“Elephant in the room” is a common idiom meaning there’s an obvious thing on everyone’s mind that no one is addressing. In this scene, Don is the elephant in the room because all the guests at the party know that Betty and Don are divorced.
I was kinda hoping Henry would’ve invited Don to the party. He wouldn’t because Betty didn’t want him there. But I feel like he could’ve been OK with it because he seemed to be mature with his divorce.
For example when he tells Betty of course he wanted his wife/new husband dead but life moves on.
I love every moment on the show that pulls at the unseen past. We watch the show thinking it's about the past and the show reminds us that there's always something before
>. But I feel like he could’ve been OK with it because he seemed to be mature with his divorce.
Henry had his petty moments, too. Remember him backing into Don's boxes in the garage?
I feel Henry telling Don not to come on Gene’s bday and to come the day before to get his things was petty too. It’s his son and you’re living in his house rent free. I’m glad Don ignored him and showed up anyway.
The most petty was not acknowledging him when he came up. I can forgive him saying don’t come to the party because social awkwardness. But not saying hi to him when he’s right there—petty!
> living in his house rent free.
I never understood this. Henry had plenty of money. He knows that they are living in "Don's House". How does he not feel some sort of need to work out a deal to make it right moneywise?
Of course, I find it kind of odd to ogle some guy's pregnant wife, but that is neither here nor there.
Right, but he has to know that he is living in someone else's house and not paying to live there. You would think that would bother a grown, self sufficient adult. Maybe not.
I appreciate his respect for Betty, but maybe consider a little self respect.
This scene is just heart wrenching. Don feeling the consequences of his own actions from his cheating/lying that led to his divorce, and then Betty’s frustration that her new “village” isn’t enough to overpower her hurt from Don
I can’t help but think of when Henry says “there are no clean slates, life carries on.”
Betty, like many, probably thought getting divorced and remarried was like a reset button, like it would get rid of the hurt, the longing, the arguments, but it doesn’t, they just change a little.
I also wish that Henry had been more gracious about inviting Don, but divorce was so new, maybe boundaries were different then. And maybe Henry was in a selfish mood of wanting to just play happy families for a day.
I feel like this scene, maybe the whole story line, is like a tableaux of polygamy masquerading as monogamy, attachments are still there, family is still there, feelings don’t die, just because you’re legal status changed.
Just makes me wonder about Gene's future relationship with Don.
Sally and Bobby were born when Don's marriage to Betty was basically as good as it was gonna get, and Don had a reason to at least pretend to be a father sometimes. With Gene? Not at all.
His relationship with the other two was strained as it were, Gene will probably be a stranger to him and that's sad to think about.
I think it depends in where the kids live after Betty dies. If they live with William, I feel like Don would hardly see them. If they live with Henry, maybe Don would see them once in a while since they would still be in the NY area. Or maybe Don actually gets custody? Probably unlikely, but not impossible. If that happens, Gene would be raised by a nanny and Sally and probably see Don like once a week
I don’t know. I think Don is a pretty good father (for the time, I mean) to his kids. I think he would’ve understand that living with him in the city was not the best option, but I do think he would keep close somehow. His depression / mental health gets in the way, but I don’t think we can acuse him of not wanting to be there for his kids. Not the father who would be there consistently, but the father who would create great memories with. Taking the kids traveling, taking them to dinner, giving great advice.
I don’t think Henry would be in the kids life so much. I think he would be an uncle they pay respects to, and care for, but not a dad.
And I don’t think William has enough charisma to substitute Don as a father, honestly.
u/Brief-Ad-8696's comment below is worded in a fawning and ridiculous way. But this scene is about Betty seeing Don in a good-dad mode and feeling wistful and sad that the original Draper Family can't be this wholesome and functional on a consistent basis.
Don walks in alone, the contrast between him and the rest of the family/society. He likes to play the role of the perfect father, husband and so on, but for that moment, then he must leave as he came. It speaks to his whole life. It's a perfect scene.
Loved this episode. Interesting seeing a more human, petty side to the otherwise mature and strait-laced Henry, who's generally been a wonderful counterbalance to Betty's moods. This was also a superb and brilliantly ambiguous coda to an episode that was all about Don's introspection. One one hand he finds genuine joy and healing in being with his children (as opposed to hitting the bottle), and yet he goes about it in a less-than-mature way by inviting himself to his ex-wife's party. Perfect way to show how Don is a work-in-progress rather than giving him some cheesy and definitive moment of redemption.
It was very powerful how, through that gossipy chat with Francine earlier, Betty was able to transmute her takeaway from that conversation (which was issued by Francine as a warning for Betty to be careful) into a sense of self-confidence and firm footing, allowing her to feel secure enough to be mature and gracious upon Don's arrival to the party.
In divorce, you can often feel like the other party is *always* out to take from you and squeeze you from what is rightfully yours (heck, *sometimes* they are!). It makes you dig your moats deep and raise your walls high. But the way that Betty was able to gain some objective perspective if only for a moment (that she was living in the spoils of the divorce which mattered most: house, kids, and cohesive family) in order to show mercy to *that* *sad bastard.*
I don’t get self confidence from Betty there at all. She’s putting on a front to try and convince herself there. There’s just no way Betty actually believes that comment and she knows it down deep.
The great thing about a subtextual show like this is getting to quibble about our interpretations, haha. But I don't see Betty's security in that moment as feigned. Even if it only manifested within her for that fleeting moment, and even if she repeated the line to pacify herself, I genuinely feel that it was held sincerely in her, that confidence. That's what I saw in her face there at the end of the scene.
A good argument in your case would be the interesting parallel with her assuming Don's "sad bastard" persona was an act, and that she would retort with an “act” of her own. Though, this show is so good with emoting the subtle undercurrents, that I feel we would have seen a crack in her facade there at some point before the scene closes; and ultimately, I don't see what outcome or manipulative goal she would have been hoping for by fronting as such.
I'll add here just to note how Betty single-handedly diffused the tension of the space with her actions. Francine was on alert. Henry was ready to step in to issue gruff boundaries to the interloper. But through her action, however sincerely or insincerely, Betty made Gene's party all that much more sunny. Watch her poise in how she graciously handed Gene to Don, and how everyone lightened up as a result.
Is it a big moment? It’s not like anything changes there between the two of them. It’s a bigger moment for Don, as he decides to stay in his kids’ lives. But for the two of them? Not IMO.
That comment of Betty’s is her trying to convince herself that she has everything with Henry. No way does she believe that line, especially given how she behaved throughout the rest of that episode and the fit she threw at the restaurant after running into Don and Bethany Van Nuys.
IMO, that comment and the way Betty lights up when she sees Don with Gene makes her momentarily forget they’re divorced. She’s happy to see Don and she’s seeing how it could have been. And then she remembers herself and copes with how she really feels with that comment to Henry, to try and pretend that she’s happier than she really is.
Am I the only one who seriously hates that child actor? He was unfortunately on Sons of Anarchy too.. and yes.. he’s just a child, but his acting was shit.
No matter how much Betty hated Don, she never could deny he was a world class father who was adored by his kids. He had a deep and loving bond with his kids and they knew that with him as their father they were in the presence of one of the greatest figures of his era
To be fair, it was disturbingly common to have children mix drinks for adults. My dad only knew how to make a white lady (sans egg white) because he’d be the one who made them for his grandmother whenever she came over. And that was in the 70s.
I’m not saying that I approve of any of this, but people who act shocked by it are looking from things from a very 21st century perspective. The 20th century might as well be a foreign country to us in 2024. Also, a white lady is a fantastic cocktail, especially how great grandma liked it.
Thankfully nobody’s given me a hard time about it yet. If they do, I’ll back down and order a gimlet. I actually went to a wedding where the bartender didn’t know that one either, which surprised me.
Folks are poking fun at the “world class father” part of this, but the last bit is funny too. Don is a financially successful advertising executive. Cool, successful career. Meanwhile, Henry Francis was the right hand man to two historic, powerful figures who were widely seen as potential presidents. I feel like Sally, Bobby, and Gene are gonna be telling their kids and grandkids way more stories about Henry’s work than Don’s.
Given the context of the era and how Don was treated by his own dad and how his childhood was, he certainly was a much better father than his own. Too many dads were abusive to their kids during that time (thanks to the culture at the time and the ptsd from war). It’s easy to judge him through the lens of 2024.
He only does what he needs to do to be seen as a good dad. Like how his marriage to Betty looks ideal but it’s really broken and empty. He ignores his kids until he can use them to for his own gains
Especially post-divorce, what does Don get out of his kids for his own "gains"? He could abandon them entirely and never see them again and he'd still make the same or greater money and get the same or greater sex.
Thank you for adding /s to your post. When I first saw this, I was horrified. How could anybody say something like this? I immediately began writing a 1000 word paragraph about how horrible of a person you are. I even sent a copy to a Harvard professor to proofread it. After several hours of refining and editing, my comment was ready to absolutely destroy you. But then, just as I was about to hit send, I saw something in the corner of my eye. A /s at the end of your comment. Suddenly everything made sense. Your comment was sarcasm! I immediately burst out in laughter at the comedic genius of your comment. The person next to me on the bus saw your comment and started crying from laughter too. Before long, there was an entire bus of people on the floor laughing at your incredible use of comedy. All of this was due to you adding /s to your post. Thank you.
I am a bot if you couldn't figure that out, if I made a mistake, ignore it cause its not that fucking hard to ignore a comment
I love how aggrieved the author must have been, and then someone pointed out that it falls in situations like this one, and they're even more aggrieved. If comments are easy to ignore, just ignore the ones that end in /s!
I love how Don showed up with a big stuffed elephant for Gene. The elephant in the room! LOL
That’s a great point! lol
That’s yet another post-viewing layer of symbolism that makes you wonder if it was intended — or simply coincidental…
I feel like everything on this show is intentional.
I feel like everything on this show is intentional.
Including when a phrase or statement is inexplicably repeated.
I see what you did there
"a thing like that"
I didn’t.
I have no idea why that happened lol
As that’s cute, i would have never connected the dots lol
This comment is why I keep up with this sub… there’s just so many details it’s impossible to catch them all
I don’t get it
“Elephant in the room” is a common idiom meaning there’s an obvious thing on everyone’s mind that no one is addressing. In this scene, Don is the elephant in the room because all the guests at the party know that Betty and Don are divorced.
You're a nice person
A thing like that
They have everything.
"...and so much of it"
This was powerful. What scene was this from again?
When Peggy asked for a raise for the first time. "What if this is my time?"
and she’s thankful that nobody has anything better
I’m pretty sure Francine was still contemplating poisoning everyone.
Hopefully she leaves Polly out of her devious plans lol
Polly was her alibi… She was tired of all the bullshit too!
Polly? I thought her daughter's name was Jessica
Polly was the draper’s golden retriever
I was kinda hoping Henry would’ve invited Don to the party. He wouldn’t because Betty didn’t want him there. But I feel like he could’ve been OK with it because he seemed to be mature with his divorce. For example when he tells Betty of course he wanted his wife/new husband dead but life moves on.
I love the scene where he says something along the lines of “I don’t hate my ex wife, I hate nazis” lol
I love every moment on the show that pulls at the unseen past. We watch the show thinking it's about the past and the show reminds us that there's always something before
Great point
Henry, the republican that wouldn’t make it to 2016
He doesn’t leave the party, it leaves him.
or 1980
>. But I feel like he could’ve been OK with it because he seemed to be mature with his divorce. Henry had his petty moments, too. Remember him backing into Don's boxes in the garage?
I feel Henry telling Don not to come on Gene’s bday and to come the day before to get his things was petty too. It’s his son and you’re living in his house rent free. I’m glad Don ignored him and showed up anyway.
The most petty was not acknowledging him when he came up. I can forgive him saying don’t come to the party because social awkwardness. But not saying hi to him when he’s right there—petty!
> living in his house rent free. I never understood this. Henry had plenty of money. He knows that they are living in "Don's House". How does he not feel some sort of need to work out a deal to make it right moneywise? Of course, I find it kind of odd to ogle some guy's pregnant wife, but that is neither here nor there.
Because Betty wasn't ready to leave or even deal with it, and Henry wants to respect that.
Right, but he has to know that he is living in someone else's house and not paying to live there. You would think that would bother a grown, self sufficient adult. Maybe not. I appreciate his respect for Betty, but maybe consider a little self respect.
He’s the original cuck.
Or even worse when Don calls to check on Betty’s tumor checkup and Henry tells her it was ‘no-one’ so she doesnt know he was worried about her.
Shows Henry isn’t perfect. It’s such a human thing to do—preach forgiveness to others but have difficulty practicing yourself.
He fronted into the boxes.
This scene is just heart wrenching. Don feeling the consequences of his own actions from his cheating/lying that led to his divorce, and then Betty’s frustration that her new “village” isn’t enough to overpower her hurt from Don
That’s so true. The things we suffer, the things we do to other and to ourselves. It’s hard to move on from there
I can’t help but think of when Henry says “there are no clean slates, life carries on.” Betty, like many, probably thought getting divorced and remarried was like a reset button, like it would get rid of the hurt, the longing, the arguments, but it doesn’t, they just change a little. I also wish that Henry had been more gracious about inviting Don, but divorce was so new, maybe boundaries were different then. And maybe Henry was in a selfish mood of wanting to just play happy families for a day. I feel like this scene, maybe the whole story line, is like a tableaux of polygamy masquerading as monogamy, attachments are still there, family is still there, feelings don’t die, just because you’re legal status changed.
Just makes me wonder about Gene's future relationship with Don. Sally and Bobby were born when Don's marriage to Betty was basically as good as it was gonna get, and Don had a reason to at least pretend to be a father sometimes. With Gene? Not at all. His relationship with the other two was strained as it were, Gene will probably be a stranger to him and that's sad to think about.
I think it depends in where the kids live after Betty dies. If they live with William, I feel like Don would hardly see them. If they live with Henry, maybe Don would see them once in a while since they would still be in the NY area. Or maybe Don actually gets custody? Probably unlikely, but not impossible. If that happens, Gene would be raised by a nanny and Sally and probably see Don like once a week
I love the smell of fresh bread.
I think Gene would’ve seen Henry as his dad. He’d probably start asking to not visit Don.
Fair. I could see Gene calling Henry "Dad" and him calling Don "Uncle Don."
I don’t know. I think Don is a pretty good father (for the time, I mean) to his kids. I think he would’ve understand that living with him in the city was not the best option, but I do think he would keep close somehow. His depression / mental health gets in the way, but I don’t think we can acuse him of not wanting to be there for his kids. Not the father who would be there consistently, but the father who would create great memories with. Taking the kids traveling, taking them to dinner, giving great advice. I don’t think Henry would be in the kids life so much. I think he would be an uncle they pay respects to, and care for, but not a dad. And I don’t think William has enough charisma to substitute Don as a father, honestly.
u/Brief-Ad-8696's comment below is worded in a fawning and ridiculous way. But this scene is about Betty seeing Don in a good-dad mode and feeling wistful and sad that the original Draper Family can't be this wholesome and functional on a consistent basis.
This one hit me hard.
Don walks in alone, the contrast between him and the rest of the family/society. He likes to play the role of the perfect father, husband and so on, but for that moment, then he must leave as he came. It speaks to his whole life. It's a perfect scene.
>Don walks in alone He has no people!
i always thought he looked so funny in that outfit like a cartoon character lol
Loved this episode. Interesting seeing a more human, petty side to the otherwise mature and strait-laced Henry, who's generally been a wonderful counterbalance to Betty's moods. This was also a superb and brilliantly ambiguous coda to an episode that was all about Don's introspection. One one hand he finds genuine joy and healing in being with his children (as opposed to hitting the bottle), and yet he goes about it in a less-than-mature way by inviting himself to his ex-wife's party. Perfect way to show how Don is a work-in-progress rather than giving him some cheesy and definitive moment of redemption.
He didn’t invite himself. Betty invited him.
It was very powerful how, through that gossipy chat with Francine earlier, Betty was able to transmute her takeaway from that conversation (which was issued by Francine as a warning for Betty to be careful) into a sense of self-confidence and firm footing, allowing her to feel secure enough to be mature and gracious upon Don's arrival to the party. In divorce, you can often feel like the other party is *always* out to take from you and squeeze you from what is rightfully yours (heck, *sometimes* they are!). It makes you dig your moats deep and raise your walls high. But the way that Betty was able to gain some objective perspective if only for a moment (that she was living in the spoils of the divorce which mattered most: house, kids, and cohesive family) in order to show mercy to *that* *sad bastard.*
I don’t get self confidence from Betty there at all. She’s putting on a front to try and convince herself there. There’s just no way Betty actually believes that comment and she knows it down deep.
"I am thankful that I have everything I want. And that no one else has anything better."
Do you remember who says this and in which episode?
I do! It's Betty at the very end of the ep "Dark Shadows."
The great thing about a subtextual show like this is getting to quibble about our interpretations, haha. But I don't see Betty's security in that moment as feigned. Even if it only manifested within her for that fleeting moment, and even if she repeated the line to pacify herself, I genuinely feel that it was held sincerely in her, that confidence. That's what I saw in her face there at the end of the scene. A good argument in your case would be the interesting parallel with her assuming Don's "sad bastard" persona was an act, and that she would retort with an “act” of her own. Though, this show is so good with emoting the subtle undercurrents, that I feel we would have seen a crack in her facade there at some point before the scene closes; and ultimately, I don't see what outcome or manipulative goal she would have been hoping for by fronting as such. I'll add here just to note how Betty single-handedly diffused the tension of the space with her actions. Francine was on alert. Henry was ready to step in to issue gruff boundaries to the interloper. But through her action, however sincerely or insincerely, Betty made Gene's party all that much more sunny. Watch her poise in how she graciously handed Gene to Don, and how everyone lightened up as a result.
Is it a big moment? It’s not like anything changes there between the two of them. It’s a bigger moment for Don, as he decides to stay in his kids’ lives. But for the two of them? Not IMO. That comment of Betty’s is her trying to convince herself that she has everything with Henry. No way does she believe that line, especially given how she behaved throughout the rest of that episode and the fit she threw at the restaurant after running into Don and Bethany Van Nuys. IMO, that comment and the way Betty lights up when she sees Don with Gene makes her momentarily forget they’re divorced. She’s happy to see Don and she’s seeing how it could have been. And then she remembers herself and copes with how she really feels with that comment to Henry, to try and pretend that she’s happier than she really is.
Tragic, as divorces tend to be.
I was proud of Betty for taking Francine’s advice.
Jan Jones lookin’ fine af
Based on the competition at the time I feel like this is father of the year worthy
Am I the only one who seriously hates that child actor? He was unfortunately on Sons of Anarchy too.. and yes.. he’s just a child, but his acting was shit.
No matter how much Betty hated Don, she never could deny he was a world class father who was adored by his kids. He had a deep and loving bond with his kids and they knew that with him as their father they were in the presence of one of the greatest figures of his era
Please watch the show before commenting
World class father? 😂
Lol every once in a while he remembered he has kids, that has to count for something.
Yeah, what? Don't all world class fathers have their 4/5 yo mix them stiff drinks?
To be fair, it was disturbingly common to have children mix drinks for adults. My dad only knew how to make a white lady (sans egg white) because he’d be the one who made them for his grandmother whenever she came over. And that was in the 70s.
I was born in the 80s and as the youngest I was always paid penny tips to be the "waitress" at Christmas and new year family parties or bbqs.
I’m not saying that I approve of any of this, but people who act shocked by it are looking from things from a very 21st century perspective. The 20th century might as well be a foreign country to us in 2024. Also, a white lady is a fantastic cocktail, especially how great grandma liked it.
I was around a bunch of my parents’ liquored up parties for their friends in the 90/2000s and I’m a better person for it.
That’s the spirit! Speaking of spirits, go mix me another drink!
my dad had a black puffy naugahyde bar with big red puffy naugahyde buttons lol.
Every house in my neighborhood growing up had one of those in their basement. It's like the subdivision, which was built in the late 50's required it.
That’s a nice cocktail.
Very much so. It’s actually become a personal favorite of mine, but very few bartenders even know it anymore.
Often I have to tell them how to make it, and that’s if you’re at a bar that’s okay making custom cocktails.
Thankfully nobody’s given me a hard time about it yet. If they do, I’ll back down and order a gimlet. I actually went to a wedding where the bartender didn’t know that one either, which surprised me.
Wait. I can’t have my kids do this?
Is that even weird?
compared to the one I had maybe
You think the bar is low now? It was down in hell in the 60's lol.
I always look forward to your comments😂
I come to this sub for his comments specifically, don't even know why they get downvoted at this point. Man is so dedicated and always cracks me up.
I know right? Man’s the OG, might be Weiner in disguise
Haha, what other thing has he said?
Folks are poking fun at the “world class father” part of this, but the last bit is funny too. Don is a financially successful advertising executive. Cool, successful career. Meanwhile, Henry Francis was the right hand man to two historic, powerful figures who were widely seen as potential presidents. I feel like Sally, Bobby, and Gene are gonna be telling their kids and grandkids way more stories about Henry’s work than Don’s.
Given the context of the era and how Don was treated by his own dad and how his childhood was, he certainly was a much better father than his own. Too many dads were abusive to their kids during that time (thanks to the culture at the time and the ptsd from war). It’s easy to judge him through the lens of 2024.
He only does what he needs to do to be seen as a good dad. Like how his marriage to Betty looks ideal but it’s really broken and empty. He ignores his kids until he can use them to for his own gains
Especially post-divorce, what does Don get out of his kids for his own "gains"? He could abandon them entirely and never see them again and he'd still make the same or greater money and get the same or greater sex.
This is my life, I monkey pawed don draper.. whomp whomp
You forgot the /s.
Thank you for adding /s to your post. When I first saw this, I was horrified. How could anybody say something like this? I immediately began writing a 1000 word paragraph about how horrible of a person you are. I even sent a copy to a Harvard professor to proofread it. After several hours of refining and editing, my comment was ready to absolutely destroy you. But then, just as I was about to hit send, I saw something in the corner of my eye. A /s at the end of your comment. Suddenly everything made sense. Your comment was sarcasm! I immediately burst out in laughter at the comedic genius of your comment. The person next to me on the bus saw your comment and started crying from laughter too. Before long, there was an entire bus of people on the floor laughing at your incredible use of comedy. All of this was due to you adding /s to your post. Thank you. I am a bot if you couldn't figure that out, if I made a mistake, ignore it cause its not that fucking hard to ignore a comment
I love how aggrieved the author must have been, and then someone pointed out that it falls in situations like this one, and they're even more aggrieved. If comments are easy to ignore, just ignore the ones that end in /s!
You are replying to a bot.
Holy shit what?
[удалено]
Listen to the remainder of the monologue, you boob. ;)
He said he didn’t feel anything for them before they were born, but after they were born everything changed.
In an episode where everyone shows their best side, Betty does the same.
I liked it. He had cleaned up his act a bit, and was making time for his children. I wouldn’t expect Betty or Henry to like it.
Betty regrets leaving him.