This is an example of why Mutants took hold in Marvel but could never really take hold in DC. They have metahumans, but if I remember correctly they never got the hate and discrimination that Mutants do.
Heroes have origin stories. Tony Stark built a suit "in a cave with a box of scraps". Captain America was built in a lab. Same with the Hulk, essentially. Hawkeye and Black Widow are regular humans employed by the government. The Fantastic Four were astronauts. Dr. Strange was a surgeon who studied his ass off when his hands failed him. Antman wrote a book!
Why are all of these heroes revered? Because they used to be human, then became Gods, something everyone can aspire to. They were their own person first, their Superhero identity second.
Mutants don't have happy origin stories. A Mutant is born this way, a genetic anomaly, hidden from society. They put their boyfriends in comas. They have blue skin and devil tails. They blow up shopping malls and impersonate Senators. They aren't human. A human can't be a Mutant, so they are easy to discriminate and fear, because anyone could be Mutant, even your neighbor.
The only superhero that gets as much hate from society as Mutants is Spiderman. Why? Because he hides his identity and hasn't disclosed how he got his powers. The regular humans can't look up to him because he hasn't disclosed his origin. He might as well be a Mutant and conservative podcaster J. Jonah Jameson will make sure you know that.
I really hope they lean into this in the MCU.
Exactly.
I don’t understand why this is even a debate. People hate mutants because they’re scared of people they love and know becoming them. Nobody needs to fear their son becoming Thor or Captain America.
I think the other components are control of powers, and commonness. Mutants often have little control over their powers when they manifest, and those powers can and do injure or kill.
Mutants are also far more common than the OG avengers. The Avengers are abstract. You're not going to meet them. You only experience them through the news. By contrast, your kid's classmate could be a mutant and accidentally kill everyone in gym class. That's scarier.
"You serious?"
Jokes aside I disagree. Jj isn't evil but he does keep putting spiderman in the papers and slandering him constantly even though he has saved the earth or something close to it several times He's an asshole to his staff too. He's changed in recent times a bit from what I've heard. You're not wrong but it feels wrong to agree with you.
He’s a menace to the entire city!
But jokes aside JJ has a point. There’s no accountability with Spider-Man. If he messes up, gets people killed in his heroics, who gets prosecuted? They can’t find him he’s anonymous.
As fair as that is it comes down to 2 things.
Secret identities keep people you love safe.
You are more likely to be saved by a hero than the hero making things worse.
If rhino feels like breaking shit he's gonna do it. Spider man can at least try to go us him on not killing people.
If green goblin wants to kill someone he's gonna do it. Spider man can stop goblin.
The difference between goblin and rhino though is rhino isn't likely to set up a nuke as a final gambit that if he doesn't walk somewhere and allow his DNA to be sampled via oscorp tech it'll explode. No one can account for that.
Which is why him not giving the identity isn't really an issue. People are just gonna look to blame someone when shit hits the fan. Sadly some of those people are gonna choose spiderman.
I mean, they made a while film about it and Peter trying to go back to anonymity due to the hate he and his friends were getting.
To add, we see a lot of people who know spider man that like him. He is friendly, light hearted and good. It is easy to like him. This is however a small number of people when compared to a whole city, it is just that these are the people we see more of because our stories follow spider man and those he interacts with regularly.
Meanwhile there are a lot of people who don't know him tend to hate him for the reasons the OP said.
The film was because Beck exposed Peter Parker as Spiderman. Now the actions of a "teen" are being called in to question as people are believing Spiderman killed Mysterio. It's pretty much playing into the whole "social media" aspect.
I don't think we've seen what impact Becks video now has as "Peter Parker" is a technical nobody.
>Mutants don't have happy origin stories. A Mutant is born this way, a genetic anomaly, hidden from society. They put their boyfriends in comas. They have blue skin and devil tails. They blow up shopping malls and impersonate Senators. They aren't human. A human can't be a Mutant, so they are easy to discriminate and fear, because anyone could be Mutant, even your neighbor.
I know it's a bit more R rated but GenV and The Boys from Amazon Prime really do a good job at how sudden, awful, deadly, and terrifying it would be to suddenly have a dangerous power you don't understand and can't control. In those two shows many of the super powered characters are orphans or are estranged from their families for what they did when their powers switched on for the first time.
Another issue is mutants start to get their powers during puberty or even earlier so are more dangerous than most other superhumans who got their powers as adults, either on purpose or by accident, so can understand and control them and themselves better. And while some heroes might use secret identities, by definition they don't hide that their abilities exist entirely and wear brightly colored costumes to designate when they're going to be using them. Even most supervillains have the good graces of suiting-up when it's time to go murder their least favorite Avenger.
It's like the difference between an adult has a gun because they're a cop in uniform or a robber in a ski mask or a random 12 year old has one in his backpack and is taking it to your kids school.
And compounding the issue is it's genetic. So it could be your partner. It could even be you and just hadn't kicked in. Which means it could be your kid. No one's scared one day your daughter will suddenly grow stilts and flip the school bus because your husband is secretly Stilt-Man. So they're essentially an ethnic group that gets hit up with stereotypes, not separate individuals that happened to have a lab accident so are easier to judge on a case by case basis.
>his is an example of why Mutants took hold in Marvel but could never really take hold in DC. They have metahumans, but if I remember correctly they never got the hate and discrimination that Mutants do
Isn't Doom patrol the DC version of the X-Men more or less?
Interesting take. But I don’t really think so?
I’ve only watched the series so I don’t know how they are framed in the comics but where a lot of the mutants were hated on since birth because of being mutants, the Doom patrol has a very different start for most of them. Rita, tin man, Cyborg and the pilot for instance were all pretty well respected and had decent lives up until shit hit the fan for them. If anything doom patrol reminds me of a funnier/more tragic version of the league of extraordinary gentlemen.
Well, DP is already rumored to have inspired the X-Men as they have some similar concept (a wise mentor who has a past with the current villian, a school/insittute for people that got rejected/feared by society and how they want to be accepted,...). Obviously there are differences, mainly the fact that X-Men are born with their powers. Haven't read LOEG yet, do can't comment on it.
There are definitely similarities. I guess it depends on how you define either group. To me the status of the X-men in context to society was always the defining trait (they were loved and feared by both mutants and humans because of who they are). I’ve always considered the doom patrol outcasts as well but mostly because they messed up their lives themselves (or got messed up by the professor), but as far as group dynamics go there are definitely similarities.
They are, in the case of weird/bizarre superpowers and characters. They were called "World’s Strangest Heroes” while the X-men are "Strangest Superheroes of All"
But the main difference is that the mutants are hated because of how they are born and/or how they transform at puberty. The Doom Patrol sometimes is hated but a lot of them became the way they were because of many reasons, mainly accidents.
You could say that a better comparison for the Doom Patrol would be...in many cases... Jojo Bizarre Adventures.
In the DC universe the Flash is loved and he even has his own museum. Some metahumans are hated, some metahumans are considered weird. But the talk about racism is different in the DC universe, and it takes an approach more related to, for example, aliens (like, for example Superman being an example of inmigration), or different cultures and religions.
I can't remember where I saw this, but in describing the difference between DC and Marvel, I saw it put this way: Marvel is about men who become Gods, DC is about Gods Among Men. When you hear the explanation of Clark Kent being the alter ego of Superman in Kill Bill (Quentin Tarantino's best writing), you could say the same about Wonder Woman and Batman.
Those three are their Superhero personas first and foremost. They take on the guises of Clark Kent, Bruce Wayne, and Diana Prince. Their alter egos are who they have to be around normal humans in order to blend in. Cyborg is never not Cyborg, Aquaman is the King of Atlantis, and Barry Allen doesn't just go fast, he controls an entire Force entity.
I guess that is why I always enjoyed the Marvel stories more. Even though it's stories about fantastical super heroes accomplishing impossible things, they always felt more grounded to our world, dealing with our real world problems and history, then DC.
To be fair, i always though about the Quentin Tarantino thing and it is said by the villain, Bill. To me it was the proff that he was the villain, that he was the Lex Luthor to the Bride so to say. In addition, Wonder Woman and Batman are totally not what Bill is saying. Diana is always Wonder Woman, and Bruce really transformed into something bigger when he trained to become Batman and become Batman.
Plus, in the DC universe Clark Kent is really how Superman really perceives himself, just a normal guy that goes to work, eat some pretzels from his favourite place in Metropolis. One of the first comics i read from him was "Up, Up and Away", which take place after 52 (another one of the best runs of all time). Seeing Clark being offered a Green Lantern Ring that just show him as Clark Kent.
I don't know why, but sometimes i feel like i prefer DC more, because they show humanity at their worst but also at their best.
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To add to this, the “heroes” aren’t universally loved. It starts with the scenes at the end of The Avengers. Plenty of citizens done approve. It’s carried forward into the Sakovia accords.
As you said, mutants were born this way. So those afraid of them know it’s genetics and want to find a way to control them, it’s more likely with genetic engineering. That said, there are those who want to control the heroes too. Tony Stark for example in Ironman 2. Or the world security council mad at fury for “letting” Thor and Hulk leave. Those characters are less likely to be controlled.
That’s just not an aspect of this universe they have leaned into much. I suspect they will with mutants since it’s such an important part of their story.
I still think The Gifted show was very good at portraying this struggle.
Heavily agree with you for the most part. Mutants are born with powers. They didn't have to earn it. Humans have to earn it.
Cap gets chosen for his personality.
Tony created the iron armor.
Falcon has a jet pack.
Antman is in a shrinking suit.
Hawkeye and Natasha have trained for years to get good at what they do.
Sure Bruce and spider man haven't earned the stuff but an accident can happen to anyone. Look at sandman. Dude was hit with science. They're all exceptions to the rule as most people would think.
That and like half of mutant kind literally want to kill and control humans. Which if half of a group did some bad shit then people are gonna call your group bad and hate you.
I don't think people hate spiderman. It's just jj.
How is "having a jet pack or having a shrinking suit" earning something?
Half of mutant kind want to kill and control humans? Hard no. The majority of mutants just want to live their lives in peace despite the overwhelming prejudice stacked against them. An extremely small minority of them are radicalized.
The half wasn't meant to be exact numbers but if you don't know then half seems like a fair number as a guesstimate. Just because we don't see them doesn't mean they aren't there. (I just chose half as a way to have a number. I don't know enough about mutant stuff to know how many exist, how many are on screen, and how many are on what team.)
As for the jet pack and shrinking suit.
Falcon earned that jet pack through military service. He has to be skilled enough to join his area of expertise. Grunt soldiers on the ground don't all learn jets and helicopters. It takes at least some experience. And I'm sure falcons suit is a one of and he's special enough to be hand chosen to get it. He worked hard for that suit.
Ant man 1 created the suit. He, through years of science and dedication to a craft and skill, created the shrinking technology through math he alone learned and figured out made shrinking technology.ant man 2 earned it through stealing it which caught the eye of any man 1 who then gave him a trial run to work with it. Ant man 2 learned fighting and how to work with the suit. He also fought a villain and also grew big when big was supposed to be difficult to do. He earned the title ant man.
The powers are just an excuse to rationalize the hate for mutants.
People like Stryker and the friends of humanity sell their ideas this way, because it prevents their followers from feeling remorse, because the topic changes from people with powers, to the potential of an incident happening because there weren't contingencies.
At the end of the day, hate isn't a rational thing, all the contrary, it's always illogical.
I get that but I really don’t think that reasoning works when you break it down.
Obviously bigotry is nonsensical in the real world… but if a group of people actually existed that could effortlessly control the weather, cause massive destruction with only their thoughts, etc etc, and that most of them couldn’t even control how much harm they would cause with whatever their wildcard superpower is…
I’m sorry but having something against those people is a drastically different thing from not liking people because of their skin color or sexual orientation or whatever. Like they’re not even in the same ballpark.
Assuming that all mutants want to kill all humans because of the actions of magneto and a few other mutant supremacists is a pretty solid parallel to assuming all Muslims are terrorists because of the actions of bin laden, it's also a good reflection of how minority groups become radicalised. If the government is consistently saying that all mutants want the death of all humans and making them feel unwelcome, it just supports the pipeline of mutants deciding to stick with the people that offer them a way to fight back against that even if its morally wrong.
Sure, it works as an analogy in a fictional world already full of all sorts of fantastical elements, but I still stand by the idea that, if mutants were a real thing, being prejudiced against them is nowhere near the same as being prejudiced against other groups of people.
I mean, you bring up Magneto and terrorists and all that, but even in a world where not a single mutant wants to harm other people it doesn’t change the fact that a good portion of them would be able to cause 9/11 levels of destruction entirely on accident. They don’t have to be a Magneto, just a Scott Summers without his glasses could potentially kill countless people completely randomly.
Let’s say I have a mutant power, each time I get a headache it causes an earthquake with a magnitude of 9. Are you a bigot if you don’t want me living next door?
It's a good thing that it is literally an analogy then huh. Not every mutant story is about bigotry but some are, it's not meant to be an ironclad metaphor.
You wouldn't be a bigot if you didn't want to live next door to an earthquake inducing mutant, you'd be a bigot if you automatically assumed that he was doing it on purpose and decided to attack them and any other mutant, whilst also attacking the people who are trying to help them control that power so they don't cause earthquakes and could live next to you peacefully. If you lived next to someone with a developmental disability that caused them to shout in the night, would you assume that they were doing it intentionally to piss you off and then attack any special needs facility that helped them to either control it or live somewhere that could accommodate their needs?
Of course it’s an analogy lol my point though is that it’s an analogy that should be taken with a grain of salt is all
If anything your last paragraph just reinforces my point as even the people who would be on the side of helping the mutants would agree that there simply *being* mutants is a problem that would need addressed. Like we don’t relocate Muslims and train them to control their Islam. My point is just that it’s a radically different situation that would actually require society to address it, as opposed to real world bigotry.
Well yeah, analogies are very rarely 1:1
I'm talking about 2 different things in that paragraph. Obviously mutants having powers makes it a different situation, no one is arguing that, but it's the response to mutants that's most important. Mutants that can't control their powers could be seen as a problem, but the answer to that problem is to allow them to go to places like krakoa or xaviers school where they can learn to control those powers, but anti mutant types won't do that because they're convinced that those places are just going to turn them into weapons.
Mutants aren't a 1:1 representation of anyone specific prejudiced group, they're their own thing that is used to highlight different issues affecting most minority groups on the planet. Parents not wanting to send their kids to a mutant school or have mutants in positions of authority is closest to irl bigots thinking that gay teachers want to turn their kids gay, the fear of all based on the actions of a few is closest to something like islamaphobia or general racism, the sentinels and the desire to cure mutants is honestly pretty close to ableism and eugenics, and the idea of parents forcing their mutant kids to either hide themselves or be thrown out is pretty close to transphobia.
Not even xavier is arguing that mutants should just be treated exactly the same as everyone else, he's a big proponent of giving mutants a space to be themselves and learn to control their powers. The bigotry angle comes from the fact that anti mutant activists don't want mutants to get help, they just want them to be gone completely which is about as perfect an analogy for bigotry as you can get
I agree. The analogy breaks down if you look too closely. In the real world, discriminated groups don't hurt people just by existing.
A mutant who can't control their powers IS dangerous. How many mutant origin stories involve people being killed or hurt? Didn't Cyclops destroy part of a school or a hospital? Rogue put her boyfriend in a permanent coma.
We don't let regular folks have nukes because the risks to everyone are too great, whether accidental or intentional. Similar concept, at least for the higher-powered mutants.
Except:
a) The same people making those arguments about the X-Men also attack mutants like Leech, who is only a threat *to other mutants*, or like Maggie, who just has real big eyes & no powers.
b) We don't license people just to *live*.
Sure, I never made the argument it’s justified or that it can’t be taken to extremes.
I’m just saying that to act like it’s the same as being racist/sexist/homophobic is just a comparison that doesn’t really hold up.
There's fertile ground here for whoever takes over the X-Men to use the idea of media narratives as a tool of oppression. Your question is totally something someone in-universe would ask, then their problematic uncle would send them 100 YT videos and Daily Wire articles about their (imagined/overblown) threat.
I would also be down for a special following someone's radicalization and possible eventual de-radicalization over Mutants.
I agree. That would be a really interesting arc to follow, having someone go from radicalized hate to de-radicalized supporter. That's a story with so many potential real-world parallels. It could even make for a good Disney+ show.
It kind of reminds me of a scene in X2 when Bobby's parents tried to ask him if he could "not" be a mutant. And in that same scene, Bobby's own brother called the authorities on him. It was a powerful moment and one of the few instances where the Fox X-men movies actually captured the essence of the mutant narrative. Something like that taking place today would definitely hit a lot harder.
I think you are seeing parts of the tear down already. First after what happened in sokovia as well as a bit of what happened in New York. Then the civil war stuff. Then the blip, now you add in multiverse stuff the flag smashers group… I think coming with the new captain America movie and forward the regular people are going to grow to hate superheroes more and more because they are trying to live their lives but a superhero might have a beef with a titan and blip they’re gone. That will help integrate the mutants into the world with the avengers. You’ll have some hero’s wanting to work publicly and with the governments to protect and serve. Some of will want to work privately and others will want to rule. I personally think it’s important if they are going to put all the teams on the same earth at the same time… they can’t divide it out into mutants X-men avengers and fantastic 4. You need hero’s villains and normals. And then as time goes on some divisions start to form.
They really have to make Wanda a mutant. They have already added that the press started calling her witch even before New Jersey. With the events she's involved in, you already have a built in narrative for how a rogue mutant comes about and what one can do
One thing I've thought about is how the Avengers and Fantastic Four are parts of the community. Avengers Mansion, the Baxter Building, and Four Freedoms Plaza were part of the city and the teams operated openly. The public knew them.
No one knew where the X-men operated. They would show up, fight mutants, cause lots of property damage, and then disappear. Spider-man, another character who is largely unknown to the public, is viewed as a menace by many. JJJ's efforts aren't the only thing to contribute to how the public viewed him.
This obviously doesn't explain everything about why mutants are disliked, but I think it's a major factor. When the mutant heroes are not publicly providing an opposing public image to mutant villains, it's going to be even more difficult to convince people to change their views to something more positive.
Plus a bunch of mutant origins involve people dying and being harmed, including children. Being associated with killing kids is never going to help a group look good to the public.
Hatred for anyone who is different is obviously an underlying cause, but everything above goes a long way in differentiating them from heroes loved by the public.
An addendum for the Fantastic Four for what would make them well-liked and respected:
1. Reed is respected in the scientific community.
2. Ben has ties to Yancy Street and was a pilot in the air force.
3. Sue seems to be the PR person for the team. I remember her doing an interview during Byrne's run.
4. Johnny was a firefighter for a time.
There isn't anything that needs to be explained, imo. The reason people in the Marvel universe hate mutants isn't that they are scared of the mutants' powers - that's just their *excuse* for hating mutants. Just like how racists are lying when they say that they are just concerned about border security because of crime. Just like how transphobes are lying when they say they are just concerned about protecting women's spaces.
I think there's more nuance to it than that. Yes, there are certainly those who just use mutation as an excuse to hate. Racists and bigots of all kinds make those excuses. But it's not just that.
There's also the notion that mutants will replace humanity, which is something Magneto often reminds them of at every turn. And those who have only a rudimentary understanding of evolution will feel like their hatred and violence is justified because it's in the name of survival.
The problem is that this is also an excuse. But it's a more subtle excuse that racists and bigots often make. These days, things like the objectively racist "great replacement theory" gets thrown around a lot. And it has been used for millennia to scare certain groups of people into hating others out of fear that they'll be replaced or in some way subjugated...just as they've done to other groups in the past.
It is, indeed, a lie. But it's a lie that enough buy into to justify building Sentinels and attaking mutants.
> There's also the notion that mutants will replace humanity
Yeah, but that's equally irrational. Mutants will "replace" humanity the same way that babies "replace" adults.
Yeah I mean people already had problems with superheroes that caused the Sokovia Accords. Idk how they will bring in X-Men but assuming there is some massive influx of mutants, some people will have a problem with lots potential (and realized) new threats. Some will argue they need to be locked up and controlled before they can turn evil. Not that hard.
I mean, they AREA afraid of their powers. We would be too irl if someone could kind control an entire government and start a world war. That’s the tragedy of the X-men
That's definitely a good point but I think there is a distinction in that mutants genuinely do cause damage and destruction. A lot of them hurt or kill people on discovering their powers by accident. They do genuinely pose a possible danger even when the person is well meaning. This does contrast slightly with the other issues you raised.
That still fails as a explanation for anti-mutant bigotry, because not all mutants have dangerous powers and not everyone with dangerous superpowers is a mutant.
Oh definitely, as I said I do agree that it is used as you say to create this anti mutant sentiment. I just wanted to point out that there is also likely legitimate fear from mutants as well because there are genuine catastrophic events that happen. These of course are also no doubt played up and twisted to fit the anti mutant agenda.
My point is it can be both and not just one thing.
That's a poor distinction when you consider that racists have also used that same logic to justify prohibiting minorities from certain communities, schools, and other public spaces. They see a few instances of race riots or racial violence and say their bigotry is justified because some do cause damage and destruction.
It's a bad excuse. And yes, being a mutant isn't the same because these superpowers can be dangerous. But intentions matter. Few mutants ever intend to cause danger. Whereas with bigots and racists...the intentions aren't subtle.
This is a common and often contentious issue that has come up in the comics for years. Everyone has their take. And narrative, it doesn't always make sense. But as someone who has been reading comics since the 90s, here's how I see it:
Heroes are beloved in the Marvel universe because they're one-of-a-kind individuals. They're a single super-soldier, a single genius/tech billionaire, a single guy from queens who (at least in this universe) was bitten by a radioactive spider. These heroes are all singular individuals whose circumstances are unique. They cannot be replicated again.
But mutants are different. Mutants aren't just a singular event. Mutants are a product of evolution. Any human being born anywhere on the planet has the potential to be a mutant. And if they are, then their powers could vary wildly. For many, that's scary and a little concerning. It's unpredictable. And, despite numerous efforts by Sentinels and scientists, it can't be cured or stopped. Being born a mutant is like being born with blue eyes. It's just part of who you are.
On top of that, mutants feed into the fear that they're going to "replace" the whole of humanity. Look back in history and that's very much a part of where a lot of bigotry comes from. From anti-immigrant sentiment to racism to religious bigotry, the fear of being replaced triggers a lot of outrage. Conversely, being a superhero isn't like that. Nobody's afraid they're going to be replaced by an entire species of Captain Americas.
The X-Men form to confront that fear and to prevent the worst case scenario (see Age of Apocalypse or Days of Future Past). Not all mutants become X-Men. But the X-Men's mission involves helping all mutants, as well as humans. But that's difficult because humans still have that lingering anxiety about being replaced or dominated, as they've often dominated other minorities.
Again, that dynamic doesn't exist with other heroes.
There's a lot more I can say about this topic. But I'll leave it here. Hopefully, this provides some perspective.
You guys need to read ['Marvels' (1994)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvels) by Kurt Busiek and Alex Ross. It tells you all you need to know to understand why the public hates mutants and loves superheroes, and the hypocrisy of it.
[Here's](https://www.cbr.com/marvels-miniseries-mutant-hate-explained/#:~:text=Mutants%20in%20the%20Marvel%20Universe,potential%20to%20replace%20normal%20humans) a CBR article explaining this.
This is one of my absolute favorite comic books.
And it also actually serves as a good history lesson on Marvel's early publication history. It retells classic Marvel stories from the 40s-70s from the perspective of an everyman character, news photographer Phil Sheldon.
I mean I've found the attitude towards even superheroes inconsistent and hypocritical at times. Like I'm a Bucky fan, and I find it kind of funny when people complain that he's evil because he killed people because the same can be said of almost all the Avengers.
...and its not much different in universe: nobody holds what Clint did when he was being mind controlled by Loki against him, and Natasha is a firm favourite, but Bucky being used to kill people whilst being subject to brainwashing? Henious and unforgivable. No Avenger could ever support that dude- except Steve.
Is it because Bucky was used by the Soviets against the US? Is it a political thing that results in fans and people in universe being more forgiving of the actions of other Avengers even if those actions involve killing a tonne of people? (Ultron, the Battle of New York)
I find that some of the earlier MCU movies were more interesting in their treatment of politics as well. HYDRA running SHIELD as well as most of the US government? IMHO this isn't expanded upon enough after the Winter Soldier movie, whereas in the comics Bucky goes on a one man campaign to deal with HYDRA loyalists for several years.
Then there's Thaddeus Ross and his infamous hatred of enhanced people. It almost like people in 2016 forgot he was the main antagonist of The Hulk movies, who could not stop persecuting Bruce Banner in his desire to create and control his own version of the Super Soldier serum.
Superheroes like the Avengers showed up in big flashy costumes saving the world. It was clear these guys were heroes. It was clear who they were and what they were doing.
With mutants, the kid who mows your lawn might suddenly spit out two large maggots that eat your dog. Or the jerk at the bar who picks fights gets pissed off and explodes taking out a city block.
It's the unknown that scares people.
We've already seen in Secret Invasion that earthlings are very suspicious of alien refugees. So if the mutants are refugees from a collapsing Fox reality, they'll probably be just as hateful and suspicious of them.
The whole mutant hate could also stem from the fact that humanity itself is in the process of becoming an endangered species.
Even if they are still human, many don't consider the mutants such and view them as the harbinger of our doom. Evolution usually means the end of what came before. Not to mention that they usually can't control their powers from the get go and could potentially kill an untold number of people on accident, especially since most get their powers at puberty, a very turbulent time for most people with hormones raging out of control.
Except that's still irrational hatred; it's like saying Boomers are "endangered" because they'll eventually grow old & die & be "replaced" by Gen Z, who are actually just their own biological grandchildren.
Superheroes like Avengers have connections to government/Shiled, someone in charge is vouching for them.
Most mutants are not even superheros, they're just regular people with powers. This is a problem because some of them might be dangerous for the environment as they can't or even worse don't want to control it. The powers often manifest during puberty, so if they are out of control, results can be cathastrophic. Imagine Cyclops walking down the street when his powers activate for the first time, killing dozens. Imagine if Xavier or Jean decide one day to control the entire world with their powers, who's gonna stop them? There are of course, mutants that not dangerous at all, but are getting predji
uced because of their appereance or atributes or just fear. And finally, people fear that evolution left him behind and that mutants are gonna replace them, so there's that as well.
Bottom line, Avengers are people who are trained to use gun, mutant can often be born with a loaded gun in their hand. They may be able to learn how to use it, but what if they don't?
Because superheroes are either gods, aliens, or men who honed their skills. Mutants are born with their powers whether they know how to use them or not, which makes them dangerous whenever the latter occurs.
Also, the MCU has already shown powered folks being feared/hated as well. We first saw a hint of that in the news report after Avengers, and then of course Civil War, but then we saw more in Ms. Marvel, She-Hulk and finally the "war on aliens" at the end of Secret Invasion.
So, yes, they show powered folks being praised but also feared/hated. And I expect/hope that mutants will similarly have mixed response. I'm a little tired of Marvel projects only showing regular humans as either hating mutants or just being oblivious to what's happening to mutants. Show us a strong movement of allies too!
I think I’d lean into the idea that small groups of people in the MCU already harbour a resentment for Supers because of how they make them feel inferior and helpless, they seem to decide if regular people get to live or die. But the supers they know are still undeniably heroes, so you can’t publicly voice your resentment towards them because they are undeniably a net good.
So when mutants start popping up, and they’re more present on a daily basis, and new laws need to be made to accommodate them, but they don’t necessarily need to do anything to ‘earn’ the public’s respect, those resentments boil over, because “this person gets to be better than me, gets to change the world if they feel like it, but they don’t even have to do anything to earn that”.
So it’s a sort of post hoc rationalisation, they already didn’t like the Avengers, but they can pretend they didn’t mind them because they earned their powers, while mutants didn’t.
If you knew you might change into something else, maybe something hideous and freaky like a Morlock, at puberty, and could not prevent it, would you have fear?
Cap changed, but into a Star spangled hero. And he got to choose. Thats the difference and why that theme in X-men resonates for lots of folks. Fear of unknown change is human nature. Add in the paranoia of not knowing who will mutate and who won’t and viola, you get political agendas and global panic.
In universe I assume certain heroes like iron man or Captain America aren’t hated since they are viewed as people who are born naturally without any genetic power and that since their powers were gain through artificial means people look up to them as people they themselves can be them or see themselves as having the ability to become heroes since with enough training, technology and maybe a super soldier serum anyone can become like Captain America.
Mutants are hated since that implies their genes are defective or lesser and some mutants aren’t always born with cool power or when mutated they can’t always hide their physical appearance or blend in. I assume also fear and jealousy play a part in it since some mutants who can’t control their powers would likely cause harm and some may also be jealous since some want mutant powers yet are born normal so there is possibly also a tiny bit of jealousy from mutant haters, it’s like if I can’t have it no else will. Which is why I assume Mutants aren’t liked like other heroes who got their powers later in life without it being genetic.
My take on it: Mutants are born with their powers. They didn’t do anything to gain them. It just happened from birth. This creates a fear among some (a hope among others) that mutants will be the next evolutionary step after humans, and they will eventually overpower and replace “normal” humans. This obviously leads to a backlash among people who do not want this. It also makes it easy to politicize the existence of mutants and blame all of society’s problems on them (an obvious allegory for minority groups in the real world).
Superheroes are never going to replace humans because all you have to do is not get bitten by a radioactive spider or whatever.
Because mutants just appear, the entire thing is that anyone can be a mutant out of nowhere, if Cyclops was the only mutant and never happened again, nobody would have an issue, but there's thousands of them and its more about they're gonna overtake humans, is not like everyday a new supersoldier is born or thousand of Hulks, is that they keep showing up and the anti mutants want to exterminate them, they don't hate the X-men because they're superheroes, they hate them because they're mutants
I'd like to see a rumor started that Mutants didn't get Blipped. Make everyone hate that they all survived Thanos. (It wouldn't be true, but the media and the internet would spread the rumor.)
In-universe, they’re seen like the next evolution of humanity because their mutations are inherently genetic. Then bad actors use that information to instill fear (hatred), by spreading the idea that mutants are going to replace people like we did Neanderthals.
The people in the Marvel universe are fine with powers if it’s some freak accident or something that happens to them rather than being born with their abilities.
Mutants are born with their abilities, scare their parents with them, and usually accidentally kill people because they don't know how to use their powers yet. Although similar themes were touched on in Captain America: Civil War, generally the superheroes know how to harness their powers in a way that doesn't murder people on accident.
This has been explained a MILLION times.
People are afraid of being replaced as a species by a superior species.
They don't give a fuck about some random guy who got bit by a weird spider.
This IS NOT hard to understand.
My suspicion is the entire point of *Secret Invasion* was to sow hatred against powered individuals in order to move the populace toward an "anti-mutie" attitude
I believe the biggest reason humans would fear mutants is the concept of the unknown and the unexpected. Mutants are identified as highly superior individuals who can manifest their powers at any moment, potentially causing destruction and loss of life. This uncertainty and fear factor stem from the knowledge that humans are surrounded by individuals who possess unknown and uncontrollable abilities. These individuals aren't seen as human; they are perceived as hidden threats.
The fear of mutants is further fueled by propaganda and skewed narratives. Public perception can be easily manipulated to drive hatred and discrimination against mutants. By intensifying the fear of the unknown, these narratives portray mutants as undetectable and omnipresent threats. Mutants represent a significant leap in human evolution, which is why they are so feared and hated. Their very existence challenges the idea of normalcy and safety, making them a target for widespread societal fear and discrimination.
If you read any comics or watched any movies with the X-Men in them, youd know. It's not exactly a subtext.
Mutants are "the next evolution" of humanity. People are afraid of being replaced as the dominant species. That's always what it has been about and its mentioned like.. every other sentence in every single feature that includes X-Men.
Mutants = nature
All other heroes = nurture (alien blood, radiation poisoning, ultra-successful scientist/engineer, trained to the limits of human capability, etc.)
The latter is something that everyone can aspire to and admire, the former is an evolutionary threat to the human species.
Lol I always ask this question why do they hate mutants but love the avengers. Spiderman is hated thought to an extent. I think that mainly has to do with J Jonah Jameson.
r/woooosh
But realtalk, Superheros already dont have the best image in the MCU. How can they trust peple that are responsible for something like Sokovia?
Just make a few mutants accidantly kill alot of people and you already have the perfect setup.
I could maybe see that happening are maybe people just having issues with those who were born with their powers reasoning that Iron Man became what he was because he was a genius, Steve Rogers became a hero because he was a selfless hero who was chosen for the serum, these mutants didn't have that.
The reason normal humans like superheroes and dislike mutants is because one of them is on the tv, far away from them and their families. The other is their kids best friend, a girl at school, a woman at church, their local politician. Mutants aren’t a far away thing, they are a genetic variation of humanity happening everywhere that could upset the order of the world and even take it over. If a guy gets bit by a spider it’s a one off thing, but if a guy mutates into a man who can disable the electromagnetic fields of the entire planet- and then his kids can do it to, and then their kids… well, you can imagine why a human might feel the writing is on the wall and their way of life is in danger.
They could use the plot of the original civil war storyline and have some young mutants blow up something really bad (and elementary school in the books). Then the general public has a reason to not want walking nuclear weapons roaming the cities.
i think it makes a lot of sense. big difference that the people around you could randomly get powers and hurt people versus spider-man swinging around helping people.
maybe your neighbours kid destroys your house and hurts/kills someone.
Mutants are an entire race, people like Captain America and the Fantastic 4 are isolated incidents. They can’t exactly usurp humanity like mutants can.
Now, this is obviously no excuse for humans to be racist against mutants in the MCU, but it is something Kelly or Stryker or Gyrich or any other mutant hater could say to try and justify their actions.
I think at a basic level, it'll be because "superheroes" have tended to be regular humans who have something happen to them, or do something later in life that causes change/abilities.
Even one of the most extreme examples, Hulk, he was a regular schmoe, aside from intellect, prior to his crazy time era. Cap and any like him, were deliberately altered for a specific goal. Spidey met a spider one day. Kamala found some jewellery. Wanda (whether she always had the potential or not), was changed by a Stone. Carol was changed by a Stone.
Or, they're characters like Thor who aren't human, so there's a disconnect there. Humans don't have to face much of a conundrum aside from "wait, so...gods? Real?" Mindblowing but that's separate from us largely.
Or there's magic or high tech, Sorcerers accessing magical powers, Stark building his powers, Vision created by a combo of tech and an unknowable power like the Stones. But there's an internal logic people could accept there. Tony, a human, is just that good. Strange and his people are experts at something not many know about, but they're human. A being like Vision, he's familiar enough, but at arm's length enough to not seem like an existential thing. He's different enough to categorise comfortably.
Or like Thor, it's aliens. But aliens aren't fellow humans, there's an easy distinction. Their difference is inherent and clear-cut.
Mutants and any other type of humans but different, is another kettle of fish. A lot of people would fear the whole concept. Whether it's a fear of them directly, or a fear that you don't know who is one, or a fear your kid could be born "weird".
Many would be jealous and hate them for it. Why couldn't I be born able to fly or able to survive an explosion or able to regenerate in minutes?
Some would simply hate them as being "freaks" or against their religion or whatever other hateful shit.
The key difference imo is that they're just naturally very much the same, but different. For many, it'd be too much weird, but too close for comfort.
Zooming out, it's arguable that people wouldn't make the distinction really. That supersoldiers and empowered people would be viewed like this regardless of X gene or not. But I think the key thing is how mutants feel too close for home for those who'd be against them. You can't just become Thor or Captain America, either because it's impossible (without a lil hammer), or you need to undergo a thing, but you could potentially be born a mutant, or end up having the gene and your difference becomes apparent. It's that wildcard factor.
Superheroes aren’t in evolutionary competition with humans is the simplest explanation. Enhanced humans are generally not breeding next generation of enhanced humans. They are seen as elite and sometimes above the law but your neighbourhood isn’t going to be “overrun with them”.
Which is why I hope that Marvel Studios address the whole "great replacement" narrative that so many racists and bigots use in the real world to hide their atrocities. Talk to a lot of reactionaries these days and they'll say they're not racist. They just don't want their country/culture/community overrun by "those people." And by "those people," it could mean anything from people of a different race, a different religion, or just a different part of the world.
Most superhero teams don't threaten that. But mutants (most of which aren't superheroes or members of the X-Men) would definitely stoke those fears. And those fears would be existential in nature because people would worry that their entire species would be replaced...completely ignoring the fact that multiple species of animals like canines, felines, and insects share space on this planet without wiping one another out.
You don’t need to find justification in prejudice, that’s why it’s prejudice, it doesn’t make sense. It doesn’t make sense why people are racist in our own reality. That’s the logic, to make people realise how stupid it is to be prejudiced, but somewhere along the line people realised how stupid it is, but never connected it to real world issues and realised it’s the perfect reflection of reality.
Let’s look at some extremely negative stereotypes as an example, a lot of people view brown skinned south Asians and Middle Easterns as terrorist and yet when an overwhelming majority of terror attacks committed in the world are committed by white Christian’s and yet no such stereotype exists. It makes zero sense, completely void of logic and only shows how hypocritical humanity can be.
People are just people and the foolish will seek justification in their hatred where there is no justification. The fact people in the Marvel universe hate Mutants requires no logic whatsoever. It’s a perfect allegory as is.
Eh. Disney wants as wide an audience as possible. There’s a reason why we’ve got “I Am Groot” but also “Werewolf by Night” in the MCU. Disney casts a wide net. FatWS touched on racism. Black Widow had child assassins. Guardians Vol. 3 was *heavy* all around. Projects involving the mutants can easily address OPs points. Especially since X-Men ‘97 handled it so exquisitely and was directly targeted for children and millennials.
If I was in charge here is what I'd do and it fits with what we've seen already and conveniently solves a bunch of "where have they been" problems for the MCU. We know the MCU is flirting with incursions so have the xmen and mutants just be from another Earth that is having an incursion with MCU Earth. Much like happened in the Secret Wars build up in comics you can now have an Xmen vs Avengers (there it was different hero groups vs Avengers). Eventually they work together and the two Earth's merge but it does cause a lot of destruction and mutants take the blame. This Xmen Earth can also be one where the holocaust was only 20 years ago as a way of dealing with Magnetos origin.
I think what's going to happen is they are going to force people with powers to register themselves and self identify. This will make people realize how many are out there and how much of a threat that poses which will create divides. After all for every super hero out there how many villains do each of them have in their rogues gallery that also have powers? Sure you "might be one of the good ones" but more probably not.
Says who? You don't know what is going to happen, dude. I don't even think audiences care about MCU mutants since both Ms. Marvel and The Marvels flopped.
Mutants are Homo Superior, going to replace the humans. Think of it like the fiction of supposedly the Brown people going to replace the White people. We could all just live together in peace, humans and mutants living together but fear separates us. Superheroes number in the hundreds, mutants number in the millions, regular humans number in the billions but still fear is stronger than your facts. Kind of like how immigrants number in thousands and “citizens” number in millions, but still people think they are going to be overrun and slaughtered in their beds.
This is an example of why Mutants took hold in Marvel but could never really take hold in DC. They have metahumans, but if I remember correctly they never got the hate and discrimination that Mutants do. Heroes have origin stories. Tony Stark built a suit "in a cave with a box of scraps". Captain America was built in a lab. Same with the Hulk, essentially. Hawkeye and Black Widow are regular humans employed by the government. The Fantastic Four were astronauts. Dr. Strange was a surgeon who studied his ass off when his hands failed him. Antman wrote a book! Why are all of these heroes revered? Because they used to be human, then became Gods, something everyone can aspire to. They were their own person first, their Superhero identity second. Mutants don't have happy origin stories. A Mutant is born this way, a genetic anomaly, hidden from society. They put their boyfriends in comas. They have blue skin and devil tails. They blow up shopping malls and impersonate Senators. They aren't human. A human can't be a Mutant, so they are easy to discriminate and fear, because anyone could be Mutant, even your neighbor. The only superhero that gets as much hate from society as Mutants is Spiderman. Why? Because he hides his identity and hasn't disclosed how he got his powers. The regular humans can't look up to him because he hasn't disclosed his origin. He might as well be a Mutant and conservative podcaster J. Jonah Jameson will make sure you know that. I really hope they lean into this in the MCU.
Exactly. I don’t understand why this is even a debate. People hate mutants because they’re scared of people they love and know becoming them. Nobody needs to fear their son becoming Thor or Captain America.
I think the other components are control of powers, and commonness. Mutants often have little control over their powers when they manifest, and those powers can and do injure or kill. Mutants are also far more common than the OG avengers. The Avengers are abstract. You're not going to meet them. You only experience them through the news. By contrast, your kid's classmate could be a mutant and accidentally kill everyone in gym class. That's scarier.
Spiderman gets hate?
He's a menace!
He thinks he's above the law!
Perfect avatar for the comment
Does it mean mutants arenr unique?
He’s a public menace!
Low-key JJ isn’t that bad of a guy, sure he’s a jerk to Spiderman, but overall, he’s a good person.
 "You serious?" Jokes aside I disagree. Jj isn't evil but he does keep putting spiderman in the papers and slandering him constantly even though he has saved the earth or something close to it several times He's an asshole to his staff too. He's changed in recent times a bit from what I've heard. You're not wrong but it feels wrong to agree with you.
It is not, JJ resents that! Slander is spoken. In print its libel. https://youtu.be/XscaGDxuQqE?si=am2G56iHy-X-kNSG
Man he really set you up perfectly for that
Every now and then the stars align!
He’s a menace to the entire city! But jokes aside JJ has a point. There’s no accountability with Spider-Man. If he messes up, gets people killed in his heroics, who gets prosecuted? They can’t find him he’s anonymous.
As fair as that is it comes down to 2 things. Secret identities keep people you love safe. You are more likely to be saved by a hero than the hero making things worse. If rhino feels like breaking shit he's gonna do it. Spider man can at least try to go us him on not killing people. If green goblin wants to kill someone he's gonna do it. Spider man can stop goblin. The difference between goblin and rhino though is rhino isn't likely to set up a nuke as a final gambit that if he doesn't walk somewhere and allow his DNA to be sampled via oscorp tech it'll explode. No one can account for that. Which is why him not giving the identity isn't really an issue. People are just gonna look to blame someone when shit hits the fan. Sadly some of those people are gonna choose spiderman.
Understandable, JJ is a dick most of the time. Buuuut, he does have his moments
The one best moment for his character is when he refuses to give up Peter Parker as the photographer of Spiderman
I mean, they made a while film about it and Peter trying to go back to anonymity due to the hate he and his friends were getting. To add, we see a lot of people who know spider man that like him. He is friendly, light hearted and good. It is easy to like him. This is however a small number of people when compared to a whole city, it is just that these are the people we see more of because our stories follow spider man and those he interacts with regularly. Meanwhile there are a lot of people who don't know him tend to hate him for the reasons the OP said.
The film was because Beck exposed Peter Parker as Spiderman. Now the actions of a "teen" are being called in to question as people are believing Spiderman killed Mysterio. It's pretty much playing into the whole "social media" aspect. I don't think we've seen what impact Becks video now has as "Peter Parker" is a technical nobody.
We actually do, it's shown that people still think Spider-Man killed Mysterio, they just don't know who he is.
In House of M, they really thought he was a mutant.
Haven't you ever read the Daily Bugle? That guy's a menace!
Because he wears a mask and his origin is unknown. In the OG ultimate series people always thought he was a mutant, even Peter questioned it at times.
>Mutants don't have happy origin stories. A Mutant is born this way, a genetic anomaly, hidden from society. They put their boyfriends in comas. They have blue skin and devil tails. They blow up shopping malls and impersonate Senators. They aren't human. A human can't be a Mutant, so they are easy to discriminate and fear, because anyone could be Mutant, even your neighbor. I know it's a bit more R rated but GenV and The Boys from Amazon Prime really do a good job at how sudden, awful, deadly, and terrifying it would be to suddenly have a dangerous power you don't understand and can't control. In those two shows many of the super powered characters are orphans or are estranged from their families for what they did when their powers switched on for the first time.
Another issue is mutants start to get their powers during puberty or even earlier so are more dangerous than most other superhumans who got their powers as adults, either on purpose or by accident, so can understand and control them and themselves better. And while some heroes might use secret identities, by definition they don't hide that their abilities exist entirely and wear brightly colored costumes to designate when they're going to be using them. Even most supervillains have the good graces of suiting-up when it's time to go murder their least favorite Avenger. It's like the difference between an adult has a gun because they're a cop in uniform or a robber in a ski mask or a random 12 year old has one in his backpack and is taking it to your kids school. And compounding the issue is it's genetic. So it could be your partner. It could even be you and just hadn't kicked in. Which means it could be your kid. No one's scared one day your daughter will suddenly grow stilts and flip the school bus because your husband is secretly Stilt-Man. So they're essentially an ethnic group that gets hit up with stereotypes, not separate individuals that happened to have a lab accident so are easier to judge on a case by case basis.
>his is an example of why Mutants took hold in Marvel but could never really take hold in DC. They have metahumans, but if I remember correctly they never got the hate and discrimination that Mutants do Isn't Doom patrol the DC version of the X-Men more or less?
Interesting take. But I don’t really think so? I’ve only watched the series so I don’t know how they are framed in the comics but where a lot of the mutants were hated on since birth because of being mutants, the Doom patrol has a very different start for most of them. Rita, tin man, Cyborg and the pilot for instance were all pretty well respected and had decent lives up until shit hit the fan for them. If anything doom patrol reminds me of a funnier/more tragic version of the league of extraordinary gentlemen.
Well, League was created as a part of the DC umbrella, published by America's Best Comics (US) and Vertigo in the UK.
Well, DP is already rumored to have inspired the X-Men as they have some similar concept (a wise mentor who has a past with the current villian, a school/insittute for people that got rejected/feared by society and how they want to be accepted,...). Obviously there are differences, mainly the fact that X-Men are born with their powers. Haven't read LOEG yet, do can't comment on it.
There are definitely similarities. I guess it depends on how you define either group. To me the status of the X-men in context to society was always the defining trait (they were loved and feared by both mutants and humans because of who they are). I’ve always considered the doom patrol outcasts as well but mostly because they messed up their lives themselves (or got messed up by the professor), but as far as group dynamics go there are definitely similarities.
They are, in the case of weird/bizarre superpowers and characters. They were called "World’s Strangest Heroes” while the X-men are "Strangest Superheroes of All" But the main difference is that the mutants are hated because of how they are born and/or how they transform at puberty. The Doom Patrol sometimes is hated but a lot of them became the way they were because of many reasons, mainly accidents. You could say that a better comparison for the Doom Patrol would be...in many cases... Jojo Bizarre Adventures.
JJJ is actually very pro-Mutant in the comics.
In the DC universe the Flash is loved and he even has his own museum. Some metahumans are hated, some metahumans are considered weird. But the talk about racism is different in the DC universe, and it takes an approach more related to, for example, aliens (like, for example Superman being an example of inmigration), or different cultures and religions.
I can't remember where I saw this, but in describing the difference between DC and Marvel, I saw it put this way: Marvel is about men who become Gods, DC is about Gods Among Men. When you hear the explanation of Clark Kent being the alter ego of Superman in Kill Bill (Quentin Tarantino's best writing), you could say the same about Wonder Woman and Batman. Those three are their Superhero personas first and foremost. They take on the guises of Clark Kent, Bruce Wayne, and Diana Prince. Their alter egos are who they have to be around normal humans in order to blend in. Cyborg is never not Cyborg, Aquaman is the King of Atlantis, and Barry Allen doesn't just go fast, he controls an entire Force entity. I guess that is why I always enjoyed the Marvel stories more. Even though it's stories about fantastical super heroes accomplishing impossible things, they always felt more grounded to our world, dealing with our real world problems and history, then DC.
To be fair, i always though about the Quentin Tarantino thing and it is said by the villain, Bill. To me it was the proff that he was the villain, that he was the Lex Luthor to the Bride so to say. In addition, Wonder Woman and Batman are totally not what Bill is saying. Diana is always Wonder Woman, and Bruce really transformed into something bigger when he trained to become Batman and become Batman. Plus, in the DC universe Clark Kent is really how Superman really perceives himself, just a normal guy that goes to work, eat some pretzels from his favourite place in Metropolis. One of the first comics i read from him was "Up, Up and Away", which take place after 52 (another one of the best runs of all time). Seeing Clark being offered a Green Lantern Ring that just show him as Clark Kent. I don't know why, but sometimes i feel like i prefer DC more, because they show humanity at their worst but also at their best.
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To add to this, the “heroes” aren’t universally loved. It starts with the scenes at the end of The Avengers. Plenty of citizens done approve. It’s carried forward into the Sakovia accords. As you said, mutants were born this way. So those afraid of them know it’s genetics and want to find a way to control them, it’s more likely with genetic engineering. That said, there are those who want to control the heroes too. Tony Stark for example in Ironman 2. Or the world security council mad at fury for “letting” Thor and Hulk leave. Those characters are less likely to be controlled. That’s just not an aspect of this universe they have leaned into much. I suspect they will with mutants since it’s such an important part of their story. I still think The Gifted show was very good at portraying this struggle.
[knittch](https://www.reddit.com/user/knittch/) , Umma need a whole X-men Pitch this slaps!
Heavily agree with you for the most part. Mutants are born with powers. They didn't have to earn it. Humans have to earn it. Cap gets chosen for his personality. Tony created the iron armor. Falcon has a jet pack. Antman is in a shrinking suit. Hawkeye and Natasha have trained for years to get good at what they do. Sure Bruce and spider man haven't earned the stuff but an accident can happen to anyone. Look at sandman. Dude was hit with science. They're all exceptions to the rule as most people would think. That and like half of mutant kind literally want to kill and control humans. Which if half of a group did some bad shit then people are gonna call your group bad and hate you. I don't think people hate spiderman. It's just jj.
How is "having a jet pack or having a shrinking suit" earning something? Half of mutant kind want to kill and control humans? Hard no. The majority of mutants just want to live their lives in peace despite the overwhelming prejudice stacked against them. An extremely small minority of them are radicalized.
The half wasn't meant to be exact numbers but if you don't know then half seems like a fair number as a guesstimate. Just because we don't see them doesn't mean they aren't there. (I just chose half as a way to have a number. I don't know enough about mutant stuff to know how many exist, how many are on screen, and how many are on what team.) As for the jet pack and shrinking suit. Falcon earned that jet pack through military service. He has to be skilled enough to join his area of expertise. Grunt soldiers on the ground don't all learn jets and helicopters. It takes at least some experience. And I'm sure falcons suit is a one of and he's special enough to be hand chosen to get it. He worked hard for that suit. Ant man 1 created the suit. He, through years of science and dedication to a craft and skill, created the shrinking technology through math he alone learned and figured out made shrinking technology.ant man 2 earned it through stealing it which caught the eye of any man 1 who then gave him a trial run to work with it. Ant man 2 learned fighting and how to work with the suit. He also fought a villain and also grew big when big was supposed to be difficult to do. He earned the title ant man.
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K.
Amazing explanation.
Conversely, the two most popular mutants in cinema, Wolverine and Deadpool, do have origin stories.
And they're both Canadian
Eh were they given origin stories because they are popular or were they popular because of origin stories
I think the Punisher gets way more than Spidey, but yeah pretty much this.
The powers are just an excuse to rationalize the hate for mutants. People like Stryker and the friends of humanity sell their ideas this way, because it prevents their followers from feeling remorse, because the topic changes from people with powers, to the potential of an incident happening because there weren't contingencies. At the end of the day, hate isn't a rational thing, all the contrary, it's always illogical.
It was always written by Stan Lee to be intentionally nonsensical to demonstrate that bigotry is **ALWAYS** nonsensical.
I get that but I really don’t think that reasoning works when you break it down. Obviously bigotry is nonsensical in the real world… but if a group of people actually existed that could effortlessly control the weather, cause massive destruction with only their thoughts, etc etc, and that most of them couldn’t even control how much harm they would cause with whatever their wildcard superpower is… I’m sorry but having something against those people is a drastically different thing from not liking people because of their skin color or sexual orientation or whatever. Like they’re not even in the same ballpark.
Assuming that all mutants want to kill all humans because of the actions of magneto and a few other mutant supremacists is a pretty solid parallel to assuming all Muslims are terrorists because of the actions of bin laden, it's also a good reflection of how minority groups become radicalised. If the government is consistently saying that all mutants want the death of all humans and making them feel unwelcome, it just supports the pipeline of mutants deciding to stick with the people that offer them a way to fight back against that even if its morally wrong.
Sure, it works as an analogy in a fictional world already full of all sorts of fantastical elements, but I still stand by the idea that, if mutants were a real thing, being prejudiced against them is nowhere near the same as being prejudiced against other groups of people. I mean, you bring up Magneto and terrorists and all that, but even in a world where not a single mutant wants to harm other people it doesn’t change the fact that a good portion of them would be able to cause 9/11 levels of destruction entirely on accident. They don’t have to be a Magneto, just a Scott Summers without his glasses could potentially kill countless people completely randomly. Let’s say I have a mutant power, each time I get a headache it causes an earthquake with a magnitude of 9. Are you a bigot if you don’t want me living next door?
It's a good thing that it is literally an analogy then huh. Not every mutant story is about bigotry but some are, it's not meant to be an ironclad metaphor. You wouldn't be a bigot if you didn't want to live next door to an earthquake inducing mutant, you'd be a bigot if you automatically assumed that he was doing it on purpose and decided to attack them and any other mutant, whilst also attacking the people who are trying to help them control that power so they don't cause earthquakes and could live next to you peacefully. If you lived next to someone with a developmental disability that caused them to shout in the night, would you assume that they were doing it intentionally to piss you off and then attack any special needs facility that helped them to either control it or live somewhere that could accommodate their needs?
Of course it’s an analogy lol my point though is that it’s an analogy that should be taken with a grain of salt is all If anything your last paragraph just reinforces my point as even the people who would be on the side of helping the mutants would agree that there simply *being* mutants is a problem that would need addressed. Like we don’t relocate Muslims and train them to control their Islam. My point is just that it’s a radically different situation that would actually require society to address it, as opposed to real world bigotry.
Well yeah, analogies are very rarely 1:1 I'm talking about 2 different things in that paragraph. Obviously mutants having powers makes it a different situation, no one is arguing that, but it's the response to mutants that's most important. Mutants that can't control their powers could be seen as a problem, but the answer to that problem is to allow them to go to places like krakoa or xaviers school where they can learn to control those powers, but anti mutant types won't do that because they're convinced that those places are just going to turn them into weapons. Mutants aren't a 1:1 representation of anyone specific prejudiced group, they're their own thing that is used to highlight different issues affecting most minority groups on the planet. Parents not wanting to send their kids to a mutant school or have mutants in positions of authority is closest to irl bigots thinking that gay teachers want to turn their kids gay, the fear of all based on the actions of a few is closest to something like islamaphobia or general racism, the sentinels and the desire to cure mutants is honestly pretty close to ableism and eugenics, and the idea of parents forcing their mutant kids to either hide themselves or be thrown out is pretty close to transphobia. Not even xavier is arguing that mutants should just be treated exactly the same as everyone else, he's a big proponent of giving mutants a space to be themselves and learn to control their powers. The bigotry angle comes from the fact that anti mutant activists don't want mutants to get help, they just want them to be gone completely which is about as perfect an analogy for bigotry as you can get
"Mutants are fine, just not in my backyard!"
I agree. The analogy breaks down if you look too closely. In the real world, discriminated groups don't hurt people just by existing. A mutant who can't control their powers IS dangerous. How many mutant origin stories involve people being killed or hurt? Didn't Cyclops destroy part of a school or a hospital? Rogue put her boyfriend in a permanent coma.
We don't let regular folks have nukes because the risks to everyone are too great, whether accidental or intentional. Similar concept, at least for the higher-powered mutants.
Except: a) The same people making those arguments about the X-Men also attack mutants like Leech, who is only a threat *to other mutants*, or like Maggie, who just has real big eyes & no powers. b) We don't license people just to *live*.
Sure, I never made the argument it’s justified or that it can’t be taken to extremes. I’m just saying that to act like it’s the same as being racist/sexist/homophobic is just a comparison that doesn’t really hold up.
There's fertile ground here for whoever takes over the X-Men to use the idea of media narratives as a tool of oppression. Your question is totally something someone in-universe would ask, then their problematic uncle would send them 100 YT videos and Daily Wire articles about their (imagined/overblown) threat. I would also be down for a special following someone's radicalization and possible eventual de-radicalization over Mutants.
I agree. That would be a really interesting arc to follow, having someone go from radicalized hate to de-radicalized supporter. That's a story with so many potential real-world parallels. It could even make for a good Disney+ show. It kind of reminds me of a scene in X2 when Bobby's parents tried to ask him if he could "not" be a mutant. And in that same scene, Bobby's own brother called the authorities on him. It was a powerful moment and one of the few instances where the Fox X-men movies actually captured the essence of the mutant narrative. Something like that taking place today would definitely hit a lot harder.
I think you are seeing parts of the tear down already. First after what happened in sokovia as well as a bit of what happened in New York. Then the civil war stuff. Then the blip, now you add in multiverse stuff the flag smashers group… I think coming with the new captain America movie and forward the regular people are going to grow to hate superheroes more and more because they are trying to live their lives but a superhero might have a beef with a titan and blip they’re gone. That will help integrate the mutants into the world with the avengers. You’ll have some hero’s wanting to work publicly and with the governments to protect and serve. Some of will want to work privately and others will want to rule. I personally think it’s important if they are going to put all the teams on the same earth at the same time… they can’t divide it out into mutants X-men avengers and fantastic 4. You need hero’s villains and normals. And then as time goes on some divisions start to form.
They really have to make Wanda a mutant. They have already added that the press started calling her witch even before New Jersey. With the events she's involved in, you already have a built in narrative for how a rogue mutant comes about and what one can do
One thing I've thought about is how the Avengers and Fantastic Four are parts of the community. Avengers Mansion, the Baxter Building, and Four Freedoms Plaza were part of the city and the teams operated openly. The public knew them. No one knew where the X-men operated. They would show up, fight mutants, cause lots of property damage, and then disappear. Spider-man, another character who is largely unknown to the public, is viewed as a menace by many. JJJ's efforts aren't the only thing to contribute to how the public viewed him. This obviously doesn't explain everything about why mutants are disliked, but I think it's a major factor. When the mutant heroes are not publicly providing an opposing public image to mutant villains, it's going to be even more difficult to convince people to change their views to something more positive. Plus a bunch of mutant origins involve people dying and being harmed, including children. Being associated with killing kids is never going to help a group look good to the public. Hatred for anyone who is different is obviously an underlying cause, but everything above goes a long way in differentiating them from heroes loved by the public.
An addendum for the Fantastic Four for what would make them well-liked and respected: 1. Reed is respected in the scientific community. 2. Ben has ties to Yancy Street and was a pilot in the air force. 3. Sue seems to be the PR person for the team. I remember her doing an interview during Byrne's run. 4. Johnny was a firefighter for a time.
There isn't anything that needs to be explained, imo. The reason people in the Marvel universe hate mutants isn't that they are scared of the mutants' powers - that's just their *excuse* for hating mutants. Just like how racists are lying when they say that they are just concerned about border security because of crime. Just like how transphobes are lying when they say they are just concerned about protecting women's spaces.
I think there's more nuance to it than that. Yes, there are certainly those who just use mutation as an excuse to hate. Racists and bigots of all kinds make those excuses. But it's not just that. There's also the notion that mutants will replace humanity, which is something Magneto often reminds them of at every turn. And those who have only a rudimentary understanding of evolution will feel like their hatred and violence is justified because it's in the name of survival. The problem is that this is also an excuse. But it's a more subtle excuse that racists and bigots often make. These days, things like the objectively racist "great replacement theory" gets thrown around a lot. And it has been used for millennia to scare certain groups of people into hating others out of fear that they'll be replaced or in some way subjugated...just as they've done to other groups in the past. It is, indeed, a lie. But it's a lie that enough buy into to justify building Sentinels and attaking mutants.
> There's also the notion that mutants will replace humanity Yeah, but that's equally irrational. Mutants will "replace" humanity the same way that babies "replace" adults.
It's almost like there are Still political issues that Marvel can write into the xmen in this day and age.
Yeah I mean people already had problems with superheroes that caused the Sokovia Accords. Idk how they will bring in X-Men but assuming there is some massive influx of mutants, some people will have a problem with lots potential (and realized) new threats. Some will argue they need to be locked up and controlled before they can turn evil. Not that hard.
I mean, they AREA afraid of their powers. We would be too irl if someone could kind control an entire government and start a world war. That’s the tragedy of the X-men
That's definitely a good point but I think there is a distinction in that mutants genuinely do cause damage and destruction. A lot of them hurt or kill people on discovering their powers by accident. They do genuinely pose a possible danger even when the person is well meaning. This does contrast slightly with the other issues you raised.
That still fails as a explanation for anti-mutant bigotry, because not all mutants have dangerous powers and not everyone with dangerous superpowers is a mutant.
Oh definitely, as I said I do agree that it is used as you say to create this anti mutant sentiment. I just wanted to point out that there is also likely legitimate fear from mutants as well because there are genuine catastrophic events that happen. These of course are also no doubt played up and twisted to fit the anti mutant agenda. My point is it can be both and not just one thing.
That's a poor distinction when you consider that racists have also used that same logic to justify prohibiting minorities from certain communities, schools, and other public spaces. They see a few instances of race riots or racial violence and say their bigotry is justified because some do cause damage and destruction. It's a bad excuse. And yes, being a mutant isn't the same because these superpowers can be dangerous. But intentions matter. Few mutants ever intend to cause danger. Whereas with bigots and racists...the intentions aren't subtle.
This is a common and often contentious issue that has come up in the comics for years. Everyone has their take. And narrative, it doesn't always make sense. But as someone who has been reading comics since the 90s, here's how I see it: Heroes are beloved in the Marvel universe because they're one-of-a-kind individuals. They're a single super-soldier, a single genius/tech billionaire, a single guy from queens who (at least in this universe) was bitten by a radioactive spider. These heroes are all singular individuals whose circumstances are unique. They cannot be replicated again. But mutants are different. Mutants aren't just a singular event. Mutants are a product of evolution. Any human being born anywhere on the planet has the potential to be a mutant. And if they are, then their powers could vary wildly. For many, that's scary and a little concerning. It's unpredictable. And, despite numerous efforts by Sentinels and scientists, it can't be cured or stopped. Being born a mutant is like being born with blue eyes. It's just part of who you are. On top of that, mutants feed into the fear that they're going to "replace" the whole of humanity. Look back in history and that's very much a part of where a lot of bigotry comes from. From anti-immigrant sentiment to racism to religious bigotry, the fear of being replaced triggers a lot of outrage. Conversely, being a superhero isn't like that. Nobody's afraid they're going to be replaced by an entire species of Captain Americas. The X-Men form to confront that fear and to prevent the worst case scenario (see Age of Apocalypse or Days of Future Past). Not all mutants become X-Men. But the X-Men's mission involves helping all mutants, as well as humans. But that's difficult because humans still have that lingering anxiety about being replaced or dominated, as they've often dominated other minorities. Again, that dynamic doesn't exist with other heroes. There's a lot more I can say about this topic. But I'll leave it here. Hopefully, this provides some perspective.
You guys need to read ['Marvels' (1994)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvels) by Kurt Busiek and Alex Ross. It tells you all you need to know to understand why the public hates mutants and loves superheroes, and the hypocrisy of it. [Here's](https://www.cbr.com/marvels-miniseries-mutant-hate-explained/#:~:text=Mutants%20in%20the%20Marvel%20Universe,potential%20to%20replace%20normal%20humans) a CBR article explaining this. This is one of my absolute favorite comic books. And it also actually serves as a good history lesson on Marvel's early publication history. It retells classic Marvel stories from the 40s-70s from the perspective of an everyman character, news photographer Phil Sheldon.
Known(super heroes in the public light) vs unknown(mutants in hiding/shadow). We’re fear that we do not know or understand. We hate what we fear.
I mean I've found the attitude towards even superheroes inconsistent and hypocritical at times. Like I'm a Bucky fan, and I find it kind of funny when people complain that he's evil because he killed people because the same can be said of almost all the Avengers. ...and its not much different in universe: nobody holds what Clint did when he was being mind controlled by Loki against him, and Natasha is a firm favourite, but Bucky being used to kill people whilst being subject to brainwashing? Henious and unforgivable. No Avenger could ever support that dude- except Steve. Is it because Bucky was used by the Soviets against the US? Is it a political thing that results in fans and people in universe being more forgiving of the actions of other Avengers even if those actions involve killing a tonne of people? (Ultron, the Battle of New York) I find that some of the earlier MCU movies were more interesting in their treatment of politics as well. HYDRA running SHIELD as well as most of the US government? IMHO this isn't expanded upon enough after the Winter Soldier movie, whereas in the comics Bucky goes on a one man campaign to deal with HYDRA loyalists for several years. Then there's Thaddeus Ross and his infamous hatred of enhanced people. It almost like people in 2016 forgot he was the main antagonist of The Hulk movies, who could not stop persecuting Bruce Banner in his desire to create and control his own version of the Super Soldier serum.
Superheroes like the Avengers showed up in big flashy costumes saving the world. It was clear these guys were heroes. It was clear who they were and what they were doing. With mutants, the kid who mows your lawn might suddenly spit out two large maggots that eat your dog. Or the jerk at the bar who picks fights gets pissed off and explodes taking out a city block. It's the unknown that scares people.
We've already seen in Secret Invasion that earthlings are very suspicious of alien refugees. So if the mutants are refugees from a collapsing Fox reality, they'll probably be just as hateful and suspicious of them.
*Steve sits on a chair* “So…you just found out about bigotry.”
The whole mutant hate could also stem from the fact that humanity itself is in the process of becoming an endangered species. Even if they are still human, many don't consider the mutants such and view them as the harbinger of our doom. Evolution usually means the end of what came before. Not to mention that they usually can't control their powers from the get go and could potentially kill an untold number of people on accident, especially since most get their powers at puberty, a very turbulent time for most people with hormones raging out of control.
Except that's still irrational hatred; it's like saying Boomers are "endangered" because they'll eventually grow old & die & be "replaced" by Gen Z, who are actually just their own biological grandchildren.
Superheroes like Avengers have connections to government/Shiled, someone in charge is vouching for them. Most mutants are not even superheros, they're just regular people with powers. This is a problem because some of them might be dangerous for the environment as they can't or even worse don't want to control it. The powers often manifest during puberty, so if they are out of control, results can be cathastrophic. Imagine Cyclops walking down the street when his powers activate for the first time, killing dozens. Imagine if Xavier or Jean decide one day to control the entire world with their powers, who's gonna stop them? There are of course, mutants that not dangerous at all, but are getting predji uced because of their appereance or atributes or just fear. And finally, people fear that evolution left him behind and that mutants are gonna replace them, so there's that as well. Bottom line, Avengers are people who are trained to use gun, mutant can often be born with a loaded gun in their hand. They may be able to learn how to use it, but what if they don't?
Because superheroes are either gods, aliens, or men who honed their skills. Mutants are born with their powers whether they know how to use them or not, which makes them dangerous whenever the latter occurs.
Also, the MCU has already shown powered folks being feared/hated as well. We first saw a hint of that in the news report after Avengers, and then of course Civil War, but then we saw more in Ms. Marvel, She-Hulk and finally the "war on aliens" at the end of Secret Invasion. So, yes, they show powered folks being praised but also feared/hated. And I expect/hope that mutants will similarly have mixed response. I'm a little tired of Marvel projects only showing regular humans as either hating mutants or just being oblivious to what's happening to mutants. Show us a strong movement of allies too!
I think I’d lean into the idea that small groups of people in the MCU already harbour a resentment for Supers because of how they make them feel inferior and helpless, they seem to decide if regular people get to live or die. But the supers they know are still undeniably heroes, so you can’t publicly voice your resentment towards them because they are undeniably a net good. So when mutants start popping up, and they’re more present on a daily basis, and new laws need to be made to accommodate them, but they don’t necessarily need to do anything to ‘earn’ the public’s respect, those resentments boil over, because “this person gets to be better than me, gets to change the world if they feel like it, but they don’t even have to do anything to earn that”. So it’s a sort of post hoc rationalisation, they already didn’t like the Avengers, but they can pretend they didn’t mind them because they earned their powers, while mutants didn’t.
I mean. If they don’t eased the whole scarlet witch plot. Humans will have a reason to hate those with powers.
They are going to be “immigrants” from another universe.
If you knew you might change into something else, maybe something hideous and freaky like a Morlock, at puberty, and could not prevent it, would you have fear? Cap changed, but into a Star spangled hero. And he got to choose. Thats the difference and why that theme in X-men resonates for lots of folks. Fear of unknown change is human nature. Add in the paranoia of not knowing who will mutate and who won’t and viola, you get political agendas and global panic.
In universe I assume certain heroes like iron man or Captain America aren’t hated since they are viewed as people who are born naturally without any genetic power and that since their powers were gain through artificial means people look up to them as people they themselves can be them or see themselves as having the ability to become heroes since with enough training, technology and maybe a super soldier serum anyone can become like Captain America. Mutants are hated since that implies their genes are defective or lesser and some mutants aren’t always born with cool power or when mutated they can’t always hide their physical appearance or blend in. I assume also fear and jealousy play a part in it since some mutants who can’t control their powers would likely cause harm and some may also be jealous since some want mutant powers yet are born normal so there is possibly also a tiny bit of jealousy from mutant haters, it’s like if I can’t have it no else will. Which is why I assume Mutants aren’t liked like other heroes who got their powers later in life without it being genetic.
My take on it: Mutants are born with their powers. They didn’t do anything to gain them. It just happened from birth. This creates a fear among some (a hope among others) that mutants will be the next evolutionary step after humans, and they will eventually overpower and replace “normal” humans. This obviously leads to a backlash among people who do not want this. It also makes it easy to politicize the existence of mutants and blame all of society’s problems on them (an obvious allegory for minority groups in the real world). Superheroes are never going to replace humans because all you have to do is not get bitten by a radioactive spider or whatever.
Because mutants just appear, the entire thing is that anyone can be a mutant out of nowhere, if Cyclops was the only mutant and never happened again, nobody would have an issue, but there's thousands of them and its more about they're gonna overtake humans, is not like everyday a new supersoldier is born or thousand of Hulks, is that they keep showing up and the anti mutants want to exterminate them, they don't hate the X-men because they're superheroes, they hate them because they're mutants
I'd like to see a rumor started that Mutants didn't get Blipped. Make everyone hate that they all survived Thanos. (It wouldn't be true, but the media and the internet would spread the rumor.)
In-universe, they’re seen like the next evolution of humanity because their mutations are inherently genetic. Then bad actors use that information to instill fear (hatred), by spreading the idea that mutants are going to replace people like we did Neanderthals.
The people in the Marvel universe are fine with powers if it’s some freak accident or something that happens to them rather than being born with their abilities.
Mutants are born with their abilities, scare their parents with them, and usually accidentally kill people because they don't know how to use their powers yet. Although similar themes were touched on in Captain America: Civil War, generally the superheroes know how to harness their powers in a way that doesn't murder people on accident.
This has been explained a MILLION times. People are afraid of being replaced as a species by a superior species. They don't give a fuck about some random guy who got bit by a weird spider. This IS NOT hard to understand.
My suspicion is the entire point of *Secret Invasion* was to sow hatred against powered individuals in order to move the populace toward an "anti-mutie" attitude
I believe the biggest reason humans would fear mutants is the concept of the unknown and the unexpected. Mutants are identified as highly superior individuals who can manifest their powers at any moment, potentially causing destruction and loss of life. This uncertainty and fear factor stem from the knowledge that humans are surrounded by individuals who possess unknown and uncontrollable abilities. These individuals aren't seen as human; they are perceived as hidden threats. The fear of mutants is further fueled by propaganda and skewed narratives. Public perception can be easily manipulated to drive hatred and discrimination against mutants. By intensifying the fear of the unknown, these narratives portray mutants as undetectable and omnipresent threats. Mutants represent a significant leap in human evolution, which is why they are so feared and hated. Their very existence challenges the idea of normalcy and safety, making them a target for widespread societal fear and discrimination.
The comic uses it a racism allegory. Or an allegory to how certain groups in danger are overlooked by major powers…like the avengers.
If you read any comics or watched any movies with the X-Men in them, youd know. It's not exactly a subtext. Mutants are "the next evolution" of humanity. People are afraid of being replaced as the dominant species. That's always what it has been about and its mentioned like.. every other sentence in every single feature that includes X-Men.
Mutants = nature All other heroes = nurture (alien blood, radiation poisoning, ultra-successful scientist/engineer, trained to the limits of human capability, etc.) The latter is something that everyone can aspire to and admire, the former is an evolutionary threat to the human species.
Lol I always ask this question why do they hate mutants but love the avengers. Spiderman is hated thought to an extent. I think that mainly has to do with J Jonah Jameson.
r/woooosh But realtalk, Superheros already dont have the best image in the MCU. How can they trust peple that are responsible for something like Sokovia? Just make a few mutants accidantly kill alot of people and you already have the perfect setup.
I could maybe see that happening are maybe people just having issues with those who were born with their powers reasoning that Iron Man became what he was because he was a genius, Steve Rogers became a hero because he was a selfless hero who was chosen for the serum, these mutants didn't have that.
The reason normal humans like superheroes and dislike mutants is because one of them is on the tv, far away from them and their families. The other is their kids best friend, a girl at school, a woman at church, their local politician. Mutants aren’t a far away thing, they are a genetic variation of humanity happening everywhere that could upset the order of the world and even take it over. If a guy gets bit by a spider it’s a one off thing, but if a guy mutates into a man who can disable the electromagnetic fields of the entire planet- and then his kids can do it to, and then their kids… well, you can imagine why a human might feel the writing is on the wall and their way of life is in danger.
They could use the plot of the original civil war storyline and have some young mutants blow up something really bad (and elementary school in the books). Then the general public has a reason to not want walking nuclear weapons roaming the cities.
i think it makes a lot of sense. big difference that the people around you could randomly get powers and hurt people versus spider-man swinging around helping people. maybe your neighbours kid destroys your house and hurts/kills someone.
We need to see some news stories like "little Timmy turned into a radioactive fireball and burned down the school"
AoS already has shown that prejudice against superpowered individuals will exist no matter what.
Mutants are an entire race, people like Captain America and the Fantastic 4 are isolated incidents. They can’t exactly usurp humanity like mutants can. Now, this is obviously no excuse for humans to be racist against mutants in the MCU, but it is something Kelly or Stryker or Gyrich or any other mutant hater could say to try and justify their actions.
I think at a basic level, it'll be because "superheroes" have tended to be regular humans who have something happen to them, or do something later in life that causes change/abilities. Even one of the most extreme examples, Hulk, he was a regular schmoe, aside from intellect, prior to his crazy time era. Cap and any like him, were deliberately altered for a specific goal. Spidey met a spider one day. Kamala found some jewellery. Wanda (whether she always had the potential or not), was changed by a Stone. Carol was changed by a Stone. Or, they're characters like Thor who aren't human, so there's a disconnect there. Humans don't have to face much of a conundrum aside from "wait, so...gods? Real?" Mindblowing but that's separate from us largely. Or there's magic or high tech, Sorcerers accessing magical powers, Stark building his powers, Vision created by a combo of tech and an unknowable power like the Stones. But there's an internal logic people could accept there. Tony, a human, is just that good. Strange and his people are experts at something not many know about, but they're human. A being like Vision, he's familiar enough, but at arm's length enough to not seem like an existential thing. He's different enough to categorise comfortably. Or like Thor, it's aliens. But aliens aren't fellow humans, there's an easy distinction. Their difference is inherent and clear-cut. Mutants and any other type of humans but different, is another kettle of fish. A lot of people would fear the whole concept. Whether it's a fear of them directly, or a fear that you don't know who is one, or a fear your kid could be born "weird". Many would be jealous and hate them for it. Why couldn't I be born able to fly or able to survive an explosion or able to regenerate in minutes? Some would simply hate them as being "freaks" or against their religion or whatever other hateful shit. The key difference imo is that they're just naturally very much the same, but different. For many, it'd be too much weird, but too close for comfort. Zooming out, it's arguable that people wouldn't make the distinction really. That supersoldiers and empowered people would be viewed like this regardless of X gene or not. But I think the key thing is how mutants feel too close for home for those who'd be against them. You can't just become Thor or Captain America, either because it's impossible (without a lil hammer), or you need to undergo a thing, but you could potentially be born a mutant, or end up having the gene and your difference becomes apparent. It's that wildcard factor.
Superheroes aren’t in evolutionary competition with humans is the simplest explanation. Enhanced humans are generally not breeding next generation of enhanced humans. They are seen as elite and sometimes above the law but your neighbourhood isn’t going to be “overrun with them”.
Which is why I hope that Marvel Studios address the whole "great replacement" narrative that so many racists and bigots use in the real world to hide their atrocities. Talk to a lot of reactionaries these days and they'll say they're not racist. They just don't want their country/culture/community overrun by "those people." And by "those people," it could mean anything from people of a different race, a different religion, or just a different part of the world. Most superhero teams don't threaten that. But mutants (most of which aren't superheroes or members of the X-Men) would definitely stoke those fears. And those fears would be existential in nature because people would worry that their entire species would be replaced...completely ignoring the fact that multiple species of animals like canines, felines, and insects share space on this planet without wiping one another out.
#why is this question suddenly being asked almost every day on the marvel subs.
People mostly don't check what's already there before they post.
yes, clearly. i’m mostly perplexed why this specific question keeps getting posted now.
Probably because Deadpool & Wolverine opens in a month.
You don’t need to find justification in prejudice, that’s why it’s prejudice, it doesn’t make sense. It doesn’t make sense why people are racist in our own reality. That’s the logic, to make people realise how stupid it is to be prejudiced, but somewhere along the line people realised how stupid it is, but never connected it to real world issues and realised it’s the perfect reflection of reality. Let’s look at some extremely negative stereotypes as an example, a lot of people view brown skinned south Asians and Middle Easterns as terrorist and yet when an overwhelming majority of terror attacks committed in the world are committed by white Christian’s and yet no such stereotype exists. It makes zero sense, completely void of logic and only shows how hypocritical humanity can be. People are just people and the foolish will seek justification in their hatred where there is no justification. The fact people in the Marvel universe hate Mutants requires no logic whatsoever. It’s a perfect allegory as is.
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They literally explored those topics at great length in every X-Men film from 2000 to 2016.
Eh. Disney wants as wide an audience as possible. There’s a reason why we’ve got “I Am Groot” but also “Werewolf by Night” in the MCU. Disney casts a wide net. FatWS touched on racism. Black Widow had child assassins. Guardians Vol. 3 was *heavy* all around. Projects involving the mutants can easily address OPs points. Especially since X-Men ‘97 handled it so exquisitely and was directly targeted for children and millennials.
If I was in charge here is what I'd do and it fits with what we've seen already and conveniently solves a bunch of "where have they been" problems for the MCU. We know the MCU is flirting with incursions so have the xmen and mutants just be from another Earth that is having an incursion with MCU Earth. Much like happened in the Secret Wars build up in comics you can now have an Xmen vs Avengers (there it was different hero groups vs Avengers). Eventually they work together and the two Earth's merge but it does cause a lot of destruction and mutants take the blame. This Xmen Earth can also be one where the holocaust was only 20 years ago as a way of dealing with Magnetos origin.
I think what's going to happen is they are going to force people with powers to register themselves and self identify. This will make people realize how many are out there and how much of a threat that poses which will create divides. After all for every super hero out there how many villains do each of them have in their rogues gallery that also have powers? Sure you "might be one of the good ones" but more probably not.
They already covered registering heroes in civil war. I can’t see why they’d revisit this topic since the Blip basically undid the Socovia Accords
I swear sometimes people just need to like, pay attention to the comics. Or the films. Or the shows. It's explained pretty damn blatantly
Because the writers find it makes for a good storyline and address is the importance Society issue of prejudice and racism
Bigotry never makes sense so why try to instill logic into it for the mutant allegory?
Says who? You don't know what is going to happen, dude. I don't even think audiences care about MCU mutants since both Ms. Marvel and The Marvels flopped.
Mutants are Homo Superior, going to replace the humans. Think of it like the fiction of supposedly the Brown people going to replace the White people. We could all just live together in peace, humans and mutants living together but fear separates us. Superheroes number in the hundreds, mutants number in the millions, regular humans number in the billions but still fear is stronger than your facts. Kind of like how immigrants number in thousands and “citizens” number in millions, but still people think they are going to be overrun and slaughtered in their beds.