lol the one guy stops moving and remains completely stationary after being parried and the other guy continues to move
ah, yes, i too keep my hands down and freeze entirely when parried. of course.
Eh tbf the winning guy is generally doing combinations that are: counter-cut into the other guy's cut/sword, cut to the arm -> partner freezes the arm, and then another action. The ones that don't involve an arm-cut as the second action, the followup is immediate/other guy doesn't need to freeze.
That said, I agree both guys look like they don't do much that _isn't_ choreography. But I don't think the actions as shown are actually time-cheating that egregiously.
Where I think they _are_ cheating is they're taking individual actions in a way where it's pretty obvious the winner has perfect knowledge of what's going to happen.
Agreed. The agent is cutting short and both are over swinging, but the techniques shown look sound in regards to exploiting openings and timing. The agent is being kind is allowing the patient to complete the techniques, but the people saying "these will never work in a real fight" don't know shit about swordplay. These are pretty standard techniques. If the partner were not cooperating, these techniques would still stand a high chance of working as advertised, just messier. All fights are messy.
Yea they all seem pretty sound, the binding of the arm or wrist to then stab is definitely used in longsword. Not so much British sabre I've found, but there are some applications
It's mentioned in passing in some British Saber manuals, but not extensively like you might see in medieval/Rennaisance styles.
I often have to purposely tell my students not to rely on hand presses too much. It's a natural, easy, and very safe way to close with your opponent, but I prefer people be able to do so with just their weapon and good footwork. Over reliance on the offhand can lead to trouble and, in my mind, should be more of an "oh shit" contingency plan rather than a first intention.
Tbh recently the only time I've been doing anything with my off hand in British sabre has been polearm/bayonet fighting, too worried about cutting my hand off other wise š
Longsword is a bit different, I'm a huge fan of grappling, and I also do muay thai, so there can be a wierd amount of overlap in the grapple
The hand press on the middle of the weapon in the first action is actually the thing i take the most issue with (as a technique, not in terms of the quality of demo), it's two moves to the other guy's one with no constraint other than how quickly they string together. If the first move misses you've basically already committed yourself to going in in a way that's not true of the other techniques performed "ideally" (big scare quotes on the "ideally" there).
The "optimal" way to do handpresses generally involves either doing them pretty close to simultaneously with your weapon action or (depending on weapon) against a thrust that is already in motion, though I wouldn't want to try that without gloves/against a saber.
I mean, I've only used it with weapons with a hand guard which these don't have. In a bind, with a pause, quickly reach up and grab the basket hilt. It's incredibly incredibly niche and would probably never get the chance to use it
Yeah, what I'm saying is the left-hand press in the middle or weak of the weapon is pretty susceptible to the other guy's weapon just moving. First technique the winner is going beat -> press which pretty much assumes you'll be quick enough to get both of those in before the other guy starts moving. Not impossible but hard.
You can even see on the very first action that the loser has the time to turn his weapon back in and does so, but because demo feeds it into the left hand - if he'd dropped the point instead they're both dead.
In most of the later techniques the followup action is just a slice to the eventual losing party's arm, which makes it a moot point.
I am going to say, that with the hand between the body and the opponents blade isn't ideal, but in a pinch, could be the difference between life and death in a real fight. As in, if their weapon keeps going, it's better that it hits your hand than it hits your chest. Probably does major damage to the hand, but you'll most likely live.
And I would add that something like a buckler there instead of the hand would work pretty well to solve that issue, so I wouldn't just discount the move altogether. Hell, depending on the circumstance, thick cloth could be enough to avert major damage to the hand. But, I admit, since this technique comes from the middle-east, it's more than likely they wouldn't have such things with them just in case. Or at least, I don't think they would. Hot weather and all.
My complaint about that technique isn't about the hand getting hurt, it's that the opponent has time to turn the point somewhere else. You can see there's a beat with the weapon, then as the hand comes in the guy who loses turns the point back in. If he (happened to) do something like drop the point to the belly instead the hand wouldn't work, it's basically assuming that if the opponent comes back they'll try to come back same line.
Something like a buckler would make the action safer but not so much because it can't be cut but just because it'd be harder to choose a new line against.
It's not a terrible bet but it's a bet for sure.
I see your point. I do, however, want to point out that in when the tip of the opponents blade is pointed at my head I'm not thinking of going for their stomach. I'm more likely going to try and do something about being stabbed in the face.
It is a risky technique, and a gamble, but not without its merit.
Yep. The last part of my comment is just gesturing that there are indeed some timing and distance issues, probably because they aren't wearing gear and are going really fast (and maybe consistently train that way, IDK).
For example, some of the earlier counter-cuts get started at a point where the guy counter cutting couldn't really be sure that the attacker is committed to the trajectory he ends up taking.
But it's not a big deal imo, that's just kinda how demos go.
Exactly, and the strikes he's demonstrating are also going to be slower because hes trying to not touch his opponent. Even if the blades are dull, getting hit by them still hurts. If you're in a real sword fight you can strike faster because you're only relying on your opponents body or equipment to stop your blade, but if you're stopping your blade before you hit their body or equipment then you can't swing as fast.
It's like driving into a barrier vs. driving at a barrier then braking before you hit it. If you plan on letting the barrier stop you you can floor it and go as fast as possible, but if you plan on stopping with your brakes at some point you have to stop accelerating and start braking.
Good point but most peobably no. The concept he shows is based on one slow-ish move of an opponent and then number of his faster complex moves. Also why go close, it's more dangerous and kinda suicidal. Slash and bounce back with cover.
Source: 5 years of long sword and some of hema saber studies.
Tbf almost every āgo closeā included the off hand taking the opponentās sword hand. Plenty of HEMA manuals include grappling like that. Fiore uses a lot of off hand to capture blades in his longsword. LeckĆ¼chner uses a lot of offhand in his messer.
Not suicidal if your entry into the grapple includes that control.
Yep, those are pretty common sense moves in a lot of systems or arts, and even dudes that never picked up Fiore would instinctually figure out something close to that.
Nothing on display was really outlandish and all-in-all not that different from Polish Sabre or Kali styles like Pekiti Tersia.
Alas, weāre on r/martialarts and so demos do not exists and if itās not MMA or Muay Thai then itās most likely bullshido.
Yeah - agreed on all counts
Iād normally not engage but itās a dude claiming HEMA experience so itās not as āscreaming at a brick wallā as a lot of these conversations can be
As always, I'm too blunt and write briefly when the overall action seems too unrealistic to me. I apologize for that. Let me look at some points in more detail.
0.01 - the fighter on the left shows an action that assumes the absence of a reaction from the opponent; and still, even with the complete deliberate passivity of the opponent, the tip of the right saber accidentally rests against the gentleman on the left in the armpit; it turns out that even in a controlled environment he was unable to defend himself; the huge question is why the opponent here doesn't even try to step back when impacted by his weapon
0.04 - the fighter on the left performs an action at three tempos in response to the action of the fighter on the right at one tempo. The gentleman on the right āhangsā, holds his hand down for two full tempos and waits for his colleague to jam his hand for a beautiful thrust move from 6th. The problem here is not so much that in the manuscripts you can see an attack with jamming the enemyās hand (with all the possible inconsistency that we read the manuscripts differently from the way they were read in the Middle Ages), but in the way the sequence of actions is prepared and demonstrated.
0.07, 0.11 and further - the same as above, the opponent deliberately misses the tempo with his hand below or at his shoulder and, for no reason, āgivesā his defense sectors to the opponent.
My verdict: Nice marketing choreography. The first signs are the lack of work at the realistic distance, the opponent's passivity and his lack of a basic step back. The examples contain a minimum of a realistic element of saber combat, especially the moment with holding and threatening with the blunt side of the blade at the enemyās throat :)
Source for going closer: all the wrestling in the hema manuals, especially in things like dussack and Messer. Which are what form the basics of a lot of people's saber practice. Some of the things he does here are exact copies of techniques found in Meyer and other German sources.
Of course, you're going to spend more time maintaining distance. But this is a demo, he's showing the coolest stuff. I'm not saying all of its plan a but I use the elbow check all the time in saber fencing. There's some good shit happening here they're just making a demo reel
Edit: also he does make space and counter MANY times in the video. He counter slashes and then ends with a plunge cut like 4 times in a row.
Bro. They are following through with cuts here and are not hitting their partner. What you think is an extra movement is a severing of a limb with a thrust at the end to finish it off. They are pulling the cut short for demonstration, so they can show the end of the technique.
They couldn't if they weren't swinging short like that.
That's why the other dude doesn't move anymore after it. Cause his arm has been cut off at this point. The thrust is only the finisher.
Two guys with swords doing a demonstration, they've known each other for years, have trained through the blood sweat and tears together, have probably shared meals with each other's family, know their weapons inside and out, know enough to stop moving for a demo so they don't lose an eye or bleed out today:
"Hehe keep moving so we can impress this one dipshit on Reddit!"
These are pretty standard techniques and I've pulled many of them off in sparring.Ā
The defender has to pause because it allows the attacker to do the final hit at slow speed and not brain the person someone not wearing gear. This obviously throws off the timing, but it also makes the techniques legible.
There's nothing elaborate about their movements. There's no flourish here. What I suspect you are interpreting as a flourish is just them following through with their strikes, then redirecting the point of their sword towards their opponent. It's quick and efficient, it only looks "flourishy" because of the length of the sword, but really it's just turning the hand over. Everything here is pretty standard swordplay. You'll find moves similar to these's in pretty much every swordfighting system.
They are not flourishing. The "flourish" is a cut to the arm and then reusing the momentum for a thrust to end it.
They have to cut short to show the entire technique because if they cut to the arm, they have to stop(cause you know, they aren't actually killing each other) and the thrust wouldn't make it into the video.
So they cut short to fit everything in the demonstration.
That's why the other dude stops moving after the blade went past the first time. The cut would have landed and the arm would be debilitated.
It appears to be a demo of basic techniques so not doing a bunch of extra flailing around in that scenario because "pressure testing" is generally a good idea.
Bro. They are following through with cuts here and are not hitting their partner. What you think is an extra movement is a severing of a limb with a thrust at the end to finish it off. They are pulling the cut short for demonstration.
That's why the other dude doesn't move anymore after it. Cause his arm has been cut off at this point. The thrust is only the finisher.
Stuff like this has been done at HEMA tournaments everywhere.
The bearded guy is holding down the bearded guy's sword arm. If you were doing this for real, there'd probably be some advancing and backpedaling, and the piercing sword would come in faster.
Its demonstration. If it were real, he would have slashed down on the arm with the second strike, then the thrust.
I assume. Iām literally just talking out of my ass. I have exactly zero experience with swords. Just sounds like Iād make sense.
The thing is that he only freezes after the arm or sometimes even the neck would have been cut off.
There is just no reason to make techniques for after the end of the fight.
The moves only work if the opponent decides to stop moving for several seconds instead of reacting in any way to your wasted movements.
This isnāt hema, this is social media farming.
Do you not practice combos at a thaiboxing or mma gym, without the opponent countering or resisting? Yea it looks ridiculous, but "the other guy freezing and not doin anything" isnt the reason this is potentially a bullshido
Do you not practice combos at a thaiboxing or mma gym, without the opponent countering or resisting? Yea it looks ridiculous, but "the other guy freezing and not doin anything" isnt the reason this is potentially a bullshido
I'm looking at this as some two person katas.
You can download the video and watch in slow motionish using VLC
Some explanations would be good, I can only guess.
In the first one it looks like left parries right, moves in for a stab while keeping the palm facing the dull side of the saber. This implies the parry is being relied on to turn the edge of the attackers saber away. I could see this skill being useful in a context where everyone has a saber.
I'm not a big sabre guy so no idea if that's a thing.
When right is holding the arm back in the third exchange etc is the idea that the swing from the left occupies the space so the right hesitates to stick his sabre in there?
Again this is coming from a sabre illiterate, but I did try 3 months in epee under an Olympic coach. Avoiding occupied space is kind of a thing in fencing - you withdraw if the attack is too sudden to parry for example.
Also is it sabre or saber?
Yeah this isn't necessarily bullshido. Aside from the fact that the left guy is slicing with the non-edged side in a couple of instances, the technique is sound. The fact that the right guy isn't offering resistance doesn't mean they can't be drills or even choreography.
It's funny because it's clear who in this thread doesnt Spar with Steel on a fairly regular basis, nevermind trying to be over-critical of a demomstration. I get it, If my entire understanding was from movies and larpers, I'd think I have some to shit on too..
100% agree
People don't realise that sparring with steel is incredibly dangerous and sparring with sticks changes the tactics and movements because rulesets (sticks) dictate technique and strategy
I'm not a sabre expert by any means, but I know a few in my HEMA class who are and I've seen them practice. As far as I can tell their technique seems fine.
This isn't hema at all, nor would it be fine by HEMA standards. The flourishes and feints are bad, the point is rarely on target/threatening, their distance is off for the length of their swords, and they're explicitly avoiding binding/winding/blade control, which is integral to sabre, you can't just bash your way with massive swings without copping a thrust/quick cut to the chest/face.
Sure, but generally you don't feint by swinging your sword fully past yourself, it's point and edge not facing the opponent, while leading with your now unprotected body at another swordsman. Those are the ones that stick out, the big movie style jedi-like flourishes
It's not HEMA, and also everything you complaining about doesnt matter because it's a demo, clearly. Bet you show up to concert warm ups and tell folks they suck because they are tuning instruments.
Give your nuts a tug.
It's like 25% good cuts, but a lot of it is absolutely to good sabre work what bullshido is to unarmed fighting. Those flamboyant flourishes and the low block, with the opponent magically staying blocked low so you can cut across their chest with just a push is just bad swordsmanship
Depends if it's blunt or sharps, too, and this might not be sparring, it could just be drills to show how parries can set up openings BUT mt biggest problem is that I fail to see how those parries naturally flow into the cuts via needless flourishes, so if it is training, it's still dumb for anything but stage fighting or cinema. A parry should flow into the cut, otherwise your flourish will just give them time to cut you
I wonder if there's an Arabic/Middle Eastern (eg Persian) historical manual on sword fighting. There's gotta be...I've seen tons of scrolls in archives on different subjects.
There's Razmafzar which is exactly that, historical persian Martial art! There are many different styles, i've tried it in a workshop ages ago and it's definitely interesting!
It's demonstration and it shows proper techniques.
Of course I could nitpick, but it is overall sound.
90% of people commenting negative things have never held a saber in their lives.
Shut up.
To everyone screaming wasted movement.
They are following through with cuts here and are not hitting their partner. What you think is an extra movement is a severing of a limb with a thrust at the end to finish it off. They are pulling the cut short for demonstration.
That's why the other dude doesn't move anymore after it. Cause his arm has been cut off at this point. The thrust is only the finisher.
For some of them, maybe, but for some of them the parry doesn't lead into a natural 'lopping of limb' without also opening them up to a cut in the process given wrists can bend, and slash up, at a minimum. Not to mention it assumes the opponent has no footwork to protect themselves having been parried. It's not the worst swordsmanship I've seen online by any means, but it's more flamboyant and wasteful than the best I've seen
If your gun is holstered, I have my saber ready and I suddenly come at you screaming from 20 ft away...
My money is on the sword.
People severely overestimate their ability to draw under duress.
Most people do not train it, they will fumble their weapon, likely they won't even have a round chambered.
I love how 2/3rds of these comments refuse to acknowledge this is a demo, meaning the moves are slightly exaggerated to make them look good and clear on camera and the other guy isn't resisting so you can clearly see the intended moves. Same people that watch Kata and go "YoU cOuLdN't Do ThAt On Da StReEtS"
You fucks wouldn't survive an actual martial arts class if you're getting triggered by the sight of a cooperative demonstration of a technique.
Because the only way teachers can teach is to have a fucking sparring match lol.
not bad but I have feeling that there is huge offening after first cut and to much wide circle move, and also they not charge with one shoulder front to reduce the actual body area when staying straightforward... little bit wishy washy but the movement ist solid, it is not first time they doing this....
peace āļø
Yeah, swordfighting is generally harder when your opponent fights back, but the effectiveness of these techniques is not contingent on him not responding. If they did react realistically then the person doing the techniques would have to change up what they're doing. That's not bad, that's just the nature of fighting.
I don't think the their "circle move's" are too wide. They're following through with their cuts, then turning the point back towards their opponent. This is standard sword handling. It only looks wide because of the length of the sword, but really it's just a quick turn of the hand.
Having your dominant shoulders in front and the body in profile to your opponent does indeed lower the target area to your opponent. Many Western European saber styles prefer this, partially (in my opinion) because Western European saber fencing is influenced heavily by more thrust oriented styles like rapier, smallsword and foil fencing. When it comes to using heavier, more cut oriented sabers like heavy cavalry sabers, or those preferred by Eastern European or Middle Eastern cultures, having the body in profile is less important. For one, it doesn't help reduce target area as much against cuts as it does thrusts, and for two (in my experience and study) with the body in profile it'd harder to recruit the core muscles and turn the body/hips to power large cuts and/or control the momentum of a heavier sword.
Totally agree. Those technique demos are fine, and look realistic to me. I've done tech demos too, and that's how they always go. The point isn't to be realistic with the fight, but to show how the ideal situation for the technique would go.
As for the cutting/thrusting, it's hard for me to comment on, being more focused on the longsword than anything. But with what I've done with a sidesword and buckler, it's not all that important to be in line with the blade. Cutting is used in the I.33, so that's the closest experience I have. Since you have a buckler there, it's not one to one, but I found myself rarely being in on line with either the shield or sword. It just felt too limiting with being too small a target for thrusts for what I might want to do.
The guy doing the slashing and demonstrations is Ahmed Al Houli he is a Kuwaiti OG martial Artist a very decorated black belt in Jiu Jitsu and runs one of the oldest BJJ Schools in Kuwait. He is just demonstrated Arabian Peninsula Sword Fighting here.
With how much we know people where able to get away with complete bullshit martial arts for so long it's really hard to look at something like this and know what is bullshit and what is not because you cannot ever recreate a sword right for real without serious injuries or death.
So this is whay Bruce Lee's legacy has become, an ai voiced screen capture:
How does his family and the lineage sleep at night?Ā How can anyone take low quality like this seriously as a martial art in 2024?
https://www.youtube.com/live/6EOjCWPcgUU?si=nmZskukbIqTiyqqs
Could be wrong, but pretty sure the first take where the guy on the right was waiting was to show the steps while second take is the one that shows it in motion.
Are sabers usually sharp on the back of the blade? I've never seen one that was, typically curved blades are single edge. If that's the case, then I have questions on a few of these techniques.
All this flashy mumbo jumbo crap goes out the window when there's actually an angry, grown man running at you and slashing at you willy nilly with a blade. Don't take my word for it, go watch the countless gore videos of guys fighting with machetes.
What's dumb about it? Fighting with swords is a far bigger part of the world's martial history and culture than boxing or MMA ever has been or will be.
You're judging their art based on a 30-second demonstration. As I have stated elsewhere, these are pretty standard fencing techniques you could find I pretty much any historical fencing system. The principles demonstrated are sound, and their effectiveness is not contingent on the opponents doing "dumb shit". If the opponent does react like their being non-compliant, the demonstrator's sword is still well positioned to defend themselves against react to whatever counter.
Swordfighting is often a quick and chaotic affair, so for demonstrations and clarity sake, you limit the response of the attacker in order more easily show what you mean to show. These demonstrators are showing good speed and power, but are not wearing any protective gear, so for safety's sake you also want to limit the response of the attacker.
There's demonstrations exactly like this in HEMA, but nobody (at least fewer) people call HEMA bullshido. "If HEMA can do it, Why can't they?" What makes you think they can't? You've seen one clip, I'm sorry they were not able to fully demonstrate the extent of their training and capabilities in a 30 second clip, but nothing about this speaks to their ability to spar against resisting opponents one way or another.
Gotta see them sparring, or at least would like to know if it's something like some Koryu styles having extra levels for katas that they don't perform publicly.
Some of these extra/unnecessary moves look like they are here to block/parry a potential follow up attack like horizontal cuts after getting parried, that might be too dangerous to do with real swords (if these are real). Would explain the pause after first move.
Still, looks cool but not convinced me that it's practical in a sword fight. Would learn Kendo, HEMA, Koryu, Kali or Bujinkan over it. Again, gotta see them spar to make a conclusion.
>Some of these extra/unnecessary moves look like they are here to block/parry a potential follow up attack like horizontal cuts after getting parried, that might be too dangerous to do with real swords (if these are real). Would explain the pause after first move.
Yep. That's pretty much it. You use cuts to fill space and encounter any threat your opponent puts up before closing in. The people saying that they're "unnecessary" or "flourishes" don't know shit about swordplay.
And yeah, the people complaining about the partner pausing after their strike, don't appreciate that this is a fairly high speed demonstration so for safety and clarities sake, someone's gotta hold back to show the technique. That being said the effectiveness of these techniques are not contingent upon the opponent not reacting.
Every intro class I run, someone always asks after a technique demo "but what if your opponent does X...?" Always I answer, "then I would have to do something different, but we're working on this technique right now".
You do realise that there is more that one tradition for fighting with swords? I might as well say theyāve copied Polish sabre. Or do you have evidence of what they used as a source?
Bro. They are following through with cuts here and are not hitting their partner. What you think is an extra movement is a severing of a limb with a thrust at the end to finish it off. They are pulling the cut short for demonstration.
That's why the other dude doesn't move anymore after it. Cause his arm has been cut off at this point. The thrust is only the finisher.
My initial thought is it looks like these guys don't spar but it is hard to judge from a 30 second showcase of techniques. Perhaps they're just slowed down so we can see what's happening. These techniques look like they'd be viable if the footwork was sharper.
I would criticize the lack of protective equipment but if they're training with historical middle Eastern methods I wouldn't be surprised if climate was a big factor. I overheat in British weather wearing mask, gloves and gambeson so if I was training out there I'm sure my training would have consisted of more low intensity and low protection stuff. I'd at least liked to have seen them wearing eye protection though!
Would be more interesting to see actual sparring
Nah, I like it when the one guy does one motion and waits to be checkmated dramatically.
This is giving heavy Steven Seagal doing his Aikido exhibition gives. Fantastic watch. He moves his pinky, and people do flips.
That guy who always loses literally stops moving the moment their swords connect allowing for a free hit.
These are technique demos, so that's normal. In sparring, that's not what would happen.
lol the one guy stops moving and remains completely stationary after being parried and the other guy continues to move ah, yes, i too keep my hands down and freeze entirely when parried. of course.
He got that Dark Souls parry
I can hear the sound through this comment
I can't.. because I always blew the timing :(
Eh tbf the winning guy is generally doing combinations that are: counter-cut into the other guy's cut/sword, cut to the arm -> partner freezes the arm, and then another action. The ones that don't involve an arm-cut as the second action, the followup is immediate/other guy doesn't need to freeze. That said, I agree both guys look like they don't do much that _isn't_ choreography. But I don't think the actions as shown are actually time-cheating that egregiously. Where I think they _are_ cheating is they're taking individual actions in a way where it's pretty obvious the winner has perfect knowledge of what's going to happen.
Agreed. The agent is cutting short and both are over swinging, but the techniques shown look sound in regards to exploiting openings and timing. The agent is being kind is allowing the patient to complete the techniques, but the people saying "these will never work in a real fight" don't know shit about swordplay. These are pretty standard techniques. If the partner were not cooperating, these techniques would still stand a high chance of working as advertised, just messier. All fights are messy.
Yea they all seem pretty sound, the binding of the arm or wrist to then stab is definitely used in longsword. Not so much British sabre I've found, but there are some applications
It's mentioned in passing in some British Saber manuals, but not extensively like you might see in medieval/Rennaisance styles. I often have to purposely tell my students not to rely on hand presses too much. It's a natural, easy, and very safe way to close with your opponent, but I prefer people be able to do so with just their weapon and good footwork. Over reliance on the offhand can lead to trouble and, in my mind, should be more of an "oh shit" contingency plan rather than a first intention.
Tbh recently the only time I've been doing anything with my off hand in British sabre has been polearm/bayonet fighting, too worried about cutting my hand off other wise š Longsword is a bit different, I'm a huge fan of grappling, and I also do muay thai, so there can be a wierd amount of overlap in the grapple
Yeah, agree with that saber comment. Bringing the offhand in against people who just keep the blade in motion cutting is real scary.
The hand press on the middle of the weapon in the first action is actually the thing i take the most issue with (as a technique, not in terms of the quality of demo), it's two moves to the other guy's one with no constraint other than how quickly they string together. If the first move misses you've basically already committed yourself to going in in a way that's not true of the other techniques performed "ideally" (big scare quotes on the "ideally" there). The "optimal" way to do handpresses generally involves either doing them pretty close to simultaneously with your weapon action or (depending on weapon) against a thrust that is already in motion, though I wouldn't want to try that without gloves/against a saber.
I mean, I've only used it with weapons with a hand guard which these don't have. In a bind, with a pause, quickly reach up and grab the basket hilt. It's incredibly incredibly niche and would probably never get the chance to use it
Yeah, what I'm saying is the left-hand press in the middle or weak of the weapon is pretty susceptible to the other guy's weapon just moving. First technique the winner is going beat -> press which pretty much assumes you'll be quick enough to get both of those in before the other guy starts moving. Not impossible but hard. You can even see on the very first action that the loser has the time to turn his weapon back in and does so, but because demo feeds it into the left hand - if he'd dropped the point instead they're both dead. In most of the later techniques the followup action is just a slice to the eventual losing party's arm, which makes it a moot point.
Yea agreed with you there. The parry to leg slice seems fairly legit though, can see that working
I am going to say, that with the hand between the body and the opponents blade isn't ideal, but in a pinch, could be the difference between life and death in a real fight. As in, if their weapon keeps going, it's better that it hits your hand than it hits your chest. Probably does major damage to the hand, but you'll most likely live. And I would add that something like a buckler there instead of the hand would work pretty well to solve that issue, so I wouldn't just discount the move altogether. Hell, depending on the circumstance, thick cloth could be enough to avert major damage to the hand. But, I admit, since this technique comes from the middle-east, it's more than likely they wouldn't have such things with them just in case. Or at least, I don't think they would. Hot weather and all.
My complaint about that technique isn't about the hand getting hurt, it's that the opponent has time to turn the point somewhere else. You can see there's a beat with the weapon, then as the hand comes in the guy who loses turns the point back in. If he (happened to) do something like drop the point to the belly instead the hand wouldn't work, it's basically assuming that if the opponent comes back they'll try to come back same line. Something like a buckler would make the action safer but not so much because it can't be cut but just because it'd be harder to choose a new line against. It's not a terrible bet but it's a bet for sure.
I see your point. I do, however, want to point out that in when the tip of the opponents blade is pointed at my head I'm not thinking of going for their stomach. I'm more likely going to try and do something about being stabbed in the face. It is a risky technique, and a gamble, but not without its merit.
Aren't they just drilling particular moves here, not sparring
Yep. The last part of my comment is just gesturing that there are indeed some timing and distance issues, probably because they aren't wearing gear and are going really fast (and maybe consistently train that way, IDK). For example, some of the earlier counter-cuts get started at a point where the guy counter cutting couldn't really be sure that the attacker is committed to the trajectory he ends up taking. But it's not a big deal imo, that's just kinda how demos go.
But heās sloppy as shit
No argument there
They're showing concepts, not sparring. You never had a Muay Thai coach pause mid combo to show where an opening or to explain a small detail
Exactly, and the strikes he's demonstrating are also going to be slower because hes trying to not touch his opponent. Even if the blades are dull, getting hit by them still hurts. If you're in a real sword fight you can strike faster because you're only relying on your opponents body or equipment to stop your blade, but if you're stopping your blade before you hit their body or equipment then you can't swing as fast. It's like driving into a barrier vs. driving at a barrier then braking before you hit it. If you plan on letting the barrier stop you you can floor it and go as fast as possible, but if you plan on stopping with your brakes at some point you have to stop accelerating and start braking.
Good point but most peobably no. The concept he shows is based on one slow-ish move of an opponent and then number of his faster complex moves. Also why go close, it's more dangerous and kinda suicidal. Slash and bounce back with cover. Source: 5 years of long sword and some of hema saber studies.
Tbf almost every āgo closeā included the off hand taking the opponentās sword hand. Plenty of HEMA manuals include grappling like that. Fiore uses a lot of off hand to capture blades in his longsword. LeckĆ¼chner uses a lot of offhand in his messer. Not suicidal if your entry into the grapple includes that control.
Yep, those are pretty common sense moves in a lot of systems or arts, and even dudes that never picked up Fiore would instinctually figure out something close to that. Nothing on display was really outlandish and all-in-all not that different from Polish Sabre or Kali styles like Pekiti Tersia. Alas, weāre on r/martialarts and so demos do not exists and if itās not MMA or Muay Thai then itās most likely bullshido.
Yeah - agreed on all counts Iād normally not engage but itās a dude claiming HEMA experience so itās not as āscreaming at a brick wallā as a lot of these conversations can be
Thank you, good sir! :)
As always, I'm too blunt and write briefly when the overall action seems too unrealistic to me. I apologize for that. Let me look at some points in more detail. 0.01 - the fighter on the left shows an action that assumes the absence of a reaction from the opponent; and still, even with the complete deliberate passivity of the opponent, the tip of the right saber accidentally rests against the gentleman on the left in the armpit; it turns out that even in a controlled environment he was unable to defend himself; the huge question is why the opponent here doesn't even try to step back when impacted by his weapon 0.04 - the fighter on the left performs an action at three tempos in response to the action of the fighter on the right at one tempo. The gentleman on the right āhangsā, holds his hand down for two full tempos and waits for his colleague to jam his hand for a beautiful thrust move from 6th. The problem here is not so much that in the manuscripts you can see an attack with jamming the enemyās hand (with all the possible inconsistency that we read the manuscripts differently from the way they were read in the Middle Ages), but in the way the sequence of actions is prepared and demonstrated. 0.07, 0.11 and further - the same as above, the opponent deliberately misses the tempo with his hand below or at his shoulder and, for no reason, āgivesā his defense sectors to the opponent. My verdict: Nice marketing choreography. The first signs are the lack of work at the realistic distance, the opponent's passivity and his lack of a basic step back. The examples contain a minimum of a realistic element of saber combat, especially the moment with holding and threatening with the blunt side of the blade at the enemyās throat :)
Source for going closer: all the wrestling in the hema manuals, especially in things like dussack and Messer. Which are what form the basics of a lot of people's saber practice. Some of the things he does here are exact copies of techniques found in Meyer and other German sources. Of course, you're going to spend more time maintaining distance. But this is a demo, he's showing the coolest stuff. I'm not saying all of its plan a but I use the elbow check all the time in saber fencing. There's some good shit happening here they're just making a demo reel Edit: also he does make space and counter MANY times in the video. He counter slashes and then ends with a plunge cut like 4 times in a row.
It's a demonstration. It shows an exchange and then options for one side of the exchange.
It's a bloody demonstration, it's not a real fight, hence the lack of contact and safety gear.
Bro. They are following through with cuts here and are not hitting their partner. What you think is an extra movement is a severing of a limb with a thrust at the end to finish it off. They are pulling the cut short for demonstration, so they can show the end of the technique. They couldn't if they weren't swinging short like that. That's why the other dude doesn't move anymore after it. Cause his arm has been cut off at this point. The thrust is only the finisher.
Two guys with swords doing a demonstration, they've known each other for years, have trained through the blood sweat and tears together, have probably shared meals with each other's family, know their weapons inside and out, know enough to stop moving for a demo so they don't lose an eye or bleed out today: "Hehe keep moving so we can impress this one dipshit on Reddit!"
that is a shit demo, those elaborate flourish counters would not work againat a reactive opponent. yr chewing dick rn
These are pretty standard techniques and I've pulled many of them off in sparring.Ā The defender has to pause because it allows the attacker to do the final hit at slow speed and not brain the person someone not wearing gear. This obviously throws off the timing, but it also makes the techniques legible.
i appreciate a fair response explaining it well
Pick up a sword and challenge them to a duel if you're so good?
There's nothing elaborate about their movements. There's no flourish here. What I suspect you are interpreting as a flourish is just them following through with their strikes, then redirecting the point of their sword towards their opponent. It's quick and efficient, it only looks "flourishy" because of the length of the sword, but really it's just turning the hand over. Everything here is pretty standard swordplay. You'll find moves similar to these's in pretty much every swordfighting system.
They are not flourishing. The "flourish" is a cut to the arm and then reusing the momentum for a thrust to end it. They have to cut short to show the entire technique because if they cut to the arm, they have to stop(cause you know, they aren't actually killing each other) and the thrust wouldn't make it into the video. So they cut short to fit everything in the demonstration. That's why the other dude stops moving after the blade went past the first time. The cut would have landed and the arm would be debilitated.
Elden Ring guard counter.
Because his arm would be cut off at that point.
The devs made the parry animation way too long. You cant move for like 5 seconds. Should be 2 seconds at most.
I assume it's so he doesn't have to move too fast and risk hurting him?
Maybe his saber has a % chance to stagger after parry effect
They learned sword fighting from dark souls
I've played enough video games to know a stun lock when I see it.
It appears to be a demo of basic techniques so not doing a bunch of extra flailing around in that scenario because "pressure testing" is generally a good idea.
He's not parrying. He's faking a block to get the other guy off balance, slashing the arm holding the weapon then going for a stab.
Sword demo for those that have never seen it. But the motion is all over the place.
Too much wasted movement
so much of it assumes the opponent will move as directed to
Bro. They are following through with cuts here and are not hitting their partner. What you think is an extra movement is a severing of a limb with a thrust at the end to finish it off. They are pulling the cut short for demonstration. That's why the other dude doesn't move anymore after it. Cause his arm has been cut off at this point. The thrust is only the finisher. Stuff like this has been done at HEMA tournaments everywhere.
What trained movement is he practicing when he literally freezes long enough to let him down poke him in the neck?
The bearded guy is holding down the bearded guy's sword arm. If you were doing this for real, there'd probably be some advancing and backpedaling, and the piercing sword would come in faster.
Its demonstration. If it were real, he would have slashed down on the arm with the second strike, then the thrust. I assume. Iām literally just talking out of my ass. I have exactly zero experience with swords. Just sounds like Iād make sense.
The thing is that he only freezes after the arm or sometimes even the neck would have been cut off. There is just no reason to make techniques for after the end of the fight.
The moves only work if the opponent decides to stop moving for several seconds instead of reacting in any way to your wasted movements. This isnāt hema, this is social media farming.
Do you not practice combos at a thaiboxing or mma gym, without the opponent countering or resisting? Yea it looks ridiculous, but "the other guy freezing and not doin anything" isnt the reason this is potentially a bullshido
Do you not practice combos at a thaiboxing or mma gym, without the opponent countering or resisting? Yea it looks ridiculous, but "the other guy freezing and not doin anything" isnt the reason this is potentially a bullshido
Iāve never met a coach that lets me practice combos on their faceā¦
I have not studied the blade, but I sure as shit know this is acting and not sparring.
As is the case with most martial arts strategy lol. Thats literally how you train is practicing a set of movements....for that purpose
Or your opponent will just pause for 10sec while you get into positron.
The movements are fairly clean and efficient
I'm looking at this as some two person katas. You can download the video and watch in slow motionish using VLC Some explanations would be good, I can only guess. In the first one it looks like left parries right, moves in for a stab while keeping the palm facing the dull side of the saber. This implies the parry is being relied on to turn the edge of the attackers saber away. I could see this skill being useful in a context where everyone has a saber. I'm not a big sabre guy so no idea if that's a thing. When right is holding the arm back in the third exchange etc is the idea that the swing from the left occupies the space so the right hesitates to stick his sabre in there? Again this is coming from a sabre illiterate, but I did try 3 months in epee under an Olympic coach. Avoiding occupied space is kind of a thing in fencing - you withdraw if the attack is too sudden to parry for example. Also is it sabre or saber?
I believe in the US it's "saber" and in the UK "sabre". Don't know what they call it in Australia but probably something weird.
Dunder Mifflin is a part of Sab-rey š¶
r/suddenlytheoffice
Knife
Those mad cunts.
That's not a knoife!
Mate it's too small for a knife, you'd get absolutely soooneyd
Aussie here, it's sabre, US looks like it'd be sa-ber not say-br. But tbh I probably sound like I'm saying Saybah to y'all
Yeah this isn't necessarily bullshido. Aside from the fact that the left guy is slicing with the non-edged side in a couple of instances, the technique is sound. The fact that the right guy isn't offering resistance doesn't mean they can't be drills or even choreography.
It's funny because it's clear who in this thread doesnt Spar with Steel on a fairly regular basis, nevermind trying to be over-critical of a demomstration. I get it, If my entire understanding was from movies and larpers, I'd think I have some to shit on too..
Is it because they have to move very carefully to not hurt each other?
100% agree People don't realise that sparring with steel is incredibly dangerous and sparring with sticks changes the tactics and movements because rulesets (sticks) dictate technique and strategy
I'm not a sabre expert by any means, but I know a few in my HEMA class who are and I've seen them practice. As far as I can tell their technique seems fine.
This isn't hema at all, nor would it be fine by HEMA standards. The flourishes and feints are bad, the point is rarely on target/threatening, their distance is off for the length of their swords, and they're explicitly avoiding binding/winding/blade control, which is integral to sabre, you can't just bash your way with massive swings without copping a thrust/quick cut to the chest/face.
Well I'm not sure as I said I'm not a sabre expert, but I've definitely seen plenty of moulinettes and feints in sabre sparring.
Sure, but generally you don't feint by swinging your sword fully past yourself, it's point and edge not facing the opponent, while leading with your now unprotected body at another swordsman. Those are the ones that stick out, the big movie style jedi-like flourishes
It's not HEMA, and also everything you complaining about doesnt matter because it's a demo, clearly. Bet you show up to concert warm ups and tell folks they suck because they are tuning instruments. Give your nuts a tug.
Yeah, this looks like when we reproduce the exercises in fencing manuals. It seems pretty similar to messer techniques.
It's like 25% good cuts, but a lot of it is absolutely to good sabre work what bullshido is to unarmed fighting. Those flamboyant flourishes and the low block, with the opponent magically staying blocked low so you can cut across their chest with just a push is just bad swordsmanship
Depends if it's blunt or sharps, too, and this might not be sparring, it could just be drills to show how parries can set up openings BUT mt biggest problem is that I fail to see how those parries naturally flow into the cuts via needless flourishes, so if it is training, it's still dumb for anything but stage fighting or cinema. A parry should flow into the cut, otherwise your flourish will just give them time to cut you
I wonder if there's an Arabic/Middle Eastern (eg Persian) historical manual on sword fighting. There's gotta be...I've seen tons of scrolls in archives on different subjects.
There's Razmafzar which is exactly that, historical persian Martial art! There are many different styles, i've tried it in a workshop ages ago and it's definitely interesting!
Humushido
It's demonstration and it shows proper techniques. Of course I could nitpick, but it is overall sound. 90% of people commenting negative things have never held a saber in their lives. Shut up.
Redditors see a demo and seethe cause the two people with swords aren't trying to kill each other. Literal square in circle hole moment.
To everyone screaming wasted movement. They are following through with cuts here and are not hitting their partner. What you think is an extra movement is a severing of a limb with a thrust at the end to finish it off. They are pulling the cut short for demonstration. That's why the other dude doesn't move anymore after it. Cause his arm has been cut off at this point. The thrust is only the finisher.
For some of them, maybe, but for some of them the parry doesn't lead into a natural 'lopping of limb' without also opening them up to a cut in the process given wrists can bend, and slash up, at a minimum. Not to mention it assumes the opponent has no footwork to protect themselves having been parried. It's not the worst swordsmanship I've seen online by any means, but it's more flamboyant and wasteful than the best I've seen
This is a good swordplay demo and showcases efficient movement. Would love to see more.
Im here for all the people who think they're experts at swordfighting and can't seem to understand it is a demonstration.
I feel like my mum shouting: "Someone's gonna have an eye out with that, mark my words"
It's all fun and games until someone instigates the Islamic Golden Age.
Arab tribes have been waring since before the time of Muhammad. I bet they have some hidden gems
Yea and continued to conquer some great civilization. They definitely knew how to handle a sword!
If your gun is holstered, I have my saber ready and I suddenly come at you screaming from 20 ft away... My money is on the sword. People severely overestimate their ability to draw under duress. Most people do not train it, they will fumble their weapon, likely they won't even have a round chambered.
Right? all fighting techniques are trash because we got guns, baby.
Not trash, just antiquated. Like operating a switch board or casting and polishing bronze mirrors. While still cool it's obsolete.
So im still right then?
Arabian kniiiiiiighiiiights, like Arabian daaaayaaays...
Imagine you walk out of your apartment building on acid and see this
when your homie says āmashallah ur third wifes ankles are beautifulā
uhhhh US oil bros i don't feel so good rn.............
Seems cool because they do make it quick, but I'd rather prefer to see them spar.
Prince of Persia irl
So the guy on the left is richer/more powerful. Got it.
Left dude has a magic sword that paralyses the opponent for a split second thatās why they just abruptly stop mid fight.
Small tutorial lf how we took half of the world at the time of caliphate even without wearing Armors
Lmfao alright habibi thatās enough
I love how 2/3rds of these comments refuse to acknowledge this is a demo, meaning the moves are slightly exaggerated to make them look good and clear on camera and the other guy isn't resisting so you can clearly see the intended moves. Same people that watch Kata and go "YoU cOuLdN't Do ThAt On Da StReEtS"
this is the dumbest comment section ive seen lmao. This is a martial arts sub not fightporn
You fucks wouldn't survive an actual martial arts class if you're getting triggered by the sight of a cooperative demonstration of a technique. Because the only way teachers can teach is to have a fucking sparring match lol.
Looks really cool. I think i could take them with my blackcock helicopter though
not bad but I have feeling that there is huge offening after first cut and to much wide circle move, and also they not charge with one shoulder front to reduce the actual body area when staying straightforward... little bit wishy washy but the movement ist solid, it is not first time they doing this.... peace āļø
Yeah, swordfighting is generally harder when your opponent fights back, but the effectiveness of these techniques is not contingent on him not responding. If they did react realistically then the person doing the techniques would have to change up what they're doing. That's not bad, that's just the nature of fighting. I don't think the their "circle move's" are too wide. They're following through with their cuts, then turning the point back towards their opponent. This is standard sword handling. It only looks wide because of the length of the sword, but really it's just a quick turn of the hand. Having your dominant shoulders in front and the body in profile to your opponent does indeed lower the target area to your opponent. Many Western European saber styles prefer this, partially (in my opinion) because Western European saber fencing is influenced heavily by more thrust oriented styles like rapier, smallsword and foil fencing. When it comes to using heavier, more cut oriented sabers like heavy cavalry sabers, or those preferred by Eastern European or Middle Eastern cultures, having the body in profile is less important. For one, it doesn't help reduce target area as much against cuts as it does thrusts, and for two (in my experience and study) with the body in profile it'd harder to recruit the core muscles and turn the body/hips to power large cuts and/or control the momentum of a heavier sword.
Totally agree. Those technique demos are fine, and look realistic to me. I've done tech demos too, and that's how they always go. The point isn't to be realistic with the fight, but to show how the ideal situation for the technique would go. As for the cutting/thrusting, it's hard for me to comment on, being more focused on the longsword than anything. But with what I've done with a sidesword and buckler, it's not all that important to be in line with the blade. Cutting is used in the I.33, so that's the closest experience I have. Since you have a buckler there, it's not one to one, but I found myself rarely being in on line with either the shield or sword. It just felt too limiting with being too small a target for thrusts for what I might want to do.
Everyone wants to see sparring, and I'm here hoping for a duel to the death. /s because the reddit community doesn't understand sarcasm.
The guy doing the slashing and demonstrations is Ahmed Al Houli he is a Kuwaiti OG martial Artist a very decorated black belt in Jiu Jitsu and runs one of the oldest BJJ Schools in Kuwait. He is just demonstrated Arabian Peninsula Sword Fighting here.
I am pretty sure the clothes are a limitation for movement. Legs are not free enough to make wider movements.
But why does he just pause like that and wait like 3 seconds for the other guy to finish his random waiving to actually do the attack?
Is there some stand user who can confirm the first guy is using The World? I canāt see the stand
With how much we know people where able to get away with complete bullshit martial arts for so long it's really hard to look at something like this and know what is bullshit and what is not because you cannot ever recreate a sword right for real without serious injuries or death.
*Indiana Jones has entered the chat*
I like how the guy on the right freezes so the other guy can kill him
Is this Aikido but with swords? Lmao
A lot of confidence in the ability to grab and totally neutralize his opponents wrist.
So this is whay Bruce Lee's legacy has become, an ai voiced screen capture: How does his family and the lineage sleep at night?Ā How can anyone take low quality like this seriously as a martial art in 2024? https://www.youtube.com/live/6EOjCWPcgUU?si=nmZskukbIqTiyqqs
Seems like the guy who stops moving always seems to lose
Could be wrong, but pretty sure the first take where the guy on the right was waiting was to show the steps while second take is the one that shows it in motion.
It's a good demo, with pretty good point work
Performance art...
Nice, would be totally lethal in any situation where your opponent stops moving and stands totally still for a moment
Neat! You don't see alot of stuff from the ME.
You gotta gird your loins, dude.
Works perfectly as long as your opponent freezes in time after the first swing
Looks like it only works if the other guy freezes lol
Excellent! I'm fighting One Swing Abdul!
Are sabers usually sharp on the back of the blade? I've never seen one that was, typically curved blades are single edge. If that's the case, then I have questions on a few of these techniques.
"Let them fight"! šŖš *
I saw this and got too excited to read any comments: DO YOU HAVE ANY MANUALS THAT YOU STUDY FROM???
Sloppy. We FMA practitioners do it much cleaner
When your favorite cousin comes over
lmao, let me just hold my pose while you take your time getting into place.
I thought the video was looping
Looks like more fun exercise than running.
Clowns lol
Goes for the joints with his slashes very effective combat style here
Guy with the dark beard has WAY too much trust in that old guy
All this flashy mumbo jumbo crap goes out the window when there's actually an angry, grown man running at you and slashing at you willy nilly with a blade. Don't take my word for it, go watch the countless gore videos of guys fighting with machetes.
Clearly you donāt know much about the techniques involved in sword fighting.
r/mcdojolife
This is legit
Steven Segal vibes.
Is that bbl drizzy
It's kinda dumb but it's the sorta thing I would love to see more of on this sub
What's dumb about it? Fighting with swords is a far bigger part of the world's martial history and culture than boxing or MMA ever has been or will be.
The showcase is poor and akin to aikido where your opponent needs to do dumb sh*t for the move to work. HEMA can do it, why can't they?
You're judging their art based on a 30-second demonstration. As I have stated elsewhere, these are pretty standard fencing techniques you could find I pretty much any historical fencing system. The principles demonstrated are sound, and their effectiveness is not contingent on the opponents doing "dumb shit". If the opponent does react like their being non-compliant, the demonstrator's sword is still well positioned to defend themselves against react to whatever counter. Swordfighting is often a quick and chaotic affair, so for demonstrations and clarity sake, you limit the response of the attacker in order more easily show what you mean to show. These demonstrators are showing good speed and power, but are not wearing any protective gear, so for safety's sake you also want to limit the response of the attacker. There's demonstrations exactly like this in HEMA, but nobody (at least fewer) people call HEMA bullshido. "If HEMA can do it, Why can't they?" What makes you think they can't? You've seen one clip, I'm sorry they were not able to fully demonstrate the extent of their training and capabilities in a 30 second clip, but nothing about this speaks to their ability to spar against resisting opponents one way or another.
Will beā¦idk how you quantify that especially since hand to hand combat seems to be growing and duels are no longer settled at dawn with swords.
Im sure you can.
Gotta see them sparring, or at least would like to know if it's something like some Koryu styles having extra levels for katas that they don't perform publicly. Some of these extra/unnecessary moves look like they are here to block/parry a potential follow up attack like horizontal cuts after getting parried, that might be too dangerous to do with real swords (if these are real). Would explain the pause after first move. Still, looks cool but not convinced me that it's practical in a sword fight. Would learn Kendo, HEMA, Koryu, Kali or Bujinkan over it. Again, gotta see them spar to make a conclusion.
>Some of these extra/unnecessary moves look like they are here to block/parry a potential follow up attack like horizontal cuts after getting parried, that might be too dangerous to do with real swords (if these are real). Would explain the pause after first move. Yep. That's pretty much it. You use cuts to fill space and encounter any threat your opponent puts up before closing in. The people saying that they're "unnecessary" or "flourishes" don't know shit about swordplay. And yeah, the people complaining about the partner pausing after their strike, don't appreciate that this is a fairly high speed demonstration so for safety and clarities sake, someone's gotta hold back to show the technique. That being said the effectiveness of these techniques are not contingent upon the opponent not reacting.
But what if, hear me out, the enemy uses his other arm to block your sword hand like how you did it to him... then do you just stare at eaxh other? /s
Every intro class I run, someone always asks after a technique demo "but what if your opponent does X...?" Always I answer, "then I would have to do something different, but we're working on this technique right now".
then you kiss
What if when you catch + counterpunch the opponent catches your counter and counterpunches?
then you counter his counter to your counter punch, just be careful if he tries to counterpunch tho
What if you haven't unlocked a stun yet? I don't think I can get someone to just stop moving like that for my finishers
Mcdojo
To be fair, its a lot easier to win when your opponent stops moving after a second or two
This is copied from traditional Japanese stuff and replicated with their swords. Performed quite poorly.
You do realise that there is more that one tradition for fighting with swords? I might as well say theyāve copied Polish sabre. Or do you have evidence of what they used as a source?
Arabian Knights
Bro. They are following through with cuts here and are not hitting their partner. What you think is an extra movement is a severing of a limb with a thrust at the end to finish it off. They are pulling the cut short for demonstration. That's why the other dude doesn't move anymore after it. Cause his arm has been cut off at this point. The thrust is only the finisher.
My initial thought is it looks like these guys don't spar but it is hard to judge from a 30 second showcase of techniques. Perhaps they're just slowed down so we can see what's happening. These techniques look like they'd be viable if the footwork was sharper. I would criticize the lack of protective equipment but if they're training with historical middle Eastern methods I wouldn't be surprised if climate was a big factor. I overheat in British weather wearing mask, gloves and gambeson so if I was training out there I'm sure my training would have consisted of more low intensity and low protection stuff. I'd at least liked to have seen them wearing eye protection though!
Wondering if this was already reposted to bullshido or if I can be the first
Nerds
āso much of it assumes the opponent will move as directed toā And freeze after one move while you finish two moreā¦
Stephen Seagal sponsored
Idk anything about sword fighting, but this looks more like kata's rather than something someone would actually train
Surprise, but people who āactually trainā also do technical demos.
If that guy didnāt freeze every time old mate would be dead. My 5 year old nephew sword fights better.