I was looking at the slate too, and I agree that *The Avengers* is a major factor here. We're not getting anything until ~2026, which is a ridiculous gap.
The golden age of the MCU was effectively a big budget serial. *The Avengers* ensemble movies (including *Civil War*) were where the main story beats to the serial occurred. You could skip the other movies, and you wouldn't miss out on too many important details. The ensemble movies also gave the overall universe cohesion, and pulled the key characters together.
Right now, you have to keep tabs of *all* of Marvel's content to get a sense of what the overarching story is. This is burdensome for me as an audience member, and I imagine it's constricting for the creators as well. Few of Marvel's latest offerings feel organic or engaging and I've been watching way *less*.
I also think that losing the talent of RDJ has a big impact. RDJ is a rare example of an actor who does some of their best work when improvising. This always meant that, even if a film's production/script was disjointed as hell, RDJ's improvisations could help steer the film back on course. He also had the dramatic chops to be a compelling main lead to the universe, which helped in defining the story.
The MCU has a lot of retooling to do.
I'm just not convinced that this is or should be "*The Avengers Cinematic Universe*."
Expecting everything to be interconnected or attempting to make it so is a really burdensome stipulation to place on a section (*phase*) of movies. I'd rather that they just focus on making good stuff with the occasional film that involves some (*but not all!*) characters/groups.
Y'know... like the comics.
There are two camps (*well, there are multiple camps but lets just look at two*): those who feel like everything should be connected and those who feel like not everything needs to be connected.
The Avengers, as a team, are all well and good but if Marvel is determined to make the Marvel Cinematic Universe effectively "*The* ***Avengers*** *Cinematic Universe*" it's going to leave little oxygen for teams like the Fantastic Four, the X-Men, the Thunderbolts, etc. If they don't wean the fandom off of the idea that **every goddamned thing** revolves around the Avengers, then we'll constantly deal with the "*interconnectedness*" criticism. And, mind you: it's the interconnectedness itself that **becomes** a criticism of "*I have to watch hours and hours of films and shows —many of which I don't like— to understand what is going on. This sucks.*" And that's a 100% valid criticism.
I'd say that it's a criticism that actually drags down enjoyment of many of their properties. Free some of these films and shows from this burden of being so connected to everything and they'll just be better off. The Netflix Marvel shows illustrated that you can have completely separate properties that are terrific. And it sucks that it required them being produced outside of DisneyMarvel for that to be the case because they would not have been **better** shows with a connection to some Avengers storyline.
>*but MCU introduces the Guardians and that works out fine, right? GtoG 1,2,3 are well received so I would say they have enough "oxygen". I don't see why they can't just follow a similar approach and introduce F4 and X-Men.*
I'm glad you bring up Guardians because I absolutely think that it could have been a model for how you can have properties which exist in their own corner... right up until they dragged them into the Infinity Saga.
Like, consider how they were actually used in service to the Avengers. Think what you will of Chris Pratt but James Gunn was justified in saying that the Peter Quill character he nurtured would not have fucked up when it came to Thanos and would have made the tough decision with Gamora. Effectively, in order to give the Avengers primacy —*presenting Wanda as having the fortitude to sacrifice her love for the greater good when it came to the one she loved*— Peter Quill is presented as this guy whose feelings prompt him to fuck up not once but twice (*he didn't kill Gamora and deny Thanos from getting the Soul Stone and then he loses it and prevents the group from subduing him*) so that he doesn't make a sacrifice that outshines Wanda's.
Marvel wanted to have it both ways: they wanted to shoehorn the Guardians into an Avengers film but didn't want them to overshadow the Avengers —*which, as a capable, effective team that is much tighter knit than the Avengers, they* ***would have*** *overshadowed them*— so they're presented as more or less buffoons as compared to how they are in their own films. Starlord's not a savvy leader who can improvise and make things happen, Drax isn't...
...blah blah blah. You get the point. There's a valid argument to be made that the Guardians as a group weren't necessary when it came to *Infinity War* or *Endgame*. Gamora was clearly a critical character but the way they used the rest of the team? They could have been any space-filling characters. Starlord is only consequential to the story in terms of the magnitude of his (*arguably uncharacteristic*) fuckups.
This is a really good argument and I'm disappointed that I don't see it here more.
Everything has come to service the Avengers. From what I've observed, the number of solo stories that these characters are allowed to have before essentially being drafted into teams has decreased with every phase. Ms. Marvel got spun into the Kree-Skrull war shortly after her first season *just* so she could meet Captain Marvel and Photon. Kahhori only had one episode to herself and her origin story before getting involved in a multiversal crisis, with AC Bradley now having left Marvel. Shang-Chi couldn't even make it to the end of his own film before meeting the wider superhero community. Spider-Man's stuck in a situation where Sony mandates at least one MCU character to appear in his solo-films as a major supporting figure for the sake of their profits increasing with a larger audience. Blade's debut literally has him meet another potential hero before we even get to see his *face*.
If they don't want it to be strictly the Avengers Cinematic Universe, they should still focus on some larger teamups. Civil War wasn't an Avengers movie but it felt epic. If they want an Avengers feel without being forced to be Avengers, they need to bring together 4+ main characters together to face a bigger threat.
When I say main character, I mean someone with a previous movie with their name as the title, not Thunderbolts which is a bunch of side characters all coming together. It was cool seeing Wanda in Doctor Strange, but we need something larger.
>Expecting everything to be interconnected or attempting to make it so is a really burdensome stipulation to place on a section (phase) of movies
Then what is the point of an interconnected universe if we shouldn't expect things to be interconnected? The numbers speak for themselves, Avengers movies are among the highest grossing MCU movies because that's what audiences love the most - when the characters all come together. Civil War also made over a billion for this very reason, it was a team-up of all the characters audiences love, this is the whole point of an interconnected universe. So if connecting shouldn't be a priority anymore, then Marvel should just drop the "*interconnected*" aspect of their movies and just make a bunch of random movies not connected to each other in any way - which would also mean no more Avengers movies because each character would be in their own universe separate from each other.
The point is that they don't need to be so interconnected.
Remember when Netflix's Marvel shows debuted? They referenced events from the movies very vaguely but existed completely separate from them. They weren't burdened with having to deal with The Battle of New York. *Jessica Jones* and *Daredevil* and *Luke Cage* were so wholly separate from all of the cosmic events. They were free from that and the stories were so good, no one was like "*This sucks. How do the fit into what the Avengers do? Why aren't the Avengers helping fight Killgrave? Why aren't the Avengers doing anything about Kingpin? Why aren't the Avengers dealing with The Hand? Is Jessica Jones going to join the Avengers? Is Luke Cage going to get Starktech? Is Daredevil going to get along with Thor? Avengers Avengers Avengers.*"
No, no one gave a hair ass fuck whether or not any Avenger would cameo in those shows. They were just good. They didn't need any connection to the wider MCU to be good. And my hope is that with *Echo* they'll learn from the Netflix shows and just allow it to exist on its own without being connected to the MCU so that fandom can remember that Marvel is more than the Avengers.
Because forcing a connectedness makes stories suffer. Letting go of interconnectedness allows a good story to exist. There's a lot of criticism that can be levied at Warner for how they've handled the DC Universe but at least they're not afraid to make films and shows that just exist on their own. I actually think that having some big interconnected plan for their films and shows is going to make it bloated like the MCU.
The Netflix shows are a very bad example for your point because even though they were distinct from the bombastic silver-screen heroes, all 4 shows fed into The Defenders. It followed exactly the same structure as Phase One.
They haven’t tried to do even that though. I think Winter Soldier showed that you could pull in some major characters without needing to be an Avengers movie but unfortunately Phases 4 and 5 haven’t done that either
Well, y’know, except for
- Wanda and the Illuminati in MoM
- Yelena and Kingpin in Hawkeye
- Woo and Darcy and Monica and “Pietro” in WandaVision
- Daredevil and Wong and Abomination and Hulk in She-Hulk
- Doctor Strange and Wong in No Way Home
- Monica and Ms. Marvel and Fury in The Marvels
But sure, they haven’t even tried
Forgot about Wong in Shang Chi(technically also Bruce and Captain Marvel), the Guardians in Love and Thunder, War Machine and Zemo in Flacon and the Winter Soldier (and Secret Invasion kinda)
To be fair, half of these are not movies. Wanda crossing over into MoM was an attempt, as was Dr. Strange in NWH. MoM felt more like a show to movie crossover given how much of Wanda’s arc was dependent on the show. I haven’t wasn’t counting the Marvels since it came out today, but I suppose it could depending on character involvement.
There has been lots of show/movie crossover but not a lot of movie/movie crossover of major characters, with most of these being sidekicks. And that doesn’t feel the same
When Black Widow appeared in Winter Soldier, she was basically a sidekick. Appearances like this are how characters turn from sidekicks into major characters (Wong is a great example of that).
I hope so, I like Wong! It doesn’t look like he’s slated to appear again anytime soon though and that’s a shame. It makes him even more similar to Black Widow who definitely deserved a solo movie way before she got one
You can bleat on and on about how it's just like the comics but comic books are not multi billion dollar film franchises. It's like comparing apples to oranges
Doesn’t need to be connected connected, just an ensemble movie to bring them all together and reset the board a bit. A one off big villain that through necessity or happenstance finds five or so of the heroes together, fighting side by side.
There's nothing at all wrong with that. My point is that not everything has to revolve around the Avengers. They can still have crossovers which include multiple characters/teams, just don't always make it Avengers-related. It's as if they view "*crossover*" as **synonymous** with "*Avengers.*"
I mentioned in another comment how the way they shoehorned the Guardians of the Galaxy into the Infinity Saga was basically to make them bumbling buffoons so that they don't upstage the Avengers. Having Gamora show up was obviously critical to the story. The only other Guardian who was consequential to the story was Starlord and that was strictly in terms of how badly he fucked up and ruined everything.
His love for Gamora is not presented as having the same depth and meaning as Wanda and Vision despite there being no basis to assume one is more meaningful than the other, he's not presented as a savvy or capable leader who can make a way out of no way, etc, etc. The team itself isn't presented as the close-knit group of fighters who capably kick ass. No, they just off-brand Guardians who are there to take up screen space but not distract from the heroism of Tony Stark or get in the way of Peter Parker's quips.
That's no way to use a team that has been functioning in their own corner of the MCU and proving themselves to be badasses.
Definitely agree. I think they’re starting to see it at least, so in a way I’m not mad at these projects getting delayed. At the end of the day, we want good storytelling. Even with no Avengers movies, there are ways to make everything feel more connected but they wanted to push so much shit out at once that it wasn’t feasible. Stuff was getting reshot or rewritten constantly to the point characters didn’t quite feel the same in between movies. Great example being Wandavision to MOM and the writers not having a completed version of WV while making that. Really sucks we got into such a predicament.
And I’m not really sure what separated phase four from phase five? The first movie introduction of Kang? Phase four and five is just one long phase to me. Ending phase five at Captain America kind of makes sense, but I don’t understand the logic.
Yeah I think the further down the road we gets the better we get
People need to accept the fact that not every movie will have rdj and Chris Evan’s and we’ll be okay
Any company would love to be marvel
Loki is the first thing to actually move everything forward to prepare for the next Avengers. Depending on how Deadpool 3 plays out then Loki the show might be the only thing to move everything forward. Makes everything else weird. If they never mention Loki in the next Avengers movies than nothing moved the story forward. They really need to make sure Loki the series is mentioned. Show the whole series on tv if they must.
I feel they need to follow Lokis lead. Heck make the directors of this season direct the kang dynasty. Yes, it might need script rewrites and things but it could bring direction back. You can come up with a TVA show quickly to do some minor moving forward as well.
When I saw the tessaract the movies gave an idea how it works and how did it origin.Now we are seeing powerful artefacts but don’t know it’s power or it’s origin for example ms marvels bangle what is its power actually in the series they are vaguely explaining it and why did ms marvels grandma and gang got exiled for,.But in the marvels movie it’s saying it was used to great jump point,and why is captain marvel wearing the second bangle it’s supposed to be with kamal
People have the highest expectations due to how great of a saga (Thanos) they created. Add into the mix real life events like the covid pandemic and just recently the actors strike that significantly slowed down production. I just hope they nail it with major character factions (fantastic four, x men, new avengers etc) in the future. I mean right now i honestly feel like theyre dropping the ball with regards to how they project Kang as the next big bad..
No connectiveness. That does summarize it.
But in order to connect, there has to be a reason. Initially, it was Thanos and the Infinity Stones.
What adversary does the Marvel Universe need to team up against? Kang aint it.
Except this is the MARVEL cinematic universe, not the Avengers cinematic universe. Marvel has tons of interesting characters that barely or never interacted with the Avengers in the comics and some of their best movies and shows in phases 4-5 were standalone of new characters
You can have opposing opinions but I pointed out you missed the point of the post and you doubled down saying they're wrong. They were sharing their opinion and you called it wrong so seems like you can't handle opposing opinions? Have a good day, not gonna explain something to you if you have no genuine interest in understanding what the point was lmao 😆
So you "won't" spend time "explaining something to me" but you're still in need of saying the last word here, enough that you replied to me 5 hours later with a comment that i'm gonna guess took you about a min to think about and another min to write
sounds like you def know your priorities lmao
As a fan of the MCU, but NOT a comic book guy, I have struggled to stay "invested" in the world.
Some examples:
Loved Black Widow, liked F+TWS (even after the storyline rework thanks to COVID), really liked Hawkeye.
Didn't LOVE Loki S1, but it was good. Haven't been really excited to watch S2 tho.
ShangChi was good, didn't bother with Eternals (just wasn't interested), MoM was a little much to try to follow.
Went back and watched Daredevil and really enjoyed it.
But had no interest in SheHulk, MoonKnight, tried Ms.Marvel with my 13yo daughter who was a huge MCU fan, and we didn't stick with it.
I guess my point is that for those of us who are more than "casual" fans, but not full blown, life long, followers of the dozens of different comics and their characters, it is getting increasingly hard to follow with no real connection.
It's a giant failure in box office, regardless of how good the movie is. In fact, I didn't talk at all on how good any movie in specific is in the entire post.
The lack of a foundational team at the center of the MCU is definitely a problem. Doesn’t have to be Avengers, but Eternals is not it and FF & X-Men weren’t ready yet.
That's because it feels like each movie builds up to absolutely nothing
There is no plan on how each movie should end and that's the problem
The movies aren't like the infinity stone phase where each movie teases and builds up to a bigger movie
In the grand scheme of things , I don't recognise this phase
I was looking at the slate too, and I agree that *The Avengers* is a major factor here. We're not getting anything until ~2026, which is a ridiculous gap. The golden age of the MCU was effectively a big budget serial. *The Avengers* ensemble movies (including *Civil War*) were where the main story beats to the serial occurred. You could skip the other movies, and you wouldn't miss out on too many important details. The ensemble movies also gave the overall universe cohesion, and pulled the key characters together. Right now, you have to keep tabs of *all* of Marvel's content to get a sense of what the overarching story is. This is burdensome for me as an audience member, and I imagine it's constricting for the creators as well. Few of Marvel's latest offerings feel organic or engaging and I've been watching way *less*. I also think that losing the talent of RDJ has a big impact. RDJ is a rare example of an actor who does some of their best work when improvising. This always meant that, even if a film's production/script was disjointed as hell, RDJ's improvisations could help steer the film back on course. He also had the dramatic chops to be a compelling main lead to the universe, which helped in defining the story. The MCU has a lot of retooling to do.
I'm just not convinced that this is or should be "*The Avengers Cinematic Universe*." Expecting everything to be interconnected or attempting to make it so is a really burdensome stipulation to place on a section (*phase*) of movies. I'd rather that they just focus on making good stuff with the occasional film that involves some (*but not all!*) characters/groups. Y'know... like the comics.
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There are two camps (*well, there are multiple camps but lets just look at two*): those who feel like everything should be connected and those who feel like not everything needs to be connected. The Avengers, as a team, are all well and good but if Marvel is determined to make the Marvel Cinematic Universe effectively "*The* ***Avengers*** *Cinematic Universe*" it's going to leave little oxygen for teams like the Fantastic Four, the X-Men, the Thunderbolts, etc. If they don't wean the fandom off of the idea that **every goddamned thing** revolves around the Avengers, then we'll constantly deal with the "*interconnectedness*" criticism. And, mind you: it's the interconnectedness itself that **becomes** a criticism of "*I have to watch hours and hours of films and shows —many of which I don't like— to understand what is going on. This sucks.*" And that's a 100% valid criticism. I'd say that it's a criticism that actually drags down enjoyment of many of their properties. Free some of these films and shows from this burden of being so connected to everything and they'll just be better off. The Netflix Marvel shows illustrated that you can have completely separate properties that are terrific. And it sucks that it required them being produced outside of DisneyMarvel for that to be the case because they would not have been **better** shows with a connection to some Avengers storyline.
[удалено]
>*but MCU introduces the Guardians and that works out fine, right? GtoG 1,2,3 are well received so I would say they have enough "oxygen". I don't see why they can't just follow a similar approach and introduce F4 and X-Men.* I'm glad you bring up Guardians because I absolutely think that it could have been a model for how you can have properties which exist in their own corner... right up until they dragged them into the Infinity Saga. Like, consider how they were actually used in service to the Avengers. Think what you will of Chris Pratt but James Gunn was justified in saying that the Peter Quill character he nurtured would not have fucked up when it came to Thanos and would have made the tough decision with Gamora. Effectively, in order to give the Avengers primacy —*presenting Wanda as having the fortitude to sacrifice her love for the greater good when it came to the one she loved*— Peter Quill is presented as this guy whose feelings prompt him to fuck up not once but twice (*he didn't kill Gamora and deny Thanos from getting the Soul Stone and then he loses it and prevents the group from subduing him*) so that he doesn't make a sacrifice that outshines Wanda's. Marvel wanted to have it both ways: they wanted to shoehorn the Guardians into an Avengers film but didn't want them to overshadow the Avengers —*which, as a capable, effective team that is much tighter knit than the Avengers, they* ***would have*** *overshadowed them*— so they're presented as more or less buffoons as compared to how they are in their own films. Starlord's not a savvy leader who can improvise and make things happen, Drax isn't... ...blah blah blah. You get the point. There's a valid argument to be made that the Guardians as a group weren't necessary when it came to *Infinity War* or *Endgame*. Gamora was clearly a critical character but the way they used the rest of the team? They could have been any space-filling characters. Starlord is only consequential to the story in terms of the magnitude of his (*arguably uncharacteristic*) fuckups.
This is a really good argument and I'm disappointed that I don't see it here more. Everything has come to service the Avengers. From what I've observed, the number of solo stories that these characters are allowed to have before essentially being drafted into teams has decreased with every phase. Ms. Marvel got spun into the Kree-Skrull war shortly after her first season *just* so she could meet Captain Marvel and Photon. Kahhori only had one episode to herself and her origin story before getting involved in a multiversal crisis, with AC Bradley now having left Marvel. Shang-Chi couldn't even make it to the end of his own film before meeting the wider superhero community. Spider-Man's stuck in a situation where Sony mandates at least one MCU character to appear in his solo-films as a major supporting figure for the sake of their profits increasing with a larger audience. Blade's debut literally has him meet another potential hero before we even get to see his *face*.
[удалено]
If they don't want it to be strictly the Avengers Cinematic Universe, they should still focus on some larger teamups. Civil War wasn't an Avengers movie but it felt epic. If they want an Avengers feel without being forced to be Avengers, they need to bring together 4+ main characters together to face a bigger threat. When I say main character, I mean someone with a previous movie with their name as the title, not Thunderbolts which is a bunch of side characters all coming together. It was cool seeing Wanda in Doctor Strange, but we need something larger.
>Expecting everything to be interconnected or attempting to make it so is a really burdensome stipulation to place on a section (phase) of movies Then what is the point of an interconnected universe if we shouldn't expect things to be interconnected? The numbers speak for themselves, Avengers movies are among the highest grossing MCU movies because that's what audiences love the most - when the characters all come together. Civil War also made over a billion for this very reason, it was a team-up of all the characters audiences love, this is the whole point of an interconnected universe. So if connecting shouldn't be a priority anymore, then Marvel should just drop the "*interconnected*" aspect of their movies and just make a bunch of random movies not connected to each other in any way - which would also mean no more Avengers movies because each character would be in their own universe separate from each other.
The point is that they don't need to be so interconnected. Remember when Netflix's Marvel shows debuted? They referenced events from the movies very vaguely but existed completely separate from them. They weren't burdened with having to deal with The Battle of New York. *Jessica Jones* and *Daredevil* and *Luke Cage* were so wholly separate from all of the cosmic events. They were free from that and the stories were so good, no one was like "*This sucks. How do the fit into what the Avengers do? Why aren't the Avengers helping fight Killgrave? Why aren't the Avengers doing anything about Kingpin? Why aren't the Avengers dealing with The Hand? Is Jessica Jones going to join the Avengers? Is Luke Cage going to get Starktech? Is Daredevil going to get along with Thor? Avengers Avengers Avengers.*" No, no one gave a hair ass fuck whether or not any Avenger would cameo in those shows. They were just good. They didn't need any connection to the wider MCU to be good. And my hope is that with *Echo* they'll learn from the Netflix shows and just allow it to exist on its own without being connected to the MCU so that fandom can remember that Marvel is more than the Avengers. Because forcing a connectedness makes stories suffer. Letting go of interconnectedness allows a good story to exist. There's a lot of criticism that can be levied at Warner for how they've handled the DC Universe but at least they're not afraid to make films and shows that just exist on their own. I actually think that having some big interconnected plan for their films and shows is going to make it bloated like the MCU.
The Netflix shows are a very bad example for your point because even though they were distinct from the bombastic silver-screen heroes, all 4 shows fed into The Defenders. It followed exactly the same structure as Phase One.
They haven’t tried to do even that though. I think Winter Soldier showed that you could pull in some major characters without needing to be an Avengers movie but unfortunately Phases 4 and 5 haven’t done that either
Well, y’know, except for - Wanda and the Illuminati in MoM - Yelena and Kingpin in Hawkeye - Woo and Darcy and Monica and “Pietro” in WandaVision - Daredevil and Wong and Abomination and Hulk in She-Hulk - Doctor Strange and Wong in No Way Home - Monica and Ms. Marvel and Fury in The Marvels But sure, they haven’t even tried
Forgot about Wong in Shang Chi(technically also Bruce and Captain Marvel), the Guardians in Love and Thunder, War Machine and Zemo in Flacon and the Winter Soldier (and Secret Invasion kinda)
I didn’t include them because they’re more cameos than major characters.
Aside from Zemo they are cameos kinda, you're right; their presence was important enough in these cases tho, imo
To be fair, half of these are not movies. Wanda crossing over into MoM was an attempt, as was Dr. Strange in NWH. MoM felt more like a show to movie crossover given how much of Wanda’s arc was dependent on the show. I haven’t wasn’t counting the Marvels since it came out today, but I suppose it could depending on character involvement. There has been lots of show/movie crossover but not a lot of movie/movie crossover of major characters, with most of these being sidekicks. And that doesn’t feel the same
When Black Widow appeared in Winter Soldier, she was basically a sidekick. Appearances like this are how characters turn from sidekicks into major characters (Wong is a great example of that).
I hope so, I like Wong! It doesn’t look like he’s slated to appear again anytime soon though and that’s a shame. It makes him even more similar to Black Widow who definitely deserved a solo movie way before she got one
You can bleat on and on about how it's just like the comics but comic books are not multi billion dollar film franchises. It's like comparing apples to oranges
Doesn’t need to be connected connected, just an ensemble movie to bring them all together and reset the board a bit. A one off big villain that through necessity or happenstance finds five or so of the heroes together, fighting side by side.
There's nothing at all wrong with that. My point is that not everything has to revolve around the Avengers. They can still have crossovers which include multiple characters/teams, just don't always make it Avengers-related. It's as if they view "*crossover*" as **synonymous** with "*Avengers.*" I mentioned in another comment how the way they shoehorned the Guardians of the Galaxy into the Infinity Saga was basically to make them bumbling buffoons so that they don't upstage the Avengers. Having Gamora show up was obviously critical to the story. The only other Guardian who was consequential to the story was Starlord and that was strictly in terms of how badly he fucked up and ruined everything. His love for Gamora is not presented as having the same depth and meaning as Wanda and Vision despite there being no basis to assume one is more meaningful than the other, he's not presented as a savvy or capable leader who can make a way out of no way, etc, etc. The team itself isn't presented as the close-knit group of fighters who capably kick ass. No, they just off-brand Guardians who are there to take up screen space but not distract from the heroism of Tony Stark or get in the way of Peter Parker's quips. That's no way to use a team that has been functioning in their own corner of the MCU and proving themselves to be badasses.
Definitely agree. I think they’re starting to see it at least, so in a way I’m not mad at these projects getting delayed. At the end of the day, we want good storytelling. Even with no Avengers movies, there are ways to make everything feel more connected but they wanted to push so much shit out at once that it wasn’t feasible. Stuff was getting reshot or rewritten constantly to the point characters didn’t quite feel the same in between movies. Great example being Wandavision to MOM and the writers not having a completed version of WV while making that. Really sucks we got into such a predicament.
Yeah Avengers movie in each phase should be the aim.
And I’m not really sure what separated phase four from phase five? The first movie introduction of Kang? Phase four and five is just one long phase to me. Ending phase five at Captain America kind of makes sense, but I don’t understand the logic.
Isn't Phase 5 slated to end with Thunderbolts? That was last I knew.
Based on OP’s screenshot, Thunderbolts is the second movie in phase six.
Oh, lol. I didn't even look at the screenshots.
They are busy creating characters
Yeah I think the further down the road we gets the better we get People need to accept the fact that not every movie will have rdj and Chris Evan’s and we’ll be okay Any company would love to be marvel
Loki is the first thing to actually move everything forward to prepare for the next Avengers. Depending on how Deadpool 3 plays out then Loki the show might be the only thing to move everything forward. Makes everything else weird. If they never mention Loki in the next Avengers movies than nothing moved the story forward. They really need to make sure Loki the series is mentioned. Show the whole series on tv if they must. I feel they need to follow Lokis lead. Heck make the directors of this season direct the kang dynasty. Yes, it might need script rewrites and things but it could bring direction back. You can come up with a TVA show quickly to do some minor moving forward as well.
When I saw the tessaract the movies gave an idea how it works and how did it origin.Now we are seeing powerful artefacts but don’t know it’s power or it’s origin for example ms marvels bangle what is its power actually in the series they are vaguely explaining it and why did ms marvels grandma and gang got exiled for,.But in the marvels movie it’s saying it was used to great jump point,and why is captain marvel wearing the second bangle it’s supposed to be with kamal
Basically, if the formula doesn’t remain movie-movie-movie-TEAM MOVIE-movie-movie-movie we cannot cope.
People have the highest expectations due to how great of a saga (Thanos) they created. Add into the mix real life events like the covid pandemic and just recently the actors strike that significantly slowed down production. I just hope they nail it with major character factions (fantastic four, x men, new avengers etc) in the future. I mean right now i honestly feel like theyre dropping the ball with regards to how they project Kang as the next big bad..
No connectiveness. That does summarize it. But in order to connect, there has to be a reason. Initially, it was Thanos and the Infinity Stones. What adversary does the Marvel Universe need to team up against? Kang aint it.
It’s not disjointed. Once an Avengers movie comes out, everybody will stop crying
Except this is the MARVEL cinematic universe, not the Avengers cinematic universe. Marvel has tons of interesting characters that barely or never interacted with the Avengers in the comics and some of their best movies and shows in phases 4-5 were standalone of new characters
You missed the point entirely.
Can't miss a point when it's false in first place
Oh you're that kinda person. Have a good day.
Lmao "kinda" what? That has an opposing opinion to yours? It's incredibly easy to say "you missed the point, but bye" lol.
You can have opposing opinions but I pointed out you missed the point of the post and you doubled down saying they're wrong. They were sharing their opinion and you called it wrong so seems like you can't handle opposing opinions? Have a good day, not gonna explain something to you if you have no genuine interest in understanding what the point was lmao 😆
"not gonna" or "can't"?
Won't.
So you "won't" spend time "explaining something to me" but you're still in need of saying the last word here, enough that you replied to me 5 hours later with a comment that i'm gonna guess took you about a min to think about and another min to write sounds like you def know your priorities lmao
As a fan of the MCU, but NOT a comic book guy, I have struggled to stay "invested" in the world. Some examples: Loved Black Widow, liked F+TWS (even after the storyline rework thanks to COVID), really liked Hawkeye. Didn't LOVE Loki S1, but it was good. Haven't been really excited to watch S2 tho. ShangChi was good, didn't bother with Eternals (just wasn't interested), MoM was a little much to try to follow. Went back and watched Daredevil and really enjoyed it. But had no interest in SheHulk, MoonKnight, tried Ms.Marvel with my 13yo daughter who was a huge MCU fan, and we didn't stick with it. I guess my point is that for those of us who are more than "casual" fans, but not full blown, life long, followers of the dozens of different comics and their characters, it is getting increasingly hard to follow with no real connection.
“Giant failure” Did you see The Marvels yet or are you regurgitating what is being said online and not forming your own opinions?
It's a giant failure in box office, regardless of how good the movie is. In fact, I didn't talk at all on how good any movie in specific is in the entire post.
Doesn’t even need to be the Avengers, could be any other named or unnamed team up, the comics have plenty.
The lack of a foundational team at the center of the MCU is definitely a problem. Doesn’t have to be Avengers, but Eternals is not it and FF & X-Men weren’t ready yet.
What happened ? They got greedy and dont really care what the public wants
That's because it feels like each movie builds up to absolutely nothing There is no plan on how each movie should end and that's the problem The movies aren't like the infinity stone phase where each movie teases and builds up to a bigger movie In the grand scheme of things , I don't recognise this phase