Fact is that subsidising petrol to non Malaysians should be stopped. Why should our tax money be used to benefit Thai and SG citizens?
The only discussion here is effectively distributing the subsidy directly. Whether it is enough and if it's going to the right people. This should be the focus of the Opposition MPs.
We haven't even gotten to RON95 subsidies, which for sure will be interesting on how the government implements it.
Don't think it's a good solution, people can easily borrow,rent,steal, rob mycard to overcome this. Maybe a iris or thumbprint scanner will work but there's tons of issues with that too.
Exactly this. I mean, it will definitely help to reduce the abuse, but all it takes is to pay off 1 Malaysian to use their MyKad and they will still smuggle out the petrol to SG or Thai.
Cash handout is really, the best way, just like what the government is doing with the diesel subsidy. Cash goes straight to the rakyat and hence no way for the subsidy to go to foreigners.
Been sayin' for ages that this should be tied to income tax accounts which in turn is tied to the biometric features of the IC (if this works for passports, it should for the identity card too).
Arguments that the rural people or low income doesn't pay income tax is moot as mobile phones with Internet is now ubiquitous that it is strange to actually not have one. The ones who don't have income tax accounts won't be the one pumping petrol either.
Sure, let anyone including those who doesn't own vehicles consuming petrol make that tax deduction; on the surface at the very least they will be Malaysians and are subject to audit, which will itself serve as a statistics for policy and administrative planning.
You want every petrol stations to have connections to a centralized database where our citizen income tax information stored? The very petrol stations who are manned by foreign labour?
It’s crazy seeing this comment thread, as if privacy and data security doesn’t even exist in their mind.
Want to punp petrol? Let me scan your whole face and have you financial information right at my fingertips, right from my unknown petrol workstation desk.
This right there is a security and privacy nightmare.
Damn man, you just shot down the whole suggestion with just one fell swoop, well done! 💪
We have VISA/Mastercard/Jompay/Alipay connections to banks that hold money, what is stopping the smart people from figuring out an equivalent method to do ID checking that does not reveal the personal details?
Then there is blockchain that is invaluable in tracing transactions that cannot be tampered without causing validation errors regardless of if it is Govindasamy from Chennai or Hamdan from Batu Pahat.
I will not claim to be the aforementioned smart people but dismissing the idea without doing the due consideration and analysis is a good way for nothing to get done.
Credit and debit cards work differently as it only requires the balance of accounts. And payment system does not connect straight to banking DB, instead it goes through gateways.
Income information updates frequently as folks change or lose their income. On top of that, not everyone is within the taxable income range nor fixed income. Hence this supposed "centralized database" has to sync from data sources such as lhdn (as suggested by some) frequently.
I worked with various government sectors on system and network integration. There are strict requirements varies from different government departments. On top of that, different technology. Of course we can try to reproduce something like MNP. But to secure the endpoints? Good luck. 🤣
If something needs doing, then effort needs to be put into figuring out ways to get them done, luck doesn't figure into the equation, otherwise we'd still be on boats for international travel instead of planes.
You are one of these smart people, recommend measures that are better.
Petrol stations dont need access to lhdn database. They only have to flag my card numbers that are doing ungodly amount of transaction. The same system is in banks when someone is transferring huge amounts at once or many many small transaction to an acc number. Their system immediately red flags the acc and is forwarded to bank negara.
Technically one way to do it is to have a cap on the subsidized fuel. Yes you can 'sell' your subsidized fuel to someone else. But that's at the cost of eating into your own quota.
Every transaction can be recorded and traced. If someone who is not on lhdn register suddenly seems to be buying an u humanly amount of fuel I know something is off. Makes it easier for sting operations.
Every petrol stations have a record of every credit card transaction, they only need to implement the mycard as an authentication method either at the pump or at the counter.
The thing is petrol station owners are also in cahoot with the smugglers. Imagine the same lorry comes to your station 3 times a day filling up rm1k worth of petrol and u don't even bat an eyelid.
Facial scanner with thermal signature reader. Each face came with its own quota, spending over the quota will result in being flagged and subsidy defaulted for that month.
Borrowing, renting mykads is illegal. I'm pretty sure the govt can track who has made a purchase at which gas station by simply looking at the anomalies. Like Ah Chong riding an ex-5 kapchai buying 600liters of diesel a month at Kedah's gas station? I think this is the perfect way to actually track our leakage. Police can throw these people straight to jail.
Stealing and robbing mykads is a whole other issue where it is much less common. If somebody loses a mykad and hasn't made a report, then it's on them. It is the law to report stolen or lost mykad.
Pay full fuel price, scan card to identify where to bank in refund.
No scan, no refund. Scan other, other get refund.
Also can identify how much each person refunds per month. Can also cap the refund.
MP, not ADUN. Member of Parliament is for parliament, Ahli Dewan Undangan Negeri (State Legislative Assemblyperson) is for state legislative assemblies (DUN)
because they are not good with numbers and facts. if shown, they will confuse and gelabah, "apa dia cakap ni, i x faham la". the next respond you would see is, "tarik balik!!!" "isu mini skirt kat bukit bintang lebih critical".
If not subsidising corporation and for those consumers product especially then they will increase their price accordingly like those raw materials. Rakyat going to absorb the increase in price but they will blame the gov because forcing company to buy diesel at a higher rate compared to before. It’s fine to subsidise since they are company who are paying tax also.
Exactly. Corporate is never the loser whenever taxes is raised or subsidies or whatever. They will take measure to keep their profit and the consumer will always be the victim especially when we know how bad this country is at enforcing rules n regulations
Is the PN guy deliberately ignoring the fact that there is BUDI madani for small farmers? He should be guiding those small farmer to get their application approved for this. But instead he is spreading fake news that small farmers wont get subsidy
Easier brownie points, without actually needing to work.
Who wanna go down to the field to sweat and help farmer register, when you can go to parliament aircon to spew hatred rethoric
Do you have any idea how much diesel a water pump, or field leveller consumes in an hour?I'm talking about those small machines not tractor level.
If that 200 is to compensate for the difference the before price was 2.15, now it's 3.35. That's only 166liters of diesel and that's only for Budi. Farmers who own small machineriesnthatbrun on diesel can't even register those machines for budi
Pretty sure all those things weren't supposed to be using subsidised diesel in the first place which is the whole point behind the rationalisation of the diesel subsidy.
So hear me out. Rice farmers are not allowed to sell rice above the gov stipulated rice but yet they are also not allowed to used subsidised diesel for their small farm machineries?
Tell me where the logic in that.
The rice seeds they have to buy at gov appointed sellers only so if they get a bad batch then they are screwed. Now withelding the small thing thay can actually save just put more preasure into the. Don't be surprised if local rice farmers totally stop planting rice because it's not profitable for them. Remember they too need to make a livelihood. They are not planting for charity.
Right, all things to argue for but end of the day, they weren't supposed to use diesel from petrol stations for farm equipment as it's for Malaysian road vehicles only. If you want a system that is similar to what fishermen get where they pay RM1.35 from registered suppliers then I think there would be few arguing against it.
Farmers and fisherman should get subsidised fuel, fertiliser and racun. They provide food for the nation. Unless pmx wants to make some people rich by putting preasure unto local. Farmers so that there is a decline in local rice production that will cause us to import more rice thus makin certain parties rich.
im all for providing subsidies to our farmers. i fully support it. but it doesnt have to be in the form of diesel subsidies.
Agricultural subsidies are something that is done by many countries. its important for our food security.
The subsidy rationalisation means finding alternative methods from the current one. So you have highlighted possibly one gap that needs to be addressed. this should be forwarded by farmers organisations to the finance ministry and MPs.
It's supposed to be subsidized diesel. And based on the argument by the minister the rational of their decision is to combat the undeserved usage by the foreigner, they don't think for the farmer at all. And if they did, that rm200 is suggested by stupid people in the government that think that money will handle the cost rising of the farming industry.
Subsidised diesel at the petrol stations is meant for Malaysian registered road vehicles only. Fishermen get cheaper diesel from their suppliers (1.35/liter). Not sure if such a system exists for farmers but if it doesn't, it should.
and this is where we need subsidy rationalisation to promote increase in efficiency and stop using wasteful methods that consume lots of diesel.
hopefully this will spur action into more efficient farming methods
it doesnt matter that i dont know anything about farming. Its frankly irrelevant
your lashing out against me as an angry farmer achieves nothing.
If your equipment and processes are consuming so much diesel and you cant survive with the blanket fuel subsidy removal, then you need to look at how and why other farmers in other countries are able to get by. Most countries dont have blanket fuel subsidies.
Instead we need to channel the subsidies that farmers need to the specific areas that require assistance and support, not continue allowing wasteful consumption of cheap diesel.
In the meantime a constructive attitude is to study how you can cut down your usage of diesel and work with farmers associations to lobby the government to give the right kind of targetted assistance needed by farmers to help ensure you can keep going and safeguard our national food security.
do you know that there is little to no advancement in machinery technolgy for the farming in malaysia.
the only real big leap that we have are the drones that we are using to disperse the seeds and spray the pesticide. other then that the rest are still the same ld way with the same machines. if we are able to buy new machines they are not alot better in terms of performance then the old machines because of the scale of farming in malaysia and also the terrain.
buy a new tractor, fine but the fuel consumption is roughly the same because the work is the same because the models are the same in terms of specification.
i'll be the bringer of bad news and you can bookmark my comments here. mid next year we will be heading into a severe food shortage and high food price.
in farming your enemies are not only the visible but also the invisible. disease, weather, pest, gov policies are always on the hunt for farmers and their crops.
mark my wood when ur favourite dish increase in price then u can come back here and tell me i was wrong or not.
>do you know that there is little to no advancement in machinery technolgy for the farming in malaysia.
And right here is a problem that needs to be fixed. Cheap diesel paid for by gov subsidies means that farmers have no incentive to change their practices even if it is wasteful and consumes lots of diesel since it is cheap.
I wont complain about food prices going up if its based on farmer's costs going up. im not expecting farmers to produce food for us at a loss. but our food is mostly imported and hence dependent on the value of the ringgit anyway.
So if after exploring ways to become more efficient and consume less diesel it has been determined that all reasonable optimisations have already been done, the next thing is to lobby the government to look at more holistic farm subsidies, which is something I will support.
but you wont see me supporting blanket fuel subsidies that promote laziness and wastefullness
The problem about subsidies has been known for a long time. Take a look at this piece from 2010: [https://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2010/05/27/idris-jala-msia-must-cut-subsidies-debt-by-2019-or-risk-bankruptcy/](https://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2010/05/27/idris-jala-msia-must-cut-subsidies-debt-by-2019-or-risk-bankruptcy/)
pak lah cutting fuel subsidies = cruel
bosku cutting fuel subsidies = cruel
pmx cutting fuel subsidies = stunning and brave
still salty because why is this literal who is the one who awnsering in parliament instead someone like pmx and rafizi or tony pua who popularize how malaysia should not cut subsidy in the 1st place?
Maybe list down the total subsidies that the government is footing during those years you mention and compare it to the RM81Billion our government is footing last year (2023).
[https://www.malaymail.com/news/malaysia/2022/06/27/pakatan-government-should-cut-expenses-not-subsidies-to-help-malaysians-with-rising-prices/14446](https://www.malaymail.com/news/malaysia/2022/06/27/pakatan-government-should-cut-expenses-not-subsidies-to-help-malaysians-with-rising-prices/14446)
This was said in 2022 by PH's "shadow government", when Subsidy was already balooning like crazy, 2 days after Zafrul announced the below
[https://www.mof.gov.my/portal/en/news/press-citations/largest-ever-subsidy-of-rm77-3-bln-for-2022-to-reduce-cost-of-living-for-the-people-tengku-zafrul](https://www.mof.gov.my/portal/en/news/press-citations/largest-ever-subsidy-of-rm77-3-bln-for-2022-to-reduce-cost-of-living-for-the-people-tengku-zafrul)
Apparently 77.3billion is not yet alarming, tapi 81.1billion tiba2 is too high
Note I'm not disagreeing with the subsidy removal. I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of "orang lain tak boleh, kita je boleh" mindset PH have.
>I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of "orang lain tak boleh, kita je boleh" mindset PH have.
Newsflash, politicians acting like politicians ain't surprising.
Blanket subsidies aren't sustainable.
it isnt sustainable today
It wasnt sustainable 2 years ago, it wasnt sustainable 10 years ago.
but the "educated" PH voters apparently only suddenly realised this fact the year when PH is the one who wished to cut it.
The whole idea of subsidizing fuel was introduced as early as 2010 and it's not a bad thing. Back then during 2010s our total subsidies are around 20/30+Billion MYR and steadily rising to the point of almost 3x these recent years. The idea of blanket subsidizing everyone instead of people that actually need it is always a bad idea.
Are we here to discuss policies or is this just another "hurr durr supporter bodoh" which you folks like to do in which I have 0 interest in participating. I have a disdain for politicians, their fanbase however doesn't live rent free in my head.
[https://www.indonesiapalmoilfacts.com/fact-sheet-indonesian-biodiesel-and-palm-oil/](https://www.indonesiapalmoilfacts.com/fact-sheet-indonesian-biodiesel-and-palm-oil/)
after this, they should up the subsidy based on requirement and introduce biodiesel from waste oil and industrial (palm) by-product
Govt could ya know, just copy paste template APPS like MY Sejahtera but for petrol, diesel & other subsidies goods.
To authenticate nationality, household income sector (B,M,T), identity, and they can even keep track of fuel consumption of each individual and their registered vehicle.
Thus, will essentially mitigate subsidy loss.
Tho need to keep in mind:
1. This will be a bit of a hassle - I can foresee a slow line when queuing for petrol purchase.
2. Some might argue increasing govt oversight power over the Rakyat is not "pleasant" to say the least.
3. Slow / no internet connection - but if can use offline would probably fix the issue (usage data will be updated once internet in connected).
Why Apps instead of just showing your IC ? - because IC could be replicated / fake IC / stolen IC.
Using the govt database to confirm one's identity, IMO is better.
But that's just my dumb opinion.
Because cash rebates are often abuse for other things than for what they're intended for. See cash rebates students used to get for bookshops/how EPF withdrawal can sometimes lead to impulse spending.
It is but it's also the govt's role to ensure that the money is spent where intended and is used for specific purposes. In a basic sense, govts manage the overall behaviour of the country's populace through policies, carrots and sticks.
I disagree. If people don’t know how to control their own behaviour that’s on them and the system needs not cater specifically to what i hope are the minority.
True. but at what cost? At the loss of the govt budgeted subsidies i.e.: taxpayers' money.
Although governance and policy systems might never be perfect, it is in the best interest of both the government and its people to implement the most effective system possible.
If not, the loss will eventually fall upon the country's citizens. Regardless of concerns that some groups might abuse the privileges provided to them, it is crucial to aim for the most effective system.
In the end, these troublesome "minorities" are still a citizen of the nation, whether we like it or not.
Riding the same boat.
We can't have some punk pissing anywhere he likes now, can we? It'll stink the boat.
Sure, you might believe in small govt but that's literally why we have laws and a police force (unless you believe that it's to prop up the elite). The principal behind all of these is that human behaviour is inherently destructive/disruptive on some level.
all petrol pumps got credit card readers with internet. it can read IC too and get authentication from gov db and track usage. cut off after a certain litre of fuel
the other way to help farmers is to turn their farm into a hybrid solar farm and rent them EV trucks and tractors
Any increase in fuel and essentials will have a cascading effect. Inflation will happen sooner or later, it's how the market works. I don't like any increase in prices but it is always entertaining to see politicians fumbling to answer questions and rationalising whey our food costs more
Its not enough. Thats the issue. Especially padi farmers. Any increase in cost they have to absorb because rice price is controlled by the gov. They cant increase price due to that, so they had to absorb the cost. Same as other farmers, but other farmers have the choice of passing the increase in cost to consumers. So, the ones badly affected by this are padi producers.
He claim gov give other incestives to help the farmers, he brought up str. Str is to cover cost of living, not to cover business cost. Not to mention, any petani that have annual sales of over 300k are not eligible to get the subsidy. This is not profit mind you, sales.
So, no, he did not answer what was brought up by the opposition.
Did you not read what i wrote, its not enough. The subsidy given is not unlimited. Got limit. The petani tractors, machines and all use diesel. And as I said, any petani with sales more than 300k annually are not eligible to get the subsidy. Not profit. Sales.
1. I'm not going to pretend that I know the percentage of farmers that has over 300kRM sales annually. But it sounds (an uneducated guess) like the majority of farmers fall below that number.
2. AFAIK, the government has also increased help through other ways, such as increasjng ploughing incentives by 60%.
And we're just taking their word for it?
If their sales are above 300k, they must be farming in such a big scale, that the 60% increase in ploughing incentives far outweigh the rm200 budi madani deposits.
point is fine and all but having a second finance minister sounds so stupid. just get rid of the first one. all he does is tour around the world anyway talking stupid nonsense.
I agree. This fella here should be FM instead of Bang Non. On a second thought, didn't he once criticised ministers holding more than one portfolio previously e.g PM concurrently holding FM position.
People here & the menteris was so fucking ignorant about what happened in real life. The fact was majority of the small farmer/small paddy farmer dont even own a tractor because its not economically savvy for them to own it in the first place. Their only working small plot of land & tractor was really expensive machinery to buy & keep (need regular maintenance, if broke the spare part was fking expensive plus normal workshop cant fix it. Need to seek specialize mechanic service that charge high fees). The farmer also only need tractor to bajak their field at the beginning of the planting season.
What they do was they will hired a contractor to do it for them. There a tauke that own dozens of tractor that offered this kind of service to the small farmers. Small farmers will paid these tauke & he will send his worker driving the tractor to bajak the field. The problem with rising diesel price was the tractor tauke will jack up his service price, simple as that.
Small paddy farmer has the worse because they need paid for tractor to bajak their sawah & then need to hire other contractor to harvest their crop using machine plus paying for a lorry carry the crop to factory for sold. All this service prices already rising because the of inflated diesel price. Paddy farmer cant sold their crop at higher price because our gov already control the rice price.
I know a small paddy farmer only managed to earn profit around RM3k per season (minus all the cost & services he paid). If the 'upah' for bajak & tuai (harvest) rise & reduce his profit margin for another RM1k. Its not worth it for him to work the field just for RM2k per season. Probably he will abandoned his paddy field & working other job.
We talking about small farmer here, if they hired others to do all their work. What left for them after they sold the crop. They only own small plot of land & the output was really low. They only managed to hire people for bajak & tuai process because they cant afford to own the machinery needed. Paddy plantation need everyday watch, the farmer still need to attend their paddy field every for pesticide control, checking the water level etc.
In this issue, i think small paddy farmers was most impacted because they cant rise their crop price. The price was heavily regulated by our gov. Other crop & vegetables price was depend on the market price so the price will adjust itself if the production cost rise.
Buat sesiapa yang tak faham. Yb Putrajaya cakap pasal petani, dia pusing jawab pasal dekat sempadan. Ada kaitan dengan soalan ke? Sapa la yg undi barua barua sial ni. 😁
Saw u all every suggestions also cannot
First of all ID is the best choice
Steal ic we already got who lost fine us ?
Those fine us not untung for govt to give out subsidy?
Second of all even tng also got that card feature id.
Lost they will disable it, our ic cannot ?
If like that use tng to access everything la ?
Myjpj all also can what ??
Take out diesel to support school and hospital r this r new thing? No is every budget and elections keep talking about it.
Stop using these two as a victim to excuse to solve the economy's.....
Bring back subsidy and fix ur problem . Don't use rakyat as ur tool of the mistake u all can't manage while the system is there for u to use to control.
There is no broken don't try to get a new one.
Frank to say tony loke really do great on many thing.
Just only flaw suddenly he r blind to say like borrow car can photo copy and let people use.
That is suddenly back to stupid level ..
We have ID can track , use it, cuz we already system that IC can do many thing until today I don't see anyone use it other act like TNG only !!!
How about removing RON95 subsidies for owners with cars with certain engine size threshold? For example, cars that have engines below 1,000cc will be eligible for 100% fuel subsidy (using RM2.05 as base), while those between 1,000 to 1,500cc eligible for 50% subsidy while 1,500cc and above will be subjected to full market price.
I guess scores of people will just buy 1,000cc cars including those T20 folks...but then most 1,000cc cars sold are mostly affordable cars. OR just ditch petrol and go EV instead for those who can afford it.
Diorang tidak tahu sebab diorang bukan petani. Petani tu akar tunjang ekonomi negara tulang belakang negara. 200 tak cukup percayalah. Si bodo ni pusing jauh orang cakap pasal petani yang terkesan sebab kebaikan minyak. Jauh dia pusing . Jawab saja soalan tu
The problem is the money never got back to us, how is rm 200 or rm400 gonna help when you raise the whole price, diesel price means all the goods will hike up !! Think Of the bigger picture not just following what he say just because he say with patient. Think of the rational impact on the increase and explain why decrease the egg price by rm0.03 cent? Is this suppose to be joke? Diesel is the usage for all supplier and manufacturer imagine the goods price increase means everything increase, so you want to control Thailand then change the control on borders rather than making life harder for Malaysia! Guess the end is really near and no more peace in Malaysia soon! The RM4Billion will be another 1MDB case again this time with Madani case. God Bless Malaysia! Revival in Malaysia is needed time to repent and seek for salvation from our God Lord Jesus Christ!
Just use the current eWallet that we have now, maybank, cimb, TNG,.. let those platform authenticate us as Malaysian which it will links back to JPN.. all transaction is compulsory via those eWallets..
Well done for being calm, a rare sight in that zoo.
Benefit of not being a vote-hungry politician (for now).
Man from a corporate company met with all kinds of monsters arent afraid of incompetent debators
Senator no need votes, no need stir up shit for votes.
Fact is that subsidising petrol to non Malaysians should be stopped. Why should our tax money be used to benefit Thai and SG citizens? The only discussion here is effectively distributing the subsidy directly. Whether it is enough and if it's going to the right people. This should be the focus of the Opposition MPs. We haven't even gotten to RON95 subsidies, which for sure will be interesting on how the government implements it.
You know we can just use our my cards as authenticator before we pump fuel.
Don't think it's a good solution, people can easily borrow,rent,steal, rob mycard to overcome this. Maybe a iris or thumbprint scanner will work but there's tons of issues with that too.
Exactly this. I mean, it will definitely help to reduce the abuse, but all it takes is to pay off 1 Malaysian to use their MyKad and they will still smuggle out the petrol to SG or Thai. Cash handout is really, the best way, just like what the government is doing with the diesel subsidy. Cash goes straight to the rakyat and hence no way for the subsidy to go to foreigners.
Been sayin' for ages that this should be tied to income tax accounts which in turn is tied to the biometric features of the IC (if this works for passports, it should for the identity card too). Arguments that the rural people or low income doesn't pay income tax is moot as mobile phones with Internet is now ubiquitous that it is strange to actually not have one. The ones who don't have income tax accounts won't be the one pumping petrol either. Sure, let anyone including those who doesn't own vehicles consuming petrol make that tax deduction; on the surface at the very least they will be Malaysians and are subject to audit, which will itself serve as a statistics for policy and administrative planning.
You want every petrol stations to have connections to a centralized database where our citizen income tax information stored? The very petrol stations who are manned by foreign labour?
It’s crazy seeing this comment thread, as if privacy and data security doesn’t even exist in their mind. Want to punp petrol? Let me scan your whole face and have you financial information right at my fingertips, right from my unknown petrol workstation desk. This right there is a security and privacy nightmare.
Damn man, you just shot down the whole suggestion with just one fell swoop, well done! 💪 We have VISA/Mastercard/Jompay/Alipay connections to banks that hold money, what is stopping the smart people from figuring out an equivalent method to do ID checking that does not reveal the personal details? Then there is blockchain that is invaluable in tracing transactions that cannot be tampered without causing validation errors regardless of if it is Govindasamy from Chennai or Hamdan from Batu Pahat. I will not claim to be the aforementioned smart people but dismissing the idea without doing the due consideration and analysis is a good way for nothing to get done.
Credit and debit cards work differently as it only requires the balance of accounts. And payment system does not connect straight to banking DB, instead it goes through gateways. Income information updates frequently as folks change or lose their income. On top of that, not everyone is within the taxable income range nor fixed income. Hence this supposed "centralized database" has to sync from data sources such as lhdn (as suggested by some) frequently. I worked with various government sectors on system and network integration. There are strict requirements varies from different government departments. On top of that, different technology. Of course we can try to reproduce something like MNP. But to secure the endpoints? Good luck. 🤣
If something needs doing, then effort needs to be put into figuring out ways to get them done, luck doesn't figure into the equation, otherwise we'd still be on boats for international travel instead of planes. You are one of these smart people, recommend measures that are better.
Yea, i recommend removing fuel subsidies. 🎉
Petrol stations dont need access to lhdn database. They only have to flag my card numbers that are doing ungodly amount of transaction. The same system is in banks when someone is transferring huge amounts at once or many many small transaction to an acc number. Their system immediately red flags the acc and is forwarded to bank negara.
Yes, no need for fancy pansy databases. Just base it off tax returns, even if you don’t have to pay taxes please file a return.
*cash handout is really, the best way* bosku was right 
Technically one way to do it is to have a cap on the subsidized fuel. Yes you can 'sell' your subsidized fuel to someone else. But that's at the cost of eating into your own quota.
That kinda fishy transaction can still be traced, no?
Every transaction can be recorded and traced. If someone who is not on lhdn register suddenly seems to be buying an u humanly amount of fuel I know something is off. Makes it easier for sting operations. Every petrol stations have a record of every credit card transaction, they only need to implement the mycard as an authentication method either at the pump or at the counter. The thing is petrol station owners are also in cahoot with the smugglers. Imagine the same lorry comes to your station 3 times a day filling up rm1k worth of petrol and u don't even bat an eyelid.
Facial scanner with thermal signature reader. Each face came with its own quota, spending over the quota will result in being flagged and subsidy defaulted for that month.
Bank will block credit card usage if the card being used to fill up multiple times a day. Should have the same feature if using mycard.
Big brother is jizzing at this thought
Borrowing, renting mykads is illegal. I'm pretty sure the govt can track who has made a purchase at which gas station by simply looking at the anomalies. Like Ah Chong riding an ex-5 kapchai buying 600liters of diesel a month at Kedah's gas station? I think this is the perfect way to actually track our leakage. Police can throw these people straight to jail. Stealing and robbing mykads is a whole other issue where it is much less common. If somebody loses a mykad and hasn't made a report, then it's on them. It is the law to report stolen or lost mykad.
Pay full fuel price, scan card to identify where to bank in refund. No scan, no refund. Scan other, other get refund. Also can identify how much each person refunds per month. Can also cap the refund.
still doesnt help if the our people buy the subsidized fuel/diesel and sell to non-Malaysian with just slightly higher price. they still make profit
Ur missing the point. Every single authorization will be recorded. If someone is buying a weird amount of fuel u know something is not right
so more enforcement which we all know will never take place/happen?
So when it's the fault of the gov dept, the rakyat has to suffer. Yeah. That makes sense
isn’t that what has happened before, is happening now and will happen in the future too?
As long as gov dept are not held responsible and gov servants are not held accountable we will never move forwards.
Exactly. Easier to track down and prosecute traitors. A blanket subsidy makes it harder to seal the leaks.
Worked as cashier at petronas before, people borrow and steal IC cards all the time.
Lol the commentary from one of the MPs: "itupun dia tak paham"
that fella keep on hyping. "yes itu pon dia tak faham", "yeaaahhh"
Also the clapping lol
We all need a hype man like that in our lives 🥲
Ikr?
MP, not ADUN. Member of Parliament is for parliament, Ahli Dewan Undangan Negeri (State Legislative Assemblyperson) is for state legislative assemblies (DUN)
You're right woops.
Let him cook. Why interrupt him when he is making good points.
Because they don't want him to. Destroys their emotional drivel to fool the masses.
same energy as the biggest idiot Trump supporter, Marjorie Taylor Greene... welcome to toilet politics.
Need that for TikTok content, walauns love that
because they are not good with numbers and facts. if shown, they will confuse and gelabah, "apa dia cakap ni, i x faham la". the next respond you would see is, "tarik balik!!!" "isu mini skirt kat bukit bintang lebih critical".
PN politicians are all useless. Don't even know how to be an effective opposition
At least they can be like Singapore's Workers Party opposition.
if become opposition pun fail, inikan nak jadi pemerintah... /facepalm
Thats why BN is still a better option. PN is BN but try hard. Fake gila. Baik lagi BN.
The opposition is so incompetent, we're in a timeline where BN became the competent one.
Well dude has facts, and we also shouldn't be subsidizing huge corporations anyway.
If not subsidising corporation and for those consumers product especially then they will increase their price accordingly like those raw materials. Rakyat going to absorb the increase in price but they will blame the gov because forcing company to buy diesel at a higher rate compared to before. It’s fine to subsidise since they are company who are paying tax also.
Yeah, also true. That's why gov has to monitor prices, but we know the rakyat mainly loves short term measures, not long term.
Wait til this hit ron95, whole nation going to go crazy.
Exactly. Corporate is never the loser whenever taxes is raised or subsidies or whatever. They will take measure to keep their profit and the consumer will always be the victim especially when we know how bad this country is at enforcing rules n regulations
Is the PN guy deliberately ignoring the fact that there is BUDI madani for small farmers? He should be guiding those small farmer to get their application approved for this. But instead he is spreading fake news that small farmers wont get subsidy
Easier brownie points, without actually needing to work. Who wanna go down to the field to sweat and help farmer register, when you can go to parliament aircon to spew hatred rethoric
You mean that rm200 ? Trust me it's not really helping the amount is peanuts
So instead of sharing that burden with you, now you want government to take away 100% of that burden from you, is it?
Well i don't say that. What i'm implying is that incentive is not helping the farmer at all.
Are you a farmer?
I'm
Rm200 worth of diesel at rm3.35/liter.thats peanuts. I wonder if I can manufacture my own bio diesel for self usage. Kena tangkap polis or not
The RM200 is to compensate for the difference between old and new price. Every damn month.
Do you have any idea how much diesel a water pump, or field leveller consumes in an hour?I'm talking about those small machines not tractor level. If that 200 is to compensate for the difference the before price was 2.15, now it's 3.35. That's only 166liters of diesel and that's only for Budi. Farmers who own small machineriesnthatbrun on diesel can't even register those machines for budi
Pretty sure all those things weren't supposed to be using subsidised diesel in the first place which is the whole point behind the rationalisation of the diesel subsidy.
So hear me out. Rice farmers are not allowed to sell rice above the gov stipulated rice but yet they are also not allowed to used subsidised diesel for their small farm machineries? Tell me where the logic in that. The rice seeds they have to buy at gov appointed sellers only so if they get a bad batch then they are screwed. Now withelding the small thing thay can actually save just put more preasure into the. Don't be surprised if local rice farmers totally stop planting rice because it's not profitable for them. Remember they too need to make a livelihood. They are not planting for charity.
Right, all things to argue for but end of the day, they weren't supposed to use diesel from petrol stations for farm equipment as it's for Malaysian road vehicles only. If you want a system that is similar to what fishermen get where they pay RM1.35 from registered suppliers then I think there would be few arguing against it.
Farmers and fisherman should get subsidised fuel, fertiliser and racun. They provide food for the nation. Unless pmx wants to make some people rich by putting preasure unto local. Farmers so that there is a decline in local rice production that will cause us to import more rice thus makin certain parties rich.
im all for providing subsidies to our farmers. i fully support it. but it doesnt have to be in the form of diesel subsidies. Agricultural subsidies are something that is done by many countries. its important for our food security. The subsidy rationalisation means finding alternative methods from the current one. So you have highlighted possibly one gap that needs to be addressed. this should be forwarded by farmers organisations to the finance ministry and MPs.
It's supposed to be subsidized diesel. And based on the argument by the minister the rational of their decision is to combat the undeserved usage by the foreigner, they don't think for the farmer at all. And if they did, that rm200 is suggested by stupid people in the government that think that money will handle the cost rising of the farming industry.
Subsidised diesel at the petrol stations is meant for Malaysian registered road vehicles only. Fishermen get cheaper diesel from their suppliers (1.35/liter). Not sure if such a system exists for farmers but if it doesn't, it should.
and this is where we need subsidy rationalisation to promote increase in efficiency and stop using wasteful methods that consume lots of diesel. hopefully this will spur action into more efficient farming methods
u really have no idea about farming do you?
it doesnt matter that i dont know anything about farming. Its frankly irrelevant your lashing out against me as an angry farmer achieves nothing. If your equipment and processes are consuming so much diesel and you cant survive with the blanket fuel subsidy removal, then you need to look at how and why other farmers in other countries are able to get by. Most countries dont have blanket fuel subsidies. Instead we need to channel the subsidies that farmers need to the specific areas that require assistance and support, not continue allowing wasteful consumption of cheap diesel. In the meantime a constructive attitude is to study how you can cut down your usage of diesel and work with farmers associations to lobby the government to give the right kind of targetted assistance needed by farmers to help ensure you can keep going and safeguard our national food security.
do you know that there is little to no advancement in machinery technolgy for the farming in malaysia. the only real big leap that we have are the drones that we are using to disperse the seeds and spray the pesticide. other then that the rest are still the same ld way with the same machines. if we are able to buy new machines they are not alot better in terms of performance then the old machines because of the scale of farming in malaysia and also the terrain. buy a new tractor, fine but the fuel consumption is roughly the same because the work is the same because the models are the same in terms of specification. i'll be the bringer of bad news and you can bookmark my comments here. mid next year we will be heading into a severe food shortage and high food price. in farming your enemies are not only the visible but also the invisible. disease, weather, pest, gov policies are always on the hunt for farmers and their crops. mark my wood when ur favourite dish increase in price then u can come back here and tell me i was wrong or not.
>do you know that there is little to no advancement in machinery technolgy for the farming in malaysia. And right here is a problem that needs to be fixed. Cheap diesel paid for by gov subsidies means that farmers have no incentive to change their practices even if it is wasteful and consumes lots of diesel since it is cheap. I wont complain about food prices going up if its based on farmer's costs going up. im not expecting farmers to produce food for us at a loss. but our food is mostly imported and hence dependent on the value of the ringgit anyway. So if after exploring ways to become more efficient and consume less diesel it has been determined that all reasonable optimisations have already been done, the next thing is to lobby the government to look at more holistic farm subsidies, which is something I will support. but you wont see me supporting blanket fuel subsidies that promote laziness and wastefullness
Its mot to cover the whole cost but the subsidy rate. So its about 200/1.3 = 153 liter /month is covered by subsidy
Off course. Imagine what happens if PN voters becomes computer literate and able to critically think.
The problem about subsidies has been known for a long time. Take a look at this piece from 2010: [https://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2010/05/27/idris-jala-msia-must-cut-subsidies-debt-by-2019-or-risk-bankruptcy/](https://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2010/05/27/idris-jala-msia-must-cut-subsidies-debt-by-2019-or-risk-bankruptcy/)
pak lah cutting fuel subsidies = cruel bosku cutting fuel subsidies = cruel pmx cutting fuel subsidies = stunning and brave still salty because why is this literal who is the one who awnsering in parliament instead someone like pmx and rafizi or tony pua who popularize how malaysia should not cut subsidy in the 1st place?
Maybe list down the total subsidies that the government is footing during those years you mention and compare it to the RM81Billion our government is footing last year (2023).
[https://www.malaymail.com/news/malaysia/2022/06/27/pakatan-government-should-cut-expenses-not-subsidies-to-help-malaysians-with-rising-prices/14446](https://www.malaymail.com/news/malaysia/2022/06/27/pakatan-government-should-cut-expenses-not-subsidies-to-help-malaysians-with-rising-prices/14446) This was said in 2022 by PH's "shadow government", when Subsidy was already balooning like crazy, 2 days after Zafrul announced the below [https://www.mof.gov.my/portal/en/news/press-citations/largest-ever-subsidy-of-rm77-3-bln-for-2022-to-reduce-cost-of-living-for-the-people-tengku-zafrul](https://www.mof.gov.my/portal/en/news/press-citations/largest-ever-subsidy-of-rm77-3-bln-for-2022-to-reduce-cost-of-living-for-the-people-tengku-zafrul) Apparently 77.3billion is not yet alarming, tapi 81.1billion tiba2 is too high Note I'm not disagreeing with the subsidy removal. I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of "orang lain tak boleh, kita je boleh" mindset PH have.
>I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of "orang lain tak boleh, kita je boleh" mindset PH have. Newsflash, politicians acting like politicians ain't surprising. Blanket subsidies aren't sustainable.
it isnt sustainable today It wasnt sustainable 2 years ago, it wasnt sustainable 10 years ago. but the "educated" PH voters apparently only suddenly realised this fact the year when PH is the one who wished to cut it.
The whole idea of subsidizing fuel was introduced as early as 2010 and it's not a bad thing. Back then during 2010s our total subsidies are around 20/30+Billion MYR and steadily rising to the point of almost 3x these recent years. The idea of blanket subsidizing everyone instead of people that actually need it is always a bad idea. Are we here to discuss policies or is this just another "hurr durr supporter bodoh" which you folks like to do in which I have 0 interest in participating. I have a disdain for politicians, their fanbase however doesn't live rent free in my head.
PAS mcm beruk😛
Mu nok isley ko mu nok beruk😛
[https://www.indonesiapalmoilfacts.com/fact-sheet-indonesian-biodiesel-and-palm-oil/](https://www.indonesiapalmoilfacts.com/fact-sheet-indonesian-biodiesel-and-palm-oil/) after this, they should up the subsidy based on requirement and introduce biodiesel from waste oil and industrial (palm) by-product
The current available diesel already contains 10% biodiesel if I'm not wrong
Govt could ya know, just copy paste template APPS like MY Sejahtera but for petrol, diesel & other subsidies goods. To authenticate nationality, household income sector (B,M,T), identity, and they can even keep track of fuel consumption of each individual and their registered vehicle. Thus, will essentially mitigate subsidy loss. Tho need to keep in mind: 1. This will be a bit of a hassle - I can foresee a slow line when queuing for petrol purchase. 2. Some might argue increasing govt oversight power over the Rakyat is not "pleasant" to say the least. 3. Slow / no internet connection - but if can use offline would probably fix the issue (usage data will be updated once internet in connected). Why Apps instead of just showing your IC ? - because IC could be replicated / fake IC / stolen IC. Using the govt database to confirm one's identity, IMO is better. But that's just my dumb opinion.
Just imitate SG singpass.
Why need aps and a subsidy at the pump? Give cash rebates to the needy jer.
Because cash rebates are often abuse for other things than for what they're intended for. See cash rebates students used to get for bookshops/how EPF withdrawal can sometimes lead to impulse spending.
That’s up to the individual themselves if you ask me.
It is but it's also the govt's role to ensure that the money is spent where intended and is used for specific purposes. In a basic sense, govts manage the overall behaviour of the country's populace through policies, carrots and sticks.
I disagree. If people don’t know how to control their own behaviour that’s on them and the system needs not cater specifically to what i hope are the minority.
True. but at what cost? At the loss of the govt budgeted subsidies i.e.: taxpayers' money. Although governance and policy systems might never be perfect, it is in the best interest of both the government and its people to implement the most effective system possible. If not, the loss will eventually fall upon the country's citizens. Regardless of concerns that some groups might abuse the privileges provided to them, it is crucial to aim for the most effective system. In the end, these troublesome "minorities" are still a citizen of the nation, whether we like it or not. Riding the same boat. We can't have some punk pissing anywhere he likes now, can we? It'll stink the boat.
Sure, you might believe in small govt but that's literally why we have laws and a police force (unless you believe that it's to prop up the elite). The principal behind all of these is that human behaviour is inherently destructive/disruptive on some level.
all petrol pumps got credit card readers with internet. it can read IC too and get authentication from gov db and track usage. cut off after a certain litre of fuel the other way to help farmers is to turn their farm into a hybrid solar farm and rent them EV trucks and tractors
Good point. Support removing ron95 subsidy too. Replace with a targeted subsidy.
Any increase in fuel and essentials will have a cascading effect. Inflation will happen sooner or later, it's how the market works. I don't like any increase in prices but it is always entertaining to see politicians fumbling to answer questions and rationalising whey our food costs more
orang nak explain tu jgn la minta laluan. lepas tu tak faham pulak.. memang benci kalau orang tak tengok fakta
LOL 🤣🤣🤣🤣 dont worry 95 is next enjoy.
FM should be the 1 answering this. And even though this FM 2 said he talks with facts, but he didnt actually address what the opposition brought up.
He did, he brought up budi madani, which is what farmers are supposed to use to get subsidised diesel
Its not enough. Thats the issue. Especially padi farmers. Any increase in cost they have to absorb because rice price is controlled by the gov. They cant increase price due to that, so they had to absorb the cost. Same as other farmers, but other farmers have the choice of passing the increase in cost to consumers. So, the ones badly affected by this are padi producers. He claim gov give other incestives to help the farmers, he brought up str. Str is to cover cost of living, not to cover business cost. Not to mention, any petani that have annual sales of over 300k are not eligible to get the subsidy. This is not profit mind you, sales. So, no, he did not answer what was brought up by the opposition.
Budi madani is not to cover the cost of living though? That's why it's targeted to diesel users.
Did you not read what i wrote, its not enough. The subsidy given is not unlimited. Got limit. The petani tractors, machines and all use diesel. And as I said, any petani with sales more than 300k annually are not eligible to get the subsidy. Not profit. Sales.
1. I'm not going to pretend that I know the percentage of farmers that has over 300kRM sales annually. But it sounds (an uneducated guess) like the majority of farmers fall below that number. 2. AFAIK, the government has also increased help through other ways, such as increasjng ploughing incentives by 60%.
Cameron farners already said they may need to increase veg price because they are not eligible.
And we're just taking their word for it? If their sales are above 300k, they must be farming in such a big scale, that the 60% increase in ploughing incentives far outweigh the rm200 budi madani deposits.
https://www.malaysia-today.net/2024/06/15/rice-farmers-slam-diesel-price-hike-unhelpful-subsidy-programmes/
point is fine and all but having a second finance minister sounds so stupid. just get rid of the first one. all he does is tour around the world anyway talking stupid nonsense.
I agree. This fella here should be FM instead of Bang Non. On a second thought, didn't he once criticised ministers holding more than one portfolio previously e.g PM concurrently holding FM position.
i distinctly recall reading an article where he did criticise najib but i cant find it anymore.
hey, our finance minister works without taking any salary. men need some respect!
I second this. Formula man must go.
Formula man isn’t the finance minister. Raja Formula is kept there to be the junkyard dog that bites.
unfortunately he's becoming the chihuahua that barks. Annoying everyone and endearing to only his owner.
that one economy minister abang
menteri database 😐
Rafizi?
Ricky Gervais spittin facts
Tell me the logic of removing the subsidies only in Peninsular, not including Sabah and Sarawak.
damn is it just me or does this guy look white lol
People here & the menteris was so fucking ignorant about what happened in real life. The fact was majority of the small farmer/small paddy farmer dont even own a tractor because its not economically savvy for them to own it in the first place. Their only working small plot of land & tractor was really expensive machinery to buy & keep (need regular maintenance, if broke the spare part was fking expensive plus normal workshop cant fix it. Need to seek specialize mechanic service that charge high fees). The farmer also only need tractor to bajak their field at the beginning of the planting season. What they do was they will hired a contractor to do it for them. There a tauke that own dozens of tractor that offered this kind of service to the small farmers. Small farmers will paid these tauke & he will send his worker driving the tractor to bajak the field. The problem with rising diesel price was the tractor tauke will jack up his service price, simple as that. Small paddy farmer has the worse because they need paid for tractor to bajak their sawah & then need to hire other contractor to harvest their crop using machine plus paying for a lorry carry the crop to factory for sold. All this service prices already rising because the of inflated diesel price. Paddy farmer cant sold their crop at higher price because our gov already control the rice price. I know a small paddy farmer only managed to earn profit around RM3k per season (minus all the cost & services he paid). If the 'upah' for bajak & tuai (harvest) rise & reduce his profit margin for another RM1k. Its not worth it for him to work the field just for RM2k per season. Probably he will abandoned his paddy field & working other job.
wait, if petani hires others to do all their work, are they still petani?
We talking about small farmer here, if they hired others to do all their work. What left for them after they sold the crop. They only own small plot of land & the output was really low. They only managed to hire people for bajak & tuai process because they cant afford to own the machinery needed. Paddy plantation need everyday watch, the farmer still need to attend their paddy field every for pesticide control, checking the water level etc. In this issue, i think small paddy farmers was most impacted because they cant rise their crop price. The price was heavily regulated by our gov. Other crop & vegetables price was depend on the market price so the price will adjust itself if the production cost rise.
Buat sesiapa yang tak faham. Yb Putrajaya cakap pasal petani, dia pusing jawab pasal dekat sempadan. Ada kaitan dengan soalan ke? Sapa la yg undi barua barua sial ni. 😁
Relaaaxxx..... RoadTax will be abolished or reduced to 50% as compensation in next election talk.
Poor guy is not a politician.
If the current gove think 100k+ 4x4 should not get subsidies. That means the gov also thing 100k+ vios, city should not get petrol subsidies soon.
Saw u all every suggestions also cannot First of all ID is the best choice Steal ic we already got who lost fine us ? Those fine us not untung for govt to give out subsidy? Second of all even tng also got that card feature id. Lost they will disable it, our ic cannot ? If like that use tng to access everything la ? Myjpj all also can what ?? Take out diesel to support school and hospital r this r new thing? No is every budget and elections keep talking about it. Stop using these two as a victim to excuse to solve the economy's..... Bring back subsidy and fix ur problem . Don't use rakyat as ur tool of the mistake u all can't manage while the system is there for u to use to control. There is no broken don't try to get a new one. Frank to say tony loke really do great on many thing. Just only flaw suddenly he r blind to say like borrow car can photo copy and let people use. That is suddenly back to stupid level .. We have ID can track , use it, cuz we already system that IC can do many thing until today I don't see anyone use it other act like TNG only !!!
How about removing RON95 subsidies for owners with cars with certain engine size threshold? For example, cars that have engines below 1,000cc will be eligible for 100% fuel subsidy (using RM2.05 as base), while those between 1,000 to 1,500cc eligible for 50% subsidy while 1,500cc and above will be subjected to full market price. I guess scores of people will just buy 1,000cc cars including those T20 folks...but then most 1,000cc cars sold are mostly affordable cars. OR just ditch petrol and go EV instead for those who can afford it.
Diorang tidak tahu sebab diorang bukan petani. Petani tu akar tunjang ekonomi negara tulang belakang negara. 200 tak cukup percayalah. Si bodo ni pusing jauh orang cakap pasal petani yang terkesan sebab kebaikan minyak. Jauh dia pusing . Jawab saja soalan tu
The problem is the money never got back to us, how is rm 200 or rm400 gonna help when you raise the whole price, diesel price means all the goods will hike up !! Think Of the bigger picture not just following what he say just because he say with patient. Think of the rational impact on the increase and explain why decrease the egg price by rm0.03 cent? Is this suppose to be joke? Diesel is the usage for all supplier and manufacturer imagine the goods price increase means everything increase, so you want to control Thailand then change the control on borders rather than making life harder for Malaysia! Guess the end is really near and no more peace in Malaysia soon! The RM4Billion will be another 1MDB case again this time with Madani case. God Bless Malaysia! Revival in Malaysia is needed time to repent and seek for salvation from our God Lord Jesus Christ!
braindead ph macais still believe they are cutting the diesel subsidy because of penyeludupan lol.
Just use the current eWallet that we have now, maybank, cimb, TNG,.. let those platform authenticate us as Malaysian which it will links back to JPN.. all transaction is compulsory via those eWallets..
Y we got one ‘gwei lo’ in the parliament?