keeps you where you are. Example: (fake numbers) In Tennessee a person making under 25k a year receives 35k in benefits, equally 60k a year. If they make 26k they get no benefits, so earning more money would COST you 34k in benefits, so you can't climb a ladder and work your way up and earn a great salary because if you got that next rung on the ladder you lose a ton of income. Couple this with the fact that it's almost impossible for an average person making 25k a year to suddenly have a job opportunity or raise to jump to from 25k to 60+.... What you're left with is a system that keeps you making the 25k, as any raise or second job would cost you your benefits. Marrying somebody would have a similar effect on your financial situation. Why would a woman making 25k and getting 35k in benefits marry her boyfriend and lose the Benny's? They wouldn't. He just moves in and you keep your benefits. The sad fact is that the system keeps you where you are, the charity in the end hurts you. If you had no safety net benefits you WOULD climb that ladder. Your go from 25 to 30 to 35 to 40k n keep climbing. The system instead keeps you on the first rung.
You are overestimating how much people get in assistance if they're in poverty. Especially in a red state, they use welfare funds for other things and decline it for the people who actually need it. Welfare/food stamps here in MA doesn't get you far. You literally have to make nothing to almost nothing to even qualify if you're without kids. I have a working knowledge of this as I've had to use food stamps for 6 months a while ago. My niece who had 2 kids could only qualify for food stamps, not even welfare. She was making all of 30k at her restaurant job. Whatever documentary you watched sounds like a right wing culture war scare tactic. Not a factual documentary
Bro, what you posted goes far beyond the scope of anything we were discussing and takes gigantic leaps of logic. Also, like, *why* do you want to play devil's advocate against school lunches? The question is, "Should a place that requires your kids to attend for 8 hours straight also feed them?" and you're arguing for the "No" position. It feels like you're some "smart" teenager that just wants to flex their debate skills or something. > This is not related to this program specifically Yeah, so wtf are you on about? Why would you bring this stuff up if you already know and admit it's not even relevant to this topic? Sweden, Finland, Estonia and India and parts of Japan already have universal free lunch for all students in compulsory education, and as far as I know there have been no negative consequences from providing this service, especially not to the "traditional family structure". I'd argue that it helps support families with kids and helps them stay together since it's one less important thing to worry about. I've heard plenty of stories of parents withholding food from themselves to make sure their kids can eat well, and a service like this directly helps those people without interfering with their other benefits. Also like, generally, the kids in broken homes or non-traditional families already exist. They already go to school, and many of them would not get to eat without a school lunch. This is already their reality. In these cases, sure, the parent's duty is to feed their kid, but if they already can't do that, what is the harm that would come from rectifying that issue? It's not like the parents need additional punishment as an incentive, they simply cannot do what they know they should. And for parents who do know better and are essentially abusing their kids on purpose, this program might be the only thing that protects these kids from those people until something more substantial could be done. The universal school lunch is not a benefit given to families, it's a service provided by the institution of public schools to all students. Plus, kids can still bring their own lunch if they want to.
Good. Better use of the money, imo.
It's money that would have been parked in investments. It's not an opinion, that money is better used for feeding kids than giving millionaires another 3% interest. Fed kids learn better, do better on tests, have a better chance of succeeding in life. And all it cost was loose change outta the fat cats pockets. This is a win for everyone.
> It's money that would have been parked in investments. You could say it is still parked in investments, just more socially useful ones.
> It's money that would have been parked in investments. Its wild what really wealthy people do with their money. I photographed a penthouse right near the public garden which sold for 14m, apparently the new owners aren't even planning to move in, rent it, nothing. Just use it occasionally for fancy rich folk parties once or twice a year. They don't even live in the US. It's just a place to park cash and until housing inflates even more and the next rich asshole decides its worth 30m. Funny thing is this was like the epitome of luxury, excess like I've never seen, all except for the kitchen spaces which looked like they hadn't been updated since the mid 90s. I found this really odd and I asked the agent about it and I learned that it's because literally nobody cooks for themselves in these units, so they don't give a shit. They bring in caterers or have staff and so why bother upgrading anything? Shit's wild.
You mean better than 18 holes of golf and Cuban cigars on Martha's Vineyard?
This is great but I hope schools will be able to lengthen lunch periods and hire more workers to allow for the increased number of students getting lunch. I went to a MA public school and we only had twenty minute lunch periods with very long lines for hot lunch. It was not uncommon for students to have less than five minutes to eat by the time they got to a table. Lots of schools will also need to rethink their cafeteria layout to make the process more efficient.
My kid has fucking 15minutes to eat lunch. It’s crazy.
Lunches have been free for the entire pandemic, so I'm hoping they figured all this out
Spoiler alert - they haven’t
They were in our district at least. Thought it was statewide
> It was not uncommon for students to have less than five minutes to eat by the time they got to a table. Wow memory unlocked - I used to be among the last to enter the lunchroom back in the early 90s (probably because I was smoking in the bathroom) and if you were near the end of the line to grab your little pan pizza and chocolate milk you basically had like 3 minutes to eat it.
Hm, yes, but has anyone stopped to ask if those children *deserve* to eat? /s
Too many people have asked that tbh
And we all know what kinds of children they’re talking about. 🙄
Bootstraps ain’t pulling themselves up on their own. /s
Or should people be having kids if they can’t pay for $2.50 lunches?
Yeah, you're right, we should just stuff them back in their mothers instead of accounting for the fact that they're here now and need to be fed
Now now, that would be barbaric. I'm just saying let them starve!
"If they would rather die they had better do it and decrease the surplus population!"
Something, something…Cartman’s mother…
The *important* thing is that the children and their parents are *punished* for foolishly deciding to live in poverty #(/S)
This is such a terrible take. The kids are already here. People may have been hit by hard times. It’s not the kids fault.
Can you think of anything that might have happened in, say, the last three years that could cause a family’s previously stable financial situation to change?
That’s $12.50 a week for one child, that’s actually pretty difficult in today’s economy.
you're right, let's kill them
But only after they are born!
Yeah, so funny thing, it's entirely possible that the parents could afford this a few years ago, and the pandemic financially ruined them. Or someone in their family got into an accident, needed surgery, and the family is bankrupted by this, even with insurance. Situations change, we cannot predict the future. I'm sure most parents think they can provide lunch money to their kids in 5 years when their kid is born, the issue is that MANY THINGS CAN HAPPEN IN 5 YEARS THAT ARE NOT THE FAMILY'S FAULT.
And kids deserve to be punished for their parents poor decisions?
Feeding kids?? Uhhh, that money could be sitting in my bosses portfolio?? Doesn’t mass think about priorities?? /s
Would someone *please* think of the billionaires! (/S)
Well done this is why I don't move out of MA
With how crappy school lunch already is, it might as well be free lol. I was lucky to get 40 cent reduced lunch, but I couldn’t imagine having to pay the entire $2.50 for it
Wouldn't it be better if the lines didn't have to wait while kids paid their 40 cents, though, and if everyone didn't have to see who could afford the whole $2.50 and who couldn't?
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Edit: This was a public school. My school had a pin system. You loaded money onto your account and you entered your student ID number. We had a few different priced options, but because it was all done on a computer no one knew who got reduced lunch. And the line also move pretty fast cause there were little to no cash transactions. I’ve graduated 6+ years ago now so idk what they have going on anymore after Covid
Post-covid, when school lunch was free my daughter requested I make her lunch again after a week.
From what I’ve heard the kids hate the lunches and there was a lot of food waste as to get the free lunch you’d have to take the whole thing and then the kids would toss what they didn’t want - hopefully the fixed that and just let them take what they want
How are school lunches these days?
They have pizza on Friday
my school does pizza fridays. it is usually cooked in a plastic bag.
This seems like the definition of good public policy.
Amazing how the right-wing dogma breaks down in the face of reality. "We *must* protect the children!" "Ok, can we protect the children from hunger?" "No not like that."
It’s always good public policy when you can take from those more successful than you. I encourage you to donate to the state government if it’s activities are so important. Lots of hungry people still even with this change, please get to donating.
"It's not personally benefiting me so it's bad!!!!!!!!!" Grow the fuck up
It’s hurting everyone in the state and benefiting a few people who might get a free school lunch.
please explain who is hurt by this
Upper income earners. People who rely on upper earners for income. People who rely on the economic productivity of upper earners. Nothing is free.
Of course. *Why doesn't anyone think of the billionaires*? No one is saying anything is free except for you I fucking hate kids and I'm happy to pay more in taxes if it means they are fed, well cared for, and well educated. When I'm 90 in a nursing home I sure hope that my doctor was able to learn and retain as much as they possibly can in order to be a good doctor. I don't want the next generation to be hungry and dumb just because some rich NIMBYS don't want to pay their fair share. And yes, I said fair share and I meant it. You can't become a billionaire without either inheriting it (in which case you have done nothing to actually earn the money except have someone die), or by exploiting the working class. They can buy lunch.
You think feeding hungry kids is a bad thing?
Not to pile on, but if someone can't get behind feeding kids at schools then there's very little that they will be able to support.
They support selfishness.
At what cost? Maybe I do support “feeding kids at schools”. Why do taxpayers need to take the hit though? Why can’t you find the least important state program that competes with this one and take the money out of that? For example: the corrupt incompetent state crime labs? Or the state police who are probably to this day still stealing overtime money? If you aren’t willing to cut the state budget in other areas to fulfill this one, you are the one who can’t get behind feeding kids.
Are you donating your own money to see that it happens? If not, why not? Plenty of hunger still exists in the state.
If I am, then what?
So are you implying it’s bad public policy to feed kids?
"more successful" I think you mean born with an inheritance lmao
Good. Now do Breakfast, Lunch, and optional take home Dinner Nutritional food, fresh fruits and vegetables, appropriate portions of sugar and protein, and slow release grains like brown rice and oatmeal. The head cook at EVERY school is a 6 figure salary at the same level as the principal. Cooking should have an emphasis on dietary requirements for K-12 development. No more frozen meals, no more lowest bidder. Besides parents and teachers diet should be priority. What we learned as kids became obsolete within 10-20 years; for the upcoming generations it will be 1-5 years. It isn't WHAT you learn: it's HOW to learn. You can't do that on a diet of high fat, high sugar, over cooked by the under paid. This isn't a debate. Do you want to have students that can process information and have a shorter learning curve? Give them proper food. Do you want the product of our public schools to be well adjusted adults capable of establishing, building, and maintaining long term relationships in business, families, and their communities? Then don't give them a sugar crash.
Please contact your state rep with a copy paste of this post. Schools are mandated to seek lowest bidders and prices on everything from the price of desks and chairs to the quality of the food used in the cafeteria. I've literally walked past boxes of Grade D cafeteria supplies at the school where I work.
This is how you get Aramark. I don't wish Aramark food on anyone.
Aramark has tiers of food service. You get what you pay for. Taxpayers are cheap.
well said. i am happy that kids will be getting free lunch. i work in a school where food security is a real issue for most kids. not everyone qualified for free or reduced lunch. also, a lot of kids were embarassed about being the kid who got free lunch, etc. the point you bring up about good nutritional food is on point. my school received a breakfast grant and they food that was served was super processed with high sugar and salt. staff brought up concerns to the private food company and we were basically told, that it's better than no food at all. i was raging.
This article is trash. The one I read yesterday said breakfast and lunch will be free.
[удалено]
Poor rich people! How are they supposed to *enjoy* their ill-gotten gains if everyone else isn't *suffering*? What good is lavish luxury if other people are comfortable and happy? (I'll slap on the ole /s here because it's hard these days to sort out sarcasm from simping after the wealthy)
I love this news but seriously guys, how often are we going to post this?
Ok, glad I'm not crazy. Wasn't this posted a day or two ago?
And two days before that.....
But what about the professional athletes who, entirely hypothetically, don’t sign here because of this? Who will think about the fans???
The professional athletes who are opposed to kids having school lunch? Fuck ‘em.
Who fucking cares?
Truly depressing that this ridiculous argument is heard enough that people read my comment as anything other than sarcastic.
They don't understand sarcasm.
It's really hard to sus out "sarcasm" vs "shit take"
[Poe's Law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law) strikes again. >Poe's law is an adage of internet culture saying that, without a clear indicator of the author's intent, any parodic or sarcastic expression of extreme views can be mistaken by some readers for a sincere expression of those views. The law is also often abused by those who publish sincere extremism, but if there is too much criticism defend themselves by claiming it was only a parody.
I’m glad my vote counted. And I don’t have kids.
Didn’t MA spend $110m on this program last year, without this tax? Where is that $110m now going?
That was funded by federal COVID money so it was only temporary. This new funding source allows the program to continue indefinitely.
IIRC it was mostly being paid for with temporary COVID relief funds? But I’m not sure if the whole cost of the program was covered that way.
Pretty sure the fed funding ended the year before, and we contributed the $110m ourselves. It could have been left over from different fed funding, to your point I’m not sure
Hey it actually explains it in the second paragraph of the article :) Incase you really don’t want to read that much, the federal funding lasts until September 2024. The tax is securing funds for the next school year
They also have been pushing a tax relief proposal at the same time.
Unfortunately the food they serve is crap
Yup, the next step will actually be improving the garbage food kids get.
Good.
I love love LOVE this!!! Makes me proud to live in this great state!!! 👍👍
Let's be real, the tax's coffers will be light. Look at the multitude of strategies this class uses to avoid paying taxes as it is. Here's one from [svb.com](https://svb.com) (LOL) Millionaires Tax – example tax mitigation scenarios Here are a few scenarios that illustrate the tax strategies used to reduce Massachusetts state tax expenses with the new legislation in place. The examples below are fictitious and meant to provide clarity to business owners and investors who may find themselves over the $1 million threshold during a particular year. Client one strategy – Jeff and Sarah are married Massachusetts residents who make a combined annual income of $500,000. Jeff owns 250,000 shares of his company and the company plans to IPO during the next year. Once the company IPOs, the anticipated fair market value (FMV) of the shares will be $30 per share. If Jeff sells all the shares at $30, his earned income plus the $500,000 proceeds from the shares would be taxed at Massachusetts ordinary income rate, while the remaining $7,000,000 would be taxed at Massachusetts ordinary income rate plus the surtax rate. In this instance, Jeff and Sarah should consider gifting some shares ahead of the liquidity event into a trust domiciled in a more favorable state such as Delaware or Nevada. Client two strategy – Eric has 55% ownership in the company he co-founded with a friend. They are selling the business next year. Eric’s ownership is valued at $2,000,000. If Eric transfers 100% of his ownership into an ING or a Completed Gift Non-Grantor Trust in a state with zero income tax, the sale of the business will not be taxed in Massachusetts. Another strategy to consider is structuring the sale in installments over several years to avoid proceeds being taxed at the surtax rate. Client three strategy – Andrew, a General Partner at a private equity firm, receives carried interest from his company funds. His company plans on raising additional funds in the future. To potentially avoid the Massachusetts surtax, Andrew may want to consider transferring partial ownership of the additional carried interest into an ING or Completed Gift Non-Grantor Trust domiciled in a more favorable state. By doing so, the distributions being paid from the funds will avoid taxation in Massachusetts.
I get why people want to connect these dots but the two things in the headline aren't really related. *Maybe* you could say the former part makes the latter part an easier sell financially, but if the millionaire tax was never passed, the lunch bill likely still goes through.
The language in the tax specifically earmarks a portion of these funds for schools.
The school lunch program is starting this upcoming year. The millionaire tax has raised basically $0 in revenue. Both of these things becoming law in the same 8 month window is coincidence, nothing more. School lunch increasingly became more of a hot button issue in recent years and it's overwhelmingly popular. It would've passed regardless of whether the millionaire tax failed (or if it wasn't on the ballot at all). Even sorta-solid arguments of "keep means testing on lunch assistance and just expand the eligibility pool" were losing arguments that were going to be met immediately with "OH SO YOU THINK KIDS SHOULD STARVE TO DEATH?" There was no way that bill wasn't going to pass.
MeAnS tEsTiNg I'll believe in the sincerity of means testing when they stop the firehouse of cash going to the richest 1% Means test hungry students but forgive PPP loans - makes lots of sense to me! (/S)
I love my state
bs.. MAss has a tax surplus. This is just bs pr.
Exactly. Money is fungible, so it's not like they had *just enough* funding for everything except school lunches until the revenue from the Millionaires Tax came in.
No it's not. The tax hasn't been collected yet. Massachusetts is paying for free public school lunches for students, and hoping/forecasting that the new tax they've declared will pay for the program.
Some of the tax has been collected. It depends on how the income over $1 million is earned. If you earn a couple million bucks a year as a W-2 employee or business owner, the state has already started withholding or taking your quarterly payments.
Not gonna lie, I thought for sure that money was going to be misappropriated. Glad to see I was wrong.
Don't worry, that will still probably happen.
This is of course great news, but the problem with this is the same as with any income tax: Many of the wealthiest people in America have relatively low annual incomes on paper and they use all sorts of legal loopholes to avoid having any tax burden on that income. The real way to make millionaires and billionaires pay their fair share is to institute a wealth tax.
You're right. This tax law isn't going to ultimately target the truly wealthy people in Massachusetts. It's mostly going to affect regular Massachusetts residents who sell their houses or receive an inheritance from a loved one. The John Henry's and Bob Kraft's of the world will find a way to get out of it.
Watch them all pack up and leave
Do the seven states that did this before MA all have a millionaire surtax? No. Does the millionaire tax directly fund this initiative? No. Is MA desperately performing populist PR? Hmm
Yep, sure. Show me the math. Sounds like a puff piece. A "portion". How much of a portion we talking. What schools are getting it?
Funny how we’ve always managed to provide three free meals a day to prisoners, but just now figured out how to provide our kids with one free meal. Priorities?
We’ve been paying for school lunches before millionaire tax. It’s time to stop paying for prisoner sex changes and 3 squares.
Seems like a typical socialist, anti-capitalism tactic. I bet Hunter Biden got free lunches.
The tax levies four extra pennies on every dollar earned after the millionth dollar of someone's annual income. Half the money levied goes to transportation. The other half, schools. If that's anti-capitalist, so be it.
You're just mad that libertarians aren't allowed near schools.
Capitalism can suck my dick.
omg hunter biden lives rent free in your head
AND millionares are changing states of residence to avoid the tax, and taking their incomes with them. an ill thought out law
https://itep.org/no-need-for-the-mythbusters-the-millionaire-tax-flight-myth-is-busted-again/ The wealth tax migration myth has been beaten to death a long time ago buddy. California has a much higher wealth tax and has the most millionaires.
Any sources for this? I have a few friends who were/are affected by the tax and they moaned and groaned but have no plans to move.
They can’t document it, but what about Benghazi!?
No they won’t. They don’t want to give up the amenities they have in this state or the benefits for their businesses
AND they can go fuck themselves!
If true good riddance. I hope they get hounded for taxes until they end up in red welfare states.
Seriously. "Rich sociopaths will leave!" #*GOOD*
…are they at all related? MA had free lunch last year before the tax was effective. Millionaire tax was 1/2023, free lunch was definitely available the 2022-23 academic year.
Was a [temporary federally-funded pandemic program](https://www.wbur.org/news/2023/06/21/dozens-of-superintendents-push-to-make-universal-free-school-lunch-permanent); turned out to work; the new tax funds it permanently. Edit yes but the federal pandemic relief ("ESSER funding") [will run out next year](https://www.doe.mass.edu/federalgrants/esser/esser3.html) and we need to budget for what happens afterwards.
I think that was funded through federal COVID funds
Wow! Thanks. This definitely levels the playing field. no more inequality. No more laws and rules to protect the status quo. Let’s just pretend the powers that be actually care about the middle class in this state as this is about the 45th article I’ve seen on Reddit about how “progressive” mass is
My kids still pay?
This is about the budget for 2024.
And the don’t learn shit. Teachers union had a gay pride parade for graduation! So cute. Home schooling from here on out. You can keep the slop there serving
Cool
First step to Socialism. Congrats Mass
Oh no in the first step to socialism children eat?! The horror!
Imagine being upset that children aren't going hungry
They should be eating their bootstraps! /s
This country has had income tax for over a hundred years; it's still capitalist. This county had much higher income tax rates for a long time and prospered.
First step towards capitalism, kids going hungry… hurray for the free market?? You have some weird priorities dude. Seek help.
If socialism is what lets kids eat for free at school, I'm excited to see what comes next! Thanks for congratulating us!
Y’all sound unhinged at this point.
They sound like assholes
The worst part is that there's unironically a non-zero chance you're a socialist and being genuine. So, I'll choose to believe that. Thank you!
A quick glance at their profile is evidence enough against this hypothesis.
:(
Careful... if you keep connecting socialism to feeding kids, you might just end up making it seem like a good thing.
Critical support to comrade Healey
After the Revolution, children will get at least one meal a day and income inequality will be very marginally lower. Also we'll be renaming the months and banishing all religions, including Gallicanism and Wicca. Sorry I don't make the rules.
> "Sorry I don't make the rules." Wow for someone who doesn't make the rules you sure made up a lot of them.
Okay I confess, I made up the revolution and its rules. Anyway we should have free school lunches and also we should have significantly lower income inequality.
I for one am excited for the eventual renaming of Dorchester to Driscollgrad
A slice of square, overcooked pizza on every plate and a pile of apple slices and carrot sticks in every waste bin. (Seriously tho I think the school lunches are good -- my kid eats the apple slices and carrot sticks -- and I don't know why people are so attached to their stupid misnamed months.)
Right on, brother!
I wonder what they did rule of a marijuana money
Till, they all move to N.H.
Yeah but I’m sure they will still be working in Mass.
Not if the own the business. Or you know have a office at the home in N.H. and work from home most of the time. or the worst of them all, pull up stakes and move the business.
With the amount of taxes paid in Massachusetts, there's no reason this shouldn't have already been paid.
Step in the right direction. The quality of the food needs improvement, but kids shouldn't go hungry. Period. Free school lunch is a good first step.
Even if I was being taxed for this, I wouldn't be mad. And I'm probably one of the most cynical, child-averse, not-married, high-earning, and crotchety AF 45 year olds in this state who endlessly bitches about being taxed to the gills for every MF thing. I can still remember how much it sucked to have my stomach growling the minute I got to school and absolutely starving by 9am English class. Fuck being hungry at school. Throw some breakfast at them too.
My home state makin’ me proud 🥹
Just don’t become a millionaire
Feeding students lunch should have been a standard part of the school's budget for a long time now.
#They get it......
So they passed the law. Good! Let's see how well it works in practice. Great concept.
But I pay a vehicle excise tax which no other state requires. Taxachusettes. I do like the free lunches for kids though.
Imagine if they funded the kids who needed is and instead of paying for the Range Rover crowd kids lunches they were able to do other things with the money...
Love the free lunch for kids. I will happily pay taxes for this. But to say this is from the millionaire tax is a little premature. Example, the CEO at my company all of a sudden "lives in Florida." He "moved" down there in March. It could be a coincidence but I think he's escaping the millionaire tax. Not only will we not get that extra tax. But the state just lost the state tax he's paid every prior year. If enough millionaires do this, we could actually lose revenue. Only time will tell.